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What is the point of these head to head polls showing one person leading the other 45% to 40% or whatever? Show me electoral college analysis. Popular vote doesn't matter.
I'll never understand how our system is actually a democracy, and how it seems I've never met anyone or read an opinion online who agrees with the way it works. It just blows my fucking mind, and there's absolutely nothing "we, the people" can do about it.
And that for a decent chunk of US history only landowners past a certain ownership threshold could vote in *any* election. "One man one vote" was definitely not the case in 1787, let alone universal suffrage across race and sex.
It was one man one vote. They just had a different definition of "man."
This is what conservatives want to conserve. What they want to return to.
A system where *all men* are equal, but all *people* aren't.
That's the thing though, even landed white men couldn't vote if they didn't have *enough* land. They explained it away as "Only a landowner of sufficient standing has enough on the line in this country to deserve a say at all" which is ...pretty scummy.
It always saddens me when I see blue collar workers renting their home say "The founding fathers weren't ever wrong". My brother in christ, the founding fathers would not have even let you vote, let alone respect you.
That's right. All we need to reduce the outsized power of states with small populations is a constitutional amendment. Which requires 3/4 of the states to agree to it! The party that has consistently benefited from land being more important than people is not going to surrender that power.
I mean one way to achieve that is to increase the size of the house to the smallest population of representatives. If Wyoming gets 1 seat for 500k of population, so should the rest of the USA.
The bigger issue is the senate where the tail is wagging the dog. The Senate has far too much power over legislation, and it should really be a house of sober second thought rather than a house of legislation.
If you increase the size of the house then all the pressure gets put on the senate. The initial compromise was that every citizen got an even say and then every state got an even say. It's bonkers that we don't even get the even say for each citizen anymore.
100%. Right now the ability to override the senate is hindered because of smaller states having over representation in the house.
I get it. Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what's for dinner. Right now it's the sheep deciding. Having a senate is smart. Having a senate so powerful it stymies the house is not smart.
American democracy is one wolf and two sheep deciding what's for dinner, but due to gerrymandering and structural over-representation of the wolf, the wolf's vote counts for more than the combined vote of the two sheep.
Having a senate isn’t smart, per se. Democracy in the UK and Canada have a toothless upper house, and they operate well.
Sweden is a unicameral state, and it isn’t a hell hole.
But there are two Dakotas! Neither of them have attracted any sort of value beyond digging things up but they are worth twice as much as a California! California could become 10 different states all with more people and higher GDPs than a single Dakota but that shouldn't happen because it would be unfair.
We could merge North and South Dakota and Montana and the resulting state would have \~2.5million people. It would be the 37th most populus state right behind Kansas. Why do those 2.5 million people get 6 US Senators, but the 2.9 million in Kansas get 2?
It's crazy how few people live in such a large area. My favorite point is that we could combine Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, Nebraska, and Kansas and still have few people than Los Angeles County!
The turnout for local elections is abysmal. :(
This year's local county election had only 18% of the registered voters cast a ballot, and there are definitely more eligible voters than that, to boot, at least 30k more according to census records. This is for a county with 141k people in a metro area of >400k.
Midwest America.
This is why I successfully fought to put my towns local elections on the same ballot as nationals. Our city turnout was like 8%, 100 votes could win you a city council seat.
ugh, Virginian here, I have voted in 20 elections (primaries and generals and one special election) over 10 years because we always have national, state, and local all staggered, our last primary had 12% turnout which is the deciding election for most of the locations that are locked R or D.
In Kansas, when the republican super majority tried to pass a state constitutional amendment to get rid of the right to an abortion they postponed the amendment vote and moved it to a summer primary. Their logic behind doing this was that they knew that even in one of the most religious and republican leaning states in the entire country, their abortion ban was unpopular.
In Kansas many areas don't even have a single democrat candidate running so the primary is mostly just republican turnout.
They acknowledged that college students are much more likely to vote democrat so they waited until the summer semester.
They intentionally chose to make the amendment as confusing as possible. If I remember correctly, they used a few double negatives in the proposed amendment and they even used wording implying that voting against this took power away from the voters to make their own choice(anti choice, lol).
And the cherry on top was that about a day or so before the election, a republican group saw the polling and started calling people telling them that voting yes for the amendment would save abortion access in an attempt to confuse pro abortion voters to make a mistake and vote to allow the republicans to ban it. A yes vote was to ban abortion and no was to keep it protected and legal.
Even after all that, the amendment still lost 60/40. Republicans know they have to stoop to these measures to even have a chance, and even with the deck stacked like it was they got blown out.
oh it's 100% because of that! Why else would places like Prince William County, one of the most diverse counties in the US, not have a person of color elected until 2019
This is exactly why I had my county start mailing me all my ballots and why mail in voting is so important. I'm so bad about knowing when local voting day is.
I 100% know this is a me problem, though. So I did what I could to remedy the situation. Then Florida purged all the mail on requests, made it so you had to request every year and didn't really notify anyone about it.
This fucking state wants no one engaged.
It's the corporate media companies that decimated local news coverage, focusing everyone's attention on national stories for the sake of having an audience to sell ad space and make money.
Local media doesn't have the budget to keep up and compete with that in a "private market" so local news has suffered tremendously.
We also have national cultures and consciousness about major events in sports or movie releases, chain restaurants that everybody in the country knows about and has at least seen, etc, so when people even have organic conversations with people they can talk about these things, and national races, but not local ones. You have to be talking with very local people to have a discussion about a local race.
On top of that, local elections are all on their own schedules, so it's not like we can all just reliably fall back onto that first/2nd Tuesday in November. They occur for school boards, towns, cities, and state governments, and I imagine a lot of regular "Joe's" and "Jane's" don't think too much about the difference between their US Senator and their State Senators, for example.
The local elections are definitely where the system is really designed to make a lot of stuff happen but we don't have strong, educated, and informed communities to press on those buttons and levers. The folks who are very good about applying pressure are some of the stupidest and worst people to lead: religious conservatives and older people who are less in-touch with reality and the latest infor.ation and whose conservative fears and inaction has the least impact on what is left of their own lives.
And unfortunately this favors the absolute nutters like Proud Boy and Moms for Auschwitz candidates.
Doubly so when they start sending death threats towards any candidate who runs left of Mussolini, causing them to drop out.
I looked at the GOP primary candidates this past election. They literally all have the same platform. Anti-choice, anti-gun reform, tax cuts for the rich, anti-teacher, cut social services. So of course the runoff was just a contest to see who could say the most outlandish things so that their name gets the most coverage.
It gives me very little hope that anything can change when there's absolutely no allowance for nuance in our elections anymore. And of course anyone to the left of them is a "woke liberal".
Hi! I'm running in PA, in a really conservative area.
With a lot of work, I did well in the primary. It's possible!!! We just need people to run and tell the voters that they DO have a choice!
Moreso, vote in primary elections.
If you don’t like the choices put on your ballot on Election Day, get the better candidates out there.
People seriously underestimate the power of a primary election. Very few bother showing up at the primary polls.
It's fascinating. Most of the rights we have as human beings in America came from illegal protests and full-on wars. Then, as those rights get taken away by Oligarchs buying our elections, we get told "all" we can do to help is vote.
Does voting matter? Of course. If it didn't, they wouldn't try so hard to stop you from voting. But voting is definitely not enough. Women's suffrage, slavery, civil rights, 8 hour work days, Saturdays off, etc., didn't just happen bc those in power woke up one day and decided to do the right thing. They had to be heavily pressured by direct action (sufferage, civil rights) and, in many cases, extreme violence (slavery, labor rights).
Democracy will not be saved at the ballot box alone. It will also take either a mass work stoppage or the revival and growth of an Occupy Wall St. type movement that floods cities and centers of power.
We didn't get what we have through voting alone, why would that be "all" we need to save what we have?
We should also automatically enroll people to receive mail-in ballots when they turn 18. The right to not vote will still be available to them but the right to vote will become so much easier to exercise.
Our system is very intentionally not a direct democracy. The founding fathers (almost exclusively a bunch of rich elites) were absolutely mortified by the idea of the country descending turning into mob rule.
So instead the opposite has happened and a minority can now play the system to grab majority power in many cases. Talk about path to hell being paved with good intentions.
The idea that the founding fathers had good intentions is kind of blown up by the fact that they let the states set the voting rights for each of their states and most of them only let white, land owning males vote.
> were absolutely mortified by the idea of the country descending turning into mob rule.
And mortified by black people having equal rights or women having the right to vote. Or the riff-raff with no land having the right to vote.
>And mortified by black people having equal rights or women having the right to vote. Or the riff-raff with no land having the right to vote.
they didn't have any worries about slaves having equal rights. They were slaves, after all.
“Something something gotta make it fair for rural voters too.”
Know what’s fair? If your policies are unpopular, change them so they will be more appealing to people who normally disagree with you.
> “Something something gotta make it fair for rural voters too.”
And then you explain to them how it actually makes their vote count significantly *more*, they'll turn around and say "well life ain't fair!" in exactly the accent you just imagined.
If you'd just stop with the "winner takes all" electoral college for the state I'm sure the system would become considerably better. It's insane to me that 50.1% nets the same result as 100%.
It's a flawed democracy when the people who depend on it later get to be the ones who can manipulate it. The electoral college is broken but it benefits the right. Having every state have 2 senators regardless of if they are 1 million or 60 million - broken. Allowing state governments to manipulate district zoning to maximize votes for one party - broken. How the hell do you fix a broken system when one party wants it broken.
Also the fact that we cannot do the right thing like add new states (Puerto Rico or Washington DC) all because the right wing will only allow a Red leaning state to enter the Union.
Because it used to work 99% of the time. However, the most recent elections have seen it not work, and always in the Republicans favor. One of the tenets of American style democracy is about giving the minority group power to not be oppressed by the “tyranny of the majority”, although you could then claim the majority is at threat from the tyranny of the minority. The electoral college and gerrymandering skews elections, and can put less popular candidates in power. In a system of checks and balances, if one party out of only 2 can gain the majority in all 3 branches, you’ve got yourself a bit of a problem.
It’s funny, in a tragic way, that a group of people so worried about the “tyranny of the majority” were and are totally okay with oppressing minority groups.
