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Mongolia had prisons full of coffins (traveler's description in appox. 1919)
[https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/29024/pg29024-images.html#plate\_vc](https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/29024/pg29024-images.html#plate_vc)
"Not far beyond the Custom House is what I believe to be one of the most horrible prisons in the world. Inside a double palisade of unpeeled timbers is a space about ten feet square upon which open the doors of small rooms, almost dark. In these dungeons are piled - 81 - wooden boxes, four feet long by two and one-half feet high. These coffins are the prisoners' cells.
Some of the poor wretches have heavy chains about their necks and both hands manacled together. They can neither sit erect nor lie at full length. Their food, when the jailer remembers to give them any, is pushed through a six-inch hole in the coffin's side. Some are imprisoned here for only a few days or weeks; others for life, or for many years. Sometimes they lose the use of their limbs, which shrink and shrivel away. The agony of their cramped position is beyond the power of words to describe. Even in winter, when the temperature drops, as it sometimes does, to sixty degrees below zero, they are given only a single sheepskin for covering. How it is possible to live in indescribable filth, half-fed, well-nigh frozen in winter, and suffering the tortures of the damned, is beyond my ken—only a Mongol could live at all.
The prison is not a Mongol invention. It was built by the Manchus and is an eloquent tribute to a knowledge of the fine arts of cruelty that has never been surpassed."
Thats why you never get captured. Human beings are just about the most savage terrifying thing nature has ever created. Really think about it, nothing compares to us because some of us can find an art in the suffering of others. Fighting a great white shark in the open ocean is preferable to being hostage to the creative cruelty of the human mind.
It makes sense when you remember our closest living relative- the humble, absolute shitgoblin- also known as the chimpanzee.
The apes are already a class unto their own when in comes to being nasty for fun, but chimps, with whom we share over 98% of our DNA, dial it up to eleven. In groups, they will chase down and tear apart lesser monkeys often just for fun (though they aren’t shy about eating them still half-alive if they’re in need of protein). In fights against other troops of chimps, they will chase them far from their own territory, gouging eyes, ripping off fingers, toes, and genitalia with their orc-like strength, and if one troop comes out in overwhelming victory against another, they will chase down those stragglers who have long-abandoned the fight to torture them to death as others hoot and cackle with excitement.
Among their own, if one falls enough in status and becomes ostracized, they run the risk of being picked apart by their peers in much the same way as would be done to a rival from an enemy band. Often the reasons for this are arbitrary but ultimately stem from not making enough allies or being generally antisocial in a climate which breeds competition for status.
Our closest living relatives are the closest thing to evil in an entire kingdom of earthly life. The only non-apes that demonstrate similar behavior are dolphins which share with us the trait of high intelligence and social behavior.
It makes sense when you think about it. Evil- *actual evil* (not just dominance or survival based general violence) is a trait that requires higher functioning.
We’ve all experienced a whiff of it in our own psyche. When you were a kid, you probably killed a bug or made fun of another kid *just for fun*.
Other animals don’t generally do those things. They do the things they do to *survive*.
Yeah, animals do horrible things for fun all the time. The important difference is having the mental capacity to understand what they're doing is wrong, which I'd argue even the chimps don't really have. That requires both an understanding of other minds, a self-reflection on the nature of suffering, and a transfer of understanding of that suffering to the other mind and what it entails.
>That requires both an understanding of other minds, a self-reflection on the nature of suffering, and a transfer of understanding of that suffering to the other mind and what it entails.
They probably know what they're doing is not beneficial to the other beings, and is more than often not necessary, but yea they'd probably have to put two and two together, but apparently they're better at ripping it apart
Check out Bonobos. We have just as much DNA in common with them as we do chimps, and they're matriarchal, have sex for pleasure, and are super gentle and beautiful creatures.
To be clear, “98% of our dna” is practically meaningless. We share 60% of our DNA with chickens and fruit flies. A vast, vast, vast majority of dna is just nonsense, and a majority of the actually functional DNA is for the things that all organisms do (like cellular respiration, division, etc). That last 2% of DNA that we have different from apes is actually a pretty large chunk of the actual functioning “makes us different from each other” genetic code.
Edit: ya’ll are right, ‘nonsense’ implies that it is completely useless or pointless and that is definitely not the case. It’s the classic issue with science communication: anything we say is inherently going to be a lie because it’s a simplification. We can always go to another level of precision and, therefore, accuracy; but in doing so we sacrifice a level of clarity and ease of understanding.
The most *accurate* discussion of a topic will be incomprehensible to anyone who has not spent a lifetime dedicated to studying and under it.
If I was a lifer I'd stop drinking and eating to bring it to an end.
Edit: You'd die of dehydration long before you starve to death, at least here in the US where most of us have an extra 20-30 lbs. My grandma had bad dementia and one day just stopped eating and drinking. She was gone in five days.
Eventually your instincts probably take over and force you to eat despite your current willpower here in 2024.
*I forgot reddit is full of supermen, each with the willpower of 1000 men, who can starve themselves at a moment's notice and aren't just keyboard warriors who have to eat every 25 mins or start crying.
I’m sure you’re quite right for perhaps the majority of people, but unless they had a way of forcing (“encouraging”) prisoners to eat and drink I’m sure plenty died of self-imposed starvation or dehydration. People attempt it in modern prisons and asylums still, in conditions much less painful. I just can’t imagine choosing to prolong that kind of suffering. And I’ve been dangerously close to dehydration.
Of course we’ll never know cause you’re right, we’re just so far removed - and thank god!
You get weak and dizzy and your head gets really heavy. Also, after 3 days without food you sometimes vomit bile. Source: Was homeless and had lengthy bouts of food insecurity.
Nope. Euthanasia isn't an option in most of the USA, so when my grandfather's health declined to the point he couldn't bear it anymore, he quit eating and drank only enough to swallow the pain medication.
It took him a week and a half to die of dehydration/starvation.
It looked like a very hard way to go, but when the other options are worse, people still choose it here in 2024.
People die of starvation diets all the time. At a certain point it becomes impossible to eat without medical intervention. Getting to that point takes commitment, but a lot less commitment than surviving a tiny box for years.
Being hungry is far from the worst thing a human can endure. As a way to go, it’s not a bad option.
They just be using the same one over and over again. For some reason every time they come back for the box the people are gone but the box remains. Haven’t figured out where the people go yet though.
The one box. There must've been conversations like this:
"Hey where did you leave the starvation box?"
"Me? You had it last. Remember that guy from the mountain?"
"Oh yeah, sorry about that. I was still thinking about that floozie from Ölgii."
