It was 100% obvious obvious just based on the low sales of Starlink and seeing it used in the Ukraine war for the last couple years.
I mean it's pretty obvious that supporting a network of thousands of satellites is not the simplest possible way to get Internet so you need a lot of subscribers or you need very premium subscribers and even then I'm not sure you're gonna justify like 10,000+ satellites.
I would say, realistically, Elon could already have more starling satellites up there, but they're not really selling so launch rate has probably declined based on reality.
We also have Elon Musk saying that Starling will probably fail without the starship to lower the cost, which is probably a very irresponsible plan because he doesn't really know what the cost of starship will be and lower the cost won't necessarily get sales up much since few consumers have a need.
didn't starlink just surpass two million customers? and 500k of those 2million were added in the last 6 months or so?
i'm no elon fanboy but at least be honest in your critiques of his companies. starlink internet is such a transformational technology
Yeah StarLink alone has more customers than the entirety of the rest of the consumer satellite internet industry. No clue what they meant by "low sales". They're bringing in about $250M/month in revenue. Launches are expensive, but they are a startup, not an established company like Viasat or HughesNet. They've gone from 250,000 to 2,000,000 customers in 18 months, so we'll see where they're at in 2025.
It's all relative. In 2015 SpaceX themselves forecasted 22 Million subscribers in 2022, so they are 20 Million short what they told investors was possible.
It's a tremendous product, I'm glad they made it, but the jury is still out if it's a good business decision.
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/09/spacex-projected-20-million-starlink-users-by-2022-it-ended-up-with-1-million/
Yeah SpaceX has an insane launch cadence, they are on track for a world record breaking 80-90 launches this year. Which will crush the previous records of 61 launches set by SpaceX last year.
> satellite network for military use
Yeah, until Elon decides to turn it off to prevent SpaceX from being “complicit in a major act of war and conflict escalation.”
Meanwhile Linus is like… uh…. It’s just me being stupid, but you could do it too if you know a little code and maybe have a pilot license and some little esoteric knowledge you too can rearrange a kernel for profit.
The country nationalized the entire US railroad system in WWI. It was one of the largest industries of the time. We should have no problem doing it for other industries or entities critical to national defense.
>We should have no problem doing it for other industries or entities critical to national defense.
God forbid we nationalize essential services though, that's communism and that's wrong.
Elon being an asshole, a narcissist, and an idiot? yea defintely.
But Spacex is defintely not something to be disregarded, theyre still the leader in reusable rocket technology and have one of the most reliable rockets currently in use (falcon 9), thats currently the only way the US has to get astronauts into space, as well as one of the most advanced engines ever built (raptor). I doubt that JPL would laugh at them.
My wife is a former JPL scientist. We watched the Perseverance landing on the private channel (essentially the Slack/Teams feed). At successful touchdown one of the mission specialists screamed, "Thank God! I don't have to fuckin' work for SpaceX again!" Cue general laughter.and hooting.
JPL doesn't laugh at SpaceX so much as pity them because they know what an absolute tool of a boss Elon is.
Yeah pretty much anyone who's had to work with SpaceX knows it's a fucking terrible experience. We always joke that we're just working with a bunch of lawyers trying to waive literally everything rather than engineers actually trying to accomplish something.
As much as I despise musk, Shotwells SpaceX is just miles ahead of everyone else.
Whilst ULA is stuck waiting for BE4 to launch a single use rocket, Europe is stuck spending billion on another single use rocket, bezo has yet to reach orbit, a falcon 9 first stage just did 14 successful reuses.
Unfortunately, if you want to be at the cutting edge of rocket science in regards to getting people and equipment into space and have it affordable. SpaceX is the only place to go work. NASA unfortunately has just run into massive over costs and delays with things like the Space Launch System. While SpaceX long term looks like the much better solution to space heavy lift capacity.
I reject the idea that SpaceX is the only source of cutting edge innovation. JPL, Lockheed, Rockwell, Northrop, and Boeing all continue to push boundaries in aeronautic.
I reject that the purpose of space flight can be found in the balance of a spreadsheet. We don't have a space program in order to generate a profit (even though NASA does). We explore space to better understand our universe and to push the boundaries of what is possible. I'm so sick of everything having to have a capitalist angle. So NASA's $6 billion over budget. So what? NASA gets less than half a penny out of every tax dollar. The F-35 project is $200 billion and no one is suggesting we turn the Air Force over the Elon Musk.
I think it turns out the reusable rockets tend to get replaced with more customizable 3-D printed rockets.
NASA has a much better rocket engine in the works posting huge thrust gains.
In fact, Japan already launched one, so realistically rocket ends, are probably all going to get redesigned, because the thrust efficiency on the detonating engines will be the largest boost in efficiency to rockets we've seen for almost ever.
[Rotating Detonation Engine](https://youtu.be/rG_Eh0J_4_s). They successfully [test fired](https://youtu.be/hRgiSHjdet0) a full scale prototype producing [4,000lb thrust](https://www.space.com/nasa-3d-printed-rocket-engine-mars-test-video) back at the end of January and did test fires up to 1 minute long. Next they're moving to an engine with 10,000lb thrust and extending the test burn length.
For a sense of scale, I think Rocket Lab's Rutherford engines are the smallest on an orbital class rocket right now and they produce 5,600lb thrust. SpaceX's Merlin engines on the Falcon 9 each produce about 92,000lb.
>What's the SLS up to now? Lol.
Everything seems to be going pretty well, honestly. Especially when compared to how people like you expected it to be going. Remember how many people said SLS would never fly and that it would be canceled way before Artemis 1. Meanwhile the second SLS is coming together nicely. The first Exploration Upper Stage has begun being built. The third sub-scale BOLE test was recently completed. Core Stage 3 is already well into development. Core Stage 4 is already being worked on. ICPS 2 and 3 are in storage. ESA is already building the sixth service module for Orion. Meanwhile the second Starship got delayed till no earlier than next year because the true "innovators" at SpaceX thought it would be a good idea to ignore 50+ years of understood rocket science like building a proper flame diverter.
That's what I was thinking... fucking around with the government doesn't allow one to hide behind laws and "Wait you can't do that" ... violating contracts has some pretty dire consequences government wise.
Guarantee this premium priced contract with starlink technology lets the government do whatever the fuck they want with the satellites. Not to mention extra encryption and security that they will need in the future when adversaries try to develop technologies to counteract their use.
I very much dislike Elon but you need to understand that the west defense is basically using Ukraine as a real world munitions test site.
It’s pretty obv that includes spacex and Elmo is demonstrated the effectiveness with starlink and without. Unfortunately at the cost of Ukrainian lives…
Grimy AF, but the US was watching, as is the rest of the world, and now they all know how much of an advantage it is… it sucks, but thats the truth
Pretty sure that was his way of flexing that starlink was an essential backbone for the modern military and the US government should buy a premium version of it if they want full control of its use.
And it looks like it worked.
Don't think Elon that smart. Elon was requested to explain after the media blew this up. And I can tell you from videos of Elon leaving that day. He was not happy. I'm sure the goverment was just "helping" Elon come to his senses. Notice the nonstop Crimea strikes now. Elon has been put in his place.
