Tracks can't change elevation as quickly and easily as the road, so if everything is higher on either end of that bridge it wouldn't make sense to drop the tracks just to raise them again.
Probably also a trestle to allow water flow under in a flood.
They're somewhat right though, 27 per mille is the same as 2.7 per cent. 2.7 isn't a hard cap, but it is somewhere near the higher grades on us mainline.
That percent sign has two zeros at the bottom, indicating it is a per mille sign. 2.7% (per cent) is 2.7 / 100 and 27‰ (per mille) is 27 / 1000. If you multiply both the dividend and divisor by 10, 2.7/100 becomes 27/1000, and since you multiplied by the same value on top and bottom, you effectively multiplied by one and it is worth the same amount.
I didn't realize it was a different symbol. I've never seen it before in my life.
Now that it's been explained, yes it is the same. They explained it's apparently a rule in their country for that to be the limit.
Oh I see that now. I've never seen the second one. Which, yes, is the same as 2.7%.
And yeah, that's a common "steep" grade for most main line USA railroads, but that's not a hard limit. A common "limit" is 2.2% according to a snippet in [Horseshoe Curve](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horseshoe_Curve_(Pennsylvania)) Wikipedia article (couldn't load the source page).
>unascendable by conventional railroads, which usually stick to grades of 2.2% or less.[12]
There was one, the [Saluda Grade](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saluda_Grade), that averaged 4.24% and max of 4.9%. The railroad chose to take it out of service for economic reasons.
The sign they use is different; it has two circles on the bottom. I didn't notice it at first, and apparently it's used for per thousand. I've never seen it in my life.
So the sign they used means 27 in 1000 meters, or 2.7 in 100. I guess going by thousands can eliminate the decimal. I understand a lot of British still use the actual rise as 1 in X, such as 1 in 50 or 1 in 60 being a 2% and 1.67% grade respectively.
Looking from here the tracks remain level. but the road dips down: [https://www.google.com/maps/@38.6767116,-121.643824,3a,75y,280.68h,85.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sAhWP8AqJuUfC3SC7RC4Rrw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en&coh=205409&entry=ttu](https://www.google.com/maps/@38.6767116,-121.643824,3a,75y,280.68h,85.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sAhWP8AqJuUfC3SC7RC4Rrw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en&coh=205409&entry=ttu)
This local road seems designed for occasional river flooding. The stretch of road below the railroad trestle grade is made of concrete instead of asphalt and there are gate barriers on the western and eastern ends of the road spanning the river flood plain.
u/itsarace1 linked to the [image source](https://www.flickr.com/photos/23065916@N04/3509621520/), and the caption there says the railroad used to have third rail electrification too.
There used to be a [large network of electrified railways ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacramento_Northern_Railway)through the Sacramento Valley. They went from the bay all the way up to Chico.
I live about 10 minutes from there. That’s an overflow floodplain for the Sacramento River and that’s a frontage road for the freeway. The whole place looks like a lake at least once a year. If you look to the left you’ll see I-5 which is also elevated. It’s surrounded by rice fields so they’re also intentionally flooded every year. Essentially it’s the old country road which didn’t have the infrastructure need to spend the money for a few mile elevated road. Before the freeway was built most people took the train or ferries to get to Sacramento from the west in this area so it makes sense the railway and not the road were invested in to maintain operation during the frequent flooding.
That area is part of the Yolo Bypass. It is designed to flood. Excess water from the Sacramento River overflows through a series of weirs and is diverted around the city of Sacramento. The entire area can flood and starts to look like an inland ocean. Video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf8cygUFBsU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf8cygUFBsU)
The video shows the ex-Southern Paciifc (now UP) Yolo Causeway (different tracks than the photo above), along with I-80 crossing the bypass. Both are elevated to stay dry in wet years.
Sacramento is one of the cities most at risk of severe flooding the entire United States. Absolutely massive amounts of water can come flooding down from the mountains and Sacramento's flat topography means there is only so much space available to put it all.
A fun fact about Sacramento, when it was first built, the entire downtown was only a little above grade for the Sacramento River. After several significant floodings of downtown, the city elected to raise the entire grade level by one story (even brick buildings). When it was raised, it wasnt filled in with dirt. So, today, you can enter and walk around the city's abandoned street level underground.
The road is elevated, just not as high as the tracks. The road is built on top of the flood wall, so it looks like it's part of the terrain, but it isn't.
