You're not, and this is by design.
Recently, I got refused for a mortgage that cost €1600 a month. Despite the fact I've been paying over €2000 a month for rent for the last few years without issue
What was the reason the banks gave because 2k a month rent payments should more than cover the repayment ability condition on the mortgage application.
We were approved no problem with rent payments of 1350 plus 500 per month savings. 2k in rent is even more than that, so it must have been a different reason.
Well im not sure when exactly they changed the mortgage rules but they now take your rent as repayment ability if you pay 2k on rent they take that as proof you can repay a 2k mortgage.
All the rest of your finances need to be in order as well. No gambling, no taking from savings etc. But if you were savings 5k per month and not touching any if it that's proof you could replay a mortgage of 1.2 million over 35 years at current interest rates. Which is obviously insane so I'm not sure why a bank told you that's the level of savings you need.
They didn't take any of that into account and I was paying 1600 a month at the time it's about 6/7 years ago
I assume it cos I haven't taken part in the credit system and have just bought everything myself I've never gotten a loan before
Ah yeah fair enough, it's a lot easier now to prove repayment. We genuinely found it handy enough to get approved with very little savings, we were really surprised. When we applied the first time we had no consistent savings for the 6 months. Repayment ability was based on rent, pension contributions, and my company stock program contributions which is 10% of my wage every month. We then started saving 500pm after that to make sure when it came time for the letter of offer we would have no problems. But that 500pm wasn't included in our AIP.
There's no credit system, it doesn't work like that. To be honest the whole 5k p/m thing sounds like a stretch. At current rates thats the repayment on 1.5m euro property.
My point is that you can't build a 'score' like in the UK or US, so there's no penalty for not having used a loan....it would be a positive/neutral not to have had a loan.
This is untrue. While we don’t have a credit score like the US banks nonetheless have records. If you are with a bank and manage your finances with them they will build up a profile about you.
Taking out loans and paying them back is a major positive as far as the bank is concerned. So is using your credit card and paying it back. It means you are someone who is not a risk to lend money to. Someone who has never borrowed is an unknown quantity - maybe they will pay it back or maybe they will default. I’ve been told this directly by a bank when I started asking about a mortgage - the small loans that I had taken out and paid back were a green mark as far as they were concerned.
We don't have a score but they definitely do consider previous loans when considering new ones. A lack of history isn't going to gate you though since so many people don't have a credit history.
My friend there's no way that's right unless something is very off. We're you looking for a very large loan or something?
To save 5k a month you'd have to be on like 150k+ minimum, and even then it would be very difficult.
I’d love if €1700 was too much for a full house but I’m in Dublin atm and a 2-bed for myself and my SO is about €1950 all-in. This is north Co. Dublin, not city, but it actually seems reasonable enough all things considered. Terraced house, small front and back garden, bath-and-a-half with the main bath having been done up in the last 2-3 year I’d say
I’ve actually only just moved up. Herself’s entire family are here and the job is on-site so I’m happy enough tbh, decent earnings potential down the line. Was very unhappy in the previous spots I was too so this is already a big improvement even though it’s a difference of about €250 p/m over my last spot (which was a Kip)
Kinda disgusting it's so much more expensive to rent then it is for a mortgage and lots of people are DQed on getting a mortgage due to not earning enough. 1950 is way too much on rent...it'd be like a 600k mortgage.
I agree with you! We don’t have much in the way of savings unfortunately but we’re in our mid 20s and our combined salary is a little over 70k atm which wouldn’t get us far yet anyway. I suppose the hope is to stick it out in this place for the foreseeable since it’s affordable for the area and hopefully our earnings increase to an extent that we can start putting away meaningful savings towards a deposit (at which point 3.5x our salary will be more significant also hopefully)
I think we both wish we were a bit further along but we’re also not in a mad rush yet
>I feel like 1700 is too much for a full house, but ya this is probably earning 5-6k per month...obscene really.
And do you know what the landlord will do with all that rent money? They'll buy up another property and so on, It gets easier for them. They'll be buying up multiple properties, turning the rest of us into renters.
>Includes utility bills and service charges including gas, electricity, TV multi-channel, super WiFi broadband and a regular cleaning service.
>Luxurious large bedroom which has an ensuite bathroom with a jacuzzi bath and a power shower available in a large, contemporary house with every modern convenience.
So, it's not a typical living area.
I guess "luxurious large bedroom" means different things to different people judging by this. Looks like a decent bedroom, normal size for double but nothing luxurious there.
Can't really comment on the designer kitchen from the one crappy photo.
Utilities included isn't all that unusual and hardly justifies this price, utilities and cleaner are probably €200 maximum between 4 people. You'd want to really love your jacuzzi bathtub.
FFG are top of the polls. Nothing will change. Why? Because decades of no investment in our indigenous industries has rendered the Irish people completely devoid of any real wealth other than the artificially inflated property prices derived from a restricted market.
In other nations, people invest in equities/start a business etc with their money. Here, they just pump it into property and speculate. We have no real wealth here. All of our money comes from foreign corporations whose responsibility for the funding of 85% of our public services. They could literally turn the light off tomorrow and we'd go back to being a third world country overnight. FFG have brought us here through their policies. They have you by the balls.
anglo landlords used to bemoan catholic middle men who aspired to nothing more than fleecing subtenants.
Our problem is we got rid of the anglo landlords when we got independence but we but the catholic middlemen in charge so they still aspire to nothing more than living of our work, no interest in developing the state or any of that just make money of fleecing actual productive members of society
We were warned by our 1916 heroes about replacing British landlords with Irish ones just chomping at the bit for a slice of the cake. After the War of Independence and towards the end of the Civil War there was a political counter-revolution oversaw by O'Higgins and his well-to-do elite family mates. The IRA got him in the end but the damage was done.