He could only get away with doing it in Ukraine or another small country, he'd be fucked if he tried that with the US military. I'd be more concerned with his company being lax on security and compromising data in other ways.
Yeah, fuck Elon for obeying US law. He should have broken international sanctions the moment a random Ukrainian general asked him, instead of waiting for presidential/Pentagon approval to turn on a US based system in Russian occupied territory it's explicitly illegal to provide services to. This lack of spontaneous action with a donated system action has something to do with providing the US military something on a direct and iron-clad contract.
> Yeah, until Elon decides to turn it off to prevent SpaceX from being “complicit in a major act of war and conflict escalation.”
That is what contracts are for.
The US military will have a contract with spaceX saying what they can and can't do with starshield.
If spacex breaches the contract by cutting off the service, the military can sue for breach of contract.
Ukraine didn't have a contract.
Tell Elon he's very close to facing criminal charges for the deaths of servicemen, asides from the regular "we'll seize all of your technology & assets" part of the noncompliance process
Yeah, the US is just awesome at punishing billionaires who endanger National security and public safety.
In the meantime, have we recovered all of those national secrets Trump stole, or the ones Kushner illegally sold to the Saudis? Has anyone checked to see if Milley is ok after Trump asked his legion of idiots to execute him? I assume Trump is in custody, right?
Muskie: that’s right Mr. president, I will not activate your defense network to stop those missiles unless you pay me
*puts pinky at lip*
**ONE BILLION DOLLARS!**
Star link is seperate from Star Shield. If Elon plays fuck-fuck games with the DoD regarding this? It's over for him. DoD using private contractors isn't anything new either.
It is just a tech contract. They will basically develop a more "military appropriate" terminal to be sold to the branches that will use the already existing and future starlink LEO satellites.
Since the US military is ALREADY using starlinks as commercial solutions, this would just make it a big picture budget line item. Musk will have little to do with it other than continue to cash his check.
> hey will basically develop a more "military appropriate" terminal to be sold to the branches that will use the already existing and future starlink LEO satellites.
Starshield satellites are actually different from the consumer/commercial Starlink satellites already on orbit. They leverage the same technology (with some improvements like enhanced cryptography) and they have additional capabilities that regular Starlink satellites don't (Hosted payloads being one example).
Elon has only received over $3 Billion from China and Putin was just being nice when he was praising SpaceX less than two weeks ago. This seems like a great deal :)
NASA should've always been the one to get funding to do it. It costs all the same funding these billionaires for SpaceX and Blue Origin, but the only difference is that the technology is privately owned.
Yes, part of how they got funding in the first place was promising those construction jobs in various states. The designs are owned by NASA though, like the SLS _made by_ Northrop Grumman.
The government is the only reason SpaceX exists, but the difference is that now it's all privately owned. Publicly funded, privately owned. Fuck that in every way, whether it be the Republicans' plans to privatize social security or handing over the nation's access to space to a narcissistic man-child.
Ah yes, NASA...
the one who's spent the past two decades building the SLS, the suposed largest rocket currently in use and which costs billions of dollars per rocket using parts from the 80s...
Quickly being dwarfed by SpaceX who's trailed and errored their Starship program into existance in 3 years, with a fraction of the budget and with a capacity 400 tons heavier than the SLS.
Relying on NASA would set us back decades in space exploration.
> the suposed largest rocket currently in use
Just to be clear, it _is_ the largest rocket in terms of range and carrying capacity in existence.
> Quickly being dwarfed by SpaceX who's trailed and errored their Starship program
Lol maybe wait for Starship to not explode before using it as a successful example of billionaire worship. SLS's first mission to the moon was a complete success. Starship is on attempt #9. Yes yes I know, failure is success in Musk fanboy world.
> a fraction of the budget
The SLS program was 11.8B (not including Orion), whereas Starship is estimated 5-10B (according to Musk, so take with a grain of salt). I don't think "a fraction" is a good descriptor here.
> Relying on NASA would set us back decades in space exploration.
_Defunding_ NASA set us back, who now has to forgo technology ownership in lieu of hoping some egomaniac can do it right for slightly cheaper. What a horrible tradeoff.
> The SLS program was 11.8B (not including Orion), whereas Starship is estimated 5-10B (according to Musk, so take with a grain of salt). I don't think "a fraction" is a good descriptor here.
Cap. Where's your source for these figures? I work in industry and the minimum budgitary cost is 2 Billion PER SLS launch, and the SpaceX Starship is fractional, with development costs only being 5 Billion in total thus far, with an anticipated launch cost of 40 million a piece.
> Lol maybe wait for Starship to not explode before using it as a successful example of billionaire worship
Get off your high horse, you pedantic redditor.
[GAO report](https://www.gao.gov/assets/gao-23-105609.pdf):
> Since 2011, NASA has spent $11.8 billion to develop the initial SLS capability.
A lot of the higher estimates you see include other stuff like the Orion capsule.
[Elon Musk](https://qz.com/how-much-more-money-can-spacex-spend-on-starship-1850395274#:~:text=Musk%20has%20said%20that%20Starship,will%20be%20about%20%2410%20billion.):
> Musk has said that Starship will cost the company between $5 billion and $10 billion to develop
NASA'S MANAGEMENT OF THE ARTEMIS MISSIONS.
"SLS/Orion Production and Operating Costs Will Average Over $4 Billion Per Launch [...] We project the cost to fly a single SLS/Orion system through at least Artemis IV to be $4.1 billion per launch at a cadence of approximately one mission per year. Building and launching one Orion capsule costs approximately $1 billion, with an additional $300 million for the Service Module supplied by the ESA [...] In addition, we estimate the single-use SLS will cost $2.2 billion to produce, including two rocket stages, two solid rocket boosters, four RS-25 engines, and two stage adapters. "
Office of Inspector General (United States). NASA.numbered page 23, PDF page 29.
As per your second link; https://www.wsj.com/articles/elon-musk-expects-spacex-to-spend-around-2-billion-on-starship-rocket-this-year-31f768fb
Elon's spent only 5 Billion on the development of 10 bllion budget, for which 3 Billion is dedicated to the fabrication and population of the Starbase factory/town.
Which then if we take the 2 Bil that was actually used to develop Starship thus far, it includes 15 prototypes (8 of 16 have survived) as well as two stacked ships for a total of 18, means that each prototype has been roughly worth 120 mil plus or minus.
So right now we have 2-4 Billion dollar single launch asset, or we have a prototype asset which has gone through nearly 20 iterations for the same price.
NASA’s last attempt to go to space resulted in an unsafe and expensive program that wasted huge amounts of money and resources as well as the deaths of 14 astronauts and nationwide trauma.
He already is. He’s been a trusted partner of the DoD and NASA for a decade.
It’s very likely the DoD doesn’t agree with your assessment at all, and maybe even agrees with his actions in the Ukraine incident.
Yep, it’s one thing for SpaceX to be a bit conservative with the help they give Ukraine (which as far as I’m aware doesn’t pay for Starlink). It would be another thing entirely for SpaceX to betray their sugar daddy the DoD.
