T O P

  • By -

AutoModerator

**[Receiving transmission from Crait intended for u/thirsty_for_chicken]** Welcome to r/saltierthancrait! I'm an [astromech droid named S4-L7](https://www.reddit.com/r/saltierthancrait/comments/ni5s77/beloved_mascot_s4l7s_visual_dictionary_entry/) and I'll be your guide through the salt mines. Saltier Than Crait is a community of Star Wars fans who engage in critical conversations about the current state of the franchise. It is our goal to maintain a civil, welcoming space for fans who have a vast supply of salt with some peppered positivity occasionally sprinkled in. **Please [review the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/saltierthancrait/wiki/index/rules) and the [post flair guide](https://reddit.com/r/saltierthancrait/wiki/index/flairs) before contributing.** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/saltierthancrait) if you have any questions or concerns.*


EnthusiasticPanic

Easy way to force emotional investment. Children are naturally seen as requiring protection and so triggering protective/paternal instincts is a fast track to doing this. In typical corporate fashion, Disney is going to milk it to death until we grow numb to fictional children suffering.


suhkuhtuh

IMO, you can get the same deal from animals. Grogu gets the benefit of being a lot like a baby animal, but it can interact like a sentient being. *John Wick* did the "kidnapped" (or in his case, murdered) animal to good effect. Disney Wars has not managed to replicate that success.


lLegendXD00

Disney Wars is a great name for the current state of the franchise lol


the_gopnik_fish

Colonel Bob Burton challenges the Disney Old Guard in the secretive briefing rooms of the Pentagon


LostMonster0

Yup! And then out go the child labor laws. It's all a ploy!


TheWitcher76

Spot on 


Jedi4Hire

Because Disney (and Hollywood in general) ran out of actual creativity and originality decades ago.


deefop

In fairness I think it's more the \*recent\* crop of creators that have absolutely no fucking creativity. You can tell just by listening to them talk about the shit they create. They think it's a "given" that everyone should like the trash they come up with.


thirsty_for_chicken

It's diminishing returns. The classic films of past generations were written and directed by people who took inspiration from ancient myths, literary classics, etc.  People who make Star Wars now take inspiration from Star Wars. It's devoid of substance and has nothing new to offer.


farmingvillein

> People who make Star Wars now take inspiration from Star Wars. That's...generous. The EU (for all its flaws) took inspiration from Star Wars. New Star Wars? Maybe as sneering parody.


angelomoxley

Throw a bunch of random nobodies together and you're liable for group project syndrome, where the end result is some pointless husk of an idea no one is really happy with or wants to take ownership of but at least they're done. When you have a creator (or team) with an actual vision and give them the reigns is when you get art.


NarcanMe_

I think creatives in the past actually did things. Traveled the world, been to war, wrote novels and the like. They had life experiences to draw from These people went to university and check boxes. Not a fan.


Past_Search7241

It's hard to understate the importance that life experience - and not just sitting behind a screen and nursing a self-diagnosed mental illness for sympathy points - has for developing someone's quality as a writer.


lefthandedpen

Disney was built on telling other peoples stories and their retelling of their own stories is at best mixed, probably just seeing them for what they always were. Just this time it’s something we actually care about.


MoodyLiz

All the rock stars are behind the bars.


Fu_la_de

If you replace the child with the senile bald grandpa, BoBF would also fit.


Yojimbo54

It’s a cheap way to create stakes. But if you think about it for 5 seconds You know it’s empty. They will never show any harm to a kid on one of their shows, so ultimately just have the heroes a chance to do their thing.


OrdinarryAlien

> "They will never show any harm..." Ah, I immediately thought of 'that' scene in Once Upon a Time in the West. This goes to show how rare and impactful something like that is.


Yojimbo54

By the way, I wasn’t advocating for Disney to show kids getting killed in a Star Wars show. Just that there’s no real stakes in that kind of plot, so hard to take anything seriously.