Every time a thread like this comes up, I’m amazed that the topic of the House of Representatives being locked in size doesn’t come up more. The reason the popular vote usually coincided with the EC winner is because the House was relatively proportional to the population. Now we have states like California that have even less representation than they should because the House’s size has been locked and that also decreases their effect on the EC
As a non American, I don't understand how this criminal can run. Stealing secret documents, selling out national security, openly slandering opposition, all very clear things he's done yet he's allowed to run for any political seat still, let alone president?
Also he's far too old
pre-trump, I would agree with you. but he exposed the system for what it is: a bunch of gentlemen's agreements. not enough is codified into law when it comes to the rich and powerful. and this country is swirling down the drain because it's going to be impossible to put the idiot toothpaste back in the tube.
Anyone can run for president as long they meet the age, birth, and residency requirements. Its not a requirement to not be in prison or to not have a felony. You can run for president from federal prison. Thats not really the issue. The issue is that people would still vote for someone who is running from prison.
If you could prevent someone from running because they're in prison then that would encourage getting your opponent into prison
Which is crazy to me, because Biden's administration has done far, far, far more than I expected or was prepared to give him credit for. Handling the Ukraine situation right, rejoining UNESCO, rejoining the Paris Agreement, forgiving federal student loans (or trying to, anyway), successfully pushing Congress to enshrine legal gay marriage…
You don't have to like the guy, but if you like all of the things I listed above, that's worth another vote IMO, and we need to make it our business to frame it that way to our friends and family who might be more forgetful of his administration's accomplishments.
Yah, polls this early arent very useful to the public.
Im sure the strategists etc for the parties can use it, but id bet even for them its not as meaningful as ppl assume.
What I found to be pretty useful warning signs are the shifts in forum content online.
For example Reddit is now allowing far-right propaganda and blatant misinformation on the front page on a daily basis, often couched with hate for minorities and hidden under the veil of things like "scienceuncensored" - a subreddit that very much censors anyting that even questions their intent ( [e.g.](https://old.reddit.com/r/TellReddit/comments/14fg9h5/the_subreddit_rscienceuncensored_is_censoring/) )
Not only that but Reddit also removed the "misinformation" report option - AND has actually been upvoting articles by the daily mail... constantly.
_____
A pattern like this is very similar to 2016 and the popular forums and gaming channels that got taken over back then. Only this time there seems to be zero push-back.
It looks like things are going to get really *really* bad tbh
TBF, part of that is due to a lot of communities of sensible people taking part in blackouts and other protests, so the junk subs have a larger market share. But also, yeah, Spez is a big fan of Elon so I am not shocked to see misinformation elevated and unable to be reported.
Besides that the video is from RFK Jr, a known grifter, who is a major source of anti-science propaganda, aka part of the "Disinformation Dozen":
https://www.npr.org/2021/05/13/996570855/disinformation-dozen-test-facebooks-twitters-ability-to-curb-vaccine-hoaxes
> Take anti-vaccine activist Robert F. Kennedy Jr., one of the "Disinformation Dozen" identified by the center, who has promoted the long discredited idea that vaccines are linked to autism. During the pandemic, he has shared baseless conspiracy theories linking 5G cellular networks to the coronavirus, and suggested, without evidence, that the death of baseball great Hank Aaron was "part of a wave of suspicious deaths" tied to vaccines.
> None of that is true.
> Kennedy was kicked off Instagram, which Facebook owns, in February over repeatedly sharing debunked claims.
> Yet Facebook did not remove him from its namesake platform.
Grifter, stealing money from ignorant Americans:
> He said the crackdown has cost "hundreds of thousands of dollars" in donations to his organization.
> Popular vote doesn't matter.
This is correct. I see so many people on Reddit who claim that Biden beat Trump by a lot, but that's not true with respect to the electoral college.
Trump beat Hillary by some 10K votes, in the right battleground states, in 2016, despite winning the popular vote. In 2020, Biden [beat Trump by some 270K votes, in the right battleground states](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-beat-trump-votes-swing-states), despite winning the popular vote as well. And [this NPR article is saying just 44K votes separated Trump and Biden from an electoral college tie](https://www.npr.org/2020/12/02/940689086/narrow-wins-in-these-key-states-powered-biden-to-the-presidency).
Biden did not beat Trump by a lot. And in 2016, Trump lucked out in the right battleground states, and the right mix of battleground states, to beat Hillary.
People keep repeating the popular vote in r/politics over and over again when they refer to Trump's chances. This is totally not true, it's the electoral college that decides the presidency, not the popular vote. **If people don't come out to vote like 2016, Trump can win.**
Also, popular votes don't really matter because *neither* candidate was campaigning for the popular vote. They're playing the game as it exists, which means that they're campaigning for EC votes to win the Presidental election. If they were campaigning for the popular vote, they would campaign differently.
Trying to talk about the popular vote in an election that was run based on the existing electoral framework is like trying to talk about a footrace and say that the guy who took the fewest steps during the race should have won; if that was the victory condition, everyone would have been running fundamentally differently from the start. It's really just cherry-picking a metric someone's preferred candidate did better at, regardless of how little it means.
The EC is so f'ing stupid it ensures candidates campaign and focus only on a handful of battleground states. Basically the opposite of what it was ever intended to do: campaign in all different states, economic classes of people, urban vs rural, etc.
I also think no popular vote we've ever had in recent history is useful or accurate from that standpoint. Why bother voting in California, TX, DC or Mississippi if your state's electoral votes were decided before the race even started? Sure you still need people to vote, but it has to affect turnout.
> Basically the opposite of what it was ever intended to do: campaign in all different states, economic classes of people, urban vs rural, etc.
That wasn't really the original intention of the EC. Because campaigning in general wasn't really a big thing until the 1900s. Candidates would release statements, but there was no traveling around the country. The first recognized public campaigning for the presidency was Benjamin Harrison doing speeches from his front porch.
Most presidents in the early days were not big time charismatic celeberties like they are now. They were mostly bureaucrats who worked their way up the government or war generals. It was treated as an honor and a real job to be president, not this popularity contest it is today.
Cook Political Report currently estimates the electoral college advantage at about R+3. So the Ds need to beat them by 4, give or take.
https://www.cookpolitical.com/cook-pvi/2022-partisan-voter-index/republican-electoral-college-advantage
The point isn't really to show who is going to win the election but rather to show a trend in favorability of candidates.
If you use the same methods every poll you should be able to create this trend.
https://www.270towin.com/
PA, GA, WI, AZ. That's the election.
IMHO, we can get PA WI and AZ without too much trouble. That puts us well over the line.
I live in PA, Trump has no chance here. Even conservatives are getting less enthusiastic about him.
Where do you live in PA? Outside the bigger cities, state college, etc. there seems to be plenty of support for Trump. I’m not saying he’ll win PA, but the idea that he has “no chance” sounds premature to me.
I don't want to be specific about my location. Suffice it to say it is in the outermost edge of the suburbs of a city. Lots of rural people come into the area to shop. My district does vote red for congress.
I can tell that enthusiasm has waned, considerably, among gop voters.
I've noticed the same. Other than the fringe "Trump 2024" flag from a clearly deranged person I don't see the amount of enthusiasm for Trump as a I saw in 2016 or 2020. My own extended family, some of whom were pretty "die hard" supporters, have said that they won't vote for him again. It took 5 years an attempted coup and subsequent pandering but I think the majority of people see through his bullshit now. Sad that it took that long and almost the downfall of our democracy to get us here.
> I can tell that enthusiasm has waned, considerably, among gop voters.
It has. I've heard people say that if it's Trump vs Biden they are just not going to vote. Hopefully at least some of them stick to that.
Most Republican voters could never vote for Biden because of the religious culture war implications of doing so (they believe it's a sin to vote for a pro-gay, pro-abortion candidate), but if they choose to stay home rather than vote for Trump, he loses.
The base wasn't particularly enthusiastic about Trump until he became the candidate in 2016, and then they fell in line. Hard. Falling in line and holding their nose is what conservatives do best. Never underestimate their willingness to cut off their nose, ears, lips, forehead, chin, cheeks, and skull, in order to spite their face.
Trump has held PA to a +/-2% in 16 and 20. He won by .72% and lost by 1.17% respectively.
I don't think any state embodies the pull Trump has on low propensity voters like Pennsylvania does. In 2018 Wolf won his gubernatorial reelection by 17% and Shapiro won in 2022 by 15%.
The fact that Trump comes within 1% of winning in a state where democratic governors have won by double digits in the last few elections is definitely a cause for concern.
Trump can 100% take Wisconsin. Ron fucking Johnson won re-election in 2022. Biden won Wisconsin by *20,000* votes in 2020, Trump won Wisconsin by 23,000 votes in 2016. Wisconsin is *not* a sure thing.
Ron Johnson won by scaring old people about his black opponent being "soft on crime". Since then, Dems won more Wisconsin supreme court seats. Ron's constituents are frightened old white people, who are more likely to relate to Biden on that front.
Johnson is awful, one of the worst senators, but Mandela Barnes did shoot himself in the foot by publicly supporting defund the police. I know he tried to walk it back some while he was campaigning but that's basically the blue equivalent of being super hard line on abortion. It's just an all around liability polling wise.
Tony Evers did get re-elected as Governor at least which does lend some credence to your old white people theory.
It's a good sign that Michigan is no longer considered one that needs to be worried about. Guess we have Whitmer and the other Democrats to thank for that.
I'd also throw in Nevada and North Carolina as relevant battlegrounds though. Cortez-Masto barely scraped by in NV during the mid terms and NC was Biden's closest loss in 2020 by just a point and a half. I've got an eye on Texas as well, it's a long shot but seems like it could get close especially with Cruz on the ballot given how poorly he performed six years ago.
It should. The democrats keep presenting bills and the republicans keep blocking it. Republicans depend on gerrymandering, redistricting, lack of access, the electoral college- otherwise they'd never win because their policy is shit.
I don't know why america doesn't fight harder for their voices, their right to vote, their rights period. Why not hold your representatives accountable.
