Dazzle camo isn't for concealment.
It's to mess with the judgement of the ships speed and heading which is used to calculate the aim for firing torpedos.
If you wrongly judge the angle of the ships heading by a few degrees, your topedo might over shoot or undershoot.
There were barely any German aircraft in the Atlantic.
Source, instead of building subs in Axis and Allies I always liked to build Aircraft Carriers and rule the waves.
Of ships with Dazzle camo vs normal, 20% fewer dazzle ships sank from torpedo hits despite being 25% more likely to be attacked
Dazzle painted ships are often much larger than the non-dazzle ships though, so the effectiveness is still questioned today
Dazzle paint is still occasionally used today, with a few NATO ships being painted in Dazzle camouflage and supposedly Russian ships doing the same to avoid Ukrainian drone strikes
It’s just something I would imagine the Germans doing first based on the Weimar Era art scene. But, I guess there is a reason. Something about a failed artist and nazis
Must be the new Taylor Swift series
[https://www.reddit.com/r/fakehistoryporn/comments/yedzvo/taylor\_swift\_british\_nautical\_engineer\_displaying/](https://www.reddit.com/r/fakehistoryporn/comments/yedzvo/taylor_swift_british_nautical_engineer_displaying/)
What? We were ok with the romans. We were called romans for millennias (quite literally, from 3rd century ad up to the 15th century and even in the 20th century, Greeks have been calling themselves Roman (Romaioi,Ρωμαίοι) and their language rhomaic (ρωμαϊκά)
A thing repeated *ad nauseam* in our history classes is "Conquered Greece has conquered Rome" because despite Rome's empire and military advantage, it has been strongly influenced by Greek culture.
Luckily, I was ignorant enough to be able feel proud.
For real though, thanks for the reminder. Guess it's easy to forget that the Western Roman empire wasn't the only one. Even when Byzantine was so pretty.
I think the symbolism is to be "atop the background of being a straight person, I am an ally to LGBT+ folks". The other way around it might be seen as "atop the background of the LGBT+ community, I am a straight ally". It's also a takeover of the "straight pride" usage of the straight flag by slapping a new symbol on top of it, like taking over the Nazi swastika and slapping an "X" over it as an anti-Nazi symbol.
You make a valid point, though it still feels a teensy bit weird to me.
Giving rainbow colours to the "A" makes it look like straight allies are part of the LGBTQ community since that's what the rainbow represents.
Either way, it's a pretty solid flag design.
>Giving rainbow colours to the "A" makes it look like straight allies are part of the LGBTQ community since that's what the rainbow represents.
I think that's the point - moreso "part of the LGBTQ movement" than "community" maybe.
I understand your point, however the swastika was already a symbol for peace until the Naz*s tilted it 45 degrees and turned it into symbol for genocide.
Anyone can fly the rainbow flag (if they're supportive). Some people choose to have the ally flag to show that they are a safe space but aren't going to be able to share lived experiences.
So, for instance, some teachers do it to show queer kids they are someone to talk to but that they aren't going to be able to share their own experiences of growing up queer (because they aren't queer).
Some people do it to show that they support but aren't part of the community (they aren't inserting themselves on to a marginalised community).
There is discourse about whether or not people should just use the rainbow flag regardless as using the ally flag specifically highlights that you're not queer and that can be seen as unnecessary. "I'm not gay!" Kind of thing.
Personally, if you're showing support (really support, not just performative or rainbow capitalism, etc), I'm not going to care which you use.
As a business, flying just the rainbow flag might give the impression that they're a queer-owned business. During pride month a lot of people try to shop at queer-owned businesses more than they would the rest of the year. By opting to fly the ally flag, they can show support while also clearly showing that they're not queer-owned to those who care about that information.
Let's keep in mind, also, that there's not a governing body deciding which identities can and can't have a flag. It's not that "the gays don't want them," it's that "someone made a flag for this group and a portion of people adopted it because they resonate with it in some way." Hence the many, many iterations of the lesbian flag, and the existence of a bear flag.
I feel like businesses using ally flags is probably the most genuine thing they can do.
Like the business isn't LGBT, the owners aren't, etc...
