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If the pressure ratchets up, he still has an out with that response. If he does eventually bow out, he'll say he did it on his own terms and nobody else's.
That's what I was thinking. Stepping down on your own accord versus, "they made me do it." I have faith that Biden will do the right thing when the time comes.
As long as they can get someone electable and fast, please fuckin' do it. It's not an overstatement that the future of the fuckin' planet might be at stake.
They learned nothing from RBG and Hillary.
We are at a point where Mitt Romney is saying hes done because of his age. A man in the actual cult that is Mormonism has the decency to be done.
Maybe they can roll out the corpse of Diane feinstein and have Jimmy Carter as the VP.
Can u imagine if the DNC hadnt decided to fuck Bernie over, and right now we'd be working towards medicare for all and watching him dunk all over trump in every debate?
These people have layers of financial and political pressure around them that are unenviable and make them do things they never probably thought they could or even would consider.
The system breaks people. We need term limits, age limits, and public finance of candidates with a removal of private money. It won't happen.
We have what we have. They managed to make Trump look coherent with a saucer eyed old man staring thru time and space at the abyss before him.
The Democrats ruined 4 years of good faith with that debate, watched the Republicans stack the supreme court, and make people forget about the likes of MTG, boebert, Christian nationalism, etc it goes on and on.
No, if we go into fascism, it will be the fault of the voters that put Trump in office, period: whether by thinking Trump "isn't old" or by voting Third Party, it would be the fault of whoever can't suck it up and vote for the platform instead of acting offended that their perfect candidate isn't on the ballot.
I mean lets get real here, that's what this is if you read between the lines. He's setting this up to be his own choice (if he makes it) and preserve his current presidency.
And he's absolutely right. No one should be forcing him out and when he decides to drop out we will treat it as such because he's important to the next candidates campaign no matter who it is. They will be running on his record.
I agree and think it would be sort of odd for him to drop out of the race in the *immediate* aftermath of the debate. This isn’t just about him dropping out; he has to set this up not only to be his “choice” but also to provide a smooth transition to wherever this goes next, and I think that’s hardly clear at this point. He can’t just say, “well, I’m out. Good luck everybody else, you can all figure out what comes next!” *mic drop* They have to figure out whether Kamala takes up the banner or someone else. Whether to do this as a brokered convention or done as a more orderly “mini-primary.”
There’s definitely a lot of work to be done behind the scenes. He’s either 100% in or 100% out but he won’t be anywhere in between in the meantime. But if he *does* drop out, I would expect to see him do that 2-3 weeks out from the debate, maybe even a full month. Hopefully sooner though, the sooner the better. Only six days after the debate is a little unrealistic.
I think it'll personally come next week or not at all. The longer it goes the more the party will splinter and hurt the entire thing. People behind the scenes are not going to hold their tongues if it looks like he's staying.
I said Friday morning after the debate that IF Biden drops it’ll be after the 4th of July holiday weekend. That gives them time to assess the damage, make a decision, have the important conversations with the important players, get their ducks in a row while everyone else is distracted by fireworks and hotdogs. Replacing the already-selected candidate, even if it’s not official, and especially if it’s the *incumbent president* takes time and can’t be a knee jerk reaction.
Completely agree. Groundwork to make this a smooth transition is quietly being laid, and if its a bit after the debate not immediately it will seem much more like Biden cementing his legacy and taking the high road, not being a feeble old man pushed out of the way.
He’s a proud guy. While his own *condition* isn’t new to him, he probably wasn’t expecting 50+ years of public service and his entire career to unceremoniously come crashing down on him on account of a lousy debate. It’s totally possible he needs a moment to process it all, which is why I think friends of his like Clyburn and others are reaching out to him. I’d like this to go quickly for obvious reasons but I can understand if an unprecedented thing like this takes a couple weeks or so.
They would be wiser not to run on his record.
Biden gaslighting Americans into thinking inflation isn't real and the economy is great is probably his second biggest problem. Number 1 being his brain melted on live TV of course.
Also, continuing unconditional support for Israel and pushing Ukraine away from peace talks are also loser issues with the American public. Most Americans want a ceasefire in both conflicts.
Only part of his record that's good is Antitrust and Labor rights. Afghanistan withdrawal as well but the media of course attacked him for that despite it being the correct decision.
Biden's record is outstanding overall lol, you're parroting right wing talking points. Inflation is obviously real but compare the US to the world here and it shows the stark difference is how well America has handled the years since covid and the war starting. Overall speaking from a statistical economic standpoint, Biden has been one of the better presidents in the last 5\~ decades. That just doesn't translate well to the average person because of how poor the global economic situation is.
With Ukraine, you're just flat out wrong and just quoting the republican approval numbers for these things. Majority of American's are still onboard with whats going on and a cease fire is absolutely about the stupidest decision that could be made on that front.
[https://news.gallup.com/poll/643601/americans-say-not-helping-ukraine-enough.aspx](https://news.gallup.com/poll/643601/americans-say-not-helping-ukraine-enough.aspx)
[https://news.gallup.com/poll/513680/american-views-ukraine-war-charts.aspx](https://news.gallup.com/poll/513680/american-views-ukraine-war-charts.aspx)
Bro, article is from April. Do better. Even Zelensky is trying to hold peace summits lol. Besides Putin, or maybe equal to him, we are holding back the possibility of peace. Folks like Biden refuse to accept the new reality. We live in a multipolar world. Biden should have used China as a lever against Russia. Instead we've isolated ourselves even more and pushed China closer to Russia. We've diminished the dollar around the world as the BRICS nations move to their own currency. Hell even North Korea is sending them weapons now. The average age of Ukrainian solider is in the 50s. At least a half million fighting age men fled the country to surrounding nations to avoid the slaughter. There losing territory and the counter offensives go nowhere. Russias artillery advantage is so wide, that even if the US exhausted our own emergency stockpiles we couldn't close the gap.
The Ukrainian policy is a failure on all levels. Anyone still holding on to the idea they will beat back the Russians into the pre war borders, or even take back Crimea, has lost their mind. The question is, will Ukraine make peace before or after the collapse of the state? Reality is the ghouls running our state department saw this as an excuse to pump more money to the military industrial complex and play geopolitics against Russia like it's still the Cold war. Classic late stage Empire behavior.
Comparing inflation to the rest of the world is the definition of gaslighting. Also, just as a basic political philosophy, it's always better to empathize with folks then tell them they actually have it pretty good! Something that was allegedly one of Bidens strengths.
It's not right wing talking points. Independent voters don't see Bidens policies favorably.
>...and pushing Ukraine away from peace talks are also loser issues with the American public.
