Devil's advocate (literally): From Putin's perspective, if we give weapons to his enemy capable of deep strikes, he can give weapons to our enemy capable of the same.
Also, fuck Putin.
>he can give weapons to our enemy [Putin says are] capable of the same [but are in fact, not]
I don't think enough can be said about the intelligence the West has gained about Russia. And I don't think it's out of the question to wonder if the United States' increasing tolerance of Ukraine's invasive tactics are directly related to the West realizing that Russia can't actually launch sophisticated missiles capable of outmanuevering our missile defense systems.
The opportunity to thin an already starving population through armed conflict while simultaneously getting aid?
This is like Russian Economics 201. "Russian (and men who can be dressed to appear as russian soldiers) soldiers are a fungible currency which can be bartered for other commodities."
It's likely ICBM and nuclear sub tech, both things North Korea has been struggling to develop themselves. Russia has already shared some things with them when they traded for ammo and artillery a few months ago, but I'm betting it's more this time.
Curious how India is getting away with working with Russia on missile tech while doing drills with America.
Isn’t Russia concerned with leaked tech or is Russia that weak now?
Putin is offering nothing, Xi is. North Korea is dependent on Chinas support. And since China can’t sell weapons to Russia without getting sanctioned by the West, they sell "scrap" to North Korea, the North Koreans assemble the weaponry, and send it over their border to Russia. China using North Korea as proxy is also why Putin had to embarrass himself by visiting Pyongyang.
I've written this before. But it's a win win?
Russia get's infantry fodder to add and gets some much needed munitions.
North Korea get's the ability to feed it's soldiers.
But Kim might be slightly reluctant because less soldiers at home means less soldiers to keep the populace in check.
>less soldiers to keep the populace in check.
That's usually done by police, not army. With army there's a problem of combat experience. You cannot give your troops combat experience without fighting a war. And inexperienced soldiers, no matter how trained, are less valuable.
Fot NK this is an opportunity to test their forces and their tech against an actual enemy without endangering their own territory. The USA experience so to speak.
It is a win-win
Russia doesn’t need munitions, they need warm zealous cannon fodder which NK can provide.
NK needs munitions and technology, which Russia can provide.
The trade helps Russia in Ukraine and NK with SK in the future.
North Korea has a massive standing army. They can afford to lose soldiers. They don't have great equipment, technology, or food...there are a lot of not so impressive things putin can hand over without incuring much cost.
Especially after we deworm them.
"Doctors discovered a large number and multiple forms of parasitic worms. Some of the parasites removed were as long as 27 centimeters (more than 10 inches), according to the South Korean doctors who treated him. One type of worm they discovered is typically found in dogs."
[https://www.cnn.com/2017/11/22/health/north-korea-defector-parasites-health/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2017/11/22/health/north-korea-defector-parasites-health/index.html)
Could mean composted. Mixing carbon (like grass, leaves, peels, cores, corpses, etc) and nitrogen (manure, soybeans, human waste) will actually start chemical processes that, if controlled and used correctly can heat a compost batch to a temperature high enough to kill bacteria and parasites. The end result is always soil, but if you don't control the heat and get it hot enough, there might be some bad stuff in there too
This is correct. Farmers will leave the manure in a pile for about half a year for it to compost properly. It's called "burning the shit" in my neck of the woods.
My parents say back in their country the farmers would dig massive deep rectangular pits in the fields that they'd fill with layers of shit, dirt, straw/husk, repeat and then cover with extra layers of dirt before leaving it to do its thing.
During the winter, the entire area would all be covered with snow except above the pits because the ground would too hot for it to accumulate.
Then before spring they'd dig up the area as compost, or just plant directly on top of it.
The way the fitness influencer industry is going, give it a year and you'll be raking in money.
Can you come up with some bullshit philosophy as to why the Vitamin S plan is the best? Have you taken steroids? How do you feel about eating raw testicles?
https://www.epa.gov/biosolids/basic-information-about-biosolids
> Biosolids are a product of the wastewater treatment process. During wastewater treatment the liquids are separated from the solids. Those solids are then treated physically and chemically to produce a semisolid, nutrient-rich product known as biosolids. The terms ‘biosolids’ and ‘sewage sludge’ are often used interchangeably.
>
> Biosolids that are to be beneficially used must meet federal and state requirements. Examples of beneficial use include application to agricultural land and reclamation sites (e.g. mining sites). When applied to land at the appropriate agronomic rate, biosolids provide a number of benefits including nutrient addition, improved soil structure, and water reuse. Land application of biosolids also can have economic and waste management benefits (e.g., conservation of landfill space; reduced demand on non-renewable resources like phosphorus; and a reduced demand for synthetic fertilizers). Biosolids also may be disposed of by incineration, landfilling, or other forms of surface disposal.
I believe a common source of biosolids is residential septic tanks. Septic tanks are just mini wastewater treatment plants. Waste enters them and it all just kinda sits there until the solids sink to the bottom, while the semi-treated water is pumped out to one of many different styles of leech fields. The solids left over are being "processed" right there by bacteria. The bacteria eat the poop then poop out the poop. Then it all gets pumped out every so often and the sludge is taken to another facility for further processing.
Here is some more reading if you're interested. It's a direct PDF link, fyi.
https://19january2017snapshot.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2015-07/documents/biosolids_generation_use_disposal_in_u.s_1999.pdf
Everyone has to collect and save their shit in big buckets to give to the government. Some people don’t have enough and have to steal some from their neighbors toilet.
I’m being completely serious.
depends on the worm! hook worms enter through your skin, usually the feet.
tape worms through consumption of meat or food or feces which has eggs in it...
others by mosquito bites or bug bites...
:o very sad
Oh boy, have I got a treat for you.
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/article/how-a-worm-gave-the-south-a-bad-name/
> “Neglected tropical diseases like hookworm not only occur in settings of poverty, but they also *cause* poverty,” says Peter Hotez, dean of the National School of Tropical Medicine at Baylor College of Medicine in Houston. “Hookworms were definitely a major factor in holding back progress in the American South.”
> A 1926 study of Alabama school children found that the greater the number of worms that students harbored, the lower their IQ.
> “You had an entire class of Southern society—including whites, blacks, and Native Americans—that was looked upon as shiftless, lazy good-for-nothings who can’t do a day’s work,” my mom explained to me. “Hookworms tainted the nation’s picture of what a Southerner looked and acted like.”
