It is. Much like FH5, it's a fantastic core wrapped in a big stinking dog shit.
The racing and the cars is great. I have only good things to say about it.
**Everything** else is either mediocre or downright idiotic and broken. It's such a shame. I'm picturing the core competence engine dev team sitting there having mixed feelings about doing a great job while a bunch of absolute idiot project managers and game designers just shit all over the fruits of their labours.
Someone on the Forza forums put it best:
"*Until Turn 10 gets their act together and delivers a product worth the price they are asking for it, people need to stop using the whole “Forza’s got a great core!” line of thought as an handwave for the rest of the game’s problems. It honestly should feel like an insult at this stage. It’s like standing in the middle of the remnants of a house gutted by fire and declaring it livable because the foundation is rock-solid.*"
> _robjamesmusic : wouldn’t it be more like appreciating the potential of the house given the presence of a solid foundation?
No "appreciating potential" until they actually *deliver* on it.
Until then, "potential" is literally nothing.
Then we will need to keep appreciating the potential instead of actually experiencing it lol. While the devs appreciate the very real solid money of ours.
It is fantastic fun. It’d be more fun with some sort of radar system and proper matchmaking.
But the reason I stopped playing is multiplayer replays. How the fuck are you supposed to improve without it and to rub salt in the wound the fucking button is still there, mocking you.
Three months since release and in the 3rd monthly update they didn't even mention replays. Out of everything in the game this is by far the most egregious failure by turn10. What kind of racing game has no functional replays three months from launch? They were broken at launch. The only time you can see them is rivals and career, but only in the race itself. You can't save *single player* replays dog. Absolute slap in the face.
If the game doesn’t crash right before the race after a half hour practice. I haven’t been able to play with my friends since update 2 and update 3 didn’t help. I’m currently trying to figure out how to buy 7 for the pc is my friends and I can play.
Competitive AI…
My brother in Christ it is literally same shitty Horizon AI on higher difficulties where one car bolts into the distance at unreal pace and rest of the field is driving behind you in a one huge conga line
And then if you are fast enough to catch the leader and pass him he will lose all his pace and just drive behind you with no intention to make a pass
Plus, the AI doesn't know if it wants to be avoidant (to a fault) or aggressive (read: ramming into you). In short, the AI lacks consistency in every way. I'd rather have the moving obstacles from GT than that.
My brother in christ have you seen GT7's AI 🤣 this shit is competitive in comparison. Definitely not perfect tho. Granted I've got the difficulty maxed out and top 1-3 isn't super hard. But at least they offer an actual race
Sophy was easier for me to beat, in the handful of events it was in (19 iirc) and sophy also had more issues with problematic contact, like just slamming into people at high speed
Sophy is really wierd because they made a big deal out of it, but it has to be watered down to fucntion on console, making it useless. It's barely on par with PS3 game AI, even PS2 in some cases. Meanwhile the base GT ai actually have capability, but it's purposely taken away from them and their behavior is super wierd. There's a good roflwaffle video about this
Yea lmao, the only weird thing sophy does is keeping thottle at like 90% on straight lines, but seems more like a gameplay thing that they forced there
Why are you bringing GT7 into this discussion, I haven’t mentioned it anywhere, my point was FM AI is terrible not FM AI is worse than racing game XY AI
Saying FM AI is less shitty than GT’s is not making FM AI good
Bro GT7 AI is way ahead of this shit, their new AI you can race against is amazing and actually competitive, at this stage I would rather play GT7 but both have their flaws. I’m a diehard fan of both but Forza fucked us with this car level bullshit and all the unstableness it’s actually criminal Microsoft let this be released like this.
Yeah I know what you mean both games suffer from lack of offline content. GT7 looks like it’s trying to fix it with all the races they added and no more catch up races finally, they also do a bunch of special weekly races for single player which is nice but can be done pretty quickly. I feel like there needs to be a lot done with Forza. I was waiting for a game called Ark (usually has a lot of glitches) to come out recently and the studio pushed the release date back to make sure their game is stable on launch and it’s been way more stable than forza… how does forza get away with this it’s so embarrassing showing my mates the new forza but then it crashes on me all the time (seriesX).
True Forza is a buggy mess but is still pretty good and the updates on GT7 make the game brilliant but being completely honest I'd rather play Crew Motorfest since it's pretty much a completely new game from the last
PROPER CAREER you are pushing a bit there mate. It has random, disconnected events designed to inflate the single player playtime. Utterly boring. It's a massive disappointment to see the career mode get worse in each iteration of Forza Motorsport.
This is obviously your first Forza.
>“This is a love letter to irl racing and cars. The classes, the tracks, the events.”
This is one of the most artificially decontented and bland Forza titles in… ever. The career mode is objectively bare bones. The multiplayer lobby selection is objectively slim at best.
The track count is objectively tiny. The car roster is objectively tiny. The amount of recycled car models dating to 10-15 years old is objectively egregious.
The amount of bugs is unforgivable. The lack of optimization is laughable. The new features are poorly implemented. Speaking of:
- replays still broken
- still no forecast for random-ass weather system; completely voids the point of tire selection
- still no proxy radar unlike every other major sim/simcade title
- broken penalty system
- broken matchmaking system
- no auction house
- no drift/drag modes
- no long-format race durations
- pit system is bare bones
- no AI in private lobbies
- no ability to customize individual competitor cars in free play (but you could in past titles)
- same archaic photo mode
- Forza vista/auto vista is so bad it’s not even a feature anymore; terrible lighting to hide details, no more per-vehicle context specific trivia; reduced exploration freedom (interior view is on limited rails); extreme glitches persisting
- car upgrade screen removing critical info like dyno graphs and at-glance quick changes
- sound track lacks passion (take FM4 - [Paris Rouen](https://youtu.be/guHnXAQboKE?si=dfz4ECzcmSPwyz79) and [Ballistic Circuit](https://youtu.be/p1KOBt1C-Fw?si=En-DdoLl5gnQcGAb) for reference)
- livery editor still broken
- worst career mode of any title, factual
- cxp universally decried for obvious reasons; impacts all facets of game bleeding into multiplayer freedom/meta
So many objectively, poorly managed decisions making this game. So much content held back to be trickled to you as “a feature” as opposed to hiding the reality that you are unusually grateful to pay full price $70-100 for a AAA-made Early Access Beta, where you are the play tester, and all of the content is just sitting there for them to release on artificial time gates.
The only significant improvements they made over past Forza titles are the physics and controller-specific handling. I’d count the weather system if it was actually implemented correctly.
Crazy amount of slurping OP. Here’s a napkin m’bro.
And if these physics are blowing your load, try giving AMS2 a shot. Or ACC. If this game makes you go “fuck, so good” you might bust a nut into the shadow realm playing those two.
Ok, im curious. What else do you want to see implemented in the pit system? We got tire compounds, we got fuel levels, we get to pick damages to fix if damage is on, what else is there to add on?
Also, why are people so adamant about the auction house? Aside from being able to auction off one-of-a-kind liveries I honestly dont see a need for it. Money is basically useless after a couple hours of play, you've got more than you'll ever need. I'm sitting on something like 5mil just by doing a handful of online races every day, even after going on a shopping binge and picking up five cars to try out in the open A class lobbies.
>What else do you want to see implemented in the pit system? We got tire compounds, we got fuel levels, we get to pick damages to fix if damage is on, what else is there to add on?
Fair question. Before talking about improvements, they need to fix the exploit that saves 1+ seconds by choosing fuel amount as the car decelerates into its box. Fixing fuel by adjusting to laps selected as opposed to fuel per tank is more logical. Being able to pre-plan pit strategies like most other games. And ultimately, having races long enough where pit strategy actually becomes something. There's no level of strat involved, it's usually a simple med/med, soft/med or med/soft combo. Maybe an outlier where you can run hards to finish no pit. But that's my main issue and I didn't word correctly bc I was flying through the list: the pit system is underutilized bc there aren't any race lengths to necessitate varied strats. There isn't a forecast system, so there's zero strat involved outside of luck and chance if there's inclement weather involved.
TLDR - add logical fuel options, add pit planning, add forecasting, add longer races, fix exploits
>Also, why are people so adamant about the auction house? Aside from being able to auction off one-of-a-kind liveries I honestly dont see a need for it. Money is basically useless after a couple hours of play, you've got more than you'll ever need. I'm sitting on something like 5mil just by doing a handful of online races every day, even after going on a shopping binge and picking up five cars to try out in the open A class lobbies.
It was a way to buy unlocked tunes and cars with preset upgrades. They probably got rid of it bc it would circumvent the CaRPG system. It was a great way to make quick cash and to find exclusive cars that T10 loves to abuse the FOMO system to death with. Eg: you were on vacation this week? Didn't have time to grind away to "earn" that exclusive car? Well tough luck, you won't get it. At least the auction house allowed you to buy it after the window.
The pit time exploit does need to be fixed, I will agree.
The fuel by percent is a great idea in concept, but from what I've seen personally theres no major difference in lap time between 10% and 11% fuel load so I wouldnt object to that being changed to laps vs % load.
Pre-planning pit strats I'm a little less enthusiastic about, especially if they tweak tire wear like I'm expecting them to sometime in the future(which they may not). This is all just anecdotal evidence from a sample size of one (me), but tire strats can play a pretty big role, especially when starting from the back. However, conditions can absolutely change on the fly requiring you to change your strat with them. Premature tire wear because you overshot a corner on mediums after 10+ minutes of practice and quali on softs can cook your tires pretty quick. I can see the use especially for players who arent familiar with the game or its mechanics to have a set of pre-made strats to guide them, but to be honest I already head in to a race with a game plan in my head, I dont really see the need to add an extra level of complication or an extra step to go through when setting up the car for a race beyond what we already have.
Longer races I'll give you, although by technicality thats not really a change to the pit system but rather the races themselves. I sincerely hope that when they implement the nurburging they'll implement actual endurance races with it, it'd be a crime not to.
As for tire strategies, this is my biggest point of contention. There is a massive amount of strategy involved if are willing to drive right, or even take risks with your race. Are your times on soft tires in practice at the top of the lobby, but you feel like starting from the back? Go hard to soft. You'll lose precious time on those hards when it comes to lap time, but you're going to lose precious tire fighting through the pack on mediums. Long stint on hards to get clear air, then short stint on softs once the carnage has shaken out was worked multiple times for me. Doing the reverse has on occasion worked as well, although this is likely much more dependent on the car as starting on pole on softs in the lambo right now isnt going to do you any good. Heck, if you're good to your tires, theres certain cars and tracks that you can run medium/soft on so long as you dont push your mediums too hard at race start. Again, my sample size is me on that one, but its def possible to do.
When it comes to race weather, I've noticed that it likes to change around the mid point of the race. Earlier today for example I jumped on Le Mans for a race in the GT spec hopper forecasted as "overcast wet". Track was very wet for practice, but bone dry on the grid during the 60 second interval for setting fuel and tire loads. Driving the 2017 RSR, I put on mediums on for the race start, was in something like 12th at the end of lap 2. I pitted, put wet tires on, and by the time I hit the Mulsanne it was belting down rain and I wound up with a podium at the end. This isnt a 100% accurate pattern, and I agree that I would very much like some form of either weather radar or at least a radio call out to let me know how if/when the weather would change, but there can absolutely be strategy with the weather system as it is right now.
>It was a way to buy unlocked tunes and cars with preset upgrades. They probably got rid of it bc it would circumvent the CaRPG system. It was a great way to make quick cash and to find exclusive cars that T10 loves to abuse the FOMO system to death with. Eg: you were on vacation this week? Didn't have time to grind away to "earn" that exclusive car? Well tough luck, you won't get it. At least the auction house allowed you to buy it after the window.
I hate the FOMO system and would much rather it either be scrapped entirely or failing that used for exclusive race suits since those dont have any actual effect on gameplay. That said, I was also never particularly fond of the auction house when I dealt with it on FH4/5. Yeah the fomo cars could be cool, but I sure as fuck wasnt going to pay 20mil for one single car, I'd just buy something else or forget about it completely. Dealing with auction snipers sucked ass as well, forcing you to pay the buyout price. At that point my options were either give up, or grind wheelspins for cash, neither of which were exciting prospects to me. I personally have no love for the auction house and dont really care that its gone, but I can see the value in it for people who really want whatever the last FOMO car they missed.
