fans were asking them to provide either itunes preorders and a EU version, so jimin can chart in uk too. The svp, head of streaming commented with a link to that artist that had the taylor swift collab saying song of the year.
She actually opened for Taylor in 2023 (she was in my show lol)
Aka, she's JJ Abrams daughter (creator of Lost, director of Star Wars, Star Trek, etc).
I gotta watch it. I liked some songs of the album but the rest is a miss. I would say it's like a solid 6/10 for me. I'll reduce a one or two just for the most atrocious album cover though.
Idk why she's suddenly being pushed everywhere though. The supposed hit song(Close to You which is on all sorts of playlists) still isn't in the Top 50 or anything. So I'm failing to see where she's gaining the so-called traction everyone is talking about.
she posted on her ig story that close to you debuted top 40. i don't know if that's actually true but her streams are greater than they usually are because of the taylor song many swifties seem to like as some extra TTPD song, and also she's become fairly popular on tiktok
this is happening with sabrina too. i mean sab had a bigger following than gracie but the autoplay seems really sus. i wonder if it's just the eras tour effect or there's something more happening here. i do know you can pay for huge playlist reach and autoplay, maybe it's just that plus greater visibility post taylor
I will say for Sabrina at least the top40 radio station in my area has Espresso on at least once an hour, and Feather comes up a few times a day as well.
Sabrina has legitimately been super successful though - even before please please please I heard Feather and Espresso EVERYWHERE on mainstream radio for months.
Feather had insane radio push by her label, but even though the streams were decent they were not remotely at Espresso level. Neither was the amount of autoplay. That's where the disconnect is for me, but Feather also did blow up on social media because of the Eras Tour, so it actually was fairly successful. I've heard Gracie's song Risk on the radio, and I imagine us is going to get pushed by her label on radio too, but once the Swifties streaming it stop and the novelty wears off I can't imagine the general public will know either song. A difference for sure, but I'm still seeing a bit of a strong leap for both artists.
I just watched it and jeez, he didn't hold back. I wanna listen to it now, can't be THAT bad
Edit: 5 seconds in to Close To You and I had to stop myself from turning it off. She is not bad, I'm just tired of this singing style from everyone.
That's just advertising 🤷♂️ I was tired of Espresso being played after every album but hey, every artist uses payola. It's just that some have far better results than others
Really? People are asking about a certain artist, and you reply with a totally different artist. This is even beyond the normal 'payola'.
Jimin has a much bigger audience, so to get eyes on your artist, you put 'ads' in front of him. I'm not a fan of his, but even then, I'm aware that he is releasing new music soon.
I only brought Espresso up because I felt it was _more_ egregious than what's going on here in terms of "shoving music down people's throats" (which I think is exaggerating what's going on here)
It's not fair that Geffen is refusing to promote Jimin's upcoming album, and it was rude to suggest that European ARMYs should stream another artist instead, but picking and choosing hits & flops is something the music industry does all the time. Commercial success is one thing, but views and streams are another. You can control the music you listen to, nobody is forcing you to like "us (ft. Taylor Swift)" by Gracie Abrams
that's not the point. he's a svp at geffen and fans were tagging geffen to get a eu ver and a pre save link and an svp replied saying song of the year & linking another artist's song right under the post to mock fans' requests and jimin.
getting a song shoved down your throats on radio is different than having the svp of an artist's label open shading their own artist to promote another artist and getting away w it.
it's not the same!!! labels pushing artists on radio and playlisting esp w Spotify autoplay is much different than a SVP of an artist's OWN LABEL openly shading him and his fans online by linking another song under a post asking pre save links of a song.
There is bad marketing. When people are asking about a certain artist and you reply with a totally different artist, that's pushing down people's throat.
Her fan base overlaps with Taylor Swift, Phoebe Bridgers, Clairo, Olivia Rodrigo, Lizzy McAlpine, Maisie Peters, Boygenius, Noah Kahan. If you listen to any of them good chance you might listen to her too.
Fan were asking a link from an account to preorder but instead He link some song with Taylor Swift collab and proceeds to say Song of the year....very condescending
Armys tagged geffen to take out random inclusions in the UK albums so it could count on charts. But the head of streaming department for the whole geffen label(so not a random employee) replied with a song of Gracie ft Taylor swift and mockingly told armys to stream soty.
The joke didn’t land and armys called him to apologize. But he deflected by deleting all his social media accounts and going radio silence.
This incident became so big that SBS news and Billboard covered it. Now that the song is being released today, geffen is putting an apology out. So it comes off as very insincere
UK charts have a lot of specific rules (for example on the singles chart only 3 songs from an album can chart, radio play doesn’t count, etc.). One of them is that if an album includes random “gifts” that aren’t available for sale separately (including photocards), it isn’t eligible for the chart. I believe it’s to stop sales inflation from people who buy multiple albums looking for specific inclusions. It means most normal kpop albums are ineligible for the charts bc they include random photocards.
Some kpop artists release specific UK versions with all photocards included to get around this (IIRC Ateez ranked high on the chart with a specific UK version without random inclusions).
Not shocked bc xenophobia is very much a thing and it’s on purpose bc they want only the artists they want to be massive to be up front and center not artists from other countries
In this case, it wasn't xenophobia. If it was, the label wouldn't have been actively promoting other BTS members or other Hybe groups on their SM. This was Jimin specifically.
Vaguely saying “employee” really downplays what a big shot idiot this dude is. How easy it would’ve been for him to just say oops sorry responded to the wrong tweet seconds after that happened. How embarrassing overall for this dude to make this big ruckus over a Gracie Abrams and Taylor Swift song of all things
Also I’m tired about hearing nepo baby Gracie Abrams. The industry push for her has just started and I’m already tired of hearing about her
Her and sabrina carpenter... They show up in my spotify autoplay CONSTANTLY, and I absolutely do not listen to that genre of music. If spotify autoplays from a megan thee stallion song? Gracie abrams and sabrina carpenter. Post rock? Gracie abrams and sabrina carpenter. Prog metal? You guessed it! Gracie abrams and sabrina carpenter.
I feel bad because I don't mind Sabrina Carpenter at all, I think she's talented and she's finally getting recognition because she's been making music for years before her recent popularity, I just wanted to stop hearing espresso in every playlist. even my kpop and afrobeats ones would have it lol. I had to mute her because of how annoyed I was. Also that if you're on tiktok/reels every other video uses her songs because it's trending and she's about to drop an album/tour so this is all to get publicity for it.
Spotify is the biggest offender when it comes to pushing artists whose companies are paying for it.
I like Sabrina Carpenter and I still ended up blocking her for now on Spotify exactly because of this reason alongside Billie and now Gracie Abrams. I dont want to turn off autoplay because I have discovered some really cool artists through that but there is no reason for Please Please Please or Lunch to start playing after a Mdou Moctar album.
oh no she’s definitely not a nepo baby. this is just her breakout year and her label is pushing extra hard to maximise her commercial success and get her a BNA win at the Grammys
Oh no she isnt and it actually took her sometime to blow up so I love that for her. It's just her label has been shoving her songs down everybody's throat that it kind of gets tiring listening to them after every song or album that you play no matter what the genre or language is. I honestly now prefer playlisting over autoplay because at least then you can choose which playlist to listen to, autoplay on the other hand is obnoxious
That’s sad they really need to cool it! I stopped listening to American music for reasons like this I despised most of the popular artists in the early 2010s despite them, looking back, were amazing artists it’s just they were pushed so hard I can’t stomach their voice or music anymore.
hate to say this but at least Columbia promoted their English releases. We don’t even get that with this incompetent ass label. LC had a whole English version and all geffen did was keeping it on TTH for like 2 weeks, didn’t even send it to radio.
[All of HYBE's music including BTS will be distributed through UMG (who Geffen is under)](https://deadline.com/2024/03/hybe-k-pop-home-to-bts-expands-deal-universal-music-group-1235866370/)
trying to look on the bright side, since it’s an UMG deal maybe they can switch labels, like Republic or Capitol, though not sure how well those treat their artists either… :/
Republic is locked up pretty tight with JYP, who has a long relationship with the CEO. In my view they've been decent as far as TV/festival/award slots and distribution for the JYP groups but I don't think they've done much as far as radio/playlisting. I get the vibe they don't really care to bother with K-pop beyond checking the box for UMG, and JYP suffices for that. Too many western superstars to promote.
