Not really an mcu flaw as much as it is an issue with the genre. I can't really name many suprrhero movies where the main antagonist doesnt die at the end besides magneto in the X-Men movies. All of Tobey's villains except sandman died on screen, the original Batman movies killed villains too. Half the dceu if not more have the villains die
All but mysterio in the Holland Spider-Man movies survived. Hydra survived throughout the MCU and in shows. Agatha is still alive from Wandavision. He Who Remains/Kang is still alive throughout the multiverse. Ghost is still alive and will be in thunderbolts as well as taskmaster. King Pin will continue to be in the MCU. This will continue with Doom whenever he is introduced.
I think both cinematic universes would benefit from villains to stick around longer than one movie. Imagine a Batman movie trilogy that ends with Arkham asylum because it established a ton of his villains up front.
Edit: I misread this comment. My fault for not wearing my glasses lol depends on the universe I guess. The original movies with Keaton kilmer and Clooney had joker die in the first one penguin die in the second one two-faced die in the third one and implied poison ivy in the fourth. I'm going to be honest I've only seen one of the bail movies to the end and it was the dark night and I fell asleep on it. I'm not a fan of Nolan films in general. I don't really remember the events of the first suicide squad that well but didn't kill her croc die and we never got to see him interact with Batman? The only other Batman villains that I remember from the DCEU are joker and Harley and both of them are still alive as far as we know.
The problem is audiences get tired of recurring villains because they think the plot stays the same. It also limits creativity and uniqueness for other movies because the villain can’t change.
If they let the villains live, then they escape jail or whatever, then all the mcu fans will be like “should’ve killed them when they had the chance” and “did you learn nothing from the joker” and other stuff like that
It’s a lose lose, keep them alive, heroes are weak willed and should have gone for the kill, have the villain die, the heroes are uncaring monsters, villains escape, then the heroes are incompetent.
...no?
Every year in the USA, there is an event held called the Super Bowl. Here, the top two American football teams of that year go head to head. There is going to be a winning team, and a losing team.
Is the losing team, a team who got to this game by being one of the best teams the entire season, suddenly incompetent because they lost the final game? No, of course not, they just went against a team that was either better or got lucky.
Apply this to superheroes. No superhero wins every battle, and sometimes the villains get away. That applies to real life, too. Sometimes the day isn't saved, that doesn't immediately mean the people trying to do their jobs are overall bad at it.
That not a very good comparison imo.
The "villain escaped again" shit in Batman comics etc. is ridiculous.
This would just be bad writing if they escape often.
Yeah, and I don't like that. I know it's about fan favorites and less costs and more reliable, but it's still awful. Don't believe me?
I will say it...
"Somehow palpatine returned."
It is funny, People constantly give Batman shit for not putting his villians in a grave.
But when the MCU you does it, it's a problem because why? You just like the villian? Even though they were about to kill more people than any of Batman's villians were capable of?
You are talking about the villain getting away every time. One time it's ok, the second time is just incompetency. Also Loki is a God and was the adopted brother of Thor. Thor actually loved his brother so he wasn't gonna let him get killed.
People are calling Batman incompetent for letting Joker commit more crimes by not killing him, now imagine what people will say about a hero who let's his villain escape his clutches everytime. Someone who has no Kill Rule.
Anyone else remember when people hated how Loki didn't die at the end of Thor 1? I remember everyone was pissed and thought the MCU was just going to keep the villains from dying at the end of all the movies.
Simpler times
Would you prefer to see an amazing never seen or mentioned again?
I’m not saying every villain gotta live, but Ultron should’ve been around for more than one movie.
For real! Everyone strokes Loki for being such a good villain, and he is! But also, he has time to develop and grow as a character because he isn’t instantly offed in his first outing. Villains don’t die in their first comic run almost ever, and that’s for a reason. Killing off villains has been my biggest pet peeve for the MCU since it began
While I agree that these are all incredible films/shows. The abundance of shows and films they’re putting out seems very quantity over quality.
I find myself as do many others, burnt out with the MCU nowadays because they’re trying too much too soon. We’re in phase 5 now! When did phase 4 end?
I’m personally over it now. I wish I could enjoy Phase 4 and 5 but it just doesn’t have my interest. I’m glad others are able to enjoy it, I wish I was enjoying it. But I’m just not unfortunately.
That's so they can come back every week. With superhero movies, they might not use that character again so they don't see the point in the villain staying alive.
Not really an mcu flaw as much as it is an issue with the genre. I can't really name many suprrhero movies where the main antagonist doesnt die at the end besides magneto in the X-Men movies. All of Tobey's villains except sandman died on screen, the original Batman movies killed villains too. Half the dceu if not more have the villains die
All but mysterio in the Holland Spider-Man movies survived. Hydra survived throughout the MCU and in shows. Agatha is still alive from Wandavision. He Who Remains/Kang is still alive throughout the multiverse. Ghost is still alive and will be in thunderbolts as well as taskmaster. King Pin will continue to be in the MCU. This will continue with Doom whenever he is introduced.
No. Not exactly.
Namor also survived in Wakanda Forever.
Not really a villain.