Take it down a fucking notch.
I'm aware that it's lacking. It's not my first forza title, although it's been a long time (FM1)
My thing is, past the issues and things missing, there's still nothing like this in the simcade market. That's my thing here. PC is dead. GT is car sales simulator now. Grid was OK but sadly not well received. FM is literally the only simcade on the market atm with a structured build up type career like this,which is incredibly nice.
It's no full blown sim. It certainly does feel good tho, coming from irl
>Take it down a fucking notch.
First off, calm down buddy. Second, no, I don’t think I will
You’re in the comments saying that people are falsely burying this as a broken game
It is a legitimately broken, failed game in its current state
It does not legitimize its pricetag. It is not a $70 game, nor a $100 one. It is still broken for the majority of people. Ever wonder why people are bitching about it and drowning out any praise that might come up?
You think people linger around Forza forums because they hate the game? It’s likely that most of us are long time Forza fans since the early days of the franchise and we’re sick and tired of T10 shitting down our necks and using rip-off tactics to string along a broken product for a 2-3 year cycle before it finally “gets good”
This game is the culmination of every wrong management decision T10’s made
Again, take it down
FM isn't a broken game. It's a _deeply flawed game_, but it's not broken.
Cyberpunk was broken. Dakar 2022 was broken. FM is flawed. FM needs work.
What I'm tired of people doing is writing off the entire game due to these things. Because at it's core it's a genuinely good simcade and had the only structured career on the market in that genre
T10/PG have been making bad decisions for like a decade now. My issue is that so has almost every other racing game franchise, yet Forza gets all the hate
I'm the exact same way you are about these things. The exact same way. But with GT. Exact same situation. Maybe I'm in a "grass is greener here" situation. Idk
Again, right back at you
The game is broken. Not figuratively speaking, but objectively. Speaking about the “launch issues” as if they’re past issues—when the same problems still persist to this today, creating a ‘broken’ experience—is just weirdly apologetic and dismissive to support your opinion.
When does a game cross the line from “deeply flawed” to “broken”
Are repeat crashes to desktop enough, terrible frame rates and flickering, recycled content making up the majority of the game, missing features, artificially locked content, etc all just “deep flaws” or signs of a broken product
I don’t understand what motivates someone to back the poor leadership behind T10 when they’re clearly taking advantage of you, the consumer
By lying to you with marketing promises that are egregiously broken, by ignoring the fanbase and its common requests for a decade+, by stripping the soul out of its title from fans like the majority here that have been with the franchise for ages
Idk what you’re trying to prove here tbh
Man you've got real fucking reading comprehension problem don't you?
I'm fucking agreeing with you. Dumbass. What I'm saying is that the core is a good game. People are ignoring that. A game is broken, imo, when not only does it have function issues but the overall gameplay is simply lacking or terrible. Cyberpunk and Dakar were my examples for this reason. Never played it, but I'm guessing Redfall would be another good example. Games that even when fixed are dogshit.
Now, they shouldn't have to be fixed in the first place. But here we are.....
> What I'm saying is that the core is a good game.
It doesn't fucking matter, if the rest is absolutely abysmal.
>People are ignoring that.
no, they're not. pay more attention.
>Cyberpunk and Dakar were my examples for this reason.
Funny enough most people only had problems with the framerates which is something that forza is having problems with too. Aka broken.
Cyberpunk now changed to a 92%. Forza is a broken game too.
You’re getting ratioed and just keep at this point quintupling down. You’re the clear minority here.
You said you haven’t played since fm1. So you don’t know jack shit aboutt this franchise and the expectations set over their pretty successful run.
If you’re okay with subpar products that’s okay, but I’d stop trying to tell everyone else that they’re wrong and the game is in fact good. We all want a good game, some of us are basically lifetime fans and players, but this game sucks.
> TC2-Drive-N-Vibe : What I'm tired of people doing is writing off the entire game due to these things. Because at it's core it's a genuinely good simcade
The fact that there's one shiny undigested peanut buried somewhere in a huge pile of manure is nowhere near enough to deem the entire pile delicious enough to gobble up.
...For many, the flavor of so much dung spoils the taste of that perfect peanut when they finally get to it.
The one or two things a game does well are not enough to make up for it simultaneously doing so many other things very poorly.
Nothing is perfect, but the bare minimum goal should at least be for the good to outweigh the bad - & it doesn't.
...If 10% of a game is great but 90% of it is garbage, it's only natural for people to write the whole thing off.
I think that some of us are a little bit just disappointed, because we had a really high hopes. This game should be top of the top, GT7 killer. Right now I can’t say that new game beat older GT7, yeah it’s better in some aspects but worse in others.
What are you talking about?
ACC may be a full blown sim but being GT3 makes it super accessible with traction control and ABS being enforced. It's also a far superior game for online play and even its barebones career is miles better than this shitty carpg.
F1 2023 has the best career mode in a racing game ever, it's a simmy simcade with very accessible driving mechanics.
WRC has you covered for rally.
And if you want to collect cars and drive around FH5 is a vastly superior game.
There's 0 reason to play this game if you're on PC. It's mostly negative on steam for a reason.
Just ditch the "sim vs simcade label" and jump into real racing games, because this one isn't even that authentic to begin with. There's much, much better racing to be had elsewhere.
GTS also has a better career than GT7 lol.
Anything, literally anything, is better than that near completely linear pile of sony slop that was billed as a gt7 career mode. It was poured into the trough and Sony pay pigs like you happily gobble it up
If you’re coming from FM1, I can see how you would want to praise this game. But if you saw Forza at its peak in FM4, it becomes obvious this game is severely lacking.
>browses discussion section on a post that openly invites a discussion about the game being shit on
Final remarks of OP's post: "Just tired of seeing nothing but shit shit shit on this game when it's objectively a good game, and far exceeds its main competitor at being a racing game"
What are you expecting when people paid $100 only to get ripped off
It's a discussion section and it's very evident that a ton of people disagree with him
Scroll on if it upsets you
Yeah cause calling op a cock sucker for enjoying the game is contributing to his discussion.
The game has many issues, too short of races in public lobbies, no consistent low class races (though i still would only race in GT), pseudo battlepass to unlock random cars, while it is weirdly satisfying seeing a car being built up with the level system, not being able to just build something is annoying, not having the nordschleif on launch (lmfao), but i enjoy the time i spend just racing with friends.
Im not an angsty teen anymore, getting unreasonably mad over a game for being shit due to garbage management and only chasing playtime rather than something engaging is a waste of energy.
>Yeah cause calling op a cock sucker for enjoying the game is contributing to his discussion.
I think you're the only one calling him that in this entire section though, and if your implication is that us (or just me) posting valid criticisms of the game is somehow equivalent to that, I have no clue what to tell you lmao
>Im not an angsty teen anymore, getting unreasonably mad over a game for being shit due to garbage management and only chasing playtime rather than something engaging is a waste of energy.
Neither are we? Is complaining about a company charging $100 for a clearly unfinished game exclusively an action for angsty teens?
It's specifically you. the majority of others accept that OP can have fun and share their grievances, but you're the one just trying to spread misery.
Hope you can grow out of it someday man, maybe find a better hobby or game you enjoy more.
Its why people are so emotional about the issues, at its core the racing and car feel is fantastic. It's just horribly let down by bugs and a lack of content structure and volume. I have high hopes for where this game will be in a years' time. I'm totally down for the live service content. I just hope enough players stick around to make it viable.
It's great you're enjoying it (I've been spending a lot of time in MP myself), but the game is genuinely broken, anti-player, and lacking features in so many ways.
Simple reason for me with the CxP system is that they do not value my time so I just don't care for it.
Its such an anti player choice for an ingame system and 100% only exist to inflate playtime.
It can be the best racing in the world once you have leveled up a car enough to upgrade and tune it, and I am fine with the grind at first. But once the "intial" grind should be over I should be able to tale what I've earned, get a new car and make it race ready on demand.
I don't want to start over from scratch everytime I want to try a new vehicle, CxP should never have been tied to specific car.
Dunno man, I main on GT7 and have tried it on PC and XSX (cross progression is really nice feature). Got to say, I think it’s shite on so many levels, light years behind GT, the physics are slightly less arcadey forza horizon, the lighting is just off, car models are last gen..
As someone with now tons of time in both, FM is levels ahead. Car models don't make a game good, the lighting and physics are better in FM and FM has an actual career
Mmm I'm sorry but no that's not a career mode. It's a few random races where you pick from a selection of cars.
Compare it to EA WRC career mode, you have a full calendar view of the season, hire and train engineers/teammates, you have budgets for your repairs and staff, you have to keep your sponsors happy etc.
Or how about grid legends, there's a whole story with actors fleshing it out.
Or dirt 1, 2, and 3.
Project cars 2.
Shit the career mode isn't even as good as any of the older FM games.
>that's not a career mode. It's a few random races where you pick from a selection of cars.
and yet, you mention
> dirt 1, 2, and 3.
as having career modes. All three are just that, actually a lot of racing games are like that, including some of very liked games - FM2, FM3, FM4, FM7 included (haven't played FM1/5/6).
> Grid Legends
What's funny is the story one there is the shit one. The good career mode in GL doesn't even involve the story.
I agree, but it's still a solid career mode, and it's the only simcade with one rn
EA WRC is on my list, haven't played yet, won't speak on it since I haven't
GT7 with the soulless menu? The same one that has a whole world map, a cozy looking cafe area, a literal autoshop area with cute and goofy little animations, overviews of tracks when selecting them, as well as overviews when selecting a car that has it driving in the background as well as an option to view the car’s history?
Look, GT7 has its fair share of issues, but the menu is great compared to FM’s “sophisticated” (dreary and boring) constant grey boxes.
>It has genuine issues, but people trying to bury it as some sort of failed game are simply wrong
I mean most of the core systems are not working at this time lmfao. it kinda is a failed game untill they make it better.
lol really. I like this Forza REALLY much..but it's my first Motorsport, so I probably don't see all the flaws that the veterans are complaining about. but saying that the career and the AI are valid makes you smile.
It‘s also the little details that bother me, like the wrong rear view mirror in the BMW E46 or false headlights (Xenon-Beams but yellow light and vice versa). But the driving itself is, compared to GT7, much more fun. Just sad they didnt tweak the details and such, screw the perfomance problems. But i want the game to be as accurate as possible and they missed this part not slightly but by a continent
It was optional on the E46 (non M as M), but what i mean is this : there are some cars that have the xenon-lights installed but the light shines yellow
>Recently had some time this weekend to sit down, really work thru the career. Fuck me I'm blown away. This is a love letter to irl racing and cars. The classes, the tracks, the events. I thought I was over my initial impressions but I keep finding things to love.
Check out some of the older Forza titles then. Because frankly this career is merely a empty shell of it's previous. Both in length, as well as progression.
>In GT7, if you wanna race anything in custom race, in a proper Class, if it's not. GR3 or GR4 car you have to buy the entire field and put them all on the same tire.
Sounds like not a praise of Forza but rather criticism to Gran Turismo for this absurd system. Being able to pick a class to race is a pretty basic functionality in race games in the last 20 years.
Not surprising because GT has always been so weird, quirky and without respect for players time. I'm not surprised the new lack of respect for players time in this Forza doesn't even occur to you.
It's both. I actually played fm1 back in the day, legendary title. And I am very aware of how wasteful the car xp system is
It's definitely cut back on content from previous titles....but it's all we have right now that plays similar.
I hate this timeline
I had so much fun in Horizon series, literally hundreds of hours. Give me proper wheel support and more real physics and I will happy forget about Motorsport. It so disappointing when you are no 1 Superman with controller and with wheel you struggle for top 3.
This is half the issue with modern games. The devs can release a half finished pos with half the content of their last release and people still praise them for making a great game. Some of yall need to wake up
FM7 was so disappointing back then. I remember looking at it and wondering what the fuck T10 was doing, instead of building up to FM6. The weird filter, camera shake, UI, menu. It was almost unrecognizable as a Forza game.
Then somehow they made something even worse. Man, the old me wouldn't believe this is what happened to the franchise.
Depends what you want. The racing is like 10x better (maybe not that much but definitely way better) in FM compared to FM7. Same with the physics and graphics. Also don’t forget the dynamic day and night cycle and the weather system which have been requested for *years*
No I fully agree with you. I'm not praising the devs here. I'm praising what's there. I also come from a fanbase where nothing ever got fixed, so T10 constantly updating is a breath of fresh air.