There were more than enough trees for the population at the time. 7% of the land is covered by forest, which doesn't sound like a lot until you realize the country's fucking huge for its population.
Back when they were conquering half the world, they had a taboo against spilling royal blood. So when they seized a city and captured the royal family members, they rolled them in a carpet and trampled them with horses.
They were also kinda spiteful, there was a city that lasted a few decades in a siege. So when they took it they killed half the population, enslaved the rest. Tore down the buildings and transported the rubble away, and even rerouted the river to make shure no new settlement would ever be able to start there again.
Just imagining a guy watching the Mongols absolutely laying bloody waste to a city and razing it, and saying to himself "those guys are kinda spiteful"
Note that the first part, the "kill half the people (usually the males) and sell the rest into slavery" was *absolutely nothing unusual at all*. That was the standard *modus operandi* of pretty much everyone in antiquity. Especially including the Romans. Look up what they did to Carthage.
Carthage was a special case. They had three wars that were the worst the Romans had had until then and Rome just barely scraped a win twice, with huge losses. They really, *really* wanted them gone forever.
Everywhere else, the viciousness of the Romans was *generally* proportional to how much trouble they got conquering. They were happy to just roll in, take the riches and a bunch of slaves, add your address to the tax collector to do list, and go on about their business.
They didn't even aim to exterminate people who *really* pissed them off. They believed that all gods were real, and if they killed our enslaved all the worshippers of a pantheon, those gods would start giving them shit. And in the end, a taxpayer is generally better than a slave.
But yeah, everyone did that kind of shit back then. Although the Mongols had their 15 minutes of fame during the Middle Ages, not antiquity. Those were the Huns.
The Mongols invaded in the 1200s though, not the 100bc. Mass enslavement of populations was not as much (still happened). in the vogue then.
massacres and looting was the norm though.
The Mongols were considered exceptionally brutal by their contemporaries.
I was always shocked at the method of building a deck on top of the thousands of russian royals stacked like cord wood as the mongols would proceed to have a party on top and slowly squish and suffocate those trapped underneath.
This was a particularly interesting way to kill people that seemed like something out of a comic book. But no, they really did it. Mongols did not fuck around when it came to punishing those that rose up against them. But were semi-merciful to cities that agreed to join the Mongol empire.
Yes not this particular historical example but the Kievan Rus did try to remain independent from the Mongols and resisted when they invaded, culminating in the siege and sacking of Kiev in 1240.
They also believed in not spilling noble blood. If someone from a royal family had to die, they had some pretty creative ways of doing it. There was one story, I believe it was when they defeated the Rus, where they tied all the nobles up and put them on the ground. A giant wooden platform was made and set on top of them. Then all the Mongols had a big party on the platform and crushed them to death.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Kalka_River
Used to work with a south African bloke. He once showed me a video his brother sent to him of this happening. Was fucking horrific. He didn't even ask if I wanted to see it!
Had a Mexican drywaller I worked with show me 8-10 guys getting executed with various stabbing tools and long poles. The way the bodies moved reminded me of my dad clubbing fish in the bottom of the boat.
Everyone laughed, even the local dudes. I just couldn’t help but think those were basically kids, maybe early 20s to late teens
Nigerian chiming in, seen it as well. Twice actually, the first time I was nine and was waiting for my mom in front of a store. It's some twisted jungle justice and it's usually done to thieves. It's not as common as it used to be a decade or two ago, but it's not completely gone in some parts. The sight sticks with you forever
"Anyway, I would not recommend the Mongolian prisoner wooden execution box because as you can see, you can break out of the box long before you run out of water in the 110 degree heat. I'm going to go commit adultery again to show that that was not a fluke."
Ghangis Khan used to pour molten silver into the ears of enemy generals as an execution when he thought they were cowardly. That’s a very tough region to live.
They also tortured people by filling their stomachs with rocks. They’d insert a tube and then fill them up with pebbles until your entire body was filled with pebbles and apparently you died in excruciating pain.
Yeah that is probably going to be insanely painful, imagine having hundreds of stones grind against your innards while all the muscles are desperately cramping to pass those stones. Probably Kidney Stones x10.
That is true. George constantly takes events, details, and characters from history for those books. War of the Five Kings was based on War of the Roses. The Dance of the Dragons was based on The Anarchy in Europe.
If you're planning to watch the show, definitely don't look up The Anarchy. It's nearly identical, minus the dragons.
> If you're planning to watch the show, definitely don't look up The Anarchy. It's nearly identical, minus the dragons.
THIS is what I was hoping for when I heard of the show.
https://simple.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scaphism#:~:text=Scaphism%20or%20The%20Boats%20was,honey%20and%20generally%20stripped%20naked.
Relatively tame in comparison.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Featured_picture_candidates/Mongolian_woman_condemned_to_die_of_starvation
Some discussion from Wikipedia. Seems like it may have been more like a single occupancy prison cell, and the prisoner would be fed.
I was wondering. Because there's a bowl there. Didn't know if they may give her enough water to keep her alive longer to prolong suffering or something though.
It might be one of those 'conditional death penalty' situations. You'd see similar stuff in Europe...they'd leave you in a cage for a month and it was basically up to the community to give you food/water during that time. If people liked you, you lived. If not? Welp.
Did image search and translated from Korean website. "**Was it a Manchurian custom to lock Crown Prince Sado in the back bar?**
# A Buddhist photographer who visited Mongolia in 1913 took a picture of a woman locked in a wooden box, calling it
# a “mobile prison for nomadic peoples.”
A woman with scattered hair is locked in a rectangular wooden box that looks like a back post. The surrounding area is a vast grassland with no people around. There is a small hole in the box she was placed in, and the woman is desperately fiddling with her locks, with only her face and her left hand sticking out of the hole.
This is a photo posted on the Facebook page of Kyung Hee University Professor Kang In-wook (Northern Archeology) on the 7th. It was taken by French photographer Stephane Paz, who visited Mongolia in 1913 when it had just gained independence from China, and was published in National Geographic magazine in May 1922. The photo caption at the time reads, ‘A woman being starved to death near Urga (currently Ulaanbaatar).’
▲ A Mongolian woman locked in a dungeon and starved to death. It was taken by French photographer Stephane Paz, who visited Mongolia in 1913. Judging by the food bowls placed around her back, it appears she was not actually starved to death (left photo). Duju appearing in the movie ‘Apostle’
Professor Kang’s explanation is as follows. "These days, the back pole is attracting attention because of the movie 'The Apostle,' but originally, this type of punishment is a unique custom of the nomads. Since they have been nomads and wandering all their lives, there is no way that there is a prison facility as we think of it. Northern peoples use wooden boxes that look like a back pole as 'mobile prisons.' 'It was used as '. Professor Kang said, "Contrary to Stephan Paz's photo caption, judging from the food bowls placed around the back pole, it appears that the purpose was to confine them for a certain period of time rather than to starve them to death." He added, "The regular back pole used in Mongolia during this period was used as a camel's back luggage. “It seems like it was made in a square shape to make it easier to load.”