What we have now is not what the men and women of 1916 fought and died for but there are many people in the country that have managed to get a few crumbs from the table since the Celtic Tiger so you won't get any sympathy from them. They view you as the enemy.
It also won't change because anyone with an opinion outside of the fffg endorsed narrative is a far right looney - according to this sub most days anyways.
Move up to northern Ireland. That's what I'm doing. Got a 5 bedroom house in a secluded area, 5 mins from 2 towns and 20 min from Armagh. 950 pounds / month
seriously though, if you're remote working and if they have fibre then whole houses in the triangle formed by Cavan/Armagh/Dundalk are fucking good value for money at the minute.
My sister rented a *microscopic* place near Monaghan for half of fuck all per month so they could save for the wedding and mortgage and they really, really liked it.
Exactly yeah. They just put in a new broadband cable past this house (1000mb/s) and I'm fully remote. But also it's close to the border so even full time work in South could work. A house that I got would probably go for 3k in South
Nope. As long as you work in South all good. And in regards of NHS I don't plan on using it or to seek any benefits in NI. I pay taxes, pension contributions in the south.
I think the only realistic way that this will improve within our lifetimes is if there are large protests against it. And by “large protests” I don’t mean very big marches on a Saturday when the entire Dáil is at home laughing at us over twitter. I mean constant squatting, vandalism/sabotage, targeted boycotts and bullying essentially of the worst landlords, rent strikes etc. etc. I work in town and every day on the Luas I pass by the building on the quays that the guards violently dragged squatters out of 2 years ago. The squatters were demonised, the owners of the building (the Salvation Army, ironically) said that it was meant to house Ukrainians, and to this day it’s boarded up. 2 years those spoofers have left it sitting idle, and sadly it was never retaken.
The state and the upper middle class responds with fury and violence at the mere hint of private property being interfered with. I think up till now this has worked out for them because they’ve been insulated from the consequences of the way they’ve set up our society. The reality that hundreds of thousands of young people are still living with their parents, or paying just under the average industrial wage in **rent alone**, or stuck in violent or abusive households, etc etc etc doesn’t seem to have come home to roost for them. How, I don’t know, as so many of these Fine Gael voters and Newstalk callers are parents and siblings of these people. But either way, the extent of the problem needs to be forcefully and painfully made clear to the powers that be, or it will not change.
Will that happen? Up to individuals to predict, but I have my thoughts on it.
I agree with you, Your statement is also why governments want to bring in monitoring chats all over Europe, including here in Ireland. They know that people can only take so much. When want an end to encrypted chat because they don't want people to organise.
What policy change would you be protesting for? We need planning reform and a yimby movement, that is what is beginning to help the problem in other countries. Which party is proposing those policies? None, because landowners know it would hurt them and non-landowners are politically confused. Young renters think of themselves as being on the "left" politically, but in fact they advocate for policies like banning foreign investment, stricter space, environmental, and heritage regulations, and rent control, which don't affect supply (or even hurt supply) and therefore protect the advantage of private property even more.
There was a proposed policy to build a large number of small shared units in high-demand areas which would have catered one of the worst-supplied sectors -- it was called co-living, and it was banned, and most people were happy to see it banned. Because people imagine that if you ban co-living, somehow we'll all get a massive cheap flat instead. Of course, what actually happens is the supply-demand ratio has got way worse, everyone lives in tiny bedrooms in big houseshares, and to top it all off we're turning into an anti-immigrant nation.
The "left" in this country has been brainwashed by the property-owning class into favoring policies that prop up asset prices. We need massive planning reform, and we need to build both private housing and social housing everywhere. Who do I vote for to support that policy? Right now the most radical planning reform proposal is from the current government!
Just emigrate, other countries are figuring it out. The Brits are always about ten years ahead of us on stuff like this. New Zealand have made a lot of progress too. There's lots of evidence out there, and nobody listening. If anyone actually wanted things to change, we would have a yimby movement, like the one that is about to win a massive majority in the UK.
Sources
https://investors.redfin.com/news-events/press-releases/detail/1091/redfin-reports-home-prices-stagnate-in-florida-and-texas-as
https://www.afr.com/policy/economy/how-auckland-took-on-the-nimbys-and-won-20230522-p5da9o
https://www.reddit.com/r/urbanplanning/comments/x4w762/stockholms_housing_for_all_is_now_just_for_the_few/
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58317555
https://oliverhartwich.com/2024/04/10/jacinda-ardern-did-one-thing-right-and-australia-could-learn-from-it/
https://view.publitas.com/primeresi/the-affordability-impacts-of-new-housing-supply-gla-housing-research-note/page/1
https://www.onlondon.co.uk/why-luxury-flats-do-not-push-out-londons-poor-and-why-we-still-need-to-build-for-low-cost-rent/
https://houstonagentmagazine.com/2024/03/26/rent-prices-are-cooling-off-in-houston/
https://www.ft.com/content/86836af4-6b52-49e8-a8f0-8aec6181dbc5
I'll bet you didn't vote in the local elections. If young people had gone out and voted it would have driven up the turn out. That would make politicians take notice and pay attention to their needs.
By the way none of my friends or I rented a nice place on our own in the 90s and 2000s. We all started out either sharing or renting some low quality place and made the most of it.
I hear some may people complaining about it. Then I see the quite guys in work buying something with the help to buy and renting out a room or the new grad sharing a place with 3 friends and having a ball. 3 miles from city centre 4 of them.
I think that's the aim of the government; if we allow everything to become super expensive, then only the rich can live and prosper here.
They'll pat themselves on the back then equating it to success.
It's absolutely what they want. 2030 onwards can't buy any new non electric car. It's going to be only the rich can afford to drive.