The road isn't elevated. I live right by here. Here's the street view: [https://maps.app.goo.gl/8FjTiUqf3jGyNVDJ7](https://maps.app.goo.gl/8FjTiUqf3jGyNVDJ7)
This area is part of the Yolo Flood Bypass. It fills with water every winter, which protects Sacramento from flooding. This particular road is underwater every winter. (Here's the [gate they close](https://maps.app.goo.gl/tVd3rotZ5qD6a7YNA).) The tracks in this picture and the I5 to the south are elevated above the flood level.
I live right here too, and this is the correct answer. I-5, not pictured here, is directly behind the photographer. It \*is\* elevated here, beginning right at the levee along the river and ending at the other side of the Yolo Bypass. The interstate is elevated because of the seasonal flooding in wet winters. The county road pictured is not, and is underwater for several months out of the year. (Except in dry years -- which also happens.)
On a 2505.9 mile road trip Utah->Nevada->California->Nevada-Utah, I remember driving through Yolo, CA. It made me chuckle because it was a buzzword at the time.
On that trip we visited (not in this order) the Sugar Pine Railway; Jamestown-Railtown (with the Back to the Future locomotive); California State Railway Museum in Sacramento (loved that city); Skunk Train in Willitz; and Fort Bragg; three days of San Francisco looking at beautiful PCC trams. Also paid 55 bucks for a three bedroom suite in Reno, it was my second time in a casino in my life and walked out with a net profit of 1500 bucks, which paid for some sweet H0 models to bring back to Europe. Then won another 800 in Vegas.
All of a sudden I'm regretting cutting my business trip & training short this summer and not doing anything for leasure afterwards in the US, hehehe.
Thank you for coming to my random anecdote.
Any time someone asks a question on reddit it seems like the top-voted top level comment is always incorrect and is actually just a popular layman assumption, then you scroll down through one or two top-level comments to find the correct answer just like this. Someone help me coin a term for this rule of thumb, it's very nearly a constant, I see it in places like ELI5 all the time.
It's one of two reasons:
1. Trains can't climb hills. This road is probably going up or down later and the bridge is simply used to smooth out the gradient.
2. Weak land. If the land underneath is too weak to support a track, they usually build a bridge and anchor the pillars directly to the bedrock to improve stability.
Sierra Northern GP7 47 was built 8/52 as RDG (Reading) 607; became CCT (Central California Traction Company) 60
http://rrpicturearchives.net/LocoPicture.aspx?id=63023
Has some vaguely [CB&Q](https://s3.amazonaws.com/rrpa_photos/30270/cbqd170-1.jpg) or NKP vibes. Always loved a striped livery.
Just an all around better plan to be prepared for flooding, in that low-lying Sacramento River delta region.
That was going to be my answer. But it's probably more that the road doesn't need to be elevated and the railroad wants to be able to use their track no matter what the flooding situation might be.
You sure? Someone else here is sure it is a GP-7.
https://old.reddit.com/r/trains/comments/1doa3fk/why_are_the_tracks_elevated_but_not_the_road/la8xt7l/
As someone who knows about the Sacramento Northern and the Sierra Northern... it's a flood plane
When river road floods you go no highway 5 train can't go on highway 5 so bridge
Tracks can't change elevation as quickly and easily as the road, so if everything is higher on either end of that bridge it wouldn't make sense to drop the tracks just to raise them again. Probably also a trestle to allow water flow under in a flood.
Prone to flooding.
max incline for trains is 27‰
They're somewhat right though, 27 per mille is the same as 2.7 per cent. 2.7 isn't a hard cap, but it is somewhere near the higher grades on us mainline.
Two and seven tenths percent (2.7) is fine. Twenty-seven percent is what they wrote and is not.
That percent sign has two zeros at the bottom, indicating it is a per mille sign. 2.7% (per cent) is 2.7 / 100 and 27‰ (per mille) is 27 / 1000. If you multiply both the dividend and divisor by 10, 2.7/100 becomes 27/1000, and since you multiplied by the same value on top and bottom, you effectively multiplied by one and it is worth the same amount.
I didn't realize it was a different symbol. I've never seen it before in my life. Now that it's been explained, yes it is the same. They explained it's apparently a rule in their country for that to be the limit.
i know itd tehnacally possible to have more than 27‰ but you will not see more on the mail line
Let's get this straight. Do you mean twenty-seven percent as you've written it twice, or two and seven tenths percent? Because both are not correct.
since when does ‰ sing means percent... %≠‰ in my country the max allowed raise is 27 meters per 1000 meters
Oh I see that now. I've never seen the second one. Which, yes, is the same as 2.7%. And yeah, that's a common "steep" grade for most main line USA railroads, but that's not a hard limit. A common "limit" is 2.2% according to a snippet in [Horseshoe Curve](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horseshoe_Curve_(Pennsylvania)) Wikipedia article (couldn't load the source page). >unascendable by conventional railroads, which usually stick to grades of 2.2% or less.[12] There was one, the [Saluda Grade](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saluda_Grade), that averaged 4.24% and max of 4.9%. The railroad chose to take it out of service for economic reasons.