Hookworm disease is also a major contributor to the "[lazy Southerner](https://www.vice.com/en/article/wnxxq5/southerners-werent-lazy-just-infected-with-hookworms-stereotype)" stereotype: short, dumb, slow-talking, distended stomach. And barefoot, of course. You know, [these guys](https://imgur.com/hPkaxWg). But the reality was that in children it causes them to be physically and mentally stunted, and looks more like [these guys](https://imgur.com/aRW10nZ).
Fun fact the one found in dogs will in humans can produce cysts in the liver, heart and sometimes even the brain. To catch it in that way means you’ve consumed infected fecal matter (tho I may have mistaken that for tapeworms)
Poor sanitation standards come with widespread poverty. Parasites are a pretty big issue in a lot of countries. I mean, "issue" being used loosely since there are typically more pressing problems I guess. It's one of those things I guess that doesn't really come up much
I get the feeling there’s gonna be a lot of guys trying to secretly learn “I surrender, take me prisoner and tell everyone you killed me - North Korea *sucks!*” in Ukranian
Isn't there a somewhat widespread black market with South Korean tv dramas and music etc being traded on USB sticks? A sizeable part of the population probably is aware of the differences.
You are correct. The NK has an ongoing crackdown on all things South Korean (K-dramas, TV shows, Kpop etc) but numerous NK defects have testified that they are being secretly distributed among the citizens. Which might sound a bit hopeful, but a revolution is still not feasible unless the upper-ranking officials/officers decide to oppose Kim's regime directly. Which is probably not happening.
The 'official black market' has been shut down. For a while some of the party big shots were profiting a lot off of it. The northern border has been turned into a no man's land. No more sellers crossing the river, bribing guards and selling goods to them. Now it's shoot to kill. At least that's from the statements of people who watch the northern border from China. Escapes are far down for that reason too.
But "contraband" came in for a long time and I'm sure information trickles in even today. There are also some North Koreans who work outside the country under strict surveillance. They also must be married with a child as collateral. Some work in public-facing jobs (such as the NK restaurants in China), so they can't be immune from information of the outside.
Interestingly enough, it is more nuanced than that. I remember a documentary from a couple of years ago where a journalist went to a North Korean labour camp in such a remote area of Siberia that they are not as supervised as you would think. He was able to talk to a few North Korean workers without any overseers being present, and they had a surprisingly midway attitude. 'Yeah North Korea and its government kinda suck, but I guess your country is not a paradise either, and you are somewhat at fault for the historical tensions we have. What are you gonna do, right? Back to chopping wood now".
That is not a 'free' or correct attitude, but North Korea is not the anthill of brainwashed zealots that it is often portrayed at. Doesn't mean that there is any even half serious opposition in the country (there is not), but they are at least somewhat aware that they are a lot poorer and more oppressed than most other nations.
They knew that they were in Russia. They however, were not going to say anything that would get them in the tiniest bit of trouble. All of these workers were married men and I'm pretty sure they all had at least 1 child. Doing anything that the NK government didn't like, would put their immediate family in danger of being sent to a camp.
Well the issue is that that in and of itself IS propaganda. "Sure x sucks, but I guess suckiness is kinda the norm" is an INCREDIBLY useful propaganda tool to stop people from mobilizing against everything from shitty living conditions to mass corruption of their politicians.
In reality, things suck SO badly in NK that the person joking about POWs leading better lives is quite literally true. A destitute person in most countries will still have FAR more opportunities than a destitute person in NK. But if you can use propaganda to say "It sucks here but everywhere has problems", that's a far easier pill for someone to swallow than "It does not suck here, starvation is good for you, and the glorious God-Emperor is literally perfect in every way".
I mean, ive seen some smuggled videos from N korea.
Even the russian troops occupying ukrainian cities were apparently surprised by the living standards.
So imagine the N koreans. Theyll see it with their own eyes.
Once they push into cities yes, but that's after they've arrived at the front and got assigned to an assault that goes into a city.
If all they see is countryside, then assault a Ukrainian position on high ground, they won't see the mythical washing machines. The higher living standard won't just appear before their eyes once they get off trains, they need to get into a position where they can see it.
It might happen, sure. But surrendering with a white flag, saying the living conditions back home suck and they want the standard here is not going to be the first thing they do once they are given a gun.
It'll take time.
They'll be sitting in a train, most likely a cattle wagon too. Even if they can see outside, what are they going to see? Fields and roads at best. Maybe they can see a few skyscrapers.
They won't see individual living standards. They won't get invited to TED talks where presenters explain all the rights the people of the west have. Or smartphones, salaries, etc.
Nah. Cannibalism isn’t legal in N Korea. So you should have chosen option 1. If you chose option 2 and survived, obviously you are a cannibal. Straight to gulag when you return.
3. “Fight” in Ukraine and immediately surrender. You may become a POW, but you’ll probably be better fed than in NK and at least a 5% shot at freedom is better than 0%z
Damn that’s so horrible. I wish there was a way to make them all “KIA” but I know that would require a level of cooperation that your average Ukrainian soldier is too preoccupied to care about (not blaming them).
This is genuinely a good point though. North Koreans fighting abroad will surely do whatever they possibly can to stay abroad. Defecting and becoming a prisoner of war in Europe is possibly a much better situation than they have in NK, with the added bonus that they were fighting for their country, so their relatives won’t necessarily be murdered / imprisoned back home
Most likely it would be the same as defecting.
Best case scenario is to steal the identity of a dead squad mate and then get captured. Then your family doesn't get gulaged and you get to stay in Europe.
Slightly true, if you're a POW when the war is over they'll likely use the "you come home or the next 3 generations of your family are in the Gulag" thing they already use with defectors.
So they may not be murdered / imprisoned while an active POW but once the war is over and the POW refuses to come home, its a good bet that will change.
Same goes for Putin. Russian economy is largely based on resource export, they don’t really need that many people. They are literally making a bank by killing their own population in Ukraine.
Genius (in the evil way - use others’ hands to get rid of people you don’t want, and they will hate those people instead). Kim is a fucking twisted fuck.
Somewhat related pointis that many developing countries send their soldiers to participate in UN peacekeeping operations so that they are not fully responsible for them. The benefit is that the UN pays their salaries and, as a result, you will have less disgruntled soldiers close to the capital who could potentially overthrow you.
They are so brainwashed that they have no idea what they are really fighting for. I doubt they will desert. However, maybe if the troops in Ukraine offers them dessert they might.
