That's been my issue with this all along. This was a July 2023 conversation. Biden is our candidate, like it or not. The time to do something about it has passed. Every Dem leader who questions his fitness publicly might as well just donate to Trump's reelection campaign.
Correct. It is infuriating that this conversation wasn’t had a year ago and internally. All these people who are now vocally questioning Biden are only sowing discord instead of focusing on what matters: defeating Project 2025.
Well, you aren’t factoring in what “decline” means. You’re speaking as if his mental capacity was the same in 2023 as it is a year later. For most of our lives we expect to be mentally about the same in the passing of a year, but that changes with age. The declination slope speeds up.
It’s not reasonable to say this should have been acted on in 2023.
And it’s not reasonable to say it should be ignored now that the problems are out there for all to see.
Personally I took no stock in all Trump’s BS about Joe’s state. I expected Joe to come on stage and prove him wrong. And then this shocking horrifying debacle happened that I never expected.
At the very least he should be tested by independent experts.
WHAT DOES IT MATTER?! Harris is his VP. It’s not like Biden is planning on operating as a DICTATOR as some other candidate is. He has a full team around him, and Harris will step into the role when the time comes. I cannot believe that we are having this debate when we should be focusing all of our energy on defeating the opponent. While we’ve been infighting over the past two weeks, Trump has been able to silently coast with little to no discussion of HIS inadequacy for the job. With all the NYT editorials calling for Biden’s head, they have NEVER asked Trump to resign or leave the race. We all need to get some perspective, for Pete’s sake!
It technically hasn't, but for all practical purposes, it has. All the primaries have been held, the convention is in a few weeks. It's as pie-in-the-sky as the 2016 concept of faithless electors. And who would it even be? Who's got the broad support needed to pull this off?
I haven't seen this brought up anywhere else, but in the Stephanopoulos interview, Biden mentioned that even though the microphone had been turned off, Trump continued taunting him. I can understand that even to an experienced debater, this must have been very challenging.
There were a couple points where that was visible on camera too...they cut Dump's mic, and his lips were still flapping. Let's talk about THAT, shall we??? Biden was visibly pissed/annoyed most of the debate, and had a "wtf is he talking about" expression several times. My sons (26 and 23) and my older son's gf (20) ALL noticed that too.
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What bothers me is he’s an experienced debater, politician, president who should know Trump taunts his opponents while they speak. Biden’s been through it and yet he didn’t have a solution.
He went up against a stochastic terrorist with some not well recalled ineffective facts and figures. As he went up against MAGA in Congress with bipartisanship as a solution. He failed the golden chance he was already given by being unable to come up with a new tactic.
Yes, Biden’s debate skills have diminished. But the solution is not to vocally question his candidacy four months before the election. All Democratic leaders need to refocus the messaging onto Project 2025 and the imminent dangers if we lose. This Democratic self-implosion is playing right into the Republicans’ hands.
Sadly, I don’t know a single person in my locality who approves of Biden or is worried about impending Fascism or Project 2025. I am not too sure the messaging is making an impact. Everyone I know won’t watch the news other than local news. I’m online because I care about politics and want to discuss it and there a total ban on that socially around me. I suppose it’s how people stay civil to each other. Not asking or telling.
I think a real contest at a convention would get attention.
And then the voters whose candidate isn’t chosen won’t vote. This is the time for party solidarity, not dissention. Say what you will about the Republicans, but their messaging is at least consistent and disciplined. Democrats repeatedly shoot themselves in the foot with in-fighting like this.
It’s speculation that they won’t vote.
My candidate of choice in 2020 wasn’t the nominee. I still voted Democrat. I will vote Democrat this time if I see a process. The primaries in 2024 mean nothing to me as no one dared step up and challenge the incumbent as was signaled but the party.
I think the Democratic Party is starting to recover somewhat from the shock we all felt after that “debate”. It was good to see some Progressives like AOC strongly supporting Biden.
I’m seeing a real push on the coverage of Project 2025 by the liberal media outlets.
The right must be getting nervous because they’ve released a Project 2025-Lite version. They’re trying to downplay the more horrifying aspects of Project 2025. Ha! Nice try, but we’ve already seen it, fellas.
Those debate podiums weren’t very far away from each other so I’m sure Biden could hear—or was atleast aware of—the constant spewage coming from the other podium.
Do you not think our candidate should be able to make a case against the greatest threat (or so Democrats say) we have faced in our Country's history? Because he hasn't made the case so far and is losing the race. VP Harris is able to make a very strong case against Trump.
Saying you already beat him is not a good reason. Nor is touting your record when 75% of voters are concerned about the next 4 years, not the past 4 years.
