You have a point here. In the video he talks about how cheap music is made now but I wonder if he is just talking about modern pop and billboard stuff.
I’m sure there are a lot of bands out there who still record in a studio
People don't need to record in a studio anymore to make high quality music. The model of these large recording spaces and extremely expensive microphones is dying. Anyone can make incredible music with a basic audio interface, a DAW and a computer
Music has never been more simple, lazy and cheap. Give me a recommendation. Give me a band that plays multiple instruments and harmonizes and creates sonic experiences that people enjoy and can't wait to share. The fact you made your statement and didn't give any examples makes the point of the video. Most songs nowadays are not shared experiences. Indeed, some people nowadays are even offended at the attempt. "How dare you tell me what I'm going to like". Not only has music quality been flushed...it's been flushed because no one wants quality music.
The thing is there's a disconnect between the old, dated interpretation of music creation and the reality of what's happened.
Musicians don't need to do any of the things you've described because music creation has largely been democratized.
It's not "lazy", it's that musicians are more empowered. You don't need thousands of hours, dollars and locations to express yourself - and that's a good thing.
Musicians are no longer beholden to these obstacles to creatively express themselves. When everyone can make music, sure you'll get a lot of low quality works, but you'll also get a big chunk of never before heard sounds, compositions, styles, etc.
The other issue that you're failing to grasp is that we no longer have a monocultire. This isn't the 1990s where people are all riding similar waves and finding anything not on the beaten path requires work.
We're only one search query away from connecting to any artist on the planet. Because of this, that means that the cultural Zeitgeist has shifted. Now we're not in a big bubble, but millions of them. People can find their people, their sound, their community at the drop of a hat.
Songs are not shared experiences as you remember them, they are becoming shared experiences as the way we interact with one another changes. That's a good thing because as everyone is now on the same level playing field, everyone who lives in these micro bubbles of content has the ability to create extremely high quality versions of those genres for next to nothing.
The quality was always subjective as well because now the technology is no longer the bar nor is the gear. The same thing happened with photography, and the same thing is happening now with videography.
Go find your own people and stop waiting for it to be mainstream.
not sure why there are so many downvotes going around here. but this guy did a great job explaining the state of music. i'm no music industry expert, so i can't say he's 100% correct, but everything seemed to be pretty on point.
i would love to hear a 20 or even 30 year old's rebuttal to this argument.
I’ll give it a shot. I think he makes some good points and I agree with some of the things he says but I have many issues with this video.
First off, I’m not sure what his first point is about. Yes, advances in technology make it easier for people to make music, but that doesn’t mean the skill ceiling isn’t any higher than it has been before. The floor may be raised, but low effort and generic music has always been made and has always been profitable.
And the use of technology is neither an inherently bad nor inherently good thing. Yes, these tools can definitely be misused and abused, but there are so many artists who use them to push the bounds of what can be done.
And I’m sorry, the idea that music is somehow more homogeneous than it was in the past is frankly laughable, and to say so is to be willfully ignorant of the state of music. And this doesn’t apply to just the indie scene either, plenty of mainstream artists are pushing the boundaries of the art form and it feels like he’s disregarding that for the sake of an “old good, new bad” argument.
And his take about the accessibility just comes across as incredibly gatekeep-y and ignorant. Yes, I do agree that the way Spotify and social media algorithms further commercialize and treat music as “content” is definitely a problem, but the way services like Spotify allow people to affordably access such wide swaths of music is unabashedly a good thing. Sure, you may appreciate an individual physical copy of an album you had to go to a store to buy more than the streaming equivalent, but that ignores the fact that there are many people who *don’t* have the money or time to engage with music in such a way. Art and culture should not only be accessible to those who can afford it. This really just came off as ignorant to me. And as someone who grew up during the age of streaming, the ease of access to different kinds of music is the thing that allowed me to appreciate music as an art form and I definitely wouldn’t have nearly as big an appreciation for all the different artists, genres and styles that I do without that.
I do wholeheartedly agree with the section about ai generated music though. The technology is very concerning and I am worried about the damage it could to.
Ultimately I don’t think this video is bad, I can see that he’s genuinely attempting to start a legitimate discussion, but his reliance on inflammatory clickbait titles and overly simplistic, wide reaching generalizations really run counter to that, and only serve to unnecessarily antagonize those who he’s trying to reach and make it more likely that his audience is just going to end up a big circle jerk that already agreed with him before clicking on the video.
great points, i can totally see your side too, and honestly i'm with you on pretty much everything.
this guy is making his case from his narrow perspective of an older white man born in the most prosperous time in american history, he *really* only understands *his* perspective. and it doesn't seem like he's making much of an effort to see the world in any other way.
i think it'd be beneficial for him and for a LOT of the old guard to sit down and discuss these kind of complicated topics with a younger, more diverse group of musicians, and try to stay open minded. he could probably learn a lot and could maybe even teach a lot.