Yeah. The higher ups and “wealthy” in NK are more likely to be the true believers (in my opinion), because the regime actually benefits them. I don’t think the masses of ordinary NK citizens are brainwashed communist zombies, they just don’t have the resources or nerve to take the extreme measure of defecting.
This shit is dangerous and difficult. If you get caught, it’s death or the gulag, which is just a death sentence but slower. You either have to take a long, expensive smuggler’s route up into China and then into Vietnam or Laos, or you have to bum rush the DMZ where you’ll almost certainly die.
I don’t blame anyone for not running. Being hungry and poor is usually preferable to a bullet in the head.
> Being hungry and poor is usually preferable to a bullet in the head.
There's also the fact that given their upbringing they're likely to end up hungry and poor in other countries.
As Korean speakers their best best is Korea, which has a very wealthy upper class that is the envy of many. But with their education, accent, and general upbringing, North Koreans aren't usually going to end up in the upper class, they're going to end up eking out a meager living at the bottom of society.
There's a reason it's not unheard of for North Koreans who flee to South Korea ending up crossing back across the border. Not to say that North Korea ends up being better, just that a North Korean upbringing means that most North Koreans aren't prepared for the "outside world," same way that many Amish who try to leave their communities end up coming back, because their unique upbringing doesn't leave them equipped for the dog-eat-dog world of modern hyper-capitalism.
What happens if entire squads, or even something like the majority of who is sent decide to defect? Is Tubby really going to have thousands upon thousands of citizens killed over it? Do they even have the bureaucratic efficiency to figure out who needs to be taken out? If there's a serious coordinated effort among the troops, I could see this being catastrophic for NK.
If there'd be serious coordinated effort within NK they could overthrow the authoritarian regime. It is a very principle of dictatorship to polarize the society and spread fear to avoid any type of revolution.
This is also why Putin had Navalny poisoned, arrested, incarcerated, and eventually killed - it's a show of force for any "ill-minded politician" who dreams of a free country rather than the oppressive government it currently has.
Do we have evidence of the NK society being polarized? Over what issue exactly?
My impression was that NK leadership does their best to keep them united and unanimous, similarly to China, not polarized over some issue.
I would say they are probably polarised in an anti-South Korea/West sense. They are highly isolationist and keep tensions with South Korea and the West high, it would make sense that this is done to aid the polarisation and political power of their country.
So what he meant to say is, dictatorships frame some external enemy to unite against? Yeah, that checks out, but it's something very different from polarization. You control democracies by polarizing them, and control autocracies by uniting them.
Absolutely.
Dictatorships are very competent at keeping records of the population. I can say it confidently, since I am from Azerbaijan, which was occupied by soviets between 1920-1991 and them became a dictatorship again in 1993 and still stuck with it.
Everyone is tegistered to their home address. It is documented who your mother, father, SO, children are, this is basic records.
In our case, all phones are registered by their IMEI number, if you dont register it, them they will block your cellular services. Phone numbers are registered.
But most important during soviets was the “propiska system”, government ofcourse knows where you live and who lives in your house.
And ofc they know who your family is, they got birth records.
With todays digitisation, it becomes easier. If soviets could do it without computers, then north koreans can do it.
In KGB everyone was supposed to write reports about their coworkers.
They would probably see it as an opportunity to bring unfathomable wealth back home to thier families. Cars, appliances, medical devices, electronics etc… i imagine that they will be scrapping Ukraine for every bit of its worth down to the lumber and water pipes.
Okay, now imagine only half of the soldiers can read. And the ones that do are loyal to the regime because they come from a family of higher standing. North Korea shows us that there is strength in being an illiterate society that’s dirt poor. America couldn’t conquer Afghanistan for this reason as well…
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH!
I would not count on mass desertions. These people have been kept isolated for generations. I would suspect that the vast majority truly believe in what they have been told. People in the west find it hard to leave cults. I can’t imagine trying to leave a truly dystopian nightmare cult that North Korea is. If NK sends troops I would expect human wave attacks like we saw during the Korean war. Junior officers shot on the spot for failing to take a trench line. NK troops climbing in tanks armed with just grenades, like fucking zombies but the fast running type not the slow type.
I would expect SK to get much more involved if NK was to send troops. This would be an intel opportunity that they couldn’t pass up.
Most of them have family members inside NK who would be tortured, starved and imprisoned for life to the third generation if they deserted or defected.
Yeah even North Korean Olympic athletes have never tried for asylum. So random soldiers who have zero knowledge of what the outside world is like will be even less likely.
N.K. claims to have a 100% literacy rate, but do we really believe that means they can recognize more than the name of their glorious leader?
I’m just not sure how effective a desertion campaign would be.
I actually believe dictatorships have a high literacy rate as kids are forced to read/write about the country and leader (mostly propaganda stuff). Now are they reading or learning anything useful or practical is another question.
Korean is a very easy language to learn how to read/write. Literacy rate is really high in both South and North - but unfortunately, educational content is limited in NK.
Yeah I was just throwing it out there. The US dropped lots of surrender leaflets during the first gulf war. Ukraine would not be that simple as NK units would likely be embedded in Russian ones, so they have a lot to worry about before they desert.
Will be temporary, as their families will suffer for any type of desertion. They are required to go back. And, the money earned goes to the DPRK.
Although, not permitted, North Korea provides cheap labour to neighbouring countries to help fill its coffers.
This is my first thought after reading the headline, there have been reports of defecting Russians but once you send the North Koreans out of North Korea they may not come back. The reason for not coming back might not be death
They also have no experience with modern equipment. Not just military, but all of it. Almost nobody in NK has internet, and if they do, they only get like 7 state controlled websites. Everything else is blocked. They don't know how to use smartphones or drones or any computer. Their journalists still use film cameras instead of digital. Their whole tech is decades out of date.
The Russians can only give them simple guns and put them in trenches, that's it.
That's the big thing here n.korea has no applicable combat experience. Even if they had the best geat available right now they have no idea how modern war works and no experienced troops to draw training lessons from. They are functionally useless in front line service.
Wonder if Kim is looking to economize on the cost of prison camps for "undesirable" elements? He might get oil in exchange for them instead of letting them starve uselessly.
Naw probably not, they already put them to work on chain gangs tilling land and planting crops, not to mention what would the reward for the prisoners to fight, if they get told they’ll be sent back to NK they’ll just end up straight back in prison for some made up crime. If NK was to send any prisoners to Russia to fight they would certain flee the second they get any sort of autonomy.
The West will make stunning and brave speeches, Westerners will laugh at North Koreans, and more Ukrainians will die while their country is under even more pressure.