Never let them get a moment's peace until they do. Not to eat, sleep... not to shit. Hold them accountable, People. Or continue to struggle. 🤷
> I don't know why america doesn't fight harder for their voices, their right to vote, their rights period. Why not hold your representatives accountable.
Because as you pointed out, one of the two major parties has a vested interest in things staying the way they are. If it ever happened that Democrats won the presidency multiple times while losing the popular vote (or, if that *ever* happened), Republicans would abolish the Electoral College the next day.
All it takes is for Dems to stay home election day - it's what defeated Hillary and it can do the same to President Biden. Remember Hillary won the popular vote by over 1,000,000 but lost in 4 key states by 75,000,
And the fact that he isn't currently in office causing daily outrage among the citizenry is going to be an issue.
This country has the attention span of a goldfish, and won't remember how awful every day was under this guy who had to make the news EVERYDAY by doing or saying something that was absolutely terrifying.
Translation: Don’t take Biden’s huge chances of winning lightly. You still have to vote, even if Trump is sitting in prison on Election Day, you still need to vote.
Dems are too comfortable with, “oh, we got this. I don’t need to vote in this one”, despite being the more educated and arguably more intelligent party, they still act quite dumb when it comes to the important stuff.
This is exactly what happened the first time he ran. I truly don’t think a lot of Dems thought he had a chance in hell. You gotta vote like your life depends on it - because for so SO many people it does.
I was 18 when Trump won.
I didn't vote, because I thought people had to be stupid to not choose Clinton over him.
I was wrong. Now, I cast my vote whenever I get the chance.
I really liked Bernie Sanders in 2016. I remember everyone in the various Bernie subs was shocked he did so badly in the primaries. Then someone asked these people who were spending all day posting Bernie memes what percentage actually voted in their primaries. The results were a joy for fans of single-digit numbers.
Also, despite how unlikable Hillary was, I made it a point to vote for her because I knew I wasn’t voting for Hillary, I was voting for the next three Supreme Court justices.
I’ve been spending way too much time since then saying “I told you so!”
If you're talking about 2016, the Democratic nominee had a big part in Democrats staying home. During the primary election, Clinton was asked what she would do to win over Sanders voters to support her in the general election given that she was the heavy favorite and under-performed. I'll never forget Clinton's answer: "We have the votes."
She could have said we'll increase the minimum wage. We'll lower the retirement age. She could have lied through her teeth to win over more voter but she was too interested in wrapping up the primary to even try. Her campaign was trash and deserves a lot of blame for Trump's win.
There are many reasons for the outcome of the 2016 election, but in my mind, Democratic hubris was the largest. The Democratic party took some states for granted. They lost WI and MI and nearly MN when they assumed they were all in the bag. IIRC, Clinton never even visited WI during the campaign.
And let’s not forget her braindead self-important campaign slogan: “I’m with her.”
How about instead: “She’s with us.”
The tone-deafness and hubris was ridiculous.
And now they are doing it again. No one wanted Biden the first time, he only won because he was "not trump." Without the pandemic raging as hot as it was in 2020, I think Trump has a pretty good shot at winning. Democrats are amazing to me in their hubris, not even allowing anyone to challenge Biden. Truly insane behavior, I absolutely loathe the DNC and the Democratic party, they will all clutch power until their dying day while the world slips into catastrophe.
I always say it was never Trump's election to win, it was Clinton's to lose. With their constant message of "fall in line" and the dismissal of everything Sanders pushed for and that his base supported, it was *extremely* common for people to vote for Trump just to make a point, or vote third-party/not vote/write in vote.
She lost that election by her own fault, by assuming everyone would just fall in and vote D, and disenfranchised her own new base in doing so. I don't know of a single person my age who actually *likes* her, only people who voted for her to not vote Trump, or who voted against her in any other way they could.
Don't forget Bernie tried to help her anyway and got his voters from the primary to vote for her in record numbers... meanwhile she still blamed him anyway after she lost.
Meanwhile exit polls and such show Bernie did a much better job at putting his weight behind her, than she did for Obama in 08.
Dems sit on their laurels instead of being a warrior for the working people party and just say GOP bad! See what Trump says and will do! Vote for us OR ELSE!
But what do we get for our votes?
You get to not have Trump and that's enough!
It's bonkers to me that we have a country as large and diverse as the US with only TWO parties to represent all our interests? No wonder everyone feels screwed.
as someone who works professionally in infrastructure, can confirm that the vast majority of people don't think about it until there's a problem... by which time it may already be too late
My ultra-conservative Parents swear to never vote for Trump and to not vote for Republicans if they run him again. I don't know if that will hold in the ballot box, or some new republican boogeyman/wedge issue will take over that is somehow scarier than Trump.
But I am hoping it's more indicative of the wider Republican base.
My dad has voted Republican his whole life and he won't vote for Trump -- and told me he didn't last time. My mom still does, though. They are very conservative Christians living in a super rural area. It's hard to break these people out of their bubble but I'm sure my dad isn't the only Republican who has taken this stance.
2020 and 2022 showed us that most Americans do not like Trump. If you're worried about not enough people showing up to the polls, you should start phonebanking and canvassing now. Those are guaranteed ways to increase turnout.
There are Republicans who don't like Trump but will vote for him just because of the r next to his name even if it is voting for someone that is not in their best interests
Incumbent usually wins. The only reason people come out to vote in massive numbers is when they are suffering. For the most part everything is pretty stable. Inflation is plateauing, jobs are increasing, the market is stable or trending up, and the POTUS isn't in the news every hour for something stupid.
I am fine with this fear mongering to get more votes out there because there are a ton of down ticket races that could use the help.
30% of the country is a lost cause. No matter what happens they'll vote for a Republican.
I ignore that percentage and focus on about the middle 30%, those who can be reached and aren't completely brainwashed.
I personally believe that percent is higher. Conservatives that lean more centric will still vote R because a good many of them may not agree with Trump as a person but agree with his policies.
Which is even sadder. My family is sooooo against the infrastructure bill/IRA and were super happy when the tax cuts in 2017 were passed. The reason why they liked the tax cuts in 2017, they got a $1000 bonus from their jobs and they pointed to that bonus as a sign that the tax cuts helped them.
Immediate returns always leave a lasting mark. I still remember when I won $700 at the slots 20 years ago when money was tight. I had a commission based job and had $10 to my name. Gambling seemed like the least risky thing to do that day.
I also remember my $20,000 hospital bill from 18 years ago. Then, not being able to work, having my car repoed, losing my apartment, and having to file bankruptcy.
We get morsels when things go right, then bent over, no lube raped, when things go south.
Which is interesting because the right blames inflation on Biden and the last Covid bill passed under him forgetting the literal check with trumps name on it. It’s so strange how money from trump =good and money from Biden is bad and socialism. Cognitive dissidence.
Biden's lead over him is excellent, actually. He's actually governing right now and hasn't remotely flipped to campaign mode. The trials of Trump are only going to make things worse for him.
**Trump took away reproductive rights from half the country**. That's his most enduring legacy and he just promised more appointments who will do *worse* than that. This kills his chances in states like Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Arizona, etc.
VOTE-VOTE-VOTE naturally. But I see too much fatalism on this sub about extremely early polling.
NOTE: 100% correct about down ballot... if Dems lose the Senate, McConnell blocks ANY Court appointment.
It’s sad this is a reality, but I simply cannot see trump being able to keep it together for the next year. He’s making stupid unforced errors on his legal issues almost daily and as the pressure cranks up, the errors will become worse and more regularly.
Trump could be in Prison a year from today, and he might still win the Presidency.
He's their Jesus Christ. They want him to be their martyr on the cross.
The NYT had an interesting thing about what could happen there. Basically if he wins, it doesn't matter if he's found guilty for the couple indictments he already has, the Justice Department can release him from prison to perform as president. Basically only a guilty verdict about Jan 6th keeps him out of the White House.
They did, it was the entire point of the electoral college. To prevent people like Trump from becoming president. It just doesn't work as intended anymore because it's a formality at this point.
well it's actually working out to have the opposite effect in the modern world. popular vote would be a better representation of the people as a representative democracy.
Trump is cranking the "any publicity is good publicity" to 11. So far it's worked for him. He's saying indictments are a badge of honor. He'll say his jail cell is nicer than Trump Tower.
Most people can't get a job interview with a single criminal charge or conviction against them, but a treasonous, twice impeached ex-President can run for President again? The US system is clearly a con game for the rich and powerful.
I actually don't disagree with being able to run for president if he's charged, but it pisses me off a lot that he's still considered a heavy contender despite being charged.
I've seen how Putin throws false charges on his opponent to not want to see a future where it is actually used as a weapon to keep political rivals out, but Trump is so clearly guilty of so much stuff and he should have been disowned by his party years ago instead of being the rallying point of it.
I feel like I think this every election, but if Americans still haven't learned I guess I just give up on the whole experiment. The fact it's even close is depressing. Support for Trump should be on about the same level as people who think the Moon is made of cheese. You'll get about 10% literal crazy people and trolls in any poll, anything past that is an indictment on society as a whole.
As an American, this frustrates me too. It's embarrassing. I don't get it at all how you can time and time again see and hear this man do truly despicable things and be like "yeah he's just great!" Like what the actual fuck is wrong with them?!! Did they stare into his soulless eyes for too long and are under a spell?!