I vehemently disagree that abandoning Ukraine to Russia's predations (make no mistake, because that is what "peace talks" would entail) is a losing issue. But with that said, there are plenty of positive things they can cherry-pick from his record to run on. It's a great opportunity, honestly.
Take a look at basically any poll.
Biden is viewed unfavorably on his foreign policy and domestic policy.
A new candidate would be wise to distance themselves from Biden as much as feasibly possible.
I feel Democrats are in a bubble similar to the MAGA folks.
If a new candidate says they want to be tougher on Bibi I’m all for that. As for a “peace deal” in Ukraine, fuck that. How long do you think “peace” will last before the next wave of tanks/artillery/infantry storm further into Eastern Europe? Just be honest and say you want to surrender to Russia, that’s exactly what you’re talking about.
Are you a Democrat/Lefty or some sort of Cold War Reaganite? Serious question.
Do you think if Ukraine makes peace with Russia on the world stage, they will literally throw it out the next day and reinvade? Are you a cartoon character? Is this John Bolton's burner account?
Could Russia eventually go to war with Ukraine again in the future? Sure. But giving Ukraine time to rebuild and strengthen its military would only help Ukraine at this point. I feel like I'm living in 1984 where War is Peace.
You only make peace with your enemies. Ukraine is losing. Agreeing to cede parts of Luhansk, Crimea, and the Donbas, no NATO membership is a small price to pay to exist as a nation. The other option is complete collapse. There is no taking back the territory hoss. That's the military reality on the ground that even the Ukrainian high command has admitted too.
I have no idea how the standard democratic party position has become the policy of John Bolton. Living in the upside down I guess.
You really think Russia would make a peace deal with Ukraine that allows them to rearm? They won’t be allowed to join NATO, they’ll cede sovereignty to Russia, they WON’T be allowed to rearm/rebuild, and if they actually make a deal with Russia, won’t be allowed to have any kind of standing army at all.
You can call me a “Reaganite” all you want. Do you mind if I call you Neville?
Wow. John Bolton also calls everyone who isn't pro never ending war Neville Chamberlain as well. You realize there are armed conflicts other than WW2? Almost all of them end in armistice.
Ukraine joining NATO should be a non starter anyway. Would you be okay with Cuba joining a nuclear suicide pact with Russia or China? Of course not. It's like you have never heard of MAD or nuclear winter. Putting every nation in Europe in NATO is a sure fire way to end the species. George Kennan, a literal founding father of sorts for NATO, repeatedly warned expanding NATO Eastward would only embolden autocrats in Russia and put the world in peril. But I guess he was just a Putin apologist.
Simply shouting that Putin is Hitler doesn't make it true. If Hitler had tactical nuclear weapons, he would have used them. The Russians haven't. Putin is bad but that doesn't mean he's a complete madman. Hell, compared to the Israelis(who we arm unconditionally) he's following the laws of armed conflict. Not to say he isn't committing war crimes.
If your argument is that we must put maximal military and diplomatic pressure until Russia makes Putin go away, you're arguing for an apocalypse.
The fate of Russia is up to everyday Russians. We can't pull the strings from here. They've had revolutions before. You have to have peace and hope from change from within. They have a nuclear arsenal that can destroy the world.
This war is more like Russia's Iraq War. We illegally invaded a sovereign country under false pretenses and caused absolute destruction (Google Julian Assange WikiLeaks). Was that right of us? Of course not. But should the world have threatened nuclear holocaust if George W Bush didn't leave office? Don't let Trump break your brain. Come back to reality.
You mean polls like [this](https://www.pewresearch.org/global/2024/05/08/views-of-ukraine-and-u-s-involvement-with-the-russia-ukraine-war/) that show 49% of Americans believe we are doing enough (or not enough) to help Ukraine vs. 31% (mainly driven by GOP sentiment) that feel we are doing too much? Abandoning Ukraine is Trump's position, and there is no reason in the world (political or moral) that we should ever *dream* of embracing it.
You basically admit your foreign policy position is in "opposition to Trump". A ridiculous way to look at world affairs. Trump doesn't believe in anything. He just says whatever pops in his head. Looking to him and doing the opposite is just chaos.
There is no way for Ukraine to regain the territory. We should have pushed them to sue for peace after that first successful counter offensive. It was the US who "advised" the Ukrainians not to sue for peace.
The military industrial complex does not care about Ukrainian sovereignty. If you believe that I have a bridge to sell you. They want an excuse to print money for contractors in northern Virginia and relive the Cold War. It's a stupid policy.
People seem to forget the Obama administration, with Joe Biden as VP, allowed Putin to play his games in Crimea. To paraphrase Obama, Ukraine is more in the Russian interest than ours. Trump actually reversed the policy, and shipped the missiles the Ukrainians wanted, after a bit of extortion of course in true Orange man fashion. Somehow all of this has been forgotten, and I am to believe that as goes the eastern Ukrainian territorial sovereignty, so goes the world.
Trump has done irreparable harm to your brains. He lurks in every corner like some boogie man. Every issue, even far off foreign affairs are tied to the Orange man The irony of course is that this hysteria only makes him more viable as the democratic party morphs into Bush Republicanism. It would be funny if it wasn't sad.
Fuck polls, fuck vibes, embrace facts, it's a bad thing if the largest and most powerful military empire in human history is shipping guns all over the planet to try and impose "our" will for X Y Z reasons - because that is just enabling the same regime that is oppressing us here at home, and which is the root of all of our goddam problems. It's a waste of money, that is our imperialism, this is an empire, we should hope that we lose in our imperialist wars to dial up the political pressure at home, and expose how delusional this government is. Take the imperialist wars and turn them into a civil war, so that we can actually have power in our own country. The loss in Afghanistan is a great example of this. Total humiliation. Good. Their people had every right to kick us out, and our *common* enemies are weaker for it.
You don't have real power right now. You are weak.
>“For the Socialist of another country cannot expose the government and bourgeoisie of a country at war with “his own” nation, and not only because he does not know that country’s language, history, specific features, etc., but also because such exposure is part of imperialist intrigue, and not an internationalist duty.”
Lenin
Absolutely nothing, directly - I'm not the one who brought up Ukraine, but I'm the biggest lover and the biggest hater of all time, so if I see Ukraine then I gotta talk about Ukraine.
It does have an obvious connection, indirectly - because clearly giving a fuck about Ukraine and being a Biden voter go hand in hand, and it's just the sort of ideology, "I want to be a fair and benevolent imperial administrator." I hate that shit. I am in hell. I don't want the empire. I don't want the lazy benefits. I want to fight. I want war, we need power, we need to conquer this country, we need to stop looking for some politician who is going to solve our problems because politicians are the problem.