Eek. So all the people that were rooting for Russia to win this war and defeat the “Nazis” of Ukraine are going to have to side with North Korea now? That’s going to be a bad look.
This sounds like it would be a one-way ticket to the battlefield. A country that closed off would never be able to afford disabled soldiers coming back to show and tell everyone about how completely outmatched they were. These guys have been brainwashed to believe they are the ultimate country, and while not everyone believes it, plenty do. Getting this experience outside of the country would be way too eye opening for them to be let back in.
Banking on trump taking office, with how the right has already attempted to block aide for Ukraine, he probably sees the conservative as convenient idiots
Not convenient idiots... useful collaborators. They have agency, they are making choices. They know what we know, and in many cases much more if they have any access to classified data.
Some definitely are idiots, but not all of them.
That seems like the plan. North Korea will have fewer mouths to feed and Russia will provide some aid to North Korea so maybe they keep the people who aren't sent off to be slaughtered in Ukraine from starving to death. Why else would Russia and North Korea be meeting? North Korea doesn't have much to offer militarily other than bodies. This is a country that is currently floating shit balloons toward its enemy.
if north Korean troops end up in Ukraine. there's really no more reason to hold back nato from joining the fight.
a country from east Asia meddling in a European war is just ripping off the bandaid that is pretending world War 3 hasn't already started
Kim will be giving his troops combat experience. The ones that survive can pass on a lot of knowledge on how to fight and survive against a modern military.
I'm genuinely curious about how they will perform in a real conflict. All I've seen so far is they can march really good and break boards using their testicles.
Something doesn't quite add up. I thought NK soldiers were brainwashed to fight to defend the motherland and not to invade other country except for South Korea. How would Kim sell the idea of fighting for Russia? Wasn't their whole dynasty philosophy to be self sufficient?
Isn’t Kim too paranoid about giving up part of his armed forces? If he didn’t think he needs the number he has now, he wouldn’t have the number he has now.
I just don't see NK sending soldiers to Ukraine.
They know they will get used as meat shields to reduce Russian casualties. They know it's impossible to keep them all contained, like they do with the NK slaves in Russia doing construction, so tons will take the opportunity to desert.
They probably have observers over there now. NK hasn't had any real combat experience since the Korean War, so they probably want to learn and test some things.
It would definitely be a huge surprise if it actually happens but the odd chance Russia makes a deal NK cant refuse it could happen. But they would semi contain them probably, use them like the storm z units probably.
It’ll be somewhat useful if they deploy NK troops. Kim will sustain heavy loses and most likely weasel out of the situation. We also get a chance to see how battle ready NK troops really are, because Russia has proven to be an absolute shit show. NK will surly be worse.
Reminds me of the line from the movie Hunt for Red October:
"This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it."
Putin must be offering something really nice if it’s able to get North Korea involved in a war that’s thousands of miles away.
Food, probably.
Food, oil, nuclear secrets, gps access etc.. maybe land?
Rocket technology
Probably this. They can claim to reach all of the U.S. with Russian technology at the cost of 100,000 troops. Less mouths to feed for Kim. Win win
Devil's advocate (literally): From Putin's perspective, if we give weapons to his enemy capable of deep strikes, he can give weapons to our enemy capable of the same. Also, fuck Putin.
Pretty much, and agreed!
>he can give weapons to our enemy [Putin says are] capable of the same [but are in fact, not] I don't think enough can be said about the intelligence the West has gained about Russia. And I don't think it's out of the question to wonder if the United States' increasing tolerance of Ukraine's invasive tactics are directly related to the West realizing that Russia can't actually launch sophisticated missiles capable of outmanuevering our missile defense systems.
Interesting hypothesis. You may not be wrong, but at least where nukes are concerned, 99% success rate isn't good enough.
Not land but all of the above including more access to the world economy.
Nah, the land has already been dibbed by China
GPS? You mean GLONASS?
Literally anything probably
The opportunity to thin an already starving population through armed conflict while simultaneously getting aid? This is like Russian Economics 201. "Russian (and men who can be dressed to appear as russian soldiers) soldiers are a fungible currency which can be bartered for other commodities."
North Koreans are picking undigested food out of shit to eat it. He's sending away mouths that require food.
Most likely fuel, old obsolete airframes to be rebuilt, maybe “slightly used” aircraft, rocket technology and expertise, and lastly food.
It's likely ICBM and nuclear sub tech, both things North Korea has been struggling to develop themselves. Russia has already shared some things with them when they traded for ammo and artillery a few months ago, but I'm betting it's more this time.
Curious how India is getting away with working with Russia on missile tech while doing drills with America. Isn’t Russia concerned with leaked tech or is Russia that weak now?
That obvious. Missiles that could get nukes to US.
Putin is offering nothing, Xi is. North Korea is dependent on Chinas support. And since China can’t sell weapons to Russia without getting sanctioned by the West, they sell "scrap" to North Korea, the North Koreans assemble the weaponry, and send it over their border to Russia. China using North Korea as proxy is also why Putin had to embarrass himself by visiting Pyongyang.
I've written this before. But it's a win win? Russia get's infantry fodder to add and gets some much needed munitions. North Korea get's the ability to feed it's soldiers. But Kim might be slightly reluctant because less soldiers at home means less soldiers to keep the populace in check.
>less soldiers to keep the populace in check. That's usually done by police, not army. With army there's a problem of combat experience. You cannot give your troops combat experience without fighting a war. And inexperienced soldiers, no matter how trained, are less valuable. Fot NK this is an opportunity to test their forces and their tech against an actual enemy without endangering their own territory. The USA experience so to speak.
It is a win-win Russia doesn’t need munitions, they need warm zealous cannon fodder which NK can provide. NK needs munitions and technology, which Russia can provide. The trade helps Russia in Ukraine and NK with SK in the future.
North Korea has almost as many soldiers as the US. I would not count on them running out.
well thats mostly just because every able bodied man is forced to be in the military.
A strong wind could probably take out 1/4 of them
North Korea has a massive standing army. They can afford to lose soldiers. They don't have great equipment, technology, or food...there are a lot of not so impressive things putin can hand over without incuring much cost.
Didn't he gift the dear leader a fake Rolls-Royce? That should be enough I reckon.
That first NK POW will think they died & went to heaven.