Since when was ‘Duju Prison’ used in Mongolia? Researchers say, “The reason why Duju began to be used as an execution tool in Mongolia was due to the influence of the Qing Dynasty (Manchu).” Currently, a large piece of Duju is on display at the Folklore Hall of the National Museum of Mongolian History in Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia. Jang Jang-sik, a curator at the National Folk Museum of Korea, said, “It is a type of punishment tool (tool for punishment) and is displayed along with iron fetters and whips. As Mongolia began to be ruled by the Qing Dynasty, ‘Duju Prison’ was created in the Mongolian region between the 17th and 19th centuries. “Torture was carried out,” he said.
Did King Yeongjo, who imprisoned Crown Prince Sado in Duju, know about this nomadic custom? Professor Kang In-wook said, “It cannot be said that King Yeongjo punished people according to nomadic customs, but it is possible to assume that he was aware of this death penalty law.”
**Was it a Manchurian custom to lock Crown Prince Sado in the back bar?**
# A Buddhist photographer who visited Mongolia in 1913 took a picture of a woman locked in a wooden box, calling it
# Source: [https://m.cafe.daum.net/kphpi21/6v6H/678](https://m.cafe.daum.net/kphpi21/6v6H/678)
If there were no one else around I'd try to help, but at the same time I'm not trying to catch my own (possibly worse, as others have noted above, the Mongols of the old days were pretty creative in the "thinking up horrible ways to execute people" sense) brutal death sentence for interfering in another country's justice system.
In theory the punishment for both sexes were 90 lashes with the whip each at this time, but because of a loophole in Imperial Chinese law the aggrieved party could use lethal force avoiding the regular courts if done immediately and the heads of the offenders were later presented to a judge as proof of identity so he could retrosign the punishment (in some locations the heads would then be thrown in a bucket of water, due to a superstitious belief that bodies of lovers will attempt to face each other in death, so if the heads looked at each other it was seen as proof of infidelity and allowed the spouse to avoid legal consequences).
A court could also order the castration of a male cheater, but that was more rare at this time as eunuchs had evolved into a professional class. Most likely, if the woman was punished with immurement like this, the male cheater was also subject to one of the Nine Punishments, or just beheaded on the spot by the spouse and his clan.
Mongolia was not a part of Imperial China at this time. Mongolia was a Chinese province from 1691 to 1911, and then again in 1919 to 1921.
From 1912 to 1919 Mongolia was under the protection of Russia.
[Source](https://2009-2017.state.gov/outofdate/bgn/mongolia/79156.htm#:~:text=Outer%20Mongolia%20was%20a%20Chinese,province%20(1919%2D21)) While some traditions from China’s influence may have stuck around, I am more on board believing that the people of Mongolia maintained their cultural heritage and held onto the traditional punishments they knew. Another [comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/s/0PIiymjoON) in the post spoke to this as well.
Yea we literally have a saying “Drown them in the pig cage” but it’s really outdated and only used in movies set in ancient times or said ironically because it’s outdated.
Traditionally these sorts of punishments were not carried out in Mongolia. This was Mongolia under Manchu rule which had some torturous punishments to keep the people from revolting for independence. We call it the 9 punishments
https://preview.redd.it/jsuyk39fje4d1.jpeg?width=499&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c4a854a519ce89da531812f721430349a14b9ad2
https://preview.redd.it/005f6j0kje4d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fb90abd9c8a0e28343d080d5d0f188e895b9cb77
The nine ways of torture/punishment
Truly, we do not live in a perfect world by any means, but I do think we sometimes overlook the ways we are so very lucky and dare I say - blessed? - to live today. Yeah rent and inflation suck, but I’d have to try REALLY hard to be tortured to death in such a way
Worse! Dude imagine being pushed. Or "gently" proved with sharp instruments.
And these were public long-form tortures. Imagine being in a town square or castle courtyard for everyone. Who would be the worst? Bored soldiers? Drunk men? Spiteful teens? Curious kids? It's a choose-your-own adventure of shit.
1. “Bonk with small stick”
2. “Trap in box”
3. “Tie to post, make uncomfortable with stick”
4. “Explain misdeeds, point for emphasis”
5. “Stand like dog”
6. “Needles under nails”
7. “Light fire on back”
8. “Bonk with large stick”
9. “Make taller”
Crown Prince Sado (1735-1762) died in a similar way. He was confined in a rice chest on the orders of his father king Yeongjo of Joseon (Korea). Probably died due to dehydration/starvation.
> I don’t think I could walk away. Like that would eat at me for the rest of my life.
Journalists that cover attrocities are haunted by their work, just lok at Kevin Carter. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Carter
We often can't know what we would do until we were to be put in such a situation. While I don't know whether this photographer had children or other loved ones whom he wouldn't want to leave, this would likely be a significant factor for many people faced with such risks.
Yeah some on here really think the people who were letting a woman die of starvation in a box would just go “ah get outta here you little knucklehead” to the person who let said woman out of the box. They would put him in an even smaller box as punishment, they clearly don’t care about being inhumane lol.
There’s not a single person in this thread who would actually try to save her. The people who say they would have just never been in a deadly situation before.
I mean, my answer really depends on the likelihood that I am caught trying to free her.
Is her box literally set in the middle of nowhere, and people only tend to it occasionally to add food/water to a small bowl? Yes- I can probably try to free her without being caught.
Is her box regularly monitored/guarded, or placed in an area with high-traffic? I probably can’t take the risk without also ending up in a box myself.
Bear in mind you'd be a foreigner in a different country. How do you get something to break her out without arising suspicion? I mean heck: taking the photo alone could put your life in danger.
On top of that, let's say everything works out and somehow you get her out. What does that really do for her? She runs back into town and then someone sees it and goes "hmm, how did she get out?". Great now you're both in a box.
I don't fault people for seeing this and WANTING to do something, that's normal human empathy. But saying you would actually do something...at best that's misguided empathy, and at worst it's ivory tower thinking.
Honestly people that are willing to execute people like this are fairly likely to need very little proof. If somebody goes to check on her an hour after you let her escape all it takes is one person to say “hey I saw that foreign guy go in that direction a little bit ago” and they’ll throw you in the box too lol.
They executed like this because they enjoyed it, it’s insanely dangerous to free her in almost any circumstance.