I think it's because people don't "see and hear this man do truly despicable things". It's some combination of:
* They don't follow the news, all they know is that he has an R next to his name, is "pro-life" , etc. Those singular facts are enough to get their support
* They've been conditioned to believe that anything they hear that is contrary to their baseline belief of Trump being great must be a lie
There’s no reason why Trump should lead in any poll or be a threat in the general election. Biden has accomplished more than any president since FDR. In 2022 alone, Biden and Dems did the following:
* passed the Inflation Reduction Act, the biggest investment in fighting climate change in history
* passed the bipartisan infrastructure bill, the largest investment in infrastructure since Eisenhower
* passed the Bipartisan Safer Communities Act, breaking a 30-year streak of federal inaction on gun violence legislation
* signed the CHIPS and Science Act into law
* took out the leader of al Qaeda
* ended America's longest war
* reauthorized and strengthened the Violence Against Women Act
* signed the PACT Act, a bill to address veteran burn pit exposure
* signed the NATO accession protocols for Sweden and Finland
* issued executive order to protect reproductive rights
* in the process of canceling $10,000 of student loan debt for borrowers making less than $125,000 and canceled $20,000 in debt for Pell Grant recipients
* canceled billions in student loan debt for borrowers who were defrauded
* nominated now-Supreme Court Associate Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson to replace Justice Breyer
* brought COVID under control in the U.S. (e.g., COVID deaths down 90% and over 220 million vaccinated)
* formed Monkeypox response team to reach communities at highest risk of contracting the virus
* unemployment at a 50-year low
* largest one-year deficit reduction in U.S. history
* limited the release of mercury from coal-burning power plants
* $5 billion for electric vehicle chargers- $119 billion budget surplus in January 2022, first in over two years
* united world against Russia’s war in Ukraine
* ended forced arbitration in workplace sexual assault cases
* reinstated California authority to set pollution standards for cars
* ended asylum restrictions for children traveling alone
* signed the Emmett Till Anti-Lynching Act, the first federal ban on lynching after 200 failed attempts
* Initiated “use it or lose it" policy for drilling on public lands to force oil companies to increase production
* released 1 million barrels of oil a day for 6 months from strategic reserves to ease gas prices
* rescinded Trump-era policy allowing rapid expulsion of migrants
* expunged student loan defaults
* overhauled USPS finances to allow the agency to modernize its service
* required federal dollars spent on infrastructure to use materials made in America
* restored environmental reviews for major infrastructure projects
* Launched $6 billion effort to save distressed nuclear plants
* provided $385 million to help families and individuals with home energy costs through the Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program. (This is in addition to $4.5 billion provided in the American Rescue Plan.)
* national registry of police officers who are fired for misconduct
* tightened restrictions on chokeholds, no-knock warrants, and transfer of military equipment to police departments
* required all federal law enforcement officers to wear body cameras
* $265 million for South Florida reservoir, key component of Everglades restoration
* major wind farm project off West coast to provide electricity for 1.5 million homes
* continued Obama administration's practice of posting log records of visitors to White House
* devoted $2.1 billion to strengthen US food supply chain
* invoked Defense Production Act to rapidly expand domestic production of critical clean energy technologies
* enacted two-year pause of anti-circumvention tariffs on solar
* allocated funds to federal agencies to counter 300-plus anti-LGBTQ laws by state lawmakers in 2022
* relaunched cancer 'moonshot' initiative to help cut death rate
* expanded access to emergency contraception and long-acting reversible contraception
* prevented states from banning Mifepristone, a medication used to end early pregnancy that has FDA approval
* 21 executive actions to reduce gun violence
* Climate Smart Buildings Initiative: Creates public-private partnerships to modernize Federal buildings to meet agencies’ missions, create good-paying jobs, and cut greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions
* Paying for today’s needed renovations with tomorrow’s energy savings without requiring upfront taxpayer funding
* ended Trump-era “Remain in Mexico” policy
* Operation Fly-Formula, bringing needed baby formula (19 missions to date)
* executive order protecting travel for abortion
* invested more in crime control and prevention than any president in history
* provided death, disability, and education benefits to public safety officers and survivors who are killed or injured in the line of duty
* Reunited 500 migrant families separated under Trump
* $1.66 billion in grants to transit agencies, territories, and states to invest in 150 bus fleets and facilities
* brokered joint US/Mexico infrastructure project; Mexico to pay $1.5 billion for US border security
* blocked 4 hospital mergers that would've driven up prices and is poised to thwart more anti-competition consolidation attempts
* 11 million jobs—more than ever created before at this point of a presidency
* record small business creation
* banned paywalls on taxpayer-funded research
* best economic growth record since Clinton
* eliminated civil statute of limitations for child abuse victims
* announced $156 million for America's first-of-its-kind critical minerals refinery, demonstrating the commercial viability of turning mine waste into clean energy technology.
I voted for Biden and even I didn't know about most of these, although I now know more about submarines than I ever thought I would.
Journalism in the US is a bit of a joke.
This is the biggest truth to the current political divide. A major part of the country hasn’t even heard about Biden’s infrastructure bill because they prescribe to news outlets and social bubbles that completely ignore any talk of anything that would show Biden in a positive light.
It's not about getting their votes.
Their votes are already cast and aren't worth fighting for. The cult is the cult.
It's getting those folks who sit on the fence every election and those who don't normally vote that matters.
This. We must get as many people out to vote as possible. They didn't win the popular vote last time or the time before that and probably longer. But they gerryrmandered every thing in the favor
Exactly. What is Biden doing to prevent the secret trans plot to convert all children with secret YA books in school libraries that acknowledge the existence of the LGBT community? Nothing I bet.
Biden beat him by 7 million votes in 2020, but less than 100,000 votes were different in a few states and Trump would have won. The Electoral College helps republicans.
I just listened to Steve Kornacki on MSNBC talk about poll numbers. He started out with Joe Biden - how his favorability number is so low and how concerned Democratic voters are of his age and mental ability... then he went on to the Republican poll numbers and talked about how much Republican voters favor Donald Trump and to a lesser extent like Ron DeSantis. Notice anything? Negative about the Democrats, positive about the Republicans. It's the same thing they did to Hillary in 2016. They talked incessantly about her emails and her unlikability factor... and gave Trump 24/7 free coverage. I'd say media want's Donald Trump to be president again to pad their bottom lines. America is addicted to Reality TV and Trump is the star. Disgusting. Politics should not be entertainment. It affects people's lives.
They also complained about Biden being too old to run the first time. Guess how old trump will be in 2024. There is no logic with these people.
Man woman camera person tv
>There is no logic with these people
Democrats complain about Biden's age.
Republicans don't complain about Trump's age.
That's why there's a difference in what is reported.
From what OP said it wasn't reporting about Trump vs Biden. It was reporting about how the candidate's are viewed by their own parties.
Won't be an issue if everyone who showed up in 2020 and 2022 does so again.
If you're concerned about that and want to make sure it happens, go start donating and volunteering for Democrats *now*. That has a much greater impact on elections than telling people on Reddit to vote.
Nothing can really be done when half the voting population want this...
Our problems are much deeper than Trump...
The people voting think when fascism comes its only going to affect people they do not like.
There will be millions claiming foul when the fascist come for them. They will either lie and say they never supported the GOP platform, or they will say they never saw it coming.
I dont understand how anyone can possibly trust him ever again?!? He literally handed over our most important secrets ABOUT US WEAKNESSES AND VULNERABILITIES TO OUR ENEMIES?? He put us all in danger and they see NO problem with that??? WTAF! why is it not a bigger deal? It's the hugest fucking deal
I don’t know how so many people forget his most egregious transgression by down playing and lying about COVID getting his base to refuse vaccines to the point that, from what I understand, an additional 300,000 Americans needlessly died all because of his insane ego. He kill hundred of thousands of Americans by willful negligence.
2016 has taught us to never underestimate this scum. 46% folks will vote for him no matter what and Biden might need to secure at least 49% or more of the vote to win because of the electoral college.
He's going to be the nominee and conservatives will get behind them. If he wins that will be the last even marginally free election we have. We either win or become slaves to conservative fascists.
Ya ya. We have a lot of dumb people in this country, we get it.
Really wish all politicians were on mute and we only got to see what they voted on and why they voted that way.
If we roll into the 2024 elections without some sort of harsh resolution to the "fake electors" nonsense, then we are in for more of the same. Honestly, even if every one of those dipshits goes to jail we're just going to have a whole new set of morons lining up to do the dirty work of DJT.
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The fake elector scheme should disqualify him for life. This is insanity.
What is the point of these head to head polls showing one person leading the other 45% to 40% or whatever? Show me electoral college analysis. Popular vote doesn't matter.
>Popular vote doesn't matter. Exactly, and if Trump runs, red states will certainly cast their vote for him.
I'll never understand how our system is actually a democracy, and how it seems I've never met anyone or read an opinion online who agrees with the way it works. It just blows my fucking mind, and there's absolutely nothing "we, the people" can do about it.
It’s because the people who benefit from it staying the same are the one who have the power to stop it from changing.
That one sentence explains so many odd quirks of government, such as why we use FPTP voting.
Reminder that it wasn’t until 1913 that Senators were actually elected…
And that for a decent chunk of US history only landowners past a certain ownership threshold could vote in *any* election. "One man one vote" was definitely not the case in 1787, let alone universal suffrage across race and sex.
It was one man one vote. They just had a different definition of "man." This is what conservatives want to conserve. What they want to return to. A system where *all men* are equal, but all *people* aren't.
That's the thing though, even landed white men couldn't vote if they didn't have *enough* land. They explained it away as "Only a landowner of sufficient standing has enough on the line in this country to deserve a say at all" which is ...pretty scummy. It always saddens me when I see blue collar workers renting their home say "The founding fathers weren't ever wrong". My brother in christ, the founding fathers would not have even let you vote, let alone respect you.
Also poll taxes didn’t end until 1965 and 1920 for women voting. The country has never been a democracy and until fairly recently not even close.
That's right. All we need to reduce the outsized power of states with small populations is a constitutional amendment. Which requires 3/4 of the states to agree to it! The party that has consistently benefited from land being more important than people is not going to surrender that power.
I mean one way to achieve that is to increase the size of the house to the smallest population of representatives. If Wyoming gets 1 seat for 500k of population, so should the rest of the USA. The bigger issue is the senate where the tail is wagging the dog. The Senate has far too much power over legislation, and it should really be a house of sober second thought rather than a house of legislation.
If you increase the size of the house then all the pressure gets put on the senate. The initial compromise was that every citizen got an even say and then every state got an even say. It's bonkers that we don't even get the even say for each citizen anymore.
100%. Right now the ability to override the senate is hindered because of smaller states having over representation in the house. I get it. Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what's for dinner. Right now it's the sheep deciding. Having a senate is smart. Having a senate so powerful it stymies the house is not smart.
American democracy is one wolf and two sheep deciding what's for dinner, but due to gerrymandering and structural over-representation of the wolf, the wolf's vote counts for more than the combined vote of the two sheep.
