Yeah, I never know what masks to buy from Amazon anymore. The first 10 brands are “sponsored” and then amazons “top pick”. Makes me think all those assholes just paid Amazon money to be top results. I don’t even know if I can trust star ratings
You absolutely can’t trust star ratings. I’ve been offered Amazon gift cards countless times for giving a 5 star review. Amazon is dead to me personally.
This isn’t new info either, but everything is procured for me. So the results are distorted and I typically can’t find what I want unless I specifically type that brand into the search bar.
I’ve gotten fake items, including food and supplements, more times than I can count. Its a fucking free for all and the consumers are losing. I buy my supplements direct for gnc or vitamin shoppe. I want a Nintendo controller, I refuse to buy it on Amazon. Im just done with the store.
Oh, and get this! We used to have free Whole Foods delivery in my area. Now they charge 10 bucks. My benefits for being a prime member are also constantly getting stripped away. They ruined Whole Foods for me too but I’ll leave that for another comment section.
I literally never buy anything that isn't name-branded off Amazon anymore. Too many fake weird rip-offs with completely fabricated photos and reviews.
I basically have to know exactly what I'm trying to buy first, and then I'll consider Amazon, otherwise I'll trust any other site first.
ReviewMeta works pretty well too I think.
https://reviewmeta.com
I use Keepa to check prices before I buy something too. That and the obvious of checking other sites too.
https://keepa.com/#!search
This is my take as well… I’m avoiding them at all costs. Everything is a Chinese poorly made knock off that is sold elsewhere for half the price or fake. I’ve gotten fake soap, fake eye drops, fake exercise equipment, fake underwear, and fake clothing all in the last 6 months. I’m straight up scared to order anything that is medical or whatever because I don’t want to die. I contacted Amazon about any case and they straight up did not care. I now buy everything in person, where I can inspect it, from target or Walmart or wherever.
Most of it was stuff I had bought before, so it either didn’t look right, didn’t smell right, or was missing the safety seal. I then looked up serial numbers or the legitimate packaging to investigate. Adidas stuff was just clearly fake.
Joke on Chinese goods runs like this:
A Chinese farmer needs seed for next season so he spend half of his earning to get seeds from market, turns out it was fake so it have no crops after 6 month.
Farmer is sad and want to kill himself so brought a pesticide to drink, he drank all 2 gallon of it and he didn’t die because it was fake as well.
In the end the family glad he survived, they brought him a high quality whisky and they celebrated with nice dinner. Everyone went blind or died because the whiskey was nonetheless, a fake whiskey.
I admire your strength, I haven't shopped at a Walmart in over a decade, haven't knowingly bought a Nestlé product in years (i found out yesterday they own cheerios), but I can't quite kick my Amazon addiction, it feels terrible.
No need to admire me, I’m an extremely disagreeable person. So when something/someone starts fucking me over in the slightest, I simply won’t participate in that activity anymore. I mean I simply can’t trust Amazon anymore.
I’m extremely sensitive to change. The ten bucks for the Whole Foods delivery is nothing, it’s the principle. They are slowly pushing and pushing, 3% at a time. Enough that most people won’t get upset and then slowly over time asking for more and more money. Manipulating reviews, curating products not based on consumers needs but for profit maximization.
I’ve dropped A LOT of brands because of the pandemic. Palmolive soap turned into water. One degree organic choco cereal, they took 50% of the cocoa powder out, doesn’t taste the same. Boxed food prices went up, so I’m eating more Whole Foods. Again, it’s not that the price of these items are too high now. But I simply cannot pay the same or more for a clearly inferior product. Nerd ropes got shorter twice during the pandemic and the eye got rid of the cardboard piece inside. Culver’s stoped using those sexy ketchup packets you can peel back, went to the regular ones. I can just keep going. But I guess my point is, why do we continue to support these places when they’re kinda fucking us? I just can’t anymore.
That's the admirable part; your commitment. When I bounced on Walmart, folks would be shocked. They would ask why I would list shitty things they've done or are doing. 95% of the time, I get a nod of it acknowledgment and agreement followed by “...but they save me money!” convenience and apathy will kill us.
I don’t know why I pay Prime. There are not really free shipping for everything. And prime video you have to pay for most of the stuff that is free on Netflix!
I pay for Prime annually for the Twitch features : the free sub obviously, but also the extra emotes and the username color choice (like Twitch Turbo).
The price per month is a few cents more than a regular sub, which basically means Prime Video is free. I can afford 5c/month for all of that...
The alternative is 15% off for a 6 months sub, but it is less convient and I would lose the customisation options.
> or most of the stuff that is free on Netflix!
Wait, isn't Netflix a subscription too?
Yes it is subscription based. However on amazon video you need to pay extra for the content that is not included in the membership. Most of that content is in Netflix (no extra charge).
Hmmm... I guess it's country specific?
I never saw even once any content not available without extra payment.
Let me guess, the ones included have a "Included with prime" tag? Because *all of them* have it on my end.
Basically Prime is what I assume Netflix would be : for a year it's like Youtube, but with better connexion.
No prime? Nothing. With prime? Everything.
I’ve talk to people online who worked at Whole Foods, they hated it also. They loved being there before Amazon. They’re are stripping what Whole Foods, what it was. You’re better off a local farmer market or Trader Joe’s.
I just read reviews elsewhere instead of paying attention to their ratings. There are also browser plugins that can identify fake ratings and will adjust the score and explain the reasoning.
the ratings are why the fake items do so well because the ratings are rigged. between what everyone else has said there are scams where scammers use the Amazon platform to buy their own fake items with stolen credit cards to get the money and then get the fake reviews from the accounts to boost their products. 80% of the shit on Amazon is a fake Chinese knockoff. people just don’t know it. i got fake batteries. fake slim jims. fake Hanes comfort soft tshirts. 95% of cosmetics are faked because there’s no regulation and there’s a good markup plus women can’t tell the difference anyway. i bought bd syringes that were clearly fake and it’s disturbing because real medical syringes are sterile. the order that came in from Amazon was probably made in a non sterile environment and all the tips were barely sharp enough to pierce skin. all of these products were highly rated and had high reviews. this has been going on for the last 7 years but it’s worse now than it’s ever been so i refuse to buy anything other than socks and underwear from Amazon. especially with the rampant price gougers. 1 jar peanut butter 9.99. Walmart 2.15. they literally go to Walmart and clean out the supply and then repost everything on Amazon with gouged prices. fuck Amazon.
