It might be due to the fact we netted a first for Rasmus Ristolainen. So if that happened, it makes someone who is, in my opinion, much better than Risto, worth more
Turns out that not every Sabres fan in r/Sabres has the same opinion, I suppose?
I think Olofsson is a good player who would be a much better fit on a different team.
If he had played in the second half of the season like he had during the first half, I would agree with you. But he’s been pretty much a non-factor since the new year started. That’s going to hurt any trade value he had pretty badly.
Idk how much better, but I could see him being a middle 6, PP1 guy on some teams. I think Olofsson and a pick going to a team for a needed defenseman is the ideal situation. Straight dealt for the pick…I think the dude that suggested a 2nd but Sabres retain 50% could be in the ballpark
Who is taking on that contract?
Honestly, we’re probably looking at Olof+prospect/pick just to get someone to take him off our hands.
Most “dumb” NHL GMs don’t look at a single stat and target said player. They want to see a foundation of tools, skills, or physicality. Olofsson has a great shot, and that’s where it all ends. But it’s not a $5m shot. It’s a $2m shot.
$4.75MM for a 30 goal scorer isn’t the worst contract out there. If we have to trade Olofsson, a prospect and a pick; I’m ok with that. Trading Olofsson opens up a spot for one of the young guys and acquiring a top for 4D is the teams biggest need.
It is one of the worst contracts for a 30 goal scorer that craters every line he is on during 5v5 play.
That salary is tough for many teams to carry, let alone for a player that actively hurts you. His goal scoring impacts are not better than what most teams have sitting somewhere in their system.
I think your looking at it from the hockey perspective and not from the business side of the business. An acquiring team can add a 30 goal scorer, a prospect, and a pick. The $4.75 with 1 year remaining is coming in. This trade would offer a fair bit of long term flexibility. The team would also be sending out a contract and the $ and term associated. I suspect most teams could make a trade structured like this.
Huh?
What I’m saying is that no team in the NHL is adding Olof at nearly $5m unless they are getting a sweetener. It isn’t likely to be a huge sweetener (top-100 pick) but the Sabres will have to kick something in.
One of the reasons I think this is because the top teams in the NHL don’t have $5m in cap space for a guy like Olof. This essentially pulls half the teams out of the question given cap constraints and the fact that I don’t see the Sabres eating much of any of his contract.
Fringe, rebuilding, or tanking teams are unlikely to part with any meaningful assets for Olof due to a variety of factors, but mostly due to his play and contract.
I wouldn’t be surprised to see a team like the Coyotes take him and his contract plus a late pick. They’d likely eat half his contract and deal him at the deadline for an additional pick.
Olofsson is an asset. He can put up points and teams will want him. The ideal trade partner is probably a team that is rebuilding/retooling. They can put him on their top 2 lines and generate production. He then adds value and can be shipped to a contender at the trade deadline.
I look at Philadelphia as a potential trade partner. They are in the process of wanting to get younger. They have some defensive players that could fit the #4 role we need on the sabres. We could deal Olofsson, a prospect, and a pick for a defender with term. The Olofsson $ helps as trade filler. The flyers could flip Olofsson at the deadline for picks/prospects. They would reduce their cap hit for future years.
Honestly, I hope you’re right. But let’s understand that Olofsson is currently being healthy scratched by the Sabres, a team currently on the outside of the playoffs.
Not a 1st, maybe a 2nd if 50% retained imo. I could see Carolina taking him, they have a great defensive system that is very good at sheltering bottom 6 players and they could really use a finisher.
I really don't think they are going to get a 1st. I'm pretty sure they tride to trade him this offseason but ultimately weren't able to find any buyers.
Makes less sense to have tried last offseason, but I don't think you'll have trouble moving a power play triggerman to another team. His numbers are down but still good.
I think you look for a hockey trade and maybe something where we add a little even.
Unless Peter Chirelli gets a GM job there's 0 chance of a first. However depending on where you send him and if we retain salary you can make a case for a 2nd.
Reason being if it's out of conference no you could get a 3rd and 5th-7th, but in conference they'd have to pay higher if Adams isn't going to get ripped off.
