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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1) I threatened to not attend my brothers wedding and 2) for being petty
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YTA - It’s not a given that if you have someone as a bridesmaid or groomsman or best man that you will the same at theirs.
Of my bridesmaids who got married, I have not been a bridesmaid at any of their weddings. And I’m really good with that.
It’s not an exchange programme.
And my husband’s been a best man at four weddings. Was he supposed to have rotating best men?
Honestly, the older I get, the more I wonder this. I have absolutely no desire to have to do all the activities (and spend money on things) that are included with being in a wedding “party”.
totally agree. when you are in your 20s and 30s you spend so much time going to weddings, being in weddings, spending money for friend's weddings you most likely wont see again, it gets so tiresome after a while and you long for the days your friends stop getting married. I think more people should elope.
Absolutely! Imagine how many couples could start their marriage with healthy bank accounts and peaceful memories if they just said no to the entire wedding industry. But it seems they are all convinced they need to compete with the British royal family and see how much money they can waste and how many people they can offend. Such a waste!
This was exactly my POV when my bro got married. Sis, on the other hand, thought it was just terrible that his weddings was ‘one-sided.’ Our SIL is much younger than us and I told sis she would probably much rather have her younger friends in the wedding party instead of people her parents’ age. Sis didn’t care, and kept browbeating bro about it. The one time he commented that she was b*tching about it yet again. I told him to make her a flower girl since she was acting so childish about it. 🙄
Also frankly being a bridesmaid or MoH is actually a death curse to your wallet and time. I don’t get why the hurt boo boo over this! You’re saving money and time not being at the whim of a bride. Count yourself lucky you just have to attend the function.
Thank you for this - I've been the Maid of Honour in THREE weddings and my goodness, would I give my left arm to just be a guest.
(Also, FWIW, I've been the MOH because I'm super Type A organized and I get shit done... not because any of those brides considered me their closest... and one time was for my sister, and I think it was easier than her choosing out of her close friends, but I didn't hold that against her because she's not dramatic, never would be, and if I had an issue with any single thing, I would tell her).
OP - BE GRATEFUL. You can wear what you want, talk to who you want, eat when you want, drink as much as you want, and most importantly... LEAVE WHEN YOU WANT.
I hate being a bridesmaid so I didn’t have a wedding party when I got married and it was awesome. I had less to worry about and my friends all got to wear their own awesome outfits and have fun instead of spending forever posing for staged photos or standing around waiting for me.
The new wedding culture is one thing that makes me glad I am old. Back in my day (I just had to use that phrase) the bridesmaids usually took the bride out to dinner at a nice restaurant, and that was it. No bachelorette trip. One of bride's relatives was responsible for a (usually in home) shower, and we paid for our dresses. That was it. Now it's like a second job, only one that takes money from you instead of paying you.
Me either, but I know people become entirely too extra about it. We skipped having one to try and cut down on drama and still had people butthurt they weren't asked to be part of the nonexistent wedding party lol
Agreed! I just had one bridesmaid - my best friend. That was it! (I didn't have siblings anyway). I trusted her to choose her own dress in her own colour and my trust was well-placed. No bachelorette parties (not a done thing in my day anyway) - just a nice afternoon tea with simple kitchen-item gifts. Honestly, who needs all the rest of the palaver? It seems to me that weddings are just totally over-the-top these days and a tremendous waste of money.
Exactly!
You don't have to plan an engagement party, bridal shower, or bachelorette- but you can attend and enjoy the benefits of those if you want to. You don't have to buy a dress (that is not really for your body type), shoes, spanx you will never wear again. You don't have to wake up early on a Saturday to get your hair and makeup done and do damage control for a nervous bride. You don't have the pressure of posing for photos.
You get to take your time, arrive when everything's been all set, drink, eat, party, not have to worry about making a speech, and leave whenever you want! Enjoy!