It's a flawed game with a phenomenal racing game within. If we keep criticizing the devs those flaws will be worked out
Imo game quality tanked mid ps3/360 era
The problem with praising whats there (when it works) is that it wasn't ready for release and some things that is there just shouldn't ever be praised.
It had an initial release window 6-7montha earlier and after that delay it was still released in the state it was, thats not something to be praised even if the devs aren't the ones responsible for the decision to release it in that state.
I fully agree with you. And I'm glad this sub thinks this way.
My issue is that in the simcade genre there's currently one alternative to FM, and it's awful. So I'm gunna support FM where I can.
But I am very glad this sub thinks this way. Because most of gaming reddit is "new game good must consoom, update will make it good later"
Idk I shit on it for lack of content, withheld features, broken features and game systems designed to pad playtime for game pass instead of make the player experience good.
I mean there's definitely more that could be added, however what we have is phenomenal
It gets into a bigger discussion of why modern game design is so shitty. Like yeah, I pretty much agree, there 100% should be more and it should be better. Modern game design did this. But that said, at least what we have is GOOD. They didn't take the entire design (GT7) or the entire franchise (PC3) and flush it down the shitter entirely in the name of making some sort of casual market game
People can say whatever they want about gamepass, but at the end of the day this is genuinely a driver/car guy's game. It's not some goofy colorful experience geared towards hypercasuals. I'm very happy about that
That all said, IM GLAD you shit on it. Please. Keep doing so. Because the fanbase I came from let their game go to shit and was 100% accepting of it. Criticism = change
The fact that you write this shit makes you a complete joke. "The fanbase you came from let their game go to shit and was 100% accepting of it?" How does that even make sense to you? Why do you brazzenly lie about something anyone can easily verify on reddit or any other social media platform.
You're pathetic.
I mean I did mention that the Carpg system exists to inflate game time and make game pass look better.
Right now replays don't work. Online lobbies have basically scheduled functionality breaks. Very low track count. Vehicles are missing engine sounds.
I agree with all of that (besides low track count)
The difference is that you're complaining about it and T10 is fixing it. Instead of "no, there's nothing wrong, stop whining and crying" and then the game is like that for 2 years.
Are they fixing replays and the Carpg system? Hasn't it been 2 patches since any replay improvements? And I use improvements generously since the only improvement I remember is that they made it so there isn't an error message when you try to download. Now they just say they downloaded and don't actually save anywhere.
And are they fixing the issue where you can't change tires or fuel at intermission for a few hours before the weekly change over of events?
Iirc replays are part of the next patch, I could be mistaken.
I doubt the carpg system will be fixed, as it's not an issue, it's a preference, and it's somewhat ingrained in the structure of the game. I doubt it will ever be removed, although im guessing it will be buffed and level quicker, or something.
Again....sadly this is the state of modern game design.
Let me ask you this tho. Would you be happy if this game was nearly 2 years old, still had broken tuning, lighting, physics, etc and whenever you said they were bad/broken someone told you to quit crying about it? Or would you rather the community complain and these issues get addressed
Yeah. I mean I can't disagree with you there.
That's the state of modern game design. Its a fucking atrocity, but the casuals keep making it worse.
My point is that I'm glad the concept of what FM is, is out there. And that the fanbase is critical of that concept.
Are they?
They are critical of bad features shoveled into a formula that was working fine (Carpg has not actually made things better for anyone) and broken features.
Yes, they are critical of that, and alot of other things. This entire post proves that, which was part of my reason for posting it, and I'm very glad for having that be the case. I'm glad people here are critical
With the amount of bugs, glitches and poor design decisions, it's far from being a love letter... More like an insult. To cars and Forza fans alike.
You only wrote this post because you got beef with PD and GT. Get over it.
This weekend I ended up uninstalling it for now because I needed to save some space. I really want to enjoy this FM, but I’m just not enjoying it. Yes it’s a racing sim, but it’s also a video game, I want to have fun while playing.
But if/when they add Bathurst and Long Beach, I’ll probably come crawling right back!
I did the same and share the same sentiment. So in terms of OP's title, it's the opposite. I've liked it less and less over time.
I'm an absolute racing game nut - arcade, sim, console, PC. I will play and enjoy them all really.
I've always found Forza's to be amazing games which I've had a soft spot for. I even enjoyed the last few motorsports, but not as much as no.4 for example obviously.
Personally for me with this latest one, it's not as much of a 'game' as I wanted it to be. We've seen the DF video recently and I am always ok with headlights being more detailed on GT7 and physics not on par with many other SIMs but FM would always provide a better 'game'. Such as choice of activities, career, progression etc.
Now that is just gone. The builders cup is just quick races wrapped up into one menu/series. I don't want to do the 4/5 bland feature races to get one random FOMO car. It's not interesting in a world where there are so many games to play (with not enough time) and GBs on my devices are better used up elsewhere.
So regardless of any issues I may have with physics or graphics, I just can't believe this is a Forza Motorsport with no real 'game' to it.
It's a real shame and I hope (expect) to be back again in the future.
PS I also at first did not mind car points but over time it's become something that makes things even more boring.
The thing is, when the previous games had great graphics and features and car lists, ships without it... in a semi niche type of game, the player base dies and people move on.
This game is a clear downgrade, especially on pc
During the launch week I left a 1 star review on FM 2023. I was so bummed at the PC performance and the visual quality. I've since updated that review to a 4 star. Visuals & performance on PC are night and day different from launch. I'm a huge GT fan and love GT7, however with each I love FM 2023 a little more each time. The general physics are fun, the car selection I am happy enough with, tracks wise both my favourite tracks are now in FM 2023 that don't feature in GT7 (Silverstone & Hockenheim). FM is a great game and with a few more QOL updates will become greater.... lastly, I hope they bring the high Res grass detail back in a future update, good I wish visually we were playing the pre release version right now, that said I can live without that.
We need a "No Sodium Forza" sub for people who are not interested in hating and "built from the ground up" comments, and who are enjoying the game.
I'd be there in a second.
You know you can just not click on these threads?
Or avoid reading them?
Or not leave a comment.
It's like - the people who have a different opinion to you are able to co-exist in the same space if only you can just let them have a different opinion to you.
I disagree - I’m bored after 2 races and just turn it off - not played for 3 days - need to do the career races for the new car but just lack the will to even be bothered to start.
It’s a ton of fun on xbox… but on PC it’s pretty bad given the other sims out there. AC with free mods looks better, feels better and has more content… and if you don’t want to mess with mods, Automobilista 2 is great out of the box and it blows forza away. But, I do agree that it’s a better game then GT7.
Calls out users when he himself is notorious for trolling and spreading bs all over GT subs. Not only that, but you step over the line by being disgusting degenerate even in reddits standards to other users regularly and that's why you've been banned multiple times from there. Not going to engage with you further, but thought this is useful note for anyone thinking about interacting with the post.
"I spread BS" ah yes, actual information is BS because it doesn't agree with the GT fanbase
All I would do is point out an issue or make a note of some issue, and offer a solution.
And I'd always get some sort of dumbest response about how actually no everything's perfect and I just don't understand this perfect Japanese racing game or some shit. It was always ridiculous
I'm not the only one. Every single fucking person who brought up and issue or suggested a change was "crying" "whining" "go play something else" "go play forza" like half of your recent comments are you lying about fucking forza man. What is wrong with the GT fanbase????
Also my bans were for calling someone a "mindless Sony consumer" and for calling electric cars "kinda gay" as a rib.
I agree with everything you said here except the car levelling,
Maybe I’m strange but I love it!
I’ll pick a car I like the look of for a championship, usually a car I’ve always liked the look of IRL and if I take to it in the first few races then that car will be lovingly owned by me.
All the way to level 50, even if it’s not the most competitive in its class, it’s mine and I’ll fuck about with it with all the passion I had when I initially took a shine to it!
On reaching level 50 it gets awarded a customised downloaded paint job to show its status amongst my non levelled cars.
Also, the racing in this game is unequaled in console racers imo
I see. We have to say the opposite of the truth. Thems the rules. Got it, chief!
For me, the game never had any issues launching or with random crashes. No issues with multiplayer freezing and chucking me out either. No issues with rammers and dirty drivers using my car as a natural way to brake. I definitely do not have issues with people on the forums having not had any issues of this sort telling me that the game is wonderful if you squint just so and wear some rose tinted glasses when looking at it.
What are your AI settings? I am really interested, I don’t know what to do. Every race when I start at the end of the pack is just destruction derby while climbing to the top 5, 3 place - and there real race begins.
Some contact? There must be something wrong in mine settings, they just ram me like I am not there, like they didn’t acknowledge my car. What level of difficulty are you playing? Are they smarter at 8-10?
I hadn't played Forza for years. I think I played 7 super breifly at some point.
Before this, I was playing GT7 with my best friend. He had never really played Forza and absolutely loved it compared to GT7. I do too actually.
I miss the old leveling system, the game modes like drift and drag, and the auction house. They probably could have just reskinned an older Forza, added a few of the physics things, more cars, and them resold the game like that every single year and I would still buy it.
Deff not a proper career. A love letter to irl racing? Yet forza gt class is miles worse then the gr3 gr4 cars in gt. How is it a love letter to irl racing when you have 6 different racing regulations crammed into one? The devs don't understand irl motorsport in the slightest
Competitive AI? Did they fix it? AI was the worst part for me by far, made it impossible to enjoy career. 1-2 cars running 2 seconds a lapp faster than everyone, And the rest lagging behind like dumbfucks. However, if you manage to pass the 1st cars on the first lap, they become dumbfucks too and suddenly can't drive. And when I say dumbfucks I mean it, just try to stop in the middle of the track. AI will stop behind you.
Went to play it after spending the morning playing AMS2 and uh...I might never touch it again. Like driving on ice skates against the opponents from Destruction Derby 2.
I agree with you to a large extent but I do miss the old career races that were track days, or special missions, or recapped a historic race event and then put you in the middle of it to recreate it. Iirc for example there was one in the rain, with 70s era F1 cars and then the graphics suddenly went black & white.. that was amazing. Just some more 'soul' and variation, like an extra mode with those kind of challenge would just immediately make it feel less clinical and austere
God I hate it when this suddenly-popular "this is a love letter to..." saying gets thrown around everywhere now. It's dumb. Besides that, what blew you away?
I think this Forza on PC is miles ahead of GT7 for multiplayer. GT7 requires $10 a month, forever, to be able to play online. Over time that's a total ripoff, imho. Plus, GT7 doesn't allow any tuning at all online, except maybe the brake bias if you're lucky. Lastly, GT7 gives you a whopping 3 tracks for a whole week in multiplayer (not counting the odd tournament). Forza lets you tune even in spec mode, plus offers modes where you can race your upgraded and tuned car. GT7 can't even comprehend such heresy, apparently. Forza has six different modes for multiplayer currently, double GT7. And each mode has a different track each race, not the SAME EXACT track every race as in GT7.
Forza has issues of course, and of course the sims like ACC are going to be more realistic. But I think Forza is good for what it is, especially the multiplayer.
I agree OP. I mostly avoid this sun due to it. I’ve just had a BLAST with the new FM. It’s literally brought me joy. Waited for it a loooong time and it has delivered.
I just jumped back into the game after playing it the first couple days then not at all.
I still hate the limitations imposed on me for customizing my cars in career mode. But otherwise the game controlled great. Until I decided to plug my G920 in. Hooooooboy. That was an incredibly terrible experience. Tried some settings that others posted here, it helped but... Still quite shit. Wasn't even using a hard to control car, 718 spyder gt3, only a little over 400hp, had aero. The behavior of the car was so much different I couldn't control it that well.
Back to controller. Game is OK, but it just doesn't feel fun anymore, especially with those career mode restrictions.
I'm having a very hard time trying to like/love the game. I'm pissed about the state of multiplayer and available lobbies/options.
With a small baby at home I have a very limited time I can actually play, not counting work hours. When she goes down for a nap I'd like to hop on and knock out a race or two. BUT no, I have to jump into a practice session that takes 25 minutes, then load for a few, then 1 min intermission, and onto a race that will take maybe 8 minutes. It's absolutely insane. And it's not even the class I want to race in. Not to mention having a lobby full of people that didn't pay for the game and think it's bumper cars. This game pushes me right back to COD, I know different genre, but I can hop in a MP game within a minute and get my gaming fix for a bit.