Some seem willfully blind or eager to drink the Biden coolaid. Let's check back in with each other in 5 months.
I think he’s done a great job, is doing a great job, and will do a great job. I think he’s the most effective President since FDR. I think he’s running against the worst President in American history. I think he’s already demonstrated my case, and the other guy demonstrates my case as well.
Some seem awfully eager to dismiss an accomplished President, while simultaneously indemnifying behavior that makes my candidate look like a Saint. This isn’t a tough call, those who can’t decide between these two have lost any semblance of decency, and are all too willing to point and scream “debate” and “old”.
Ain’t playing that crap, don’t have to, but you’re free to. Knock yourself out.
He’s not going to be replaced because of people like you keeping him in a bubble so he’s not even aware how bad this is. He’s also not going to be replaced because it turns out he’s severe narcissist too who is ok putting himself above country and party.
You can pick any fantastic, mind-numbing reason you wish. You can blame it on alien species mind control, an equivalent value.
Point, scream, gnash teeth, clutch pearls - it’s your world.
There will still be 2 candidates on that ballot in November, and their names are Biden and Trump. You will vote, or you will not. Your call. If you’re having a moral dilemma between those two, well you definitely have one.
This post truly shows a massive ignorance on your part.
All of us complaining are going to vote for Biden’s head in a blue jar. What we’re saying is that the country will not. The country will vote for “strong”. Not feeble. Unable to finish a sentence. Unable to string thoughts together. Trump looked like a god damn normal person standing next to Biden.
So yeah, like everyone is saying, he can’t win. And he’s staying in because he’s a severe narcissist.
He’s losing in the polls too. Wasn’t in 2020. At all. Never see you guys address that.
>“…people like you keeping him in a bubble…”
Nobody in this sub has any kind of control over Joe Biden and whether or not he’s in a bubble. That would be his family and staff, if it’s anybody. How on earth are any of us supposed to reach him?
I hope if you care this much and think he’s in a bubble and needs to step down that you reached out- called the White House, called your reps, and actually made an effort to talk sense into Joe Biden and his handlers, instead of just berating random strangers on Reddit.
The personal attacks and blaming each other that are happening here really sucks. Not one of us can actually do anything, and we’re all treating each other like it’s the personal fault of the other person.
I don’t agree. I would argue the insistent nature of this crowd to ignore this reality—including mobbing people like Axelrod and Pod Save guys on Twitter—does actually have a real life impact.
Cogent? That’s a guy putting his ego over party and country. Makes me angry.
Defiance is note cute. Defiance and resisting advice are hallmarks of dementia. Run a search on defiance and dementia and there are endless resources on how defiance
Increases the problems caregivers have with age related dementia.
That’s whataboutism… originally a Russian tactic.
I’m looking at other Democrats who could do a far better job.
Trump’s decline is obvious.
At this crucial time we need a strong, smart, articulate, energetic President, not a feeble, senile, stubborn one.
Winning the election is crucial, but the fight for democracy after inauguration 2025 needs a highly intelligent leader to be in the White House.
The selection is literally down to two. You will choose, but I’m guessing not quietly. I’m all for your dissent, and right to express it. However, in the end, it will be one of the two.
Well, the ranking members and chairs of some of the most powerful committees in Congress, all Democrats, are meeting to discuss it, and letting it be known they think he should step down.
And they are just the forerunners of the wave.
Nancy Pelosi endorses him getting a cognitive test at the least and he refuses. You’re voting for a guy who makes frequent mental slips and who won’t take a cognitive test to reassure the American people?
Yep, without reservation. Not a tough call. I’m aware of what the party minority is doing, simply not on board with it. Waste of time. 10 out of 215 Democratic congressmen is hardly a consensus. Pretty sure they have other work they should be doing, but hey, put it out there, get it over with.
He refuses to resign, a prerequisite to replacing him. Now, he has the NATO summit. Folks won’t speak out now, not Democrats anyway. A minority of the house and senate has spoken out. There are a lot more rank and file Democrats that have spoken out.
Politico: Of the 86 percent of likely voters who watched all or part of the debate, just 29 percent said Biden has the mental capacity and physical stamina to serve another four-year term, compared with 61 percent who said he does not. Only 33 percent said he should continue as the Democratic nominee, versus 52 percent who believe he should not. And just half of Democrats said Biden should be the party’s nominee or is mentally and physically fit to serve out another term.
Ok, like I said, put it out there and get it over with.
The two candidates in November will not change. They were both elected overwhelmingly by their respective parties. There they are. Vote.
Yup. This place is the new Cult, and will downvote you to death for stating the obvious.
All of you people—when Biden gets crushed in November—IT’S YOUR FAULT.