In my experience with some of these things in history: they'll even torture the person who you freed and promise them freedom if they narc on you. The person will narc, then you'll both get put in a box.
They don't even have to narc on the actual person, torture hardly ever gets real useful information, but they'll lock up innocent people all the same.
It would definitely eat at me the rest of my life too… but I think realistically if he would’ve tried he would’ve been put in his own box. Impossible situation
Imagine seeing someone from another country stumbling on you, mid torture. Begging for their help only to have a photo taken and a confused exchange before they wander off.
“ outdoor cages are still used in Arizona, but now have shade”
Jesus fucking Christ. Why in the FUCK are they using outdoor cages in ARIZONA?!?? I’ve also heard of prisons not having consistent AC in hot climates like Texas and Florida which is mind fucking blowing to me, considering at least in Florida, it’s considered an emergency to not have AC
Insufficient evidence here meaning the prosecutors are in bed with the police and won’t ever prosecute unless there’s political pressure and no one even filed a wrongful death lawsuit for this poor woman. There are literal murderers out there collecting a government check
Bro it's Maricopa County, The same place that elected [This psycopath](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Arpaio) for Sheriff for nearly 3 decades despite costing them over 300 million in legal fees due to his consistent torturing of prisoners.
That place ain't right.
That fucker also didn’t know that pardoned meant you owned up to your crimes. When confronted by the media about it, he fumbled terribly. At 92 that fucker (his pronoun) is running for mayor of a local city.
Arpaio is absolutely one of the worst Americans to ever live. An absolute traitor to any of the values that America holds itself to. No death is too bad for him.
>"insufficient evidence to go forward with a prosecution against any of the named individuals".
Why not try the whole system then?
Or if that's too hard, maybe make actual changes to stop shit like that from happening? Here's an idea, let's not use outdoor cages in one of the hottest areas in the country. Or better yet mandate what is or isn't an acceptable form of punishment.
There's prison and there's torture and I kind of remember "Cruel and unusual punishments" being outlawed at one time in America, heck I think it's in the constitution. Then again what hope does (Not did, it's still open) Guantanamo Bay have if this is the type of shit we do to our own prisoners whose crime was.... prostitution.
Fuck.
Jesus this Wikipedia page is so deeply sad. All the missing details feel like a person who was never shown real love or compassion in her life and then died horrifically.
You wouldn’t think anything like this would happen today.
They’d definitely wouldn’t let you die free of charge in a box. You’d have to pay rent, and the torture water would be on subscription.
Hi how are you!? Are you stuck, can I help you?
I'm left here to slowly die!
Oh my, that's terrible! Can you try and look at the camera ?
Bye and succes with the thing you're doing!
Immurement was absolutely a form of punishment in Mongolia at the time, but there is no definite proof that this lady was left to starve. National Geographic suggested that is the case, but it has not been proven so far. Wikipedia suggests it might be a prisoner transport but I'm not quite buying that if the box was found on its own by Passet, then it would be more likely that the punishment was either temporary or, in fact immurement.
I am sure, and believe that those who created this law, those who arrested her, those who were running the country, religious leaders, and every single person involved in this - had also committed adultery but never got caught, or they had created laws/amendments to protect their own adultery.
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Mongolia had prisons full of coffins (traveler's description in appox. 1919) [https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/29024/pg29024-images.html#plate\_vc](https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/29024/pg29024-images.html#plate_vc) "Not far beyond the Custom House is what I believe to be one of the most horrible prisons in the world. Inside a double palisade of unpeeled timbers is a space about ten feet square upon which open the doors of small rooms, almost dark. In these dungeons are piled - 81 - wooden boxes, four feet long by two and one-half feet high. These coffins are the prisoners' cells. Some of the poor wretches have heavy chains about their necks and both hands manacled together. They can neither sit erect nor lie at full length. Their food, when the jailer remembers to give them any, is pushed through a six-inch hole in the coffin's side. Some are imprisoned here for only a few days or weeks; others for life, or for many years. Sometimes they lose the use of their limbs, which shrink and shrivel away. The agony of their cramped position is beyond the power of words to describe. Even in winter, when the temperature drops, as it sometimes does, to sixty degrees below zero, they are given only a single sheepskin for covering. How it is possible to live in indescribable filth, half-fed, well-nigh frozen in winter, and suffering the tortures of the damned, is beyond my ken—only a Mongol could live at all. The prison is not a Mongol invention. It was built by the Manchus and is an eloquent tribute to a knowledge of the fine arts of cruelty that has never been surpassed."
Jesus…that is horrific.
Thats why you never get captured. Human beings are just about the most savage terrifying thing nature has ever created. Really think about it, nothing compares to us because some of us can find an art in the suffering of others. Fighting a great white shark in the open ocean is preferable to being hostage to the creative cruelty of the human mind.
It makes sense when you remember our closest living relative- the humble, absolute shitgoblin- also known as the chimpanzee. The apes are already a class unto their own when in comes to being nasty for fun, but chimps, with whom we share over 98% of our DNA, dial it up to eleven. In groups, they will chase down and tear apart lesser monkeys often just for fun (though they aren’t shy about eating them still half-alive if they’re in need of protein). In fights against other troops of chimps, they will chase them far from their own territory, gouging eyes, ripping off fingers, toes, and genitalia with their orc-like strength, and if one troop comes out in overwhelming victory against another, they will chase down those stragglers who have long-abandoned the fight to torture them to death as others hoot and cackle with excitement. Among their own, if one falls enough in status and becomes ostracized, they run the risk of being picked apart by their peers in much the same way as would be done to a rival from an enemy band. Often the reasons for this are arbitrary but ultimately stem from not making enough allies or being generally antisocial in a climate which breeds competition for status. Our closest living relatives are the closest thing to evil in an entire kingdom of earthly life. The only non-apes that demonstrate similar behavior are dolphins which share with us the trait of high intelligence and social behavior.
The smarter you get, the more evil you get, apparently.
It makes sense when you think about it. Evil- *actual evil* (not just dominance or survival based general violence) is a trait that requires higher functioning. We’ve all experienced a whiff of it in our own psyche. When you were a kid, you probably killed a bug or made fun of another kid *just for fun*. Other animals don’t generally do those things. They do the things they do to *survive*.
Animals torment other animals for entertainment all the time. Have you ever had a cat as a pet?
Yeah, animals do horrible things for fun all the time. The important difference is having the mental capacity to understand what they're doing is wrong, which I'd argue even the chimps don't really have. That requires both an understanding of other minds, a self-reflection on the nature of suffering, and a transfer of understanding of that suffering to the other mind and what it entails.