Built from the ground up yet it has the same issues/bugs as previous titles.
Customization sucks.
For being a racing game, why the hell do they only offer one livery per car? Wouldn't it make sense to offer different color options/versions/car numbers for each 'race' car? It's always awesome to see 15 copies of the same car on the grid. Just like IRL /s. Even with the ability to paint your own, download someone else's.
With all that, plus every other complaint stated by others, this is my last FM.
car leveling completely kills it for me, so lame to want to try out a new car in multiplayer but oops you have to afk for 3 hours to get it to the level where you can tune it, at least the spec events are fun ig
I've yet to understand whats great about these physics. Honestly. For the rest, i enjoy the game for a race or two...Enough games out there. Assetto corsa 2 will destroy this game this year or the next so thats why i'm chilling on that front. Destroy it, completely. Even gt7
You like FM because you have already played a fair lot of GTS and GT7, but trust me, if you would not know both games and would play both to see which one you prefer more, it would be 100% GT7. So, fair enough that you like FM currently, but as you pointed out the complaints about it are legit and they will continue for as long as it takes Turn10 to actually make an actual next gen game out of it because compared to FM7 from over 6 yrs ago this for sure is not the game people were hoping for given the time and resources Turn10 has at its disposal. So its not necessarily that FM is objectively a "bad gam", its that it fell short of valid expectations and a lot of the game is simply reused from the previous one.
Even if I understand your points, I still believe that this game had underdelivered - and unfortunately is still underdelivering.
The new car upgrade mechanics are free to play bullshit. Probably at some point Microsoft even thought adding some sort of micro transaction to speed everything up, but they changed their minds.
Driving feels good, that’s the main reason why I am still playing it, but a lot of stuff around that is just a step back. I am not listing everything, there are plenty of posts here with the main issues.
What I found really disappointing is how old this game looks in 2023. Normally car games or racing games are showcasing how powerful a console is.
Well if you want a benchmark, look at forza horizon 5. That game is a masterpiece in its genre and also from a visual perspective.
This FM looks just a step behind the last FM, which is something I don’t really understand. The car models are good but not very detailed - I drive from the inside and it is a low poly count and low res textures fest. There are a bunch of cars where these visual issues are not so strong, but try to have a look at the speed or RPMs behind the wheel, you will instantly see what I mean.
I cannot really share also your enthusiasm for the AI. Once you overtake the first position the game is basically over. Yesterday I had some hard time trying to surpass a car that was faster than me for 4 races. In the last race I could manage to gain the first position after the first curve, at the end of the race, the same car that I was struggling overtaking, had more than 30 seconds delay.
What the fuck?
So it’s a good game, but it’s also a disappointing one.
Competitive AI? They just crash at you at the first corner like on a multiplayer race. They get far behind once you pass them and the first 3 are almost unreachable. AI is s***
people like you are the reason gamedevs nowadays can sell shitty unfinished game for full price, you maybe have the money and dont care but when not so rich people buy things they want their moneys worth, i payed 100€ for the game with bonus content, i was super hyped, just to be unbelievably disappointed, forza motorsport is an insult, they have the marketing budget to trick people into buying but not for the game itself, youre WECLCOME
> worth, i *paid* 100€ for
FTFY.
Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in:
* Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.*
* *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.*
Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment.
*Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
My game freezes on start up, every time. Sometimes after five min it will go the the home menu, and after one or two races it will just shut down. Had this pc for almost a year 6800xt-5600x, first game I have ever had problems with. I have the settings turned down no Rt, and nothing but problems, even though getting over 100fps. The game is good though, love racing with the wheel, when I can.
There’s more problems with this game than good things. Bugs, glitches, horrible ai, trash ffb, all cars feeel generally similar. Anybody that likes this game is forcing themselves to like it or has never played a good simulator.
This whole thread is basically "Stockholm Syndrome encapsulated". I wonder how many of you are reading your own comments.
"When it actually works, is so fun", "If you forget about these things its actually great!", "At least it handles nice, unlike other games on the market".
It IS bad; It IS greedy; It IS half-baked. Stop excusing everything as if you were trying to prove to everyone that there is an actual value on that thing to everyone.
I was having so much fun grinding thru the career mode. I was playing an OFFLINE mode, my internet stuttered and I got booted mid race and told that i can only play free roam while offline. I deleted the game and cancelled my game pass subscription that I had to try this game.
Sick fucking game, but always online bullshit really grinds my tits.
It’s a fantastic game. Wish it ran well on the Steam Deck. It’s inexplicable how Forza Horizon 5 is a better looking game and runs amazingly on the Steam Deck. I hate having to sit at my PC every time I play a racing game. Finished the career mode on Motorsport and thoroughly enjoyed it.
I’m glad you’re enjoying the game, I am too! However, I am highly confused about your “solid career” and “competitive AI” comments. I really only have three complaints about the game; horrible AI, barebones career, and far too many crashes.
I also quit on GT7 for reasons, and while the AI in Forza may be better than the abysmal AI that GT7 had on release, Forza’s AI is nowhere near the ballpark or even zip code of competitive. And the career mode is the most barebones career Forza has ever seen. GT7’s, while not great by any means, definitely beats FM here.
Since getting game on Steam early access, I have put in 230 hours into FM. There's definitely great game play in the title, reguardless of the low content, poor optimisation, and contentious car leveling system. When I drive or race in FM, the issues seem to go away.
When Turn 10 rights this ship, FM is going to be awesome! It has the potential to be the best Forza Motorsport title out if every FM that came before it. Hopefully T10 doesn't screw it up any more.
(Gimmie them down votes!)
I don't think we're playing the same games.
As a competitive player, GT7 offers everything you want and need with Sport mode, Manufacturers Cup, Nations Cup etc.
The main complaint i see all the time about GT7 is how much cars cost compared to what you earn but me being someone who only ever plays Sport mode, Manu Cup, Nations Cup, i always rent the cars anyways so i don't even spend credits on the game.
Now let's look at some direct comparisons regarding competitive play on these two games:
FM2023
1. Rating System doesn't really equate to the actual driver skill since everyone and their mom reaches 4999 rather quickly and easily.
Matchmaking doesn't work. Still finishing 30s+ ahead of p2 while starting from last most of the time.
2. No special ranked events.
3. Penalty System not working as expected at all and very abusable. (Very rarely games get it right except games with live stewarding like iRacing in special events)
4. Egregious Forza GT Class: in this subclass you have GT4, GT3, GTE, Super Trofeo (soon with the huracán evo coming), Trans-am, Challenge Cars (488) and Factory Track Race Cars (Essenza).
4.1. The Balance for the TC class is ok, for the GT class is horrible because of the aforementioned problem.
note.: this subclass is borderline insulting but it can be improved if they take each of the specs i mentioned that are in it and make it their own with more car releases of each class.
Gran Turismo 7
1. Rating system not optimal, but certainly more fleshed out.
2. Matchmaking seems to work more often than not in Daily B and C races from personal experience. (usually my A+ lobbies are pretty close in quali times from top 7 onwards except when the ocasional pro player or ultra cracked player joins)
3. Same as FM2023
4. Decently put together classes. There is still meta cars as it happens in every multiplayer game but the field is closer together more often than not. (fuck the genesis gr3, supra gr3 and gtr gr3 though).
PhysX - both games went different ways but both physics are enjoyable.
Video Quality - better on GT7 personally because it's much clearer and vibrant but FM2023 is pretty good as well more often than not.
Car sounds - FM2023 overall, lots of race cars in GT7 still sound like vaccuum cleaners.
Well... It's your opinion after all, there is no wrong and right to personal opinion. But I guess it's just agree to disagree. I'll just ask one simple question: is this your first ever Forza from the Motorsport series?
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to be deletionist and put you in the corner because "you didn't go through the same experiences I have in order to have such opinion". What I'm trying to say is that out of all Motorsports games, this is the most mediocre one by a large margin. I will co-sign everything you just said about physics and gameplay, this game is just different from anything I've ever laid hands.
But what does it do only by itself? Is this all a racing game has to offer? You get in a track with your realistic driving car, spin around for 5 minutes and say "oh, me car feels nice". Is this enough for you?
The car points system is farmy. The career mode is farmy. It has no sense of progression whatsoever, you just feel like you are doing different things from time to time. You leave event A, you are forced to buy car B to compete in event B. You basically spend all the IG credits just to be able to play.
The multiplayer is extremely limited the rotation system is extremely unfun, and this is all it has to offer. Why on earth would they remove class lobbies? Why would they remove open track day lobbies? No drifting game modes anywhere, even though the game labels certain car parts exclusive for this use?
Back to the part where I ask if this is your first Motorsport game, this is what I'm talking about. They have torn to pieces a decade old formula, trying to force down our throats this lame ass "built from the ground up" propaganda.
If they were trying to be bold and create another whole game apart from a pretty much legendary series, they should have just named it a different thing. It's a different dev team anyways...
Am I asking too much here? It feels like I'm playing an online demo with limited game modes and features removed from previous Motorsports...
I tell everyone this game is great and it's like a souls game lol. Every straight or corner is like a boss battle. Never know if you gonna get spun out, pushed off, dive bombed or my favorite taking a corner wide to push you off when side by side on a corner lol
If you enjoy racing, it's a fantastic game. Everything else is questionable.
Races aren't long enough, pit strategies pointless, car balance not great. However the actual wheel to wheel racing, so damn enjoyable that it makes you come back for more.
It is. Much like FH5, it's a fantastic core wrapped in a big stinking dog shit. The racing and the cars is great. I have only good things to say about it. **Everything** else is either mediocre or downright idiotic and broken. It's such a shame. I'm picturing the core competence engine dev team sitting there having mixed feelings about doing a great job while a bunch of absolute idiot project managers and game designers just shit all over the fruits of their labours.
Someone on the Forza forums put it best: "*Until Turn 10 gets their act together and delivers a product worth the price they are asking for it, people need to stop using the whole “Forza’s got a great core!” line of thought as an handwave for the rest of the game’s problems. It honestly should feel like an insult at this stage. It’s like standing in the middle of the remnants of a house gutted by fire and declaring it livable because the foundation is rock-solid.*"
wouldn’t it be more like appreciating the potential of the house given the presence of a solid foundation?
> _robjamesmusic : wouldn’t it be more like appreciating the potential of the house given the presence of a solid foundation? No "appreciating potential" until they actually *deliver* on it. Until then, "potential" is literally nothing.
Bingo. When you get a meal from a restaurant, you don’t eat around the cockroach.
Then we will need to keep appreciating the potential instead of actually experiencing it lol. While the devs appreciate the very real solid money of ours.
This. This x100.
Playing online with clean drivers is sooo fun and it makes you forget about the issues
It is fantastic fun. It’d be more fun with some sort of radar system and proper matchmaking. But the reason I stopped playing is multiplayer replays. How the fuck are you supposed to improve without it and to rub salt in the wound the fucking button is still there, mocking you.
Three months since release and in the 3rd monthly update they didn't even mention replays. Out of everything in the game this is by far the most egregious failure by turn10. What kind of racing game has no functional replays three months from launch? They were broken at launch. The only time you can see them is rivals and career, but only in the race itself. You can't save *single player* replays dog. Absolute slap in the face.
If the game doesn’t crash right before the race after a half hour practice. I haven’t been able to play with my friends since update 2 and update 3 didn’t help. I’m currently trying to figure out how to buy 7 for the pc is my friends and I can play.
Yes, but then again, only about 1 in 10 games are good because matchmaking is fucked.
Competitive AI… My brother in Christ it is literally same shitty Horizon AI on higher difficulties where one car bolts into the distance at unreal pace and rest of the field is driving behind you in a one huge conga line And then if you are fast enough to catch the leader and pass him he will lose all his pace and just drive behind you with no intention to make a pass
Plus, the AI doesn't know if it wants to be avoidant (to a fault) or aggressive (read: ramming into you). In short, the AI lacks consistency in every way. I'd rather have the moving obstacles from GT than that.