Honestly I do see him getting dealt. Quinn has already shown he can end up being better and not limited to being one dimensional. Then you have guys like Kulich and Rosen who have shown in the AHL a pretty good shot plus again more than just a good shot. If we kept him it would be a massive waste of money, but it also depends on how our cap situation looks for next season. Sometimes you need a contract just to be compliant. I do prefer the need a contract for compliance over playing LTIR tag.
If I had to take a shot in the dark the Canes are probably where he lands so it's basically a 3rd round pick from where they should end up in the playoffs. A boost to your bottom 6 scoring and a guy to add to a good power play is something they could use and if the Sabres retain salary we could always.have it be a conditional pick. Like it's a 3rd and 7th, but if Olofssob gets 30 goals in the season or 10 in the playoffs it's becomes a 2nd and 5th or some shit like that.
The biggest question mark however is not Olofsson. It's Mitts.
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats!
2
+ 3
+ 5
- 7
+ 3
+ 6
+ 3
+ 7
+ 30
+ 10
+ 2
+ 5
= 69
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This is my thought as well. Sure, I’d only give a 4th for Olofsson on the Sabres, but on another team he is more valuable. Plus, you never know when a GM feels strongly about getting a player
I have no idea why you’re getting downvoted. He’s an overpaid bottom 6 winger who can’t play defense, forecheck, drive plays, or score 5on5. Other GMs wont just look at the goal count and hand us assets for him, they’ll look at his play and understand why we’re trying to get rid of him.
I think their best bet is to use Olofsson as a sweetener in an important deal. His value is probably roughly a 3rd rounder. Say you're trying to get from the 13th/14th/32nd overall pick to a few spots higher to get the prospect you want you might be able to use him to do it. Same for a deal where you're trying to lessen the value of a pick you have to give in exchange for a veteran defenseman - Olofsson & a pick should probably be a popular offer coming out of GMKA's mouth this offseason.
I think his highest value would be at the trade deadline for someone looking to bolster their power play. Unfortunately, I think the Sabres would want that slot open at the beginning of next year.
I hope to be wrong, but I really don't think they're going to move him. It's not that there won't be an opportunity, I just don't think Adams will move him for anything less than what he sees as full value.
So, you're talking about a 27 year old who has scored over twenty goals three times and has term left of their contract. My guess here is that Adams would think he's worth a second, but probably the highest he gets offered is a late third.
My reasoning isn't about whether they want to trade him, or whether there will be an opportunity to, it's that Adams won't budge for anything less than he sees as full value.
He's been shrewd, I think that's a good thing, but from time to time it means you end up not making a deal because no one is willing to pay the exact price you're looking for.
Factor in most teams are better defensively than us and can accommodate his play style better
Teams are looking for scoring and PP help wich is his jam
A 2nd would seem fair for a 30ish goal scorer
Maybe a 4th? With his contract, it could also just be future considerations. Depends on if a team really values a PP specialist.
I am setting this value in my mind so anything more would be a pleasant surprise.
He has a great shot but is a net negative everywhere else on the ice. He was by no means the 4th or 5th best forward on our team. If a team can afford to give him 7-9 minutes 5v5 and PP1 time, he will do okay. But he is so inconsistent and has had huge cold spells, each of the last few years. He doesn't drive play or create offense himself all that often so playing him with grinders will not get the same goal scoring output.
I just see no way we could get a 1st or 2nd for him and with 50 retained I still think a 3rd is a stretch. These teams all have pro scouts. They see how Vic has looked the 2nd half of the season and that he is the odd man out and a healthy scratch.
I hope we get more than this, but I will set expectations low. If KA gets more than that he is a wizard, we have no leverage trying to deal our unwanted players. People can downvote away, the truth of the matter is Vic doesn't have a play style that will score us a top 2 round pick and maybe even a top 3. On top of that, he is overpaid and is going into his last year before UFA.
That makes sense, I was more arguing his value on his own. I don't think many teams would give more than a 4th for JUST olofsson. I totally agree the best value is using him as a piece with others and salary retention as part of a package.
I just don't know if his offense will come out playing with defensive forwards. He is a guy who finds open space or stays on the outside. But, he needs others to find him. Any linemates would have to be defensively responsible on top of able to drive play because he can't create on his own consistently.
What makes you think the Sabres will eat any portion of a contract?
This is a team that had loads of cap space and didn’t play middle man once during the deadline and who brought in a heavily insured contract simply to get to the cap floor.