He's got a point...to all those in the party who want him out who do you want as a replacement? The polling shows that they are tied in what was always considered a tight race.
If Biden bombs in the next debate then...I don't even want to think about that..
The polling only tells you were the race is headed, and its headed to a landslide loss because we're starting to see safe blue states like New Jerey slip away. Stop listening to the copium. The longer he stays in race the more he's going to hurt down ballot candidates.
Also an open convention could turn into an absolute shitshow that could endanger the party for years.
I think the point was missed above was that an open convention would include Biden as a contender, whereas what can work is a convention that is definitely working on selecting a different candidate because Biden would have agreed to step down.
None of this matters. Biden is going to go stick it out and the entire campaign will be about him and his fucking age and nothing else. Project 2025, Trump's felonies, none of it will get oxygen. And we'll deserve it.
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Wow, you went from accusing me of being a conservative to ... a KKK member ... for suggesting we run a Black woman as President. And somehow I'm the troll. You can see from my post history I am no concern troll.
The candidates have a combined age of 160. A Harris/Whitmer ticket could energize the left, and that's what's missing, energy.
As an independent voting Dem you gotta give up this nonsense. Incumbents get the bump. They aren’t going to make a change. The more you sew discord the worse you make it. Get in line and support the Dem regardless of who it is. You do seem like a concern troll. The black caucus just came out in support of Biden. Case closed.
Polls have never been right. Only states that matter are PA, WI, MI, and MN, by the way Florida is in play too due to the dictatorship of Ron and recreational marijuana and Abortion on the ballot. Don’t be fooled by the media hoopla.
I don’t see how Harris can challenge him unless he steps down and anoints her. She’d be painted as disloyal, don’t you think?
Personally I am impressed with Gavin Newsome. He’s able to respond cogently and with nuance on the fly, unscripted. He has energy to spare. He has charisma.
I read something yesterday that Trump camp is leaking they want to face Joe or Kamala and they’re terrified, Trump is terrified, of facing Gavin.
Wittmer for VP?
I think Josh Shapiro is a fine guy, but I like him in his current position and he doesn’t seem aggressive enough for the crisis we’re in.
I think the party stepping over the Black, female VP for a white man and a white woman would cause an absolute furor in the party- particularly since Black women are such a major part of the Democratic Party.
I wish we could look at candidates for who they are and for the gender and ethnicity boxes they check.
As we saw, Harris ran for President in 2020 and quit the race after failing to generate enough support in the primaries. That’s her record as a presidential candidate.
Now she’s had a term as VP to build a base, but I don’t see that she’s done much. I do know that VPs don’t get to take the limelight.
If it weren’t for her ethnicity, would she be the clear choice?
I’d vote for a woman, a black woman, a gay man, and so forth, if the person has what it takes to capture the voter enthusiasm, but she already had a chance to do that and it didn’t happen for her.
I’m not saying that I think the candidate has to be her because she’s a black woman. That’s not at all what I mean. I mean that it would cause an uproar in one of the major, core groups of the Democratic Party. I think it’s fraught with risk to step past her.
I like this combination but Biden is neck and neck with Trump and switching him out now?
I am not looking forward to the September debate..🤔 I admit that. The Democratic convention will be interesting for sure.
To those saying it’s too late to change.
I remember election year 1968. (I was not eligible to vote until 1972, but I was following closely.)
LBJ announces he won’t run again on March 31, 1968.
RFK immediately becomes frontrunner.
RFK is assassinated June 5, 1968.
The convention in Chicago was the means of choosing the ticket, not primaries.
There was none of the technology for disseminating information and feedback on a broad scale almost instantaneously as we have now.
IMO, the Dems lost in 1968 because they put forward a boring middle of the road unpopular guy Hubert Humphrey, IIRC. To a nation with a youth majority that had supported the now murdered RFK. If the Dems had put up a charismatic progressive candidate to counter Nixon we may not have had Nixon.
My point though is that this debate wasn’t much later at all than the RFK whammy, so it is only too late to change if the D voters are all calcified and timid. The party pushed the country into a pro forma uncontested primary this year in order to unilaterally back the incumbent. The country didn’t have a real voice this year.
If our House and Senate members who WERE Biden supporters have grasped that a change must be made and quickly, good for them for their courage.
A party is responsible to create a ticket that will get the down ballot races elected too, so we can have a shot at majorities. These representatives see that Biden’s failure has jeopardized all the races, and he is no longer favored to win against Trump either — and they are doing their job.
I applaud them and I’m tired of being told that supporting a new tack is the same as supporting Trump or Putin. That’s just undemocratic to throttle the conversation.