The rest of us still here will exist simply to be slaves to the upper class, living in cramped, crowded conditions, not able to have a car, and paying insane rents with no ability to save, no ability to retire.
I fear so. I'm in my forties and it seems that greed and trying to come top of the heap are the only ambitions that are out there. Shameful. Ireland’s lost it's humility and fairness.
The housing problem here is vast (and complex). Ireland is currently building more houses than almost every other country in Europe, thats still not nearly enough. Elected officials can definitely do more, but they don't have magic powers, and we aren't the only country with a serious housing problem. I genuinely wish a group of people would get together to put housing top of the agenda and then run for office. I guarantee if they got in they'd still find the issue incredibly difficult to fix, and any fixes would take time. Not saying they couldn't do it, but it would still be very challenging.
>Ireland is currently building more houses than almost every other country in Europe
Overall or per capita? Also where do you see the comparisons of this data?
Number of completed dwellings per 1,000 citizens 2022
France 7.09
Poland 6.31
Denmark 5.92
Ireland 5.83
Liechtenstein 5.66
Israel 5.38
Norway 5.1
Estonia 4.8
Belgium 4.41
Netherlands 4.16
Czechia 3.75
Slovakia 3.72
Germany 3.5
Bulgaria 3.05
United Kingdom 2.63
Hungary 2.12
Portugal 1.92
Spain 1.69
So to get to top of list we need 7x5127=36k/year
Unfortunately 2024 Q1 completions are down 12% vs Q1 2023.
I haven't fact checked these stats.
Then do "what if 6m population".
https://www.statista.com/statistics/650790/completed-dwellings-per-citizens-by-country-europe/
Meanwhile...
A new report from the ESRI shows that 35,000 to 53,000 new dwellings will be needed annually based on projected population growth scenarios.
https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0702/1457635-esri-housing-report/
The non cynic in me is thinking this ads either been made by a dope that's given the entire rent for the place (which you should divide by 4, as there's already 3 there) or they've made some all merciful typo in pricing. Not a hope anyone takes that like.
You'd think you'll get peace and quality at least for this price but the landlord is psychotic and constantly in and out of her rental houses. Also keeps a room in all of them as BnB overflow so it isn't even consistent people in the house.
She's a few properties in the area, all easily spotted as they're furnished the exact same and ridiculously expensive. Clearly been upping her prices beyond the RPZ rates too if they're that expensive now.
Worst landlord I ever had by a long shot, truly a rotten woman to the core.
Does seem you're cherry-picking the one ridiculously expensive place, to be fair; there are a dozen other rooms in the same neighbourhood going for less than a grand a month (which is still way too fucking much for just a room, but not as ridiculous as that one).
Thousands are sailing
Across the western ocean
To a land of opportunity
That some of them will never see
Fortune prevailing
Across the western ocean
Their bellies full
Their spirits free
They'll break the chains of poverty
And they'll dance
We need to unite and protest. This shit is unacceptable and been allowed to worsen under FFG for too long.
Vacant buildings and empty council land needs to be taken over, im sick of Irish people leaving this Island because they cant make it their home
The reality is that a lot of the electorate just don't want the housing crisis to end.
They love it. They either profit massively off of it, or are getting a faux illusion of wealth - just like in the Celtic Tiger.
Fuckwits probably mutter to themselves again "a million isn't _really_ a lot of money!", based on inflated house prices.
They're probably also saying to themselves - "this time it's different!" - once again.
The reality is, one _extremely powerful/overwhelming_ part of the electorate, will keep us locked in a housing crisis.
An additional reality, is _peaceful means of protest will have fuck all effect at stopping this_, because money trumps all.
That means _violent means of protest may be the only way to stop/reverse this_ - which _does not mean I advocate that_.
The far-right already have a major head start on everyone else, on the whole violent-protest front - so it's really looking like everyone is going to voluntarily cede power to the far-right, now - because they are fucking gutless.
If history tells you anything, peaceful protests absolutely do not work. That's a harsh reality.
"Oh, you don't like our countries policies right now? OK, go stand in that park. Times up guys, head back to work."
Why would a government be pressured to change anything, if they don't lose anything from 'protests' anyway?
I moved into Rural... I'm in a 5 bed / 6 bath for less than that. Yeah.. price is cheaper because our landlord (not a company) is truly amazing.
But you do need a car as there is nothing nearby.. closest shop is nearly 8km away.
There should be a lot more control on Rentals.. and companies should be blocked from owning more than 2-3 apartments within a 10KM radius.
I actually rented off this lady years ago (a lot cheaper then). She's a good few places around Wilton and western road in cork. She doesn't rent every room in the houses out and keeps one as overflow for her BnB. According to threshold at the time this meant you weren't actually a tenant so no rights, and no requirement to register as a rental. Couldn't stop the cunt from dropping in and out with no notice, and had random BnB guests robbing food from the kitchen. I've never wished ill on any other person but loath the owner of this property and truly hope she suffers in the next life. Absolute cow of a woman!
It felt exceptionally dodgy and unfair at the time but threshold were adamant we could do nothing. I still feel physically angry when I think back to renting off her.
You've literally picked the most expensive place you could find.
Here are 11 other options in Wilton for less than €900 a month, the cheapest of which is €430 a month. https://www.daft.ie/sharing/wilton-cork
I agree it's a sensationalist post because OP implied that this is a typical price when it is not (not yet at least). These greedy dickheads do deserve to be called out though.
Damn you folks have the same horrific housing costs that we do in the states. 😥 This seems to be a world wide problem. Here in America we have up to 1/4 of all houses being owned by wall street investment firms and then who knows how many Air BNBs.