Having a senate isn’t smart, per se. Democracy in the UK and Canada have a toothless upper house, and they operate well. Sweden is a unicameral state, and it isn’t a hell hole.
But there are two Dakotas! Neither of them have attracted any sort of value beyond digging things up but they are worth twice as much as a California! California could become 10 different states all with more people and higher GDPs than a single Dakota but that shouldn't happen because it would be unfair.
We could merge North and South Dakota and Montana and the resulting state would have \~2.5million people. It would be the 37th most populus state right behind Kansas. Why do those 2.5 million people get 6 US Senators, but the 2.9 million in Kansas get 2? It's crazy how few people live in such a large area. My favorite point is that we could combine Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Wyoming, Nebraska, and Kansas and still have few people than Los Angeles County!
You want the 2 senators we have in Kansas? You can have 'em. They're both pretty useless.
North and South Dakota we're actually divided in the first place as a a gerrymandering tactic
Vote in local elections/ state wide elections. It’s all we really can do to help
The turnout for local elections is abysmal. :( This year's local county election had only 18% of the registered voters cast a ballot, and there are definitely more eligible voters than that, to boot, at least 30k more according to census records. This is for a county with 141k people in a metro area of >400k. Midwest America.
This is why I successfully fought to put my towns local elections on the same ballot as nationals. Our city turnout was like 8%, 100 votes could win you a city council seat.
ugh, Virginian here, I have voted in 20 elections (primaries and generals and one special election) over 10 years because we always have national, state, and local all staggered, our last primary had 12% turnout which is the deciding election for most of the locations that are locked R or D.
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In Kansas, when the republican super majority tried to pass a state constitutional amendment to get rid of the right to an abortion they postponed the amendment vote and moved it to a summer primary. Their logic behind doing this was that they knew that even in one of the most religious and republican leaning states in the entire country, their abortion ban was unpopular. In Kansas many areas don't even have a single democrat candidate running so the primary is mostly just republican turnout. They acknowledged that college students are much more likely to vote democrat so they waited until the summer semester. They intentionally chose to make the amendment as confusing as possible. If I remember correctly, they used a few double negatives in the proposed amendment and they even used wording implying that voting against this took power away from the voters to make their own choice(anti choice, lol). And the cherry on top was that about a day or so before the election, a republican group saw the polling and started calling people telling them that voting yes for the amendment would save abortion access in an attempt to confuse pro abortion voters to make a mistake and vote to allow the republicans to ban it. A yes vote was to ban abortion and no was to keep it protected and legal.
Even after all that, the amendment still lost 60/40. Republicans know they have to stoop to these measures to even have a chance, and even with the deck stacked like it was they got blown out.
oh it's 100% because of that! Why else would places like Prince William County, one of the most diverse counties in the US, not have a person of color elected until 2019
This is exactly why I had my county start mailing me all my ballots and why mail in voting is so important. I'm so bad about knowing when local voting day is. I 100% know this is a me problem, though. So I did what I could to remedy the situation. Then Florida purged all the mail on requests, made it so you had to request every year and didn't really notify anyone about it. This fucking state wants no one engaged.
It's the corporate media companies that decimated local news coverage, focusing everyone's attention on national stories for the sake of having an audience to sell ad space and make money. Local media doesn't have the budget to keep up and compete with that in a "private market" so local news has suffered tremendously. We also have national cultures and consciousness about major events in sports or movie releases, chain restaurants that everybody in the country knows about and has at least seen, etc, so when people even have organic conversations with people they can talk about these things, and national races, but not local ones. You have to be talking with very local people to have a discussion about a local race. On top of that, local elections are all on their own schedules, so it's not like we can all just reliably fall back onto that first/2nd Tuesday in November. They occur for school boards, towns, cities, and state governments, and I imagine a lot of regular "Joe's" and "Jane's" don't think too much about the difference between their US Senator and their State Senators, for example. The local elections are definitely where the system is really designed to make a lot of stuff happen but we don't have strong, educated, and informed communities to press on those buttons and levers. The folks who are very good about applying pressure are some of the stupidest and worst people to lead: religious conservatives and older people who are less in-touch with reality and the latest infor.ation and whose conservative fears and inaction has the least impact on what is left of their own lives.
You call it abysmal, I call it the opportunity to win by thin margins.
And unfortunately this favors the absolute nutters like Proud Boy and Moms for Auschwitz candidates. Doubly so when they start sending death threats towards any candidate who runs left of Mussolini, causing them to drop out.
I looked at the GOP primary candidates this past election. They literally all have the same platform. Anti-choice, anti-gun reform, tax cuts for the rich, anti-teacher, cut social services. So of course the runoff was just a contest to see who could say the most outlandish things so that their name gets the most coverage. It gives me very little hope that anything can change when there's absolutely no allowance for nuance in our elections anymore. And of course anyone to the left of them is a "woke liberal".
Hi! I'm running in PA, in a really conservative area. With a lot of work, I did well in the primary. It's possible!!! We just need people to run and tell the voters that they DO have a choice!
Moreso, vote in primary elections. If you don’t like the choices put on your ballot on Election Day, get the better candidates out there. People seriously underestimate the power of a primary election. Very few bother showing up at the primary polls.
Protesting and direct action are things we can and should do.
It's fascinating. Most of the rights we have as human beings in America came from illegal protests and full-on wars. Then, as those rights get taken away by Oligarchs buying our elections, we get told "all" we can do to help is vote. Does voting matter? Of course. If it didn't, they wouldn't try so hard to stop you from voting. But voting is definitely not enough. Women's suffrage, slavery, civil rights, 8 hour work days, Saturdays off, etc., didn't just happen bc those in power woke up one day and decided to do the right thing. They had to be heavily pressured by direct action (sufferage, civil rights) and, in many cases, extreme violence (slavery, labor rights). Democracy will not be saved at the ballot box alone. It will also take either a mass work stoppage or the revival and growth of an Occupy Wall St. type movement that floods cities and centers of power. We didn't get what we have through voting alone, why would that be "all" we need to save what we have?
In gonna vote so hard next year
We should also automatically enroll people to receive mail-in ballots when they turn 18. The right to not vote will still be available to them but the right to vote will become so much easier to exercise.
Our system is very intentionally not a direct democracy. The founding fathers (almost exclusively a bunch of rich elites) were absolutely mortified by the idea of the country descending turning into mob rule.
So instead the opposite has happened and a minority can now play the system to grab majority power in many cases. Talk about path to hell being paved with good intentions.
The idea that the founding fathers had good intentions is kind of blown up by the fact that they let the states set the voting rights for each of their states and most of them only let white, land owning males vote.
That was the intention though, it’s always been about a specific minority holding power and making sure others can’t.
> were absolutely mortified by the idea of the country descending turning into mob rule. And mortified by black people having equal rights or women having the right to vote. Or the riff-raff with no land having the right to vote.
>And mortified by black people having equal rights or women having the right to vote. Or the riff-raff with no land having the right to vote. they didn't have any worries about slaves having equal rights. They were slaves, after all.
“Directly popularly elected” is not the same as “direct democracy” anyway.
“Something something gotta make it fair for rural voters too.” Know what’s fair? If your policies are unpopular, change them so they will be more appealing to people who normally disagree with you.
I never understood why one persons vote should have more power than another’s based solely on their address.
> “Something something gotta make it fair for rural voters too.” And then you explain to them how it actually makes their vote count significantly *more*, they'll turn around and say "well life ain't fair!" in exactly the accent you just imagined.
If you'd just stop with the "winner takes all" electoral college for the state I'm sure the system would become considerably better. It's insane to me that 50.1% nets the same result as 100%.
It's a flawed democracy when the people who depend on it later get to be the ones who can manipulate it. The electoral college is broken but it benefits the right. Having every state have 2 senators regardless of if they are 1 million or 60 million - broken. Allowing state governments to manipulate district zoning to maximize votes for one party - broken. How the hell do you fix a broken system when one party wants it broken.
Also the fact that we cannot do the right thing like add new states (Puerto Rico or Washington DC) all because the right wing will only allow a Red leaning state to enter the Union.
I've met someone who agreed with it. He said Republicans would never win again if we changed it to a fair system.
Because it used to work 99% of the time. However, the most recent elections have seen it not work, and always in the Republicans favor. One of the tenets of American style democracy is about giving the minority group power to not be oppressed by the “tyranny of the majority”, although you could then claim the majority is at threat from the tyranny of the minority. The electoral college and gerrymandering skews elections, and can put less popular candidates in power. In a system of checks and balances, if one party out of only 2 can gain the majority in all 3 branches, you’ve got yourself a bit of a problem.
It’s funny, in a tragic way, that a group of people so worried about the “tyranny of the majority” were and are totally okay with oppressing minority groups.
Every time a thread like this comes up, I’m amazed that the topic of the House of Representatives being locked in size doesn’t come up more. The reason the popular vote usually coincided with the EC winner is because the House was relatively proportional to the population. Now we have states like California that have even less representation than they should because the House’s size has been locked and that also decreases their effect on the EC
As a non American, I don't understand how this criminal can run. Stealing secret documents, selling out national security, openly slandering opposition, all very clear things he's done yet he's allowed to run for any political seat still, let alone president? Also he's far too old
pre-trump, I would agree with you. but he exposed the system for what it is: a bunch of gentlemen's agreements. not enough is codified into law when it comes to the rich and powerful. and this country is swirling down the drain because it's going to be impossible to put the idiot toothpaste back in the tube.
Anyone can run for president as long they meet the age, birth, and residency requirements. Its not a requirement to not be in prison or to not have a felony. You can run for president from federal prison. Thats not really the issue. The issue is that people would still vote for someone who is running from prison. If you could prevent someone from running because they're in prison then that would encourage getting your opponent into prison
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Which is crazy to me, because Biden's administration has done far, far, far more than I expected or was prepared to give him credit for. Handling the Ukraine situation right, rejoining UNESCO, rejoining the Paris Agreement, forgiving federal student loans (or trying to, anyway), successfully pushing Congress to enshrine legal gay marriage… You don't have to like the guy, but if you like all of the things I listed above, that's worth another vote IMO, and we need to make it our business to frame it that way to our friends and family who might be more forgetful of his administration's accomplishments.