I don’t care for empire either, but I’d rather Europe not be steamrolled by an imperial power. Is it wrong to want to defend your allies against an imperial invasion?
Yes it is. Ukraine, Israel, Taiwan, Border Control - all one conflict, all the same frontier, I want them all to lose. I am not for liberating all nations - some of them are very reactionary! and I want power. I want the working class of this country to seize power. And we do not have power here if we are lined up behind the "revolutionary defeat of our enemies" - marching in lockstop with the Pentagon and the State Department. We have to smash the state. I mean, what are you defending here? What's in it for me? This is not civilization, this is not democracy, it's not freedom, this isn't even *dignified*, this is not working.
You see, you're not living in reality yet, Russia doesn't give a fuck about steamrolling "Europe" - Russia wants to be a regional hegemon, and, I think they want some kind of multipolar coalition that can displace unipolar western hegemony. Whatever, not my problem, in fact, we are strategic allies. Three cheers for Putin and Xi and Kim and - in Palestine - you know who.
If you want Russia to win you’re just supporting one imperial power over another dude. They’re in it for much more than just “”regional” dominance. If you’re just rattling off Russian propaganda about how you’re strategic allies with an imperial power trying to reconstitute its former empire/republic you too support imperialism.
I live a few hours from DC. Honestly thinking of going up and protesting outside of the WH all day tomorrow. Probably a waste of my time but I'm not sure what else to do.
It is Biden, which makes sense because he is objectively the best President we've had since the Clinton Golden Age. I watched Biden speak the day after the debate and he was spittin' fire. It's obvious that he just had one bad night. What I'm shocked by is how there are so many "commentators" who act as a herd rather than thinking things through. The dooming is pointless and counterproductive. Either start helping the campaign or get out of the way
There are lots of options for actually useful things we can and should be doing: Organizing a national campaign of peaceful protest marches and public demonstrations against Trump, Russia, and the new Axis, for one example
Biden is our nominee though. The only questions there are how we (each of us individually and as a movement) make sure he and the rest of the good guys win
respectfully, you don't get to decide how the rest of us feel is the best path forward or limit what our options are. This is the same crap from 2016 when folks voiced legitimate concerns over Hilary's chances.
Biden was a great president, and he would continue to be a great president. But I legitimately do not believe that he can generate the level of turnout from swing voters that is needed to beat Trump. It isn't his fault. The polling after the debate certainly paints that reality.
> you don't get to decide how the rest of us feel is the best path forward or limit what our options are
I don't, but Joe Biden does, and he already has. Debate over
Hillary was the right candidate in 2016. The problem was that she didn't just need to win a campaign. She needed to defend against the Russian military. Anybody else would have been even more vulnerable. Biden understands that well, happily
I agree Joe’s been the best president in years. But it was indeed a *very* bad day at the debate, and it’s likely these’ll appear with increasing frequency. What if the debate in September is similarly disastrous? I was initially somewhat calmed by the NC rally, but it’s obvious he had a teleprompter.
> it’s likely these’ll appear with increasing frequency
I see no reason to assume that, and I expect that the debate in September will go much better for the good guys
Thing is, we can’t afford to just assume he’ll be better in September. And yes I think it’s very likely that these ‘episodes’/bad days’ll happen more and more often, *many* who have spent time with an elderly person of declining health can confirm how fast these things can happen. Sadly.
None of that speculation matters because he can obviously do the job extremely well
FDR had polio so bad he was paralyzed from the waist down and relied on a wheelchair and leg braces for mobility, which he took efforts to conceal in public
Then use your head, instead of your heart, and step aside old man.
Tbh I don't care, I'm voting for "not Trump" regardless of who it is, but that debate was far too visible for Biden to overcome it's impact with a few well-delivered prepared speeches at rallies. Sad thing is, even at 1/4 speed Joe's still a better President than Trump could even dream of being, but unfortunately politics is all about optics now.
Our culture is also about a 24 hour news cycle. This story in spite of getting a feeding frenzy of 6 days will fade, in spite of all the enemies of democracy piling on. It is 4 months; 124 days minus early voting until the election. That's a long time to be shrill, people will tune it out.
What so many people don’t even realize is normal people have not even started paying attention. Every campaign knows the real work doesn’t hit till Labor Day. It’s the summer people are at the beach going to ball games and playing with kids who are back from school. The only people freaking out are the DC beltway and media who as someone who has lived there studied there and worked there freak out about everything. A forecast of snow causes a panic you would think nukes were falling like Fallout. Everyone seriously for the good of your brains tune out for the weekend, have a drink shoot some fireworks, go to the beach (or a place without WiFi)
From hero for defeating Trump in 2020 to villain for being too egoic to recognize reality in 2024.
If anything demonstrates that he's now unfit it's his refusal to accept reality and step aside for the good of the country.
I'd give him a pass if it was a debate one-off, but he keeps doing it. Fundamentally POTUS is a communication job and if you can't be consistently coherent you're unfit.
Honestly im concerned for him as a candidate but actually concerned for him as the president. He needs to Resign and it genuinely pains me to say that; I'm just not in a cult
i don't think he's so bad off that he needs to resign, there's only 6 or 7 months left in his current term. having him stay in office for a second term is concerning though.
if you're referring to [this axios article](https://www.axios.com/2024/06/29/two-bidens-trump-debate-2024-president), i'm not seeing anything super concerning there for the immediate future at least.
>From 10am to 4pm, Biden is dependably engaged — and many of his public events in front of cameras are held within those hours.
>Outside of that time range or while traveling abroad, Biden is more likely to have verbal miscues and become fatigued, aides told Axios.
if those aides are waaaaay underselling his difficulties or his health rapidly declines in the coming months it's a different story though.
I think Biden has done a quite good job as president all in all. But man, am I angered by his stubborness right now. I hope, as others have suggested, that he’s actually considering to step aside but says these things now because he wants it to be his own choice. Had the current Republican candidate been *fairly* normal — like, heck, even Bush Jr, for crying out loud — I wouldn’t have been *this* concerned. But another term with the orange blowhard will be an absolute disaster for US democracy. To put it mildly.
So now there’s going to be a worry every time he’s unscripted, and the media jumping on any small mistake. I’m praying this isn’t his ‘but her emails’, but this time there’s some truth to it.