It's actually way worse here because there aren't 49 other states to look at as options we just have one little country. And the entire country is basically one huge tourist destination especially all the nicer and busier places in it. There's zero rentals available in my town, but with over 150 Airbnbs just within a ten minutes walk from my place. Throw in an influx of 100k+ Ukrainian war refugees and it's really dire at the moment.
Worse thing is the houses here are mostly so much smaller than what you get in the US and the bedrooms are most often just enough room for the bed and maybe just enough space to walk next to the bed. There's no 'walking across the room' like in a US house, most places don't have a porch, there's no basements and usually no 'utility room', the washing machine is in the kitchen usually and in shared accommodation you end up sharing the space not just with housemates but with their laundry hanging up all over the place on every radiator and whatnot because electricity is so expensive you only use the dryer sparingly. Nothing like starting the day staring at your housemates boxers while you have your morning coffee.
There's no crash coming anytime soon unless there's a global economic crash that results in massive job losses and net emigration. If anything, this is going to get worse as our population is going to continue growing at a rate that outpaces our supply, we're going for economic growth by any means necessary
Where will you go?
Not England or America, France or Spain, Australia or New Zealand as it's fucked there too.
If you can get a decent job I hear Dubai is fucking horrible in this lifetime.
I've got news for you, if you leave Ireland expecting this to suddenly stop, you're in for a surprise.
This is happening in most countries and remeber that many political parties will imply that it's an Ireland-only problem. That's a very disingenuous thing to do but not surprising. Any city/country that's in demand is suffering from the same problem.
[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65485908](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65485908)
[https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20240105-just-fix-it-why-portugal-s-housing-crisis-keeps-getting-worse](https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20240105-just-fix-it-why-portugal-s-housing-crisis-keeps-getting-worse)
[https://www.euronews.com/business/2023/11/04/housing-crisis-are-you-prepared-to-wait-6-months-to-rent-a-studio-in-paris](https://www.euronews.com/business/2023/11/04/housing-crisis-are-you-prepared-to-wait-6-months-to-rent-a-studio-in-paris)
"Europe’s on-going housing crisis
Paris isn’t the only European city experiencing a severe housing shortage.
In London, the average rent for a one-bedroom flat in the city centre is now nearly €2,500 per month, while the median monthly salary in the UK is €2,600.
The same thing is happening in Amsterdam, with the average rent being over €1,500 per month - more than a third of the average salary in the Netherlands.
It’s low-income households and young people who are most acutely feeling the burn from the impact of the housing crisis.
To address the situation, some cities have opted for different solutions.
Vienna, Paris, Amsterdam and Amsterdam and other cities decided [**to crack down on Airbnb-style rentals**](https://www.euronews.com/travel/2023/06/11/italy-malaysia-usa-which-cities-and-countries-are-cracking-down-on-airbnb-style-rentals) that are believed to fuel the lack of rental properties available on the market.
Berlin has lifted its ban on Airbnb but strict rules - enforced with hefty fines - remain.
Another solution is to tax vacant properties to discourage landlords from keeping homes empty and coax them into renting them out.
In Europe, Spain paved the way with its first-ever national “right to housing” law - adopted last year - which included a tax for owners leaving accommodation unrented for lengthy periods.
The French government followed this year with a similar tax for cities with more than 50,000 inhabitants.
Across the Atlantic, Vancouver in Canada and Washington, DC in the US have adopted a similar measure, with other cities like San Francisco and Honolulu considering the same."
My mortgage repayments on a decent size semi-d are less than this. How are people supposed to save for a mortgage when renting a ROOM costs more?
You're not, and this is by design. Recently, I got refused for a mortgage that cost €1600 a month. Despite the fact I've been paying over €2000 a month for rent for the last few years without issue
Did they provide a reason out of curiosity? Could you not pass a stress test?
What was the reason the banks gave because 2k a month rent payments should more than cover the repayment ability condition on the mortgage application. We were approved no problem with rent payments of 1350 plus 500 per month savings. 2k in rent is even more than that, so it must have been a different reason.
I applied a few years ago and was told after all bills and spending I had to be saving 5k a month
Well im not sure when exactly they changed the mortgage rules but they now take your rent as repayment ability if you pay 2k on rent they take that as proof you can repay a 2k mortgage. All the rest of your finances need to be in order as well. No gambling, no taking from savings etc. But if you were savings 5k per month and not touching any if it that's proof you could replay a mortgage of 1.2 million over 35 years at current interest rates. Which is obviously insane so I'm not sure why a bank told you that's the level of savings you need.
They didn't take any of that into account and I was paying 1600 a month at the time it's about 6/7 years ago I assume it cos I haven't taken part in the credit system and have just bought everything myself I've never gotten a loan before
Ah yeah fair enough, it's a lot easier now to prove repayment. We genuinely found it handy enough to get approved with very little savings, we were really surprised. When we applied the first time we had no consistent savings for the 6 months. Repayment ability was based on rent, pension contributions, and my company stock program contributions which is 10% of my wage every month. We then started saving 500pm after that to make sure when it came time for the letter of offer we would have no problems. But that 500pm wasn't included in our AIP.
There's no credit system, it doesn't work like that. To be honest the whole 5k p/m thing sounds like a stretch. At current rates thats the repayment on 1.5m euro property.
https://www.centralcreditregister.ie/
My point is that you can't build a 'score' like in the UK or US, so there's no penalty for not having used a loan....it would be a positive/neutral not to have had a loan.
This is untrue. While we don’t have a credit score like the US banks nonetheless have records. If you are with a bank and manage your finances with them they will build up a profile about you. Taking out loans and paying them back is a major positive as far as the bank is concerned. So is using your credit card and paying it back. It means you are someone who is not a risk to lend money to. Someone who has never borrowed is an unknown quantity - maybe they will pay it back or maybe they will default. I’ve been told this directly by a bank when I started asking about a mortgage - the small loans that I had taken out and paid back were a green mark as far as they were concerned.