Ally flag just says we support your patronage, without appropriating anything.
I'm kinda of the opposite opinion. I find it beautiful that pride as a flag and as a month are used by everyone. Yes, it does mean they are longer using pride for its original purpose: as a sign of being proud of their LGBT identity. But symbol always evolves, and in this case I think they're evolving into something greater: a symbol of progressive values and celebrating our sexual diversity.
I understand for some, having a symbol they're familiar with appropriated with another meaning is irksome. But I enjoy the fact that pride flag has made its way out of a relatively small community and made a significant impact on human history for the better. And I do think the new meaning it carries remains in line with its original vexillogical symbolism.
As a queer person I feel the same. I love to see the pride flag flown by people who love and support us, and I don't really think allies should need a special flag to represent them as a member of the "person who doesn't hate us" community. No hate to people who use it, I appreciate the sentiment either way.
I've seen the progress pride flag effectively used as an "all accepted" signal by allies and businesses.
A part of me sees the ally flag as making something that's explicitly not about you about you.
I'm a straight dude wearing a [pride t-shirt](https://shop.startrek.com/cdn/shop/products/ST-TOS-RBWD-Adult_Tank_Top-RO_620x.jpg?v=1590677343) right now.
Yo that's a sick design! I have a [similar one](https://sw6.elbenwald.de/thumbnail/bf/b8/4b/1633451800/E1062795_1_1600x1600.jpg) but I really enjoy the minimalism on yours
I agree with your take as well, but I also really appreciate the sentiment behind an ally flag.
I mean if you are straight, you dont have to care about our rights, and in a lot of areas, openly supporting us is met with judgement. So someone who does not need to show their support, still choosing to do so... idk I just really respect it.
Yeah, I don't see the point of all those dozens those different rainbow flag designs in general - other than than a conversation starter; "what does this one mean?" it all feels kind of superficial.
The colours of the classic pride flag were supposed to represent: life, healing, sun, peace, nature and spirit - it has no direct correlation to sexual or gender identities. So how I see it is that it's always bee about what unites us - not about what distinguishes us. So the pride flag itself has always been intersectional in spirit - its design was already perfect as it is.
And to be clear, I'm okay pride flags flying next to the OG pride flag. But for instance the rainbow flags that include neurodivergence have so much going on that they're simply not neuro-divergent friendly designs.
Speaking as a queer person, me too. a lot of people make an active effort to support LGBT *owned* businesses in particular, so I quite like the distinction between "we are a business that supports you!" and "business *for queer people by queer people*".
I personally feel like it should be Pride for just your orientation in general, it can still be mainly focused on LGBTQ but Heterosexuals don't get representation. I get that the point is to celebrate being different, but we should really just celebrate who we are
I'm a cishet male. As an ally I wear pride shit because I think the ally flag is ugly as shit. No queer people have ever been anything but happy I'm showing support. They don't give a fuck about appropriating.
I find the representation of these kind of flags always conflicting.
All people should be treated the same, that is the ideal.
The original rainbow is pretty good at this, it keeps it vague which color represents what.
The other flags manage to divide people in ever more closed of colors. Segregation is the opposite of what it should represent.
I felt this way after the progress pride flags. Wasn’t the whole point of the rainbow that it included all colors (sexualities, identities, etc). It almost feels divisive having separate flags for separate things.
I know flags have been a big part of queer identification (dating bag to pocket flags and whatnot in the 70s). But it feels like todays many pride flags are different than the identifiers of before
I’m not sure what you mean about the colors being vague. They have distinct meanings from Gilbert Baker:
Hot pink: sex; Red: life; Orange: healing; Yellow: sunlight; Green: nature; Turquoise: magic and art; Indigo: serenity; and Violet: spirit.
If I may, I think the point he’s trying to make is that Baker’s pride flag 🏳️🌈 represents everyone who falls under the umbrella of “not heterosexual”, and all who fall under that category can celebrate it and feel represented by it. When you start adding the triangles and more colours onto Baker’s flag, to represent specific segments of the queer spectrum (allies, or trans, etc.), you’re not actually adding representation, you’re separating a certain segment of the queer population from the queer community, even elevating it from the queer community. Some people have the same problem with adding letters to LGBTQ. The Q was added as an umbrella for everyone who doesn’t feel represented by the L, G, B or T. Why add an A, or an I, a 2S? They’re covered by the Q!