My brother in christ have you seen GT7's AI 🤣 this shit is competitive in comparison. Definitely not perfect tho. Granted I've got the difficulty maxed out and top 1-3 isn't super hard. But at least they offer an actual race
Light years behind Sophy
Sophy was easier for me to beat, in the handful of events it was in (19 iirc) and sophy also had more issues with problematic contact, like just slamming into people at high speed Sophy is really wierd because they made a big deal out of it, but it has to be watered down to fucntion on console, making it useless. It's barely on par with PS3 game AI, even PS2 in some cases. Meanwhile the base GT ai actually have capability, but it's purposely taken away from them and their behavior is super wierd. There's a good roflwaffle video about this
You’re mad if you think the Sophy AI isn’t good. The forza AI literally cheat their PI to whatever the game feels like!
Yea lmao, the only weird thing sophy does is keeping thottle at like 90% on straight lines, but seems more like a gameplay thing that they forced there
If you think the AI in this game is good, then try F1 2023. You'll be blown away lol.
Why are you bringing GT7 into this discussion, I haven’t mentioned it anywhere, my point was FM AI is terrible not FM AI is worse than racing game XY AI Saying FM AI is less shitty than GT’s is not making FM AI good
I'm just saying its what my point of view is. It's what my basis is
Bro GT7 AI is way ahead of this shit, their new AI you can race against is amazing and actually competitive, at this stage I would rather play GT7 but both have their flaws. I’m a diehard fan of both but Forza fucked us with this car level bullshit and all the unstableness it’s actually criminal Microsoft let this be released like this.
Y'all slating this guy for stating his opinion, lol you lot need to grow up
Yeah and that’s my view, sorry I forgot to add that. Didn’t mean to be rude, but it’s as clear as day the difference with these two games.
All matters on what you want in a game tbh, personally I see a lot of potential in Forza but GT7 tends to dry out quite quickly IMO
Yeah I know what you mean both games suffer from lack of offline content. GT7 looks like it’s trying to fix it with all the races they added and no more catch up races finally, they also do a bunch of special weekly races for single player which is nice but can be done pretty quickly. I feel like there needs to be a lot done with Forza. I was waiting for a game called Ark (usually has a lot of glitches) to come out recently and the studio pushed the release date back to make sure their game is stable on launch and it’s been way more stable than forza… how does forza get away with this it’s so embarrassing showing my mates the new forza but then it crashes on me all the time (seriesX).
True Forza is a buggy mess but is still pretty good and the updates on GT7 make the game brilliant but being completely honest I'd rather play Crew Motorfest since it's pretty much a completely new game from the last
PROPER CAREER you are pushing a bit there mate. It has random, disconnected events designed to inflate the single player playtime. Utterly boring. It's a massive disappointment to see the career mode get worse in each iteration of Forza Motorsport.
Dude really said "competitive AI"
"Solid career. Competitive AI" "Objectively a good game" LOL
This is obviously your first Forza. >“This is a love letter to irl racing and cars. The classes, the tracks, the events.” This is one of the most artificially decontented and bland Forza titles in… ever. The career mode is objectively bare bones. The multiplayer lobby selection is objectively slim at best. The track count is objectively tiny. The car roster is objectively tiny. The amount of recycled car models dating to 10-15 years old is objectively egregious. The amount of bugs is unforgivable. The lack of optimization is laughable. The new features are poorly implemented. Speaking of: - replays still broken - still no forecast for random-ass weather system; completely voids the point of tire selection - still no proxy radar unlike every other major sim/simcade title - broken penalty system - broken matchmaking system - no auction house - no drift/drag modes - no long-format race durations - pit system is bare bones - no AI in private lobbies - no ability to customize individual competitor cars in free play (but you could in past titles) - same archaic photo mode - Forza vista/auto vista is so bad it’s not even a feature anymore; terrible lighting to hide details, no more per-vehicle context specific trivia; reduced exploration freedom (interior view is on limited rails); extreme glitches persisting - car upgrade screen removing critical info like dyno graphs and at-glance quick changes - sound track lacks passion (take FM4 - [Paris Rouen](https://youtu.be/guHnXAQboKE?si=dfz4ECzcmSPwyz79) and [Ballistic Circuit](https://youtu.be/p1KOBt1C-Fw?si=En-DdoLl5gnQcGAb) for reference) - livery editor still broken - worst career mode of any title, factual - cxp universally decried for obvious reasons; impacts all facets of game bleeding into multiplayer freedom/meta So many objectively, poorly managed decisions making this game. So much content held back to be trickled to you as “a feature” as opposed to hiding the reality that you are unusually grateful to pay full price $70-100 for a AAA-made Early Access Beta, where you are the play tester, and all of the content is just sitting there for them to release on artificial time gates. The only significant improvements they made over past Forza titles are the physics and controller-specific handling. I’d count the weather system if it was actually implemented correctly. Crazy amount of slurping OP. Here’s a napkin m’bro. And if these physics are blowing your load, try giving AMS2 a shot. Or ACC. If this game makes you go “fuck, so good” you might bust a nut into the shadow realm playing those two.
Ok, im curious. What else do you want to see implemented in the pit system? We got tire compounds, we got fuel levels, we get to pick damages to fix if damage is on, what else is there to add on? Also, why are people so adamant about the auction house? Aside from being able to auction off one-of-a-kind liveries I honestly dont see a need for it. Money is basically useless after a couple hours of play, you've got more than you'll ever need. I'm sitting on something like 5mil just by doing a handful of online races every day, even after going on a shopping binge and picking up five cars to try out in the open A class lobbies.
>What else do you want to see implemented in the pit system? We got tire compounds, we got fuel levels, we get to pick damages to fix if damage is on, what else is there to add on? Fair question. Before talking about improvements, they need to fix the exploit that saves 1+ seconds by choosing fuel amount as the car decelerates into its box. Fixing fuel by adjusting to laps selected as opposed to fuel per tank is more logical. Being able to pre-plan pit strategies like most other games. And ultimately, having races long enough where pit strategy actually becomes something. There's no level of strat involved, it's usually a simple med/med, soft/med or med/soft combo. Maybe an outlier where you can run hards to finish no pit. But that's my main issue and I didn't word correctly bc I was flying through the list: the pit system is underutilized bc there aren't any race lengths to necessitate varied strats. There isn't a forecast system, so there's zero strat involved outside of luck and chance if there's inclement weather involved. TLDR - add logical fuel options, add pit planning, add forecasting, add longer races, fix exploits >Also, why are people so adamant about the auction house? Aside from being able to auction off one-of-a-kind liveries I honestly dont see a need for it. Money is basically useless after a couple hours of play, you've got more than you'll ever need. I'm sitting on something like 5mil just by doing a handful of online races every day, even after going on a shopping binge and picking up five cars to try out in the open A class lobbies. It was a way to buy unlocked tunes and cars with preset upgrades. They probably got rid of it bc it would circumvent the CaRPG system. It was a great way to make quick cash and to find exclusive cars that T10 loves to abuse the FOMO system to death with. Eg: you were on vacation this week? Didn't have time to grind away to "earn" that exclusive car? Well tough luck, you won't get it. At least the auction house allowed you to buy it after the window.
The pit time exploit does need to be fixed, I will agree. The fuel by percent is a great idea in concept, but from what I've seen personally theres no major difference in lap time between 10% and 11% fuel load so I wouldnt object to that being changed to laps vs % load. Pre-planning pit strats I'm a little less enthusiastic about, especially if they tweak tire wear like I'm expecting them to sometime in the future(which they may not). This is all just anecdotal evidence from a sample size of one (me), but tire strats can play a pretty big role, especially when starting from the back. However, conditions can absolutely change on the fly requiring you to change your strat with them. Premature tire wear because you overshot a corner on mediums after 10+ minutes of practice and quali on softs can cook your tires pretty quick. I can see the use especially for players who arent familiar with the game or its mechanics to have a set of pre-made strats to guide them, but to be honest I already head in to a race with a game plan in my head, I dont really see the need to add an extra level of complication or an extra step to go through when setting up the car for a race beyond what we already have. Longer races I'll give you, although by technicality thats not really a change to the pit system but rather the races themselves. I sincerely hope that when they implement the nurburging they'll implement actual endurance races with it, it'd be a crime not to. As for tire strategies, this is my biggest point of contention. There is a massive amount of strategy involved if are willing to drive right, or even take risks with your race. Are your times on soft tires in practice at the top of the lobby, but you feel like starting from the back? Go hard to soft. You'll lose precious time on those hards when it comes to lap time, but you're going to lose precious tire fighting through the pack on mediums. Long stint on hards to get clear air, then short stint on softs once the carnage has shaken out was worked multiple times for me. Doing the reverse has on occasion worked as well, although this is likely much more dependent on the car as starting on pole on softs in the lambo right now isnt going to do you any good. Heck, if you're good to your tires, theres certain cars and tracks that you can run medium/soft on so long as you dont push your mediums too hard at race start. Again, my sample size is me on that one, but its def possible to do. When it comes to race weather, I've noticed that it likes to change around the mid point of the race. Earlier today for example I jumped on Le Mans for a race in the GT spec hopper forecasted as "overcast wet". Track was very wet for practice, but bone dry on the grid during the 60 second interval for setting fuel and tire loads. Driving the 2017 RSR, I put on mediums on for the race start, was in something like 12th at the end of lap 2. I pitted, put wet tires on, and by the time I hit the Mulsanne it was belting down rain and I wound up with a podium at the end. This isnt a 100% accurate pattern, and I agree that I would very much like some form of either weather radar or at least a radio call out to let me know how if/when the weather would change, but there can absolutely be strategy with the weather system as it is right now. >It was a way to buy unlocked tunes and cars with preset upgrades. They probably got rid of it bc it would circumvent the CaRPG system. It was a great way to make quick cash and to find exclusive cars that T10 loves to abuse the FOMO system to death with. Eg: you were on vacation this week? Didn't have time to grind away to "earn" that exclusive car? Well tough luck, you won't get it. At least the auction house allowed you to buy it after the window. I hate the FOMO system and would much rather it either be scrapped entirely or failing that used for exclusive race suits since those dont have any actual effect on gameplay. That said, I was also never particularly fond of the auction house when I dealt with it on FH4/5. Yeah the fomo cars could be cool, but I sure as fuck wasnt going to pay 20mil for one single car, I'd just buy something else or forget about it completely. Dealing with auction snipers sucked ass as well, forcing you to pay the buyout price. At that point my options were either give up, or grind wheelspins for cash, neither of which were exciting prospects to me. I personally have no love for the auction house and dont really care that its gone, but I can see the value in it for people who really want whatever the last FOMO car they missed.
Literally every one of your “factual“ and “objective” takes are actually anecdotal and subjective.
That’s fair Change objective to obvious and my points still stand
Take it down a fucking notch. I'm aware that it's lacking. It's not my first forza title, although it's been a long time (FM1) My thing is, past the issues and things missing, there's still nothing like this in the simcade market. That's my thing here. PC is dead. GT is car sales simulator now. Grid was OK but sadly not well received. FM is literally the only simcade on the market atm with a structured build up type career like this,which is incredibly nice. It's no full blown sim. It certainly does feel good tho, coming from irl
>Take it down a fucking notch. First off, calm down buddy. Second, no, I don’t think I will You’re in the comments saying that people are falsely burying this as a broken game It is a legitimately broken, failed game in its current state It does not legitimize its pricetag. It is not a $70 game, nor a $100 one. It is still broken for the majority of people. Ever wonder why people are bitching about it and drowning out any praise that might come up? You think people linger around Forza forums because they hate the game? It’s likely that most of us are long time Forza fans since the early days of the franchise and we’re sick and tired of T10 shitting down our necks and using rip-off tactics to string along a broken product for a 2-3 year cycle before it finally “gets good” This game is the culmination of every wrong management decision T10’s made
Petty as ever lol
Again, take it down FM isn't a broken game. It's a _deeply flawed game_, but it's not broken. Cyberpunk was broken. Dakar 2022 was broken. FM is flawed. FM needs work. What I'm tired of people doing is writing off the entire game due to these things. Because at it's core it's a genuinely good simcade and had the only structured career on the market in that genre T10/PG have been making bad decisions for like a decade now. My issue is that so has almost every other racing game franchise, yet Forza gets all the hate I'm the exact same way you are about these things. The exact same way. But with GT. Exact same situation. Maybe I'm in a "grass is greener here" situation. Idk
Again, right back at you The game is broken. Not figuratively speaking, but objectively. Speaking about the “launch issues” as if they’re past issues—when the same problems still persist to this today, creating a ‘broken’ experience—is just weirdly apologetic and dismissive to support your opinion. When does a game cross the line from “deeply flawed” to “broken” Are repeat crashes to desktop enough, terrible frame rates and flickering, recycled content making up the majority of the game, missing features, artificially locked content, etc all just “deep flaws” or signs of a broken product I don’t understand what motivates someone to back the poor leadership behind T10 when they’re clearly taking advantage of you, the consumer By lying to you with marketing promises that are egregiously broken, by ignoring the fanbase and its common requests for a decade+, by stripping the soul out of its title from fans like the majority here that have been with the franchise for ages Idk what you’re trying to prove here tbh
Man you've got real fucking reading comprehension problem don't you? I'm fucking agreeing with you. Dumbass. What I'm saying is that the core is a good game. People are ignoring that. A game is broken, imo, when not only does it have function issues but the overall gameplay is simply lacking or terrible. Cyberpunk and Dakar were my examples for this reason. Never played it, but I'm guessing Redfall would be another good example. Games that even when fixed are dogshit. Now, they shouldn't have to be fixed in the first place. But here we are.....
