If your dojo was a pyramid scam with a goal to make money, why would they let you train for free?
They wouldn't. I don't think it's suss that you're getting free training in exchange for lessons. I've seen that done before and it's fine imo.
What do you mean help run the dojo? Do you mean do administrative tasks? Like help with paperwork. If that's the case, that seems OK and pretty normal. My dojo will give people a break on tuition if they help with special events like birthday parties or special self-defense classes. There's also a couple of students that help with paperwork and office stuff exchange for reduced or free tuition. They're typically young people who otherwise couldn't afford full tuition otherwise.
But if you mean helping teach classes... I would never go to a school that let a white belt even help teach a class.
Well I wasn’t allowed to teach anybody until I was blue belt and still was supervised. I also was given extra private trading to speed up the process so I was be an efficient teacher. What’s your take on that?
>Well I wasn’t allowed to teach anybody until I was blue belt and still was supervised.
So what were you doing before blue belt? Are you saying your teacher didn't charge you anything prior to that even though you weren't actively teaching or doing anything for the dojo? It seems pretty stupid on the owners' part to give free tuition just because they thought someone had the potential to be an instructor.
The color of belts are fairly arbitrary so I can't say for certain what your rank is, but from what you describe it doesn't seem out of line for you to be helping with classes as blue belt. In my organization, you can be a dojo helper at yon kyu for adults. We take teenagers on a case by case basis to help with classes.
>I also was given extra private trading to speed up the process so I was be an efficient teacher. What’s your take on that?
That seems strange, to be honest. Especially if it was from the very beginning. It's one thing if you had been around a while and showed yourself to be a dedicated student who expressed interest in teaching yourself. I could see a teacher giving extra attention or training to someone like that. But it seems unusual and a fairly big risk to do that with a white belt who you have no idea if they'll quit in two weeks.
I started out doing GKR. Moved on after about 2 years when the veil finally lifted from my eyes and i started cross-training in Tai-chi and goju-ryu. This was going back to 2002 or so.
I actually enjoyed the training, but looking back, it was so, so basic.....
Nothing seems like a red flag to me. You're actively helping your sensei with something they need and in return you're being given complimentary training that has proved effective. Good on you for being an obviously reliable helper and a solid student.
I worked for lessons at my first dojo. Cleaned it a couple days a week and helped out with the odd tasks and covered in the office here and there. That doesn't make a dojo fake- it makes it a fair trade. If they see your work as valuable/helpful, you're earning your lessons.
You are over-thinking it frankly. I'm really failing to see how this could be a 'pyramid scheme' when your sensei seems to have waived your fees because you help out and are committed. You haven't really explained what you do at the dojo to help out though apart from a little teaching.
Yeah no red flag. If you had gotten your black belt after 6 months, then yeah it’s a belt factory but I’m just seeing work for training. I’m a full blown instructor at my school and I get half off tuition since it’s once a week I teach.
Have an honest conversation with your sensei or head coach. Ask why the arrangements (waived fees)? Good sensei would have a good rationale tied to the philosophy of the dojo. If I were in your position and I don't agree with the answer, I would just thank all the good things they did for me and walk away respectfully.
So getting a black belt in two ish years?
.
That's the one thing that sounds sketchy to me. All mine took 6 plus years to learn everything, acquire the experience necessary, and develop the fitness to pass a black belt test.
Well. Take the belts out of it.
If one guy has been training for six years and the other 15 months, and they get put in the same skill division, who do you have your money on?
Ah ok. Well..... in determining a Mcdojo I look for quality of senior students, what organisation the dojo is accredited with etc, and whether the lead instructor is still actively training and grading and not just getting awarded grades by his school - ive known that happen - you held your own in kumite so....
Maybe go visit a few other dojos and see how they do things?
I look at it two different ways - one are your tests registered with the KarateDo federation in Okinawa, if not that is fine but just know that may not be traditional Karate. Two, is it effective - remember - all martial arts are made up by some person who successfully defended themselves and wanted to share it. If it works and you are happy, you are paying for knowledge not prestige. McDojo or not.
Yes he has he was also a fairly successful kickboxer so I don’t see him making the switch back to his roots unless he realised it actually had things to offer
There are LOADS of high quality, reputable organizations headquartered outside Okinawa, and even outside Japan. Hell, the majority of practitioners globally don't even practice Okinawan styles, so why would anything be registered in Okinawa? And many of those styles are as old, or nearly as old as most of the Okinawan styles practices today - so no less "traditional"....
You sound like you might need wider exposure outside your own organization before you comment too much on others....
If your dojo was a pyramid scam with a goal to make money, why would they let you train for free? They wouldn't. I don't think it's suss that you're getting free training in exchange for lessons. I've seen that done before and it's fine imo.