Sorry if it’s a bit of a rant, but yes, I think it’s a subject worth exploring.
2S is an indigenous identity that predates the word queer, and intersex refers to people that have bodies that physically don't fit in either category, not just psychologically. It's pretty understandable why those two groups wouldn't want to be lumped in with queer. The A was added to fend off asexual erasure, but has oft been appropriated to mean ally.
*(The funny thing about that is that I always knew I identified with the A, but I assumed it was because I was an ally, not because I'm aspec)*
That argument is very commonly made, but has nothing to do with the flag in the post. This flag was created in a situation where someone thought it was worth making it clear that there were straight people who were happy to loudly support LGBT+ people. There are some contexts where people find that helpful, and others where people are more put off by the idea that people bother saying they're not themselves LGBT+ rather than just flying a rainbow. Either way, it's not about "adding representation", but about whether a particular message is helpful in a particular context.
The other thing with that argument is that it completely ignores the history of the rainbow flag and why it was taken up the way it was. Yes, the symbolism does lend itself to an "all people should be treated the same" message that is definitely relevant to the context of the flag, but Baker and others did very deliberately adopt it not as a flag of universal equality, but as a flag for the gay community.
As a queer person, I kinda like what it shows - when I see it in a parade or smth, I can tell that it's not only the LGBT+ community fighting for itself, but also our allies fighting for us. Nice to know there's people with enough empathy to help. I see your point though.
From this article titled, “LGBTQ PRIDE: Gilbert Baker, creator of rainbow flag, shares story of strength and pride”:
“Each color of the rainbow flag stands for something. "Pink is for sex, red for life, orange for healing, yellow for sun," Baker told ABC7 News. "Green for nature, turquoise for magic, blue for serenity and purple for the spirit. I like to think of those elements as in every person, everyone shares that."
https://abc7news.com/pride-flag-rainbow-the-colors/1780322/
You need a beer as well.
You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer.
There’s one in the window of a shop near me that sells crystals and has a chiropractor. I turned to the person I was with and asked “why do they have an ally flag? That’s a little weird, right?”
This was sometime in April, not related to Pride Month at all.
Posts like this are a mousetrap for phobes. They can't help telling us how they don't care if people are queer, but always go on to say bigoted shit. Makes it easier to report them lol
“I don’t hate LGBTQ people.. but I never want to see or hear about them ever in my whole life and I vote for people who want to take away their rights”
Basically what all those people sound like lol
Feels super performative to me. If you're an ally, just put up the regular pride flag.
"I'm a friend of the gays! But I'm not gay I swear. Really see my flag? I'm not gay, I'm just on their side. I would really hate if someone thought I might be gay so I have to make it clear I'm straight."
Why does it have to be negative? Why can’t they want a flag that makes that clarification? I think it would be pretty great to see more cishet people actively supporting us, but with a normal pride flag, I don’t know.
“I’m a friend of the gays” is all that it has to be.
But you don't need a special flag to say "I'm a friend of the gays", the flag already exists. Cishet people flying the pride flag is how it becomes normalized for cishet people flying the pride flag. Cishet people making themselves their own flag to separate themselves perpetuates the idea that only queer people fly the actual pride flag. It also gives me the impression that they would feel offended in a way that someone thought they were gay. Gays don't care if people think they're straight. I think it does the opposite of what you say.
My opinion.
I gotta Say, not to offend anyone, but I never understood the point of pride flags. Like why do you need to show that you're LGBT ? And why use a flag, idk just the Principle of using a flag to represent sexuality seems so starnge to me.
I don't understand why you would like the World to know your sexuality.
No Stupid People beyond this point. With that being said stuffed animals are located to the right. Crystals And tchotchkes for people who think Halloween is a personality type located against the back wall.
I'm no expert but why not just fly a pride flag if you support the pride community? Doesn't this flag rather symbolise "hi I really want to show that I am straight, but I don't want people to think I'm homophobic"?