How about you take it down a notch
> What I'm saying is that the core is a good game. It doesn't fucking matter, if the rest is absolutely abysmal. >People are ignoring that. no, they're not. pay more attention.
Whew, take it down a notch bro
>Cyberpunk and Dakar were my examples for this reason. Funny enough most people only had problems with the framerates which is something that forza is having problems with too. Aka broken. Cyberpunk now changed to a 92%. Forza is a broken game too.
You’re getting ratioed and just keep at this point quintupling down. You’re the clear minority here. You said you haven’t played since fm1. So you don’t know jack shit aboutt this franchise and the expectations set over their pretty successful run. If you’re okay with subpar products that’s okay, but I’d stop trying to tell everyone else that they’re wrong and the game is in fact good. We all want a good game, some of us are basically lifetime fans and players, but this game sucks.
> TC2-Drive-N-Vibe : What I'm tired of people doing is writing off the entire game due to these things. Because at it's core it's a genuinely good simcade The fact that there's one shiny undigested peanut buried somewhere in a huge pile of manure is nowhere near enough to deem the entire pile delicious enough to gobble up. ...For many, the flavor of so much dung spoils the taste of that perfect peanut when they finally get to it. The one or two things a game does well are not enough to make up for it simultaneously doing so many other things very poorly. Nothing is perfect, but the bare minimum goal should at least be for the good to outweigh the bad - & it doesn't. ...If 10% of a game is great but 90% of it is garbage, it's only natural for people to write the whole thing off.
I think that some of us are a little bit just disappointed, because we had a really high hopes. This game should be top of the top, GT7 killer. Right now I can’t say that new game beat older GT7, yeah it’s better in some aspects but worse in others.
What are you talking about? ACC may be a full blown sim but being GT3 makes it super accessible with traction control and ABS being enforced. It's also a far superior game for online play and even its barebones career is miles better than this shitty carpg. F1 2023 has the best career mode in a racing game ever, it's a simmy simcade with very accessible driving mechanics. WRC has you covered for rally. And if you want to collect cars and drive around FH5 is a vastly superior game. There's 0 reason to play this game if you're on PC. It's mostly negative on steam for a reason. Just ditch the "sim vs simcade label" and jump into real racing games, because this one isn't even that authentic to begin with. There's much, much better racing to be had elsewhere.
lol even FM5 and GTS have a better career than this
GTS also has a better career than GT7 lol. Anything, literally anything, is better than that near completely linear pile of sony slop that was billed as a gt7 career mode. It was poured into the trough and Sony pay pigs like you happily gobble it up
If you’re coming from FM1, I can see how you would want to praise this game. But if you saw Forza at its peak in FM4, it becomes obvious this game is severely lacking.
> FM is literally the only simcade on the market atm but it's shiiiiit
If youre that miserable with the game play a different one
Would it surprise you that I already do Are you upset with valid criticism?
No, I'm more just upset when people can't let anyone else enjoy something without attempting pass on their misery
>browses discussion section on a post that openly invites a discussion about the game being shit on Final remarks of OP's post: "Just tired of seeing nothing but shit shit shit on this game when it's objectively a good game, and far exceeds its main competitor at being a racing game" What are you expecting when people paid $100 only to get ripped off It's a discussion section and it's very evident that a ton of people disagree with him Scroll on if it upsets you
Yeah cause calling op a cock sucker for enjoying the game is contributing to his discussion. The game has many issues, too short of races in public lobbies, no consistent low class races (though i still would only race in GT), pseudo battlepass to unlock random cars, while it is weirdly satisfying seeing a car being built up with the level system, not being able to just build something is annoying, not having the nordschleif on launch (lmfao), but i enjoy the time i spend just racing with friends. Im not an angsty teen anymore, getting unreasonably mad over a game for being shit due to garbage management and only chasing playtime rather than something engaging is a waste of energy.
>Yeah cause calling op a cock sucker for enjoying the game is contributing to his discussion. I think you're the only one calling him that in this entire section though, and if your implication is that us (or just me) posting valid criticisms of the game is somehow equivalent to that, I have no clue what to tell you lmao >Im not an angsty teen anymore, getting unreasonably mad over a game for being shit due to garbage management and only chasing playtime rather than something engaging is a waste of energy. Neither are we? Is complaining about a company charging $100 for a clearly unfinished game exclusively an action for angsty teens?
It's specifically you. the majority of others accept that OP can have fun and share their grievances, but you're the one just trying to spread misery. Hope you can grow out of it someday man, maybe find a better hobby or game you enjoy more.
Wow, did you just call me a cocksucker? I’m just tracking with your line of sensitivity brother
Lmao. If you want to think so, then i guess. But no you specifically called op a cock sucker.
You are comparing it to GT. Compare it to any of the previous 7 Forza motorsports titles and the newest is the weakest of the bunch.
Not exactly
Its why people are so emotional about the issues, at its core the racing and car feel is fantastic. It's just horribly let down by bugs and a lack of content structure and volume. I have high hopes for where this game will be in a years' time. I'm totally down for the live service content. I just hope enough players stick around to make it viable.
this must be a joke letter...
It's a fanboy post.
Dude think this game have a good career mode in his reply, well every game subs always need a weekly cope post
Or….its his genuine opinion? It can’t be that hard to understand my man
>genuine opinion So thats why he calls it an objective statement right?
No it deserves the criticism it’s received. The gameplay is great, but every other aspect of the game there’s major issues
It's great you're enjoying it (I've been spending a lot of time in MP myself), but the game is genuinely broken, anti-player, and lacking features in so many ways.
It has genuine issues, but people trying to bury it as some sort of failed game are simply wrong
Simple reason for me with the CxP system is that they do not value my time so I just don't care for it. Its such an anti player choice for an ingame system and 100% only exist to inflate playtime. It can be the best racing in the world once you have leveled up a car enough to upgrade and tune it, and I am fine with the grind at first. But once the "intial" grind should be over I should be able to tale what I've earned, get a new car and make it race ready on demand. I don't want to start over from scratch everytime I want to try a new vehicle, CxP should never have been tied to specific car.
The Car Xp system is a genuine issue. I get both sides of why they did it. It's just done _wrong_.
Dunno man, I main on GT7 and have tried it on PC and XSX (cross progression is really nice feature). Got to say, I think it’s shite on so many levels, light years behind GT, the physics are slightly less arcadey forza horizon, the lighting is just off, car models are last gen..
As someone with now tons of time in both, FM is levels ahead. Car models don't make a game good, the lighting and physics are better in FM and FM has an actual career
Mmm I'm sorry but no that's not a career mode. It's a few random races where you pick from a selection of cars. Compare it to EA WRC career mode, you have a full calendar view of the season, hire and train engineers/teammates, you have budgets for your repairs and staff, you have to keep your sponsors happy etc. Or how about grid legends, there's a whole story with actors fleshing it out. Or dirt 1, 2, and 3. Project cars 2. Shit the career mode isn't even as good as any of the older FM games.
>that's not a career mode. It's a few random races where you pick from a selection of cars. and yet, you mention > dirt 1, 2, and 3. as having career modes. All three are just that, actually a lot of racing games are like that, including some of very liked games - FM2, FM3, FM4, FM7 included (haven't played FM1/5/6).
> Grid Legends What's funny is the story one there is the shit one. The good career mode in GL doesn't even involve the story. I agree, but it's still a solid career mode, and it's the only simcade with one rn EA WRC is on my list, haven't played yet, won't speak on it since I haven't
>I agree, but it's still a solid career mode, and it's the only simcade with one rn It's not a solid career mode because it isnt a career mode...
You mean that soulless menu? Now I know you’re a troll. Do you work at T10? lol
> soulless menu Yeah that's what GT7 has for sure lol.
How much did turn10 pay you?
GT7 with the soulless menu? The same one that has a whole world map, a cozy looking cafe area, a literal autoshop area with cute and goofy little animations, overviews of tracks when selecting them, as well as overviews when selecting a car that has it driving in the background as well as an option to view the car’s history? Look, GT7 has its fair share of issues, but the menu is great compared to FM’s “sophisticated” (dreary and boring) constant grey boxes.
Look buddy, if he thinks it has more soul than GT7’s menu, that’s his 2 cents. Who are you to tell him what to think?
Exactly...
>It has genuine issues, but people trying to bury it as some sort of failed game are simply wrong I mean most of the core systems are not working at this time lmfao. it kinda is a failed game untill they make it better.
>Solid career > > Competitive AI Care to tell us which Forza exactly you are playing?
I'm coming from other games. Last FM was FM1. I do understand it's lacking.
lol really. I like this Forza REALLY much..but it's my first Motorsport, so I probably don't see all the flaws that the veterans are complaining about. but saying that the career and the AI are valid makes you smile.
GT7 player but your entire account is focused on the crew 2? Back in my days bait used to be less obvious
I don't use this much in general. Reddit generally isn't worth posting on, but the crew community was solid
I respect this .. some communities be 👍
Brother we had 3 races to choose from for MP at launch
It‘s also the little details that bother me, like the wrong rear view mirror in the BMW E46 or false headlights (Xenon-Beams but yellow light and vice versa). But the driving itself is, compared to GT7, much more fun. Just sad they didnt tweak the details and such, screw the perfomance problems. But i want the game to be as accurate as possible and they missed this part not slightly but by a continent
As an E46 owner I'll throw out there that Xenon's were an option, not standard, although not sure if they were on the M
It was optional on the E46 (non M as M), but what i mean is this : there are some cars that have the xenon-lights installed but the light shines yellow
They straight up lied about a fleshed out career mode
>Recently had some time this weekend to sit down, really work thru the career. Fuck me I'm blown away. This is a love letter to irl racing and cars. The classes, the tracks, the events. I thought I was over my initial impressions but I keep finding things to love. Check out some of the older Forza titles then. Because frankly this career is merely a empty shell of it's previous. Both in length, as well as progression. >In GT7, if you wanna race anything in custom race, in a proper Class, if it's not. GR3 or GR4 car you have to buy the entire field and put them all on the same tire. Sounds like not a praise of Forza but rather criticism to Gran Turismo for this absurd system. Being able to pick a class to race is a pretty basic functionality in race games in the last 20 years. Not surprising because GT has always been so weird, quirky and without respect for players time. I'm not surprised the new lack of respect for players time in this Forza doesn't even occur to you.
It's both. I actually played fm1 back in the day, legendary title. And I am very aware of how wasteful the car xp system is It's definitely cut back on content from previous titles....but it's all we have right now that plays similar. I hate this timeline
I think the only good news is they will build off of it hopefully. I guess we'll see future updates but excited for FH6 as well haha
I had so much fun in Horizon series, literally hundreds of hours. Give me proper wheel support and more real physics and I will happy forget about Motorsport. It so disappointing when you are no 1 Superman with controller and with wheel you struggle for top 3.