A lot of the people you need to sway don’t care about policy, they’ll make their decision on simple things - will they care that he looks stiff and unsure on his feet etc? Even when he’s up against a felon? His family and team must be hoping Biden’s poll numbers recover somewhat, but right now his younger VP has better numbers. Hopefully things get better and the popular vote is big enough on election day to save democracy.
thats being generous, the number of people in multiple polls have been around 40-45% of Democratic voters that think he shouldnt be our nominee. With all voters its a 72-75% of people that think he cant do the job. You think he has a snowballs chance in hell when 3/4 of the electorate thinks he cant do the job?
Yep, the selfish liars closest to him who have facilitated his reelection campaign that no one asked for are now unable to push Biden out. And no one else’s opinion matters, as Biden’s made clear by barely even reaching out to anyone outside his inner circle.
He has to wait until the calls to step away peak or else he'll look like he is selfishly staying. In spite of all the wild claims about Biden's acuity, he is a master statesman, and he gets solid advice from people he trusts, unlike the mob boss Trump.
I feel like the current president, former VP, and man who was senator for almost 40 years with barely a real threat stubbornly clinging onto power doesn't come across as scrappy underdog it comes across as entitled. And I'm not sure if there's a way to thread that needle. Like you've successfully done all the things Joe. You might've had to wait a little longer than you wanted to in order to be president but like...that's it
It seems the Bidens have become accustomed to the trappings of the presidency and don’t want to give that up. And it’s really not a good look for Joe. The more he digs in, the more obstinate he becomes in the face of reality, the lower his polls and approval rating will go. So instead of a close race, it’ll be a landslide for trump, the end of our democracy, and a new era of fascism, baseball, and apple pie. And Joe and Hunter and Dr Jill will be seen as the people who let that happen. Because they didn’t want to give up their grip on power. Which makes Joe seem a little bit like trump in that regard.
At a certain point you gotta wonder: why would he still want to be working at his age? I just don't understand this mentality. The only reason I work now is so that someday (hopefully) I won't have to. If octogenarians want to volunteer at the library or whatever, that's great. If they want to run the fucking country, we shouldn't act like that's some noble pursuit. He's not hurting for money. Retire, dude.
I’m just saying that for most people, it doesn’t matter. Chances are you’re voting for one party no matter who they run. If you support the democrats, the candidate could be a newborn. Same goes for Republican voters.
Also dollars only flow if people think the candidate can win. Right now the perception is not only that he can't win - but that he shouldn't be running. Hard to get donations like that.
And what happens in 2 weeks when he stumbles getting on Air Force One or in a month when he forgets someone's name? This story isn't going away because it wasn't just one bad night
Of course you gotta decide, but still I’m saying — I hope you reconsider. In practice it’ll be a vote to the orange guy which may be the end of US democracy (which I’d have thought was hyperbole a few years ago).
How is replacing Biden supposed to inspire trust for the democrats?
“Hey, we were wrong completely wrong about Joe, so we’re gonna ignore our primary results, ignore our own rules, and swap him out. We were totally wrong before but we are definitely right now. Trust us.”
Absolute disaster
“But his debate performance” = “but her emails”
We know how that turned out, especially with those protest votes and third party votes
Change the narrative- what’s project 2025? Why do republicans want to keep the border open? Keep children hungry? Etc etc
> He's a billionaire so he can self-fund his campaign
Ah yes. I remember when that was such a great selling point for Bloomberg.
And Trump.
You should probably also add a similar bullet point saying something like "And that means he won't be open to corruption"
Hell yes. He was jetlagged af and still didn't lose! This is the kind of fighting spirit we need to see a lot more of. Next time he won't be jetlagged or need to hock a loogie. Let's go
I’m sorry, the damage is done. The seen can’t be unseen. The polls are already showing what we all know to be true. If he quits today there’s only a very small chance that the November outcome will be different. Might as well face it and figure out how we all get through this. There is still a way to outwit, outplay, and outlast.
I just worry he’ll lose the incumbent advantage. There are a lot of people who voted for the other guy, a lot of independents will vote for the other guy now. I’m not sure which situation is worse.
Not sure there's much incumbent advantage anywhere world wide right now. Incumbents are going down and getting blamed because of the post-covid economy and inflation.
Right? There's no such thing as incumbent advantage when everyone on both sides is dissatisfied with the status quo.
And there is nothing more "status quo" than having two people who've already been president run against each other.
People don’t vote for the executive, they vote for his support. They’re not voting for trump, they’re voting for the federalist society. Democrats are not organized at that level it seems, and it’s leading us down a very restrictive, unamerican path.
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If the pressure ratchets up, he still has an out with that response. If he does eventually bow out, he'll say he did it on his own terms and nobody else's.
That's what I was thinking. Stepping down on your own accord versus, "they made me do it." I have faith that Biden will do the right thing when the time comes.
Time is against the dems, so needs to be soon.
The time came, put on pants and left
As long as they can get someone electable and fast, please fuckin' do it. It's not an overstatement that the future of the fuckin' planet might be at stake.
Someone else would use the new powers of the president in time.
Ruth Bader Biden.
He’s gonna Ruth Bader Ginsburg us into fascism isn’t he?
They learned nothing from RBG and Hillary. We are at a point where Mitt Romney is saying hes done because of his age. A man in the actual cult that is Mormonism has the decency to be done. Maybe they can roll out the corpse of Diane feinstein and have Jimmy Carter as the VP.
Can u imagine if the DNC hadnt decided to fuck Bernie over, and right now we'd be working towards medicare for all and watching him dunk all over trump in every debate?
kind of curious why romney even ran, probably just ego. A single term then bye?
Gigantic fucking egos.
These people have layers of financial and political pressure around them that are unenviable and make them do things they never probably thought they could or even would consider. The system breaks people. We need term limits, age limits, and public finance of candidates with a removal of private money. It won't happen. We have what we have. They managed to make Trump look coherent with a saucer eyed old man staring thru time and space at the abyss before him. The Democrats ruined 4 years of good faith with that debate, watched the Republicans stack the supreme court, and make people forget about the likes of MTG, boebert, Christian nationalism, etc it goes on and on.
Already has
No, if we go into fascism, it will be the fault of the voters that put Trump in office, period: whether by thinking Trump "isn't old" or by voting Third Party, it would be the fault of whoever can't suck it up and vote for the platform instead of acting offended that their perfect candidate isn't on the ballot.
Lot of words for 'end of freedom'
It's becoming embarrassing. Would be so much better if he could just bow out gracefully, rather than forced out which at this point seems inevitable.
I mean lets get real here, that's what this is if you read between the lines. He's setting this up to be his own choice (if he makes it) and preserve his current presidency. And he's absolutely right. No one should be forcing him out and when he decides to drop out we will treat it as such because he's important to the next candidates campaign no matter who it is. They will be running on his record.