Especially after we deworm them. "Doctors discovered a large number and multiple forms of parasitic worms. Some of the parasites removed were as long as 27 centimeters (more than 10 inches), according to the South Korean doctors who treated him. One type of worm they discovered is typically found in dogs." [https://www.cnn.com/2017/11/22/health/north-korea-defector-parasites-health/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2017/11/22/health/north-korea-defector-parasites-health/index.html)
My god...
Yeah, it's because they fertilise their crops with human shit
To be fair a lot of places do but it is processed, not raw
Yea there’s a documentary where someone did that on Mars to grow potatoes
I mean.... If he went to Mars without worms, I think it would make his fertiliser safe to use? Maybe? I dno.... I'm just talking out of my ass
Mars worms.
Better than Arrakis one's?
maybe this is how we got arrakis worms..
Shai Hulud intestinal worms
I think they're from Uranus?
That's how we get Dune. Do you want Dune?
Yes, yes I do.
That may be the worms talking
It's crazy how he started out as a lowly janitor in Boston and worked his way up to astronaut!!
Also went through a phase of robbing banks in Vegas and the Netherlands, but somehow was never tried!
He also fought in WWII.
And was a corrupt Boston cop.
Because he was a super spy with a deep cover identity.
Worked his way up to Martian shit-potato farmer, amirite?
That documentary is probably the best documentary I've watched.
What does processed mean in this context?
likely cooked and or dried maybe to kill off living organisms.
Could mean composted. Mixing carbon (like grass, leaves, peels, cores, corpses, etc) and nitrogen (manure, soybeans, human waste) will actually start chemical processes that, if controlled and used correctly can heat a compost batch to a temperature high enough to kill bacteria and parasites. The end result is always soil, but if you don't control the heat and get it hot enough, there might be some bad stuff in there too
This is correct. Farmers will leave the manure in a pile for about half a year for it to compost properly. It's called "burning the shit" in my neck of the woods.
My parents say back in their country the farmers would dig massive deep rectangular pits in the fields that they'd fill with layers of shit, dirt, straw/husk, repeat and then cover with extra layers of dirt before leaving it to do its thing. During the winter, the entire area would all be covered with snow except above the pits because the ground would too hot for it to accumulate. Then before spring they'd dig up the area as compost, or just plant directly on top of it.
Vitamin D added to fortify for human consumption
I’ve been looking to replace my boring old multivitamin
The way the fitness influencer industry is going, give it a year and you'll be raking in money. Can you come up with some bullshit philosophy as to why the Vitamin S plan is the best? Have you taken steroids? How do you feel about eating raw testicles?
https://www.epa.gov/biosolids/basic-information-about-biosolids > Biosolids are a product of the wastewater treatment process. During wastewater treatment the liquids are separated from the solids. Those solids are then treated physically and chemically to produce a semisolid, nutrient-rich product known as biosolids. The terms ‘biosolids’ and ‘sewage sludge’ are often used interchangeably. > > Biosolids that are to be beneficially used must meet federal and state requirements. Examples of beneficial use include application to agricultural land and reclamation sites (e.g. mining sites). When applied to land at the appropriate agronomic rate, biosolids provide a number of benefits including nutrient addition, improved soil structure, and water reuse. Land application of biosolids also can have economic and waste management benefits (e.g., conservation of landfill space; reduced demand on non-renewable resources like phosphorus; and a reduced demand for synthetic fertilizers). Biosolids also may be disposed of by incineration, landfilling, or other forms of surface disposal. I believe a common source of biosolids is residential septic tanks. Septic tanks are just mini wastewater treatment plants. Waste enters them and it all just kinda sits there until the solids sink to the bottom, while the semi-treated water is pumped out to one of many different styles of leech fields. The solids left over are being "processed" right there by bacteria. The bacteria eat the poop then poop out the poop. Then it all gets pumped out every so often and the sludge is taken to another facility for further processing. Here is some more reading if you're interested. It's a direct PDF link, fyi. https://19january2017snapshot.epa.gov/sites/production/files/2015-07/documents/biosolids_generation_use_disposal_in_u.s_1999.pdf
Everyone has to collect and save their shit in big buckets to give to the government. Some people don’t have enough and have to steal some from their neighbors toilet. I’m being completely serious.
Can't talk about NK without mentioning the poop quota. Can you imagine.
I mean I certainly could. I don't *have* to, do I?
How long can worms live outside of a host body? Also, do the worms transfer from the human shit into the vegetation?
depends on the worm! hook worms enter through your skin, usually the feet. tape worms through consumption of meat or food or feces which has eggs in it... others by mosquito bites or bug bites... :o very sad
As someone that really likes being barefoot I did not need to read this today
Oh boy, have I got a treat for you. https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/article/how-a-worm-gave-the-south-a-bad-name/ > “Neglected tropical diseases like hookworm not only occur in settings of poverty, but they also *cause* poverty,” says Peter Hotez, dean of the National School of Tropical Medicine at Baylor College of Medicine in Houston. “Hookworms were definitely a major factor in holding back progress in the American South.” > A 1926 study of Alabama school children found that the greater the number of worms that students harbored, the lower their IQ. > “You had an entire class of Southern society—including whites, blacks, and Native Americans—that was looked upon as shiftless, lazy good-for-nothings who can’t do a day’s work,” my mom explained to me. “Hookworms tainted the nation’s picture of what a Southerner looked and acted like.” Hookworm disease is also a major contributor to the "[lazy Southerner](https://www.vice.com/en/article/wnxxq5/southerners-werent-lazy-just-infected-with-hookworms-stereotype)" stereotype: short, dumb, slow-talking, distended stomach. And barefoot, of course. You know, [these guys](https://imgur.com/hPkaxWg). But the reality was that in children it causes them to be physically and mentally stunted, and looks more like [these guys](https://imgur.com/aRW10nZ).
the military in North Korea doesn't provide enough food rations to live off of, soldiers are expected to grow their own supplementary food.
So what are they supposed to do grow a patch of potatoes in the middle of a war zone?
Spending time with russians in the same trenches in unsanitary conditions would definitely cause epidemics in their army, what a shitshow
That's a shame.
Literally
Fun fact the one found in dogs will in humans can produce cysts in the liver, heart and sometimes even the brain. To catch it in that way means you’ve consumed infected fecal matter (tho I may have mistaken that for tapeworms)
I read the link as North Korea Defecator
Poor sanitation standards come with widespread poverty. Parasites are a pretty big issue in a lot of countries. I mean, "issue" being used loosely since there are typically more pressing problems I guess. It's one of those things I guess that doesn't really come up much
Fuck imagine getting FED
We never knew the horrible depths humans would go for a Klondike bar until now...