This is half the issue with modern games. The devs can release a half finished pos with half the content of their last release and people still praise them for making a great game. Some of yall need to wake up
FM7 released with more than twice the tracks and way more options for multiplayer. This games deserves all the shit weve given it
It was also shit
FM7 was so disappointing back then. I remember looking at it and wondering what the fuck T10 was doing, instead of building up to FM6. The weird filter, camera shake, UI, menu. It was almost unrecognizable as a Forza game. Then somehow they made something even worse. Man, the old me wouldn't believe this is what happened to the franchise.
I think it’s miles better rn. The framework here has potential to be amazing in 4-5 good patches. The ones so far even have been really good.
Depends what you want. The racing is like 10x better (maybe not that much but definitely way better) in FM compared to FM7. Same with the physics and graphics. Also don’t forget the dynamic day and night cycle and the weather system which have been requested for *years*
No I fully agree with you. I'm not praising the devs here. I'm praising what's there. I also come from a fanbase where nothing ever got fixed, so T10 constantly updating is a breath of fresh air. It's a flawed game with a phenomenal racing game within. If we keep criticizing the devs those flaws will be worked out Imo game quality tanked mid ps3/360 era
The problem with praising whats there (when it works) is that it wasn't ready for release and some things that is there just shouldn't ever be praised. It had an initial release window 6-7montha earlier and after that delay it was still released in the state it was, thats not something to be praised even if the devs aren't the ones responsible for the decision to release it in that state.
I fully agree with you. And I'm glad this sub thinks this way. My issue is that in the simcade genre there's currently one alternative to FM, and it's awful. So I'm gunna support FM where I can. But I am very glad this sub thinks this way. Because most of gaming reddit is "new game good must consoom, update will make it good later"
Idk I shit on it for lack of content, withheld features, broken features and game systems designed to pad playtime for game pass instead of make the player experience good.
I mean there's definitely more that could be added, however what we have is phenomenal It gets into a bigger discussion of why modern game design is so shitty. Like yeah, I pretty much agree, there 100% should be more and it should be better. Modern game design did this. But that said, at least what we have is GOOD. They didn't take the entire design (GT7) or the entire franchise (PC3) and flush it down the shitter entirely in the name of making some sort of casual market game People can say whatever they want about gamepass, but at the end of the day this is genuinely a driver/car guy's game. It's not some goofy colorful experience geared towards hypercasuals. I'm very happy about that That all said, IM GLAD you shit on it. Please. Keep doing so. Because the fanbase I came from let their game go to shit and was 100% accepting of it. Criticism = change
The fact that you write this shit makes you a complete joke. "The fanbase you came from let their game go to shit and was 100% accepting of it?" How does that even make sense to you? Why do you brazzenly lie about something anyone can easily verify on reddit or any other social media platform. You're pathetic.
Maybe that’s his personal experience with the community? Just saying
are you OPs hype monkey? you're tailing him like a greasy sidekick
I mean I did mention that the Carpg system exists to inflate game time and make game pass look better. Right now replays don't work. Online lobbies have basically scheduled functionality breaks. Very low track count. Vehicles are missing engine sounds.
I agree with all of that (besides low track count) The difference is that you're complaining about it and T10 is fixing it. Instead of "no, there's nothing wrong, stop whining and crying" and then the game is like that for 2 years.
Are they fixing replays and the Carpg system? Hasn't it been 2 patches since any replay improvements? And I use improvements generously since the only improvement I remember is that they made it so there isn't an error message when you try to download. Now they just say they downloaded and don't actually save anywhere. And are they fixing the issue where you can't change tires or fuel at intermission for a few hours before the weekly change over of events?
Iirc replays are part of the next patch, I could be mistaken. I doubt the carpg system will be fixed, as it's not an issue, it's a preference, and it's somewhat ingrained in the structure of the game. I doubt it will ever be removed, although im guessing it will be buffed and level quicker, or something. Again....sadly this is the state of modern game design. Let me ask you this tho. Would you be happy if this game was nearly 2 years old, still had broken tuning, lighting, physics, etc and whenever you said they were bad/broken someone told you to quit crying about it? Or would you rather the community complain and these issues get addressed
Loaded as hell. I'd rather they release a complete and tested product.
Yeah. I mean I can't disagree with you there. That's the state of modern game design. Its a fucking atrocity, but the casuals keep making it worse. My point is that I'm glad the concept of what FM is, is out there. And that the fanbase is critical of that concept.
Are they? They are critical of bad features shoveled into a formula that was working fine (Carpg has not actually made things better for anyone) and broken features.
Yes, they are critical of that, and alot of other things. This entire post proves that, which was part of my reason for posting it, and I'm very glad for having that be the case. I'm glad people here are critical
I can't stand the AI in career, they slow down once they're behind you. What's good about it?
With the amount of bugs, glitches and poor design decisions, it's far from being a love letter... More like an insult. To cars and Forza fans alike. You only wrote this post because you got beef with PD and GT. Get over it.
This weekend I ended up uninstalling it for now because I needed to save some space. I really want to enjoy this FM, but I’m just not enjoying it. Yes it’s a racing sim, but it’s also a video game, I want to have fun while playing. But if/when they add Bathurst and Long Beach, I’ll probably come crawling right back!
I did the same and share the same sentiment. So in terms of OP's title, it's the opposite. I've liked it less and less over time. I'm an absolute racing game nut - arcade, sim, console, PC. I will play and enjoy them all really. I've always found Forza's to be amazing games which I've had a soft spot for. I even enjoyed the last few motorsports, but not as much as no.4 for example obviously. Personally for me with this latest one, it's not as much of a 'game' as I wanted it to be. We've seen the DF video recently and I am always ok with headlights being more detailed on GT7 and physics not on par with many other SIMs but FM would always provide a better 'game'. Such as choice of activities, career, progression etc. Now that is just gone. The builders cup is just quick races wrapped up into one menu/series. I don't want to do the 4/5 bland feature races to get one random FOMO car. It's not interesting in a world where there are so many games to play (with not enough time) and GBs on my devices are better used up elsewhere. So regardless of any issues I may have with physics or graphics, I just can't believe this is a Forza Motorsport with no real 'game' to it. It's a real shame and I hope (expect) to be back again in the future. PS I also at first did not mind car points but over time it's become something that makes things even more boring.
The thing is, when the previous games had great graphics and features and car lists, ships without it... in a semi niche type of game, the player base dies and people move on. This game is a clear downgrade, especially on pc
Someone hasn’t played Forza 4 I see. Now that was a love letter
Absolutely bonkers that GTA V has better engine sounds to boot
😂😂😂fried
This is the most braindead thing i have ever read. Coping so hard
No. They did a couple things well but overall, this game is doo doo
During the launch week I left a 1 star review on FM 2023. I was so bummed at the PC performance and the visual quality. I've since updated that review to a 4 star. Visuals & performance on PC are night and day different from launch. I'm a huge GT fan and love GT7, however with each I love FM 2023 a little more each time. The general physics are fun, the car selection I am happy enough with, tracks wise both my favourite tracks are now in FM 2023 that don't feature in GT7 (Silverstone & Hockenheim). FM is a great game and with a few more QOL updates will become greater.... lastly, I hope they bring the high Res grass detail back in a future update, good I wish visually we were playing the pre release version right now, that said I can live without that.
Is that you Phil Spencer?
We need a "No Sodium Forza" sub for people who are not interested in hating and "built from the ground up" comments, and who are enjoying the game. I'd be there in a second.
You know you can just not click on these threads? Or avoid reading them? Or not leave a comment. It's like - the people who have a different opinion to you are able to co-exist in the same space if only you can just let them have a different opinion to you.
I disagree - I’m bored after 2 races and just turn it off - not played for 3 days - need to do the career races for the new car but just lack the will to even be bothered to start.
agreed, the ai is so bad i can full on watch a show and beat them from 20th to first
Yea I just put all the assists on now and let it do the unlocks for me - still haven’t started yet might do it after the gym tomorrow 🫡
they fucked that method up btw, u need to move ur controller every 15 minutes or like change the input
Yea I know I have built a home studio so I just put it on another monitor and press a button
aha i see, goodluck :)
It’s a ton of fun on xbox… but on PC it’s pretty bad given the other sims out there. AC with free mods looks better, feels better and has more content… and if you don’t want to mess with mods, Automobilista 2 is great out of the box and it blows forza away. But, I do agree that it’s a better game then GT7.
This all said, I fully expect users like enduro, Cal, Hubble and the rest to show up and make shit up and lie about Forza and GT
Calls out users when he himself is notorious for trolling and spreading bs all over GT subs. Not only that, but you step over the line by being disgusting degenerate even in reddits standards to other users regularly and that's why you've been banned multiple times from there. Not going to engage with you further, but thought this is useful note for anyone thinking about interacting with the post.
"I spread BS" ah yes, actual information is BS because it doesn't agree with the GT fanbase All I would do is point out an issue or make a note of some issue, and offer a solution. And I'd always get some sort of dumbest response about how actually no everything's perfect and I just don't understand this perfect Japanese racing game or some shit. It was always ridiculous I'm not the only one. Every single fucking person who brought up and issue or suggested a change was "crying" "whining" "go play something else" "go play forza" like half of your recent comments are you lying about fucking forza man. What is wrong with the GT fanbase???? Also my bans were for calling someone a "mindless Sony consumer" and for calling electric cars "kinda gay" as a rib.
I agree with everything you said here except the car levelling, Maybe I’m strange but I love it! I’ll pick a car I like the look of for a championship, usually a car I’ve always liked the look of IRL and if I take to it in the first few races then that car will be lovingly owned by me. All the way to level 50, even if it’s not the most competitive in its class, it’s mine and I’ll fuck about with it with all the passion I had when I initially took a shine to it! On reaching level 50 it gets awarded a customised downloaded paint job to show its status amongst my non levelled cars. Also, the racing in this game is unequaled in console racers imo
I see. We have to say the opposite of the truth. Thems the rules. Got it, chief! For me, the game never had any issues launching or with random crashes. No issues with multiplayer freezing and chucking me out either. No issues with rammers and dirty drivers using my car as a natural way to brake. I definitely do not have issues with people on the forums having not had any issues of this sort telling me that the game is wonderful if you squint just so and wear some rose tinted glasses when looking at it.
He has a point 👉. Fix the AI and we have a winner offline
What are your AI settings? I am really interested, I don’t know what to do. Every race when I start at the end of the pack is just destruction derby while climbing to the top 5, 3 place - and there real race begins.
I've noticed some contact, but real road car racing also has contact, so I don't really care. It's mostly just doorswipes and bumper taps and shit
Some contact? There must be something wrong in mine settings, they just ram me like I am not there, like they didn’t acknowledge my car. What level of difficulty are you playing? Are they smarter at 8-10?
I'd have to look, but I think I've got them at whatever max is. I've had bumps, never had rams. That said, are you making slow moves in front of them?
I hadn't played Forza for years. I think I played 7 super breifly at some point. Before this, I was playing GT7 with my best friend. He had never really played Forza and absolutely loved it compared to GT7. I do too actually. I miss the old leveling system, the game modes like drift and drag, and the auction house. They probably could have just reskinned an older Forza, added a few of the physics things, more cars, and them resold the game like that every single year and I would still buy it.
I would like a downloaded copy of your AI please, mine brake on straights and ram and blocks passes. Anything but competitive.
I've said from day 1 of release that the bugs and technical issues hold back what would otherwise be a great racing game.
Deff not a proper career. A love letter to irl racing? Yet forza gt class is miles worse then the gr3 gr4 cars in gt. How is it a love letter to irl racing when you have 6 different racing regulations crammed into one? The devs don't understand irl motorsport in the slightest
Competitive AI? Did they fix it? AI was the worst part for me by far, made it impossible to enjoy career. 1-2 cars running 2 seconds a lapp faster than everyone, And the rest lagging behind like dumbfucks. However, if you manage to pass the 1st cars on the first lap, they become dumbfucks too and suddenly can't drive. And when I say dumbfucks I mean it, just try to stop in the middle of the track. AI will stop behind you.
Went to play it after spending the morning playing AMS2 and uh...I might never touch it again. Like driving on ice skates against the opponents from Destruction Derby 2.
I agree with you to a large extent but I do miss the old career races that were track days, or special missions, or recapped a historic race event and then put you in the middle of it to recreate it. Iirc for example there was one in the rain, with 70s era F1 cars and then the graphics suddenly went black & white.. that was amazing. Just some more 'soul' and variation, like an extra mode with those kind of challenge would just immediately make it feel less clinical and austere
Everyone thinks they’re an expert when playing games or even movie watching. If you like the game you like it. That’s awesome. I like this game too.