We don't have a score but they definitely do consider previous loans when considering new ones. A lack of history isn't going to gate you though since so many people don't have a credit history.
My friend there's no way that's right unless something is very off. We're you looking for a very large loan or something? To save 5k a month you'd have to be on like 150k+ minimum, and even then it would be very difficult.
If you were saving 5k a month you wouldn't need a mortgage. Simply save for four years. Buy a house.
You were refused for a different reason, the banks accept rent payments as proof of affordability.
Was the mortgage within 3.5x your gross annual income? Being within 3.5x gross income is the single most important thing.
is it not 4x now? I think I read an article that it increased some time ago?
It's been 4 for first-time buyers since Jan-23.
Geez. I got a mortgage in October 2022.
THIS is the issue!!! Also I thought they had to take in your rent payments ?
That looks like the idea.
That looks like the idea.
That looks like the idea.
Why would landlords want you to be able to save a deposit? 🤔
That's a room? I thought it'd be the whole house given that it's not Dublin. London isn't this bad.
That looks like a nice house for the money….oh never mind.
I feel like 1700 is too much for a full house, but ya this is probably earning 5-6k per month...obscene really.
Yeah, those RPZ's sure fixed the problem. Once they clamp down on the airbnb's,any day now, they'll have the whole thing solved by the GE.
I’d love if €1700 was too much for a full house but I’m in Dublin atm and a 2-bed for myself and my SO is about €1950 all-in. This is north Co. Dublin, not city, but it actually seems reasonable enough all things considered. Terraced house, small front and back garden, bath-and-a-half with the main bath having been done up in the last 2-3 year I’d say
If you can get out do , live in thurles bought a doer upper with no heating , mtg is 630 a month for the same size
I’ve actually only just moved up. Herself’s entire family are here and the job is on-site so I’m happy enough tbh, decent earnings potential down the line. Was very unhappy in the previous spots I was too so this is already a big improvement even though it’s a difference of about €250 p/m over my last spot (which was a Kip)
Kinda disgusting it's so much more expensive to rent then it is for a mortgage and lots of people are DQed on getting a mortgage due to not earning enough. 1950 is way too much on rent...it'd be like a 600k mortgage.
I agree with you! We don’t have much in the way of savings unfortunately but we’re in our mid 20s and our combined salary is a little over 70k atm which wouldn’t get us far yet anyway. I suppose the hope is to stick it out in this place for the foreseeable since it’s affordable for the area and hopefully our earnings increase to an extent that we can start putting away meaningful savings towards a deposit (at which point 3.5x our salary will be more significant also hopefully) I think we both wish we were a bit further along but we’re also not in a mad rush yet
>1950 is way too much on rent...it'd be like a 600k mortgage. 1950 a month is a mortgage of about 350-400k
You have to remember that one person's rent is another lazy cunt's income
>I feel like 1700 is too much for a full house, but ya this is probably earning 5-6k per month...obscene really. And do you know what the landlord will do with all that rent money? They'll buy up another property and so on, It gets easier for them. They'll be buying up multiple properties, turning the rest of us into renters.
>Includes utility bills and service charges including gas, electricity, TV multi-channel, super WiFi broadband and a regular cleaning service. >Luxurious large bedroom which has an ensuite bathroom with a jacuzzi bath and a power shower available in a large, contemporary house with every modern convenience. So, it's not a typical living area.
Sounds like you’d be covering Everton else’s utility bills as well for that amount
I guess "luxurious large bedroom" means different things to different people judging by this. Looks like a decent bedroom, normal size for double but nothing luxurious there. Can't really comment on the designer kitchen from the one crappy photo.
Jacuzzi and utilities paid for are what I was pointing out.
Utilities included isn't all that unusual and hardly justifies this price, utilities and cleaner are probably €200 maximum between 4 people. You'd want to really love your jacuzzi bathtub.
€1,700 for a room is beyond cunty lads. This type of shit should be illegal We need a new, better government.
FFG are top of the polls. Nothing will change. Why? Because decades of no investment in our indigenous industries has rendered the Irish people completely devoid of any real wealth other than the artificially inflated property prices derived from a restricted market. In other nations, people invest in equities/start a business etc with their money. Here, they just pump it into property and speculate. We have no real wealth here. All of our money comes from foreign corporations whose responsibility for the funding of 85% of our public services. They could literally turn the light off tomorrow and we'd go back to being a third world country overnight. FFG have brought us here through their policies. They have you by the balls.
anglo landlords used to bemoan catholic middle men who aspired to nothing more than fleecing subtenants. Our problem is we got rid of the anglo landlords when we got independence but we but the catholic middlemen in charge so they still aspire to nothing more than living of our work, no interest in developing the state or any of that just make money of fleecing actual productive members of society
We were warned by our 1916 heroes about replacing British landlords with Irish ones just chomping at the bit for a slice of the cake. After the War of Independence and towards the end of the Civil War there was a political counter-revolution oversaw by O'Higgins and his well-to-do elite family mates. The IRA got him in the end but the damage was done. What we have now is not what the men and women of 1916 fought and died for but there are many people in the country that have managed to get a few crumbs from the table since the Celtic Tiger so you won't get any sympathy from them. They view you as the enemy.
FFG don’t run the country, they sell it
It also won't change because anyone with an opinion outside of the fffg endorsed narrative is a far right looney - according to this sub most days anyways.
The left get more votes than the far right, people assuming that if you advocate changing to fascist government as an alternative
Define the far right for me and which Irish politicians are far right
Well said.