Where does it say in this article that Elon specifically asked his team to save sex tapes as the accuser claims?
The closest it ever gets to mentioning his personal involvement in this is that a picture of a movie car he owns was shared around, and even that is just 'Reuters isn't aware if Elon knows about this or not'.
Isn’t it much more likely that the DoD disagrees with your assessment?
EDIT: LOL at the downvotes with no replies. I wonder if that indicates something…
I would be more willing to bet that this is going to come with more conditions and DoD control than before.
A useful tool is even more useful when you know it has a microphone straight to the opposition built into it.
Schrödinger's welfare. Redditors think getting paid a fair value for your work is extremely important for artists, service workers, and union members but extremely bad when the government buys goods and services.
Plenty of criticism to go around with government handing staggering amounts of money to corporations and with Elon Musk in general, but launching a military-controlled LEO satellite constellation under a short term contract that no other company or government entity is capable of deploying for 70 million is hardly a great example.
Agree. There's ample criticism for the rampant waste and fraud associated with government contracts with corporations. Musk is a self-promoting narcissist who has been successful at obtaining investor money based primarily in his antics and unrealistic promises. With that all said, our government has had contracts with satellite system providers similar to SpaceEx, which cost way more and offered way less. We hardly have any knowledge what they will use Starshield for (it's all being kept secret), it appears to be in combination with over a dozen other companies and the odds of it being "controlled" by SpaceEx is slim to none. I have way more issues with SpaceEx basically owning a corporate town and their intent to dump toxic materials in the Gulf.
What’s funny to me is that I have extremely strong anti musk sentiments. What drives me bananas is when people let their negative opinions about a person interpret literally everything the person is directly or indirectly involved with as negative - often undermining their own arguments in the process.
Don’t like the government giving corporate welfare to rich people? Because I dislike THIS rich person in particular, let’s give 5x as much to this other rich guy to get half as much done in 4x the time!
Why is it that people seem to think that the government paying a company to do something and for a service is welfare when it’s SpaceX, but not when it’s any other country.
Was it welfare to Russia when the US was paying Russia to launch all of the astronauts to the space station? SoaceX is the single reason that the US isn’t currently beholden to the Kremlin for access to the ISS.
They are paid money to provide a service on a fixed cost contract. The welfare queens are ULA and Boeing who got waaaaaay more money and still haven’t even taken a single person to orbit from their contract, while spaceX has completed theirs and started on another one already.
And Starliner is grounded again with issues.
Do you know how government contracts actually work? Let me break it down for you into extremelyyyyy simple terms since that’s probably all you can understand.
Government needs X product/service. Government puts out a contract expressing this need. Private companies bid on this contract.
Company Y offers the best price for fulfilling this contract and the government’s need of X product/service. Government awards contract to Company Y.
This really isn’t difficult to grasp, but instead you chose to just regurgite some edgy line you read somewhere online, fueled in part by your hatred of some CEO
He shut down Starlink during an Ukrainian offensive against Russia. The US is allies with Ukraine. Not only that but his excuse of not wanting to be part of an act of war is moot since his action directly helps Russia , which is the aggressor here and is still killing civilians every day. He has clearly picked a side.
The US hasn't sent troops to fight in Ukraine. That directly helps Russia. Clearly, the US has picked a side and is a Russian ally.
Same logic. Except Starlink isn't even military at all so there's even less reason for them to get directly involved in conflict.
> The US hasn't sent troops to fight in Ukraine. That directly helps Russia. Clearly, the US has picked a side and is a Russian ally.
>
>
Or as someone else wisely put it in another thread discussing this article, "By your logic, if we don't give working nuclear weapons to Ukraine, we are helping Russia".
Don't you think the Pentagon reviewed that incident before this contract? StarLink had a justification for why they shut that down. If you want to believe it's because Elon loves Russia and wants to protect them, then go off, but why would he put Starlink over there in the first place if he wanted Russia to succeed
His politics sucks and he’s weird but let’s use logical thinking here
I think that the Pentagon would review it and demand that they would have total control over Starshield to prevent that kind of situation.
Logic only works if everybody involved is logical. Elon is a weirdo who is trying to control information through Twitter/X at the World level and who has private phone calls with Putin (who called him an outstanding person). Who knows why he had Starlink there just to disable it when Ukraine needed it. All I know is this is not the action of someone siding with Ukraine in this invasion.
Yeah, I figure the entire reason Starshield exists and not just Starlink is to put control in the government's hands. They want the SpaceX tech and they don't mind paying him. But they won't hand him the keys to what they bought.
No… Ukraine asked him to turn Starlink on for that offensive attack in the middle of the night. It wasn’t on in that area because it sanctioned by the US Government.
No private citizen should be making the call if one country attacks another.
Imagine if Musk said, “sure thing Ukraine!” And then Putin fired a few nukes and killed a million people in retaliation… you’d be saying Musk should be hung for treason.
These decisions should NOT be made by a private citizen.
Good news is Starshield will be in control by the government, not SpaceX or Musk.
This is the dumbest comment section I have ever seen. You do know that Musk is not an engineer and won't be designing anything for this, right? And that the government will review the design and approve it? And then be the operators, only calling in SpaceX when necessary?
I know not everyone is an aerospace engineer at a defense contractor who designs satellites for the military like I am, but you should be able to at least use your brains to think for four seconds before commenting.
It's the most logical choice. They've already established a working platform and relationship with the military. The US government loves sticking with operations they know.
It is just a tech contract. They will basically develop a more "military appropriate" terminal to be sold to the branches that will use the already existing and future starlink LEO satellites.
Since the US military is ALREADY using starlinks as commercial solutions, this would just make it a big picture budget line item. Musk will have little to do with it other than continue to cash his check.
If civilian starlink was turned on in Crimea - which it never was by the way - for use in direct guided drone attacks into Russian controlled territory, it would have violated international laws and US laws and the entire thing would likely have to be shut down ENTIRELY for violating ITAR.
This wasn’t Musk - who I agree is an ass - doing something. It was a company following the law. And according to even the more recent scathing news articles that reporting on this, near the bottom, if you bothered to read more than the headline, it was apparently an order from Biden’s administration that they, as US satellite and rocket company, which need to abide by certain specific rules, were not permitted to turn it on in Russian territory to be used as an active offensive military weapon.
To the people saying nationalise - if it is nationalised, then it’s not a company even providing a service. It’s the US government providing a military service to Ukraine. Which could be a direct military escalation. If nationalised, it would potentially not be allowed to be used in *any* part of Ukraine.
Know who would like outrage and for it to be nationalised, and might try to get people to be outraged to get this to happen? RUSSIA. and their online misinformation teams.
He's constantly amplifying literal nazi rhetoric including antisemitism on his platform.
And I don't mean he just allows it to exist, he seeks it out, and responds to it so the algo he modified to prioritize his shit pushes it to the top of everyone's feed.
SpaceX had been an integral part of Space Force and the Air Force before them for a decade launching top secret payloads to orbit.