You can’t really trust the ratings. There are too many fakes. One thing that has helped me sift through the garbage, though, is to sort ratings by new. I feel like that gives a much better picture of the actual situation.
Edit: two -> too. How embarrassing.
Yup. Filtering by 1 stars is dumb because it’s people getting mad at UPS that their package was dented. Completely irrelevant to Amazon or the seller. 2-4 stars are good because it shows people actually thought about the rating
Unlike Walmart, Target, Macy’s, Pennies, Marshall’s, Home Depot, Lowe’s, every grocery store, every single Sears store in existence, and every retailer that has ever existed???
Big difference here. (I worked retail for over 10 years as a manager.) For Walmart, Target, etc, they place the store brand directly next to the name brand. So Tylenol is directly next to the store brand Tylenol. On Amazon, they are burying the name brand product to page 2, 3 or 4 while showing their product first. They also use the "Amazon Choice" labels to further highlight their brand. I don't care that they are selling their own brands, but at least show them together to let the consumer decide which they prefer.
The selling point of Amazon is online shopping, fast delivery, etc. At no point has anyone ever said "Yeah I like shopping at Amazon because they hide products!" So what are you on about?
The fact that I’m not shopping on A,axon for selections of manufacturer. I’m shopping on Amazon to type in a word and usually buy the cheapest thing of that word that shows up.
Shopping at Walmart to avoid amazon is like wandering though bear country to avoid mountain lions.
The neat thing, though, is that the analogy works both ways.
1) Order groceries through Whole Foods (Amazon).
2) Search for brand name product.
3a) Previously, desired result with in top 8 (might be shuffled around with variations from brand).
3b) Amazon results now fill top 8, then crazy non-substitutes (ordering strawberries? How about lentils). Desired brand might be on page 2, 3. The “your product couldn’t be found” fillers - the lentils, for example - discourage further looking.
This isn’t even preferential, or variation - I’m all for seeing Major Competitor and Indie Competitor, and hey, understandably House Brand - in the above the fold results. **Burying the direct matches on page 2-3** has well known user behavior results (kills more than 80% of audience reach).
> 1) Order groceries through Whole Foods (Amazon).
>
> 2) Search for brand name product.
>
> 3a) Previously, desired result with in top 8 (might be shuffled around with variations from brand).
>
> 3b) Amazon results now fill top 8, then crazy non-substitutes (ordering strawberries? How about lentils). Desired brand might be on page 2, 3. The “your product couldn’t be found” fillers - the lentils, for example - discourage further looking.
>
> This isn’t even preferential, or variation - I’m all for seeing Major Competitor and Indie Competitor, and hey, understandably House Brand - in the above the fold results. Burying the direct matches on page 2-3 has well known user behavior results (kills more than 80% of audience reach).
That sounds like it's an upcoming anti-trust case.
Since Amazon took over whole foods I have noticed quite a bit more in-store shelf space dedicated to inhouse brands as well.
Other major grocers do it to with their brands but whole foods under Amazon management replaced half their store.
I mean. You’re grocery shopping on a website. What do you expect? And wanting buy Whole Foods wouldn’t you want to support your local seller than a corporation anyway?
I would expect that if I searched “brand,” and they stocked “brand” that the website would not pretend they do not have “brand,” but helpfully suggest in house alternative.
What do you not understand about burying it on the third page, after a page of random results?
Like I said, that’s worlds different than “oh, are you looking for Famous Soy Sauce? How about Amazon Soy Sauce, large, small, or gluten free? Also, Indie Soy Sauce? And I guess here’s Famous Soy Sauce, too.”
Again groceries in a warehouse store. It’s like sushi at a gas station. Yea they stock it would I buy it or even go look for it? Nah probably not I’m gonna go to the sushi place down the road for sushi. Warehouse stores are great for things with barcodes. Something tossed in a bin that can be tossed in another bin. Grocery stores are meant for groceries.
You must’ve. Whole Foods. It’s there in the thread. Ordering online is through Amazon’s site because they’ve been purchased and integrated. When the actual product is packed, it’s from a Whole Foods **store**. Go in one and see the Amazon shoppers packing bags, loading cars, and making a fool of you.
None of which has anything to do with anti-competitive brand redirection and burying in their search.
Seriously it isnt. We used to actually punish and break up companies for doing this. It only led to the greatest middle class of all time. Look at us now.
The logic to split up Amazon's marketplace from Amazon's manufactured brands -- goods sold on that marketplace -- is a straight line.
Amazon uses their control over the single most important ~~online~~ marketplace to gather metrics on other peoples' products to skip having to do any research, development, and advertising. Then they basically can jump in on top of third party brands and outcompete them through better search placement, which they have 100% control over, and they don't have to take on any risk at all since R&D was already done (meaning that risk can be folded out of their prices). Let the third parties eat all the negative externalities.
There's a lot of commodity goods where it probably doesn't matter much, but Amazon also has some pretty goddamn niche goods put out under AmazonBasics. They operate as a practical protection racket for a lot of their customers.
They've been doing it for years. No one is surprised. It isn't right, but there's no political will to stand up to big business anymore.
You forgot their other cheats: they figure out which suppliers you’re using and utilize the same one with your same formulation. They get a return address from your supplier so they allow everyone else to take the risk to figure out the best product/supplier then they just copy it (combined with best research results). They don’t need to spend on R&D, or supplier selection process.