There are also places in Wilton for €430 a month, see my other post. This place is ridiculously overpriced, but they'll never get anyone to live there
Nah, most of us are happy the way things are.
Move up to northern Ireland. That's what I'm doing. Got a 5 bedroom house in a secluded area, 5 mins from 2 towns and 20 min from Armagh. 950 pounds / month
seriously though, if you're remote working and if they have fibre then whole houses in the triangle formed by Cavan/Armagh/Dundalk are fucking good value for money at the minute. My sister rented a *microscopic* place near Monaghan for half of fuck all per month so they could save for the wedding and mortgage and they really, really liked it.
Exactly yeah. They just put in a new broadband cable past this house (1000mb/s) and I'm fully remote. But also it's close to the border so even full time work in South could work. A house that I got would probably go for 3k in South
How does that work with salary? Who do you pay taxes to?
South
The does the UK government not demand taxes? can you use the NHS?
Nope. As long as you work in South all good. And in regards of NHS I don't plan on using it or to seek any benefits in NI. I pay taxes, pension contributions in the south.
So what happens if you break your leg and you need to go to hospital and physio and everything?
Southern hospitals ? I will be living 5 mins from the border.
Please don't do this.
Remember, your government hates you and this is some of the evidence.
I think the only realistic way that this will improve within our lifetimes is if there are large protests against it. And by “large protests” I don’t mean very big marches on a Saturday when the entire Dáil is at home laughing at us over twitter. I mean constant squatting, vandalism/sabotage, targeted boycotts and bullying essentially of the worst landlords, rent strikes etc. etc. I work in town and every day on the Luas I pass by the building on the quays that the guards violently dragged squatters out of 2 years ago. The squatters were demonised, the owners of the building (the Salvation Army, ironically) said that it was meant to house Ukrainians, and to this day it’s boarded up. 2 years those spoofers have left it sitting idle, and sadly it was never retaken. The state and the upper middle class responds with fury and violence at the mere hint of private property being interfered with. I think up till now this has worked out for them because they’ve been insulated from the consequences of the way they’ve set up our society. The reality that hundreds of thousands of young people are still living with their parents, or paying just under the average industrial wage in **rent alone**, or stuck in violent or abusive households, etc etc etc doesn’t seem to have come home to roost for them. How, I don’t know, as so many of these Fine Gael voters and Newstalk callers are parents and siblings of these people. But either way, the extent of the problem needs to be forcefully and painfully made clear to the powers that be, or it will not change. Will that happen? Up to individuals to predict, but I have my thoughts on it.
I agree with you, Your statement is also why governments want to bring in monitoring chats all over Europe, including here in Ireland. They know that people can only take so much. When want an end to encrypted chat because they don't want people to organise.
What policy change would you be protesting for? We need planning reform and a yimby movement, that is what is beginning to help the problem in other countries. Which party is proposing those policies? None, because landowners know it would hurt them and non-landowners are politically confused. Young renters think of themselves as being on the "left" politically, but in fact they advocate for policies like banning foreign investment, stricter space, environmental, and heritage regulations, and rent control, which don't affect supply (or even hurt supply) and therefore protect the advantage of private property even more. There was a proposed policy to build a large number of small shared units in high-demand areas which would have catered one of the worst-supplied sectors -- it was called co-living, and it was banned, and most people were happy to see it banned. Because people imagine that if you ban co-living, somehow we'll all get a massive cheap flat instead. Of course, what actually happens is the supply-demand ratio has got way worse, everyone lives in tiny bedrooms in big houseshares, and to top it all off we're turning into an anti-immigrant nation. The "left" in this country has been brainwashed by the property-owning class into favoring policies that prop up asset prices. We need massive planning reform, and we need to build both private housing and social housing everywhere. Who do I vote for to support that policy? Right now the most radical planning reform proposal is from the current government! Just emigrate, other countries are figuring it out. The Brits are always about ten years ahead of us on stuff like this. New Zealand have made a lot of progress too. There's lots of evidence out there, and nobody listening. If anyone actually wanted things to change, we would have a yimby movement, like the one that is about to win a massive majority in the UK. Sources https://investors.redfin.com/news-events/press-releases/detail/1091/redfin-reports-home-prices-stagnate-in-florida-and-texas-as https://www.afr.com/policy/economy/how-auckland-took-on-the-nimbys-and-won-20230522-p5da9o https://www.reddit.com/r/urbanplanning/comments/x4w762/stockholms_housing_for_all_is_now_just_for_the_few/ https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58317555 https://oliverhartwich.com/2024/04/10/jacinda-ardern-did-one-thing-right-and-australia-could-learn-from-it/ https://view.publitas.com/primeresi/the-affordability-impacts-of-new-housing-supply-gla-housing-research-note/page/1 https://www.onlondon.co.uk/why-luxury-flats-do-not-push-out-londons-poor-and-why-we-still-need-to-build-for-low-cost-rent/ https://houstonagentmagazine.com/2024/03/26/rent-prices-are-cooling-off-in-houston/ https://www.ft.com/content/86836af4-6b52-49e8-a8f0-8aec6181dbc5
I'll bet you didn't vote in the local elections. If young people had gone out and voted it would have driven up the turn out. That would make politicians take notice and pay attention to their needs. By the way none of my friends or I rented a nice place on our own in the 90s and 2000s. We all started out either sharing or renting some low quality place and made the most of it. I hear some may people complaining about it. Then I see the quite guys in work buying something with the help to buy and renting out a room or the new grad sharing a place with 3 friends and having a ball. 3 miles from city centre 4 of them.
I voted all the way down the ballot paper mate.
Good all the same the turn out was shìt for all the complaints
I think that's the aim of the government; if we allow everything to become super expensive, then only the rich can live and prosper here. They'll pat themselves on the back then equating it to success.