His last point about accessibility isn't wrong taken on it's own, it's wrong taken in the context of the circumstances surrounding the rise of streaming platforms. He's right. If you wanted to listen to music, you would have to work a lot harder for it, and because of that you would have to carefully choose which albums you bought . Of course this would create a stronger bond between a listener and their music collection, and make the act of listening to music special.
But we can never go back to that for one simple reason: piracy. The streaming platform and it's $10.99 price tag was the great compromise between record labels and consumers. It wasn't about making music more accessible--piracy had already made music universally accessible with it's $0 price tag--$10.99/month just happened to be the highest price people would pay to not have to pirate music.
Ironically, if we all went back to pirating our music collections again we would be able to reclaim a small part of what he argues we lost when we stopped listening to physical media. People would have to actually curate their own music collections again and find new music without the help of algorithms.
Personally for me my gripe with him isn’t whether he’s right or wrong. He knows what he’s talking about and he always makes good points. My problem with him is what his channel used to be versus what it is now. This is like the hundredth version of this same video he’s put out in the last two years.
He used to break down songs and go into their music theory, their recording process, and production. He used to have videos all about chord progressions. These days all he does is moan about the current state of the industry. It’s gotten old.
oh ok, this is my first time seeing this guy. i can definitely see how that would get old quick.
but i think i'm gonna go back and watch some of his older stuff. i just recently got into music theory youtube videos, it's fascinating stuff.
I have seen a lot of content creators, this one included, who have made videos responding to the “you used to make content like X and I liked it better.” The answer is always that content gets way fewer views/less engagement so they make more of what gets the metrics to get them paid because it’s their job
I think he has a point in the video that music has become much easier and cheaper to make which results in very vanilla plastic sounding crap that all sounds the same.
However, I think he might be generalising here. He’s likely talking about modern pop and hip hop - chart music type stuff. My guess is that there are a lot of “proper” bands out there who record the “traditional” way that would be offended by this take.
In his second point, sure music has become more disposable and the attention span of consumers has dwindled into nothing but I feel like that’s just life - that’s where we are right now with all digital content. It’s also worth mentioning that the streaming apps aren’t the cause of the short attention span wothin consumers. A consumer can sit down with Apple Music and play entire albums all the way through if they want.
I think Beato’s gripe is maybe not with streaming platforms themselves but the way consumers use them and treat the music as disposable and therefore less valuable.
As a final point my 80yr old father thinks it’s amazing that he can have all his favourite albums from the 60s/70s on one app. So maybe streaming apps are a blessing and a curse at the same time.
Ah yes, the bi-monthly Rick Beatoff's - Hey kid, get off my lawn! / everything was amazing and GOD-like in the 60's and 70's with doves and unicorns flying around, and everything is terrible and demonic nowadays / only rock and rock-adjacent music is REAL music and everything else is a pale imitation to be honest, video.
Wash, rinse, repackage, repeat.
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I highly recommend going back to vinyl. This video articulates exactly what comes to mind when you put down the phone and put on a record you bought for the first time, and not the records they sell at starbucks, but a real record store. Thats where music hides.
I’m not sure that I agree with your comment “that’s where music hides” but I 100% agree that listening to records can fix a lot of what is broken with the disposable listening on streaming platforms.
80% of my listening is through streaming. And I have to admit it’s quite disposable. I put on playlists or “best” or artists playlists and it just plays on the background. I enjoy it but it’s not “critical listening”
20% of my listening is through records. The phone goes away and i spend an hour or two enjoying my favourite albums usually listening a lot more intently than when streaming music.
I’m not sure if either approach is better. Both give me enjoyment and serve a purpose.
We all can have different approaches, I'm sharing what I found to be enjoyable for me. I use streaming to source new artists, in tandem with a growing vinyl collection. It can be challenging to sift through the noise on Spotify and find the good stuff. A record store has artists and versions of songs that never made it to digitization or just arent on streaming services.
Beato
You know Beato is tubbed the fuck up.