Becuase they pay politicians astronomical amounts of money. And now AWS is the literal backbone of our entire military.
Many don't realize their marketplace lost money every single year until 2016. It's still in the negative. They only lasted from AWS money
Excellent explanation. Thank you. I was finding it difficult to find the monopoly- hence my question. It’s just like Disney, Unilever, or Walmart - thank you
As far as trade practices, ripping off profitable products and undercutting them into oblivion is worse. Amazon Brand is a cancer. What Amazon does to workers with its miserly performance metrics is the worst.
This is a very good point. The problem is the scale and cruel efficiency at which Amazon is able to rip off and eliminate competitors. They can mine the sellers data, find the optimal suppliers/manufacturers and squeeze out the original seller(s). Amazon will sell at a loss if it has to, in order to gain market share. Once the competition is gone, they can raise prices, so the consumer doesn’t even benefit. I wouldn’t be surprised if this process is basically automated or will be soon.
Eh if they are all just selling the same chinese product. Why the fuck should i care if its amazon branded or not? Why are we trying to keep an industry of middle men alive?
I would agree, if that was the case. [It’s not.](https://www.vice.com/en/article/akz48p/jeff-bezos-has-no-idea-how-often-amazon-rips-off-its-sellers)They have all of the sellers data and they target profitable items with high profit margins. They copy the product as an Amazon Basic and then undercut the original seller and/or use their recommendations to promote their own brand unfairly.
Your link still does not contradict what i said. You half assed google search does not provide any factual data on stolen ip.
Seller are not the manufacturer or ip owners. Most these “sellers” are rebranders. They are middle men branding Chinese products and selling them.
They provide zero actual value and if amazon “ripping them” results in the same final product but cheaper then its just better for the consumers.
Middle men are fucking useless anyways and your google search does not provide any support that these are anything other than just that.
Big difference is likely how searching for products works.
Online spaces have the ability to use dark patterns or other psychological tricks to get people to do the things they want. Most people never go beyond page 1 and generally go for items high on the list. The first search result even, if it's the cheapest(which amazon items most of the time are.)
So while i agree this isn't anything out of the ordinary, you can't really have this same magnitude of effect in a real life retail environment. Sure you can move the items closer to the beginning of the aisle or make them slightly more prominent, but i'd argue that isn't really nearly as much of a driving force as what amazon has going on for it with it's search algorithms. Items on page 2 and beyond might as well not exist for most users, you really don't have that problem in a real store.
I think the main difference is simply Amazon's size. If many smaller (although still huge IMO) companies do it, where the marketshare is more evenly distributed, the potential for distortion and basically fucking consumers over is less extreme.
Personally I don’t think any of those companies should be allowed to sell their own products side-by-side. I don’t think they should be allowed to be producing competition to the products they sell. There’s a conflict of interest.
Break them up.
Thank you! It is monopolistic, and anti competitive. Especially given the size of Amazon.
They also note trends of up and coming products, then contact the producer of the goods and then undercut the people who made the product popular on their website to begin with.
This is the reason I stopped buying from Amazon like 10 years ago, they are only here to make money and hurt people who are making them slightly less money than they could make by ruining their lives, but thats what is called a free market these days.
There was a time when machine tools were being popularized, and large factories we're getting built, and people were excited about how that would change "work" in general.
Fast forward 40 years and those factories had armies of 6-10 year olds working 90 hour weeks. Labor unions were literally getting gunned down in the streets.
We're at the exciting part of automation. Our kids will fight the labor wars.
1. How is this relevant to the topic of private label goods? The point is that if Kroger can put its store brand at eye level and the name brand one shelf down, Amazon can put its store brand in the top search result and one search result down.
2. Keep in mind that while Amazon is the largest player in e-commerce, it is tiny in the broader retail market.
2. You underestimate the infinite wants and desires of consumers.
I really don’t understand why people keep writing about this. Of course they do, same thing as Walmart putting great value brand in the front of the store
When Walmart started they had to becuase Monopoly laws were still being upheld.
There was a time when Microsoft couldn't even preinstall IE on windows.
Now I get my prescriptions from a bookstore that also runs the US military.
This is not at all surprising. It is no different than how they hijack searches for products to sell their own or the product that gets them more profit.
It really just comes down to if this should be legal or not.
Agreed. I feel they could have an even greater market share today if they had gone the route of making sure ratings are fair, honest verified, and products are well described and easily comparable. Why does nobody make a store like that?
I think for an anti monopoly solution for Amazon would be to bar them from selling their own brands (or having any stake in a brand). Truly take it back as a marketplace.
Legit question, no snark implied or intended, but should we extend that to all of the big box stores? A huge chunk of the best-placed items on shelves in retail stores like Walmart or Target are their own brands disguised as others.
Couldn’t be Best Buy who ONLY sells their cables. Manufacturing cost and employee price is like $0.60 while retail is $35. It’s a fucking scam how bad these places are. No wonder everyone hates Best Buy. Cause it’s the worst and most expensive buy. Sure they have a “price match policy” but it has to be new and sold by a large retailer. Well, Best Buy doesn’t sell their cables anywhere else except their website and in store. Which surprise surprise never go on sale or go down in price.
Honestly just buy the cheaper cable from Amazon and use Best Buys 15 day return policy if you NEED a cable right then and there.
This is an argument I have with friends who are very pro "Buy from stores not just amazon". I would if it didn't cost double+ the price.
Example, just 2 days ago I purchased a Ryobi Nail gun from a local small chain hardware store. It was an impulse buy so I didn't really price check. I got that and the 40v battery that it uses. Got home, realized "Oh man forgot a charger". So my wife said just check online maybe they have next day delivery. I check... At the store the battery alone was $99. On amazon, 2x 40v batteries and charger $80.