From what I’ve been seeing, there’s a non zero chance that a conservative state could turn blue during the election but still be given to Trump.
What is the point of any head to head polls a year and a half out from the election? So, so many things could change between now and then.
Yah, polls this early arent very useful to the public. Im sure the strategists etc for the parties can use it, but id bet even for them its not as meaningful as ppl assume.
What I found to be pretty useful warning signs are the shifts in forum content online. For example Reddit is now allowing far-right propaganda and blatant misinformation on the front page on a daily basis, often couched with hate for minorities and hidden under the veil of things like "scienceuncensored" - a subreddit that very much censors anyting that even questions their intent ( [e.g.](https://old.reddit.com/r/TellReddit/comments/14fg9h5/the_subreddit_rscienceuncensored_is_censoring/) ) Not only that but Reddit also removed the "misinformation" report option - AND has actually been upvoting articles by the daily mail... constantly. _____ A pattern like this is very similar to 2016 and the popular forums and gaming channels that got taken over back then. Only this time there seems to be zero push-back. It looks like things are going to get really *really* bad tbh
TBF, part of that is due to a lot of communities of sensible people taking part in blackouts and other protests, so the junk subs have a larger market share. But also, yeah, Spez is a big fan of Elon so I am not shocked to see misinformation elevated and unable to be reported.
Besides that the video is from RFK Jr, a known grifter, who is a major source of anti-science propaganda, aka part of the "Disinformation Dozen": https://www.npr.org/2021/05/13/996570855/disinformation-dozen-test-facebooks-twitters-ability-to-curb-vaccine-hoaxes > Take anti-vaccine activist Robert F. Kennedy Jr., one of the "Disinformation Dozen" identified by the center, who has promoted the long discredited idea that vaccines are linked to autism. During the pandemic, he has shared baseless conspiracy theories linking 5G cellular networks to the coronavirus, and suggested, without evidence, that the death of baseball great Hank Aaron was "part of a wave of suspicious deaths" tied to vaccines. > None of that is true. > Kennedy was kicked off Instagram, which Facebook owns, in February over repeatedly sharing debunked claims. > Yet Facebook did not remove him from its namesake platform. Grifter, stealing money from ignorant Americans: > He said the crackdown has cost "hundreds of thousands of dollars" in donations to his organization.
> Popular vote doesn't matter. This is correct. I see so many people on Reddit who claim that Biden beat Trump by a lot, but that's not true with respect to the electoral college. Trump beat Hillary by some 10K votes, in the right battleground states, in 2016, despite winning the popular vote. In 2020, Biden [beat Trump by some 270K votes, in the right battleground states](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/biden-beat-trump-votes-swing-states), despite winning the popular vote as well. And [this NPR article is saying just 44K votes separated Trump and Biden from an electoral college tie](https://www.npr.org/2020/12/02/940689086/narrow-wins-in-these-key-states-powered-biden-to-the-presidency). Biden did not beat Trump by a lot. And in 2016, Trump lucked out in the right battleground states, and the right mix of battleground states, to beat Hillary. People keep repeating the popular vote in r/politics over and over again when they refer to Trump's chances. This is totally not true, it's the electoral college that decides the presidency, not the popular vote. **If people don't come out to vote like 2016, Trump can win.**
Also, popular votes don't really matter because *neither* candidate was campaigning for the popular vote. They're playing the game as it exists, which means that they're campaigning for EC votes to win the Presidental election. If they were campaigning for the popular vote, they would campaign differently. Trying to talk about the popular vote in an election that was run based on the existing electoral framework is like trying to talk about a footrace and say that the guy who took the fewest steps during the race should have won; if that was the victory condition, everyone would have been running fundamentally differently from the start. It's really just cherry-picking a metric someone's preferred candidate did better at, regardless of how little it means.
The EC is so f'ing stupid it ensures candidates campaign and focus only on a handful of battleground states. Basically the opposite of what it was ever intended to do: campaign in all different states, economic classes of people, urban vs rural, etc. I also think no popular vote we've ever had in recent history is useful or accurate from that standpoint. Why bother voting in California, TX, DC or Mississippi if your state's electoral votes were decided before the race even started? Sure you still need people to vote, but it has to affect turnout.
Wdym? It’s a perfect system! My vote has literally never counted in a presidential election. Ever. Works just as intended.
> Basically the opposite of what it was ever intended to do: campaign in all different states, economic classes of people, urban vs rural, etc. That wasn't really the original intention of the EC. Because campaigning in general wasn't really a big thing until the 1900s. Candidates would release statements, but there was no traveling around the country. The first recognized public campaigning for the presidency was Benjamin Harrison doing speeches from his front porch. Most presidents in the early days were not big time charismatic celeberties like they are now. They were mostly bureaucrats who worked their way up the government or war generals. It was treated as an honor and a real job to be president, not this popularity contest it is today.
Cook Political Report currently estimates the electoral college advantage at about R+3. So the Ds need to beat them by 4, give or take. https://www.cookpolitical.com/cook-pvi/2022-partisan-voter-index/republican-electoral-college-advantage
The point isn't really to show who is going to win the election but rather to show a trend in favorability of candidates. If you use the same methods every poll you should be able to create this trend.
https://www.270towin.com/ PA, GA, WI, AZ. That's the election. IMHO, we can get PA WI and AZ without too much trouble. That puts us well over the line. I live in PA, Trump has no chance here. Even conservatives are getting less enthusiastic about him.
Where do you live in PA? Outside the bigger cities, state college, etc. there seems to be plenty of support for Trump. I’m not saying he’ll win PA, but the idea that he has “no chance” sounds premature to me.
I don't want to be specific about my location. Suffice it to say it is in the outermost edge of the suburbs of a city. Lots of rural people come into the area to shop. My district does vote red for congress. I can tell that enthusiasm has waned, considerably, among gop voters.
I hope you’re right. After 2016, it’s hard to take anything for granted.
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I've noticed the same. Other than the fringe "Trump 2024" flag from a clearly deranged person I don't see the amount of enthusiasm for Trump as a I saw in 2016 or 2020. My own extended family, some of whom were pretty "die hard" supporters, have said that they won't vote for him again. It took 5 years an attempted coup and subsequent pandering but I think the majority of people see through his bullshit now. Sad that it took that long and almost the downfall of our democracy to get us here.
> I can tell that enthusiasm has waned, considerably, among gop voters. It has. I've heard people say that if it's Trump vs Biden they are just not going to vote. Hopefully at least some of them stick to that. Most Republican voters could never vote for Biden because of the religious culture war implications of doing so (they believe it's a sin to vote for a pro-gay, pro-abortion candidate), but if they choose to stay home rather than vote for Trump, he loses.
The base wasn't particularly enthusiastic about Trump until he became the candidate in 2016, and then they fell in line. Hard. Falling in line and holding their nose is what conservatives do best. Never underestimate their willingness to cut off their nose, ears, lips, forehead, chin, cheeks, and skull, in order to spite their face.
Trump has held PA to a +/-2% in 16 and 20. He won by .72% and lost by 1.17% respectively. I don't think any state embodies the pull Trump has on low propensity voters like Pennsylvania does. In 2018 Wolf won his gubernatorial reelection by 17% and Shapiro won in 2022 by 15%. The fact that Trump comes within 1% of winning in a state where democratic governors have won by double digits in the last few elections is definitely a cause for concern.
Trump can 100% take Wisconsin. Ron fucking Johnson won re-election in 2022. Biden won Wisconsin by *20,000* votes in 2020, Trump won Wisconsin by 23,000 votes in 2016. Wisconsin is *not* a sure thing.
Ron Johnson won by scaring old people about his black opponent being "soft on crime". Since then, Dems won more Wisconsin supreme court seats. Ron's constituents are frightened old white people, who are more likely to relate to Biden on that front.
Johnson is awful, one of the worst senators, but Mandela Barnes did shoot himself in the foot by publicly supporting defund the police. I know he tried to walk it back some while he was campaigning but that's basically the blue equivalent of being super hard line on abortion. It's just an all around liability polling wise. Tony Evers did get re-elected as Governor at least which does lend some credence to your old white people theory.
It's a good sign that Michigan is no longer considered one that needs to be worried about. Guess we have Whitmer and the other Democrats to thank for that. I'd also throw in Nevada and North Carolina as relevant battlegrounds though. Cortez-Masto barely scraped by in NV during the mid terms and NC was Biden's closest loss in 2020 by just a point and a half. I've got an eye on Texas as well, it's a long shot but seems like it could get close especially with Cruz on the ballot given how poorly he performed six years ago.
It should. The democrats keep presenting bills and the republicans keep blocking it. Republicans depend on gerrymandering, redistricting, lack of access, the electoral college- otherwise they'd never win because their policy is shit. I don't know why america doesn't fight harder for their voices, their right to vote, their rights period. Why not hold your representatives accountable. Never let them get a moment's peace until they do. Not to eat, sleep... not to shit. Hold them accountable, People. Or continue to struggle. 🤷
> I don't know why america doesn't fight harder for their voices, their right to vote, their rights period. Why not hold your representatives accountable. Because as you pointed out, one of the two major parties has a vested interest in things staying the way they are. If it ever happened that Democrats won the presidency multiple times while losing the popular vote (or, if that *ever* happened), Republicans would abolish the Electoral College the next day.
All it takes is for Dems to stay home election day - it's what defeated Hillary and it can do the same to President Biden. Remember Hillary won the popular vote by over 1,000,000 but lost in 4 key states by 75,000,
And the fact that he isn't currently in office causing daily outrage among the citizenry is going to be an issue. This country has the attention span of a goldfish, and won't remember how awful every day was under this guy who had to make the news EVERYDAY by doing or saying something that was absolutely terrifying.
Her margin over Trump in the popular vote was more like 4 million wasn’t it? Edit: it was almost 3 million.
Translation: Don’t take Biden’s huge chances of winning lightly. You still have to vote, even if Trump is sitting in prison on Election Day, you still need to vote. Dems are too comfortable with, “oh, we got this. I don’t need to vote in this one”, despite being the more educated and arguably more intelligent party, they still act quite dumb when it comes to the important stuff.