NASA trusts them to launch their astronauts to the ISS. They trust them to land astronauts on the moon for the first time since Apollo.
The odds are your interpretation of the situation is just way off.
This thread is hilarious to read. "Elon Musk bad so SpaceX bad!"
Do people think Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, Booz-Allen Hamilton, etc. are all run by kind people? They're all run by narcissistic douches, just Elon Musk is the only one who loves the spotlight. Him running SpaceX is probably the best thing for the company. Since they're not under shareholder control, they move at a much faster pace but also much more volatile manner. Throwing away money at projects like they've worked on with little historical evidence for success is what drives innovation. They might not be the best option forever but right now they're the best at their niche.
Didn't elon turn off internet in Ukraine randomly during the war? How can a company he's involved with be trusted for military usage since he's obviously compromised?
The tldr of that was, Ukraine was using Starlink, a civilian system donated for humanitarian reasons, as a direct guidance component in their drones, something which could get Starlink into problems with ITAR (by classifying it as an arms export). So Starlink had been disabled outside of ukrainian controlled territory, and when Ukraine asked for it to be turned on to attack the russian port, Starlink refused.They werent under contract at the time, so would have had zero obligation to stick their necks out for a potential ITAR violation.
Because he warned up front he wouldnt use it to support attacks? And the US can always make sure they have full authority over the project, to avoid unwanted actions.
They are so busy hating on Musk but forgot Space X has been getting these contract because their competition can't compete with them right now on both on efficient and price. Blue Origins has got a contract from the Pentagon and still isn't launching anything.
And I don't like Musk but Boeing and Lockheed Martin CEO aren't that much better.
Elon can't become President, but he can control a hell of a lot of our government and military.
[Ronan Farrow on Elon Musk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXfzU6tS-b4)
I’ve never seen so much hatred for a man that has had a net positive effect on our world. what he’s done for online banking/electric cars / space flight / and internet access for everyone on earth is enough to overlook what he says on twitter. Everyone is free to criticize him but I’m still rooting for him to continue to push our technology as a species.
So the company that has been deploying a net of satellites on the promise of fast, low-cost internet for rural residents has now won a defense contract?
wHo CoUlD hAvE sEeN tHiS cOmInG?
The key was that using the civilian version as part of a weapon (like ukraine did) could've made all the terminals they normally sell fall under ITAR regulations, but having a military version under contract (the important bit) to the US government wouldnt cause that issue.
Guy's a cunt, but he does seem genuinely concerned about the civilian/corporate version of Star link being used in Ukraine, as that essentially makes it a viable military target in Russia's eyes. Star Shield is the military version, and AFAIK only the US government has access to it
Either the pentagon is fucking nuts or they got an unimaginably solid guarantee that they can control the world's biggest manchild
no, no they are nuts
This comment section so perfectly exemplifies the average redditor. People with total ignorance on a subject commenting and providing their opinion on it 😂
I’m against this. We’ve clearly seen the shortcomings of utilizing commercial internet resources already with Ukraine. Additionally, haven’t we learned the vulnerability of lean manufacturing and corporate cost cutting after COVID and our (necessary) investment in critical manufacturing infrastructure that’s been offshored through cost cutting measures?
This is not a commercial internet resource. Made strictly for government use. No different than any other government satellite constellation. A commercial contractor develops the system, and then the government takes over command and control.
If only we could have seen this coming..... https://www.cnbc.com/2022/12/05/spacex-unveils-starshield-a-military-variation-of-starlink-satellites.html
It was 100% obvious obvious just based on the low sales of Starlink and seeing it used in the Ukraine war for the last couple years. I mean it's pretty obvious that supporting a network of thousands of satellites is not the simplest possible way to get Internet so you need a lot of subscribers or you need very premium subscribers and even then I'm not sure you're gonna justify like 10,000+ satellites. I would say, realistically, Elon could already have more starling satellites up there, but they're not really selling so launch rate has probably declined based on reality. We also have Elon Musk saying that Starling will probably fail without the starship to lower the cost, which is probably a very irresponsible plan because he doesn't really know what the cost of starship will be and lower the cost won't necessarily get sales up much since few consumers have a need.
didn't starlink just surpass two million customers? and 500k of those 2million were added in the last 6 months or so? i'm no elon fanboy but at least be honest in your critiques of his companies. starlink internet is such a transformational technology
Yeah StarLink alone has more customers than the entirety of the rest of the consumer satellite internet industry. No clue what they meant by "low sales". They're bringing in about $250M/month in revenue. Launches are expensive, but they are a startup, not an established company like Viasat or HughesNet. They've gone from 250,000 to 2,000,000 customers in 18 months, so we'll see where they're at in 2025.
They're also already turning a profit
It's all relative. In 2015 SpaceX themselves forecasted 22 Million subscribers in 2022, so they are 20 Million short what they told investors was possible. It's a tremendous product, I'm glad they made it, but the jury is still out if it's a good business decision. https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/09/spacex-projected-20-million-starlink-users-by-2022-it-ended-up-with-1-million/
Lol launch rate this year is the highest it has ever been - they're launching almost every 2 weeks, if not more.
They are launching twice per week, not once every 2 weeks.
Yeah SpaceX has an insane launch cadence, they are on track for a world record breaking 80-90 launches this year. Which will crush the previous records of 61 launches set by SpaceX last year.
SpaceX to literally anyone on the globe: "Do you even launch bro?"
Yeah... This won't turn out horribly. No chance of that at all.
> satellite network for military use Yeah, until Elon decides to turn it off to prevent SpaceX from being “complicit in a major act of war and conflict escalation.”
Well, then I guess that taxpayers will be acquiring a new space toy for free then.
Just imagining SpaceX nationalized and given to NASA for Christmas cracks me up.
You guys joke but it's happened before that's how NASA got the TDRS technology from TRW.
And how bell labs ended up giving us most devices used today…
Poor Abe. He had a good thing going at Bell Labs.
Meanwhile Linus is like… uh…. It’s just me being stupid, but you could do it too if you know a little code and maybe have a pilot license and some little esoteric knowledge you too can rearrange a kernel for profit.
The country nationalized the entire US railroad system in WWI. It was one of the largest industries of the time. We should have no problem doing it for other industries or entities critical to national defense.
>We should have no problem doing it for other industries or entities critical to national defense. God forbid we nationalize essential services though, that's communism and that's wrong.
Not if it’s for the military, then it’s freedom. *taps helmet with handgun*
Like internet.
Yeah well the internet is Authoritarian Communism.
We can only hope so.
Keep going…
NASA doesn't want SpaceX. Everyone at JPL shit talks SpaceX all the time. They think of Elon as just a useful idiot to make things go up.
Elon being an asshole, a narcissist, and an idiot? yea defintely. But Spacex is defintely not something to be disregarded, theyre still the leader in reusable rocket technology and have one of the most reliable rockets currently in use (falcon 9), thats currently the only way the US has to get astronauts into space, as well as one of the most advanced engines ever built (raptor). I doubt that JPL would laugh at them.