Returned the battery and bought online. The nail gun was only $5 more locally so I kept it. 🤷♂️
But this is literally the same thing as brick-and-mortar stores are doing - offering products similar to the competition but with their own branding and often in promotional prices.
This is the equivalent but much more visible due to the interactiveness of the medium.
In the end it’s users choice why to buy. I.e. I just “ignore” every top result as it’s always a paid ad.
Water is actually not wet; It makes other materials/objects wet. Wetness is the state of a non-liquid when a liquid adheres to, and/or permeates its substance while maintaining chemically distinct structures. So if we say something is wet we mean the liquid is sticking to the object.
I hate all corporations and capitalism in itself, but there is nothing wrong with this as long as they disclose it is their brand lol. Non-story, Amazon is doing way worse.
Would be pretty great if countries got together and created their own open virtual marketplaces for all traders. Kinda like how they build real life malls and marketplaces, why not build online ones?
Malls were not government buildings and were very much for profit. I get what you’re saying, but that would be a huge financial burden to moderate that, and any time something went wrong the government would get sued.
Because the online storefront isn't the hard part of e-commerce, fulfillment is. The competitive edge of Amazon has always been on the fulfillment side.
You know it’s not unreasonable it’s just cost of doing business. Any smart buyer can look at eBay, the other price options, and other stores people get so used to going to one place for stuff they forget about competitive markets where the stuff they get is sold elsewhere for different prices.
Not a surprise. They seem to do this for many unknown brands. I’ve definitely had times when I had to search specifically for a popular highly rated brand since it didn’t come up during a general search.
We do the same thing with the products we distribute from 3rd parties. The rallying cry is “In-house before out house” (our shit is better than their shit),
While I see this as somewhat immoral, I don't think it's that big of a deal. If I want brand X, I'll get brand X. I don't think anyone would go "oh, I wanted this brand and model that I've researched for half a day or more but now I'll just get the Amazon Basics".
It’s far more likely that US politicians will need to be highly ranked on Amazon to win their elections which will occur on Amazon in the future than Amazon’s monopoly being broken up, lest they be replaced by an Amazon branded politician with better rankings.
Did anyone expect otherwise? Really? Everyone pushes their store brand. I see it, and I’ll consider the generic if I want. It’s not subversive, it’s to be expected.
Don’t use Amazon for reviews. Use an independent unbiased review for this information. Then search the product on Amazon, go 3 pages deep and buy your product.
In related news, CVS pharmacy put their brand of stool softener right next to name brand products.
“No, I didn’t have to go looking for it. Their brand was right there next to the name brands!”
I want to quit Amazon altogether, but I'm not strong enough... too goddamn convenient. However, I did stop buying Amazon basics long ago. I know that HDMI cable would have been $2.71 cheaper. I'm just not sure I want to sell myself for $2.71 when I already feel like an asshole for shopping here in the first place.
Yeah, I never know what masks to buy from Amazon anymore. The first 10 brands are “sponsored” and then amazons “top pick”. Makes me think all those assholes just paid Amazon money to be top results. I don’t even know if I can trust star ratings
You absolutely can’t trust star ratings. I’ve been offered Amazon gift cards countless times for giving a 5 star review. Amazon is dead to me personally. This isn’t new info either, but everything is procured for me. So the results are distorted and I typically can’t find what I want unless I specifically type that brand into the search bar. I’ve gotten fake items, including food and supplements, more times than I can count. Its a fucking free for all and the consumers are losing. I buy my supplements direct for gnc or vitamin shoppe. I want a Nintendo controller, I refuse to buy it on Amazon. Im just done with the store. Oh, and get this! We used to have free Whole Foods delivery in my area. Now they charge 10 bucks. My benefits for being a prime member are also constantly getting stripped away. They ruined Whole Foods for me too but I’ll leave that for another comment section.
I literally never buy anything that isn't name-branded off Amazon anymore. Too many fake weird rip-offs with completely fabricated photos and reviews. I basically have to know exactly what I'm trying to buy first, and then I'll consider Amazon, otherwise I'll trust any other site first.
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You need [Fakespot.](https://www.fakespot.com)
ReviewMeta works pretty well too I think. https://reviewmeta.com I use Keepa to check prices before I buy something too. That and the obvious of checking other sites too. https://keepa.com/#!search
This is my take as well… I’m avoiding them at all costs. Everything is a Chinese poorly made knock off that is sold elsewhere for half the price or fake. I’ve gotten fake soap, fake eye drops, fake exercise equipment, fake underwear, and fake clothing all in the last 6 months. I’m straight up scared to order anything that is medical or whatever because I don’t want to die. I contacted Amazon about any case and they straight up did not care. I now buy everything in person, where I can inspect it, from target or Walmart or wherever.
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If it’s something you buy often, the smell/texture/quality/difference in packaging can be a tip-off that it’s a fake.
Most of it was stuff I had bought before, so it either didn’t look right, didn’t smell right, or was missing the safety seal. I then looked up serial numbers or the legitimate packaging to investigate. Adidas stuff was just clearly fake.
Joke on Chinese goods runs like this: A Chinese farmer needs seed for next season so he spend half of his earning to get seeds from market, turns out it was fake so it have no crops after 6 month. Farmer is sad and want to kill himself so brought a pesticide to drink, he drank all 2 gallon of it and he didn’t die because it was fake as well. In the end the family glad he survived, they brought him a high quality whisky and they celebrated with nice dinner. Everyone went blind or died because the whiskey was nonetheless, a fake whiskey.
Straight up.
I admire your strength, I haven't shopped at a Walmart in over a decade, haven't knowingly bought a Nestlé product in years (i found out yesterday they own cheerios), but I can't quite kick my Amazon addiction, it feels terrible.