I’m about the same age as you, registered to vote when I was 19 in 1971 when the voting age was lowered to 18. I too followed politics closely in the 60s. I agree that the Dems made a huge mistake nominating HHH, who was pro-war in a divided party, at the 1968 Democratic convention. That’s when the riots broke out in Chicago. After that fiasco, the Parties went to the primary system to nominate the presidential candidates.
While the primaries allow the voters instead of party delegates to choose a candidate, the custom of having the incumbent as the sole party candidate on the primary ballot does reduce the efficacy of our votes.
I wonder how the primary system would work for president if the incumbent plus other party candidates for president were on the ballot trying for the majority of votes to be the nominee for the party? Would it work using the current individual state primary system or would we have to go to a national primary system, do you think?
I may be overthinking this. Lol.
This is a weird phrasing. There is no “announce and challenge”. They are his hand-chosen delegates attending the convention because he ran (mostly) unopposed in the primaries.
All of the hypotheticals of the past week were predicated on him voluntarily dropping out, but if he doesn’t want to drop out then nobody can make him.
“If he wants” was what I was getting at. It doesn’t sound like he’s releasing the delegates which would make a challenge pointless. He just wanted to sound tough on the phone call.
I would actually respect him if he is seriously challenging Democrats. He would prove that he actually cares about Democracy, that he isn't running for selfish reasons, and that is actually confident that he can beat Trump.
ARE YOU SURE JOE? We luv you & what you’ve done. BUT DONT BE LIKE RBG AND F UP YOUR LEGACY!! It’s time to Pass The Torch to Kamala!! YOUNG PEOPLE SEE YOU AS A STUBBORN OLD MAN …AFTER THE DEBATE😞 soory THEY WILL NOT VOTE FOR YOU ! But will vote for a YOUNGER CANDIDATE TO SAVE DEMOCRACY!!
Is your EGO MORE IMPORTANT THAN OUR DEMOCRACY? The Joe I know will Say No & STEP DOWN… Based on your life’s work in public service
What I find halarious(ly depressing), is these two chucklefucks - Joey Scars and Mika - are the ones who helped Trump get into the White House in 2016. How did they do that? By ignoring his faults and bringing him onto their show via telephone and yucking it up.
Now they bring Biden on via telephone and largely ignore his glaring faults while feeding him pre-prepared softball questions. Not that it will change anyone’s minds here, but I’m gradually turning from someone who would vote for Biden because I’m being forced to, into someone who may not vote for him at all. I’ll vote down ballot for Dems but I no longer trust Biden and his team to be honest with their voters, nor do I trust Biden can do the job even if I he does somehow regain my trust.
And here’s the thing, I’m FAR from the only one who feels this way. Everyone here cheerleading him regardless of what he says and does had better be ready for a devastating loss in November if nothing changes. He’s not lost my vote completely yet, but it’s going to take something big and different from what I’m getting right now. And he doesn’t seem to think people like me matter.
Biden vs Trump. The two best options that US citizens could come up with, in a country with over 300 million people idiots. You send better options to the Olympics.
I’ve changed my mind about Biden!
I Was Wrong. Biden has been awesome lately and I am with Joe! Fighting to remain the candidate has ignited a Passion that has been like drinking from the fountain of youth that everyone will continue to see!
Great news #1 google search yesterday was Project 2025 followed by Taylor Swift. GOP was hoping we wouldn’t find out
Interesting what George Clooney just said. Here he was throwing a massive fundraiser for Joe, only to be stunned at how much Joe has lost it. He spent a bunch of time with him, not just in formal speeches.
There was a fundraising prize recently offered to meet the Bidens, Obama, and George Clooney and Julia Roberts. I assume that has happened now and Clooney felt he had to say something about how Joe is losing it. He’s been a major supporter.
That's been my issue with this all along. This was a July 2023 conversation. Biden is our candidate, like it or not. The time to do something about it has passed. Every Dem leader who questions his fitness publicly might as well just donate to Trump's reelection campaign.
Correct. It is infuriating that this conversation wasn’t had a year ago and internally. All these people who are now vocally questioning Biden are only sowing discord instead of focusing on what matters: defeating Project 2025.
Well, you aren’t factoring in what “decline” means. You’re speaking as if his mental capacity was the same in 2023 as it is a year later. For most of our lives we expect to be mentally about the same in the passing of a year, but that changes with age. The declination slope speeds up. It’s not reasonable to say this should have been acted on in 2023. And it’s not reasonable to say it should be ignored now that the problems are out there for all to see. Personally I took no stock in all Trump’s BS about Joe’s state. I expected Joe to come on stage and prove him wrong. And then this shocking horrifying debacle happened that I never expected. At the very least he should be tested by independent experts.