>That requires both an understanding of other minds, a self-reflection on the nature of suffering, and a transfer of understanding of that suffering to the other mind and what it entails. They probably know what they're doing is not beneficial to the other beings, and is more than often not necessary, but yea they'd probably have to put two and two together, but apparently they're better at ripping it apart
Check out Bonobos. We have just as much DNA in common with them as we do chimps, and they're matriarchal, have sex for pleasure, and are super gentle and beautiful creatures.
To be clear, “98% of our dna” is practically meaningless. We share 60% of our DNA with chickens and fruit flies. A vast, vast, vast majority of dna is just nonsense, and a majority of the actually functional DNA is for the things that all organisms do (like cellular respiration, division, etc). That last 2% of DNA that we have different from apes is actually a pretty large chunk of the actual functioning “makes us different from each other” genetic code. Edit: ya’ll are right, ‘nonsense’ implies that it is completely useless or pointless and that is definitely not the case. It’s the classic issue with science communication: anything we say is inherently going to be a lie because it’s a simplification. We can always go to another level of precision and, therefore, accuracy; but in doing so we sacrifice a level of clarity and ease of understanding. The most *accurate* discussion of a topic will be incomprehensible to anyone who has not spent a lifetime dedicated to studying and under it.
I was totally absorbed in that article, it's really descriptive
If I was a lifer I'd stop drinking and eating to bring it to an end. Edit: You'd die of dehydration long before you starve to death, at least here in the US where most of us have an extra 20-30 lbs. My grandma had bad dementia and one day just stopped eating and drinking. She was gone in five days.
Eventually your instincts probably take over and force you to eat despite your current willpower here in 2024. *I forgot reddit is full of supermen, each with the willpower of 1000 men, who can starve themselves at a moment's notice and aren't just keyboard warriors who have to eat every 25 mins or start crying.
I’m sure you’re quite right for perhaps the majority of people, but unless they had a way of forcing (“encouraging”) prisoners to eat and drink I’m sure plenty died of self-imposed starvation or dehydration. People attempt it in modern prisons and asylums still, in conditions much less painful. I just can’t imagine choosing to prolong that kind of suffering. And I’ve been dangerously close to dehydration. Of course we’ll never know cause you’re right, we’re just so far removed - and thank god!
No, death by self induced starvation is a common out for the tormented.
The good news is past a certain point you stop being hungry at all
You get weak and dizzy and your head gets really heavy. Also, after 3 days without food you sometimes vomit bile. Source: Was homeless and had lengthy bouts of food insecurity.
I’m so sorry you went through that. Are things better for you now?
Hey thanks. Yeah, that was 30 years ago. Finally able to talk about it.
Nope. Euthanasia isn't an option in most of the USA, so when my grandfather's health declined to the point he couldn't bear it anymore, he quit eating and drank only enough to swallow the pain medication. It took him a week and a half to die of dehydration/starvation. It looked like a very hard way to go, but when the other options are worse, people still choose it here in 2024.
People die of starvation diets all the time. At a certain point it becomes impossible to eat without medical intervention. Getting to that point takes commitment, but a lot less commitment than surviving a tiny box for years. Being hungry is far from the worst thing a human can endure. As a way to go, it’s not a bad option.
Meanwhile I'm like "Fuck, I'm out of Pringles! This sucks!"
There is something seriously wrong with a lot of people. It’s pretty frightening what we’re capable of.
"an eloquent tribute to a knowledge of the fine arts of cruelty that has never been surpassed." hits like the end of a Cormac novel
Mother fuckers ain't got no trees but got the time to make a wooden box for torture.
They just be using the same one over and over again. For some reason every time they come back for the box the people are gone but the box remains. Haven’t figured out where the people go yet though.
The one box. There must've been conversations like this: "Hey where did you leave the starvation box?" "Me? You had it last. Remember that guy from the mountain?" "Oh yeah, sorry about that. I was still thinking about that floozie from Ölgii."
There were more than enough trees for the population at the time. 7% of the land is covered by forest, which doesn't sound like a lot until you realize the country's fucking huge for its population.
Okay but, OTHER THAN THAT, how was your vacation?
Unexpected Anthony Jeselnik
“Other than that, how was the play Mrs Lincoln?”
Jesus, that’s a horrifying way to die.
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Back when they were conquering half the world, they had a taboo against spilling royal blood. So when they seized a city and captured the royal family members, they rolled them in a carpet and trampled them with horses.
I think poison would be easier, but you do you mongols.
They were also kinda spiteful, there was a city that lasted a few decades in a siege. So when they took it they killed half the population, enslaved the rest. Tore down the buildings and transported the rubble away, and even rerouted the river to make shure no new settlement would ever be able to start there again.
Just imagining a guy watching the Mongols absolutely laying bloody waste to a city and razing it, and saying to himself "those guys are kinda spiteful"
What a bunch of jerks!
Hey mongols! The jerk store called and they’re all out of you!
What’s the difference, you’re their all time best seller.
Oh yeah, well I had sex with your wife!
The worst part was the hypocrisy.
Those Mongols were way out of line. They have a lot of growing up to do. Ridiculous.
I thought it was the raping
Its actually the *lack of respect*!
That’s bad and all, but what bothers me most is the hypocrisy.
r/mildlyinfuriating
They would also re-route rivers *into* cities during a seige. Hard to stay comfortable in your valley when your houses and crops are under a lake
I was about to say, if it was seiged for a decade it would have been easier to just route the river during it.
Note that the first part, the "kill half the people (usually the males) and sell the rest into slavery" was *absolutely nothing unusual at all*. That was the standard *modus operandi* of pretty much everyone in antiquity. Especially including the Romans. Look up what they did to Carthage.
Carthage was a special case. They had three wars that were the worst the Romans had had until then and Rome just barely scraped a win twice, with huge losses. They really, *really* wanted them gone forever. Everywhere else, the viciousness of the Romans was *generally* proportional to how much trouble they got conquering. They were happy to just roll in, take the riches and a bunch of slaves, add your address to the tax collector to do list, and go on about their business. They didn't even aim to exterminate people who *really* pissed them off. They believed that all gods were real, and if they killed our enslaved all the worshippers of a pantheon, those gods would start giving them shit. And in the end, a taxpayer is generally better than a slave. But yeah, everyone did that kind of shit back then. Although the Mongols had their 15 minutes of fame during the Middle Ages, not antiquity. Those were the Huns.
Sounds like overpopulation was a rare problem.
The Mongols invaded in the 1200s though, not the 100bc. Mass enslavement of populations was not as much (still happened). in the vogue then. massacres and looting was the norm though. The Mongols were considered exceptionally brutal by their contemporaries.
They really really liked horses
When fermented mare's milk is your go to alcohol....
sometimes you have more rugs than poison.