The North Korean mind could never comprehend a Chicken Chalupa Supreme
I get the feeling there’s gonna be a lot of guys trying to secretly learn “I surrender, take me prisoner and tell everyone you killed me - North Korea *sucks!*” in Ukranian
Nobody will learn that, because they aren't aware how much their living conditions suck compared to the rest of the world.
Isn't there a somewhat widespread black market with South Korean tv dramas and music etc being traded on USB sticks? A sizeable part of the population probably is aware of the differences.
You are correct. The NK has an ongoing crackdown on all things South Korean (K-dramas, TV shows, Kpop etc) but numerous NK defects have testified that they are being secretly distributed among the citizens. Which might sound a bit hopeful, but a revolution is still not feasible unless the upper-ranking officials/officers decide to oppose Kim's regime directly. Which is probably not happening.
The 'official black market' has been shut down. For a while some of the party big shots were profiting a lot off of it. The northern border has been turned into a no man's land. No more sellers crossing the river, bribing guards and selling goods to them. Now it's shoot to kill. At least that's from the statements of people who watch the northern border from China. Escapes are far down for that reason too. But "contraband" came in for a long time and I'm sure information trickles in even today. There are also some North Koreans who work outside the country under strict surveillance. They also must be married with a child as collateral. Some work in public-facing jobs (such as the NK restaurants in China), so they can't be immune from information of the outside.
Interestingly enough, it is more nuanced than that. I remember a documentary from a couple of years ago where a journalist went to a North Korean labour camp in such a remote area of Siberia that they are not as supervised as you would think. He was able to talk to a few North Korean workers without any overseers being present, and they had a surprisingly midway attitude. 'Yeah North Korea and its government kinda suck, but I guess your country is not a paradise either, and you are somewhat at fault for the historical tensions we have. What are you gonna do, right? Back to chopping wood now". That is not a 'free' or correct attitude, but North Korea is not the anthill of brainwashed zealots that it is often portrayed at. Doesn't mean that there is any even half serious opposition in the country (there is not), but they are at least somewhat aware that they are a lot poorer and more oppressed than most other nations.
When you want to throw people at your enemies, you cultivate anger. When you want to protect yourself from your people, you cultivate apathy.
Thats that old vice doc right? Didnt a lot of them not realize they werent in north korea anymore too
They knew that they were in Russia. They however, were not going to say anything that would get them in the tiniest bit of trouble. All of these workers were married men and I'm pretty sure they all had at least 1 child. Doing anything that the NK government didn't like, would put their immediate family in danger of being sent to a camp.
Well the issue is that that in and of itself IS propaganda. "Sure x sucks, but I guess suckiness is kinda the norm" is an INCREDIBLY useful propaganda tool to stop people from mobilizing against everything from shitty living conditions to mass corruption of their politicians. In reality, things suck SO badly in NK that the person joking about POWs leading better lives is quite literally true. A destitute person in most countries will still have FAR more opportunities than a destitute person in NK. But if you can use propaganda to say "It sucks here but everywhere has problems", that's a far easier pill for someone to swallow than "It does not suck here, starvation is good for you, and the glorious God-Emperor is literally perfect in every way".
No need to go to remote Siberia; just interview one of the tens of thousands who have defected to the south.
I mean, ive seen some smuggled videos from N korea. Even the russian troops occupying ukrainian cities were apparently surprised by the living standards. So imagine the N koreans. Theyll see it with their own eyes.
Once they push into cities yes, but that's after they've arrived at the front and got assigned to an assault that goes into a city. If all they see is countryside, then assault a Ukrainian position on high ground, they won't see the mythical washing machines. The higher living standard won't just appear before their eyes once they get off trains, they need to get into a position where they can see it. It might happen, sure. But surrendering with a white flag, saying the living conditions back home suck and they want the standard here is not going to be the first thing they do once they are given a gun. It'll take time.
I’m fairly sure they know up to a certain extent. It’s just that NK has the policy of murdering your entire blood line if you defect.
Are they going to blindfold them until they get all the way to the front?
They'll be sitting in a train, most likely a cattle wagon too. Even if they can see outside, what are they going to see? Fields and roads at best. Maybe they can see a few skyscrapers. They won't see individual living standards. They won't get invited to TED talks where presenters explain all the rights the people of the west have. Or smartphones, salaries, etc.
Kim probably sees that as less mouths to feed
1. Starve to death in NKorea 2. Fight in Ukraine. If you kill one, you get to eat him
If you manage to return to North Korea after helping Russia and China with their war crimes in Ukraine, you get a free glorious leader sausage
And 185 medals
they get that for their grandfather finishing boot camp.
Nah. Cannibalism isn’t legal in N Korea. So you should have chosen option 1. If you chose option 2 and survived, obviously you are a cannibal. Straight to gulag when you return.
3. “Fight” in Ukraine and immediately surrender. You may become a POW, but you’ll probably be better fed than in NK and at least a 5% shot at freedom is better than 0%z
His family will be put to labor camp for 30 yrs
Damn that’s so horrible. I wish there was a way to make them all “KIA” but I know that would require a level of cooperation that your average Ukrainian soldier is too preoccupied to care about (not blaming them).
Alternatively Fake their deaths on the battlefield then immediately "disappear" them.... to South Korea under a new name and alias.
+6 unit reinforcements every turn Hyuk hyuk hyuk
3rd option is slave labor in Russia. It does appear all their oilfield workers have been fired.
This is genuinely a good point though. North Koreans fighting abroad will surely do whatever they possibly can to stay abroad. Defecting and becoming a prisoner of war in Europe is possibly a much better situation than they have in NK, with the added bonus that they were fighting for their country, so their relatives won’t necessarily be murdered / imprisoned back home
no not defecting. captured. that is the best case scenario. defecting will probably cause your whole family to be punished
And being captured won’t?
Most likely it would be the same as defecting. Best case scenario is to steal the identity of a dead squad mate and then get captured. Then your family doesn't get gulaged and you get to stay in Europe.
Squad mate's family hates this trick.
Slightly true, if you're a POW when the war is over they'll likely use the "you come home or the next 3 generations of your family are in the Gulag" thing they already use with defectors. So they may not be murdered / imprisoned while an active POW but once the war is over and the POW refuses to come home, its a good bet that will change.
Fewer
Ser Davos: "What?"
Same goes for Putin. Russian economy is largely based on resource export, they don’t really need that many people. They are literally making a bank by killing their own population in Ukraine.
