They honestly wouldn’t have invited you if they didn’t care for you. Alcohol has different effects on different people, one good reason to treat drinking alcohol with respect and caution. Especially when you’re on your own over here. Be well, tomorrow is always a better day.
This right here OP. If they didn’t want to hang out with you, they wouldn’t have invited you to an event outside of work. And as for lots of drinks, it’s custom to pour drinks for others here. There’s a whole culture and science behind it (how much to pour, cheers/kampai’ing with someone older than you means you need to keep your glass lower than theirs when glasses touch, etc) so when they do that, it just means they want to interact with you. You’re lucky! Maybe just be careful with alcohol!
Ps: one tip I saw was to always keep your glass full so when they try to pour you tons of alcohol they physically can’t and then you won’t feel obligated to get wasted
Thanks for this kind comment. I was socially pressured to drink soooo much. I dont ever wanna drink that much again. Usually I’m so much more cautious. Idk what happened
At least they have nomikais with you. I haven't seen my work colleagues outside of work a single time... We barely talk about non work related stuff and I even suggested we go out for drinks or coffee or something a few times which was met with a lot of yes yes let's do it and never actually happened.
I dont know, I had a bunch of nomikais with my old school and I feel like they didnt want me there but there was about 5 people that were actually nice and feindly to me throughout them all, non of the jtes. They did invite me to karaoke after one which i went and my head JTE had like a breakdown and cried which was really strange. I think she drank to much.
There are those kinds of drunk personalities that cry etc, alcohol does strange things to people. I'm a happy drunk myself, or just sleepy if it's boring lol
Not a worry, the unwritten rule is that this is the only acceptable time to complain about something directly to your boss (after he/she has already had a few) a lot of people get emotional when they drink. You’re fine.
The following is not meant as advice nor anything more than an observation by a veteran nomikai-er who does not drink. The pouring of drinks for another is an act of kindness, respect, and inclusion----has very little to do with "pressuring" anyone to drink. You only need to take a small sip in reciprocation. In fact, you can even keep your glass near full or even drink tea or juice; it's not the drink, it's the intent. You will notice that later in the evening, some people get up and pour drinks for supervisors, principals, and other higher ranking individuals---you should do the same. It shows respect for others, shows you are trying to fit in with your group, and gives you a way to join in and not drink.
Great thing about nomikais in Japan is what happened at the nomikai stays at the nomikai. Nobody is going to care that you cried and they’ll toss it up to alcohol.
They like you a lot. Most of us aren’t even close enough to the in group to get invited. And pouring you more and more drinks is an expression of friendship. They’ll like that you felt sad and could release the tension. They want to also!
Okay thats interesting i thought they just poured to polite. Two differnt times I had teachers oder speical drinks to share with me when i found out i liked as well, maybe they actullay liked more then i thought?
I don’t understand this post at all. Why do you feel like they don’t care about you? Just drunk? It might be hard to communicate sometimes. You’re probably over thinking!
Yeah i think i woke up with hangxiety because the longer I sit on it the more okay I feel 😅 maybe I should edit the post but everyone has made me feel better in the comments.
I know things can feel personal in the moment, especially when you're drinking, but what you experienced has very little to do with you individually and a whole lot more to do with Japanese drinking culture.
In old school Japanese business drinking culture it's a bit of a social faux pax to make somebody pour their own drinks or not have a drink provided for them. It's a larger part of the idea that "if the customer had to ask for something, you already failed by not anticipating they'd need it". I don't really agree with the idea myself, but it is what it is. In that framework, you having an empty glass would make them bad hosts and be an insult to you.
At these larger scale more official nomikai these social rules tend to come out to play, and you'll have teachers watching each other like hawks, or roaming from table to table with bottles of beer topping others off. If may have felt like pressure, but it's likely just that those people all wanted you to feel included and provided for.
If you choose to go to any more big official nomikai in future, here's the secret sauce:
-Drink slowly, so that there's enough space in your cup for people to top it up a little and feel they've done their dues, but so you don't have to down a whole glass for everyone on staff.
-Give reasons with refusals. Refusing the first offer and accepting the second is another old school social pattern here. If you just say "No thank you" people will see it as a cue to ask again. Give a reason, like "No thank you, I am feeling full", to show your refusal is genuine and not a social dance.
-Be content with leaving drinks unfinished. All of the above about giving you the drinks is just social politics, once you have the drink nobody really cares if you actually drink it all or not. Don't force yourself to drink anything you don't want to. If anything, a full glass left untouched signals "I'm done".