But aside from my misunderstanding, a rule in your country doesn't make it a rule everywhere.
Wouldn’t that be 2.7% then not 27%? 27% would be 27 over 100 meters
The sign they use is different; it has two circles on the bottom. I didn't notice it at first, and apparently it's used for per thousand. I've never seen it in my life. So the sign they used means 27 in 1000 meters, or 2.7 in 100. I guess going by thousands can eliminate the decimal. I understand a lot of British still use the actual rise as 1 in X, such as 1 in 50 or 1 in 60 being a 2% and 1.67% grade respectively.
I don’t know why you are getting downvoted, people are either dyslexic or outright stupid. 27‰ = 2.7%
I'd say the symbol is rather unexpected, both to be read in general and also in context of inclination..
american education system...
Looking from here the tracks remain level. but the road dips down: [https://www.google.com/maps/@38.6767116,-121.643824,3a,75y,280.68h,85.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sAhWP8AqJuUfC3SC7RC4Rrw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en&coh=205409&entry=ttu](https://www.google.com/maps/@38.6767116,-121.643824,3a,75y,280.68h,85.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sAhWP8AqJuUfC3SC7RC4Rrw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en&coh=205409&entry=ttu)
This local road seems designed for occasional river flooding. The stretch of road below the railroad trestle grade is made of concrete instead of asphalt and there are gate barriers on the western and eastern ends of the road spanning the river flood plain. u/itsarace1 linked to the [image source](https://www.flickr.com/photos/23065916@N04/3509621520/), and the caption there says the railroad used to have third rail electrification too.
There used to be a [large network of electrified railways ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacramento_Northern_Railway)through the Sacramento Valley. They went from the bay all the way up to Chico.
That would be the Sacramento Northern Railway.
BART took over the Sacramento Northern’s old right of ways to get their start.
I live about 10 minutes from there. That’s an overflow floodplain for the Sacramento River and that’s a frontage road for the freeway. The whole place looks like a lake at least once a year. If you look to the left you’ll see I-5 which is also elevated. It’s surrounded by rice fields so they’re also intentionally flooded every year. Essentially it’s the old country road which didn’t have the infrastructure need to spend the money for a few mile elevated road. Before the freeway was built most people took the train or ferries to get to Sacramento from the west in this area so it makes sense the railway and not the road were invested in to maintain operation during the frequent flooding.
Fascinating, thanks!
That area is part of the Yolo Bypass. It is designed to flood. Excess water from the Sacramento River overflows through a series of weirs and is diverted around the city of Sacramento. The entire area can flood and starts to look like an inland ocean. Video: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf8cygUFBsU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf8cygUFBsU) The video shows the ex-Southern Paciifc (now UP) Yolo Causeway (different tracks than the photo above), along with I-80 crossing the bypass. Both are elevated to stay dry in wet years. Sacramento is one of the cities most at risk of severe flooding the entire United States. Absolutely massive amounts of water can come flooding down from the mountains and Sacramento's flat topography means there is only so much space available to put it all.
A fun fact about Sacramento, when it was first built, the entire downtown was only a little above grade for the Sacramento River. After several significant floodings of downtown, the city elected to raise the entire grade level by one story (even brick buildings). When it was raised, it wasnt filled in with dirt. So, today, you can enter and walk around the city's abandoned street level underground.
The decaying remains of Old New York.
To shreds, you say?
Chicago has the same history. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raising_of_Chicago
Quite a few cities also did this, Seattle and Chicago both come to mind.
The road is elevated, just not as high as the tracks. The road is built on top of the flood wall, so it looks like it's part of the terrain, but it isn't.
The road isn't elevated. I live right by here. Here's the street view: [https://maps.app.goo.gl/8FjTiUqf3jGyNVDJ7](https://maps.app.goo.gl/8FjTiUqf3jGyNVDJ7) This area is part of the Yolo Flood Bypass. It fills with water every winter, which protects Sacramento from flooding. This particular road is underwater every winter. (Here's the [gate they close](https://maps.app.goo.gl/tVd3rotZ5qD6a7YNA).) The tracks in this picture and the I5 to the south are elevated above the flood level.