No need to admire me, I’m an extremely disagreeable person. So when something/someone starts fucking me over in the slightest, I simply won’t participate in that activity anymore. I mean I simply can’t trust Amazon anymore. I’m extremely sensitive to change. The ten bucks for the Whole Foods delivery is nothing, it’s the principle. They are slowly pushing and pushing, 3% at a time. Enough that most people won’t get upset and then slowly over time asking for more and more money. Manipulating reviews, curating products not based on consumers needs but for profit maximization. I’ve dropped A LOT of brands because of the pandemic. Palmolive soap turned into water. One degree organic choco cereal, they took 50% of the cocoa powder out, doesn’t taste the same. Boxed food prices went up, so I’m eating more Whole Foods. Again, it’s not that the price of these items are too high now. But I simply cannot pay the same or more for a clearly inferior product. Nerd ropes got shorter twice during the pandemic and the eye got rid of the cardboard piece inside. Culver’s stoped using those sexy ketchup packets you can peel back, went to the regular ones. I can just keep going. But I guess my point is, why do we continue to support these places when they’re kinda fucking us? I just can’t anymore.
That's the admirable part; your commitment. When I bounced on Walmart, folks would be shocked. They would ask why I would list shitty things they've done or are doing. 95% of the time, I get a nod of it acknowledgment and agreement followed by “...but they save me money!” convenience and apathy will kill us.
I don’t know why I pay Prime. There are not really free shipping for everything. And prime video you have to pay for most of the stuff that is free on Netflix!
And yet there's a bunch of shows free on Prime Video that are also on Hulu, but Hulu has ads in them.
I pay for Prime annually for the Twitch features : the free sub obviously, but also the extra emotes and the username color choice (like Twitch Turbo). The price per month is a few cents more than a regular sub, which basically means Prime Video is free. I can afford 5c/month for all of that... The alternative is 15% off for a 6 months sub, but it is less convient and I would lose the customisation options. > or most of the stuff that is free on Netflix! Wait, isn't Netflix a subscription too?
Yes it is subscription based. However on amazon video you need to pay extra for the content that is not included in the membership. Most of that content is in Netflix (no extra charge).
Hmmm... I guess it's country specific? I never saw even once any content not available without extra payment. Let me guess, the ones included have a "Included with prime" tag? Because *all of them* have it on my end. Basically Prime is what I assume Netflix would be : for a year it's like Youtube, but with better connexion. No prime? Nothing. With prime? Everything.
I’ve talk to people online who worked at Whole Foods, they hated it also. They loved being there before Amazon. They’re are stripping what Whole Foods, what it was. You’re better off a local farmer market or Trader Joe’s.
I just read reviews elsewhere instead of paying attention to their ratings. There are also browser plugins that can identify fake ratings and will adjust the score and explain the reasoning.
Damn. I haven’t been offered one gift card. Not that I don’t believe you damn, what am I doing wrong
the ratings are why the fake items do so well because the ratings are rigged. between what everyone else has said there are scams where scammers use the Amazon platform to buy their own fake items with stolen credit cards to get the money and then get the fake reviews from the accounts to boost their products. 80% of the shit on Amazon is a fake Chinese knockoff. people just don’t know it. i got fake batteries. fake slim jims. fake Hanes comfort soft tshirts. 95% of cosmetics are faked because there’s no regulation and there’s a good markup plus women can’t tell the difference anyway. i bought bd syringes that were clearly fake and it’s disturbing because real medical syringes are sterile. the order that came in from Amazon was probably made in a non sterile environment and all the tips were barely sharp enough to pierce skin. all of these products were highly rated and had high reviews. this has been going on for the last 7 years but it’s worse now than it’s ever been so i refuse to buy anything other than socks and underwear from Amazon. especially with the rampant price gougers. 1 jar peanut butter 9.99. Walmart 2.15. they literally go to Walmart and clean out the supply and then repost everything on Amazon with gouged prices. fuck Amazon.
You can’t really trust the ratings. There are too many fakes. One thing that has helped me sift through the garbage, though, is to sort ratings by new. I feel like that gives a much better picture of the actual situation. Edit: two -> too. How embarrassing.
Former Amazon employee here. Don’t trust star ratings. While the advertising side knows about fake reviews, they do nothing to counteract it.
You definitely can’t trust the 5-star ratings, but I feel you can trust the 1-star ones.
Yup. I always start at 1 star. If it’s consistently the same issue…pass. Sometimes the reviewers are just idiots though lol
I do 4 star. No company would pay for a 4 star review and it weeds out the idiots who put 1 star for some reason unrelated to the product
Yup. Filtering by 1 stars is dumb because it’s people getting mad at UPS that their package was dented. Completely irrelevant to Amazon or the seller. 2-4 stars are good because it shows people actually thought about the rating
I ordered the wrong item! 1 Star.
Amazon making us walk though WalMart to get to the mall.
You must have nice malls where you’re from. All mind are dead.
Jokes on you. The mall is just another Amazon store.
Joke?
Exactly.
Unlike Walmart, Target, Macy’s, Pennies, Marshall’s, Home Depot, Lowe’s, every grocery store, every single Sears store in existence, and every retailer that has ever existed???
Big difference here. (I worked retail for over 10 years as a manager.) For Walmart, Target, etc, they place the store brand directly next to the name brand. So Tylenol is directly next to the store brand Tylenol. On Amazon, they are burying the name brand product to page 2, 3 or 4 while showing their product first. They also use the "Amazon Choice" labels to further highlight their brand. I don't care that they are selling their own brands, but at least show them together to let the consumer decide which they prefer.
No they’re not burying it to the second page, it gets displaced to the second search result.
The conSumer has Walmart’s for that. People go to Amazon specifically because they DONT want to shop that way.
The selling point of Amazon is online shopping, fast delivery, etc. At no point has anyone ever said "Yeah I like shopping at Amazon because they hide products!" So what are you on about?
The fact that I’m not shopping on A,axon for selections of manufacturer. I’m shopping on Amazon to type in a word and usually buy the cheapest thing of that word that shows up.
How would you know what the cheapest product is without comparing the same product from different brands?