Republic still sucks for JYP (at least for twice, I don’t follow other jype groups that closely). The promo we get for English stuff is one (1) tweet on release day and stocking in Target, Walmart, and Barnes and Noble. Maybe a (dying) tv show appearance and a random billboard. Zero playlisting, never sending anything to radio, and no meaningful collabs.
Mentioned this separately too but BTS and the members should all move to some other UMG label.
TXT, BTS's direct labelmates, are under Republic Records for US distribution. And while Republic isn't perfect at managing TXT either, it's a situation that's miles better than all these issues BTS have to go through because of Geffen
Edited bc typo
Sadly i think they only promoted their English releases bcs Ron Perry had credits in them or was personally responsible for getting them the song 😔. Anything he didn't have a hand in, English or otherwise, went mostly unpromoted or minimal effort
This is how these companies seem to move. They make a bigger chunk of money than usual, they move to promote. They don't get the cut they want then they don't move
Yeah, he is credited as a songwriter, composer, and producer along with his wife on Butter and his wife was the vocal producer for Dynamite and those are the only two releases where he made an attempt to push
Ding ding thats the answer...the English released were directly tired to Perry’s bank account.
I actually follow a lot of US artist who have now gone independent with certain distribution deals like Megan Thee Stallion & Tinashe. I think in general if the US agency is not directly tied to the music royalties or main source of income…they simply do not try.
Like Megan’s album is coming out tonight and if I judged Warner’s behavior like kpop fans judge Geffen X BTS…I would say Warner had done almost nothing.
I just really think they don’t move unless they are getting a real piece of the pie.
how was this a mistake 😭 mistake that he accidentally replied with his personal account instead of burner? they acting like this was some random employee when he’s literally the SVP and head of streaming at geffen? ridiculous.
not to mention how this half-assed apology still doesn’t address any of the fans’ reasonable concerns and requests. they reblogged bh’s post about muse right after on their twt account and called it a day. mind you, this “apology” is the first muse-related post on their instagram. lol.
I cannot believe that it took them 4 whole days to make a statement and that too such a half baked one with no sincerity and regret for such a stan twt level tweet from a executive. Embarrassing, honestly.
The only post they have posted about MUSE is this "apology". What a way to tell the world that you have zero professionalism and a terrible pr and can't even promote one of your biggest talents.
honestly it could have been the case that this dumbass forgot to switch accounts from his official one to a stan twt one, i wouldn't be surprised if some labels have disguised stan twitter accounts to enhance engagement for their artists on that platform. but the fact that they intentionally chose to respond to that tweet shows how they truly don't care about him or bts, they just want a piece of the cake. even more now that this is the only related post they've made about muse.
This is the first logical explanation I’ve read. Otherwise why would a post from his personal account NOT reflect his personal views? Still makes me upset that they aren’t promoting his release.
as a fan of bts and its members obviously the blatant dismissiveness and disrespect boils my blood, but what upsets me even more is that this is truly the state of non-english language music in the american market
there is absolutely no respect and modest exposure at these major us labels for some of the biggest music acts in the entire world, and we're just talking about bare minimum release & promo strategy
i would love to see what our mainstream music market would look like if everyone from iu to peso pluma to arijit singh — literally scratching the surface of global popular music here — was paid more than dirt and 2 tweets by the racist, close-minded white men who run these mega agencies just to collect as much coin as possible and leave these artists on read
i know bts and jimin and iu and peso pluma and arijit singh all have thriving careers and opportunities elsewhere, but the resistance to actually reflecting in the mainstream american market what it is we like and listen to — diversity! what a new concept! — can be so demoralising at times
Seeing how the industry gatekeeps non-english speaking artists always remind me of the infamous David Bowie interview on MTV where he calls out TV and Radio for intentionally limiting the exposure of POC artists and never allocating primetime slot for them and it's actually so sad that even after 5 decades that still is the reality in the american music industry.
I just read an article this morning about "the 20 must-hear albums of 2024" and it's all in English. It wasn't even a typical clickbait site, it was our national broadcaster's music arm. I'm not necessarily expecting kpop to be listed there but there wasn't ONE of the 20 albums that could have been in a language other than English?
In the time it took to write this "apology" they could have just promoted Jimin's album.
They could've posted a link. A poster. Could've even had an EU version of the album be prepared. Would've been a great way to show how "apologetic" they were.
Instead, SGMB is being released less than 10 hours and there has yet to be SINGLE post on their account. Not one.
Cmiiw, but this statement might be the first time they've ever posted about Jimin on their account. Like, what are we doing here?
>Could've even had an EU version of the album be prepared.
I agree with the sentiment of your comment almost entirely but this isn't as easy as some people make it seem. Preparing a EU version if they didn't plan for one to begin with means they would need to produce them from the very beginning to include only one photocard, it would need to be a different one from the normal inclusions and that would take time. Not only would the albums not arrived in time for the release like this but it's likely that BHM already send a batch to Europe before the announcement was even made. If European stores put the album up for preorder it means they have stock coming and confirmed.
Transportation by sea takes several weeks, it's likely the albums were already sent. You can't just recall the stock to send an eu exclusive album several weeks later and stores need to sell what they get rn.
So a EU Exclusive is impossible at the moment and it's also BH job since the albums are produced in Korea, not by Geffen. They would have needed to plan for it from the very beginning. The rest are fair complaints
The question is, why didn't they plan for a UK version? If they could do it for the other members and see the positive results, why not for Jimin? This album wasn't done a couple of months ago. It was completed well over a year ago. So plenty of time to fix it if they really wanted to.
Geffen is such an incompetent label in the first place it annoys me so much BTS is stuck with them because of Hybe’s stupid deal with them. So tired of seeing BTS’ money being thrown at other acts to keep them relevant but never for actually supporting them. This blatant sabotage of Jimin is frustrating
It's a pretty big deal because this guy is head of streaming for all of Geffen. For a big executive like him to do something so petty is highly unprofessional and concerning. It's an obvious show of bias I've never seen before.
The incompetence is staggering. I don't understand what their job is, because I have seen zero promo and I have the growing suspicion the title track won't receive a single spin and will have. Now their higher ups are even publicly mocking the artist they work for?
Literally didn't apologize anywhere in this.
It just says we get to make oopsies and not say sorry, you get to be told off for calling it out, now forget about it.
Me, looking for an apologies that is no where in sight, what a long paragraph with useless context and BS excuses
Kinda surprised they actually addressed it tbh.
It’s also interesting to think about the differences between American and Korean PR. Would a Korean company ever say “we request that fans refrain from any personal attacks”? This is a genuine question, in case it comes off as snarky or anything; I just can’t think of any examples off the top of my head. In my experience, it’s usually just straight up apologetic, “we will do better in the future.”
I know twt armys have been pelting UMG/Geffen with demands to apologize, but I’ve mostly seen the same copy-paste message over and over - one that doesn’t have personal attacks.
Also the downplaying: “an employee,” “a single post” when it was the VP of Streaming lol and the song he posted is a collab between a nepo baby and a woman who has perfected chart influencing…
Probably hybe pressured them to post smthg since it was blowing up on korean side that it even featured in the news. Also, armys were sending emails and cc all the executives in it.
Frankly, I am annoyed they used that line about personal attacks. In vacuum, of course people have a right to push back on personal attacks, but this is clearly an attempt to discredit the legitimate concerns of the (non-toxic) fans. They are a giant entertainment corporation who deals with fandoms ALL THE TIME. You can't tell me they haven't encountered the worst of the worst fans from other artists.
Aren't these fans customers? Isn't Jimin a client?
This "statement" is overtly hostile.
"Employee" my ass. He's the executive in charge of streaming. This is just another version of "blame the intern."
Sadly, I think it's way more normal than people know. BTS isn't the only artist with a passionate fandom. Swifties have sent plenty of death threats to executives.
The fact that this being the only post that they have up on Instagram that is remotely related to Jimin or Muse is truly pathetic. Also they wouldn't have addressed it if it didnt start picking up steam after K Media and Billboard started reporting on it so this feels so insincere.
"mistake"
Yeah right
"employee"
Downplaying his job to make it look like an irrelevant employee did this
"Deeply sorry that this has happened"
Yeah right, sorry your sass-attempt by an arrogant executive got pushback
"We request that fans refrain from any personal attacks"
Jimin akgaes are insane, but I'm glad their insanity was properly directed this time (now chill before you make us all look unhinged)
I have truly been surprise by Jimin's solo fans organization. Since it seems like Jimin is not getting much promotion, they have created promotional posters, with QR code to his Playlist and fans are printing and posting them in their country base. They don't seem to play when it comes to Jimin.