I agree and think it would be sort of odd for him to drop out of the race in the *immediate* aftermath of the debate. This isn’t just about him dropping out; he has to set this up not only to be his “choice” but also to provide a smooth transition to wherever this goes next, and I think that’s hardly clear at this point. He can’t just say, “well, I’m out. Good luck everybody else, you can all figure out what comes next!” *mic drop* They have to figure out whether Kamala takes up the banner or someone else. Whether to do this as a brokered convention or done as a more orderly “mini-primary.” There’s definitely a lot of work to be done behind the scenes. He’s either 100% in or 100% out but he won’t be anywhere in between in the meantime. But if he *does* drop out, I would expect to see him do that 2-3 weeks out from the debate, maybe even a full month. Hopefully sooner though, the sooner the better. Only six days after the debate is a little unrealistic.
I think it'll personally come next week or not at all. The longer it goes the more the party will splinter and hurt the entire thing. People behind the scenes are not going to hold their tongues if it looks like he's staying.
Good point. They’d probably stay unified in their message if they thought they could continue onward with him.
I said Friday morning after the debate that IF Biden drops it’ll be after the 4th of July holiday weekend. That gives them time to assess the damage, make a decision, have the important conversations with the important players, get their ducks in a row while everyone else is distracted by fireworks and hotdogs. Replacing the already-selected candidate, even if it’s not official, and especially if it’s the *incumbent president* takes time and can’t be a knee jerk reaction.
Completely agree. Groundwork to make this a smooth transition is quietly being laid, and if its a bit after the debate not immediately it will seem much more like Biden cementing his legacy and taking the high road, not being a feeble old man pushed out of the way.
He’s a proud guy. While his own *condition* isn’t new to him, he probably wasn’t expecting 50+ years of public service and his entire career to unceremoniously come crashing down on him on account of a lousy debate. It’s totally possible he needs a moment to process it all, which is why I think friends of his like Clyburn and others are reaching out to him. I’d like this to go quickly for obvious reasons but I can understand if an unprecedented thing like this takes a couple weeks or so.
They would be wiser not to run on his record. Biden gaslighting Americans into thinking inflation isn't real and the economy is great is probably his second biggest problem. Number 1 being his brain melted on live TV of course. Also, continuing unconditional support for Israel and pushing Ukraine away from peace talks are also loser issues with the American public. Most Americans want a ceasefire in both conflicts. Only part of his record that's good is Antitrust and Labor rights. Afghanistan withdrawal as well but the media of course attacked him for that despite it being the correct decision.
Biden's record is outstanding overall lol, you're parroting right wing talking points. Inflation is obviously real but compare the US to the world here and it shows the stark difference is how well America has handled the years since covid and the war starting. Overall speaking from a statistical economic standpoint, Biden has been one of the better presidents in the last 5\~ decades. That just doesn't translate well to the average person because of how poor the global economic situation is. With Ukraine, you're just flat out wrong and just quoting the republican approval numbers for these things. Majority of American's are still onboard with whats going on and a cease fire is absolutely about the stupidest decision that could be made on that front. [https://news.gallup.com/poll/643601/americans-say-not-helping-ukraine-enough.aspx](https://news.gallup.com/poll/643601/americans-say-not-helping-ukraine-enough.aspx) [https://news.gallup.com/poll/513680/american-views-ukraine-war-charts.aspx](https://news.gallup.com/poll/513680/american-views-ukraine-war-charts.aspx)
"Gaslighting" seems to be the favored word for trolls lol
It's become a tell for exactly the intentions of a lot of posters who consume a certain type of media.
Yeah. I assume this place is going to be "2016 on steroids" for the next week or so lol
Same guy is now trying to tell me that comparing US inflation to global inflation is the definition of gaslighting. Brutal stuff.
Bro, article is from April. Do better. Even Zelensky is trying to hold peace summits lol. Besides Putin, or maybe equal to him, we are holding back the possibility of peace. Folks like Biden refuse to accept the new reality. We live in a multipolar world. Biden should have used China as a lever against Russia. Instead we've isolated ourselves even more and pushed China closer to Russia. We've diminished the dollar around the world as the BRICS nations move to their own currency. Hell even North Korea is sending them weapons now. The average age of Ukrainian solider is in the 50s. At least a half million fighting age men fled the country to surrounding nations to avoid the slaughter. There losing territory and the counter offensives go nowhere. Russias artillery advantage is so wide, that even if the US exhausted our own emergency stockpiles we couldn't close the gap. The Ukrainian policy is a failure on all levels. Anyone still holding on to the idea they will beat back the Russians into the pre war borders, or even take back Crimea, has lost their mind. The question is, will Ukraine make peace before or after the collapse of the state? Reality is the ghouls running our state department saw this as an excuse to pump more money to the military industrial complex and play geopolitics against Russia like it's still the Cold war. Classic late stage Empire behavior. Comparing inflation to the rest of the world is the definition of gaslighting. Also, just as a basic political philosophy, it's always better to empathize with folks then tell them they actually have it pretty good! Something that was allegedly one of Bidens strengths. It's not right wing talking points. Independent voters don't see Bidens policies favorably.
>...and pushing Ukraine away from peace talks are also loser issues with the American public. I vehemently disagree that abandoning Ukraine to Russia's predations (make no mistake, because that is what "peace talks" would entail) is a losing issue. But with that said, there are plenty of positive things they can cherry-pick from his record to run on. It's a great opportunity, honestly.
Take a look at basically any poll. Biden is viewed unfavorably on his foreign policy and domestic policy. A new candidate would be wise to distance themselves from Biden as much as feasibly possible. I feel Democrats are in a bubble similar to the MAGA folks.
And yet the polls disagree with you. Israel of course is the outlier there.
If a new candidate says they want to be tougher on Bibi I’m all for that. As for a “peace deal” in Ukraine, fuck that. How long do you think “peace” will last before the next wave of tanks/artillery/infantry storm further into Eastern Europe? Just be honest and say you want to surrender to Russia, that’s exactly what you’re talking about.
Are you a Democrat/Lefty or some sort of Cold War Reaganite? Serious question. Do you think if Ukraine makes peace with Russia on the world stage, they will literally throw it out the next day and reinvade? Are you a cartoon character? Is this John Bolton's burner account? Could Russia eventually go to war with Ukraine again in the future? Sure. But giving Ukraine time to rebuild and strengthen its military would only help Ukraine at this point. I feel like I'm living in 1984 where War is Peace. You only make peace with your enemies. Ukraine is losing. Agreeing to cede parts of Luhansk, Crimea, and the Donbas, no NATO membership is a small price to pay to exist as a nation. The other option is complete collapse. There is no taking back the territory hoss. That's the military reality on the ground that even the Ukrainian high command has admitted too. I have no idea how the standard democratic party position has become the policy of John Bolton. Living in the upside down I guess.