Genius (in the evil way - use others’ hands to get rid of people you don’t want, and they will hate those people instead). Kim is a fucking twisted fuck.
Somewhat related pointis that many developing countries send their soldiers to participate in UN peacekeeping operations so that they are not fully responsible for them. The benefit is that the UN pays their salaries and, as a result, you will have less disgruntled soldiers close to the capital who could potentially overthrow you.
Imagine if North Korean troops get sent to the front lines and then decide to desert.
They are so brainwashed that they have no idea what they are really fighting for. I doubt they will desert. However, maybe if the troops in Ukraine offers them dessert they might.
NK'ers aren't as brainwashed as people think they are. Everyone's just afraid their neighbors might snitch on them similar to Germany's stasi.
Yeah. The higher ups and “wealthy” in NK are more likely to be the true believers (in my opinion), because the regime actually benefits them. I don’t think the masses of ordinary NK citizens are brainwashed communist zombies, they just don’t have the resources or nerve to take the extreme measure of defecting. This shit is dangerous and difficult. If you get caught, it’s death or the gulag, which is just a death sentence but slower. You either have to take a long, expensive smuggler’s route up into China and then into Vietnam or Laos, or you have to bum rush the DMZ where you’ll almost certainly die. I don’t blame anyone for not running. Being hungry and poor is usually preferable to a bullet in the head.
> Being hungry and poor is usually preferable to a bullet in the head. There's also the fact that given their upbringing they're likely to end up hungry and poor in other countries. As Korean speakers their best best is Korea, which has a very wealthy upper class that is the envy of many. But with their education, accent, and general upbringing, North Koreans aren't usually going to end up in the upper class, they're going to end up eking out a meager living at the bottom of society. There's a reason it's not unheard of for North Koreans who flee to South Korea ending up crossing back across the border. Not to say that North Korea ends up being better, just that a North Korean upbringing means that most North Koreans aren't prepared for the "outside world," same way that many Amish who try to leave their communities end up coming back, because their unique upbringing doesn't leave them equipped for the dog-eat-dog world of modern hyper-capitalism.
Trouble might be that their families could face reprisals.
Desert for dessert!
They will murder your entire family and then proceed to maul each other like wild dogs for the chance to loot a microwave oven or refrigerator
What happens if entire squads, or even something like the majority of who is sent decide to defect? Is Tubby really going to have thousands upon thousands of citizens killed over it? Do they even have the bureaucratic efficiency to figure out who needs to be taken out? If there's a serious coordinated effort among the troops, I could see this being catastrophic for NK.
If there'd be serious coordinated effort within NK they could overthrow the authoritarian regime. It is a very principle of dictatorship to polarize the society and spread fear to avoid any type of revolution. This is also why Putin had Navalny poisoned, arrested, incarcerated, and eventually killed - it's a show of force for any "ill-minded politician" who dreams of a free country rather than the oppressive government it currently has.
Do we have evidence of the NK society being polarized? Over what issue exactly? My impression was that NK leadership does their best to keep them united and unanimous, similarly to China, not polarized over some issue.
I would say they are probably polarised in an anti-South Korea/West sense. They are highly isolationist and keep tensions with South Korea and the West high, it would make sense that this is done to aid the polarisation and political power of their country.
So what he meant to say is, dictatorships frame some external enemy to unite against? Yeah, that checks out, but it's something very different from polarization. You control democracies by polarizing them, and control autocracies by uniting them.
Absolutely. Dictatorships are very competent at keeping records of the population. I can say it confidently, since I am from Azerbaijan, which was occupied by soviets between 1920-1991 and them became a dictatorship again in 1993 and still stuck with it. Everyone is tegistered to their home address. It is documented who your mother, father, SO, children are, this is basic records. In our case, all phones are registered by their IMEI number, if you dont register it, them they will block your cellular services. Phone numbers are registered. But most important during soviets was the “propiska system”, government ofcourse knows where you live and who lives in your house. And ofc they know who your family is, they got birth records. With todays digitisation, it becomes easier. If soviets could do it without computers, then north koreans can do it. In KGB everyone was supposed to write reports about their coworkers.
They would probably see it as an opportunity to bring unfathomable wealth back home to thier families. Cars, appliances, medical devices, electronics etc… i imagine that they will be scrapping Ukraine for every bit of its worth down to the lumber and water pipes.
Whether or not families of deserters would be punished is irrelevant. I assume that if you are NK citizen, you are convinced this is what will happen.
I can see Ukraine dropping propaganda saying "You kill your Russian handlers and defect, and we'll claim we killed you.".
Okay, now imagine only half of the soldiers can read. And the ones that do are loyal to the regime because they come from a family of higher standing. North Korea shows us that there is strength in being an illiterate society that’s dirt poor. America couldn’t conquer Afghanistan for this reason as well… IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH!
Would they send troops or prisoners?
You mean work camp laborers. NK is too pure and moral righteous to have prisoners.
Ukraine should launch a fake death defector program.
Dibs on the coffee maker
I would not count on mass desertions. These people have been kept isolated for generations. I would suspect that the vast majority truly believe in what they have been told. People in the west find it hard to leave cults. I can’t imagine trying to leave a truly dystopian nightmare cult that North Korea is. If NK sends troops I would expect human wave attacks like we saw during the Korean war. Junior officers shot on the spot for failing to take a trench line. NK troops climbing in tanks armed with just grenades, like fucking zombies but the fast running type not the slow type. I would expect SK to get much more involved if NK was to send troops. This would be an intel opportunity that they couldn’t pass up.
Most of them have family members inside NK who would be tortured, starved and imprisoned for life to the third generation if they deserted or defected.
Yeah even North Korean Olympic athletes have never tried for asylum. So random soldiers who have zero knowledge of what the outside world is like will be even less likely.
They literally have soldiers deployed in yemen *right now* which is why all this talk about how they'd defect immediately is dumb as hell.
At least they'll be able to leave N. Korea
Ukraine dropping defect leaflets instead of grenades by drone.
N.K. claims to have a 100% literacy rate, but do we really believe that means they can recognize more than the name of their glorious leader? I’m just not sure how effective a desertion campaign would be.
I actually believe dictatorships have a high literacy rate as kids are forced to read/write about the country and leader (mostly propaganda stuff). Now are they reading or learning anything useful or practical is another question.
They also tend to fudge the numbers
Korean is a very easy language to learn how to read/write. Literacy rate is really high in both South and North - but unfortunately, educational content is limited in NK.