What I have been seeing all over twitter is very surprising. One of the Jimin FBs started a promotional challenge for him and fans ALL OVER THE WORLD started printing and pasting posters , and the amount of MEN doing that was surprising to me. From US to UK , from Mexico to Thailand, from Japan to Korea. They got him a huge digital Billboard in one of the African countries ( sorry I don't remember which country) , a junior high school boy in Japan printed flyers for SGMB and distributed it all over his school with the help of his teacher , who is a Jimin stan herself. Their energy is mind blowing.
Do you know the reason that this was addressed in the first place? Because the news made it to Billboard. And why did it made to Billboard? Because the reporter was a HUGE Jimin stan and very active on twitter.
Hopefully this energy is up for the entire comeback.
Ik this is controversial, but if they're gonna release solo music they're gonna have solo fandoms, which is good, because otherwise that would mean they're all making the same artistic choices, if everything is appealing to all the same people, what would be the point of any of it
edit: yeh, controversial xd
I lowkey agree that there's a way for solo fans to be non-toxic. As long as they don't clamor for the member to leave BTS or start hating on the other members, it might be a healthy thing. For example, I've seen a lot of BTS agnostics/haters begin to get into the rapline, especially RM, and even all three of them have different styles so they attract different audiences.
Solos and akgaes are very much different things imo, solo as in like "I am a fan of x, they're in a band with other people I'm not interested in" is just normal fandom
The most hateful, toxic, and dangerous fan behavior in BTS history was directed against Jimin. I refer to the campaign to get the SK government and military to single out Jimin for punishment and persecution for the great sin of enlisting with Jungkook.
Nothing can top that. At least, I hope not. That's the kind of homophobic crap that gets people killed.
the real problem is when they get that toxic mentality and start hating the others for no reason. and make everything a big competition. otherwise I'm not bothered.
So, as an ARMYWol, SHINee world has had its fair share of toxic solo behavior within the fandom, both now and throughout SHINee's career.
The comments in this thread are talking about fans who support one specific member and who tend to be highly toxic/aggressive within fandom spaces (akgaes). BTS does not actually have official solo fandoms, unlike with SHINee. BTS have expressed their wish that ARMYs love them equally, whether that's practical or not.
ARMYs have biases just like Shawols, but "solos" in the ARMY fandom tend to lean towards Akgaes
I think JK still has more non-group fans tbh (and possibly Tae, going by instagram), but Jimin definitely has one of the more, let's say, involved fandoms
I think JK has the most casual support along with a strong solo fandom, he is also the strongest in SK. Tae has much less casual support, but a very strong solo fandom in Asia mostly. Jimin's solo fandom is strong pretty much everywhere, even if he doesn't have that many casuals. He is the strongest in the US for sure.
I'd say JK has the gp on a chokehold and Jimin has the strongest solo fanbase. Tae has the gp too judging by ig but his songs are less gp friendly so he doesn't get as much support in his music.
Wow, talk about backhanded compliments.
Are they Jimin fans or akgaes or are they one in the same?
I mean, how does asking for basic support make you a hater? That is what an "akgae" is, right?
All akgaes are insane. No sane person would be an akgae. I don’t even understand the concept of being one. You only listen to Jimin’s parts on group songs? I don’t really know how it works. Akgae is rooted in hatred and envy for other artists so you token stan that one and eventually you become an akgae. Discovering one member solo music and becoming a fan is something completely different. That’s normal. You like his music and you become a casual fan, don’t need to deep dive in his past. The biggest example would be Harry Styles. He has so many fans who don’t necessarily vibe with one direction’s music.
Idk what geffen trying to achieve by posting this? They are still blaming the fans who wants the best of their favourite artist, protecting the stupid ass executive who in charge their streaming department and they still have not posted anything about muse.
Doubt they care about Jimin tbh. Pretty sure he’s stuck in contract regardless of how he feels about them at the moment. It’s probably the US press that’s scaring them.
Yet, still no EU version, so Jimin is still not eligible for uk charts. They also didn't promote in their accounts... we had to beg them for itunes preorders. We always to keep tagging them for every single thing for every bts release for days for them to move at all.
Makes me wish for the deal they had with Columbia where they can leave after a short term contract they had renew each time (forgot the length it was but I think it was a year???)
But of course Hybe REALLY wants that expansion to the West with Hybe America and yet the stupid record company in charge of distribution and promotion in the States and parts of Europe cant even lift a finger and rather promote/shoving a freaken nepo baby into everyones faces, including during Jimin's promo period by a childish employee from them
Do you think they can/will sue to terminate the contract? Sounds like they would have grounds to, considering how much Geffen is screwing up/doesnt give a crap about promoting BTS
No idea of the legal ramifications, we have no idea about the deal itself, also, it seems that it's even bigger than just one contract, GEFFEN is handling other HYBE groups and they are partners with HYBE for KATSEYE. I can't hardly see HYBE going back on this when they have such tantalizing links. Better outcome would be for HYBE to pressure them to move rather than breaking contract.
Is anyone else surprised? This kind of BS has been going on for decades in America. Anytime an Asian brother pops off, there are loads of people who will try to put him down. This ALWAYS happens!
The way that this is actually sabotage.
I’ve seen so many times that bts has been disrespected in the past but I’ve never actually witnessed bts getting shafted so publicly but here we are 😭
It's frustrating that a.) Western labels seem incapable of doing promo for any artist who doesn't sing exclusively in English and b.) they're also picking and choosing who succeeds and who flops.
I find this incident baffling. Why pass up sales to joke about your own reluctance to let international artists break through?
I have no doubt this SVP, like the rest of the US music industry, just think Army and other kpop fans are just bat shit insane for fangirling over an Asian male. Yes they are that racist.
icb these morons at Geffen are scolding fans and saying no personal attacks and giving the notes app apology. Chalking the actions of the head of streaming as a mistake. Like he DELIBERATELY posted a nepo baby's song and captioned it as "song of the year" under the fanbase's post geniune request from his PERSONAL ACCOUNT.
That's the thing that annoys me the most, everyone wants a piece of BTS: HYBE, other HYBE groups, western labels, western acts, brands, everyone but when the time comes to actually invest in them????
Crickets....
It’s infuriating because we as fans and BTS themselves are so handicapped in this situation.
For us- we want to promote BTS and, in this instance specifically Jimin as much as possible but we also don’t want to embarrass or undermine him. We don’t want to tell Jimin what to do to promote a certain way, and we don’t want to be seen as “unreasonable crazed fans”
Hybe- and through Hybe- Geffen are the business decisions bts made- they have chosen to stay with bighit. And we should respect that grown 30 year old millionaires can make their own business decisions. But on the other hand how can you, as a fan, not feel misgivings when you quite literally are shown through someone’s actions that they do not respect your artist?
They want BTS money but they won’t respect them, they treat them as outsiders. Jimin deserves as much push as any western artist and stands to make as much money as some of the top acts on their roster- but god forbid they treat him accordingly!
Bts as soloists stand to be even bigger than they are currently- if only they were promoted properly. A large part of that is of course the military service but not all of it.
It just sucks. And jimin is in the military so he cannot directly intervene even if he wanted to.
I’ve been grappling with this for a while and it’s just so disheartening to constantly have to see what BTS and Jimin have been having to face, and this is just what was bold enough to be posted online! Who knows what it’s like for him behind closed doors within the industry.
One big thing I've noticed is that Big Hit and Geffen are still stuck in this weird infantilization of the members. The member who got the most promotion (still not enough) was Jungkook but the narrative around his release was him working with "big Western producers". No one gives a shit about these producers, Jungkook is a MUCH bigger name than any of the producers he got on Golden x100. As a former communications professional, I was dumbfounded by their narrative around JK's debut. He was already a huge global star, no one was tuning in because of these "producers".
When members keep working with Korean teams, like most have done, they have no clue how to talk about their music or even how to categorize it beyond it being a "BTS member".
Ultimately, I only trust what the members say about their own music and I think they got a crazy sweet payout and revenue share.
I agree and, at some level, I do have some level of human empathy for Bighit in that they are pretty much going in blind as to how to market BTS within the western market.
Or I *did* feel that way. But we are several years into the matter at this point. Bighit isn’t a tiny company anymore. And I was under the impression that hybe America and their American acquisitions were going to help overcome some of the barriers that being a foreign company had put in their path.
I agree with you that they seem to have no idea how to push the proper narrative or build the proper marketing tactic for the bts solo careers.