Eh, thats debatable. Not that it's supposed to be a guarantee, but I'm not the type of person that selects groomsman because I'm related to them or something. I only chose those closest to me. And if those closest to me do not consider me close enough to them to stand up with them at the wedding, I'd very much be offendedly reevaluating my friendship with them
Nah, that's not how this works. In a family, there are expectations, it's no use to pretend like they don't matter. It's what keeps us going back to each other even when we're mad at each other. That thing called love and all that. It really depends on how close a family is. Mine is pretty much like glue, and if my sister decided to keep me out for whatever reason, that would have changed our relationship forever.
This is not a friend, it's her brother. I think it's very weird you guys don't think she's allowed to be incredibly sad about what's obviously a very specific exclusion. All the wife's siblings are there, it's not unreasonable of her to be upset
She’s allowed to be sad, it’s just an AH move to refuse to go to the wedding over it.
And it’s nice that your family is so close knit but not every family is your family.
And she’s not been left out, she’s invited. It’s the bride’s family and friends who are bridesmaids, not the groom’s. I would actually think it’s quite odd to have the groom’s family in the bridal party.
They don’t have to be friends just because OP’s brother is marrying her.
She’s being left out of the wedding party because the bride is upset that she didn’t spend her first Mother’s Day at a bridal shower. On top of that, Bride and Bro made up a bullshit reason and didn’t have the guts to tell her the truth.
I agree with you @Aposematicpebble. I would be pretty hurt and upset if I were the OP. No disrespect to the people who think differently, I just see it the way you do, for the same reasons that you gave.
ESH. Your brother should be more respectful of your feelings, but he probably has to manage a lot of demands with his fiances family. So don't be petty, remember it is not *your* wedding, and relax.
He of course could have, but chose not to, which is why I maybe thought and OP weren’t that close. OP specifically mentioned being a bridesmaid though, which is generally up to the bride.
Sure, but OP hasn’t suggested that. She’s just been upset the bride got to pick her own bridesmaids. If the brother wanted OP as someone on his side he should’ve asked 🤷♀️
Maybe. Or maybe there’s a dynamic between OP and her brother that we aren’t seeing the brother’s side of and he doesn’t want OP in the wedding for the given reason, or any other number of possible reasons.
yeah, really the only correct answer to this post is INFO. Is OP distant or rude to their brother? Is their brother especially close to the ILs? Lots of questions would need answering.
I think as OP presents it, OP is NTA, but on the other hand the post is pretty short and idk OP's vibe makes me think there are missing missing reasons for why OP's brother doesn't want them in the wedding party.
Definitely not distant or particularly rude. We have always been pretty close. I would say the only time we weren’t as close was when I went away to college but that changed when came back. Honestly, the post is short because I was writing it while in line to pick up my kids from daycare.
Are you very close friendds with your bro's fiance? Is your husband close friends with your brother? If the answer is no then why would you expect to be a bridesmaid?
>appears that it's not 'his' wedding either.
Don't count him out just yet..... his sister not being asked could very easily be his idea. He may not want his sister in his wedding or he just doesn't care and the bride does or he traded for something he does want. Not everyone wants their siblings in their wedding but also do not want the confrontation from those siblings. He might be hiding behind his bride to avoid an argument with OP.
It’s definitely not her wedding but it seems like she is close or was close with her brother. And his future wife is demanding his sister to be left out (if he would allow her, that is). Because of missing an engagement party? Seems like petty is, petty does for all of them.
Responding to OP's edit:
>The truth- his fiancé is mad at me because I didn’t go to the engagement party. Which was on Mother’s Day.
Who on earth schedules an engagement party on Mother's Day? That's going to be a hugely inconvenient clash for so many people!
Brother's fiancée sounds supremely petty and a drama llama.
Exactly. IMO OP dodged a bullet here not having to be in the wedding. Go be a guest and avoid the drama. Cheer up, maybe you can be in your brother’s next wedding OP and in the meantime you now know where you stand with your brother.
YTA Really? You’re incapable of being there to support and celebrate your sibling because you’re expected to be a guest without a title? Come on! You can be better than that.
Honestly, do you really want to spend all the time and money on all the bridesmaid requirements anyway?
Just go & have fun. You’re not the bride’s bff or family. It would have been nice for her to include you, but it’s hardly tragic that she didn’t.