OrdinarryAlien

Isn't it a bit late to say that? I've already reported you to Interpol and my uncle Tyron (he's a former NBA player and a black belt trained by Bruce Lee). Sorry not sorry. 💅


Yojimbo54

I’ve got a two day head start on him which is more than I need. I’ve got friends in every town and village from here to the Sudan. I speak a dozen languages, know every local custom. I’ll blend in, disappear, you'll never see me again.


c0rnballa

"Does anybody here speak English?"


dm_me_milkers

Ya know, now that you mention it, props to G.Lucas for having Anakin murder people. And not just the men, but the women and the children, too. Disney will never have the balls to pull that off.


lefthandedpen

Makes sense they would get crucified if it was a woman being saved.


thirsty_for_chicken

I've been trying to make it through Bad Batch, but it's really devolved into "oh no, Omega's been kidnapped... AGAIN!" makes it a real chore. There's occasionally interesting stuff in it but it's drowned out with so much pointless filler.


corneridea

Especially empty when we know the ultimate fates of the characters (Leia)


MahinaFable

>They will never show any harm to a kid on one of their shows, so ultimately just have the heroes a chance to do their thing. I mean, *Kenobi* opened with the slaughter at the Jedi Temple, and later showed pre-suit Vader stabbing a little girl with a lightsaber.


Past_Search7241

Yeah, but... she got be'er.


mcmanus2099

The only plot they know is * Heroes look for a mcguffin * Heroes run away with mcguffin You can replace mcguffin with child and Disney think it's original


pikapalooza

https://preview.redd.it/wjpurtav5xtc1.jpeg?width=868&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bb643e6d699e7bfe5c550cf30bdf07e884b442d2


Dante_FromSpace

My guess is that for bad batch, the target audience is "children" and they wanted to shoe in a child character. Grogu was an unexpected success, and Disney double and tripped down on the trope


thirsty_for_chicken

Omega is an interesting idea for a character, and I like her personality, even if it's just "what if Boba Fett was girl?" But the fact that they're hinting that she's force sensitive now is really annoying. She was completely fine without making her yet another force user main character. And Clone Force 99 trying to save other clones and deal with the fallout of Order 66 has completely been dropped so Omega can be kidnapped for the fifth time.


realist50

I suppose Grogu ended up more popular than expected, but imho that success was *very* engineered / calculated. I'm just now watching The Mandalorian for the first time. In S1E4 - Mando and the Child travel to Sorgan looking to hideout, meet Cara Dune and local farmers - we see: * Lots of shots lingering on Grogu * Camera showing things from Grogu's POV after Mando and Grogu go into a restaurant * Most of all: Winta - a child in the farming village - asks Mando if she can feed Grogu ("sure") and then if she can play with Grogu ("sure"). Call me cynical, but it comes across to me as blatantly on the nose as an analogy for real-life children watching the show to imitate by asking parents to buy them Grogu merchandise.


Dante_FromSpace

No, I agree, it was of course engineered. I don't think they expected it to take off like it did though. But what's funny is that they squandered that hype anf momentum and no even mentions that show anymore. It went from being in the cultural zeitgeist to a footnote. Granted, this was pandemic times. But still, it evaporated.


mrmoneyinthebanks

It's one of the only two ways they can show how EVIL the Empire is. The other is blowing planets up. The Empire is so EVIL because of it!


Dianneis

It's all Lucas's fault for not making handlebar moustaches a part of the Empire's lore. If they just had one to twirl, no such subplots would be necessary.


Yojimbo54

I really liked how Andor explored the bureaucracy of evil. From the infighting and competition of the ISB, the way the Empire subjugates and maintains a hold on a planet, and their brutal legal and prison system. I would argue there were no mustache twirling villains or cheap stakes, but the show made the enemy feel like they had unlimited resources, were everywhere and suffocating, and capable of anything.


RAVsec

Disney will kidnap a thousand children before they let this franchise die!


lLegendXD00

I understood that reference!


Lithuim

It’s a cheap way to make a threat to a character instantly sympathetic. We don’t really care if Rebel infantryman Getz Kidnappo is being held hostage because dozens like him die every day in this conflict - but we’re hardwired to care about kids. It also means the good guys can’t just bomb the bad guys. Hostages are the driving plot point to explain nothing but close quarters fighting.