A regular beato burner
Music has never been better, y'all just need to find new artists and stop listening to top billboard charts or radio
You have a point here. In the video he talks about how cheap music is made now but I wonder if he is just talking about modern pop and billboard stuff. I’m sure there are a lot of bands out there who still record in a studio
People don't need to record in a studio anymore to make high quality music. The model of these large recording spaces and extremely expensive microphones is dying. Anyone can make incredible music with a basic audio interface, a DAW and a computer
Music has never been more simple, lazy and cheap. Give me a recommendation. Give me a band that plays multiple instruments and harmonizes and creates sonic experiences that people enjoy and can't wait to share. The fact you made your statement and didn't give any examples makes the point of the video. Most songs nowadays are not shared experiences. Indeed, some people nowadays are even offended at the attempt. "How dare you tell me what I'm going to like". Not only has music quality been flushed...it's been flushed because no one wants quality music.
The thing is there's a disconnect between the old, dated interpretation of music creation and the reality of what's happened. Musicians don't need to do any of the things you've described because music creation has largely been democratized. It's not "lazy", it's that musicians are more empowered. You don't need thousands of hours, dollars and locations to express yourself - and that's a good thing. Musicians are no longer beholden to these obstacles to creatively express themselves. When everyone can make music, sure you'll get a lot of low quality works, but you'll also get a big chunk of never before heard sounds, compositions, styles, etc. The other issue that you're failing to grasp is that we no longer have a monocultire. This isn't the 1990s where people are all riding similar waves and finding anything not on the beaten path requires work. We're only one search query away from connecting to any artist on the planet. Because of this, that means that the cultural Zeitgeist has shifted. Now we're not in a big bubble, but millions of them. People can find their people, their sound, their community at the drop of a hat. Songs are not shared experiences as you remember them, they are becoming shared experiences as the way we interact with one another changes. That's a good thing because as everyone is now on the same level playing field, everyone who lives in these micro bubbles of content has the ability to create extremely high quality versions of those genres for next to nothing. The quality was always subjective as well because now the technology is no longer the bar nor is the gear. The same thing happened with photography, and the same thing is happening now with videography. Go find your own people and stop waiting for it to be mainstream.
If you can produce it in your bedroom or on your computer, it's definitively lazy
Then this is just a case of you being out of touch. A good artist never blames their tools.
Says the person who loves the accordion
Love this guy's videos. He's not wrong AND this is an old man rant. Kid these days don't appreicate nothin'!
not sure why there are so many downvotes going around here. but this guy did a great job explaining the state of music. i'm no music industry expert, so i can't say he's 100% correct, but everything seemed to be pretty on point. i would love to hear a 20 or even 30 year old's rebuttal to this argument.
I’ll give it a shot. I think he makes some good points and I agree with some of the things he says but I have many issues with this video. First off, I’m not sure what his first point is about. Yes, advances in technology make it easier for people to make music, but that doesn’t mean the skill ceiling isn’t any higher than it has been before. The floor may be raised, but low effort and generic music has always been made and has always been profitable. And the use of technology is neither an inherently bad nor inherently good thing. Yes, these tools can definitely be misused and abused, but there are so many artists who use them to push the bounds of what can be done. And I’m sorry, the idea that music is somehow more homogeneous than it was in the past is frankly laughable, and to say so is to be willfully ignorant of the state of music. And this doesn’t apply to just the indie scene either, plenty of mainstream artists are pushing the boundaries of the art form and it feels like he’s disregarding that for the sake of an “old good, new bad” argument. And his take about the accessibility just comes across as incredibly gatekeep-y and ignorant. Yes, I do agree that the way Spotify and social media algorithms further commercialize and treat music as “content” is definitely a problem, but the way services like Spotify allow people to affordably access such wide swaths of music is unabashedly a good thing. Sure, you may appreciate an individual physical copy of an album you had to go to a store to buy more than the streaming equivalent, but that ignores the fact that there are many people who *don’t* have the money or time to engage with music in such a way. Art and culture should not only be accessible to those who can afford it. This really just came off as ignorant to me. And as someone who grew up during the age of streaming, the ease of access to different kinds of music is the thing that allowed me to appreciate music as an art form and I definitely wouldn’t have nearly as big an appreciation for all the different artists, genres and styles that I do without that. I do wholeheartedly agree with the section about ai generated music though. The technology is very concerning and I am worried about the damage it could to. Ultimately I don’t think this video is bad, I can see that he’s genuinely attempting to start a legitimate discussion, but his reliance on inflammatory clickbait titles and overly simplistic, wide reaching generalizations really run counter to that, and only serve to unnecessarily antagonize those who he’s trying to reach and make it more likely that his audience is just going to end up a big circle jerk that already agreed with him before clicking on the video.
great points, i can totally see your side too, and honestly i'm with you on pretty much everything. this guy is making his case from his narrow perspective of an older white man born in the most prosperous time in american history, he *really* only understands *his* perspective. and it doesn't seem like he's making much of an effort to see the world in any other way. i think it'd be beneficial for him and for a LOT of the old guard to sit down and discuss these kind of complicated topics with a younger, more diverse group of musicians, and try to stay open minded. he could probably learn a lot and could maybe even teach a lot.