My wife is a former JPL scientist. We watched the Perseverance landing on the private channel (essentially the Slack/Teams feed). At successful touchdown one of the mission specialists screamed, "Thank God! I don't have to fuckin' work for SpaceX again!" Cue general laughter.and hooting. JPL doesn't laugh at SpaceX so much as pity them because they know what an absolute tool of a boss Elon is.
Yeah pretty much anyone who's had to work with SpaceX knows it's a fucking terrible experience. We always joke that we're just working with a bunch of lawyers trying to waive literally everything rather than engineers actually trying to accomplish something.
As much as I despise musk, Shotwells SpaceX is just miles ahead of everyone else. Whilst ULA is stuck waiting for BE4 to launch a single use rocket, Europe is stuck spending billion on another single use rocket, bezo has yet to reach orbit, a falcon 9 first stage just did 14 successful reuses.
You just explained 50% of my experience as an engineer.
Unfortunately, if you want to be at the cutting edge of rocket science in regards to getting people and equipment into space and have it affordable. SpaceX is the only place to go work. NASA unfortunately has just run into massive over costs and delays with things like the Space Launch System. While SpaceX long term looks like the much better solution to space heavy lift capacity.
I reject the idea that SpaceX is the only source of cutting edge innovation. JPL, Lockheed, Rockwell, Northrop, and Boeing all continue to push boundaries in aeronautic. I reject that the purpose of space flight can be found in the balance of a spreadsheet. We don't have a space program in order to generate a profit (even though NASA does). We explore space to better understand our universe and to push the boundaries of what is possible. I'm so sick of everything having to have a capitalist angle. So NASA's $6 billion over budget. So what? NASA gets less than half a penny out of every tax dollar. The F-35 project is $200 billion and no one is suggesting we turn the Air Force over the Elon Musk.
I think it turns out the reusable rockets tend to get replaced with more customizable 3-D printed rockets. NASA has a much better rocket engine in the works posting huge thrust gains. In fact, Japan already launched one, so realistically rocket ends, are probably all going to get redesigned, because the thrust efficiency on the detonating engines will be the largest boost in efficiency to rockets we've seen for almost ever.
>NASA has a much better rocket engine in the works posting huge thrust gains. What rocket engine?
[Rotating Detonation Engine](https://youtu.be/rG_Eh0J_4_s). They successfully [test fired](https://youtu.be/hRgiSHjdet0) a full scale prototype producing [4,000lb thrust](https://www.space.com/nasa-3d-printed-rocket-engine-mars-test-video) back at the end of January and did test fires up to 1 minute long. Next they're moving to an engine with 10,000lb thrust and extending the test burn length. For a sense of scale, I think Rocket Lab's Rutherford engines are the smallest on an orbital class rocket right now and they produce 5,600lb thrust. SpaceX's Merlin engines on the Falcon 9 each produce about 92,000lb.
RDE is really not game changing.
The two things are not incompatible. Reusing rockets doesn't mean you can't put more efficient engines on them.
He said that. He said rocket ends.
What are you, a rocket surgeon or something?
For it to work the rocket needs a redesign - the top needs to be more pointy, not round
Any chance you can share a link to an overview of the new engine design? Would love to learn more.
Reusing the rocket is still a whole lot cheaper than using it once and throwing it in the ocean no matter what engines are on it.
They aren't wrong.
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>What's the SLS up to now? Lol. Everything seems to be going pretty well, honestly. Especially when compared to how people like you expected it to be going. Remember how many people said SLS would never fly and that it would be canceled way before Artemis 1. Meanwhile the second SLS is coming together nicely. The first Exploration Upper Stage has begun being built. The third sub-scale BOLE test was recently completed. Core Stage 3 is already well into development. Core Stage 4 is already being worked on. ICPS 2 and 3 are in storage. ESA is already building the sixth service module for Orion. Meanwhile the second Starship got delayed till no earlier than next year because the true "innovators" at SpaceX thought it would be a good idea to ignore 50+ years of understood rocket science like building a proper flame diverter.
https://arstechnica.com/space/2023/09/nasa-finally-admits-what-everyone-already-knows-sls-is-unaffordable/ lol?
Well, at least the SLS didn't explode like Starship. Stop licking Elon's boots, he's never going to care about you.
Wow. “Incompetent”?! Wtf is Elmo doing these days? Solid business work? He is a jackass, and so are all of his supporters.
That's what I was thinking... fucking around with the government doesn't allow one to hide behind laws and "Wait you can't do that" ... violating contracts has some pretty dire consequences government wise.
Guarantee this premium priced contract with starlink technology lets the government do whatever the fuck they want with the satellites. Not to mention extra encryption and security that they will need in the future when adversaries try to develop technologies to counteract their use.
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I'm sure the Pentagon is going to roll over and accept that /s
Thats when he'll FAFO, can't fuck around with military contracts
I very much dislike Elon but you need to understand that the west defense is basically using Ukraine as a real world munitions test site. It’s pretty obv that includes spacex and Elmo is demonstrated the effectiveness with starlink and without. Unfortunately at the cost of Ukrainian lives… Grimy AF, but the US was watching, as is the rest of the world, and now they all know how much of an advantage it is… it sucks, but thats the truth
Pretty sure that was his way of flexing that starlink was an essential backbone for the modern military and the US government should buy a premium version of it if they want full control of its use. And it looks like it worked.
Don't think Elon that smart. Elon was requested to explain after the media blew this up. And I can tell you from videos of Elon leaving that day. He was not happy. I'm sure the goverment was just "helping" Elon come to his senses. Notice the nonstop Crimea strikes now. Elon has been put in his place.
More like accidently creating demand by being neutral. Branagin was on to something about those neutral fellows after all.
I'm going to assume this is in the legal contracts somewhere. Hopefully someone thought about it after Ukraine.
I hope the government has drawn up some plans on how to seize SpaceX under Eminent Domain laws. You know, for a rainy day...
It's basically boilerplate in our contacts. Here's the nice version. https://www.bis.doc.gov/index.php/other-areas/strategic-industries-and-economic-security-sies/defense-priorities-a-allocations-system-program-dpas
He could only get away with doing it in Ukraine or another small country, he'd be fucked if he tried that with the US military. I'd be more concerned with his company being lax on security and compromising data in other ways.
DOD’s legal department must be sweating rn
Yeah, fuck Elon for obeying US law. He should have broken international sanctions the moment a random Ukrainian general asked him, instead of waiting for presidential/Pentagon approval to turn on a US based system in Russian occupied territory it's explicitly illegal to provide services to. This lack of spontaneous action with a donated system action has something to do with providing the US military something on a direct and iron-clad contract.
> Yeah, until Elon decides to turn it off to prevent SpaceX from being “complicit in a major act of war and conflict escalation.” That is what contracts are for. The US military will have a contract with spaceX saying what they can and can't do with starshield. If spacex breaches the contract by cutting off the service, the military can sue for breach of contract. Ukraine didn't have a contract.
Suing is an action after the fact, but what does the military do the moment the system gets shut down and they can no longer rely on it?