You really think Russia would make a peace deal with Ukraine that allows them to rearm? They won’t be allowed to join NATO, they’ll cede sovereignty to Russia, they WON’T be allowed to rearm/rebuild, and if they actually make a deal with Russia, won’t be allowed to have any kind of standing army at all. You can call me a “Reaganite” all you want. Do you mind if I call you Neville?
Wow. John Bolton also calls everyone who isn't pro never ending war Neville Chamberlain as well. You realize there are armed conflicts other than WW2? Almost all of them end in armistice. Ukraine joining NATO should be a non starter anyway. Would you be okay with Cuba joining a nuclear suicide pact with Russia or China? Of course not. It's like you have never heard of MAD or nuclear winter. Putting every nation in Europe in NATO is a sure fire way to end the species. George Kennan, a literal founding father of sorts for NATO, repeatedly warned expanding NATO Eastward would only embolden autocrats in Russia and put the world in peril. But I guess he was just a Putin apologist. Simply shouting that Putin is Hitler doesn't make it true. If Hitler had tactical nuclear weapons, he would have used them. The Russians haven't. Putin is bad but that doesn't mean he's a complete madman. Hell, compared to the Israelis(who we arm unconditionally) he's following the laws of armed conflict. Not to say he isn't committing war crimes. If your argument is that we must put maximal military and diplomatic pressure until Russia makes Putin go away, you're arguing for an apocalypse. The fate of Russia is up to everyday Russians. We can't pull the strings from here. They've had revolutions before. You have to have peace and hope from change from within. They have a nuclear arsenal that can destroy the world. This war is more like Russia's Iraq War. We illegally invaded a sovereign country under false pretenses and caused absolute destruction (Google Julian Assange WikiLeaks). Was that right of us? Of course not. But should the world have threatened nuclear holocaust if George W Bush didn't leave office? Don't let Trump break your brain. Come back to reality.
You mean polls like [this](https://www.pewresearch.org/global/2024/05/08/views-of-ukraine-and-u-s-involvement-with-the-russia-ukraine-war/) that show 49% of Americans believe we are doing enough (or not enough) to help Ukraine vs. 31% (mainly driven by GOP sentiment) that feel we are doing too much? Abandoning Ukraine is Trump's position, and there is no reason in the world (political or moral) that we should ever *dream* of embracing it.
You basically admit your foreign policy position is in "opposition to Trump". A ridiculous way to look at world affairs. Trump doesn't believe in anything. He just says whatever pops in his head. Looking to him and doing the opposite is just chaos. There is no way for Ukraine to regain the territory. We should have pushed them to sue for peace after that first successful counter offensive. It was the US who "advised" the Ukrainians not to sue for peace. The military industrial complex does not care about Ukrainian sovereignty. If you believe that I have a bridge to sell you. They want an excuse to print money for contractors in northern Virginia and relive the Cold War. It's a stupid policy. People seem to forget the Obama administration, with Joe Biden as VP, allowed Putin to play his games in Crimea. To paraphrase Obama, Ukraine is more in the Russian interest than ours. Trump actually reversed the policy, and shipped the missiles the Ukrainians wanted, after a bit of extortion of course in true Orange man fashion. Somehow all of this has been forgotten, and I am to believe that as goes the eastern Ukrainian territorial sovereignty, so goes the world. Trump has done irreparable harm to your brains. He lurks in every corner like some boogie man. Every issue, even far off foreign affairs are tied to the Orange man The irony of course is that this hysteria only makes him more viable as the democratic party morphs into Bush Republicanism. It would be funny if it wasn't sad.
Fuck polls, fuck vibes, embrace facts, it's a bad thing if the largest and most powerful military empire in human history is shipping guns all over the planet to try and impose "our" will for X Y Z reasons - because that is just enabling the same regime that is oppressing us here at home, and which is the root of all of our goddam problems. It's a waste of money, that is our imperialism, this is an empire, we should hope that we lose in our imperialist wars to dial up the political pressure at home, and expose how delusional this government is. Take the imperialist wars and turn them into a civil war, so that we can actually have power in our own country. The loss in Afghanistan is a great example of this. Total humiliation. Good. Their people had every right to kick us out, and our *common* enemies are weaker for it. You don't have real power right now. You are weak. >“For the Socialist of another country cannot expose the government and bourgeoisie of a country at war with “his own” nation, and not only because he does not know that country’s language, history, specific features, etc., but also because such exposure is part of imperialist intrigue, and not an internationalist duty.” Lenin
What does any of this have to do with Biden staying or dropping out?
Absolutely nothing, directly - I'm not the one who brought up Ukraine, but I'm the biggest lover and the biggest hater of all time, so if I see Ukraine then I gotta talk about Ukraine. It does have an obvious connection, indirectly - because clearly giving a fuck about Ukraine and being a Biden voter go hand in hand, and it's just the sort of ideology, "I want to be a fair and benevolent imperial administrator." I hate that shit. I am in hell. I don't want the empire. I don't want the lazy benefits. I want to fight. I want war, we need power, we need to conquer this country, we need to stop looking for some politician who is going to solve our problems because politicians are the problem.
I don’t care for empire either, but I’d rather Europe not be steamrolled by an imperial power. Is it wrong to want to defend your allies against an imperial invasion?
Yes it is. Ukraine, Israel, Taiwan, Border Control - all one conflict, all the same frontier, I want them all to lose. I am not for liberating all nations - some of them are very reactionary! and I want power. I want the working class of this country to seize power. And we do not have power here if we are lined up behind the "revolutionary defeat of our enemies" - marching in lockstop with the Pentagon and the State Department. We have to smash the state. I mean, what are you defending here? What's in it for me? This is not civilization, this is not democracy, it's not freedom, this isn't even *dignified*, this is not working. You see, you're not living in reality yet, Russia doesn't give a fuck about steamrolling "Europe" - Russia wants to be a regional hegemon, and, I think they want some kind of multipolar coalition that can displace unipolar western hegemony. Whatever, not my problem, in fact, we are strategic allies. Three cheers for Putin and Xi and Kim and - in Palestine - you know who.
If you want Russia to win you’re just supporting one imperial power over another dude. They’re in it for much more than just “”regional” dominance. If you’re just rattling off Russian propaganda about how you’re strategic allies with an imperial power trying to reconstitute its former empire/republic you too support imperialism.
Can’t force him out.
I am. I am pushing Joe Biden out. Who's with me?