I was always shocked at the method of building a deck on top of the thousands of russian royals stacked like cord wood as the mongols would proceed to have a party on top and slowly squish and suffocate those trapped underneath.
This was a particularly interesting way to kill people that seemed like something out of a comic book. But no, they really did it. Mongols did not fuck around when it came to punishing those that rose up against them. But were semi-merciful to cities that agreed to join the Mongol empire.
They did not rise up against them. It was the great khans scouting party that came across Russians in Europe.
Yes not this particular historical example but the Kievan Rus did try to remain independent from the Mongols and resisted when they invaded, culminating in the siege and sacking of Kiev in 1240.
r/decks
And that's why Ivan the Terrible appears and started to decimate the mongols, step by step
Steppe by steppe
Oooo baby🎵
Gonna get to you Khan.
Yea Tbh everybody was pretty horrible back then. People aren't great nowadays either, I guess.
Seems like that would spill a lot of blood.
Ya that sounds less bloody
They also believed in not spilling noble blood. If someone from a royal family had to die, they had some pretty creative ways of doing it. There was one story, I believe it was when they defeated the Rus, where they tied all the nobles up and put them on the ground. A giant wooden platform was made and set on top of them. Then all the Mongols had a big party on the platform and crushed them to death. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Kalka_River
Man what a gig for that DJ
It's murder on the dancefloor But you better not kill the groove
Jump around! Jump around!
Perfect time to renounce your bloodline
Here is my country the worst thing that gets done to people is having tyres put on them and then setting it alight, we call it necklacing.
Used to work with a south African bloke. He once showed me a video his brother sent to him of this happening. Was fucking horrific. He didn't even ask if I wanted to see it!
Not the first time I've heard of them literally forcing foreigners to witness those burnings. It's some kind of sick enjoyment thing.
Yeh it was pretty weird. I would have only been about 20 at the time and he found it hilarious that I thought it was disgusting.
Had a Mexican drywaller I worked with show me 8-10 guys getting executed with various stabbing tools and long poles. The way the bodies moved reminded me of my dad clubbing fish in the bottom of the boat. Everyone laughed, even the local dudes. I just couldn’t help but think those were basically kids, maybe early 20s to late teens
What the fuck man. That’s crazy. How can they be so desensitized to it?
Mexican here. Frankly we don't know, we don't even think about it. It's a coping mechanism for how awful violence is in here.
Nigerian chiming in, seen it as well. Twice actually, the first time I was nine and was waiting for my mom in front of a store. It's some twisted jungle justice and it's usually done to thieves. It's not as common as it used to be a decade or two ago, but it's not completely gone in some parts. The sight sticks with you forever
I've never seen it personally, that will haunt me.
>they would be killed by making 100 horses run over you. What a logistical nightmare
Not if you built your empire on the superiority of your horsemanship.
Not when everyone in attendance arrived on a horse. It’s more like “ok we’re all here, what are we going to do with all these horses?”
Another name for the corruption punishment was the Mongolian steppe
"Lockpicking Lawyer here, and today we have something really special..."
"I hear a click, my shoulder is dislocated, and now we can get to pick this lock.
All while his voice is completely unfazed.
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"Anyway, I would not recommend the Mongolian prisoner wooden execution box because as you can see, you can break out of the box long before you run out of water in the 110 degree heat. I'm going to go commit adultery again to show that that was not a fluke."
Mrs. Lockpickinglawyer won't like that a bit. But she will have to agree it's the only way to prove it's not a fluke.
Ghangis Khan used to pour molten silver into the ears of enemy generals as an execution when he thought they were cowardly. That’s a very tough region to live.
They also tortured people by filling their stomachs with rocks. They’d insert a tube and then fill them up with pebbles until your entire body was filled with pebbles and apparently you died in excruciating pain.
Yeah that is probably going to be insanely painful, imagine having hundreds of stones grind against your innards while all the muscles are desperately cramping to pass those stones. Probably Kidney Stones x10.
>*apparently* you died in excruciating pain guess we'll never know
Yeah but at least it was silver! Could’ve been iron or some worthless molten metal.
Sometimes it’s just nice to know you’re worth the expense
Could be because silver has a much lower melting point vs iron
The OG Khal Drogo.
Literally, in the sense that this is where George R. R. Martin got the inspiration from
That is true. George constantly takes events, details, and characters from history for those books. War of the Five Kings was based on War of the Roses. The Dance of the Dragons was based on The Anarchy in Europe. If you're planning to watch the show, definitely don't look up The Anarchy. It's nearly identical, minus the dragons.
> If you're planning to watch the show, definitely don't look up The Anarchy. It's nearly identical, minus the dragons. THIS is what I was hoping for when I heard of the show.
https://simple.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scaphism#:~:text=Scaphism%20or%20The%20Boats%20was,honey%20and%20generally%20stripped%20naked. Relatively tame in comparison.
"Related Pages: Smoothie, milkshake " wtf wikipedia
Worst smoothie ever
https://preview.redd.it/x04lfw49we4d1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=4bfe2b9806613433cac8df80839037b0ef656730
Maybe someone can clarify but the last time this popped up someone mentioned there were no records of this actually happening.
Marco Polo spread a lot of the rumors. He was an official attache to the Khan and spread rumors of his cruelty far and wide.
This method of death is rumored to fictional. Though I wouldn’t put it past people to do this. We have always been brutal to each other.
This picture isnt real but staged I read. Been posted on Reddit for many years.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Featured_picture_candidates/Mongolian_woman_condemned_to_die_of_starvation Some discussion from Wikipedia. Seems like it may have been more like a single occupancy prison cell, and the prisoner would be fed.
I was wondering. Because there's a bowl there. Didn't know if they may give her enough water to keep her alive longer to prolong suffering or something though.
It might be one of those 'conditional death penalty' situations. You'd see similar stuff in Europe...they'd leave you in a cage for a month and it was basically up to the community to give you food/water during that time. If people liked you, you lived. If not? Welp.