Tell Elon he's very close to facing criminal charges for the deaths of servicemen, asides from the regular "we'll seize all of your technology & assets" part of the noncompliance process
"Of course I have a back door to turn it off at my whim based on whichever dictator needs me to do so at specific times."
Unless he puts in a back door the military will have control of the satellites and will be running them not Musk or space X.
Hopefully there's a clause they can just call in an air strike on musk if he screws with it
Yeah, the US is just awesome at punishing billionaires who endanger National security and public safety. In the meantime, have we recovered all of those national secrets Trump stole, or the ones Kushner illegally sold to the Saudis? Has anyone checked to see if Milley is ok after Trump asked his legion of idiots to execute him? I assume Trump is in custody, right?
Was Elon in a contract with Ukraine?
Muskie: that’s right Mr. president, I will not activate your defense network to stop those missiles unless you pay me *puts pinky at lip* **ONE BILLION DOLLARS!**
You mean until Putin decides? What reason would Elon have to act without permission from his taskmaster?
do you honestly think if putin was his "taskmaster" spacex would be helping ukraine with starlink for the past year and a half?
Star link is seperate from Star Shield. If Elon plays fuck-fuck games with the DoD regarding this? It's over for him. DoD using private contractors isn't anything new either.
It is just a tech contract. They will basically develop a more "military appropriate" terminal to be sold to the branches that will use the already existing and future starlink LEO satellites. Since the US military is ALREADY using starlinks as commercial solutions, this would just make it a big picture budget line item. Musk will have little to do with it other than continue to cash his check.
> hey will basically develop a more "military appropriate" terminal to be sold to the branches that will use the already existing and future starlink LEO satellites. Starshield satellites are actually different from the consumer/commercial Starlink satellites already on orbit. They leverage the same technology (with some improvements like enhanced cryptography) and they have additional capabilities that regular Starlink satellites don't (Hosted payloads being one example).
Well, the good news now is that if he fucks around with the Pentagon, Elon is going to jail for a really long time.
Right? Elon is many things, but foremost (maybe) he's a government teat sucker.
It just gets turned off when Russia requests
Elon has only received over $3 Billion from China and Putin was just being nice when he was praising SpaceX less than two weeks ago. This seems like a great deal :)
I wonder if you’ll change your view when SpaceX doesn’t breach the contract or betray the DoD in any way? 🤔 Nah, nothing will change that!
Give the budding Super Villan, A doomsday weapon.
Elon Musk should not be trusted with undertaking any task involved with American National Security.
Idk what your talking about he’s the most trusted South African National /s
So we should be depending on Russia as our sole human rated launch provider? Boeing certainly can't do it.
NASA should've always been the one to get funding to do it. It costs all the same funding these billionaires for SpaceX and Blue Origin, but the only difference is that the technology is privately owned.
You realize NASA doesn't build rockets, right? They've always contracted out construction.
Yes, part of how they got funding in the first place was promising those construction jobs in various states. The designs are owned by NASA though, like the SLS _made by_ Northrop Grumman. The government is the only reason SpaceX exists, but the difference is that now it's all privately owned. Publicly funded, privately owned. Fuck that in every way, whether it be the Republicans' plans to privatize social security or handing over the nation's access to space to a narcissistic man-child.
Ah yes, NASA... the one who's spent the past two decades building the SLS, the suposed largest rocket currently in use and which costs billions of dollars per rocket using parts from the 80s... Quickly being dwarfed by SpaceX who's trailed and errored their Starship program into existance in 3 years, with a fraction of the budget and with a capacity 400 tons heavier than the SLS. Relying on NASA would set us back decades in space exploration.
> the suposed largest rocket currently in use Just to be clear, it _is_ the largest rocket in terms of range and carrying capacity in existence. > Quickly being dwarfed by SpaceX who's trailed and errored their Starship program Lol maybe wait for Starship to not explode before using it as a successful example of billionaire worship. SLS's first mission to the moon was a complete success. Starship is on attempt #9. Yes yes I know, failure is success in Musk fanboy world. > a fraction of the budget The SLS program was 11.8B (not including Orion), whereas Starship is estimated 5-10B (according to Musk, so take with a grain of salt). I don't think "a fraction" is a good descriptor here. > Relying on NASA would set us back decades in space exploration. _Defunding_ NASA set us back, who now has to forgo technology ownership in lieu of hoping some egomaniac can do it right for slightly cheaper. What a horrible tradeoff.
> The SLS program was 11.8B (not including Orion), whereas Starship is estimated 5-10B (according to Musk, so take with a grain of salt). I don't think "a fraction" is a good descriptor here. Cap. Where's your source for these figures? I work in industry and the minimum budgitary cost is 2 Billion PER SLS launch, and the SpaceX Starship is fractional, with development costs only being 5 Billion in total thus far, with an anticipated launch cost of 40 million a piece. > Lol maybe wait for Starship to not explode before using it as a successful example of billionaire worship Get off your high horse, you pedantic redditor.
[GAO report](https://www.gao.gov/assets/gao-23-105609.pdf): > Since 2011, NASA has spent $11.8 billion to develop the initial SLS capability. A lot of the higher estimates you see include other stuff like the Orion capsule. [Elon Musk](https://qz.com/how-much-more-money-can-spacex-spend-on-starship-1850395274#:~:text=Musk%20has%20said%20that%20Starship,will%20be%20about%20%2410%20billion.): > Musk has said that Starship will cost the company between $5 billion and $10 billion to develop
NASA'S MANAGEMENT OF THE ARTEMIS MISSIONS. "SLS/Orion Production and Operating Costs Will Average Over $4 Billion Per Launch [...] We project the cost to fly a single SLS/Orion system through at least Artemis IV to be $4.1 billion per launch at a cadence of approximately one mission per year. Building and launching one Orion capsule costs approximately $1 billion, with an additional $300 million for the Service Module supplied by the ESA [...] In addition, we estimate the single-use SLS will cost $2.2 billion to produce, including two rocket stages, two solid rocket boosters, four RS-25 engines, and two stage adapters. " Office of Inspector General (United States). NASA.numbered page 23, PDF page 29. As per your second link; https://www.wsj.com/articles/elon-musk-expects-spacex-to-spend-around-2-billion-on-starship-rocket-this-year-31f768fb Elon's spent only 5 Billion on the development of 10 bllion budget, for which 3 Billion is dedicated to the fabrication and population of the Starbase factory/town. Which then if we take the 2 Bil that was actually used to develop Starship thus far, it includes 15 prototypes (8 of 16 have survived) as well as two stacked ships for a total of 18, means that each prototype has been roughly worth 120 mil plus or minus. So right now we have 2-4 Billion dollar single launch asset, or we have a prototype asset which has gone through nearly 20 iterations for the same price.
NASA’s last attempt to go to space resulted in an unsafe and expensive program that wasted huge amounts of money and resources as well as the deaths of 14 astronauts and nationwide trauma.
He already is. He’s been a trusted partner of the DoD and NASA for a decade. It’s very likely the DoD doesn’t agree with your assessment at all, and maybe even agrees with his actions in the Ukraine incident.