WHAT DOES IT MATTER?! Harris is his VP. It’s not like Biden is planning on operating as a DICTATOR as some other candidate is. He has a full team around him, and Harris will step into the role when the time comes. I cannot believe that we are having this debate when we should be focusing all of our energy on defeating the opponent. While we’ve been infighting over the past two weeks, Trump has been able to silently coast with little to no discussion of HIS inadequacy for the job. With all the NYT editorials calling for Biden’s head, they have NEVER asked Trump to resign or leave the race. We all need to get some perspective, for Pete’s sake!
If Biden is seriously challenging his doubters than the time technically hasn't passed.
It technically hasn't, but for all practical purposes, it has. All the primaries have been held, the convention is in a few weeks. It's as pie-in-the-sky as the 2016 concept of faithless electors. And who would it even be? Who's got the broad support needed to pull this off?
I haven't seen this brought up anywhere else, but in the Stephanopoulos interview, Biden mentioned that even though the microphone had been turned off, Trump continued taunting him. I can understand that even to an experienced debater, this must have been very challenging.
There were a couple points where that was visible on camera too...they cut Dump's mic, and his lips were still flapping. Let's talk about THAT, shall we??? Biden was visibly pissed/annoyed most of the debate, and had a "wtf is he talking about" expression several times. My sons (26 and 23) and my older son's gf (20) ALL noticed that too.
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I thought 69 was a lucky number when I was 13 years old. I've grown past that.
lol! Yeah, it’s definitely a teenage meme number
🤣
What bothers me is he’s an experienced debater, politician, president who should know Trump taunts his opponents while they speak. Biden’s been through it and yet he didn’t have a solution. He went up against a stochastic terrorist with some not well recalled ineffective facts and figures. As he went up against MAGA in Congress with bipartisanship as a solution. He failed the golden chance he was already given by being unable to come up with a new tactic.
Yes, Biden’s debate skills have diminished. But the solution is not to vocally question his candidacy four months before the election. All Democratic leaders need to refocus the messaging onto Project 2025 and the imminent dangers if we lose. This Democratic self-implosion is playing right into the Republicans’ hands.
Dump never had debate skills to begin with...he just whines and diverts and rambles, and always has.
Sadly, I don’t know a single person in my locality who approves of Biden or is worried about impending Fascism or Project 2025. I am not too sure the messaging is making an impact. Everyone I know won’t watch the news other than local news. I’m online because I care about politics and want to discuss it and there a total ban on that socially around me. I suppose it’s how people stay civil to each other. Not asking or telling. I think a real contest at a convention would get attention.
And then the voters whose candidate isn’t chosen won’t vote. This is the time for party solidarity, not dissention. Say what you will about the Republicans, but their messaging is at least consistent and disciplined. Democrats repeatedly shoot themselves in the foot with in-fighting like this.
It’s speculation that they won’t vote. My candidate of choice in 2020 wasn’t the nominee. I still voted Democrat. I will vote Democrat this time if I see a process. The primaries in 2024 mean nothing to me as no one dared step up and challenge the incumbent as was signaled but the party.
I think the Democratic Party is starting to recover somewhat from the shock we all felt after that “debate”. It was good to see some Progressives like AOC strongly supporting Biden. I’m seeing a real push on the coverage of Project 2025 by the liberal media outlets. The right must be getting nervous because they’ve released a Project 2025-Lite version. They’re trying to downplay the more horrifying aspects of Project 2025. Ha! Nice try, but we’ve already seen it, fellas.
Those debate podiums weren’t very far away from each other so I’m sure Biden could hear—or was atleast aware of—the constant spewage coming from the other podium.
Oh no, a mentally cogent point! Thought he couldn’t do that before 10 o’clock? He’s running, get over it, and do it fast. Enough.
He can't put two sentences together
🥱
Do you not think our candidate should be able to make a case against the greatest threat (or so Democrats say) we have faced in our Country's history? Because he hasn't made the case so far and is losing the race. VP Harris is able to make a very strong case against Trump. Saying you already beat him is not a good reason. Nor is touting your record when 75% of voters are concerned about the next 4 years, not the past 4 years. Some seem willfully blind or eager to drink the Biden coolaid. Let's check back in with each other in 5 months.
I think he’s done a great job, is doing a great job, and will do a great job. I think he’s the most effective President since FDR. I think he’s running against the worst President in American history. I think he’s already demonstrated my case, and the other guy demonstrates my case as well. Some seem awfully eager to dismiss an accomplished President, while simultaneously indemnifying behavior that makes my candidate look like a Saint. This isn’t a tough call, those who can’t decide between these two have lost any semblance of decency, and are all too willing to point and scream “debate” and “old”. Ain’t playing that crap, don’t have to, but you’re free to. Knock yourself out.