I think this is very correct and insightful. But my friends kept holding up the sake and telling me to drink all my sake in my cup so they could give me more because mottainai. It was silly fun times and we were all doing it to each other but I definitely drank wayyyy too much
I am sure it is hard for some people to make friends, but that wasn't/isn't my priority here. Anyway, was your post just venting or something different?
2 things.
When the person in charge orders beer for everyone, just don’t drink it. No one is going to pour anything into a full glass.
Or be proactive and tell the person in charge to order alcohol-free beer for you. Then order whatever you want after that. You have a choice to leave that initial cup full or tell folks it’s alcohol-free when they try to pour.
I personally don’t like nomikais especially if I have to pay. I’d rather be around my family or friends. I wouldn’t beat myself over this.
The trick is to just leave your glass full. It's a custom to make sure everyone is being cared for and pouring a drink is a good ice-breaker for conversation, or for those teachers that don't speak English, a way to show friendliness.
I don't drink alcohol, so I get through the parties by drinking soda. Don't feel any pressure to get drunk beyond your comfort level.
So to avoid drinking next time, just tell them you can’t drink as the doctor gave you some medications for your stomach. Acid reflux is a great one; it’s permanent, not life affecting but you can claim that drinking really aggravates your condition.
That or you have a health check soon so you can’t have more than one drink. Nearly every Japanese person I know try’s not to drink when it’s health check time.
You’re welcome! And the other redditor’s comment on how alcohol can affect your mood is also spot on.
Do something that will cheer you up; for me it’s a walk in a park, some exercise or a nice long bath. Take a few moments to note down the positive things you got going for you. Even the fact that you posted on Reddit today is a positive action; it shows you want change in your life.
Nomikai PSA: If your drink is empty, someone is going to fill it up for you. Just stop finishing your drink if you feel like you've had too much alcohol. Ask for tea or water and sip that.
I think you have to look fairly inward when it comes to teacher’s room dynamics, it’s fairly transient, you see this people everyday for a year then between March and April you can be in a totally different teachers room with a whole set of different people.
As a foreigner not everyone is going to want you there, don’t take it personally. Do your best to represent, if people want to interact try to, but don’t expect to become best buddies with everyone, it’s not that kind of job..
That is why I limit my alcohol consumption and time spent with people who are not my close friends or family because drinking a lot in that setting can cause a lot drama possibly beyond salvage. When there is a longer history and closer relationship, there is a better chance of recovering from a negative situation. Hope you can push past this situation.
Yeah, it just seems that being a foreigner draws more attention to situations in general, so I am even more vigilant. No more than 2 drinks. Staying only an hour max. I honestly hate fraternization with anyone related to work, but I just tolerate compulsory hanging out to a bare minimum.
Been in Japan for 7 years now, there’s a concept called ‘Nomi-cation’, which only occurs after drinking alcohol. I think they can feel your walls/barriers of protection and they want you to be relaxed or just trust them more, hence the endless pour of alcohol. Don’t look/think too much into it
Have you heard of tattemae? Japanese are fabled to have 3 faces. The first is at work, always professional and smiling/ serious( no emotional leakage), second is with friends and family, at nomikai where they laugh or talk more, third is only with themselves. Their real motives and thoughts that no one gets to see
I enjoyed my time as a JTE more when I just relaxed, made jokes and let my real personality out (ofcourse, being aware of professional boundaries and reading the atmosphere among different people). Focus on making friends with those teachers that want to communicate, with kids and find hobbies you enjoy and you’ll enjoy your stay more
Goodluck !
Don't worry sender, Japanese people drink alcohol to release their own demons or tension so your little outburst they will just chalk it up to alcohol. Maybe next time tell them you have a limit and just make up some excuse. They invited you so they care about you. I purposely avoid nomikais though because I don't trust myself not to drink when someone is pushing me and I definitely don't trust myself drunk lol.
If you're gonna cry, that's one of more culturally appropriate times to do so. It might be good to think about what you were crying about and what, if anything, you can do about it.
They honestly wouldn’t have invited you if they didn’t care for you. Alcohol has different effects on different people, one good reason to treat drinking alcohol with respect and caution. Especially when you’re on your own over here. Be well, tomorrow is always a better day.
This right here OP. If they didn’t want to hang out with you, they wouldn’t have invited you to an event outside of work. And as for lots of drinks, it’s custom to pour drinks for others here. There’s a whole culture and science behind it (how much to pour, cheers/kampai’ing with someone older than you means you need to keep your glass lower than theirs when glasses touch, etc) so when they do that, it just means they want to interact with you. You’re lucky! Maybe just be careful with alcohol! Ps: one tip I saw was to always keep your glass full so when they try to pour you tons of alcohol they physically can’t and then you won’t feel obligated to get wasted
Japanese sober: 😐🙄🤨 Japanese when drinks are involved: 🤣😵💫🤢😁
Thanks for this kind comment. I was socially pressured to drink soooo much. I dont ever wanna drink that much again. Usually I’m so much more cautious. Idk what happened
At least they have nomikais with you. I haven't seen my work colleagues outside of work a single time... We barely talk about non work related stuff and I even suggested we go out for drinks or coffee or something a few times which was met with a lot of yes yes let's do it and never actually happened.