Yep, it’s one thing for SpaceX to be a bit conservative with the help they give Ukraine (which as far as I’m aware doesn’t pay for Starlink). It would be another thing entirely for SpaceX to betray their sugar daddy the DoD.
You mean the same guy who has his team save sex tapes from Tesla cameras??
He what now? My opinion on the guy is about as low as it can get, but I hadn’t heard this one before. Got a source I can read?
https://www.reuters.com/technology/tesla-workers-shared-sensitive-images-recorded-by-customer-cars-2023-04-06/
Where does it say in this article that Elon specifically asked his team to save sex tapes as the accuser claims? The closest it ever gets to mentioning his personal involvement in this is that a picture of a movie car he owns was shared around, and even that is just 'Reuters isn't aware if Elon knows about this or not'.
"no, no, see, it's blurred, and it only gets shared within that one office, so it's fine" - something I've actually seen a Tesla fanboy say
Dude is in league with Russia. Is this really a good idea?
Half of Congress is in league with Russia. Is this really a surprise?
Just America things
You think the Department of Defense would be giving SpaceX these contracts if they thought Musk was collaborating with Russia to undermine the US?
The DoD will own and operate these so Dude won’t have control over it.
Isn’t it much more likely that the DoD disagrees with your assessment? EDIT: LOL at the downvotes with no replies. I wonder if that indicates something…
I would be more willing to bet that this is going to come with more conditions and DoD control than before. A useful tool is even more useful when you know it has a microphone straight to the opposition built into it.
Welfare billionaire is given more public assistance.
I mean, is providing a product and/or service for payment considered welfare?
Schrödinger's welfare. Redditors think getting paid a fair value for your work is extremely important for artists, service workers, and union members but extremely bad when the government buys goods and services.
Plenty of criticism to go around with government handing staggering amounts of money to corporations and with Elon Musk in general, but launching a military-controlled LEO satellite constellation under a short term contract that no other company or government entity is capable of deploying for 70 million is hardly a great example.
Agree. There's ample criticism for the rampant waste and fraud associated with government contracts with corporations. Musk is a self-promoting narcissist who has been successful at obtaining investor money based primarily in his antics and unrealistic promises. With that all said, our government has had contracts with satellite system providers similar to SpaceEx, which cost way more and offered way less. We hardly have any knowledge what they will use Starshield for (it's all being kept secret), it appears to be in combination with over a dozen other companies and the odds of it being "controlled" by SpaceEx is slim to none. I have way more issues with SpaceEx basically owning a corporate town and their intent to dump toxic materials in the Gulf.
Sorry, but this is Reddit and anti Musk sentiments only. Please refrain from critical thinking during your stay here. Regards.
What’s funny to me is that I have extremely strong anti musk sentiments. What drives me bananas is when people let their negative opinions about a person interpret literally everything the person is directly or indirectly involved with as negative - often undermining their own arguments in the process. Don’t like the government giving corporate welfare to rich people? Because I dislike THIS rich person in particular, let’s give 5x as much to this other rich guy to get half as much done in 4x the time!
Exactly, Legitimate reasons to dislike and like him and what he's done/doing. But the blind hate/love is annoying.
Why is it that people seem to think that the government paying a company to do something and for a service is welfare when it’s SpaceX, but not when it’s any other country. Was it welfare to Russia when the US was paying Russia to launch all of the astronauts to the space station? SoaceX is the single reason that the US isn’t currently beholden to the Kremlin for access to the ISS. They are paid money to provide a service on a fixed cost contract. The welfare queens are ULA and Boeing who got waaaaaay more money and still haven’t even taken a single person to orbit from their contract, while spaceX has completed theirs and started on another one already. And Starliner is grounded again with issues.
Do you know how government contracts actually work? Let me break it down for you into extremelyyyyy simple terms since that’s probably all you can understand. Government needs X product/service. Government puts out a contract expressing this need. Private companies bid on this contract. Company Y offers the best price for fulfilling this contract and the government’s need of X product/service. Government awards contract to Company Y. This really isn’t difficult to grasp, but instead you chose to just regurgite some edgy line you read somewhere online, fueled in part by your hatred of some CEO
Yea! We should have gone to that other company that’s making global wifi… oh wait there isn’t one.
He can finally pay his rent.
Bad idea. He's shown he's not trustworthy.
And that he's a Russian ally. What could go wrong?
I don't think the government would partner with him if that indeed were the case of him being an “ally.”
He shut down Starlink during an Ukrainian offensive against Russia. The US is allies with Ukraine. Not only that but his excuse of not wanting to be part of an act of war is moot since his action directly helps Russia , which is the aggressor here and is still killing civilians every day. He has clearly picked a side.
The US hasn't sent troops to fight in Ukraine. That directly helps Russia. Clearly, the US has picked a side and is a Russian ally. Same logic. Except Starlink isn't even military at all so there's even less reason for them to get directly involved in conflict.
> The US hasn't sent troops to fight in Ukraine. That directly helps Russia. Clearly, the US has picked a side and is a Russian ally. > > Or as someone else wisely put it in another thread discussing this article, "By your logic, if we don't give working nuclear weapons to Ukraine, we are helping Russia".
Imagine thinking that you understand the news because you read titles of articles on Reddit
No he didn't. He declined removing a geofence around Crimea that SpaceX was illegally obligated to create
Don't you think the Pentagon reviewed that incident before this contract? StarLink had a justification for why they shut that down. If you want to believe it's because Elon loves Russia and wants to protect them, then go off, but why would he put Starlink over there in the first place if he wanted Russia to succeed His politics sucks and he’s weird but let’s use logical thinking here
>His politics sucks and he’s weird but let’s use logical thinking here You're asking far too much.
I think that the Pentagon would review it and demand that they would have total control over Starshield to prevent that kind of situation. Logic only works if everybody involved is logical. Elon is a weirdo who is trying to control information through Twitter/X at the World level and who has private phone calls with Putin (who called him an outstanding person). Who knows why he had Starlink there just to disable it when Ukraine needed it. All I know is this is not the action of someone siding with Ukraine in this invasion.
Yeah, I figure the entire reason Starshield exists and not just Starlink is to put control in the government's hands. They want the SpaceX tech and they don't mind paying him. But they won't hand him the keys to what they bought.
No… Ukraine asked him to turn Starlink on for that offensive attack in the middle of the night. It wasn’t on in that area because it sanctioned by the US Government. No private citizen should be making the call if one country attacks another. Imagine if Musk said, “sure thing Ukraine!” And then Putin fired a few nukes and killed a million people in retaliation… you’d be saying Musk should be hung for treason. These decisions should NOT be made by a private citizen. Good news is Starshield will be in control by the government, not SpaceX or Musk.
Better to just nationalize SpaceX and kick the traitor out of the company.
The DoD obviously disagrees that he’s a traitor. Actually they might have even agreed with his actions in the Ukraine incident.
I think the idea that spaceX as a company is far more than just one guy. There are smart people doing their lives work too.