His last point about accessibility isn't wrong taken on it's own, it's wrong taken in the context of the circumstances surrounding the rise of streaming platforms. He's right. If you wanted to listen to music, you would have to work a lot harder for it, and because of that you would have to carefully choose which albums you bought . Of course this would create a stronger bond between a listener and their music collection, and make the act of listening to music special. But we can never go back to that for one simple reason: piracy. The streaming platform and it's $10.99 price tag was the great compromise between record labels and consumers. It wasn't about making music more accessible--piracy had already made music universally accessible with it's $0 price tag--$10.99/month just happened to be the highest price people would pay to not have to pirate music. Ironically, if we all went back to pirating our music collections again we would be able to reclaim a small part of what he argues we lost when we stopped listening to physical media. People would have to actually curate their own music collections again and find new music without the help of algorithms.
Personally for me my gripe with him isn’t whether he’s right or wrong. He knows what he’s talking about and he always makes good points. My problem with him is what his channel used to be versus what it is now. This is like the hundredth version of this same video he’s put out in the last two years. He used to break down songs and go into their music theory, their recording process, and production. He used to have videos all about chord progressions. These days all he does is moan about the current state of the industry. It’s gotten old.
oh ok, this is my first time seeing this guy. i can definitely see how that would get old quick. but i think i'm gonna go back and watch some of his older stuff. i just recently got into music theory youtube videos, it's fascinating stuff.
I have seen a lot of content creators, this one included, who have made videos responding to the “you used to make content like X and I liked it better.” The answer is always that content gets way fewer views/less engagement so they make more of what gets the metrics to get them paid because it’s their job
I think he has a point in the video that music has become much easier and cheaper to make which results in very vanilla plastic sounding crap that all sounds the same. However, I think he might be generalising here. He’s likely talking about modern pop and hip hop - chart music type stuff. My guess is that there are a lot of “proper” bands out there who record the “traditional” way that would be offended by this take. In his second point, sure music has become more disposable and the attention span of consumers has dwindled into nothing but I feel like that’s just life - that’s where we are right now with all digital content. It’s also worth mentioning that the streaming apps aren’t the cause of the short attention span wothin consumers. A consumer can sit down with Apple Music and play entire albums all the way through if they want. I think Beato’s gripe is maybe not with streaming platforms themselves but the way consumers use them and treat the music as disposable and therefore less valuable. As a final point my 80yr old father thinks it’s amazing that he can have all his favourite albums from the 60s/70s on one app. So maybe streaming apps are a blessing and a curse at the same time.
Ah yes, the bi-monthly Rick Beatoff's - Hey kid, get off my lawn! / everything was amazing and GOD-like in the 60's and 70's with doves and unicorns flying around, and everything is terrible and demonic nowadays / only rock and rock-adjacent music is REAL music and everything else is a pale imitation to be honest, video. Wash, rinse, repackage, repeat.
I agreed with every single point, as it applies to the average song/mainstream music. Of course there is niche songs that are the best
/r/mealtimevideos is your reddit destination for medium to long videos you can pop on and kick back for a while. For an alternate experience leading to the same kind of content, we welcome you to [join our official Discord server](https://discord.gg/AXXVVgZVSN). [](#autoignorereports) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/mealtimevideos) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I highly recommend going back to vinyl. This video articulates exactly what comes to mind when you put down the phone and put on a record you bought for the first time, and not the records they sell at starbucks, but a real record store. Thats where music hides.
Yeah I love records but this is just elitism The vast majority cannot afford records or a record player and/or it’s just impractical
I’m not sure that I agree with your comment “that’s where music hides” but I 100% agree that listening to records can fix a lot of what is broken with the disposable listening on streaming platforms. 80% of my listening is through streaming. And I have to admit it’s quite disposable. I put on playlists or “best” or artists playlists and it just plays on the background. I enjoy it but it’s not “critical listening” 20% of my listening is through records. The phone goes away and i spend an hour or two enjoying my favourite albums usually listening a lot more intently than when streaming music. I’m not sure if either approach is better. Both give me enjoyment and serve a purpose.
We all can have different approaches, I'm sharing what I found to be enjoyable for me. I use streaming to source new artists, in tandem with a growing vinyl collection. It can be challenging to sift through the noise on Spotify and find the good stuff. A record store has artists and versions of songs that never made it to digitization or just arent on streaming services.