The gay community is a god send for vexillology, they create new concepts and flags to represent them faster than any other group. Will provide content for this subreddit indefinitely.
My neighbors across the street have a flag pole with the US flag, and a second flag that varies by time of year. It's a jolly roger during October, a weird Christmas flag during December, a couple other like that, and then the Ally flag during pride month.
There’s a double meaning here to ally, the black/white could be d-day invasion stripes and the V shape could be like a victory symbol or whatever. But that’s def not the intended meaning
I was thinking about the allied from ww2 and was like how tf this is an allied flag.
[Invasion stripes.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Invasion_stripes)
Since it's an ally, [dazzle camouflage](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazzle_camouflage) is more likely.
Braking up the ally flag could make for some pretty cool dazzle camo tbh
TIL "razzle dazzle" is a term with meaning, not just a fun phrase to say
Ain’t no way that was effective 😭
Dazzle camo isn't for concealment. It's to mess with the judgement of the ships speed and heading which is used to calculate the aim for firing torpedos. If you wrongly judge the angle of the ships heading by a few degrees, your topedo might over shoot or undershoot.
I don't think it works for planes as they have a distinct front
There were barely any German aircraft in the Atlantic. Source, instead of building subs in Axis and Allies I always liked to build Aircraft Carriers and rule the waves.
Of ships with Dazzle camo vs normal, 20% fewer dazzle ships sank from torpedo hits despite being 25% more likely to be attacked Dazzle painted ships are often much larger than the non-dazzle ships though, so the effectiveness is still questioned today Dazzle paint is still occasionally used today, with a few NATO ships being painted in Dazzle camouflage and supposedly Russian ships doing the same to avoid Ukrainian drone strikes
It’s just something I would imagine the Germans doing first based on the Weimar Era art scene. But, I guess there is a reason. Something about a failed artist and nazis
The ally flag just got a whole lot more cool than it already was
No way that's actually why the straight ally flag is black and white stripes
The "Straight Pride" flag has black and white stripes. The Ally flag hijacked the "Straight Pride" flag by adding the rainbow colours
my handsome gay zebra flag
Learning can be the most fun when you didn't expect it.
Must be the new Taylor Swift series [https://www.reddit.com/r/fakehistoryporn/comments/yedzvo/taylor\_swift\_british\_nautical\_engineer\_displaying/](https://www.reddit.com/r/fakehistoryporn/comments/yedzvo/taylor_swift_british_nautical_engineer_displaying/)
Because it has a V for Victory on it
True!
Ah yes , P-day , July 1st, when all companies prepare to celebrate pride
V for victory ✌️Damn the nazis !
Had no idea the ally flag was a thing. Is the rainbow in a V for a particular reason?
It's an A for ally and the black and white represents straight people
ah yes, Λlly
Λny issues with that? Don't you find it *Λ Ε S Τ Η Ξ Γ Ι C ???*
This is an r/grssk moment
So it's *LESTNXGI(c)*?
I think it's more like LESTIXGI(c) (in modern Greek).
And LESTEXGI(C) in Ancient Greek but I think the capital eta confused them because it looks like Cyrillic n
I am a Greek. Please, don't abuse my alphabet any further. My eyes are already bleeding
You'll keep seeing it, and like it.
I finally get to feel like a Roman victor!
What? We were ok with the romans. We were called romans for millennias (quite literally, from 3rd century ad up to the 15th century and even in the 20th century, Greeks have been calling themselves Roman (Romaioi,Ρωμαίοι) and their language rhomaic (ρωμαϊκά)
A thing repeated *ad nauseam* in our history classes is "Conquered Greece has conquered Rome" because despite Rome's empire and military advantage, it has been strongly influenced by Greek culture.
And then the eastern roman empire (also known as byzantine empire) is the roman empire with greek culture
Luckily, I was ignorant enough to be able feel proud. For real though, thanks for the reminder. Guess it's easy to forget that the Western Roman empire wasn't the only one. Even when Byzantine was so pretty.
"LESTIXGIC"
Wouldn't it make more sense if the A was in black and white, since it stands for straight allies?