I hope I’m wrong. But the signs aren’t pointing in the right direction.
You must be new here. Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that, and even the stupidest in the lot can find there way to reddit.
I love Mitts, and want him to do well. It’s been my opinion for a while that the Sabres need a different kind of player in that third-line role and/or should package Casey to upgrade our D. If he stays with the Sabres long term I’m certainly going to root for him, not against him.
he’s a 5 million dollar healthy scratch. the only way a team takes him is to avoid cap floor or if we retain a chunk of his salary. the return value won’t be much.
maybe a depth piece and a mid round draft pick.
My hope is that the Sabres are willing to eat a chunk of his contract and can move him for a mid-round pick.
I don’t think they will eat salary, so I’d guess they need to package him with something, a mid to late round pick, in order to move him to a team like the Coyotes.
My fear is they are unwilling to eat salary and/or move an asset and he will be one of the 12 starting forwards next year.
For the people thinking he will be moved for a pick in the first two rounds, you are dreaming. Cap space will again be a premium asset and teams aren’t adding a guy like Olofsson.
Let’s put it this way, if Olof was a UFA do you think he’s getting around $5m, even on a one year deal? Look at the players that signed for less than $6m last off-season.
r/sabres : I don't want this player on my team anymore also r/sabres : But I expect a 1st/2nd for them
It might be due to the fact we netted a first for Rasmus Ristolainen. So if that happened, it makes someone who is, in my opinion, much better than Risto, worth more
Turns out that not every Sabres fan in r/Sabres has the same opinion, I suppose? I think Olofsson is a good player who would be a much better fit on a different team.
If he had played in the second half of the season like he had during the first half, I would agree with you. But he’s been pretty much a non-factor since the new year started. That’s going to hurt any trade value he had pretty badly.
Idk how much better, but I could see him being a middle 6, PP1 guy on some teams. I think Olofsson and a pick going to a team for a needed defenseman is the ideal situation. Straight dealt for the pick…I think the dude that suggested a 2nd but Sabres retain 50% could be in the ballpark
Olofsson + a prospect or pick for a #4 defender would be ideal. That’s the teams biggest need.
Upvote upvote upvote
Who is taking on that contract? Honestly, we’re probably looking at Olof+prospect/pick just to get someone to take him off our hands. Most “dumb” NHL GMs don’t look at a single stat and target said player. They want to see a foundation of tools, skills, or physicality. Olofsson has a great shot, and that’s where it all ends. But it’s not a $5m shot. It’s a $2m shot.
$4.75MM for a 30 goal scorer isn’t the worst contract out there. If we have to trade Olofsson, a prospect and a pick; I’m ok with that. Trading Olofsson opens up a spot for one of the young guys and acquiring a top for 4D is the teams biggest need.
It is one of the worst contracts for a 30 goal scorer that craters every line he is on during 5v5 play. That salary is tough for many teams to carry, let alone for a player that actively hurts you. His goal scoring impacts are not better than what most teams have sitting somewhere in their system.
I think your looking at it from the hockey perspective and not from the business side of the business. An acquiring team can add a 30 goal scorer, a prospect, and a pick. The $4.75 with 1 year remaining is coming in. This trade would offer a fair bit of long term flexibility. The team would also be sending out a contract and the $ and term associated. I suspect most teams could make a trade structured like this.
Huh? What I’m saying is that no team in the NHL is adding Olof at nearly $5m unless they are getting a sweetener. It isn’t likely to be a huge sweetener (top-100 pick) but the Sabres will have to kick something in. One of the reasons I think this is because the top teams in the NHL don’t have $5m in cap space for a guy like Olof. This essentially pulls half the teams out of the question given cap constraints and the fact that I don’t see the Sabres eating much of any of his contract. Fringe, rebuilding, or tanking teams are unlikely to part with any meaningful assets for Olof due to a variety of factors, but mostly due to his play and contract. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a team like the Coyotes take him and his contract plus a late pick. They’d likely eat half his contract and deal him at the deadline for an additional pick.