It feels like everything is disorganized or an afterthought. My biggest concern though is that it doesn’t seem like there’s much learning happening? Like if it doesn’t go smoothly the first time- it should the next? That’s my biggest concern- how much trial and error are they going to need in order for hybe and geffen to roll out solo releases as seamlessly as many of their peers?
And how can they hope to compete in the western market space if they can’t do it?
We were told all the mistakes around Face were due to a "learning curve" so let's move on from their incompetence. So what is the excuse now,? How big of a learning curve does a multi-billion corporation need?
Well as I stated in my comment, I agree with you. There’s no reason these releases shouldn’t be standardized with those provided to western artists of similar level. There’s no reason the same or similar mistakes made with face are being made now. Why are we constantly going one step forward and two steps back?
On the one hand I do have some pause immediately throwing the entirety of bighit into the fire because I’m not a Korean person trying to navigate the intricacies of marketing and promotion in a seemingly hostile western market. So in that way I do have human empathy for those doing their best at hybe and bighit to help promote Jimin and BTS.
On the other hand- I also refuse to infantilize people. Like you said bighit is a part of hybe and hybe is a multimillion dollar operation- a conglomerate now- and should be held to that standard.
It’s a serious problem and I hate seeing his efforts handicapped. And I also hate seeing someone be actively hostile to jimin who is supposed to be helping to promote him.
You raise such a good point. If a fan complains about promotion, marketing and all the business stuff that goes into a release, we're told we are "infantilizing," the artist. As if they are supposed to know all the ins and outs of business along with their songwriting, composing, recording, learning choreography and everything else that goes into their artistic vision.
I don't expect any BH executive to dance like Jimin or write layered poetry like RM. So why doesn't it go the other way around?
This is their effing job. Why is it so much to expect that they do it? Why are we 'infantalizing" a bunch of MBAs and people raking in millions off the hard work of BTS members?
All those MBAs? Totally replaceable. BTS is not.
They’re getting so much money to do nothing off the backs of hardworking artists. Execs no matter the company are always a bunch of entitled freeloaders.
I'm just so happy that people are not defending the corps anymore, especially the ARMYs who were very loud during the Face negligence. I think the MHJ situation showed point blank how many greedy and harmful people BSH has allowed to associate with Hybe for their quest of expansion , and how incompetent Hybe can be that they couldn't even protect BTS from the malicious rumours.
Alas , it took an executive going fully mask off on social media for fans to finally believe what the Jimin biased ARMYs and solos were telling from March last year.
I actually DMd you to discuss some things lol!
The thing is that of course, BTS have an 11 year old career, they know what's best but we are not just fans, in the strict sense of the word, we are customers and Geffen is the "supplier" of the goods, like, wouldn't they be interested to actually listen to what customers with buying power have to say?
So confusing lol
That's why I'm putting my faith in Namjoon and Yoongi to ask for the moon and stars for their comeback. I get the feeling neither Big Hit or Geffen will do anything interesting or innovative unless the members demand it. The members have been the ones to ask for big Festa celebrations, RM's RPWP rollout and aesthetics were all HIS ideas, ect ect....
And yet BH did not push him outside the K-pop market, did they? Any of us can see his album deserved and needed to be heard outside of the K-pop limits.
I mean, he is obviously so satisfied and proud of his work. As he should be. He needs both a wider and more tailored audience than just K-pop and BTS stans.
Look how invested we were in because of a Instagram broadcast channel from Bighit. They literally do nothing interesting.
They don't even know how to keep fans informed about the releases let alone non-fans. It's so irritating to see them do this over and over again.
I think the members have made a deal about those kinds of things. They get to do whatever they want creatively and stay out of the business deals. That's what I suspect anyway. For example, Jin asked for the hug event but he likely didn't get into the weeds of who would qualify, album purchases ect. So when Big Hit/HYBE made dumb decisions, of course it blows back on the members.
Good luck, Jimin, with whatever contract you signed as a soloist. Because this is the first post on their Instagram about Muse. A broadcast channel on Instagram for *only* the followers of the account and a gif is not promoting an album. It's incredibly infuriating but you can't say too much in case people say we don't respect Jimin's wishes. So yes. Good luck, Jimin.
I, for one, and just not putting up with that "respect his wishes" bullshit. Jimin is the artist, not the promoter. And did the entire marketing team enlist with him?
I still find it weird they made his Face documentary Weverse exclusive and behind a paywall. Now wider audiences will get zero exposure to him as an artist the way they did with Yoongi and Hobi.
I always think his contract as a soloist is somehow different from others. That is, if he has a solo contract. I feel so curious about the inner dealings of Hybe and how they work with BTS as individuals and as a group it's almost an itch that never goes away. I've noticed this discrepancy myself. Thank you for reminding me of how odd it is.
I don't understand what the heck BTS is doing with such an incompetent and unprofessional company?? Like, even if you have to shove UMG down their throats because of HyBe dEaL, UMG has other labels, dude.
LITERALLY Tomorrow X Together, labelmates of BTS, are managed by UMG's Republic Records. And while Republic is faaaaar from perfect and does miss the ball several times with TXT, (and yes, ABSOLUTELY several times especially for playlisting, radioplay and virality, among many other things), it still seems like a better alternative than these jerkfaces who clearly run on clout from BTS and the BTS members and then insult them like this.
Doing this while Jimin most probably can't discuss/coordinate and/or manage his album's promotions directly like he would've been able to if he wasn't enlisted, absolutely not a good look for Geffen.
And isn't the survival show group of Geffen and HYBE debuting right now?? Iirc? Well, good luck to the group and the members and I hope they don't suffer mistreatment cause damn their label really sucks...
What happened??
[here’s a screenshot](https://imgur.com/a/l1gM5X9)
fans were asking them to provide either itunes preorders and a EU version, so jimin can chart in uk too. The svp, head of streaming commented with a link to that artist that had the taylor swift collab saying song of the year.
That artist?
Gracie Abrams, nepo baby who just released an album
[удалено]
[удалено]
She actually opened for Taylor in 2023 (she was in my show lol) Aka, she's JJ Abrams daughter (creator of Lost, director of Star Wars, Star Trek, etc).
Oh she’s next level nepo baby
Ohhhh that's why her last name is familiar
I gotta watch it. I liked some songs of the album but the rest is a miss. I would say it's like a solid 6/10 for me. I'll reduce a one or two just for the most atrocious album cover though. Idk why she's suddenly being pushed everywhere though. The supposed hit song(Close to You which is on all sorts of playlists) still isn't in the Top 50 or anything. So I'm failing to see where she's gaining the so-called traction everyone is talking about.
she posted on her ig story that close to you debuted top 40. i don't know if that's actually true but her streams are greater than they usually are because of the taylor song many swifties seem to like as some extra TTPD song, and also she's become fairly popular on tiktok
On my randomly generated spotify playlists she started popping up ALL OVER THEM out of nowhere a month ago. Very sus
this is happening with sabrina too. i mean sab had a bigger following than gracie but the autoplay seems really sus. i wonder if it's just the eras tour effect or there's something more happening here. i do know you can pay for huge playlist reach and autoplay, maybe it's just that plus greater visibility post taylor
I will say for Sabrina at least the top40 radio station in my area has Espresso on at least once an hour, and Feather comes up a few times a day as well.
Sabrina has legitimately been super successful though - even before please please please I heard Feather and Espresso EVERYWHERE on mainstream radio for months.
Feather had insane radio push by her label, but even though the streams were decent they were not remotely at Espresso level. Neither was the amount of autoplay. That's where the disconnect is for me, but Feather also did blow up on social media because of the Eras Tour, so it actually was fairly successful. I've heard Gracie's song Risk on the radio, and I imagine us is going to get pushed by her label on radio too, but once the Swifties streaming it stop and the novelty wears off I can't imagine the general public will know either song. A difference for sure, but I'm still seeing a bit of a strong leap for both artists.
Her album is projected to debut #1 on the Uk chart and #2 on bb200. That’s pretty good. And no, Taylor didn’t release any new version.
[удалено]
[удалено]
I just watched it and jeez, he didn't hold back. I wanna listen to it now, can't be THAT bad Edit: 5 seconds in to Close To You and I had to stop myself from turning it off. She is not bad, I'm just tired of this singing style from everyone.
Her music is actually good tho 😭 I haven't heard her new album yet but her older stuff is chill
Doesn't matter if the songs are good or bad. It's just wrong to keep pushing it down people's throats.