I live right here too, and this is the correct answer. I-5, not pictured here, is directly behind the photographer. It \*is\* elevated here, beginning right at the levee along the river and ending at the other side of the Yolo Bypass. The interstate is elevated because of the seasonal flooding in wet winters. The county road pictured is not, and is underwater for several months out of the year. (Except in dry years -- which also happens.)
You guys should go grab a beer and post pics
With a name like Yolo Flood, I'm sure there'll be a flood of you only live once sayings, and people doing crazy things while shouting YOLO.
We immediately recognize those people as out-of-towners. It was the county's name long before it was a dudebro hashtag.
Literally Noah
Duuuude I thought this looked way too familiar
On a 2505.9 mile road trip Utah->Nevada->California->Nevada-Utah, I remember driving through Yolo, CA. It made me chuckle because it was a buzzword at the time. On that trip we visited (not in this order) the Sugar Pine Railway; Jamestown-Railtown (with the Back to the Future locomotive); California State Railway Museum in Sacramento (loved that city); Skunk Train in Willitz; and Fort Bragg; three days of San Francisco looking at beautiful PCC trams. Also paid 55 bucks for a three bedroom suite in Reno, it was my second time in a casino in my life and walked out with a net profit of 1500 bucks, which paid for some sweet H0 models to bring back to Europe. Then won another 800 in Vegas. All of a sudden I'm regretting cutting my business trip & training short this summer and not doing anything for leasure afterwards in the US, hehehe. Thank you for coming to my random anecdote.
Thanks for that explanation.
Any time someone asks a question on reddit it seems like the top-voted top level comment is always incorrect and is actually just a popular layman assumption, then you scroll down through one or two top-level comments to find the correct answer just like this. Someone help me coin a term for this rule of thumb, it's very nearly a constant, I see it in places like ELI5 all the time.
It's kinda like Cunningham's law: "The best way to get the right answer on the Internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer."
Tracks benefit from a minimal slope. The roadway doesn't need it as level... Because vehicles on it don't have steel on steel traction issues
Simple flooding issues. Roads often have alternate routes if one road is flooded. Alternate tracks are way less common
Thats a good lookin paintjob.
Beautiful Geep!
GP7?
GP20
It's one of two reasons: 1. Trains can't climb hills. This road is probably going up or down later and the bridge is simply used to smooth out the gradient. 2. Weak land. If the land underneath is too weak to support a track, they usually build a bridge and anchor the pillars directly to the bedrock to improve stability.
Source [https://www.flickr.com/photos/23065916@N04/3509621520/](https://www.flickr.com/photos/23065916@N04/3509621520/)
I'm just here to admire the pic
Looks like Woodland to me.
You are correct -- just on the outskirts, halfway between Woodland and the Sacramento airport.
Because track needs to be as level as possible.
Sierra Northern GP7 47 was built 8/52 as RDG (Reading) 607; became CCT (Central California Traction Company) 60 http://rrpicturearchives.net/LocoPicture.aspx?id=63023
So the others here claiming it is a GP20 are wrong?
Yes. It would have operated alongside WP highnose GP-20’s in the day though.
Because the trains deserve to look down upon all inferior forms of transportation
This is the correct answer
Has some vaguely [CB&Q](https://s3.amazonaws.com/rrpa_photos/30270/cbqd170-1.jpg) or NKP vibes. Always loved a striped livery. Just an all around better plan to be prepared for flooding, in that low-lying Sacramento River delta region.
Cute little trestle 🥹🤭
Cuz floor is made of lava
‘Cause f*** them cars, bro!
Because the railroad is smarter than the highway department.
That was going to be my answer. But it's probably more that the road doesn't need to be elevated and the railroad wants to be able to use their track no matter what the flooding situation might be.
EMD GP20! We use this as a switch engine at our feed mill. It’s not very powerful and it needs a lot of repairs, but it gets the job done
You sure? Someone else here is sure it is a GP-7. https://old.reddit.com/r/trains/comments/1doa3fk/why_are_the_tracks_elevated_but_not_the_road/la8xt7l/
cause cars are happier climbing hills then the train is.
As someone who knows about the Sacramento Northern and the Sierra Northern... it's a flood plane When river road floods you go no highway 5 train can't go on highway 5 so bridge
Tracks wash away much easier and faster than a road
Flood plain.
Water
There are a lot of track lines like this in my state, in the low laying areas near rivers and swamps.
Simply, simply amazing
Flood zone. The rail road build their track to last the government don't build their roads to the same standard
There could actually be several different reasons for that but I'm not familiar with that area so I can't say