Olofsson is an asset. He can put up points and teams will want him. The ideal trade partner is probably a team that is rebuilding/retooling. They can put him on their top 2 lines and generate production. He then adds value and can be shipped to a contender at the trade deadline. I look at Philadelphia as a potential trade partner. They are in the process of wanting to get younger. They have some defensive players that could fit the #4 role we need on the sabres. We could deal Olofsson, a prospect, and a pick for a defender with term. The Olofsson $ helps as trade filler. The flyers could flip Olofsson at the deadline for picks/prospects. They would reduce their cap hit for future years.
Honestly, I hope you’re right. But let’s understand that Olofsson is currently being healthy scratched by the Sabres, a team currently on the outside of the playoffs.
Not a 1st, maybe a 2nd if 50% retained imo. I could see Carolina taking him, they have a great defensive system that is very good at sheltering bottom 6 players and they could really use a finisher.
I really don't think they are going to get a 1st. I'm pretty sure they tride to trade him this offseason but ultimately weren't able to find any buyers.
Makes less sense to have tried last offseason, but I don't think you'll have trouble moving a power play triggerman to another team. His numbers are down but still good. I think you look for a hockey trade and maybe something where we add a little even.
Unless Peter Chirelli gets a GM job there's 0 chance of a first. However depending on where you send him and if we retain salary you can make a case for a 2nd. Reason being if it's out of conference no you could get a 3rd and 5th-7th, but in conference they'd have to pay higher if Adams isn't going to get ripped off. Honestly I do see him getting dealt. Quinn has already shown he can end up being better and not limited to being one dimensional. Then you have guys like Kulich and Rosen who have shown in the AHL a pretty good shot plus again more than just a good shot. If we kept him it would be a massive waste of money, but it also depends on how our cap situation looks for next season. Sometimes you need a contract just to be compliant. I do prefer the need a contract for compliance over playing LTIR tag. If I had to take a shot in the dark the Canes are probably where he lands so it's basically a 3rd round pick from where they should end up in the playoffs. A boost to your bottom 6 scoring and a guy to add to a good power play is something they could use and if the Sabres retain salary we could always.have it be a conditional pick. Like it's a 3rd and 7th, but if Olofssob gets 30 goals in the season or 10 in the playoffs it's becomes a 2nd and 5th or some shit like that. The biggest question mark however is not Olofsson. It's Mitts.
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats! 2 + 3 + 5 - 7 + 3 + 6 + 3 + 7 + 30 + 10 + 2 + 5 = 69 ^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \ ^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
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This is my thought as well. Sure, I’d only give a 4th for Olofsson on the Sabres, but on another team he is more valuable. Plus, you never know when a GM feels strongly about getting a player
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We got a 1st for Risto. Not a chance seems to be a heavy handed response.
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So you’re saying there’s a chance.
So we've gotta trade hime to Philly then? :)
The Flyers fired their GM, though.
We’ve fired a couple GM’s too
Not much. Have to add retention for anyone to bite.
I have no idea why you’re getting downvoted. He’s an overpaid bottom 6 winger who can’t play defense, forecheck, drive plays, or score 5on5. Other GMs wont just look at the goal count and hand us assets for him, they’ll look at his play and understand why we’re trying to get rid of him.
I think their best bet is to use Olofsson as a sweetener in an important deal. His value is probably roughly a 3rd rounder. Say you're trying to get from the 13th/14th/32nd overall pick to a few spots higher to get the prospect you want you might be able to use him to do it. Same for a deal where you're trying to lessen the value of a pick you have to give in exchange for a veteran defenseman - Olofsson & a pick should probably be a popular offer coming out of GMKA's mouth this offseason.
I think his highest value would be at the trade deadline for someone looking to bolster their power play. Unfortunately, I think the Sabres would want that slot open at the beginning of next year.
I think you package him and a pick to either move up in the draft, or to pick up a better player
He’s definitely not a first round pick trade. He’s likely a 2 but I think he’ll be bundled up with a pick or prospect for a RHD
I hope to be wrong, but I really don't think they're going to move him. It's not that there won't be an opportunity, I just don't think Adams will move him for anything less than what he sees as full value. So, you're talking about a 27 year old who has scored over twenty goals three times and has term left of their contract. My guess here is that Adams would think he's worth a second, but probably the highest he gets offered is a late third.
Why do you think this when he has been a healthy scratch recently?
My reasoning isn't about whether they want to trade him, or whether there will be an opportunity to, it's that Adams won't budge for anything less than he sees as full value. He's been shrewd, I think that's a good thing, but from time to time it means you end up not making a deal because no one is willing to pay the exact price you're looking for.