That's just advertising 🤷♂️ I was tired of Espresso being played after every album but hey, every artist uses payola. It's just that some have far better results than others
Really? People are asking about a certain artist, and you reply with a totally different artist. This is even beyond the normal 'payola'. Jimin has a much bigger audience, so to get eyes on your artist, you put 'ads' in front of him. I'm not a fan of his, but even then, I'm aware that he is releasing new music soon.
I only brought Espresso up because I felt it was _more_ egregious than what's going on here in terms of "shoving music down people's throats" (which I think is exaggerating what's going on here) It's not fair that Geffen is refusing to promote Jimin's upcoming album, and it was rude to suggest that European ARMYs should stream another artist instead, but picking and choosing hits & flops is something the music industry does all the time. Commercial success is one thing, but views and streams are another. You can control the music you listen to, nobody is forcing you to like "us (ft. Taylor Swift)" by Gracie Abrams
that's not the point. he's a svp at geffen and fans were tagging geffen to get a eu ver and a pre save link and an svp replied saying song of the year & linking another artist's song right under the post to mock fans' requests and jimin. getting a song shoved down your throats on radio is different than having the svp of an artist's label open shading their own artist to promote another artist and getting away w it.
That’s how PR works. Like how Sabrina has hits because Spotify put them on every pop playlist and people heard it and streamed it more?
Pushing down people’s throats how? Marketing and playlisting like literally every other artist with a budget? Lmao
it's not the same!!! labels pushing artists on radio and playlisting esp w Spotify autoplay is much different than a SVP of an artist's OWN LABEL openly shading him and his fans online by linking another song under a post asking pre save links of a song.
There is bad marketing. When people are asking about a certain artist and you reply with a totally different artist, that's pushing down people's throat.
Iron knee
Ofc... tbh never even knew she existed until his comment. No wonder they re spamming her and refusing to post jimin on their sns anywhere
Her fan base overlaps with Taylor Swift, Phoebe Bridgers, Clairo, Olivia Rodrigo, Lizzy McAlpine, Maisie Peters, Boygenius, Noah Kahan. If you listen to any of them good chance you might listen to her too.
Have most of them blocked on spotify since they keep showing up even tho i dnt like any of their songs. The others idk them
I have all of these blocked except Clairo LOL
Neither did I. I still don't because no one's mentioned her name yet lol
I believe it's Gracie Abrams, daughter of JJ Abrams
I still dont know her name 🤣 I only remember the picture of her song
Fan were asking a link from an account to preorder but instead He link some song with Taylor Swift collab and proceeds to say Song of the year....very condescending
Seconded! I missed something…
Armys tagged geffen to take out random inclusions in the UK albums so it could count on charts. But the head of streaming department for the whole geffen label(so not a random employee) replied with a song of Gracie ft Taylor swift and mockingly told armys to stream soty. The joke didn’t land and armys called him to apologize. But he deflected by deleting all his social media accounts and going radio silence. This incident became so big that SBS news and Billboard covered it. Now that the song is being released today, geffen is putting an apology out. So it comes off as very insincere
Thanks for an explanation that makes sense and isn't full of weird short hand that makes me feel even more lost than before
Thanks! I feel so out of the loop these days lmao
>take out random inclusions in the UK albums so it could count on charts ELI5?
UK charts have a lot of specific rules (for example on the singles chart only 3 songs from an album can chart, radio play doesn’t count, etc.). One of them is that if an album includes random “gifts” that aren’t available for sale separately (including photocards), it isn’t eligible for the chart. I believe it’s to stop sales inflation from people who buy multiple albums looking for specific inclusions. It means most normal kpop albums are ineligible for the charts bc they include random photocards. Some kpop artists release specific UK versions with all photocards included to get around this (IIRC Ateez ranked high on the chart with a specific UK version without random inclusions).
Not shocked bc xenophobia is very much a thing and it’s on purpose bc they want only the artists they want to be massive to be up front and center not artists from other countries
In this case, it wasn't xenophobia. If it was, the label wouldn't have been actively promoting other BTS members or other Hybe groups on their SM. This was Jimin specifically.
“mistake” 
Vaguely saying “employee” really downplays what a big shot idiot this dude is. How easy it would’ve been for him to just say oops sorry responded to the wrong tweet seconds after that happened. How embarrassing overall for this dude to make this big ruckus over a Gracie Abrams and Taylor Swift song of all things Also I’m tired about hearing nepo baby Gracie Abrams. The industry push for her has just started and I’m already tired of hearing about her
Her and sabrina carpenter... They show up in my spotify autoplay CONSTANTLY, and I absolutely do not listen to that genre of music. If spotify autoplays from a megan thee stallion song? Gracie abrams and sabrina carpenter. Post rock? Gracie abrams and sabrina carpenter. Prog metal? You guessed it! Gracie abrams and sabrina carpenter.
I feel bad because I don't mind Sabrina Carpenter at all, I think she's talented and she's finally getting recognition because she's been making music for years before her recent popularity, I just wanted to stop hearing espresso in every playlist. even my kpop and afrobeats ones would have it lol. I had to mute her because of how annoyed I was. Also that if you're on tiktok/reels every other video uses her songs because it's trending and she's about to drop an album/tour so this is all to get publicity for it. Spotify is the biggest offender when it comes to pushing artists whose companies are paying for it.
I like Sabrina Carpenter and I still ended up blocking her for now on Spotify exactly because of this reason alongside Billie and now Gracie Abrams. I dont want to turn off autoplay because I have discovered some really cool artists through that but there is no reason for Please Please Please or Lunch to start playing after a Mdou Moctar album.
Carpenter is a nepo baby too?
oh no she’s definitely not a nepo baby. this is just her breakout year and her label is pushing extra hard to maximise her commercial success and get her a BNA win at the Grammys
feel this year is more Chappell Roan's. her lyricism and production >>>>>>
Oh no she isnt and it actually took her sometime to blow up so I love that for her. It's just her label has been shoving her songs down everybody's throat that it kind of gets tiring listening to them after every song or album that you play no matter what the genre or language is. I honestly now prefer playlisting over autoplay because at least then you can choose which playlist to listen to, autoplay on the other hand is obnoxious
That’s sad they really need to cool it! I stopped listening to American music for reasons like this I despised most of the popular artists in the early 2010s despite them, looking back, were amazing artists it’s just they were pushed so hard I can’t stomach their voice or music anymore.
I can't believe I'm actually missing Columbia lol
hate to say this but at least Columbia promoted their English releases. We don’t even get that with this incompetent ass label. LC had a whole English version and all geffen did was keeping it on TTH for like 2 weeks, didn’t even send it to radio.
That's why I'm a little on edge about their 10 year deal, we haven't seen what they can do with BTS as a full team.
wait, 10 year deal as in Hybe’s deal with Geffen? Dont tell me BTS actually signed a 10 years long contract with them 😟
[All of HYBE's music including BTS will be distributed through UMG (who Geffen is under)](https://deadline.com/2024/03/hybe-k-pop-home-to-bts-expands-deal-universal-music-group-1235866370/)
They should move to other UMG labels. Geffen is a joke
trying to look on the bright side, since it’s an UMG deal maybe they can switch labels, like Republic or Capitol, though not sure how well those treat their artists either… :/
Honestly how are they not on Repubic which has all the thriving super stars? Geffen was a little strange label. Even Columbia was better than this.
Republic is locked up pretty tight with JYP, who has a long relationship with the CEO. In my view they've been decent as far as TV/festival/award slots and distribution for the JYP groups but I don't think they've done much as far as radio/playlisting. I get the vibe they don't really care to bother with K-pop beyond checking the box for UMG, and JYP suffices for that. Too many western superstars to promote.
Republic still sucks for JYP (at least for twice, I don’t follow other jype groups that closely). The promo we get for English stuff is one (1) tweet on release day and stocking in Target, Walmart, and Barnes and Noble. Maybe a (dying) tv show appearance and a random billboard. Zero playlisting, never sending anything to radio, and no meaningful collabs.
Mentioned this separately too but BTS and the members should all move to some other UMG label. TXT, BTS's direct labelmates, are under Republic Records for US distribution. And while Republic isn't perfect at managing TXT either, it's a situation that's miles better than all these issues BTS have to go through because of Geffen Edited bc typo
Sadly i think they only promoted their English releases bcs Ron Perry had credits in them or was personally responsible for getting them the song 😔. Anything he didn't have a hand in, English or otherwise, went mostly unpromoted or minimal effort This is how these companies seem to move. They make a bigger chunk of money than usual, they move to promote. They don't get the cut they want then they don't move
Yeah, he is credited as a songwriter, composer, and producer along with his wife on Butter and his wife was the vocal producer for Dynamite and those are the only two releases where he made an attempt to push
Ding ding thats the answer...the English released were directly tired to Perry’s bank account. I actually follow a lot of US artist who have now gone independent with certain distribution deals like Megan Thee Stallion & Tinashe. I think in general if the US agency is not directly tied to the music royalties or main source of income…they simply do not try. Like Megan’s album is coming out tonight and if I judged Warner’s behavior like kpop fans judge Geffen X BTS…I would say Warner had done almost nothing. I just really think they don’t move unless they are getting a real piece of the pie.