Did image search and translated from Korean website. "**Was it a Manchurian custom to lock Crown Prince Sado in the back bar?** # A Buddhist photographer who visited Mongolia in 1913 took a picture of a woman locked in a wooden box, calling it # a “mobile prison for nomadic peoples.” A woman with scattered hair is locked in a rectangular wooden box that looks like a back post. The surrounding area is a vast grassland with no people around. There is a small hole in the box she was placed in, and the woman is desperately fiddling with her locks, with only her face and her left hand sticking out of the hole. This is a photo posted on the Facebook page of Kyung Hee University Professor Kang In-wook (Northern Archeology) on the 7th. It was taken by French photographer Stephane Paz, who visited Mongolia in 1913 when it had just gained independence from China, and was published in National Geographic magazine in May 1922. The photo caption at the time reads, ‘A woman being starved to death near Urga (currently Ulaanbaatar).’ ▲ A Mongolian woman locked in a dungeon and starved to death. It was taken by French photographer Stephane Paz, who visited Mongolia in 1913. Judging by the food bowls placed around her back, it appears she was not actually starved to death (left photo). Duju appearing in the movie ‘Apostle’ Professor Kang’s explanation is as follows. "These days, the back pole is attracting attention because of the movie 'The Apostle,' but originally, this type of punishment is a unique custom of the nomads. Since they have been nomads and wandering all their lives, there is no way that there is a prison facility as we think of it. Northern peoples use wooden boxes that look like a back pole as 'mobile prisons.' 'It was used as '. Professor Kang said, "Contrary to Stephan Paz's photo caption, judging from the food bowls placed around the back pole, it appears that the purpose was to confine them for a certain period of time rather than to starve them to death." He added, "The regular back pole used in Mongolia during this period was used as a camel's back luggage. “It seems like it was made in a square shape to make it easier to load.” Since when was ‘Duju Prison’ used in Mongolia? Researchers say, “The reason why Duju began to be used as an execution tool in Mongolia was due to the influence of the Qing Dynasty (Manchu).” Currently, a large piece of Duju is on display at the Folklore Hall of the National Museum of Mongolian History in Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia. Jang Jang-sik, a curator at the National Folk Museum of Korea, said, “It is a type of punishment tool (tool for punishment) and is displayed along with iron fetters and whips. As Mongolia began to be ruled by the Qing Dynasty, ‘Duju Prison’ was created in the Mongolian region between the 17th and 19th centuries. “Torture was carried out,” he said. Did King Yeongjo, who imprisoned Crown Prince Sado in Duju, know about this nomadic custom? Professor Kang In-wook said, “It cannot be said that King Yeongjo punished people according to nomadic customs, but it is possible to assume that he was aware of this death penalty law.” **Was it a Manchurian custom to lock Crown Prince Sado in the back bar?** # A Buddhist photographer who visited Mongolia in 1913 took a picture of a woman locked in a wooden box, calling it # Source: [https://m.cafe.daum.net/kphpi21/6v6H/678](https://m.cafe.daum.net/kphpi21/6v6H/678)
Oh thank god, my next thought was the photographer just LEFT her to die. I mean it’s still horrible, but at least she lived.
If there were no one else around I'd try to help, but at the same time I'm not trying to catch my own (possibly worse, as others have noted above, the Mongols of the old days were pretty creative in the "thinking up horrible ways to execute people" sense) brutal death sentence for interfering in another country's justice system.
Well now I don’t know who to believe.
The modern internet experience!
i wonder what happened to the guy she committed adultery with
In theory the punishment for both sexes were 90 lashes with the whip each at this time, but because of a loophole in Imperial Chinese law the aggrieved party could use lethal force avoiding the regular courts if done immediately and the heads of the offenders were later presented to a judge as proof of identity so he could retrosign the punishment (in some locations the heads would then be thrown in a bucket of water, due to a superstitious belief that bodies of lovers will attempt to face each other in death, so if the heads looked at each other it was seen as proof of infidelity and allowed the spouse to avoid legal consequences). A court could also order the castration of a male cheater, but that was more rare at this time as eunuchs had evolved into a professional class. Most likely, if the woman was punished with immurement like this, the male cheater was also subject to one of the Nine Punishments, or just beheaded on the spot by the spouse and his clan.
Mongolia was not a part of Imperial China at this time. Mongolia was a Chinese province from 1691 to 1911, and then again in 1919 to 1921. From 1912 to 1919 Mongolia was under the protection of Russia. [Source](https://2009-2017.state.gov/outofdate/bgn/mongolia/79156.htm#:~:text=Outer%20Mongolia%20was%20a%20Chinese,province%20(1919%2D21)) While some traditions from China’s influence may have stuck around, I am more on board believing that the people of Mongolia maintained their cultural heritage and held onto the traditional punishments they knew. Another [comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/s/0PIiymjoON) in the post spoke to this as well.
I read that in ancient China they drown both the adulterer and adulteress in a pond or river in pig cages.
Yea we literally have a saying “Drown them in the pig cage” but it’s really outdated and only used in movies set in ancient times or said ironically because it’s outdated.
Oh, kind of like how we use "burn the witch" or something.
Yes! Exactly!
A crisp high five I'd imagine
He’s probably the owner of the company that makes those boxes.
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Traditionally these sorts of punishments were not carried out in Mongolia. This was Mongolia under Manchu rule which had some torturous punishments to keep the people from revolting for independence. We call it the 9 punishments https://preview.redd.it/jsuyk39fje4d1.jpeg?width=499&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c4a854a519ce89da531812f721430349a14b9ad2
https://preview.redd.it/005f6j0kje4d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fb90abd9c8a0e28343d080d5d0f188e895b9cb77 The nine ways of torture/punishment
Translation?
1. Slapping with wood 2. Boxed 3. Crushing calves 4. Squished 5. Precious stallion 6. Bamboo insertion (between hand nails) 7. Searing 8. Beating with stick 9. Pulling out bricka
They're all awful but I felt that bamboo shit
I am so grateful to have been born when and where I was holy fuck.
Truly, we do not live in a perfect world by any means, but I do think we sometimes overlook the ways we are so very lucky and dare I say - blessed? - to live today. Yeah rent and inflation suck, but I’d have to try REALLY hard to be tortured to death in such a way
Just realised with 5 that when you eventually fall over, you're going to break your wrists and ankles
terrifyingly simple.
Worse! Dude imagine being pushed. Or "gently" proved with sharp instruments. And these were public long-form tortures. Imagine being in a town square or castle courtyard for everyone. Who would be the worst? Bored soldiers? Drunk men? Spiteful teens? Curious kids? It's a choose-your-own adventure of shit.
>1. Slapping with wood That's a paddlin'
1. “Bonk with small stick” 2. “Trap in box” 3. “Tie to post, make uncomfortable with stick” 4. “Explain misdeeds, point for emphasis” 5. “Stand like dog” 6. “Needles under nails” 7. “Light fire on back” 8. “Bonk with large stick” 9. “Make taller”
why did i think this was real for a second
It is the direct translation
Nine Ways of Mongol Torture/Punishment. #6 Will Shock You!
The Geneva Convention Hates These 9 Simple Tricks!
Crown Prince Sado (1735-1762) died in a similar way. He was confined in a rice chest on the orders of his father king Yeongjo of Joseon (Korea). Probably died due to dehydration/starvation.