Is this Mika's burner?
It’s what you think it is, obviously.
The fact you’re satisfied with a guy who conducts himself like this is beyond stunning.
You should see the other guy.
THAT IS NOT AN ARGUMENT WHEN WE ARE TALKING ABOUT REPLACING THE DEM NOMINEE Jesus christ
Why argue about it? He’s not going to be replaced. Maybe you want to argue with someone who subscribes to that crap.
He’s not going to be replaced because of people like you keeping him in a bubble so he’s not even aware how bad this is. He’s also not going to be replaced because it turns out he’s severe narcissist too who is ok putting himself above country and party.
You can pick any fantastic, mind-numbing reason you wish. You can blame it on alien species mind control, an equivalent value. Point, scream, gnash teeth, clutch pearls - it’s your world. There will still be 2 candidates on that ballot in November, and their names are Biden and Trump. You will vote, or you will not. Your call. If you’re having a moral dilemma between those two, well you definitely have one.
This post truly shows a massive ignorance on your part. All of us complaining are going to vote for Biden’s head in a blue jar. What we’re saying is that the country will not. The country will vote for “strong”. Not feeble. Unable to finish a sentence. Unable to string thoughts together. Trump looked like a god damn normal person standing next to Biden. So yeah, like everyone is saying, he can’t win. And he’s staying in because he’s a severe narcissist. He’s losing in the polls too. Wasn’t in 2020. At all. Never see you guys address that.
>“…people like you keeping him in a bubble…” Nobody in this sub has any kind of control over Joe Biden and whether or not he’s in a bubble. That would be his family and staff, if it’s anybody. How on earth are any of us supposed to reach him? I hope if you care this much and think he’s in a bubble and needs to step down that you reached out- called the White House, called your reps, and actually made an effort to talk sense into Joe Biden and his handlers, instead of just berating random strangers on Reddit. The personal attacks and blaming each other that are happening here really sucks. Not one of us can actually do anything, and we’re all treating each other like it’s the personal fault of the other person.
I don’t agree. I would argue the insistent nature of this crowd to ignore this reality—including mobbing people like Axelrod and Pod Save guys on Twitter—does actually have a real life impact.
Cogent? That’s a guy putting his ego over party and country. Makes me angry. Defiance is note cute. Defiance and resisting advice are hallmarks of dementia. Run a search on defiance and dementia and there are endless resources on how defiance Increases the problems caregivers have with age related dementia.
Uh huh - you should see the other guy.
That’s whataboutism… originally a Russian tactic. I’m looking at other Democrats who could do a far better job. Trump’s decline is obvious. At this crucial time we need a strong, smart, articulate, energetic President, not a feeble, senile, stubborn one. Winning the election is crucial, but the fight for democracy after inauguration 2025 needs a highly intelligent leader to be in the White House.
Exactly. Our country deserves the best leader we can field. Not "the guy who isn't the other guy"
The selection is literally down to two. You will choose, but I’m guessing not quietly. I’m all for your dissent, and right to express it. However, in the end, it will be one of the two.
Well, the ranking members and chairs of some of the most powerful committees in Congress, all Democrats, are meeting to discuss it, and letting it be known they think he should step down. And they are just the forerunners of the wave. Nancy Pelosi endorses him getting a cognitive test at the least and he refuses. You’re voting for a guy who makes frequent mental slips and who won’t take a cognitive test to reassure the American people?
Yep, without reservation. Not a tough call. I’m aware of what the party minority is doing, simply not on board with it. Waste of time. 10 out of 215 Democratic congressmen is hardly a consensus. Pretty sure they have other work they should be doing, but hey, put it out there, get it over with.
He refuses to resign, a prerequisite to replacing him. Now, he has the NATO summit. Folks won’t speak out now, not Democrats anyway. A minority of the house and senate has spoken out. There are a lot more rank and file Democrats that have spoken out. Politico: Of the 86 percent of likely voters who watched all or part of the debate, just 29 percent said Biden has the mental capacity and physical stamina to serve another four-year term, compared with 61 percent who said he does not. Only 33 percent said he should continue as the Democratic nominee, versus 52 percent who believe he should not. And just half of Democrats said Biden should be the party’s nominee or is mentally and physically fit to serve out another term.
Ok, like I said, put it out there and get it over with. The two candidates in November will not change. They were both elected overwhelmingly by their respective parties. There they are. Vote.
Well, you can quit looking because it ain’t happening. Now what are you doing?
Yup. This place is the new Cult, and will downvote you to death for stating the obvious. All of you people—when Biden gets crushed in November—IT’S YOUR FAULT.