selfcheckoutlord

Consume product and get excited for next product... Or rather, you are asking why the company that bought Disney and then IMMEDIATELY copy/pasted A New Hope into The Force Awakens has a history of recycling plots for their Star Wars shows. The answer is that those running Star Wars is completely uncreative. Does it matter that it makes absolutely zero sense for Obi-Wan to leave Tattooine to save Leia? Does it matter that very male in Kenobi was emasculated to make the women look better? Does it matter that Boba Fett honestly has no reason to want to stay on Tattooine, has no connection to Tattooine and should have instantly robbed Jabba/Bib Fortuna's palace and left for other adventures? Star Wars has gone from a series where there are consequences to a series where nothing matters. As someone recently said "Star Wars is like a kid playing with his toys. Nothing matters, nothing makes sense, and toys are put back into play with no regard for what happened before. An example of this is a recent book called "From a Certain Point of View" where we see the events of Return of the Jedi from the view points of minor characters...and a couple major ones. All the female characters are heroes or get absolved of their crimes..most of them are bisexual or lesbian, and even though we saw a sail barge explode in a giant fireball, we find out that several people were somehow blown out of the sail barge and landed somewhere safe and sound. These idiots would a third Speed movie, have the bus blow up and then say that everyone was blown out of the bus and safely landed somewhere else.


halo1besthalo

Because we live in Disney hell where unfortunately lone Wolf with cub is the ultimate family friendly storyline


StrongStyleFiction

Bad writers beleive the phrase "write what you know." Apparently, Disney writers only know kidnapping children.


tempest_wing

Because the children happen to be force sensitive and use that plot device for a lot of things, mostly in trying to tie in how the fucking emperor has a cloning program. I'm betting right now they'll do the same thing in the next game after Jedi Survivor since Cal is now taking care of Bode's kid. The kid's gonna turn out to be force sensitive as well and get kidnapped by either the empire or bounty hunters or both and Cal and his girlfriend have to save them.


TheWitcher76

I will remember this comment. You’ll probably be right 


yimmysucks

people write about what they know, and hollywood probably has a shit load of pedophiles


zombizle1

i cant wait to see what harvey weinstein's assistant is gonna do with the acolyte


YautjaPrime13

I can wait.. I’m good.


Past_Search7241

I'm probably not even going to watch the reviews that tear it apart. I just can't bring myself to care.


SovComrade

Because losing your child is the most common (and one of the most horrific) [Adult Fears](https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AdultFear). Its easy drama.


No-Push4667

Andor was basically kidnapped when he was a child.


stick_always_wins

Yea lol but its only a minor backstory to the character and not intrinsic to the plot like what happens in Bad Batch, Mandalorian, and Obi-Wan.


rexstillbottom

Adult-napping just doesn’t have the same ring to it? Easy for bad guys to take advantage of a kid. So easy to write I’m guessing.


Nopuebloplz

Even Book of Boba Fett had that child Tusken


wonderlandisburning

Because when Disney gets praise for doing one thing right (like, for instance, The first season of Mandalorian) they set about trying to replicate that same success by doing the same story over and over again - but worse and worse each time, because they care less about story and more about doing that one thing people liked that one time.


Past_Search7241

It's like that one socially inept dweeb who repeats the same joke, driving it into the ground, because he got a laugh one time. ... Yeah, that... actually makes a lot of sense, considering who they've got writing this schlock.


OmegaMalkior

Alluring more to your title post than actual post- I can’t believe the SW CW movie was about rescuing the offspring of Jabba the Hut. Like of all things lmao. I just started watching TCW after watching all that you mentioned here (weird order I know, except not having started Bad Batch) and yeah that was my first thought when I saw it due to the order I’m watching.


ThreeArmedYeti

You forgot Rebels with Kanan and Ezra. Maybe this is about normalizing children going with warrior-lookalike strangers just for them being end up in Epstein island which Disney HQ often visits. Oops sorry i realized I'm not on the circlejerk sub now


Glock99bodies

Two major reasons, demographics. Adding the kids into the stories instantly makes a character children watching the show can relate too. That way Disney can sell toys to kids. Also the children and paternal protection elements exist to attract women, specifically mothers into the franchise. Women are a major demographic Disney is looking to get interested into Star Wars and marvel. That’s why the child protagonist is usually female, and why there’s a child.


NarcanMe_

I'd buy that. Cast the widest net. Chicks do go crazy for baby Yoda.. so much so that they had to bring him back after the beautiful ending of season 2. It feels cheap


Glock99bodies

They’ve already hit critical mass with male audiences. Basically every white English speaking male who would be a Star Wars fan is one at this point. They are desperate to generate new fans.


Past_Search7241

At the expense of losing old fans?


Glock99bodies

Yes because they’ll never actually loose old fans. Sure some people may not be interested is 90% of what they put out. But things like Andor, keep older fans around. Older fans will still purchase merchandise relating to the original trilogy.