It's absolutely what they want. 2030 onwards can't buy any new non electric car. It's going to be only the rich can afford to drive. The rest of us still here will exist simply to be slaves to the upper class, living in cramped, crowded conditions, not able to have a car, and paying insane rents with no ability to save, no ability to retire.
I fear so. I'm in my forties and it seems that greed and trying to come top of the heap are the only ambitions that are out there. Shameful. Ireland’s lost it's humility and fairness.
The housing problem here is vast (and complex). Ireland is currently building more houses than almost every other country in Europe, thats still not nearly enough. Elected officials can definitely do more, but they don't have magic powers, and we aren't the only country with a serious housing problem. I genuinely wish a group of people would get together to put housing top of the agenda and then run for office. I guarantee if they got in they'd still find the issue incredibly difficult to fix, and any fixes would take time. Not saying they couldn't do it, but it would still be very challenging.
>Ireland is currently building more houses than almost every other country in Europe Overall or per capita? Also where do you see the comparisons of this data?
Number of completed dwellings per 1,000 citizens 2022 France 7.09 Poland 6.31 Denmark 5.92 Ireland 5.83 Liechtenstein 5.66 Israel 5.38 Norway 5.1 Estonia 4.8 Belgium 4.41 Netherlands 4.16 Czechia 3.75 Slovakia 3.72 Germany 3.5 Bulgaria 3.05 United Kingdom 2.63 Hungary 2.12 Portugal 1.92 Spain 1.69 So to get to top of list we need 7x5127=36k/year Unfortunately 2024 Q1 completions are down 12% vs Q1 2023. I haven't fact checked these stats. Then do "what if 6m population". https://www.statista.com/statistics/650790/completed-dwellings-per-citizens-by-country-europe/
Meanwhile... A new report from the ESRI shows that 35,000 to 53,000 new dwellings will be needed annually based on projected population growth scenarios. https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0702/1457635-esri-housing-report/
At least give us a link to the accommodation in question...
[It's easy enough to find](https://www.daft.ie/share/30-laburnum-drive-wilton-co-cork/5756795).
Is that another rental unit they have in the back garden?
The non cynic in me is thinking this ads either been made by a dope that's given the entire rent for the place (which you should divide by 4, as there's already 3 there) or they've made some all merciful typo in pricing. Not a hope anyone takes that like.
And this isn't even in Dublin...
You'd think you'll get peace and quality at least for this price but the landlord is psychotic and constantly in and out of her rental houses. Also keeps a room in all of them as BnB overflow so it isn't even consistent people in the house. She's a few properties in the area, all easily spotted as they're furnished the exact same and ridiculously expensive. Clearly been upping her prices beyond the RPZ rates too if they're that expensive now. Worst landlord I ever had by a long shot, truly a rotten woman to the core.
Greed
ATP ?
Adenosine tri phospate. Obviously
Alien Terminator Predator.
Acronym that perplexes
Airline Transport Pirate?
At this point
Was that so hard?
Not really, it looks like a rather simple acronym.
Where are you off to? All the best with your adventure
Does seem you're cherry-picking the one ridiculously expensive place, to be fair; there are a dozen other rooms in the same neighbourhood going for less than a grand a month (which is still way too fucking much for just a room, but not as ridiculous as that one).
Any links?
https://www.daft.ie/sharing/wilton-cork
Spot on
Luxury living in Wilton.
Thousands are sailing Across the western ocean To a land of opportunity That some of them will never see Fortune prevailing Across the western ocean Their bellies full Their spirits free They'll break the chains of poverty And they'll dance
We need to unite and protest. This shit is unacceptable and been allowed to worsen under FFG for too long. Vacant buildings and empty council land needs to be taken over, im sick of Irish people leaving this Island because they cant make it their home
Alright, see you.
The reality is that a lot of the electorate just don't want the housing crisis to end. They love it. They either profit massively off of it, or are getting a faux illusion of wealth - just like in the Celtic Tiger. Fuckwits probably mutter to themselves again "a million isn't _really_ a lot of money!", based on inflated house prices. They're probably also saying to themselves - "this time it's different!" - once again. The reality is, one _extremely powerful/overwhelming_ part of the electorate, will keep us locked in a housing crisis. An additional reality, is _peaceful means of protest will have fuck all effect at stopping this_, because money trumps all. That means _violent means of protest may be the only way to stop/reverse this_ - which _does not mean I advocate that_. The far-right already have a major head start on everyone else, on the whole violent-protest front - so it's really looking like everyone is going to voluntarily cede power to the far-right, now - because they are fucking gutless.
If history tells you anything, peaceful protests absolutely do not work. That's a harsh reality. "Oh, you don't like our countries policies right now? OK, go stand in that park. Times up guys, head back to work." Why would a government be pressured to change anything, if they don't lose anything from 'protests' anyway?
If protests worked, they wouldn't be allowed.
€1700 for double room? What???🤨
I moved into Rural... I'm in a 5 bed / 6 bath for less than that. Yeah.. price is cheaper because our landlord (not a company) is truly amazing. But you do need a car as there is nothing nearby.. closest shop is nearly 8km away. There should be a lot more control on Rentals.. and companies should be blocked from owning more than 2-3 apartments within a 10KM radius.
Its a protest the people in power have never cared about, remember The Gathering? That was shameless spin. And not one beheading!
Cries in moving back to Ireland 😭
Not even registered with the RTB as a rental property. I would be dropping the tax man a wee note just in case they're not paying tax.