I live a few hours from DC. Honestly thinking of going up and protesting outside of the WH all day tomorrow. Probably a waste of my time but I'm not sure what else to do.
If you do, please be nice about it. He's done a good job as President.
Absolutely. I would need to be very careful with any language I'd put on a sign.
I'm way too far but I will GLADLY chip in from Denver to send pizzas if you organize a group
Yeah but then I'll have the right attack me for...pizza.
I'm with you. Our interests are for now aligned.
74 % thinks he’s too old. He should listen to the voters.
Not me, and he's not going anywhere. Either start helping the campaign or get out of the way
I'm all in for whoever its gonna be even if it stays Biden. But I really really really really don't want it to be Biden because we will lose.
It is Biden, which makes sense because he is objectively the best President we've had since the Clinton Golden Age. I watched Biden speak the day after the debate and he was spittin' fire. It's obvious that he just had one bad night. What I'm shocked by is how there are so many "commentators" who act as a herd rather than thinking things through. The dooming is pointless and counterproductive. Either start helping the campaign or get out of the way
This is the thinking things through part though. Discussing options.
There are lots of options for actually useful things we can and should be doing: Organizing a national campaign of peaceful protest marches and public demonstrations against Trump, Russia, and the new Axis, for one example Biden is our nominee though. The only questions there are how we (each of us individually and as a movement) make sure he and the rest of the good guys win
respectfully, you don't get to decide how the rest of us feel is the best path forward or limit what our options are. This is the same crap from 2016 when folks voiced legitimate concerns over Hilary's chances. Biden was a great president, and he would continue to be a great president. But I legitimately do not believe that he can generate the level of turnout from swing voters that is needed to beat Trump. It isn't his fault. The polling after the debate certainly paints that reality.
> you don't get to decide how the rest of us feel is the best path forward or limit what our options are I don't, but Joe Biden does, and he already has. Debate over Hillary was the right candidate in 2016. The problem was that she didn't just need to win a campaign. She needed to defend against the Russian military. Anybody else would have been even more vulnerable. Biden understands that well, happily
I agree Joe’s been the best president in years. But it was indeed a *very* bad day at the debate, and it’s likely these’ll appear with increasing frequency. What if the debate in September is similarly disastrous? I was initially somewhat calmed by the NC rally, but it’s obvious he had a teleprompter.
> it’s likely these’ll appear with increasing frequency I see no reason to assume that, and I expect that the debate in September will go much better for the good guys
Thing is, we can’t afford to just assume he’ll be better in September. And yes I think it’s very likely that these ‘episodes’/bad days’ll happen more and more often, *many* who have spent time with an elderly person of declining health can confirm how fast these things can happen. Sadly.
None of that speculation matters because he can obviously do the job extremely well FDR had polio so bad he was paralyzed from the waist down and relied on a wheelchair and leg braces for mobility, which he took efforts to conceal in public
I'm in. But only if Harris is the replacement. Or Whitmere, I could maybe get behind. But I simply can not stand the American Psycho
Joes got this! We believe in him!
Then use your head, instead of your heart, and step aside old man. Tbh I don't care, I'm voting for "not Trump" regardless of who it is, but that debate was far too visible for Biden to overcome it's impact with a few well-delivered prepared speeches at rallies. Sad thing is, even at 1/4 speed Joe's still a better President than Trump could even dream of being, but unfortunately politics is all about optics now.
Our culture is also about a 24 hour news cycle. This story in spite of getting a feeding frenzy of 6 days will fade, in spite of all the enemies of democracy piling on. It is 4 months; 124 days minus early voting until the election. That's a long time to be shrill, people will tune it out.
What so many people don’t even realize is normal people have not even started paying attention. Every campaign knows the real work doesn’t hit till Labor Day. It’s the summer people are at the beach going to ball games and playing with kids who are back from school. The only people freaking out are the DC beltway and media who as someone who has lived there studied there and worked there freak out about everything. A forecast of snow causes a panic you would think nukes were falling like Fallout. Everyone seriously for the good of your brains tune out for the weekend, have a drink shoot some fireworks, go to the beach (or a place without WiFi)
From hero for defeating Trump in 2020 to villain for being too egoic to recognize reality in 2024. If anything demonstrates that he's now unfit it's his refusal to accept reality and step aside for the good of the country.
The "we beat medicare" moment was frightening, he's clearly not fit for office.
I'd give him a pass if it was a debate one-off, but he keeps doing it. Fundamentally POTUS is a communication job and if you can't be consistently coherent you're unfit.
Honestly im concerned for him as a candidate but actually concerned for him as the president. He needs to Resign and it genuinely pains me to say that; I'm just not in a cult
Agreed, loyalty to the country and not a man is the primary difference between them and us.
i don't think he's so bad off that he needs to resign, there's only 6 or 7 months left in his current term. having him stay in office for a second term is concerning though.
Reports about him having trouble functioning after 4pm is especially concerning from our president
if you're referring to [this axios article](https://www.axios.com/2024/06/29/two-bidens-trump-debate-2024-president), i'm not seeing anything super concerning there for the immediate future at least. >From 10am to 4pm, Biden is dependably engaged — and many of his public events in front of cameras are held within those hours. >Outside of that time range or while traveling abroad, Biden is more likely to have verbal miscues and become fatigued, aides told Axios. if those aides are waaaaay underselling his difficulties or his health rapidly declines in the coming months it's a different story though.
Fine, just voluntarily shuffle out the door old man.
I think Biden has done a quite good job as president all in all. But man, am I angered by his stubborness right now. I hope, as others have suggested, that he’s actually considering to step aside but says these things now because he wants it to be his own choice. Had the current Republican candidate been *fairly* normal — like, heck, even Bush Jr, for crying out loud — I wouldn’t have been *this* concerned. But another term with the orange blowhard will be an absolute disaster for US democracy. To put it mildly.
Every second he waits to drop out he is stealing prep-time from the next candidate.
So now there’s going to be a worry every time he’s unscripted, and the media jumping on any small mistake. I’m praying this isn’t his ‘but her emails’, but this time there’s some truth to it. A lot of the people you need to sway don’t care about policy, they’ll make their decision on simple things - will they care that he looks stiff and unsure on his feet etc? Even when he’s up against a felon? His family and team must be hoping Biden’s poll numbers recover somewhat, but right now his younger VP has better numbers. Hopefully things get better and the popular vote is big enough on election day to save democracy.
2/3rds of the party want him. People are donating in large numbers to show support. Joe isn't going anywhere.
2/3rds of the party is not enough to win the election.
thats being generous, the number of people in multiple polls have been around 40-45% of Democratic voters that think he shouldnt be our nominee. With all voters its a 72-75% of people that think he cant do the job. You think he has a snowballs chance in hell when 3/4 of the electorate thinks he cant do the job?