This is the dumbest comment section I have ever seen. You do know that Musk is not an engineer and won't be designing anything for this, right? And that the government will review the design and approve it? And then be the operators, only calling in SpaceX when necessary? I know not everyone is an aerospace engineer at a defense contractor who designs satellites for the military like I am, but you should be able to at least use your brains to think for four seconds before commenting.
\>"at least use your brains to think" I'm sorry sir, but this is Reddit.
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It's the most logical choice. They've already established a working platform and relationship with the military. The US government loves sticking with operations they know.
I am pretty sure pentagon will take over all command and control. If u think they will allow Musk any control over it ur mistaken
It is just a tech contract. They will basically develop a more "military appropriate" terminal to be sold to the branches that will use the already existing and future starlink LEO satellites. Since the US military is ALREADY using starlinks as commercial solutions, this would just make it a big picture budget line item. Musk will have little to do with it other than continue to cash his check.
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Unfortunately, if you think Musk won't build a backdoor so he/Russia could control it, you're mistaken.
But wait. I thought Musk didn’t want his stuff used for wars.
Its not "his stuff." Its satellites and launch services sold to the US government.
If civilian starlink was turned on in Crimea - which it never was by the way - for use in direct guided drone attacks into Russian controlled territory, it would have violated international laws and US laws and the entire thing would likely have to be shut down ENTIRELY for violating ITAR. This wasn’t Musk - who I agree is an ass - doing something. It was a company following the law. And according to even the more recent scathing news articles that reporting on this, near the bottom, if you bothered to read more than the headline, it was apparently an order from Biden’s administration that they, as US satellite and rocket company, which need to abide by certain specific rules, were not permitted to turn it on in Russian territory to be used as an active offensive military weapon. To the people saying nationalise - if it is nationalised, then it’s not a company even providing a service. It’s the US government providing a military service to Ukraine. Which could be a direct military escalation. If nationalised, it would potentially not be allowed to be used in *any* part of Ukraine. Know who would like outrage and for it to be nationalised, and might try to get people to be outraged to get this to happen? RUSSIA. and their online misinformation teams.
The consumer/commercial network, yes. Starshield is dedicated to military use and designed to better meet their needs.
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Nazi? Can you elaporate on that one?
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He's constantly amplifying literal nazi rhetoric including antisemitism on his platform. And I don't mean he just allows it to exist, he seeks it out, and responds to it so the algo he modified to prioritize his shit pushes it to the top of everyone's feed.
He isn’t. This comment section is fucking delusional
ITT people think they know better then the DOD and their army of lawyers and pencil pushers.
Musk should not have anything to do with US military projects. FFS
SpaceX had been an integral part of Space Force and the Air Force before them for a decade launching top secret payloads to orbit. NASA trusts them to launch their astronauts to the ISS. They trust them to land astronauts on the moon for the first time since Apollo. The odds are your interpretation of the situation is just way off.
This thread is hilarious to read. "Elon Musk bad so SpaceX bad!" Do people think Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, Booz-Allen Hamilton, etc. are all run by kind people? They're all run by narcissistic douches, just Elon Musk is the only one who loves the spotlight. Him running SpaceX is probably the best thing for the company. Since they're not under shareholder control, they move at a much faster pace but also much more volatile manner. Throwing away money at projects like they've worked on with little historical evidence for success is what drives innovation. They might not be the best option forever but right now they're the best at their niche.
>Musk should not have anything to do with US military projects Maybe the US DoD is better informed than you?
He probably doesn't really have much to do with any of his projects. That's why he has so much time to run his mouth.
Didn't elon turn off internet in Ukraine randomly during the war? How can a company he's involved with be trusted for military usage since he's obviously compromised?
No, he refused to break US law and enable it in a sanctioned area without explicit US government approval.
The tldr of that was, Ukraine was using Starlink, a civilian system donated for humanitarian reasons, as a direct guidance component in their drones, something which could get Starlink into problems with ITAR (by classifying it as an arms export). So Starlink had been disabled outside of ukrainian controlled territory, and when Ukraine asked for it to be turned on to attack the russian port, Starlink refused.They werent under contract at the time, so would have had zero obligation to stick their necks out for a potential ITAR violation.
Because he warned up front he wouldnt use it to support attacks? And the US can always make sure they have full authority over the project, to avoid unwanted actions.
He did and it wasn't random.
And it wasn't turned off, it was just never on and he refused to turn it on (after consulting with White House and army brass).
Who else is going to deliver the payloads as cheap and efficiently as them? It doesn't surprise me at all.
They are so busy hating on Musk but forgot Space X has been getting these contract because their competition can't compete with them right now on both on efficient and price. Blue Origins has got a contract from the Pentagon and still isn't launching anything. And I don't like Musk but Boeing and Lockheed Martin CEO aren't that much better.
Elon can't become President, but he can control a hell of a lot of our government and military. [Ronan Farrow on Elon Musk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXfzU6tS-b4)
I’ve never seen so much hatred for a man that has had a net positive effect on our world. what he’s done for online banking/electric cars / space flight / and internet access for everyone on earth is enough to overlook what he says on twitter. Everyone is free to criticize him but I’m still rooting for him to continue to push our technology as a species.
Relax the Ion Cannon is still in research and development stage.
Until the autistic man boy says no.
You’re going to give that guy potential control of military equipment ?
What happens when he says we have to stop respecting trans people to keep his network on?
I’d like to keep Elon away from gov contracts
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So the company that has been deploying a net of satellites on the promise of fast, low-cost internet for rural residents has now won a defense contract? wHo CoUlD hAvE sEeN tHiS cOmInG?
I thought Musk was against using satellites for military targets?
The key was that using the civilian version as part of a weapon (like ukraine did) could've made all the terminals they normally sell fall under ITAR regulations, but having a military version under contract (the important bit) to the US government wouldnt cause that issue.
Guy's a cunt, but he does seem genuinely concerned about the civilian/corporate version of Star link being used in Ukraine, as that essentially makes it a viable military target in Russia's eyes. Star Shield is the military version, and AFAIK only the US government has access to it
Stop making sense
Next up, Elon changes Tesla to Texla
Either the pentagon is fucking nuts or they got an unimaginably solid guarantee that they can control the world's biggest manchild no, no they are nuts
This comment section so perfectly exemplifies the average redditor. People with total ignorance on a subject commenting and providing their opinion on it 😂
“I’ve got a bad feeling about this”
Thought this was a “The Onion” article from the title.
Great. Musk in charge of military contracts. What could go wrong?
I’m against this. We’ve clearly seen the shortcomings of utilizing commercial internet resources already with Ukraine. Additionally, haven’t we learned the vulnerability of lean manufacturing and corporate cost cutting after COVID and our (necessary) investment in critical manufacturing infrastructure that’s been offshored through cost cutting measures?
This is not a commercial internet resource. Made strictly for government use. No different than any other government satellite constellation. A commercial contractor develops the system, and then the government takes over command and control.
It’s a bold strategy Cotton! Let’s see how it plays out for the US!
This isn’t going to backfire when we need it most
Doing any business with Elon like this is WILDLY stupid. He will fuck the U.S. first chance he gets. Just look what he did to Ukraine.