I actually rented off this lady years ago (a lot cheaper then). She's a good few places around Wilton and western road in cork. She doesn't rent every room in the houses out and keeps one as overflow for her BnB. According to threshold at the time this meant you weren't actually a tenant so no rights, and no requirement to register as a rental. Couldn't stop the cunt from dropping in and out with no notice, and had random BnB guests robbing food from the kitchen. I've never wished ill on any other person but loath the owner of this property and truly hope she suffers in the next life. Absolute cow of a woman!
I wish I knew full law on this.....
It felt exceptionally dodgy and unfair at the time but threshold were adamant we could do nothing. I still feel physically angry when I think back to renting off her.
1,700 to live in Cork. Crazy.
€1,700 for a room!!??? 😳... Nah fuck this.... 😔
Send this to your local TDs OP. The more people to complain about this to elected representatives, the better.
Meanwhile on r/irishpersonalfinance every 2nd post is 'I accidentally saved 100k eur and I don't know what to do"
You've literally picked the most expensive place you could find. Here are 11 other options in Wilton for less than €900 a month, the cheapest of which is €430 a month. https://www.daft.ie/sharing/wilton-cork
I agree it's a sensationalist post because OP implied that this is a typical price when it is not (not yet at least). These greedy dickheads do deserve to be called out though.
Damn you folks have the same horrific housing costs that we do in the states. 😥 This seems to be a world wide problem. Here in America we have up to 1/4 of all houses being owned by wall street investment firms and then who knows how many Air BNBs.
It's actually way worse here because there aren't 49 other states to look at as options we just have one little country. And the entire country is basically one huge tourist destination especially all the nicer and busier places in it. There's zero rentals available in my town, but with over 150 Airbnbs just within a ten minutes walk from my place. Throw in an influx of 100k+ Ukrainian war refugees and it's really dire at the moment. Worse thing is the houses here are mostly so much smaller than what you get in the US and the bedrooms are most often just enough room for the bed and maybe just enough space to walk next to the bed. There's no 'walking across the room' like in a US house, most places don't have a porch, there's no basements and usually no 'utility room', the washing machine is in the kitchen usually and in shared accommodation you end up sharing the space not just with housemates but with their laundry hanging up all over the place on every radiator and whatnot because electricity is so expensive you only use the dryer sparingly. Nothing like starting the day staring at your housemates boxers while you have your morning coffee.
We do indeed. In fact, it's actually leagues worse here than in other countries.
And there will still be people waiting in line unbelievable
its mad that we're not seeing organised squatting, how are people actually paying these prices
Tell me about it. Just got fired for another member of staff who has no experience, is late to work and undercooks gone off food. Fucking joke
What?
You need a job for the basic quality of life. Kind of getting sick of hospitality being a rotating door
Scumbag. The crash is coming, and I hope all these leeches rot.
There's no crash coming anytime soon unless there's a global economic crash that results in massive job losses and net emigration. If anything, this is going to get worse as our population is going to continue growing at a rate that outpaces our supply, we're going for economic growth by any means necessary
Where will you go? Not England or America, France or Spain, Australia or New Zealand as it's fucked there too. If you can get a decent job I hear Dubai is fucking horrible in this lifetime.
I've got news for you, if you leave Ireland expecting this to suddenly stop, you're in for a surprise. This is happening in most countries and remeber that many political parties will imply that it's an Ireland-only problem. That's a very disingenuous thing to do but not surprising. Any city/country that's in demand is suffering from the same problem. [https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65485908](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65485908) [https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20240105-just-fix-it-why-portugal-s-housing-crisis-keeps-getting-worse](https://www.france24.com/en/europe/20240105-just-fix-it-why-portugal-s-housing-crisis-keeps-getting-worse) [https://www.euronews.com/business/2023/11/04/housing-crisis-are-you-prepared-to-wait-6-months-to-rent-a-studio-in-paris](https://www.euronews.com/business/2023/11/04/housing-crisis-are-you-prepared-to-wait-6-months-to-rent-a-studio-in-paris) "Europe’s on-going housing crisis Paris isn’t the only European city experiencing a severe housing shortage. In London, the average rent for a one-bedroom flat in the city centre is now nearly €2,500 per month, while the median monthly salary in the UK is €2,600. The same thing is happening in Amsterdam, with the average rent being over €1,500 per month - more than a third of the average salary in the Netherlands. It’s low-income households and young people who are most acutely feeling the burn from the impact of the housing crisis. To address the situation, some cities have opted for different solutions. Vienna, Paris, Amsterdam and Amsterdam and other cities decided [**to crack down on Airbnb-style rentals**](https://www.euronews.com/travel/2023/06/11/italy-malaysia-usa-which-cities-and-countries-are-cracking-down-on-airbnb-style-rentals) that are believed to fuel the lack of rental properties available on the market. Berlin has lifted its ban on Airbnb but strict rules - enforced with hefty fines - remain. Another solution is to tax vacant properties to discourage landlords from keeping homes empty and coax them into renting them out. In Europe, Spain paved the way with its first-ever national “right to housing” law - adopted last year - which included a tax for owners leaving accommodation unrented for lengthy periods. The French government followed this year with a similar tax for cities with more than 50,000 inhabitants. Across the Atlantic, Vancouver in Canada and Washington, DC in the US have adopted a similar measure, with other cities like San Francisco and Honolulu considering the same."
As the old saying goes, shop around.
Lol, shop around for what?! Every greedy landlord is charging the same. I haven’t seen a reasonably priced place yet.
The only thing OP will shopping around for is which country to move to.
Belgium is nice. I recommend Brussels.
I don't know why this is downvoted. There may be better places, but it's still a massive step up from Ireland.
Ember renting Ina. Student house in Wilson 20 years ago , the house was 800 for a three bed !
Very likely some sort of mistake in the ad. It's well above market rates for a room, more than double
1700 is one of the cheaper rooms too