Because Amazon tells me…..ooooooooh…..man I never realized. You’re right about everything internet. Damned……
Shopping at Walmart to avoid amazon is like wandering though bear country to avoid mountain lions. The neat thing, though, is that the analogy works both ways.
1) Order groceries through Whole Foods (Amazon). 2) Search for brand name product. 3a) Previously, desired result with in top 8 (might be shuffled around with variations from brand). 3b) Amazon results now fill top 8, then crazy non-substitutes (ordering strawberries? How about lentils). Desired brand might be on page 2, 3. The “your product couldn’t be found” fillers - the lentils, for example - discourage further looking. This isn’t even preferential, or variation - I’m all for seeing Major Competitor and Indie Competitor, and hey, understandably House Brand - in the above the fold results. **Burying the direct matches on page 2-3** has well known user behavior results (kills more than 80% of audience reach).
> 1) Order groceries through Whole Foods (Amazon). > > 2) Search for brand name product. > > 3a) Previously, desired result with in top 8 (might be shuffled around with variations from brand). > > 3b) Amazon results now fill top 8, then crazy non-substitutes (ordering strawberries? How about lentils). Desired brand might be on page 2, 3. The “your product couldn’t be found” fillers - the lentils, for example - discourage further looking. > > This isn’t even preferential, or variation - I’m all for seeing Major Competitor and Indie Competitor, and hey, understandably House Brand - in the above the fold results. Burying the direct matches on page 2-3 has well known user behavior results (kills more than 80% of audience reach). That sounds like it's an upcoming anti-trust case.
Well, less certainly got Microsoft in trouble during round 5 or so of the Browser Wars, but parent comment had a pretty weak take on it.
Since Amazon took over whole foods I have noticed quite a bit more in-store shelf space dedicated to inhouse brands as well. Other major grocers do it to with their brands but whole foods under Amazon management replaced half their store.
I mean. You’re grocery shopping on a website. What do you expect? And wanting buy Whole Foods wouldn’t you want to support your local seller than a corporation anyway?
I would expect that if I searched “brand,” and they stocked “brand” that the website would not pretend they do not have “brand,” but helpfully suggest in house alternative. What do you not understand about burying it on the third page, after a page of random results? Like I said, that’s worlds different than “oh, are you looking for Famous Soy Sauce? How about Amazon Soy Sauce, large, small, or gluten free? Also, Indie Soy Sauce? And I guess here’s Famous Soy Sauce, too.”
Again groceries in a warehouse store. It’s like sushi at a gas station. Yea they stock it would I buy it or even go look for it? Nah probably not I’m gonna go to the sushi place down the road for sushi. Warehouse stores are great for things with barcodes. Something tossed in a bin that can be tossed in another bin. Grocery stores are meant for groceries.
Wtf. Whole Foods is not a warehouse. Please join reality before commenting.
Amazon is.. did you forget what we’re taking about?
You must’ve. Whole Foods. It’s there in the thread. Ordering online is through Amazon’s site because they’ve been purchased and integrated. When the actual product is packed, it’s from a Whole Foods **store**. Go in one and see the Amazon shoppers packing bags, loading cars, and making a fool of you. None of which has anything to do with anti-competitive brand redirection and burying in their search.
Shop online with HEB. Your bar is too low. God damn I miss that store.
It’s actually one of the less immoral things they’ve done.
Seriously it isnt. We used to actually punish and break up companies for doing this. It only led to the greatest middle class of all time. Look at us now.
Yes. Why isn’t Amazon being considered to be broken up?
The logic to split up Amazon's marketplace from Amazon's manufactured brands -- goods sold on that marketplace -- is a straight line. Amazon uses their control over the single most important ~~online~~ marketplace to gather metrics on other peoples' products to skip having to do any research, development, and advertising. Then they basically can jump in on top of third party brands and outcompete them through better search placement, which they have 100% control over, and they don't have to take on any risk at all since R&D was already done (meaning that risk can be folded out of their prices). Let the third parties eat all the negative externalities. There's a lot of commodity goods where it probably doesn't matter much, but Amazon also has some pretty goddamn niche goods put out under AmazonBasics. They operate as a practical protection racket for a lot of their customers. They've been doing it for years. No one is surprised. It isn't right, but there's no political will to stand up to big business anymore.
AWS should immediately be its own thing. The rest of it certainly has arguments too, bit AWS 100% needs to be a separate company yesterday
You forgot their other cheats: they figure out which suppliers you’re using and utilize the same one with your same formulation. They get a return address from your supplier so they allow everyone else to take the risk to figure out the best product/supplier then they just copy it (combined with best research results). They don’t need to spend on R&D, or supplier selection process.
Becuase they pay politicians astronomical amounts of money. And now AWS is the literal backbone of our entire military. Many don't realize their marketplace lost money every single year until 2016. It's still in the negative. They only lasted from AWS money
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Excellent explanation. Thank you. I was finding it difficult to find the monopoly- hence my question. It’s just like Disney, Unilever, or Walmart - thank you
As far as trade practices, ripping off profitable products and undercutting them into oblivion is worse. Amazon Brand is a cancer. What Amazon does to workers with its miserly performance metrics is the worst.
Which every grocery store I've ever been to has done, it's not like Amazon invented ripping off the profitable shit to make a generic brand.
This is a very good point. The problem is the scale and cruel efficiency at which Amazon is able to rip off and eliminate competitors. They can mine the sellers data, find the optimal suppliers/manufacturers and squeeze out the original seller(s). Amazon will sell at a loss if it has to, in order to gain market share. Once the competition is gone, they can raise prices, so the consumer doesn’t even benefit. I wouldn’t be surprised if this process is basically automated or will be soon.
Eh if they are all just selling the same chinese product. Why the fuck should i care if its amazon branded or not? Why are we trying to keep an industry of middle men alive?
Except that’s not what’s happening.