He's got a point...to all those in the party who want him out who do you want as a replacement? The polling shows that they are tied in what was always considered a tight race. If Biden bombs in the next debate then...I don't even want to think about that..
The polling only tells you were the race is headed, and its headed to a landslide loss because we're starting to see safe blue states like New Jerey slip away. Stop listening to the copium. The longer he stays in race the more he's going to hurt down ballot candidates. Also an open convention could turn into an absolute shitshow that could endanger the party for years.
Playing both sides, eh? We have a problem and you pointed out another problem. How about a proposed solution, chief?
Biden steps down, Harris takes over ticket. I thought that was inferred.
I think the point was missed above was that an open convention would include Biden as a contender, whereas what can work is a convention that is definitely working on selecting a different candidate because Biden would have agreed to step down.
None of this matters. Biden is going to go stick it out and the entire campaign will be about him and his fucking age and nothing else. Project 2025, Trump's felonies, none of it will get oxygen. And we'll deserve it.
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Wow, you went from accusing me of being a conservative to ... a KKK member ... for suggesting we run a Black woman as President. And somehow I'm the troll. You can see from my post history I am no concern troll. The candidates have a combined age of 160. A Harris/Whitmer ticket could energize the left, and that's what's missing, energy.
As an independent voting Dem you gotta give up this nonsense. Incumbents get the bump. They aren’t going to make a change. The more you sew discord the worse you make it. Get in line and support the Dem regardless of who it is. You do seem like a concern troll. The black caucus just came out in support of Biden. Case closed.
You do you, but the polls haven't moved since October and Trump is measuring the drapes.
Polls have never been right. Only states that matter are PA, WI, MI, and MN, by the way Florida is in play too due to the dictatorship of Ron and recreational marijuana and Abortion on the ballot. Don’t be fooled by the media hoopla.
Good grief. And if the polls were saying Biden was up the same amount, you’d be saying this thing is in the bag. This is just nonsense.
I don’t see how Harris can challenge him unless he steps down and anoints her. She’d be painted as disloyal, don’t you think? Personally I am impressed with Gavin Newsome. He’s able to respond cogently and with nuance on the fly, unscripted. He has energy to spare. He has charisma. I read something yesterday that Trump camp is leaking they want to face Joe or Kamala and they’re terrified, Trump is terrified, of facing Gavin. Wittmer for VP? I think Josh Shapiro is a fine guy, but I like him in his current position and he doesn’t seem aggressive enough for the crisis we’re in.
I think the party stepping over the Black, female VP for a white man and a white woman would cause an absolute furor in the party- particularly since Black women are such a major part of the Democratic Party.
I wish we could look at candidates for who they are and for the gender and ethnicity boxes they check. As we saw, Harris ran for President in 2020 and quit the race after failing to generate enough support in the primaries. That’s her record as a presidential candidate. Now she’s had a term as VP to build a base, but I don’t see that she’s done much. I do know that VPs don’t get to take the limelight. If it weren’t for her ethnicity, would she be the clear choice? I’d vote for a woman, a black woman, a gay man, and so forth, if the person has what it takes to capture the voter enthusiasm, but she already had a chance to do that and it didn’t happen for her.
I’m not saying that I think the candidate has to be her because she’s a black woman. That’s not at all what I mean. I mean that it would cause an uproar in one of the major, core groups of the Democratic Party. I think it’s fraught with risk to step past her.
Troll talk is.what you spew. Troll label is what I bestow.
Gavin Newsome and Gretchen Wittmer would make me happy.
Gavin Newsome will not get the swing vote, and that’s what will make or break the election.
Yeah, I loathe the electoral college. Living in a blue state, I feel my vote for President has no real meaning and no one cares about earning it.
I like this combination but Biden is neck and neck with Trump and switching him out now? I am not looking forward to the September debate..🤔 I admit that. The Democratic convention will be interesting for sure.
To those saying it’s too late to change. I remember election year 1968. (I was not eligible to vote until 1972, but I was following closely.) LBJ announces he won’t run again on March 31, 1968. RFK immediately becomes frontrunner. RFK is assassinated June 5, 1968. The convention in Chicago was the means of choosing the ticket, not primaries. There was none of the technology for disseminating information and feedback on a broad scale almost instantaneously as we have now. IMO, the Dems lost in 1968 because they put forward a boring middle of the road unpopular guy Hubert Humphrey, IIRC. To a nation with a youth majority that had supported the now murdered RFK. If the Dems had put up a charismatic progressive candidate to counter Nixon we may not have had Nixon. My point though is that this debate wasn’t much later at all than the RFK whammy, so it is only too late to change if the D voters are all calcified and timid. The party pushed the country into a pro forma uncontested primary this year in order to unilaterally back the incumbent. The country didn’t have a real voice this year. If our House and Senate members who WERE Biden supporters have grasped that a change must be made and quickly, good for them for their courage. A party is responsible to create a ticket that will get the down ballot races elected too, so we can have a shot at majorities. These representatives see that Biden’s failure has jeopardized all the races, and he is no longer favored to win against Trump either — and they are doing their job. I applaud them and I’m tired of being told that supporting a new tack is the same as supporting Trump or Putin. That’s just undemocratic to throttle the conversation.