Apparently Sado was a bit of a sadist, randomly murdering people and raping some of the palace maids. So, don't feel too bad.
I don’t think I could walk away. Like that would eat at me for the rest of my life.
They have a box for you too
That's my box! I must go there..
And for you
> I don’t think I could walk away. Like that would eat at me for the rest of my life. Journalists that cover attrocities are haunted by their work, just lok at Kevin Carter. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Carter
We often can't know what we would do until we were to be put in such a situation. While I don't know whether this photographer had children or other loved ones whom he wouldn't want to leave, this would likely be a significant factor for many people faced with such risks.
Most important thing it would be pointless they probably both wold die
Yeah some on here really think the people who were letting a woman die of starvation in a box would just go “ah get outta here you little knucklehead” to the person who let said woman out of the box. They would put him in an even smaller box as punishment, they clearly don’t care about being inhumane lol. There’s not a single person in this thread who would actually try to save her. The people who say they would have just never been in a deadly situation before.
I mean, my answer really depends on the likelihood that I am caught trying to free her. Is her box literally set in the middle of nowhere, and people only tend to it occasionally to add food/water to a small bowl? Yes- I can probably try to free her without being caught. Is her box regularly monitored/guarded, or placed in an area with high-traffic? I probably can’t take the risk without also ending up in a box myself.
Bear in mind you'd be a foreigner in a different country. How do you get something to break her out without arising suspicion? I mean heck: taking the photo alone could put your life in danger. On top of that, let's say everything works out and somehow you get her out. What does that really do for her? She runs back into town and then someone sees it and goes "hmm, how did she get out?". Great now you're both in a box. I don't fault people for seeing this and WANTING to do something, that's normal human empathy. But saying you would actually do something...at best that's misguided empathy, and at worst it's ivory tower thinking.
Honestly people that are willing to execute people like this are fairly likely to need very little proof. If somebody goes to check on her an hour after you let her escape all it takes is one person to say “hey I saw that foreign guy go in that direction a little bit ago” and they’ll throw you in the box too lol. They executed like this because they enjoyed it, it’s insanely dangerous to free her in almost any circumstance.
In my experience with some of these things in history: they'll even torture the person who you freed and promise them freedom if they narc on you. The person will narc, then you'll both get put in a box. They don't even have to narc on the actual person, torture hardly ever gets real useful information, but they'll lock up innocent people all the same.
It would definitely eat at me the rest of my life too… but I think realistically if he would’ve tried he would’ve been put in his own box. Impossible situation
The original r/donthelpjustfilm
stephane passet really took the national geographic oath to heart
Christ... Imagine stumbling across that on your travels.
Imagine seeing someone from another country stumbling on you, mid torture. Begging for their help only to have a photo taken and a confused exchange before they wander off.
So basically the same thing that happens now with people and cellphones
You’d probably get a boxing for helping her.
You wanted to see the world my boy
It still happens… https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Marcia_Powell
“ outdoor cages are still used in Arizona, but now have shade” Jesus fucking Christ. Why in the FUCK are they using outdoor cages in ARIZONA?!?? I’ve also heard of prisons not having consistent AC in hot climates like Texas and Florida which is mind fucking blowing to me, considering at least in Florida, it’s considered an emergency to not have AC
her "crime" was prostitution
So baked to death for the crime of being desperately poor. This is hideous.
Agreed, truly disgusting. Apparently no charges or anything were prosecuted due to insufficient evidence.
Insufficient evidence here meaning the prosecutors are in bed with the police and won’t ever prosecute unless there’s political pressure and no one even filed a wrongful death lawsuit for this poor woman. There are literal murderers out there collecting a government check
> Powell was cremated Yikes, then burned her some more.
Bro it's Maricopa County, The same place that elected [This psycopath](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Arpaio) for Sheriff for nearly 3 decades despite costing them over 300 million in legal fees due to his consistent torturing of prisoners. That place ain't right.
"he was convicted of criminal contempt of court, a crime for which he was pardoned by President Donald Trump on August 25, 2017" I have no words...
And Trump fucking pardoned him 2 months before his sentencing for the one crime they finally nailed him with. What a dick.
That fucker also didn’t know that pardoned meant you owned up to your crimes. When confronted by the media about it, he fumbled terribly. At 92 that fucker (his pronoun) is running for mayor of a local city.
Jesus. That is one upsetting wikipedia page. It just kept getting worse and worse.
Arpaio is absolutely one of the worst Americans to ever live. An absolute traitor to any of the values that America holds itself to. No death is too bad for him.
>"insufficient evidence to go forward with a prosecution against any of the named individuals". Why not try the whole system then? Or if that's too hard, maybe make actual changes to stop shit like that from happening? Here's an idea, let's not use outdoor cages in one of the hottest areas in the country. Or better yet mandate what is or isn't an acceptable form of punishment. There's prison and there's torture and I kind of remember "Cruel and unusual punishments" being outlawed at one time in America, heck I think it's in the constitution. Then again what hope does (Not did, it's still open) Guantanamo Bay have if this is the type of shit we do to our own prisoners whose crime was.... prostitution. Fuck.
Jesus this Wikipedia page is so deeply sad. All the missing details feel like a person who was never shown real love or compassion in her life and then died horrifically.
Yeah, locked up for *prostitution* of all things. Heartbreaking.
I'm guessing this was Joe Arpaio's doing.
Well. That’s fucked up.
And what happened to the guy?
stern warning. that'll teach'em.
Also, there's a real chance that the "adultery" was actually rape
https://i.redd.it/44kxb5s6le4d1.gif
You wouldn’t think anything like this would happen today. They’d definitely wouldn’t let you die free of charge in a box. You’d have to pay rent, and the torture water would be on subscription.
Hi how are you!? Are you stuck, can I help you? I'm left here to slowly die! Oh my, that's terrible! Can you try and look at the camera ? Bye and succes with the thing you're doing!
Immurement was absolutely a form of punishment in Mongolia at the time, but there is no definite proof that this lady was left to starve. National Geographic suggested that is the case, but it has not been proven so far. Wikipedia suggests it might be a prisoner transport but I'm not quite buying that if the box was found on its own by Passet, then it would be more likely that the punishment was either temporary or, in fact immurement.
So ... were they reusing the same box? Like ... was that the murder box in the back of the shed ... or making a new one each time?
Humanity is so FUCKING cruel
I am sure, and believe that those who created this law, those who arrested her, those who were running the country, religious leaders, and every single person involved in this - had also committed adultery but never got caught, or they had created laws/amendments to protect their own adultery.
Nothing a 3 inch punch can’t get you out of. 