God I hate it when this suddenly-popular "this is a love letter to..." saying gets thrown around everywhere now. It's dumb. Besides that, what blew you away?
I think this Forza on PC is miles ahead of GT7 for multiplayer. GT7 requires $10 a month, forever, to be able to play online. Over time that's a total ripoff, imho. Plus, GT7 doesn't allow any tuning at all online, except maybe the brake bias if you're lucky. Lastly, GT7 gives you a whopping 3 tracks for a whole week in multiplayer (not counting the odd tournament). Forza lets you tune even in spec mode, plus offers modes where you can race your upgraded and tuned car. GT7 can't even comprehend such heresy, apparently. Forza has six different modes for multiplayer currently, double GT7. And each mode has a different track each race, not the SAME EXACT track every race as in GT7. Forza has issues of course, and of course the sims like ACC are going to be more realistic. But I think Forza is good for what it is, especially the multiplayer.
I agree OP. I mostly avoid this sun due to it. I’ve just had a BLAST with the new FM. It’s literally brought me joy. Waited for it a loooong time and it has delivered.
I just jumped back into the game after playing it the first couple days then not at all. I still hate the limitations imposed on me for customizing my cars in career mode. But otherwise the game controlled great. Until I decided to plug my G920 in. Hooooooboy. That was an incredibly terrible experience. Tried some settings that others posted here, it helped but... Still quite shit. Wasn't even using a hard to control car, 718 spyder gt3, only a little over 400hp, had aero. The behavior of the car was so much different I couldn't control it that well. Back to controller. Game is OK, but it just doesn't feel fun anymore, especially with those career mode restrictions.
It has potential if they supported VR.
I'm having a very hard time trying to like/love the game. I'm pissed about the state of multiplayer and available lobbies/options. With a small baby at home I have a very limited time I can actually play, not counting work hours. When she goes down for a nap I'd like to hop on and knock out a race or two. BUT no, I have to jump into a practice session that takes 25 minutes, then load for a few, then 1 min intermission, and onto a race that will take maybe 8 minutes. It's absolutely insane. And it's not even the class I want to race in. Not to mention having a lobby full of people that didn't pay for the game and think it's bumper cars. This game pushes me right back to COD, I know different genre, but I can hop in a MP game within a minute and get my gaming fix for a bit. Built from the ground up yet it has the same issues/bugs as previous titles. Customization sucks. For being a racing game, why the hell do they only offer one livery per car? Wouldn't it make sense to offer different color options/versions/car numbers for each 'race' car? It's always awesome to see 15 copies of the same car on the grid. Just like IRL /s. Even with the ability to paint your own, download someone else's. With all that, plus every other complaint stated by others, this is my last FM.
I just wish the AI was better, as of now I can’t get down with the career.
car leveling completely kills it for me, so lame to want to try out a new car in multiplayer but oops you have to afk for 3 hours to get it to the level where you can tune it, at least the spec events are fun ig
Bro’s being crucified for going against the grain lol
I've yet to understand whats great about these physics. Honestly. For the rest, i enjoy the game for a race or two...Enough games out there. Assetto corsa 2 will destroy this game this year or the next so thats why i'm chilling on that front. Destroy it, completely. Even gt7
You like FM because you have already played a fair lot of GTS and GT7, but trust me, if you would not know both games and would play both to see which one you prefer more, it would be 100% GT7. So, fair enough that you like FM currently, but as you pointed out the complaints about it are legit and they will continue for as long as it takes Turn10 to actually make an actual next gen game out of it because compared to FM7 from over 6 yrs ago this for sure is not the game people were hoping for given the time and resources Turn10 has at its disposal. So its not necessarily that FM is objectively a "bad gam", its that it fell short of valid expectations and a lot of the game is simply reused from the previous one.
Even if I understand your points, I still believe that this game had underdelivered - and unfortunately is still underdelivering. The new car upgrade mechanics are free to play bullshit. Probably at some point Microsoft even thought adding some sort of micro transaction to speed everything up, but they changed their minds. Driving feels good, that’s the main reason why I am still playing it, but a lot of stuff around that is just a step back. I am not listing everything, there are plenty of posts here with the main issues. What I found really disappointing is how old this game looks in 2023. Normally car games or racing games are showcasing how powerful a console is. Well if you want a benchmark, look at forza horizon 5. That game is a masterpiece in its genre and also from a visual perspective. This FM looks just a step behind the last FM, which is something I don’t really understand. The car models are good but not very detailed - I drive from the inside and it is a low poly count and low res textures fest. There are a bunch of cars where these visual issues are not so strong, but try to have a look at the speed or RPMs behind the wheel, you will instantly see what I mean. I cannot really share also your enthusiasm for the AI. Once you overtake the first position the game is basically over. Yesterday I had some hard time trying to surpass a car that was faster than me for 4 races. In the last race I could manage to gain the first position after the first curve, at the end of the race, the same car that I was struggling overtaking, had more than 30 seconds delay. What the fuck? So it’s a good game, but it’s also a disappointing one.
Competitive AI? They just crash at you at the first corner like on a multiplayer race. They get far behind once you pass them and the first 3 are almost unreachable. AI is s***
No VR suport = its not an actual racing simulator.
people like you are the reason gamedevs nowadays can sell shitty unfinished game for full price, you maybe have the money and dont care but when not so rich people buy things they want their moneys worth, i payed 100€ for the game with bonus content, i was super hyped, just to be unbelievably disappointed, forza motorsport is an insult, they have the marketing budget to trick people into buying but not for the game itself, youre WECLCOME
> worth, i *paid* 100€ for FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*
My game freezes on start up, every time. Sometimes after five min it will go the the home menu, and after one or two races it will just shut down. Had this pc for almost a year 6800xt-5600x, first game I have ever had problems with. I have the settings turned down no Rt, and nothing but problems, even though getting over 100fps. The game is good though, love racing with the wheel, when I can.
It’s the best racing game for the visually impaired. So many aids and features that help make it accessible.
There’s more problems with this game than good things. Bugs, glitches, horrible ai, trash ffb, all cars feeel generally similar. Anybody that likes this game is forcing themselves to like it or has never played a good simulator.
This whole thread is basically "Stockholm Syndrome encapsulated". I wonder how many of you are reading your own comments. "When it actually works, is so fun", "If you forget about these things its actually great!", "At least it handles nice, unlike other games on the market". It IS bad; It IS greedy; It IS half-baked. Stop excusing everything as if you were trying to prove to everyone that there is an actual value on that thing to everyone.
I was having so much fun grinding thru the career mode. I was playing an OFFLINE mode, my internet stuttered and I got booted mid race and told that i can only play free roam while offline. I deleted the game and cancelled my game pass subscription that I had to try this game. Sick fucking game, but always online bullshit really grinds my tits.
I've bid on 3 copies of forza 6 on ebay. I just want split screen back lol.
\> The more I play FM 2023, the more I'm realizing how good this game is, tell that to r\\BuiltFromTheGroundUp , i dare you
It’s a fantastic game. Wish it ran well on the Steam Deck. It’s inexplicable how Forza Horizon 5 is a better looking game and runs amazingly on the Steam Deck. I hate having to sit at my PC every time I play a racing game. Finished the career mode on Motorsport and thoroughly enjoyed it.
I cant even play it after update 3, its not working in mostly amd cards. But I played it nearly 100 hours. To quote todd howard "it just works"
I’m glad you’re enjoying the game, I am too! However, I am highly confused about your “solid career” and “competitive AI” comments. I really only have three complaints about the game; horrible AI, barebones career, and far too many crashes. I also quit on GT7 for reasons, and while the AI in Forza may be better than the abysmal AI that GT7 had on release, Forza’s AI is nowhere near the ballpark or even zip code of competitive. And the career mode is the most barebones career Forza has ever seen. GT7’s, while not great by any means, definitely beats FM here.
Since getting game on Steam early access, I have put in 230 hours into FM. There's definitely great game play in the title, reguardless of the low content, poor optimisation, and contentious car leveling system. When I drive or race in FM, the issues seem to go away. When Turn 10 rights this ship, FM is going to be awesome! It has the potential to be the best Forza Motorsport title out if every FM that came before it. Hopefully T10 doesn't screw it up any more. (Gimmie them down votes!)
I don't think we're playing the same games. As a competitive player, GT7 offers everything you want and need with Sport mode, Manufacturers Cup, Nations Cup etc. The main complaint i see all the time about GT7 is how much cars cost compared to what you earn but me being someone who only ever plays Sport mode, Manu Cup, Nations Cup, i always rent the cars anyways so i don't even spend credits on the game. Now let's look at some direct comparisons regarding competitive play on these two games: FM2023 1. Rating System doesn't really equate to the actual driver skill since everyone and their mom reaches 4999 rather quickly and easily. Matchmaking doesn't work. Still finishing 30s+ ahead of p2 while starting from last most of the time. 2. No special ranked events. 3. Penalty System not working as expected at all and very abusable. (Very rarely games get it right except games with live stewarding like iRacing in special events) 4. Egregious Forza GT Class: in this subclass you have GT4, GT3, GTE, Super Trofeo (soon with the huracán evo coming), Trans-am, Challenge Cars (488) and Factory Track Race Cars (Essenza). 4.1. The Balance for the TC class is ok, for the GT class is horrible because of the aforementioned problem. note.: this subclass is borderline insulting but it can be improved if they take each of the specs i mentioned that are in it and make it their own with more car releases of each class. Gran Turismo 7 1. Rating system not optimal, but certainly more fleshed out. 2. Matchmaking seems to work more often than not in Daily B and C races from personal experience. (usually my A+ lobbies are pretty close in quali times from top 7 onwards except when the ocasional pro player or ultra cracked player joins) 3. Same as FM2023 4. Decently put together classes. There is still meta cars as it happens in every multiplayer game but the field is closer together more often than not. (fuck the genesis gr3, supra gr3 and gtr gr3 though). PhysX - both games went different ways but both physics are enjoyable. Video Quality - better on GT7 personally because it's much clearer and vibrant but FM2023 is pretty good as well more often than not. Car sounds - FM2023 overall, lots of race cars in GT7 still sound like vaccuum cleaners.
Wish they made the game so it looked good and ran well on anything other than a 4090
Well... It's your opinion after all, there is no wrong and right to personal opinion. But I guess it's just agree to disagree. I'll just ask one simple question: is this your first ever Forza from the Motorsport series? Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to be deletionist and put you in the corner because "you didn't go through the same experiences I have in order to have such opinion". What I'm trying to say is that out of all Motorsports games, this is the most mediocre one by a large margin. I will co-sign everything you just said about physics and gameplay, this game is just different from anything I've ever laid hands. But what does it do only by itself? Is this all a racing game has to offer? You get in a track with your realistic driving car, spin around for 5 minutes and say "oh, me car feels nice". Is this enough for you? The car points system is farmy. The career mode is farmy. It has no sense of progression whatsoever, you just feel like you are doing different things from time to time. You leave event A, you are forced to buy car B to compete in event B. You basically spend all the IG credits just to be able to play. The multiplayer is extremely limited the rotation system is extremely unfun, and this is all it has to offer. Why on earth would they remove class lobbies? Why would they remove open track day lobbies? No drifting game modes anywhere, even though the game labels certain car parts exclusive for this use? Back to the part where I ask if this is your first Motorsport game, this is what I'm talking about. They have torn to pieces a decade old formula, trying to force down our throats this lame ass "built from the ground up" propaganda. If they were trying to be bold and create another whole game apart from a pretty much legendary series, they should have just named it a different thing. It's a different dev team anyways... Am I asking too much here? It feels like I'm playing an online demo with limited game modes and features removed from previous Motorsports...
I tell everyone this game is great and it's like a souls game lol. Every straight or corner is like a boss battle. Never know if you gonna get spun out, pushed off, dive bombed or my favorite taking a corner wide to push you off when side by side on a corner lol
If you enjoy racing, it's a fantastic game. Everything else is questionable. Races aren't long enough, pit strategies pointless, car balance not great. However the actual wheel to wheel racing, so damn enjoyable that it makes you come back for more.
The driving itself is amazing, it’s just wrapped in 100 layers of Microsoft, and Microsoft is *always* a bad thing.