I think the symbolism is to be "atop the background of being a straight person, I am an ally to LGBT+ folks". The other way around it might be seen as "atop the background of the LGBT+ community, I am a straight ally". It's also a takeover of the "straight pride" usage of the straight flag by slapping a new symbol on top of it, like taking over the Nazi swastika and slapping an "X" over it as an anti-Nazi symbol.
A top you say 😏
Really bottomed out with that joke.
You make a valid point, though it still feels a teensy bit weird to me. Giving rainbow colours to the "A" makes it look like straight allies are part of the LGBTQ community since that's what the rainbow represents. Either way, it's a pretty solid flag design.
>Giving rainbow colours to the "A" makes it look like straight allies are part of the LGBTQ community since that's what the rainbow represents. I think that's the point - moreso "part of the LGBTQ movement" than "community" maybe.
Well they are, and they should be.
I understand your point, however the swastika was already a symbol for peace until the Naz*s tilted it 45 degrees and turned it into symbol for genocide.
*prosperity and good fortune
*tilted and reversed
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Anyone can fly the rainbow flag (if they're supportive). Some people choose to have the ally flag to show that they are a safe space but aren't going to be able to share lived experiences. So, for instance, some teachers do it to show queer kids they are someone to talk to but that they aren't going to be able to share their own experiences of growing up queer (because they aren't queer). Some people do it to show that they support but aren't part of the community (they aren't inserting themselves on to a marginalised community). There is discourse about whether or not people should just use the rainbow flag regardless as using the ally flag specifically highlights that you're not queer and that can be seen as unnecessary. "I'm not gay!" Kind of thing. Personally, if you're showing support (really support, not just performative or rainbow capitalism, etc), I'm not going to care which you use.
The original rainbow flag was invented specifically for the gay community. It’s not meant to symbolize everyone.
As a business, flying just the rainbow flag might give the impression that they're a queer-owned business. During pride month a lot of people try to shop at queer-owned businesses more than they would the rest of the year. By opting to fly the ally flag, they can show support while also clearly showing that they're not queer-owned to those who care about that information. Let's keep in mind, also, that there's not a governing body deciding which identities can and can't have a flag. It's not that "the gays don't want them," it's that "someone made a flag for this group and a portion of people adopted it because they resonate with it in some way." Hence the many, many iterations of the lesbian flag, and the existence of a bear flag.
Don't read too far into it. It's just a piece of cloth, not some fuel for whatever gotcha you're trying to do here.
[удалено]
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I especially love the "NO STUPID PEOPLE"
Some straight people are also apart of the lgbt though
Damn that's even gayer than an actual pride flag
V for Vendetta
I thought it was an A
It’s INGSOC
Love the cheeky sign next to it: *No Stupid People Beyond This Point* 😂
The A in the sign is pointing to it 💀
Ok, thanks for the warning
Absolute based store owner ngl
Then how come their flag is in the window??
Too much to post outside my office at work? 😬 I don't want to be in the HR watch list (again)
I feel like businesses using ally flags is probably the most genuine thing they can do. Like the business isn't LGBT, the owners aren't, etc... Ally flag just says we support your patronage, without appropriating anything.
I'm kinda of the opposite opinion. I find it beautiful that pride as a flag and as a month are used by everyone. Yes, it does mean they are longer using pride for its original purpose: as a sign of being proud of their LGBT identity. But symbol always evolves, and in this case I think they're evolving into something greater: a symbol of progressive values and celebrating our sexual diversity. I understand for some, having a symbol they're familiar with appropriated with another meaning is irksome. But I enjoy the fact that pride flag has made its way out of a relatively small community and made a significant impact on human history for the better. And I do think the new meaning it carries remains in line with its original vexillogical symbolism.
As a queer person I feel the same. I love to see the pride flag flown by people who love and support us, and I don't really think allies should need a special flag to represent them as a member of the "person who doesn't hate us" community. No hate to people who use it, I appreciate the sentiment either way.
You gotta admit, though, the ally flag looks dope as hell.
I've seen the progress pride flag effectively used as an "all accepted" signal by allies and businesses. A part of me sees the ally flag as making something that's explicitly not about you about you.