You basically cited a chunk of stories where the villain lives while telling they don't survive in the media lol.
batman villains tend to stick around
I think both cinematic universes would benefit from villains to stick around longer than one movie. Imagine a Batman movie trilogy that ends with Arkham asylum because it established a ton of his villains up front. Edit: I misread this comment. My fault for not wearing my glasses lol depends on the universe I guess. The original movies with Keaton kilmer and Clooney had joker die in the first one penguin die in the second one two-faced die in the third one and implied poison ivy in the fourth. I'm going to be honest I've only seen one of the bail movies to the end and it was the dark night and I fell asleep on it. I'm not a fan of Nolan films in general. I don't really remember the events of the first suicide squad that well but didn't kill her croc die and we never got to see him interact with Batman? The only other Batman villains that I remember from the DCEU are joker and Harley and both of them are still alive as far as we know.
The problem is audiences get tired of recurring villains because they think the plot stays the same. It also limits creativity and uniqueness for other movies because the villain can’t change.
« Somehow Palpatine returned » should be the final answer to this
If they let the villains live, then they escape jail or whatever, then all the mcu fans will be like “should’ve killed them when they had the chance” and “did you learn nothing from the joker” and other stuff like that
It’s a lose lose, keep them alive, heroes are weak willed and should have gone for the kill, have the villain die, the heroes are uncaring monsters, villains escape, then the heroes are incompetent.
That's superhero movies overall, not just the MCU
Fr all the villains just wanna make society better lol
People would just complain just like how they complain about Batman. Most Marvel characters don't have a no Kill Rule.
But you don't need to have a no kill rule to not kill off villains. Just make them competent enough to escape every time, like Loki did.
Then that would make the hero incompetent.
...no? Every year in the USA, there is an event held called the Super Bowl. Here, the top two American football teams of that year go head to head. There is going to be a winning team, and a losing team. Is the losing team, a team who got to this game by being one of the best teams the entire season, suddenly incompetent because they lost the final game? No, of course not, they just went against a team that was either better or got lucky. Apply this to superheroes. No superhero wins every battle, and sometimes the villains get away. That applies to real life, too. Sometimes the day isn't saved, that doesn't immediately mean the people trying to do their jobs are overall bad at it.
That not a very good comparison imo. The "villain escaped again" shit in Batman comics etc. is ridiculous. This would just be bad writing if they escape often.
Villains escape all the time in comics, Batman or otherwise. Or in case of ones like Carnage, come back from the dead.
Yeah, and I don't like that. I know it's about fan favorites and less costs and more reliable, but it's still awful. Don't believe me? I will say it... "Somehow palpatine returned."
It is funny, People constantly give Batman shit for not putting his villians in a grave. But when the MCU you does it, it's a problem because why? You just like the villian? Even though they were about to kill more people than any of Batman's villians were capable of?
You are talking about the villain getting away every time. One time it's ok, the second time is just incompetency. Also Loki is a God and was the adopted brother of Thor. Thor actually loved his brother so he wasn't gonna let him get killed.
Plus every time Loki got away it wasn't due to Thor's incompetent. Thor legitimately thought he died both times.
People are calling Batman incompetent for letting Joker commit more crimes by not killing him, now imagine what people will say about a hero who let's his villain escape his clutches everytime. Someone who has no Kill Rule.
Not saying people wouldn’t complain, they’d complain wether society is better or not it doesn’t really matter
After all, look what they did with MODOK!
Anyone else remember when people hated how Loki didn't die at the end of Thor 1? I remember everyone was pissed and thought the MCU was just going to keep the villains from dying at the end of all the movies. Simpler times
How many catchphrases have there been?
I mean, villains in general are being wasted in the MCU. Kill off the good ones, and then turn the rest into a joke.
Loki?
And the villains they don’t kill off straight away return to become some tiny small character that guards a rock.
What would you prefer? "I'll get you next time, Gadget!" or "We'll meet again, Spider-man!" and other such nonsense?
Hey everyone! Sorry, I am late. It's a jungle out there.
Would you prefer to see an amazing never seen or mentioned again? I’m not saying every villain gotta live, but Ultron should’ve been around for more than one movie.
As long as they're great in the one movie they have, I'm satisfied.
For real! Everyone strokes Loki for being such a good villain, and he is! But also, he has time to develop and grow as a character because he isn’t instantly offed in his first outing. Villains don’t die in their first comic run almost ever, and that’s for a reason. Killing off villains has been my biggest pet peeve for the MCU since it began
Well, unpopular opinion but I like to see my heroes being useful.
The MCU if they had just stopped at Endgame
We wouldn’t have gotten movies like Far From Home, No Way Home, GotG vol.3, Wakanda Forever, WandaVision and Loki.
While I agree that these are all incredible films/shows. The abundance of shows and films they’re putting out seems very quantity over quality. I find myself as do many others, burnt out with the MCU nowadays because they’re trying too much too soon. We’re in phase 5 now! When did phase 4 end? I’m personally over it now. I wish I could enjoy Phase 4 and 5 but it just doesn’t have my interest. I’m glad others are able to enjoy it, I wish I was enjoying it. But I’m just not unfortunately.
Nah, already defeated villains have no value, unless they're redeemed or something.
60 years of spiderman comics would disagree with you.
It's time to pay.
That's so they can come back every week. With superhero movies, they might not use that character again so they don't see the point in the villain staying alive.
reminds me of agent grant ward....