Yeah I was just throwing it out there. The US dropped lots of surrender leaflets during the first gulf war. Ukraine would not be that simple as NK units would likely be embedded in Russian ones, so they have a lot to worry about before they desert.
Smart phones with pornhub would be much more effective.
Will be temporary, as their families will suffer for any type of desertion. They are required to go back. And, the money earned goes to the DPRK. Although, not permitted, North Korea provides cheap labour to neighbouring countries to help fill its coffers.
This is my first thought after reading the headline, there have been reports of defecting Russians but once you send the North Koreans out of North Korea they may not come back. The reason for not coming back might not be death
_See, I told you it's very dangerous outside of NK borders_
It's unfortunate and quite obvious. With malnutrition and no combat experience, they are essentially set up to be mere pawns.
They also have no experience with modern equipment. Not just military, but all of it. Almost nobody in NK has internet, and if they do, they only get like 7 state controlled websites. Everything else is blocked. They don't know how to use smartphones or drones or any computer. Their journalists still use film cameras instead of digital. Their whole tech is decades out of date. The Russians can only give them simple guns and put them in trenches, that's it.
Drone swarms are going to be a living nightmare for them to see I guess
That's the big thing here n.korea has no applicable combat experience. Even if they had the best geat available right now they have no idea how modern war works and no experienced troops to draw training lessons from. They are functionally useless in front line service.
"You see Ivan, we use North Korean soldiers because they are smaller to hit because of malnourishment. The vest will fall to the might of our cause"
Wonder if Kim is looking to economize on the cost of prison camps for "undesirable" elements? He might get oil in exchange for them instead of letting them starve uselessly.
Naw probably not, they already put them to work on chain gangs tilling land and planting crops, not to mention what would the reward for the prisoners to fight, if they get told they’ll be sent back to NK they’ll just end up straight back in prison for some made up crime. If NK was to send any prisoners to Russia to fight they would certain flee the second they get any sort of autonomy.
So wait. North Korea can send troops, but if NATO does it there will be a nuclear war? And the West will say ok Mr. put it as deep as you like?
My first thought as well
The West will make stunning and brave speeches, Westerners will laugh at North Koreans, and more Ukrainians will die while their country is under even more pressure.
so tired of westerners circle jerking over how weak russia is while they are allowed to chip away at ukraine day by day, enough is enough
Eek. So all the people that were rooting for Russia to win this war and defeat the “Nazis” of Ukraine are going to have to side with North Korea now? That’s going to be a bad look.
And Iran. It's ridiculous that people in North America still support Russia. This is the new Axis of Evil.
To be fair, they will have the odd-job advantage...
Keep that goddamn Odd-Job out of my pistols stack combo.
Fucking spit out my coffee.
"Less mouths to feed." - I’m Kim Jong Un, and I approve this message.
But.. but… the generals who command them have so many medals!
Someone do the Lord Farquar doing the "some of you may die..."
This sounds like it would be a one-way ticket to the battlefield. A country that closed off would never be able to afford disabled soldiers coming back to show and tell everyone about how completely outmatched they were. These guys have been brainwashed to believe they are the ultimate country, and while not everyone believes it, plenty do. Getting this experience outside of the country would be way too eye opening for them to be let back in.
Can you imagine being as sheltered as them and dropped into a modern battlefield? It would be like getting pulled into a sci-fi war
Has pootin not figured out the west is just gonna go as long and hard as needed?
Banking on trump taking office, with how the right has already attempted to block aide for Ukraine, he probably sees the conservative as convenient idiots
Not convenient idiots... useful collaborators. They have agency, they are making choices. They know what we know, and in many cases much more if they have any access to classified data. Some definitely are idiots, but not all of them.
It’s crazy that if Trump takes the White House and pulls support for Ukraine he is now aligning himself politically with Russia and North Korea.
He is already politically aligned with them lol
Russians troops are already cannon fodder, neither NK or Rus care
This, as well as fortune seekers from Somali, Nepal, India, China, etc.
That seems like the plan. North Korea will have fewer mouths to feed and Russia will provide some aid to North Korea so maybe they keep the people who aren't sent off to be slaughtered in Ukraine from starving to death. Why else would Russia and North Korea be meeting? North Korea doesn't have much to offer militarily other than bodies. This is a country that is currently floating shit balloons toward its enemy.
if north Korean troops end up in Ukraine. there's really no more reason to hold back nato from joining the fight. a country from east Asia meddling in a European war is just ripping off the bandaid that is pretending world War 3 hasn't already started
Kim will be giving his troops combat experience. The ones that survive can pass on a lot of knowledge on how to fight and survive against a modern military.
I'm genuinely curious about how they will perform in a real conflict. All I've seen so far is they can march really good and break boards using their testicles.
Then maybe when it comes to hand-to-hand combat the North Korean lads will be unzipping
Something doesn't quite add up. I thought NK soldiers were brainwashed to fight to defend the motherland and not to invade other country except for South Korea. How would Kim sell the idea of fighting for Russia? Wasn't their whole dynasty philosophy to be self sufficient?
You just tell them this is a province of North Korea they've never been to. They have already been trained to believe absurdities.
Isn’t Kim too paranoid about giving up part of his armed forces? If he didn’t think he needs the number he has now, he wouldn’t have the number he has now.
Putin to Kim: "I understand you have a food shortage. I can help you with that..."
I just don't see NK sending soldiers to Ukraine. They know they will get used as meat shields to reduce Russian casualties. They know it's impossible to keep them all contained, like they do with the NK slaves in Russia doing construction, so tons will take the opportunity to desert.
They probably have observers over there now. NK hasn't had any real combat experience since the Korean War, so they probably want to learn and test some things.
Not true. They've sent troops to the middle east, vietnam and african conflicts since the 50s.
It would definitely be a huge surprise if it actually happens but the odd chance Russia makes a deal NK cant refuse it could happen. But they would semi contain them probably, use them like the storm z units probably.
Everyone one but old kim there already knows that
I feel like Kim is banking on it. Free up some of the scarce food supply
More like North Korean troops will become deserters if they get half a chance.
It’ll be somewhat useful if they deploy NK troops. Kim will sustain heavy loses and most likely weasel out of the situation. We also get a chance to see how battle ready NK troops really are, because Russia has proven to be an absolute shit show. NK will surly be worse.
Reminds me of the line from the movie Hunt for Red October: "This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it."
You know it’s a seriously bad decision when the US is encouraging North Korea not to do it.