This is scooter brauns fault right
how was this a mistake 😭 mistake that he accidentally replied with his personal account instead of burner? they acting like this was some random employee when he’s literally the SVP and head of streaming at geffen? ridiculous. not to mention how this half-assed apology still doesn’t address any of the fans’ reasonable concerns and requests. they reblogged bh’s post about muse right after on their twt account and called it a day. mind you, this “apology” is the first muse-related post on their instagram. lol.
They also say the thing *he posted* doesn't reflect *his* views. So, what... He's just admitting to trolling? Or is this all just PR double-speak?
They only released this non apology after billboard and other websites wrote about it. Also still no links to preorders or anything.
I cannot believe that it took them 4 whole days to make a statement and that too such a half baked one with no sincerity and regret for such a stan twt level tweet from a executive. Embarrassing, honestly.
Still they've posted a net total of drum rolls.... zero posts on the IG about the album or the single. They're a joke.
The only post they have posted about MUSE is this "apology". What a way to tell the world that you have zero professionalism and a terrible pr and can't even promote one of your biggest talents.
honestly it could have been the case that this dumbass forgot to switch accounts from his official one to a stan twt one, i wouldn't be surprised if some labels have disguised stan twitter accounts to enhance engagement for their artists on that platform. but the fact that they intentionally chose to respond to that tweet shows how they truly don't care about him or bts, they just want a piece of the cake. even more now that this is the only related post they've made about muse.
This is the first logical explanation I’ve read. Otherwise why would a post from his personal account NOT reflect his personal views? Still makes me upset that they aren’t promoting his release.
They thought that it will die down but it didn't.
This statement isn't going to help it go away. Its going to make it worse. Still no promo for the album with the pre-release out soon.
If there is something about armys, they won’t let things like this go away or die down lol.
as a fan of bts and its members obviously the blatant dismissiveness and disrespect boils my blood, but what upsets me even more is that this is truly the state of non-english language music in the american market there is absolutely no respect and modest exposure at these major us labels for some of the biggest music acts in the entire world, and we're just talking about bare minimum release & promo strategy i would love to see what our mainstream music market would look like if everyone from iu to peso pluma to arijit singh — literally scratching the surface of global popular music here — was paid more than dirt and 2 tweets by the racist, close-minded white men who run these mega agencies just to collect as much coin as possible and leave these artists on read i know bts and jimin and iu and peso pluma and arijit singh all have thriving careers and opportunities elsewhere, but the resistance to actually reflecting in the mainstream american market what it is we like and listen to — diversity! what a new concept! — can be so demoralising at times
Look no further than Bad Bunny, someone who’s a US citizen but just happens to also be Puerto Rican and sings in Spanish 🙃🙃🙃
Seeing how the industry gatekeeps non-english speaking artists always remind me of the infamous David Bowie interview on MTV where he calls out TV and Radio for intentionally limiting the exposure of POC artists and never allocating primetime slot for them and it's actually so sad that even after 5 decades that still is the reality in the american music industry.
I just read an article this morning about "the 20 must-hear albums of 2024" and it's all in English. It wasn't even a typical clickbait site, it was our national broadcaster's music arm. I'm not necessarily expecting kpop to be listed there but there wasn't ONE of the 20 albums that could have been in a language other than English?
Well said!
Translation: “We are sorry that you got offended” And lmao at the last paragraph, they just rt-ed BTS’ account and called it a day for promotion.
"Without any impact." That's their goal.
F Hybe for tying up BTS with these AH’s.
In the time it took to write this "apology" they could have just promoted Jimin's album. They could've posted a link. A poster. Could've even had an EU version of the album be prepared. Would've been a great way to show how "apologetic" they were. Instead, SGMB is being released less than 10 hours and there has yet to be SINGLE post on their account. Not one. Cmiiw, but this statement might be the first time they've ever posted about Jimin on their account. Like, what are we doing here?
>Could've even had an EU version of the album be prepared. I agree with the sentiment of your comment almost entirely but this isn't as easy as some people make it seem. Preparing a EU version if they didn't plan for one to begin with means they would need to produce them from the very beginning to include only one photocard, it would need to be a different one from the normal inclusions and that would take time. Not only would the albums not arrived in time for the release like this but it's likely that BHM already send a batch to Europe before the announcement was even made. If European stores put the album up for preorder it means they have stock coming and confirmed. Transportation by sea takes several weeks, it's likely the albums were already sent. You can't just recall the stock to send an eu exclusive album several weeks later and stores need to sell what they get rn. So a EU Exclusive is impossible at the moment and it's also BH job since the albums are produced in Korea, not by Geffen. They would have needed to plan for it from the very beginning. The rest are fair complaints
The question is, why didn't they plan for a UK version? If they could do it for the other members and see the positive results, why not for Jimin? This album wasn't done a couple of months ago. It was completed well over a year ago. So plenty of time to fix it if they really wanted to.
Geffen is such an incompetent label in the first place it annoys me so much BTS is stuck with them because of Hybe’s stupid deal with them. So tired of seeing BTS’ money being thrown at other acts to keep them relevant but never for actually supporting them. This blatant sabotage of Jimin is frustrating
Exactly. I need BTS out of this company. This is so disappointing
You said it!
It's a pretty big deal because this guy is head of streaming for all of Geffen. For a big executive like him to do something so petty is highly unprofessional and concerning. It's an obvious show of bias I've never seen before.
What a pathetic attempt of apology and i don't believe for a second that what that man did was by mistake.
The incompetence is staggering. I don't understand what their job is, because I have seen zero promo and I have the growing suspicion the title track won't receive a single spin and will have. Now their higher ups are even publicly mocking the artist they work for?
Literally didn't apologize anywhere in this. It just says we get to make oopsies and not say sorry, you get to be told off for calling it out, now forget about it.
Me, looking for an apologies that is no where in sight, what a long paragraph with useless context and BS excuses 
“An employee” my ass.. that was head of streaming for the frickin company. Talk about showing your hands.
Kinda surprised they actually addressed it tbh. It’s also interesting to think about the differences between American and Korean PR. Would a Korean company ever say “we request that fans refrain from any personal attacks”? This is a genuine question, in case it comes off as snarky or anything; I just can’t think of any examples off the top of my head. In my experience, it’s usually just straight up apologetic, “we will do better in the future.” I know twt armys have been pelting UMG/Geffen with demands to apologize, but I’ve mostly seen the same copy-paste message over and over - one that doesn’t have personal attacks. Also the downplaying: “an employee,” “a single post” when it was the VP of Streaming lol and the song he posted is a collab between a nepo baby and a woman who has perfected chart influencing…
Probably hybe pressured them to post smthg since it was blowing up on korean side that it even featured in the news. Also, armys were sending emails and cc all the executives in it.
Ah I see, thanks for the additional info.
Frankly, I am annoyed they used that line about personal attacks. In vacuum, of course people have a right to push back on personal attacks, but this is clearly an attempt to discredit the legitimate concerns of the (non-toxic) fans. They are a giant entertainment corporation who deals with fandoms ALL THE TIME. You can't tell me they haven't encountered the worst of the worst fans from other artists.
Aren't these fans customers? Isn't Jimin a client? This "statement" is overtly hostile. "Employee" my ass. He's the executive in charge of streaming. This is just another version of "blame the intern."
Probably because they recognize its not normal for fans to send employees death threats
Sadly, I think it's way more normal than people know. BTS isn't the only artist with a passionate fandom. Swifties have sent plenty of death threats to executives.
Not you calling that person a mere “employee”.. it seems you not involved in pop fanbases a lot to make to make this comment lol
The fact that this being the only post that they have up on Instagram that is remotely related to Jimin or Muse is truly pathetic. Also they wouldn't have addressed it if it didnt start picking up steam after K Media and Billboard started reporting on it so this feels so insincere.