But like it is though. They dont have their own factories. They dont do their own manufacturing. But what ever yall just l ove to blindly hate.
I would agree, if that was the case. [It’s not.](https://www.vice.com/en/article/akz48p/jeff-bezos-has-no-idea-how-often-amazon-rips-off-its-sellers)They have all of the sellers data and they target profitable items with high profit margins. They copy the product as an Amazon Basic and then undercut the original seller and/or use their recommendations to promote their own brand unfairly.
Your link still does not contradict what i said. You half assed google search does not provide any factual data on stolen ip. Seller are not the manufacturer or ip owners. Most these “sellers” are rebranders. They are middle men branding Chinese products and selling them. They provide zero actual value and if amazon “ripping them” results in the same final product but cheaper then its just better for the consumers. Middle men are fucking useless anyways and your google search does not provide any support that these are anything other than just that.
> It’s actually one of the less immoral things they’ve done. Probably a anti-trust case worthy though.
Big difference is likely how searching for products works. Online spaces have the ability to use dark patterns or other psychological tricks to get people to do the things they want. Most people never go beyond page 1 and generally go for items high on the list. The first search result even, if it's the cheapest(which amazon items most of the time are.) So while i agree this isn't anything out of the ordinary, you can't really have this same magnitude of effect in a real life retail environment. Sure you can move the items closer to the beginning of the aisle or make them slightly more prominent, but i'd argue that isn't really nearly as much of a driving force as what amazon has going on for it with it's search algorithms. Items on page 2 and beyond might as well not exist for most users, you really don't have that problem in a real store.
I think the main difference is simply Amazon's size. If many smaller (although still huge IMO) companies do it, where the marketshare is more evenly distributed, the potential for distortion and basically fucking consumers over is less extreme.
I don’t see how market share is relevant. They still sell other brands. People have a choice. Their company their marketing.
It's a vertical monopoly that should be broken up in the interest of national security.
National security? If Amazon goes down, you drive to the local grocery store.
The grocery stores will be empty before Amazon, because AWS is like half the internet now.
Luckily major grocers know that Amazon is a competitor and hopefully they will not be using AWS
Add Microsoft, Google and specially Apple to this list
Personally I don’t think any of those companies should be allowed to sell their own products side-by-side. I don’t think they should be allowed to be producing competition to the products they sell. There’s a conflict of interest. Break them up.
Yes - that’s what monopolies do.
Everyone here saying "duh" don't realize this would have been illegal just 15 years ago.
Thank you! It is monopolistic, and anti competitive. Especially given the size of Amazon. They also note trends of up and coming products, then contact the producer of the goods and then undercut the people who made the product popular on their website to begin with. This is the reason I stopped buying from Amazon like 10 years ago, they are only here to make money and hurt people who are making them slightly less money than they could make by ruining their lives, but thats what is called a free market these days.
All companies only care about making money.
"It's okay that our empire has slaves, every other empire had slaves too"
Except literally every brick and mortar retailer has done this since the beginning of time.
There was a time when machine tools were being popularized, and large factories we're getting built, and people were excited about how that would change "work" in general. Fast forward 40 years and those factories had armies of 6-10 year olds working 90 hour weeks. Labor unions were literally getting gunned down in the streets. We're at the exciting part of automation. Our kids will fight the labor wars.
1. How is this relevant to the topic of private label goods? The point is that if Kroger can put its store brand at eye level and the name brand one shelf down, Amazon can put its store brand in the top search result and one search result down. 2. Keep in mind that while Amazon is the largest player in e-commerce, it is tiny in the broader retail market. 2. You underestimate the infinite wants and desires of consumers.
Got it. We're just gonna cuck for Amazon no matter what.
Another thing they do is allow products on their website to get free r&d as they figure out which products work best and then steal the IP.
you’re telling me a company promoted their products over others on their own platform? how could they?!?!
I really don’t understand why people keep writing about this. Of course they do, same thing as Walmart putting great value brand in the front of the store
Or at eye level
When Walmart started they had to becuase Monopoly laws were still being upheld. There was a time when Microsoft couldn't even preinstall IE on windows. Now I get my prescriptions from a bookstore that also runs the US military.
Ikr this isn’t really news
Sometimes articles like these make me question how smart the general population actually is
Or the journalists
Consider how stupid the average person is, then realize half of them are dumber than that! -George Carlin
This is not at all surprising. It is no different than how they hijack searches for products to sell their own or the product that gets them more profit. It really just comes down to if this should be legal or not.
Amazon is basically filled with ads, they had something good going on, but they ruined it.
Agreed. I feel they could have an even greater market share today if they had gone the route of making sure ratings are fair, honest verified, and products are well described and easily comparable. Why does nobody make a store like that?
This is news?
Shocking?
Really? Nooooooo!
Imagine my shock
How tediously predictable
Shocker! It’s the same for pharmacy giants like walgreens or cvs.
File this under, “Well, duh…”
Duh…
I think for an anti monopoly solution for Amazon would be to bar them from selling their own brands (or having any stake in a brand). Truly take it back as a marketplace.
Legit question, no snark implied or intended, but should we extend that to all of the big box stores? A huge chunk of the best-placed items on shelves in retail stores like Walmart or Target are their own brands disguised as others.
Couldn’t be Best Buy who ONLY sells their cables. Manufacturing cost and employee price is like $0.60 while retail is $35. It’s a fucking scam how bad these places are. No wonder everyone hates Best Buy. Cause it’s the worst and most expensive buy. Sure they have a “price match policy” but it has to be new and sold by a large retailer. Well, Best Buy doesn’t sell their cables anywhere else except their website and in store. Which surprise surprise never go on sale or go down in price. Honestly just buy the cheaper cable from Amazon and use Best Buys 15 day return policy if you NEED a cable right then and there.