I’m about the same age as you, registered to vote when I was 19 in 1971 when the voting age was lowered to 18. I too followed politics closely in the 60s. I agree that the Dems made a huge mistake nominating HHH, who was pro-war in a divided party, at the 1968 Democratic convention. That’s when the riots broke out in Chicago. After that fiasco, the Parties went to the primary system to nominate the presidential candidates. While the primaries allow the voters instead of party delegates to choose a candidate, the custom of having the incumbent as the sole party candidate on the primary ballot does reduce the efficacy of our votes. I wonder how the primary system would work for president if the incumbent plus other party candidates for president were on the ballot trying for the majority of votes to be the nominee for the party? Would it work using the current individual state primary system or would we have to go to a national primary system, do you think? I may be overthinking this. Lol.
This is a weird phrasing. There is no “announce and challenge”. They are his hand-chosen delegates attending the convention because he ran (mostly) unopposed in the primaries. All of the hypotheticals of the past week were predicated on him voluntarily dropping out, but if he doesn’t want to drop out then nobody can make him.
Biden can release his delegates if he wants, AFAIK. So I wonder if he is serious about the challenge.
“If he wants” was what I was getting at. It doesn’t sound like he’s releasing the delegates which would make a challenge pointless. He just wanted to sound tough on the phone call.
I would actually respect him if he is seriously challenging Democrats. He would prove that he actually cares about Democracy, that he isn't running for selfish reasons, and that is actually confident that he can beat Trump.
ARE YOU SURE JOE? We luv you & what you’ve done. BUT DONT BE LIKE RBG AND F UP YOUR LEGACY!! It’s time to Pass The Torch to Kamala!! YOUNG PEOPLE SEE YOU AS A STUBBORN OLD MAN …AFTER THE DEBATE😞 soory THEY WILL NOT VOTE FOR YOU ! But will vote for a YOUNGER CANDIDATE TO SAVE DEMOCRACY!! Is your EGO MORE IMPORTANT THAN OUR DEMOCRACY? The Joe I know will Say No & STEP DOWN… Based on your life’s work in public service
The Bidens have a family history of being eaten by cannibals. It’s happening again.
What I find halarious(ly depressing), is these two chucklefucks - Joey Scars and Mika - are the ones who helped Trump get into the White House in 2016. How did they do that? By ignoring his faults and bringing him onto their show via telephone and yucking it up. Now they bring Biden on via telephone and largely ignore his glaring faults while feeding him pre-prepared softball questions. Not that it will change anyone’s minds here, but I’m gradually turning from someone who would vote for Biden because I’m being forced to, into someone who may not vote for him at all. I’ll vote down ballot for Dems but I no longer trust Biden and his team to be honest with their voters, nor do I trust Biden can do the job even if I he does somehow regain my trust. And here’s the thing, I’m FAR from the only one who feels this way. Everyone here cheerleading him regardless of what he says and does had better be ready for a devastating loss in November if nothing changes. He’s not lost my vote completely yet, but it’s going to take something big and different from what I’m getting right now. And he doesn’t seem to think people like me matter.
Biden vs Trump. The two best options that US citizens could come up with, in a country with over 300 million people idiots. You send better options to the Olympics.
I’ve changed my mind about Biden! I Was Wrong. Biden has been awesome lately and I am with Joe! Fighting to remain the candidate has ignited a Passion that has been like drinking from the fountain of youth that everyone will continue to see! Great news #1 google search yesterday was Project 2025 followed by Taylor Swift. GOP was hoping we wouldn’t find out
Interesting what George Clooney just said. Here he was throwing a massive fundraiser for Joe, only to be stunned at how much Joe has lost it. He spent a bunch of time with him, not just in formal speeches. There was a fundraising prize recently offered to meet the Bidens, Obama, and George Clooney and Julia Roberts. I assume that has happened now and Clooney felt he had to say something about how Joe is losing it. He’s been a major supporter.
Stephen King just announced that Joe Biden must step aside.
Are they downvoting you or Stephen King? Your post is true.
They’re coping extremely hard.