This is exactly what happened the first time he ran. I truly don’t think a lot of Dems thought he had a chance in hell. You gotta vote like your life depends on it - because for so SO many people it does.
I was 18 when Trump won. I didn't vote, because I thought people had to be stupid to not choose Clinton over him. I was wrong. Now, I cast my vote whenever I get the chance.
I think that was the case for a lot of people. They didn't like Hillary and felt like she was going to win anyway, so they stayed home.
I went to a post election protest and the number of people who made time for the protest but not to vote the week before was shocking.
I really liked Bernie Sanders in 2016. I remember everyone in the various Bernie subs was shocked he did so badly in the primaries. Then someone asked these people who were spending all day posting Bernie memes what percentage actually voted in their primaries. The results were a joy for fans of single-digit numbers. Also, despite how unlikable Hillary was, I made it a point to vote for her because I knew I wasn’t voting for Hillary, I was voting for the next three Supreme Court justices. I’ve been spending way too much time since then saying “I told you so!”
And after Hillary was officially the nominee, Bernie practically got on his knees and begged people to vote for her.
No, you were correct. You would have to be stupid to vote for Trump. Unfortunately, there's a lot more very stupid people out there than we realized.
If you're talking about 2016, the Democratic nominee had a big part in Democrats staying home. During the primary election, Clinton was asked what she would do to win over Sanders voters to support her in the general election given that she was the heavy favorite and under-performed. I'll never forget Clinton's answer: "We have the votes." She could have said we'll increase the minimum wage. We'll lower the retirement age. She could have lied through her teeth to win over more voter but she was too interested in wrapping up the primary to even try. Her campaign was trash and deserves a lot of blame for Trump's win.
There are many reasons for the outcome of the 2016 election, but in my mind, Democratic hubris was the largest. The Democratic party took some states for granted. They lost WI and MI and nearly MN when they assumed they were all in the bag. IIRC, Clinton never even visited WI during the campaign.
And let’s not forget her braindead self-important campaign slogan: “I’m with her.” How about instead: “She’s with us.” The tone-deafness and hubris was ridiculous.
The hubris is totally right. So many people thought it was a long shot that trump would win - including Hilary. She phoned it in.
And now they are doing it again. No one wanted Biden the first time, he only won because he was "not trump." Without the pandemic raging as hot as it was in 2020, I think Trump has a pretty good shot at winning. Democrats are amazing to me in their hubris, not even allowing anyone to challenge Biden. Truly insane behavior, I absolutely loathe the DNC and the Democratic party, they will all clutch power until their dying day while the world slips into catastrophe.
I always say it was never Trump's election to win, it was Clinton's to lose. With their constant message of "fall in line" and the dismissal of everything Sanders pushed for and that his base supported, it was *extremely* common for people to vote for Trump just to make a point, or vote third-party/not vote/write in vote. She lost that election by her own fault, by assuming everyone would just fall in and vote D, and disenfranchised her own new base in doing so. I don't know of a single person my age who actually *likes* her, only people who voted for her to not vote Trump, or who voted against her in any other way they could.
Don't forget Bernie tried to help her anyway and got his voters from the primary to vote for her in record numbers... meanwhile she still blamed him anyway after she lost. Meanwhile exit polls and such show Bernie did a much better job at putting his weight behind her, than she did for Obama in 08.
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Dems sit on their laurels instead of being a warrior for the working people party and just say GOP bad! See what Trump says and will do! Vote for us OR ELSE! But what do we get for our votes? You get to not have Trump and that's enough!
Exactly. Legalize weed and pass universal healthcare. Slam dunk.
Two steps that would guarantee the GOP get slaughtered as they should with their lack of policy.
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It's bonkers to me that we have a country as large and diverse as the US with only TWO parties to represent all our interests? No wonder everyone feels screwed.
>But what do we get for our votes? Infrastructure
as someone who works professionally in infrastructure, can confirm that the vast majority of people don't think about it until there's a problem... by which time it may already be too late
I'll take not going back decades on social and climate progress and keeping a democracy even if we're not moving forward but you do you.
Yeah, I’m hoping most of America isn’t as bonkers and depraved as the GOP. They really love this crooked ass motherfucker
My ultra-conservative Parents swear to never vote for Trump and to not vote for Republicans if they run him again. I don't know if that will hold in the ballot box, or some new republican boogeyman/wedge issue will take over that is somehow scarier than Trump. But I am hoping it's more indicative of the wider Republican base.
My dad has voted Republican his whole life and he won't vote for Trump -- and told me he didn't last time. My mom still does, though. They are very conservative Christians living in a super rural area. It's hard to break these people out of their bubble but I'm sure my dad isn't the only Republican who has taken this stance.
Yeah, my pops still didn't say he would vote Democrat, but said he'd go "independent". Baby-steps for an 80 year old.
2020 and 2022 showed us that most Americans do not like Trump. If you're worried about not enough people showing up to the polls, you should start phonebanking and canvassing now. Those are guaranteed ways to increase turnout.
There are Republicans who don't like Trump but will vote for him just because of the r next to his name even if it is voting for someone that is not in their best interests
'member Georgia Senate football guy almost won last year.
Incumbent usually wins. The only reason people come out to vote in massive numbers is when they are suffering. For the most part everything is pretty stable. Inflation is plateauing, jobs are increasing, the market is stable or trending up, and the POTUS isn't in the news every hour for something stupid. I am fine with this fear mongering to get more votes out there because there are a ton of down ticket races that could use the help.
Conservatives believe they are suffering and will be out en masse to vote for anyone with the R. Complacency is our death.
30% of the country is a lost cause. No matter what happens they'll vote for a Republican. I ignore that percentage and focus on about the middle 30%, those who can be reached and aren't completely brainwashed.
I personally believe that percent is higher. Conservatives that lean more centric will still vote R because a good many of them may not agree with Trump as a person but agree with his policies.
They THINK they agree with the policies and don't realize that those policies are actually hurting them.
Which is even sadder. My family is sooooo against the infrastructure bill/IRA and were super happy when the tax cuts in 2017 were passed. The reason why they liked the tax cuts in 2017, they got a $1000 bonus from their jobs and they pointed to that bonus as a sign that the tax cuts helped them.
Immediate returns always leave a lasting mark. I still remember when I won $700 at the slots 20 years ago when money was tight. I had a commission based job and had $10 to my name. Gambling seemed like the least risky thing to do that day. I also remember my $20,000 hospital bill from 18 years ago. Then, not being able to work, having my car repoed, losing my apartment, and having to file bankruptcy. We get morsels when things go right, then bent over, no lube raped, when things go south.
Which is interesting because the right blames inflation on Biden and the last Covid bill passed under him forgetting the literal check with trumps name on it. It’s so strange how money from trump =good and money from Biden is bad and socialism. Cognitive dissidence.
Exactly, stimulus checks were just a fraction of the bill. Most of it went to corporations, where they gave out massive bonuses.
Biden's lead over him is excellent, actually. He's actually governing right now and hasn't remotely flipped to campaign mode. The trials of Trump are only going to make things worse for him. **Trump took away reproductive rights from half the country**. That's his most enduring legacy and he just promised more appointments who will do *worse* than that. This kills his chances in states like Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Arizona, etc. VOTE-VOTE-VOTE naturally. But I see too much fatalism on this sub about extremely early polling. NOTE: 100% correct about down ballot... if Dems lose the Senate, McConnell blocks ANY Court appointment.
Don't underestimate the fact that a portion of GOP women voters gladly handed over that right and agree with it being taken.
It’s sad this is a reality, but I simply cannot see trump being able to keep it together for the next year. He’s making stupid unforced errors on his legal issues almost daily and as the pressure cranks up, the errors will become worse and more regularly.
Trump could be in Prison a year from today, and he might still win the Presidency. He's their Jesus Christ. They want him to be their martyr on the cross.
The NYT had an interesting thing about what could happen there. Basically if he wins, it doesn't matter if he's found guilty for the couple indictments he already has, the Justice Department can release him from prison to perform as president. Basically only a guilty verdict about Jan 6th keeps him out of the White House.
I'm starting to think the Founding Father's didn't think through what would happen if we elected someone like Trump as president.
They did, it was the entire point of the electoral college. To prevent people like Trump from becoming president. It just doesn't work as intended anymore because it's a formality at this point.
well it's actually working out to have the opposite effect in the modern world. popular vote would be a better representation of the people as a representative democracy.
I fully agree, then we wouldn't have had a Republican president for the last 30 years.
Trump is cranking the "any publicity is good publicity" to 11. So far it's worked for him. He's saying indictments are a badge of honor. He'll say his jail cell is nicer than Trump Tower.
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They wouldn’t consider it, there’s too much money to be lost. Trump makes good tv in financial terms alone.
That's how he won in the first place. They gave him a massive amount of free press for the spectacle and he just rode it into the White House.
Most people can't get a job interview with a single criminal charge or conviction against them, but a treasonous, twice impeached ex-President can run for President again? The US system is clearly a con game for the rich and powerful.
I actually don't disagree with being able to run for president if he's charged, but it pisses me off a lot that he's still considered a heavy contender despite being charged. I've seen how Putin throws false charges on his opponent to not want to see a future where it is actually used as a weapon to keep political rivals out, but Trump is so clearly guilty of so much stuff and he should have been disowned by his party years ago instead of being the rallying point of it.
Well, no. A president guilty of treason cannot run again.
It's tragic if those most wanting to destroy democracy are more motivated to vote than those most wanting to save it.
I feel like I think this every election, but if Americans still haven't learned I guess I just give up on the whole experiment. The fact it's even close is depressing. Support for Trump should be on about the same level as people who think the Moon is made of cheese. You'll get about 10% literal crazy people and trolls in any poll, anything past that is an indictment on society as a whole.
As an American, this frustrates me too. It's embarrassing. I don't get it at all how you can time and time again see and hear this man do truly despicable things and be like "yeah he's just great!" Like what the actual fuck is wrong with them?!! Did they stare into his soulless eyes for too long and are under a spell?!