This is an argument I have with friends who are very pro "Buy from stores not just amazon". I would if it didn't cost double+ the price. Example, just 2 days ago I purchased a Ryobi Nail gun from a local small chain hardware store. It was an impulse buy so I didn't really price check. I got that and the 40v battery that it uses. Got home, realized "Oh man forgot a charger". So my wife said just check online maybe they have next day delivery. I check... At the store the battery alone was $99. On amazon, 2x 40v batteries and charger $80. Returned the battery and bought online. The nail gun was only $5 more locally so I kept it. 🤷♂️
The idea is to even be willing to lose money or make next to nothing on certain products in order to push competition out of business.
Meh. I don’t care. Just use your brain when you buy stuff.
But this is literally the same thing as brick-and-mortar stores are doing - offering products similar to the competition but with their own branding and often in promotional prices. This is the equivalent but much more visible due to the interactiveness of the medium. In the end it’s users choice why to buy. I.e. I just “ignore” every top result as it’s always a paid ad.
Amazon is shit. Haven’t bought anything from them since they got infested with cheap chinese garbage.
Sounds like a monopoly. Time to break it up.
I always wondered if Amazon edits/removes negative reviews of its own products.
Company has a policy against this.
Maybe but I assume they also enforce their own policy so they can still get away with it and nothing will happen.
In other news, water is wet.
Water is actually not wet; It makes other materials/objects wet. Wetness is the state of a non-liquid when a liquid adheres to, and/or permeates its substance while maintaining chemically distinct structures. So if we say something is wet we mean the liquid is sticking to the object.
I bet this bot is fun at parties
What else would you expect it to do?
I hate all corporations and capitalism in itself, but there is nothing wrong with this as long as they disclose it is their brand lol. Non-story, Amazon is doing way worse.
Wow, how, could, Amazon, do, this,?,
Let me rewrite that headline for you. “Company focuses first on their own products and then gives next best results to companies that pay for it”
Would be pretty great if countries got together and created their own open virtual marketplaces for all traders. Kinda like how they build real life malls and marketplaces, why not build online ones?
Malls were not government buildings and were very much for profit. I get what you’re saying, but that would be a huge financial burden to moderate that, and any time something went wrong the government would get sued.
Because the online storefront isn't the hard part of e-commerce, fulfillment is. The competitive edge of Amazon has always been on the fulfillment side.
*shocked Pikachu face*
You know it’s not unreasonable it’s just cost of doing business. Any smart buyer can look at eBay, the other price options, and other stores people get so used to going to one place for stuff they forget about competitive markets where the stuff they get is sold elsewhere for different prices.
Not a surprise. They seem to do this for many unknown brands. I’ve definitely had times when I had to search specifically for a popular highly rated brand since it didn’t come up during a general search.
When you control the entire system you are going to push your own product
Yes they do, and they don’t publish bad reviews on their products. Facts!!!!
Who would have thought
why is this a problem
No shit, it’s their platform. They can do as they please.
I’m so shocked I feel betrayed
Is this news? I thought this was openly the Amazon business model aside from drivers with piss bottles
Why won't they?
Lol! This is “new”s?
The choice is yours
Really!! No way. Of course they do. It's just good business
Wow I am so surprised, I would never have imagined. If you buy from Amazon you should get your head checked
Does this actually surprise anyone?
Duh
Duh.
Shocking…(*yawn*)…
I meaaaaan are any of us actually surprised by this?????
We do the same thing with the products we distribute from 3rd parties. The rallying cry is “In-house before out house” (our shit is better than their shit),
Immediate question I have is.. so???? Doesn’t every company prioritize and promote their own products????
Why wouldn’t they? It’s their website…
What will they think of next!?
In other news water is wet
KEKWLMFAOOMEGALUL
While I see this as somewhat immoral, I don't think it's that big of a deal. If I want brand X, I'll get brand X. I don't think anyone would go "oh, I wanted this brand and model that I've researched for half a day or more but now I'll just get the Amazon Basics".
duh
Well yeah. That makes sense
It’s far more likely that US politicians will need to be highly ranked on Amazon to win their elections which will occur on Amazon in the future than Amazon’s monopoly being broken up, lest they be replaced by an Amazon branded politician with better rankings.
This is the way
Did anyone expect otherwise? Really? Everyone pushes their store brand. I see it, and I’ll consider the generic if I want. It’s not subversive, it’s to be expected.
On their own platform. Yes. So surprising.
I thought we all knew that already
Why does this keep showing up in headlines? This behavior is a given
Ummm no shit? They are a business after all. Of all the thinks to be pissed at Jeffy over, this is by far the most retarded.
Why wouldn’t they??
No shit Sherlock
No shit
Don’t use Amazon for reviews. Use an independent unbiased review for this information. Then search the product on Amazon, go 3 pages deep and buy your product.
As someone who used to sell Amazon millions of dollars of ukuleles the graphic for this article blows my mind
What percentage of Amazon reviews are fake bs?! I say 40-60.
Just don't shop at amazon they don't pay taxes they don't pay their workers properly and you STILL have options to find competitors to buy from.
what do you mean they don’t pay their workers properly? they pay $15 minimum, who are you comparing them to?
Better rated doesn’t mean shit either when there’s so many fake reviews
Duh
In related news, CVS pharmacy put their brand of stool softener right next to name brand products. “No, I didn’t have to go looking for it. Their brand was right there next to the name brands!”
I want to quit Amazon altogether, but I'm not strong enough... too goddamn convenient. However, I did stop buying Amazon basics long ago. I know that HDMI cable would have been $2.71 cheaper. I'm just not sure I want to sell myself for $2.71 when I already feel like an asshole for shopping here in the first place.
Rich companies isn’t rich enough so uses riches to becomes rich enough to be rich.
And you’re surprised ?
Duh , exclusive/generic brands are always higher margin
Literally their business model lol
Well, Facebook is a huge, private company so they can do what they want.
Yep! They kill off competitors by doing this! If you have a successful store, you end up losing in the end!