What do you mean help run the dojo? Do you mean do administrative tasks? Like help with paperwork. If that's the case, that seems OK and pretty normal. My dojo will give people a break on tuition if they help with special events like birthday parties or special self-defense classes. There's also a couple of students that help with paperwork and office stuff exchange for reduced or free tuition. They're typically young people who otherwise couldn't afford full tuition otherwise. But if you mean helping teach classes... I would never go to a school that let a white belt even help teach a class.
Well I wasn’t allowed to teach anybody until I was blue belt and still was supervised. I also was given extra private trading to speed up the process so I was be an efficient teacher. What’s your take on that?
>Well I wasn’t allowed to teach anybody until I was blue belt and still was supervised. So what were you doing before blue belt? Are you saying your teacher didn't charge you anything prior to that even though you weren't actively teaching or doing anything for the dojo? It seems pretty stupid on the owners' part to give free tuition just because they thought someone had the potential to be an instructor. The color of belts are fairly arbitrary so I can't say for certain what your rank is, but from what you describe it doesn't seem out of line for you to be helping with classes as blue belt. In my organization, you can be a dojo helper at yon kyu for adults. We take teenagers on a case by case basis to help with classes. >I also was given extra private trading to speed up the process so I was be an efficient teacher. What’s your take on that? That seems strange, to be honest. Especially if it was from the very beginning. It's one thing if you had been around a while and showed yourself to be a dedicated student who expressed interest in teaching yourself. I could see a teacher giving extra attention or training to someone like that. But it seems unusual and a fairly big risk to do that with a white belt who you have no idea if they'll quit in two weeks.
That sounds very GKR to me, the "sped up training".
I started out doing GKR. Moved on after about 2 years when the veil finally lifted from my eyes and i started cross-training in Tai-chi and goju-ryu. This was going back to 2002 or so. I actually enjoyed the training, but looking back, it was so, so basic.....
Nothing seems like a red flag to me. You're actively helping your sensei with something they need and in return you're being given complimentary training that has proved effective. Good on you for being an obviously reliable helper and a solid student.
I worked for lessons at my first dojo. Cleaned it a couple days a week and helped out with the odd tasks and covered in the office here and there. That doesn't make a dojo fake- it makes it a fair trade. If they see your work as valuable/helpful, you're earning your lessons.
You are over-thinking it frankly. I'm really failing to see how this could be a 'pyramid scheme' when your sensei seems to have waived your fees because you help out and are committed. You haven't really explained what you do at the dojo to help out though apart from a little teaching.
Yeah no red flag. If you had gotten your black belt after 6 months, then yeah it’s a belt factory but I’m just seeing work for training. I’m a full blown instructor at my school and I get half off tuition since it’s once a week I teach.
Awesome what do you teach?
I teach shutokan. It’s not widely taught in America I believe. Founder was Kanken Toyama.
Sometimes Sensei’s needs a break from teaching. If they don’t have a senior student, they pick someone they can trust to do it. L
Have an honest conversation with your sensei or head coach. Ask why the arrangements (waived fees)? Good sensei would have a good rationale tied to the philosophy of the dojo. If I were in your position and I don't agree with the answer, I would just thank all the good things they did for me and walk away respectfully.
Overthinking!
Are you particularly attractive?
Ummm yeah??
How long has you been training? Offering free lessons in exchange for being a student instructor isn't uncommon
One and a half years
So getting a black belt in two ish years? . That's the one thing that sounds sketchy to me. All mine took 6 plus years to learn everything, acquire the experience necessary, and develop the fitness to pass a black belt test.
In 15 months
Well. Take the belts out of it. If one guy has been training for six years and the other 15 months, and they get put in the same skill division, who do you have your money on?
6 years… it’s sad bc I rlly want to have a proper rank. Iv also done wing Chun and taekwondo
Need a little more info. What style of karate are you doing? I mean, free training is free training....
Kyshkin
Ah ok. Well..... in determining a Mcdojo I look for quality of senior students, what organisation the dojo is accredited with etc, and whether the lead instructor is still actively training and grading and not just getting awarded grades by his school - ive known that happen - you held your own in kumite so.... Maybe go visit a few other dojos and see how they do things?
Thank you for your advice:)
I look at it two different ways - one are your tests registered with the KarateDo federation in Okinawa, if not that is fine but just know that may not be traditional Karate. Two, is it effective - remember - all martial arts are made up by some person who successfully defended themselves and wanted to share it. If it works and you are happy, you are paying for knowledge not prestige. McDojo or not.
Yes he has he was also a fairly successful kickboxer so I don’t see him making the switch back to his roots unless he realised it actually had things to offer
There are LOADS of high quality, reputable organizations headquartered outside Okinawa, and even outside Japan. Hell, the majority of practitioners globally don't even practice Okinawan styles, so why would anything be registered in Okinawa? And many of those styles are as old, or nearly as old as most of the Okinawan styles practices today - so no less "traditional".... You sound like you might need wider exposure outside your own organization before you comment too much on others....