Perfectly stated 👏👏👏
I'm a straight dude wearing a [pride t-shirt](https://shop.startrek.com/cdn/shop/products/ST-TOS-RBWD-Adult_Tank_Top-RO_620x.jpg?v=1590677343) right now.
Yo that's a sick design! I have a [similar one](https://sw6.elbenwald.de/thumbnail/bf/b8/4b/1633451800/E1062795_1_1600x1600.jpg) but I really enjoy the minimalism on yours
IDIC
[Indeed.](https://shop.startrek.com/cdn/shop/products/ST-PVS-Adult_Tank_Top-RO_1800x1800.jpg?v=1590677308)
Yeah, an ally flag kind gives insecure “no homo” vibes
I agree with your take as well, but I also really appreciate the sentiment behind an ally flag. I mean if you are straight, you dont have to care about our rights, and in a lot of areas, openly supporting us is met with judgement. So someone who does not need to show their support, still choosing to do so... idk I just really respect it.
Yeah, I don't see the point of all those dozens those different rainbow flag designs in general - other than than a conversation starter; "what does this one mean?" it all feels kind of superficial. The colours of the classic pride flag were supposed to represent: life, healing, sun, peace, nature and spirit - it has no direct correlation to sexual or gender identities. So how I see it is that it's always bee about what unites us - not about what distinguishes us. So the pride flag itself has always been intersectional in spirit - its design was already perfect as it is. And to be clear, I'm okay pride flags flying next to the OG pride flag. But for instance the rainbow flags that include neurodivergence have so much going on that they're simply not neuro-divergent friendly designs.
Speaking as a queer person, me too. a lot of people make an active effort to support LGBT *owned* businesses in particular, so I quite like the distinction between "we are a business that supports you!" and "business *for queer people by queer people*".
I personally feel like it should be Pride for just your orientation in general, it can still be mainly focused on LGBTQ but Heterosexuals don't get representation. I get that the point is to celebrate being different, but we should really just celebrate who we are
I'm a cishet male. As an ally I wear pride shit because I think the ally flag is ugly as shit. No queer people have ever been anything but happy I'm showing support. They don't give a fuck about appropriating.
Yeah this flag is horrendous and I kind of hate it.
How does it support you in any way, to show a flag?
It’s all just kinda performative and means nothing
“Warning, no stupid people beyond this point” Whelp, another store I’m not allowed to go into
Gaybizond
I thought it was gay V for Vendetta 😅
Gay V for Vendetta is just V for Vendetta (especially the film).
Isn’t that redundant? V for Vendetta is pretty queer coded.
Noooo! V for Vendetta is part of my sigma-pilled deepstate domestic terrorist fantasy! It can’t be gay 😭 EDIT: /s if that’s needed
Speaking of the red pill…. Hahaha
What's that one show with the green girl named vendetta¿
I find the representation of these kind of flags always conflicting. All people should be treated the same, that is the ideal. The original rainbow is pretty good at this, it keeps it vague which color represents what. The other flags manage to divide people in ever more closed of colors. Segregation is the opposite of what it should represent.
I felt this way after the progress pride flags. Wasn’t the whole point of the rainbow that it included all colors (sexualities, identities, etc). It almost feels divisive having separate flags for separate things. I know flags have been a big part of queer identification (dating bag to pocket flags and whatnot in the 70s). But it feels like todays many pride flags are different than the identifiers of before
I’m not sure what you mean about the colors being vague. They have distinct meanings from Gilbert Baker: Hot pink: sex; Red: life; Orange: healing; Yellow: sunlight; Green: nature; Turquoise: magic and art; Indigo: serenity; and Violet: spirit.
Right but how many people know that individually unless you asked them to? You see a rainbow you see a rainbow
If I may, I think the point he’s trying to make is that Baker’s pride flag 🏳️🌈 represents everyone who falls under the umbrella of “not heterosexual”, and all who fall under that category can celebrate it and feel represented by it. When you start adding the triangles and more colours onto Baker’s flag, to represent specific segments of the queer spectrum (allies, or trans, etc.), you’re not actually adding representation, you’re separating a certain segment of the queer population from the queer community, even elevating it from the queer community. Some people have the same problem with adding letters to LGBTQ. The Q was added as an umbrella for everyone who doesn’t feel represented by the L, G, B or T. Why add an A, or an I, a 2S? They’re covered by the Q! Sorry if it’s a bit of a rant, but yes, I think it’s a subject worth exploring.