"mistake" Yeah right "employee" Downplaying his job to make it look like an irrelevant employee did this "Deeply sorry that this has happened" Yeah right, sorry your sass-attempt by an arrogant executive got pushback "We request that fans refrain from any personal attacks" Jimin akgaes are insane, but I'm glad their insanity was properly directed this time (now chill before you make us all look unhinged)
Jimin has THE solo fandom in BTS. It's gotten bigger as of late. They are the most organized. I keep being surprised by how they move.
I have truly been surprise by Jimin's solo fans organization. Since it seems like Jimin is not getting much promotion, they have created promotional posters, with QR code to his Playlist and fans are printing and posting them in their country base. They don't seem to play when it comes to Jimin.
What I have been seeing all over twitter is very surprising. One of the Jimin FBs started a promotional challenge for him and fans ALL OVER THE WORLD started printing and pasting posters , and the amount of MEN doing that was surprising to me. From US to UK , from Mexico to Thailand, from Japan to Korea. They got him a huge digital Billboard in one of the African countries ( sorry I don't remember which country) , a junior high school boy in Japan printed flyers for SGMB and distributed it all over his school with the help of his teacher , who is a Jimin stan herself. Their energy is mind blowing. Do you know the reason that this was addressed in the first place? Because the news made it to Billboard. And why did it made to Billboard? Because the reporter was a HUGE Jimin stan and very active on twitter. Hopefully this energy is up for the entire comeback.
Ik this is controversial, but if they're gonna release solo music they're gonna have solo fandoms, which is good, because otherwise that would mean they're all making the same artistic choices, if everything is appealing to all the same people, what would be the point of any of it edit: yeh, controversial xd
I lowkey agree that there's a way for solo fans to be non-toxic. As long as they don't clamor for the member to leave BTS or start hating on the other members, it might be a healthy thing. For example, I've seen a lot of BTS agnostics/haters begin to get into the rapline, especially RM, and even all three of them have different styles so they attract different audiences.
I kinda agree with your logic. But it crosses the line when solo stans start to hate on other members which I've noticed happens a lot.
Solos and akgaes are very much different things imo, solo as in like "I am a fan of x, they're in a band with other people I'm not interested in" is just normal fandom
The most hateful, toxic, and dangerous fan behavior in BTS history was directed against Jimin. I refer to the campaign to get the SK government and military to single out Jimin for punishment and persecution for the great sin of enlisting with Jungkook. Nothing can top that. At least, I hope not. That's the kind of homophobic crap that gets people killed.
There's solo fans and then there's 😡👺solo💢🤪 fans. I wish them all a bunch of the former, and less of the latter.
the real problem is when they get that toxic mentality and start hating the others for no reason. and make everything a big competition. otherwise I'm not bothered.
[удалено]
So, as an ARMYWol, SHINee world has had its fair share of toxic solo behavior within the fandom, both now and throughout SHINee's career. The comments in this thread are talking about fans who support one specific member and who tend to be highly toxic/aggressive within fandom spaces (akgaes). BTS does not actually have official solo fandoms, unlike with SHINee. BTS have expressed their wish that ARMYs love them equally, whether that's practical or not. ARMYs have biases just like Shawols, but "solos" in the ARMY fandom tend to lean towards Akgaes
[удалено]
I think JK still has more non-group fans tbh (and possibly Tae, going by instagram), but Jimin definitely has one of the more, let's say, involved fandoms
I think JK has the most casual support along with a strong solo fandom, he is also the strongest in SK. Tae has much less casual support, but a very strong solo fandom in Asia mostly. Jimin's solo fandom is strong pretty much everywhere, even if he doesn't have that many casuals. He is the strongest in the US for sure.
I'd say JK has the gp on a chokehold and Jimin has the strongest solo fanbase. Tae has the gp too judging by ig but his songs are less gp friendly so he doesn't get as much support in his music.
Wow, talk about backhanded compliments. Are they Jimin fans or akgaes or are they one in the same? I mean, how does asking for basic support make you a hater? That is what an "akgae" is, right?
Not a compliment and not the same, but I don't have to guess which of the 2 you mostly identify with if you're taking this personally
Not taking it personally, but yes, I did think your "Jimin akgaes are insane" was unjust. Especially in this context.
All akgaes are insane. No sane person would be an akgae. I don’t even understand the concept of being one. You only listen to Jimin’s parts on group songs? I don’t really know how it works. Akgae is rooted in hatred and envy for other artists so you token stan that one and eventually you become an akgae. Discovering one member solo music and becoming a fan is something completely different. That’s normal. You like his music and you become a casual fan, don’t need to deep dive in his past. The biggest example would be Harry Styles. He has so many fans who don’t necessarily vibe with one direction’s music.
Idk what geffen trying to achieve by posting this? They are still blaming the fans who wants the best of their favourite artist, protecting the stupid ass executive who in charge their streaming department and they still have not posted anything about muse.
I wonder if they issued this statement because it reached k-media and thus Jimin possibly saw it? Normally they swept things like this under the rug.
Doubt they care about Jimin tbh. Pretty sure he’s stuck in contract regardless of how he feels about them at the moment. It’s probably the US press that’s scaring them.
Kmedis was feeling charges of racism, apparently.
An employee made a post that is not reflective of his views? How? Was there a gun pointed at his head?
Yet, still no EU version, so Jimin is still not eligible for uk charts. They also didn't promote in their accounts... we had to beg them for itunes preorders. We always to keep tagging them for every single thing for every bts release for days for them to move at all.
The ITunes pre-order (as with other pre-save/order links) was given by BH, so literally GEFFEN did nothing for Jimin, again.
I remember they have a 10 years deal and I just want to scream 😭
BSH needs to be banned from making executive decisions cause this is crazy 😭
Was this done when he was still CEO?
Makes me wish for the deal they had with Columbia where they can leave after a short term contract they had renew each time (forgot the length it was but I think it was a year???) But of course Hybe REALLY wants that expansion to the West with Hybe America and yet the stupid record company in charge of distribution and promotion in the States and parts of Europe cant even lift a finger and rather promote/shoving a freaken nepo baby into everyones faces, including during Jimin's promo period by a childish employee from them
Me too, they got so fucked. 😭
Do you think they can/will sue to terminate the contract? Sounds like they would have grounds to, considering how much Geffen is screwing up/doesnt give a crap about promoting BTS
No idea of the legal ramifications, we have no idea about the deal itself, also, it seems that it's even bigger than just one contract, GEFFEN is handling other HYBE groups and they are partners with HYBE for KATSEYE. I can't hardly see HYBE going back on this when they have such tantalizing links. Better outcome would be for HYBE to pressure them to move rather than breaking contract.
sigh, I guess we'll have to see what HYBE does
I feel it lol, I'm as tired as you are about them, always waiting for someone to move. 😭
10 years?! Tell me you‘re joking 😭
I wish 😭
What do they mean **"no way reflects the views of the employee?"** He literally said it on his own account.
I should really stop being surprised at some people’s stupidity, but here we are. And an executive at Geffen at that.
Is anyone else surprised? This kind of BS has been going on for decades in America. Anytime an Asian brother pops off, there are loads of people who will try to put him down. This ALWAYS happens!
Bruno Mars would be the exception.
The way that this is actually sabotage. I’ve seen so many times that bts has been disrespected in the past but I’ve never actually witnessed bts getting shafted so publicly but here we are 😭
It's frustrating that a.) Western labels seem incapable of doing promo for any artist who doesn't sing exclusively in English and b.) they're also picking and choosing who succeeds and who flops. I find this incident baffling. Why pass up sales to joke about your own reluctance to let international artists break through?
I have no doubt this SVP, like the rest of the US music industry, just think Army and other kpop fans are just bat shit insane for fangirling over an Asian male. Yes they are that racist.
icb these morons at Geffen are scolding fans and saying no personal attacks and giving the notes app apology. Chalking the actions of the head of streaming as a mistake. Like he DELIBERATELY posted a nepo baby's song and captioned it as "song of the year" under the fanbase's post geniune request from his PERSONAL ACCOUNT.
It should have just said “our EX employee”, sheesh. i hate when companies try to distant themselves in situations that are apparent
“Mistake” Get in line or lose out. You want bts money? You want jimin money? You better support him and bts 1000%.
That's the thing that annoys me the most, everyone wants a piece of BTS: HYBE, other HYBE groups, western labels, western acts, brands, everyone but when the time comes to actually invest in them???? Crickets....