I dont know, I had a bunch of nomikais with my old school and I feel like they didnt want me there but there was about 5 people that were actually nice and feindly to me throughout them all, non of the jtes. They did invite me to karaoke after one which i went and my head JTE had like a breakdown and cried which was really strange. I think she drank to much.
There are those kinds of drunk personalities that cry etc, alcohol does strange things to people. I'm a happy drunk myself, or just sleepy if it's boring lol
Worried i might have shot myself in the foot with the tears tho. RIP
Nah, the nomikai is a free pass in Japan.
Not a worry, the unwritten rule is that this is the only acceptable time to complain about something directly to your boss (after he/she has already had a few) a lot of people get emotional when they drink. You’re fine.
This makes me feel a lot better. You’re very kind. I feel relieved!
The following is not meant as advice nor anything more than an observation by a veteran nomikai-er who does not drink. The pouring of drinks for another is an act of kindness, respect, and inclusion----has very little to do with "pressuring" anyone to drink. You only need to take a small sip in reciprocation. In fact, you can even keep your glass near full or even drink tea or juice; it's not the drink, it's the intent. You will notice that later in the evening, some people get up and pour drinks for supervisors, principals, and other higher ranking individuals---you should do the same. It shows respect for others, shows you are trying to fit in with your group, and gives you a way to join in and not drink.
Great thing about nomikais in Japan is what happened at the nomikai stays at the nomikai. Nobody is going to care that you cried and they’ll toss it up to alcohol.
Thank god
They like you a lot. Most of us aren’t even close enough to the in group to get invited. And pouring you more and more drinks is an expression of friendship. They’ll like that you felt sad and could release the tension. They want to also!
Honestly by the end of the night we were all laughing about it and everything was ok, probably. I do feel embarrassed though
Okay thats interesting i thought they just poured to polite. Two differnt times I had teachers oder speical drinks to share with me when i found out i liked as well, maybe they actullay liked more then i thought?
Wtf is this nonsensical cry baby post?
*starts shaking my ass VERY hard in your direction *
I don’t understand this post at all. Why do you feel like they don’t care about you? Just drunk? It might be hard to communicate sometimes. You’re probably over thinking!
Yeah i think i woke up with hangxiety because the longer I sit on it the more okay I feel 😅 maybe I should edit the post but everyone has made me feel better in the comments.
I know things can feel personal in the moment, especially when you're drinking, but what you experienced has very little to do with you individually and a whole lot more to do with Japanese drinking culture. In old school Japanese business drinking culture it's a bit of a social faux pax to make somebody pour their own drinks or not have a drink provided for them. It's a larger part of the idea that "if the customer had to ask for something, you already failed by not anticipating they'd need it". I don't really agree with the idea myself, but it is what it is. In that framework, you having an empty glass would make them bad hosts and be an insult to you. At these larger scale more official nomikai these social rules tend to come out to play, and you'll have teachers watching each other like hawks, or roaming from table to table with bottles of beer topping others off. If may have felt like pressure, but it's likely just that those people all wanted you to feel included and provided for. If you choose to go to any more big official nomikai in future, here's the secret sauce: -Drink slowly, so that there's enough space in your cup for people to top it up a little and feel they've done their dues, but so you don't have to down a whole glass for everyone on staff. -Give reasons with refusals. Refusing the first offer and accepting the second is another old school social pattern here. If you just say "No thank you" people will see it as a cue to ask again. Give a reason, like "No thank you, I am feeling full", to show your refusal is genuine and not a social dance. -Be content with leaving drinks unfinished. All of the above about giving you the drinks is just social politics, once you have the drink nobody really cares if you actually drink it all or not. Don't force yourself to drink anything you don't want to. If anything, a full glass left untouched signals "I'm done".
I think this is very correct and insightful. But my friends kept holding up the sake and telling me to drink all my sake in my cup so they could give me more because mottainai. It was silly fun times and we were all doing it to each other but I definitely drank wayyyy too much
The pouring the drink for the customer thing actually goes back to inn keepers forcing people to drink more then it became the custom and was polite.
Whenever I get invited out, I just say I'm busy. You can do the same.