Past_Search7241

I think you'd be surprised how many haven't. Shit, I don't think I've spent a dime on Disney Star Wars since the Sequel Trilogy wrapped up.


2Fruit11

I think that the writers have become so cynical and uncreative that they think you have to rescue a child (or some equivalent act) to show that you're good. Another reason I'm astounded Andor was allowed to be as good as it was.


antinumerology

Andor was the kid that got saved/kidnapped. Still valid lol.


thirsty_for_chicken

Fair point, but at least that's his backstory rather than the central plot. All the other shows are essentially "oh no _______ has been kidnapped! I (the main character) must go save them!"


Jahleel007

Andor also *did* the kidnapping when they took that kid hostage on Aldhani


liarandahorsethief

It’s a terrible crime that can be easily depicted in a PG show, so the villains are now irredeemably evil and completely deserving of their eventual demise. Also, the hero, no matter how much of a scoundrel he or she may be, can heroically rescue them and that won’t be out of character because even brooding space badasses want to help kids in peril.


_cat_in_hat_

The Last of Us(2013), as good as it was did an irreversible damage to storytelling, literally everyone tries to copy it and fails miserably, in both tv show and games.


Stoneyrc07

I dunno, the concept of a loner adult needing to guide and protect a child from danger is far from a new concept, I think it has much more to do with lack of creativity in how to use that storyline with these modern writers, and also the *absolute oversaturation* of it needing to be in everything. It can still be a good plot, but we get numb to it when it's in 85%of the media made


Threefates654

I mean I agree with you but I will point out that Omega isn't force sensitive. She's needed for something else entirely. There might be others out there who's blood can be used for what she is needed for but Omega is the only one that the Empire knows of during the time of the Bad Batch. And admittedly it is easy to get emotional investment when it comes to kidnapping children and pragmatically these villains kidnap kids because children are easier to control.


thirsty_for_chicken

She has a high midichlorian count, so eventually she'll be a jedi in some sequel or spinoff, if not the finale of this series.


Threefates654

When was it ever said she has a high midichlorian count?


Sniper64000

Because it's Disney, magical orphans are kind of their Forte. Plus, they are afraid to take any kind of risk creatively. Their job is to follow boring formulas that are known to make money. And I think the average Disney plus viewers are young parents who just want their kids to be entertained, they don't really care about innovative storytelling.


redjedi182

I understand where you are coming from. It’s very monotone. But all of Star Wars is rescue missions. It was so ingrained that my figures had rescued missions lol Why didn’t they stay put on Death Star I Why did Luke go to Bespin What was the first act of return? Why did Luke turn himself over to Vader on Endor? The entire plot of shadows of the empire Invasion of theed The beginning of the clone wars The first scene of Revenge Rescues all the way down


MechanicalMenace54

the producers probably just wanted something they could relate to on tv


Liesmith424

"Write what you know." --Ghandi


YautjaPrime13

Because that’s what the creators wish they could do, so it’s all they can ‘write’ about..


Jahleel007

"Andor has almost no kids in it, and none of them get kidnapped." During the Aldhani heist, its the good guys that do the kidnapping and take that general's son hostage.


BlazingBlue59

I think The Book of Boba Fett avoids it because it's barely even a show (most of it is pointless Tusken filler and the rest is Boba being confused at what a *CRIME* boss is). The best episode of the show didn't even have the titular Boba Fett in it. I'm pretty sure somebody came around last minute and told them to throw together a show without a script so they could air it on D+ during a month when nothing else was scheduled to come out (gotta keep the sludge pipe flowing).


NicholasStarfall

Write what you know


5549372729

Disney has some skeletons leaking out of the closet


MCAdad

Mandalorian- grogu sells so much merch by himself Bad batch- a kids show so it makes sense there is a kid . Just like how Clone Wars had Ahsoka Kenobi- I think they had no idea what he should be doing without Luke or Leia being involved


Giveld

>Ahsoka - Sabine (she's like 30 but acts like a child so I'm including it) Bruhh😂


[deleted]

[удалено]


ChartUnlikely2407

Bruh wtf 😑 💀


MozeTheNecromancer

Because kidnapping is the last thing an evil group can do that's simultaneously evil and not "too evil for TV". Killing people is okay so long as they're portrayed as "bad", slavery is too evil to be portrayed, crime is okay because the government is Bad, etc. Disney wants you to know that the villains are evil without showing that the GFFA can be a dangerous and evil place.