It’s infuriating because we as fans and BTS themselves are so handicapped in this situation. For us- we want to promote BTS and, in this instance specifically Jimin as much as possible but we also don’t want to embarrass or undermine him. We don’t want to tell Jimin what to do to promote a certain way, and we don’t want to be seen as “unreasonable crazed fans” Hybe- and through Hybe- Geffen are the business decisions bts made- they have chosen to stay with bighit. And we should respect that grown 30 year old millionaires can make their own business decisions. But on the other hand how can you, as a fan, not feel misgivings when you quite literally are shown through someone’s actions that they do not respect your artist? They want BTS money but they won’t respect them, they treat them as outsiders. Jimin deserves as much push as any western artist and stands to make as much money as some of the top acts on their roster- but god forbid they treat him accordingly! Bts as soloists stand to be even bigger than they are currently- if only they were promoted properly. A large part of that is of course the military service but not all of it. It just sucks. And jimin is in the military so he cannot directly intervene even if he wanted to. I’ve been grappling with this for a while and it’s just so disheartening to constantly have to see what BTS and Jimin have been having to face, and this is just what was bold enough to be posted online! Who knows what it’s like for him behind closed doors within the industry.
One big thing I've noticed is that Big Hit and Geffen are still stuck in this weird infantilization of the members. The member who got the most promotion (still not enough) was Jungkook but the narrative around his release was him working with "big Western producers". No one gives a shit about these producers, Jungkook is a MUCH bigger name than any of the producers he got on Golden x100. As a former communications professional, I was dumbfounded by their narrative around JK's debut. He was already a huge global star, no one was tuning in because of these "producers". When members keep working with Korean teams, like most have done, they have no clue how to talk about their music or even how to categorize it beyond it being a "BTS member". Ultimately, I only trust what the members say about their own music and I think they got a crazy sweet payout and revenue share.
I agree and, at some level, I do have some level of human empathy for Bighit in that they are pretty much going in blind as to how to market BTS within the western market. Or I *did* feel that way. But we are several years into the matter at this point. Bighit isn’t a tiny company anymore. And I was under the impression that hybe America and their American acquisitions were going to help overcome some of the barriers that being a foreign company had put in their path. I agree with you that they seem to have no idea how to push the proper narrative or build the proper marketing tactic for the bts solo careers. It feels like everything is disorganized or an afterthought. My biggest concern though is that it doesn’t seem like there’s much learning happening? Like if it doesn’t go smoothly the first time- it should the next? That’s my biggest concern- how much trial and error are they going to need in order for hybe and geffen to roll out solo releases as seamlessly as many of their peers? And how can they hope to compete in the western market space if they can’t do it?
We were told all the mistakes around Face were due to a "learning curve" so let's move on from their incompetence. So what is the excuse now,? How big of a learning curve does a multi-billion corporation need?
Well as I stated in my comment, I agree with you. There’s no reason these releases shouldn’t be standardized with those provided to western artists of similar level. There’s no reason the same or similar mistakes made with face are being made now. Why are we constantly going one step forward and two steps back? On the one hand I do have some pause immediately throwing the entirety of bighit into the fire because I’m not a Korean person trying to navigate the intricacies of marketing and promotion in a seemingly hostile western market. So in that way I do have human empathy for those doing their best at hybe and bighit to help promote Jimin and BTS. On the other hand- I also refuse to infantilize people. Like you said bighit is a part of hybe and hybe is a multimillion dollar operation- a conglomerate now- and should be held to that standard. It’s a serious problem and I hate seeing his efforts handicapped. And I also hate seeing someone be actively hostile to jimin who is supposed to be helping to promote him.
You raise such a good point. If a fan complains about promotion, marketing and all the business stuff that goes into a release, we're told we are "infantilizing," the artist. As if they are supposed to know all the ins and outs of business along with their songwriting, composing, recording, learning choreography and everything else that goes into their artistic vision. I don't expect any BH executive to dance like Jimin or write layered poetry like RM. So why doesn't it go the other way around? This is their effing job. Why is it so much to expect that they do it? Why are we 'infantalizing" a bunch of MBAs and people raking in millions off the hard work of BTS members? All those MBAs? Totally replaceable. BTS is not.
They’re getting so much money to do nothing off the backs of hardworking artists. Execs no matter the company are always a bunch of entitled freeloaders.
I'm just so happy that people are not defending the corps anymore, especially the ARMYs who were very loud during the Face negligence. I think the MHJ situation showed point blank how many greedy and harmful people BSH has allowed to associate with Hybe for their quest of expansion , and how incompetent Hybe can be that they couldn't even protect BTS from the malicious rumours. Alas , it took an executive going fully mask off on social media for fans to finally believe what the Jimin biased ARMYs and solos were telling from March last year.
Said it before and will say it again. That Geffen executive didn't learn that kind of disdain in a vacuum.
I actually DMd you to discuss some things lol! The thing is that of course, BTS have an 11 year old career, they know what's best but we are not just fans, in the strict sense of the word, we are customers and Geffen is the "supplier" of the goods, like, wouldn't they be interested to actually listen to what customers with buying power have to say? So confusing lol
That's why I'm putting my faith in Namjoon and Yoongi to ask for the moon and stars for their comeback. I get the feeling neither Big Hit or Geffen will do anything interesting or innovative unless the members demand it. The members have been the ones to ask for big Festa celebrations, RM's RPWP rollout and aesthetics were all HIS ideas, ect ect....
And yet BH did not push him outside the K-pop market, did they? Any of us can see his album deserved and needed to be heard outside of the K-pop limits.
I wish he released 😪 it when he was out or before military. It's hurts it's not reaching the target market
I mean, he is obviously so satisfied and proud of his work. As he should be. He needs both a wider and more tailored audience than just K-pop and BTS stans.
Look how invested we were in because of a Instagram broadcast channel from Bighit. They literally do nothing interesting. They don't even know how to keep fans informed about the releases let alone non-fans. It's so irritating to see them do this over and over again.
They can use the community section of BangtanTV channel, but nope.
I’m hopeful when it comes to things like dynamic pricing for their eventual tour too. That may be a pipe dream though.
I think the members have made a deal about those kinds of things. They get to do whatever they want creatively and stay out of the business deals. That's what I suspect anyway. For example, Jin asked for the hug event but he likely didn't get into the weeds of who would qualify, album purchases ect. So when Big Hit/HYBE made dumb decisions, of course it blows back on the members.
That’s the one thing music fans don’t have to worry about in Europe
Yea not forgiven and they have yet to promote his release of SGMB or MUSE
What a lackluster response. Especially so long after the incident
they can keep it, playlist him instead of this.
This is shocking. BTS have enemy everywhere. It explain why geffen are so incompetent. What an useless label
Uh huh 🤨🙄
wait. what posted?
Good luck, Jimin, with whatever contract you signed as a soloist. Because this is the first post on their Instagram about Muse. A broadcast channel on Instagram for *only* the followers of the account and a gif is not promoting an album. It's incredibly infuriating but you can't say too much in case people say we don't respect Jimin's wishes. So yes. Good luck, Jimin.
I, for one, and just not putting up with that "respect his wishes" bullshit. Jimin is the artist, not the promoter. And did the entire marketing team enlist with him?
I'm with you!
I still find it weird they made his Face documentary Weverse exclusive and behind a paywall. Now wider audiences will get zero exposure to him as an artist the way they did with Yoongi and Hobi.
I always think his contract as a soloist is somehow different from others. That is, if he has a solo contract. I feel so curious about the inner dealings of Hybe and how they work with BTS as individuals and as a group it's almost an itch that never goes away. I've noticed this discrepancy myself. Thank you for reminding me of how odd it is.
"Accident" suuure 🙄 How hard is it to hold their dipshit employees accountable???
I'm out of the loop. Who is geffen records, how are they related to bts, and why should I care?
I don't understand what the heck BTS is doing with such an incompetent and unprofessional company?? Like, even if you have to shove UMG down their throats because of HyBe dEaL, UMG has other labels, dude. LITERALLY Tomorrow X Together, labelmates of BTS, are managed by UMG's Republic Records. And while Republic is faaaaar from perfect and does miss the ball several times with TXT, (and yes, ABSOLUTELY several times especially for playlisting, radioplay and virality, among many other things), it still seems like a better alternative than these jerkfaces who clearly run on clout from BTS and the BTS members and then insult them like this. Doing this while Jimin most probably can't discuss/coordinate and/or manage his album's promotions directly like he would've been able to if he wasn't enlisted, absolutely not a good look for Geffen. And isn't the survival show group of Geffen and HYBE debuting right now?? Iirc? Well, good luck to the group and the members and I hope they don't suffer mistreatment cause damn their label really sucks...
Jeksk
Geffen apologized wow