I think it's because people don't "see and hear this man do truly despicable things". It's some combination of: * They don't follow the news, all they know is that he has an R next to his name, is "pro-life" , etc. Those singular facts are enough to get their support * They've been conditioned to believe that anything they hear that is contrary to their baseline belief of Trump being great must be a lie
Since we live in the worst timeline, trump goes to jail, wins election from jail, pardons himself.
There’s no reason why Trump should lead in any poll or be a threat in the general election. Biden has accomplished more than any president since FDR. In 2022 alone, Biden and Dems did the following: * passed the Inflation Reduction Act, the biggest investment in fighting climate change in history * passed the bipartisan infrastructure bill, the largest investment in infrastructure since Eisenhower * passed the Bipartisan Safer Communities Act, breaking a 30-year streak of federal inaction on gun violence legislation * signed the CHIPS and Science Act into law * took out the leader of al Qaeda * ended America's longest war * reauthorized and strengthened the Violence Against Women Act * signed the PACT Act, a bill to address veteran burn pit exposure * signed the NATO accession protocols for Sweden and Finland * issued executive order to protect reproductive rights * in the process of canceling $10,000 of student loan debt for borrowers making less than $125,000 and canceled $20,000 in debt for Pell Grant recipients * canceled billions in student loan debt for borrowers who were defrauded * nominated now-Supreme Court Associate Justice Ketanji Brown Jackson to replace Justice Breyer * brought COVID under control in the U.S. (e.g., COVID deaths down 90% and over 220 million vaccinated) * formed Monkeypox response team to reach communities at highest risk of contracting the virus * unemployment at a 50-year low * largest one-year deficit reduction in U.S. history * limited the release of mercury from coal-burning power plants * $5 billion for electric vehicle chargers- $119 billion budget surplus in January 2022, first in over two years * united world against Russia’s war in Ukraine * ended forced arbitration in workplace sexual assault cases * reinstated California authority to set pollution standards for cars * ended asylum restrictions for children traveling alone * signed the Emmett Till Anti-Lynching Act, the first federal ban on lynching after 200 failed attempts * Initiated “use it or lose it" policy for drilling on public lands to force oil companies to increase production * released 1 million barrels of oil a day for 6 months from strategic reserves to ease gas prices * rescinded Trump-era policy allowing rapid expulsion of migrants * expunged student loan defaults * overhauled USPS finances to allow the agency to modernize its service * required federal dollars spent on infrastructure to use materials made in America * restored environmental reviews for major infrastructure projects * Launched $6 billion effort to save distressed nuclear plants * provided $385 million to help families and individuals with home energy costs through the Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program. (This is in addition to $4.5 billion provided in the American Rescue Plan.) * national registry of police officers who are fired for misconduct * tightened restrictions on chokeholds, no-knock warrants, and transfer of military equipment to police departments * required all federal law enforcement officers to wear body cameras * $265 million for South Florida reservoir, key component of Everglades restoration * major wind farm project off West coast to provide electricity for 1.5 million homes * continued Obama administration's practice of posting log records of visitors to White House * devoted $2.1 billion to strengthen US food supply chain * invoked Defense Production Act to rapidly expand domestic production of critical clean energy technologies * enacted two-year pause of anti-circumvention tariffs on solar * allocated funds to federal agencies to counter 300-plus anti-LGBTQ laws by state lawmakers in 2022 * relaunched cancer 'moonshot' initiative to help cut death rate * expanded access to emergency contraception and long-acting reversible contraception * prevented states from banning Mifepristone, a medication used to end early pregnancy that has FDA approval * 21 executive actions to reduce gun violence * Climate Smart Buildings Initiative: Creates public-private partnerships to modernize Federal buildings to meet agencies’ missions, create good-paying jobs, and cut greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions * Paying for today’s needed renovations with tomorrow’s energy savings without requiring upfront taxpayer funding * ended Trump-era “Remain in Mexico” policy * Operation Fly-Formula, bringing needed baby formula (19 missions to date) * executive order protecting travel for abortion * invested more in crime control and prevention than any president in history * provided death, disability, and education benefits to public safety officers and survivors who are killed or injured in the line of duty * Reunited 500 migrant families separated under Trump * $1.66 billion in grants to transit agencies, territories, and states to invest in 150 bus fleets and facilities * brokered joint US/Mexico infrastructure project; Mexico to pay $1.5 billion for US border security * blocked 4 hospital mergers that would've driven up prices and is poised to thwart more anti-competition consolidation attempts * 11 million jobs—more than ever created before at this point of a presidency * record small business creation * banned paywalls on taxpayer-funded research * best economic growth record since Clinton * eliminated civil statute of limitations for child abuse victims * announced $156 million for America's first-of-its-kind critical minerals refinery, demonstrating the commercial viability of turning mine waste into clean energy technology.
But Trump owns the Libs. The people who vote for Trump care about nothing you’ve listed.
The people that vote for Trump don't know any of these things happened either.
And if they did, they'd figure out a way to claim they are bad.
They already do, almost everything here they just say is part of big liberal government spending and causing inflation or allowing open borders
I think you misspelt those scary words "communism" & "woke"
Or claim it was really republicans who did that anyways, even though they voted against mostly all of it.
Modern conservatism isn't an ideology, it's a tribe.
I voted for Biden and even I didn't know about most of these, although I now know more about submarines than I ever thought I would. Journalism in the US is a bit of a joke.
This is the biggest truth to the current political divide. A major part of the country hasn’t even heard about Biden’s infrastructure bill because they prescribe to news outlets and social bubbles that completely ignore any talk of anything that would show Biden in a positive light.
>The people that vote for Trump don't know any ~~of these~~ thing~~s happened either.~~ FTFY
It's not about getting their votes. Their votes are already cast and aren't worth fighting for. The cult is the cult. It's getting those folks who sit on the fence every election and those who don't normally vote that matters.
This. We must get as many people out to vote as possible. They didn't win the popular vote last time or the time before that and probably longer. But they gerryrmandered every thing in the favor
TeLl Me OnE gOoD tHiNg BiDeN hAs DoNe * Hand them this list "Where'd you get that list?? The liberal media? Fake news!"
According and thanks to NBC News, et al., none of that matters as much as the GOP's boogeyman du jour
Exactly. What is Biden doing to prevent the secret trans plot to convert all children with secret YA books in school libraries that acknowledge the existence of the LGBT community? Nothing I bet.
He could make drag shows punishable by death and the GOP would counterspin. It literally doesn’t matter what the policy is.
Trump owns the cult primary. Biden owns the general and Democracy. It's that simple.
Be realistic, LBJ did a hell of a lot more substantial progressive legislation
True, though the vietnam war was his biggest failure. Though I just loved how he just went and bullied the living shit outta congress.
LBJ also had a very different Congress to work with.
Biden beat him by 7 million votes in 2020, but less than 100,000 votes were different in a few states and Trump would have won. The Electoral College helps republicans.
Probably a good time to activate your progressive base
I just listened to Steve Kornacki on MSNBC talk about poll numbers. He started out with Joe Biden - how his favorability number is so low and how concerned Democratic voters are of his age and mental ability... then he went on to the Republican poll numbers and talked about how much Republican voters favor Donald Trump and to a lesser extent like Ron DeSantis. Notice anything? Negative about the Democrats, positive about the Republicans. It's the same thing they did to Hillary in 2016. They talked incessantly about her emails and her unlikability factor... and gave Trump 24/7 free coverage. I'd say media want's Donald Trump to be president again to pad their bottom lines. America is addicted to Reality TV and Trump is the star. Disgusting. Politics should not be entertainment. It affects people's lives.
They also complained about Biden being too old to run the first time. Guess how old trump will be in 2024. There is no logic with these people. Man woman camera person tv
>There is no logic with these people Democrats complain about Biden's age. Republicans don't complain about Trump's age. That's why there's a difference in what is reported. From what OP said it wasn't reporting about Trump vs Biden. It was reporting about how the candidate's are viewed by their own parties.
Tbf they are both far too old to be running for president. I don't have faith in either of them surviving 4 more years.
Won't be an issue if everyone who showed up in 2020 and 2022 does so again. If you're concerned about that and want to make sure it happens, go start donating and volunteering for Democrats *now*. That has a much greater impact on elections than telling people on Reddit to vote.
Only way to prevent it is to vote. So vote.
Nothing can really be done when half the voting population want this... Our problems are much deeper than Trump... The people voting think when fascism comes its only going to affect people they do not like. There will be millions claiming foul when the fascist come for them. They will either lie and say they never supported the GOP platform, or they will say they never saw it coming.
I dont understand how anyone can possibly trust him ever again?!? He literally handed over our most important secrets ABOUT US WEAKNESSES AND VULNERABILITIES TO OUR ENEMIES?? He put us all in danger and they see NO problem with that??? WTAF! why is it not a bigger deal? It's the hugest fucking deal
He hates democrats. It’s that simple. He mocks them and doesn’t hide it. That’s all that matters in politics any more. Do you hate the other side
I don’t know how so many people forget his most egregious transgression by down playing and lying about COVID getting his base to refuse vaccines to the point that, from what I understand, an additional 300,000 Americans needlessly died all because of his insane ego. He kill hundred of thousands of Americans by willful negligence.
If you vote for this man in 2024 you are a treasonous piece of shit to this country.
Preach!
Biden is oddly unpopular despite his accomplishments and the electoral college is always a threat. I definitely am still sweating this one
The con's already have their spoiler green strawman candidate ready and they are building him up on every social platform there is. RFK Jr.
The threat to this country of Trump wins is very real.
2016 has taught us to never underestimate this scum. 46% folks will vote for him no matter what and Biden might need to secure at least 49% or more of the vote to win because of the electoral college.
He's going to be the nominee and conservatives will get behind them. If he wins that will be the last even marginally free election we have. We either win or become slaves to conservative fascists.
Ya ya. We have a lot of dumb people in this country, we get it. Really wish all politicians were on mute and we only got to see what they voted on and why they voted that way.
If we roll into the 2024 elections without some sort of harsh resolution to the "fake electors" nonsense, then we are in for more of the same. Honestly, even if every one of those dipshits goes to jail we're just going to have a whole new set of morons lining up to do the dirty work of DJT.
Not American so can’t do much here - please don’t vote him back in
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