2S is an indigenous identity that predates the word queer, and intersex refers to people that have bodies that physically don't fit in either category, not just psychologically. It's pretty understandable why those two groups wouldn't want to be lumped in with queer. The A was added to fend off asexual erasure, but has oft been appropriated to mean ally. *(The funny thing about that is that I always knew I identified with the A, but I assumed it was because I was an ally, not because I'm aspec)*
That argument is very commonly made, but has nothing to do with the flag in the post. This flag was created in a situation where someone thought it was worth making it clear that there were straight people who were happy to loudly support LGBT+ people. There are some contexts where people find that helpful, and others where people are more put off by the idea that people bother saying they're not themselves LGBT+ rather than just flying a rainbow. Either way, it's not about "adding representation", but about whether a particular message is helpful in a particular context. The other thing with that argument is that it completely ignores the history of the rainbow flag and why it was taken up the way it was. Yes, the symbolism does lend itself to an "all people should be treated the same" message that is definitely relevant to the context of the flag, but Baker and others did very deliberately adopt it not as a flag of universal equality, but as a flag for the gay community.
As a queer person, I kinda like what it shows - when I see it in a parade or smth, I can tell that it's not only the LGBT+ community fighting for itself, but also our allies fighting for us. Nice to know there's people with enough empathy to help. I see your point though.
From this article titled, “LGBTQ PRIDE: Gilbert Baker, creator of rainbow flag, shares story of strength and pride”: “Each color of the rainbow flag stands for something. "Pink is for sex, red for life, orange for healing, yellow for sun," Baker told ABC7 News. "Green for nature, turquoise for magic, blue for serenity and purple for the spirit. I like to think of those elements as in every person, everyone shares that." https://abc7news.com/pride-flag-rainbow-the-colors/1780322/
Some times this feels like a matter of "us" and "them". Sadly.
As a gay dude I completely agree
I love this. I think some people forget not too long ago this business would have had there windows broken. Support should be universal and loved❤️
Is that Gay Ingsoc???
I'm not a fan of the black-white "ally" flag, kind of implies straight people are binary, boring, colorless.
The design was a reclaiming of the homophobic straight pride flag that implies exactly that because frankly it looks like prison bars.
[But that's literally the straight flag](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight_flag)
It's *a* straight flag, and I'm not a fan of it. There's also an orange and black flag used by transphobes.
What is an ally flag?
he actually means "straight ally" flag. The stripes are for heterosexuality and the A is for ally (of LGBT).
So a flag for straight people who support LGBT+ community?
Yes
Alright
Average Juventus fan?
Ingsoc has always supported Pride Month.
It's such a sick flag tbh so good
Does everything need a flag?
Well, if you don't have a flag, then you can't have a country. Those are the rules... that I just made up!
Britain, is that you?
You need a beer as well. You can't be a real country unless you have a beer and an airline. It helps if you have some kind of a football team, or some nuclear weapons, but at the very least you need a beer.
I propose a flag that shows our desire for less flags.
Gordon freeman in the back
There’s one in the window of a shop near me that sells crystals and has a chiropractor. I turned to the person I was with and asked “why do they have an ally flag? That’s a little weird, right?” This was sometime in April, not related to Pride Month at all.
What makes it weird?
I honestly dont like the design the A looks too much like a V.
Certainly doesn't look like a v when it's flying though
doesn't look like an A either, imo. chevrons are wayyy too common in flags for a Λ to be read as an A
Posts like this are a mousetrap for phobes. They can't help telling us how they don't care if people are queer, but always go on to say bigoted shit. Makes it easier to report them lol
“I don’t hate LGBTQ people.. but I never want to see or hear about them ever in my whole life and I vote for people who want to take away their rights” Basically what all those people sound like lol
Your quote isn't accurate because it doesn't feature the "shove their ideology down our throats" that people like this always say for some reason
“You can do whatever you like in your home. Just don’t make me feel funny and question myself “
Gay supporters of the Juventus F.C.
im from utah. when i used to live there i saw a lot of these!!! might be a surprise but utah is pretty chill.