It's the tipping point so we'll see. I'll just say rumors of his demise are premature.
A lot of people are.
Yep, the selfish liars closest to him who have facilitated his reelection campaign that no one asked for are now unable to push Biden out. And no one else’s opinion matters, as Biden’s made clear by barely even reaching out to anyone outside his inner circle.
That's fine. It should be *your* decision, Joe. Just make it soon, I beg of you.
He has to wait until the calls to step away peak or else he'll look like he is selfishly staying. In spite of all the wild claims about Biden's acuity, he is a master statesman, and he gets solid advice from people he trusts, unlike the mob boss Trump.
They shouldn’t have to, step down gracefully, keep your legacy and promote the next generation.
It's more of a nudge. A push would probably hurt him.
Pride comes before the fall.
I feel like the current president, former VP, and man who was senator for almost 40 years with barely a real threat stubbornly clinging onto power doesn't come across as scrappy underdog it comes across as entitled. And I'm not sure if there's a way to thread that needle. Like you've successfully done all the things Joe. You might've had to wait a little longer than you wanted to in order to be president but like...that's it
He sounds like any other senior when their family is trying to convince them it’s time for “the home”. Time for a conservatorship!
So what color prisoner outfits do they will give biden voters for the Trump branded slave pits? Orange or gold?
It seems the Bidens have become accustomed to the trappings of the presidency and don’t want to give that up. And it’s really not a good look for Joe. The more he digs in, the more obstinate he becomes in the face of reality, the lower his polls and approval rating will go. So instead of a close race, it’ll be a landslide for trump, the end of our democracy, and a new era of fascism, baseball, and apple pie. And Joe and Hunter and Dr Jill will be seen as the people who let that happen. Because they didn’t want to give up their grip on power. Which makes Joe seem a little bit like trump in that regard.
He is leveraging for kickbacks to drop out or he has just lost it completely.
What if nature does, I mean the guy looks about dead as it is?
At a certain point you gotta wonder: why would he still want to be working at his age? I just don't understand this mentality. The only reason I work now is so that someday (hopefully) I won't have to. If octogenarians want to volunteer at the library or whatever, that's great. If they want to run the fucking country, we shouldn't act like that's some noble pursuit. He's not hurting for money. Retire, dude.
That phrase is telling.
Like an old man stubbornly holding on to his DL, even tho he can’t see shit, and is a danger to everyone on the road. His ego is all in this decision
Please Joe. You’re a good man, please put the country over pride. I can’t see how he can win at this point.
Maybe once the democrats won’t let seniority get in the way of intelligent political calculation. Don’t make it RCB squared.
The public certainly is
Interesting wording because he could drop out and say he did it on his own volition, nobody forced him to?
Somebody should have the balls to do so
That's exactly the problem
Oh yes they are. Go be with your kids Joe. Your job is done. No shame in stepping aside.
Great Biden , now use your “”Presidential immunity” while you have the chance and start taking the facists out starting with,well you know.
It’s not like it matters. Most people vote for the party, not the person.
Or they vote third-party. Or they just don't vote at all. It absolutely does matter.
I’m just saying that for most people, it doesn’t matter. Chances are you’re voting for one party no matter who they run. If you support the democrats, the candidate could be a newborn. Same goes for Republican voters.
Also dollars only flow if people think the candidate can win. Right now the perception is not only that he can't win - but that he shouldn't be running. Hard to get donations like that. And what happens in 2 weeks when he stumbles getting on Air Force One or in a month when he forgets someone's name? This story isn't going away because it wasn't just one bad night
Yeah, no biggie, we have a parliament, like the UK
Then we’re voting you out
Self centered prick. He’s lost me and most of the undecided who will now go for the moronic RFK.
Of course you gotta decide, but still I’m saying — I hope you reconsider. In practice it’ll be a vote to the orange guy which may be the end of US democracy (which I’d have thought was hyperbole a few years ago).
Man's brainrot has him oblivious to everyone with common sense that is saying he has to step down.
How is replacing Biden supposed to inspire trust for the democrats? “Hey, we were wrong completely wrong about Joe, so we’re gonna ignore our primary results, ignore our own rules, and swap him out. We were totally wrong before but we are definitely right now. Trust us.” Absolute disaster
Well, Trump will when he wins the last American election.
Selfish prick
Politicians are so predictable. They'll say anything but never actually do it when it interferes with their own personal gain
“But his debate performance” = “but her emails” We know how that turned out, especially with those protest votes and third party votes Change the narrative- what’s project 2025? Why do republicans want to keep the border open? Keep children hungry? Etc etc
You got this Joe! 💪🏻
The ballot box in November will,probably! AIPAC working overtime now.
Its almost been an entire week. Its time to get over the debate and go back to hyperventilating about Donald Trump.
It’s gonna be like this for the next 4 months
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> He's a billionaire so he can self-fund his campaign Ah yes. I remember when that was such a great selling point for Bloomberg. And Trump. You should probably also add a similar bullet point saying something like "And that means he won't be open to corruption"
You had me at rizz
[Absolutely not](https://news.wttw.com/2024/02/01/pritzker-disappointed-chicago-s-gaza-cease-fire-resolution-says-it-ll-have-no-impact)
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Hell yes. He was jetlagged af and still didn't lose! This is the kind of fighting spirit we need to see a lot more of. Next time he won't be jetlagged or need to hock a loogie. Let's go
I’m sorry, the damage is done. The seen can’t be unseen. The polls are already showing what we all know to be true. If he quits today there’s only a very small chance that the November outcome will be different. Might as well face it and figure out how we all get through this. There is still a way to outwit, outplay, and outlast.
I just worry he’ll lose the incumbent advantage. There are a lot of people who voted for the other guy, a lot of independents will vote for the other guy now. I’m not sure which situation is worse.
Not sure there's much incumbent advantage anywhere world wide right now. Incumbents are going down and getting blamed because of the post-covid economy and inflation.
Right? There's no such thing as incumbent advantage when everyone on both sides is dissatisfied with the status quo. And there is nothing more "status quo" than having two people who've already been president run against each other.
I think that advantage was already lost.
> I just worry he’ll lose the recumbent advantage. I thought we didn't want him lying down on the job?
People don’t vote for the executive, they vote for his support. They’re not voting for trump, they’re voting for the federalist society. Democrats are not organized at that level it seems, and it’s leading us down a very restrictive, unamerican path.
> it’s leading us down a very restrictive, unamerican path. No doubt whilst on our recumbent bikes.
Yeah that’s a typo.