Fair enough, I do agree that Adams won’t just get rid of him for the sake of doing it. I am curious what happens
Factor in most teams are better defensively than us and can accommodate his play style better Teams are looking for scoring and PP help wich is his jam A 2nd would seem fair for a 30ish goal scorer
Maybe a 4th? With his contract, it could also just be future considerations. Depends on if a team really values a PP specialist. I am setting this value in my mind so anything more would be a pleasant surprise.
The $5M is an issue, but I imagine any trade would involve 50% retained to make it much more appealing
Yeah, I still think it's a 4th at most. People don't give up assets for soft players that need to be sheltered with limited 5v5 time.
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He has a great shot but is a net negative everywhere else on the ice. He was by no means the 4th or 5th best forward on our team. If a team can afford to give him 7-9 minutes 5v5 and PP1 time, he will do okay. But he is so inconsistent and has had huge cold spells, each of the last few years. He doesn't drive play or create offense himself all that often so playing him with grinders will not get the same goal scoring output. I just see no way we could get a 1st or 2nd for him and with 50 retained I still think a 3rd is a stretch. These teams all have pro scouts. They see how Vic has looked the 2nd half of the season and that he is the odd man out and a healthy scratch. I hope we get more than this, but I will set expectations low. If KA gets more than that he is a wizard, we have no leverage trying to deal our unwanted players. People can downvote away, the truth of the matter is Vic doesn't have a play style that will score us a top 2 round pick and maybe even a top 3. On top of that, he is overpaid and is going into his last year before UFA.
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That makes sense, I was more arguing his value on his own. I don't think many teams would give more than a 4th for JUST olofsson. I totally agree the best value is using him as a piece with others and salary retention as part of a package. I just don't know if his offense will come out playing with defensive forwards. He is a guy who finds open space or stays on the outside. But, he needs others to find him. Any linemates would have to be defensively responsible on top of able to drive play because he can't create on his own consistently.
What makes you think the Sabres will eat any portion of a contract? This is a team that had loads of cap space and didn’t play middle man once during the deadline and who brought in a heavily insured contract simply to get to the cap floor. I hope I’m wrong. But the signs aren’t pointing in the right direction.
Well, you may be right. But I’m not so sure that playing middleman and being willing to retain salary are exactly the same thing.
I suppose you are somewhat correct. I’m referring to being a middle man like the Wild did.
A third.
Less than Greenway, huh?
You must be new here. Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that, and even the stupidest in the lot can find there way to reddit.
You sure did.
I'm the asshole, you're the idiot. Know your place, Larry. Hows that double shot to the face from Mitts tasting?
I love Mitts, and want him to do well. It’s been my opinion for a while that the Sabres need a different kind of player in that third-line role and/or should package Casey to upgrade our D. If he stays with the Sabres long term I’m certainly going to root for him, not against him.
You won't need to worry about Mitts on the third line. He is going to be the wing to Cozens and Quinn on the 1B line next season.
We probably overpaid for Greenway. Never underestimate Adams though—look at the returns on Risto and Reinhart.
Honestly as long as he’s gone I could care less
Bag of pucks?
3rd or 4th and 6th
he’s a 5 million dollar healthy scratch. the only way a team takes him is to avoid cap floor or if we retain a chunk of his salary. the return value won’t be much. maybe a depth piece and a mid round draft pick.
He’s a healthy scratch here but I do think a team would see value in a 20+ goal scorer PP specialist
I will be happy to see him go, he will score 20+ again in the right situation somewhere. I hope we can get some sort of value for him
My hope is that the Sabres are willing to eat a chunk of his contract and can move him for a mid-round pick. I don’t think they will eat salary, so I’d guess they need to package him with something, a mid to late round pick, in order to move him to a team like the Coyotes. My fear is they are unwilling to eat salary and/or move an asset and he will be one of the 12 starting forwards next year. For the people thinking he will be moved for a pick in the first two rounds, you are dreaming. Cap space will again be a premium asset and teams aren’t adding a guy like Olofsson. Let’s put it this way, if Olof was a UFA do you think he’s getting around $5m, even on a one year deal? Look at the players that signed for less than $6m last off-season.