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i vibe w that, i want one
Well I don’t. And it would be a great visual displeasure to view one in public for myself.
Didn't know there was an ally flag! Love it 😍
Didn’t know there was an ally flag! I hate it.
I fly that one! Black and white stripes are like 80% of my clothes so when I saw this flag I knew that was the one for me to fly 🤓
Feels super performative to me. If you're an ally, just put up the regular pride flag. "I'm a friend of the gays! But I'm not gay I swear. Really see my flag? I'm not gay, I'm just on their side. I would really hate if someone thought I might be gay so I have to make it clear I'm straight."
Why does it have to be negative? Why can’t they want a flag that makes that clarification? I think it would be pretty great to see more cishet people actively supporting us, but with a normal pride flag, I don’t know. “I’m a friend of the gays” is all that it has to be.
But you don't need a special flag to say "I'm a friend of the gays", the flag already exists. Cishet people flying the pride flag is how it becomes normalized for cishet people flying the pride flag. Cishet people making themselves their own flag to separate themselves perpetuates the idea that only queer people fly the actual pride flag. It also gives me the impression that they would feel offended in a way that someone thought they were gay. Gays don't care if people think they're straight. I think it does the opposite of what you say. My opinion.
lol so dumb
My man!! https://preview.redd.it/575xv06br69d1.jpeg?width=544&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=805ed071a1fe5d1f7aac14a3c0f7b129d9186df8
I gotta Say, not to offend anyone, but I never understood the point of pride flags. Like why do you need to show that you're LGBT ? And why use a flag, idk just the Principle of using a flag to represent sexuality seems so starnge to me. I don't understand why you would like the World to know your sexuality.
No Stupid People beyond this point. With that being said stuffed animals are located to the right. Crystals And tchotchkes for people who think Halloween is a personality type located against the back wall.
Always thought ally businesses would just put up the progress flag, interesting
Curious why this is a vexology tho?
>a vexology It's written at the top of your browser... : Vexillology
Gay INGSOC
There are ally flags? I got to get one just to upset my dad.
Alternate INGSOC lmao
Tf is that?
…read the title
A mentally ill person’s flag?
I'm no expert but why not just fly a pride flag if you support the pride community? Doesn't this flag rather symbolise "hi I really want to show that I am straight, but I don't want people to think I'm homophobic"?
I mean… yeah.
a what flag now
The gay community is a god send for vexillology, they create new concepts and flags to represent them faster than any other group. Will provide content for this subreddit indefinitely.
There's plenty for vexillologists to be interested in apart from new flags...
Yes I agree, just seems the gay community loves inventing a new concept every month and a flag to represent it.
Where do you live?
I live in Norway, this picture is from Bangor in Wales
I was not expecting Bangor to show up on Reddit today.
Just wondering since in the US and Canada, pride flags are everywhere
Plenty of pride flags, but this is the first time I saw an ally flag
I've seen tons of them too here
As wheezing from dragon tales says Looooooove it!!!!!!
Arch pride flag
It makes me think of Ingsoc being allies lul
i've seen two houses with them before they go hard
That's what that flag is! I deliver parcels to a house that has this flag outside
The specsavers guy in the reflection looks happy too
Vaulttech at pridemonth:
The flag looks nice but I feel like the colors should be reversed,
It’s just such a bad looking flag
What is an ally flag??
House in my town has an ally/Gadsden fusion
My neighbors across the street have a flag pole with the US flag, and a second flag that varies by time of year. It's a jolly roger during October, a weird Christmas flag during December, a couple other like that, and then the Ally flag during pride month.
Ugly AF
That’s new. What does it mean?
Gay rights! (no homo)
in Italy they call it the gay friendly straight flag
How many space pirate fleets are there?
If I hang it upside down, does it mean I'm an enemy to gays?
Disgusting.
I've got one hanging from my flag pole right now?
I saw one in PG County, MD the other day.
There’s a double meaning here to ally, the black/white could be d-day invasion stripes and the V shape could be like a victory symbol or whatever. But that’s def not the intended meaning