I dont want to not be invited out. I love my friends/coworkers
Hmmm, I never wanted to get close to coworkers. I always tried to separate work and personal life. I guess I dont understand your problem.
I get wanting that separation. I think its kinda hard to make friends in Japan though
I am sure it is hard for some people to make friends, but that wasn't/isn't my priority here. Anyway, was your post just venting or something different?
Venting and seeking some reassurance through other people’s experiences
2 things. When the person in charge orders beer for everyone, just don’t drink it. No one is going to pour anything into a full glass. Or be proactive and tell the person in charge to order alcohol-free beer for you. Then order whatever you want after that. You have a choice to leave that initial cup full or tell folks it’s alcohol-free when they try to pour. I personally don’t like nomikais especially if I have to pay. I’d rather be around my family or friends. I wouldn’t beat myself over this.
The trick is to just leave your glass full. It's a custom to make sure everyone is being cared for and pouring a drink is a good ice-breaker for conversation, or for those teachers that don't speak English, a way to show friendliness. I don't drink alcohol, so I get through the parties by drinking soda. Don't feel any pressure to get drunk beyond your comfort level.
So to avoid drinking next time, just tell them you can’t drink as the doctor gave you some medications for your stomach. Acid reflux is a great one; it’s permanent, not life affecting but you can claim that drinking really aggravates your condition. That or you have a health check soon so you can’t have more than one drink. Nearly every Japanese person I know try’s not to drink when it’s health check time.
Thanks for this advice. Generally i only drink a little at these things but they gave me tooooo many drinks.
You’re welcome! And the other redditor’s comment on how alcohol can affect your mood is also spot on. Do something that will cheer you up; for me it’s a walk in a park, some exercise or a nice long bath. Take a few moments to note down the positive things you got going for you. Even the fact that you posted on Reddit today is a positive action; it shows you want change in your life.
Nomikai PSA: If your drink is empty, someone is going to fill it up for you. Just stop finishing your drink if you feel like you've had too much alcohol. Ask for tea or water and sip that.
They were forcing me to chug my drinks so they could refill them 😅 otherwise yeah i just keep one drink for awhile but things got crazy ig
I think you have to look fairly inward when it comes to teacher’s room dynamics, it’s fairly transient, you see this people everyday for a year then between March and April you can be in a totally different teachers room with a whole set of different people. As a foreigner not everyone is going to want you there, don’t take it personally. Do your best to represent, if people want to interact try to, but don’t expect to become best buddies with everyone, it’s not that kind of job..
That is why I limit my alcohol consumption and time spent with people who are not my close friends or family because drinking a lot in that setting can cause a lot drama possibly beyond salvage. When there is a longer history and closer relationship, there is a better chance of recovering from a negative situation. Hope you can push past this situation.
Gah, me too. If not, its okay. I’ll just keep being cheerful in the teacher’s office
Yeah, it just seems that being a foreigner draws more attention to situations in general, so I am even more vigilant. No more than 2 drinks. Staying only an hour max. I honestly hate fraternization with anyone related to work, but I just tolerate compulsory hanging out to a bare minimum.
I know this is a personal question and unrelated to the thread (sort of) but why do you hate it???
Because I know how full of shit colleagues and people in general are. I have my boundaries and do what works for my life, not to please people.
Alcohol kills.
Been in Japan for 7 years now, there’s a concept called ‘Nomi-cation’, which only occurs after drinking alcohol. I think they can feel your walls/barriers of protection and they want you to be relaxed or just trust them more, hence the endless pour of alcohol. Don’t look/think too much into it Have you heard of tattemae? Japanese are fabled to have 3 faces. The first is at work, always professional and smiling/ serious( no emotional leakage), second is with friends and family, at nomikai where they laugh or talk more, third is only with themselves. Their real motives and thoughts that no one gets to see I enjoyed my time as a JTE more when I just relaxed, made jokes and let my real personality out (ofcourse, being aware of professional boundaries and reading the atmosphere among different people). Focus on making friends with those teachers that want to communicate, with kids and find hobbies you enjoy and you’ll enjoy your stay more Goodluck !
Don't worry sender, Japanese people drink alcohol to release their own demons or tension so your little outburst they will just chalk it up to alcohol. Maybe next time tell them you have a limit and just make up some excuse. They invited you so they care about you. I purposely avoid nomikais though because I don't trust myself not to drink when someone is pushing me and I definitely don't trust myself drunk lol.
I actually woke up and there was selfies with my coworkers while i was crying so maybe they thought it was kind of endearing!!!
If you're gonna cry, that's one of more culturally appropriate times to do so. It might be good to think about what you were crying about and what, if anything, you can do about it.