Shift your focus from yourself to your brother, and enjoy his wedding.
There is no way I would miss my sibling’s wedding over not being in the wedding party. Like you said, why are you unwilling to support your brother over a title?
I missed my sibling’s wedding because I had Covid and it sucked, but only one member of the family was included in the party, and that was by the bride, not my sibling. So immature, if you need a title to support your sibling, you’re not there to support at all.
ESH. The YTA votes are a bit ridiculous. If the BRIDE is having all of her siblings as bridesmaids and groomsmen, then OP's brother, who was the best man at her wedding and godparent to her first child, should have spoken up and ensured OP at least was involved in the wedding party or has a special part. It doesn't look like anything bad happened between the siblings. They also lied because being single has nothing to do with anything and I'm from the same culture as OP. They could have at least kept it real. Now where OP goes wrong is expecting everyone to have the same expectations as she does. It is your brother's wedding and his day. His choice (although I think it's all the bride and if so good luck with that marriage). He is justified in what he wants for his day, as much as you feel hurt and excluded. Maybe your relationship was closer than you thought. He showed his cards on how he feels about your sibling relationship, so run with it.
I would attend the wedding, pay them dust, and not let them get to you. At least you can let loose, have fun, not be expected to take a bunch of photos, not shell out tons of money, and just do you. Make sure your man and you look HAWT! You are there as guests, nothing more! I would also politely decline any duties given from here on out until the wedding day. Bridal party, rehearsal dinner, son as ring carrier, reading Bible passage during the ceremony, additional activities, all would be a NO from me. Keep it cool, calm, collected, and maintain your distance for your peace. Your emotions are justified and you are allowed to feel hurt. How you continue forward is what matters as you want to enforce boundaries, but don't want to look like the bad person. Your brother should also know that he can't run to you with any issues anymore, that door is closed. Don't get your parents involved anymore. If they bring it up divert or close the conversation. As adults, it's between your brother and you and that is it. It's mind-boggling how family members get to be complete trash toward other family members and it is okay. At least he can't run back to you when issues happen because the relationship already sounds completely unbalanced and unstable. Do you and take people for what they show you to be!
I mean what if OP isn’t close with future SIL at all though? She hasn’t mentioned even being close with her brother, only that he was in her wedding. Her brother and FSIL could hang out with her siblings all the time and be really close.
We don’t know this if this is the case or not, but I do find it odd OP never mentioned what type of relationship she has with either of them. That matters.
It 100% matters, but if you are my husband's best man and godfather to my child, then that relationship is very close. OP also hinted that her brother's partner's siblings whom he has known for less than a year are in the wedding party as groomsmen. I honestly think the fiance is controlling things and that the brother has no backbone.
The whole point of me saying he was best man and godfather was to show (rather than just say) how close we are. Thank you for being the only one to pick up on that.
Given the update, NTA. Your future SIL is being ridiculously petty and holding a grudge. I feel sorry for your brother. Going forwards, you need to support him because she sounds like a bucket of fun /s
I would go to the wedding as a normal guest and address your hurt with your brother at a different date.
Yes, you are not owed a place in the wedding party, but the fact that she's packing your brother's groomsmen with her own brothers does send a message. I doubt your brother has much call here either way, unless he happens to be good friends with his fiancee's brothers.
Cut any contributions you intended to give for the wedding to that of a standard guest, wash your hands of needing to help out or clean up, and go enjoy a party.
Explain to him after the wedding that you were wondering if something has happened, as you thought the two of you were close. Hear him out and then let it go. Being hurt is reasonable, choosing not to go is an escalation.
If your brother’s fiancée is controlling things, don’t turn that into a rift with your brother over this. You can express your hurt without refusing to support him.
OP after reading the update, I would honestly just tell my brother “Okay, thank you for being honest. I respect your stance on your fiance's decision. I will support your wedding from a distance, as a guest”. Decline any and every future change/invite, keep clear of SIL, and always just remain cordial in front of her. They should have not scheduled an Engagement Party on Mother's Day, SIL should have spoken up if she felt a way, and your brother should have put his foot down through SIL's exclusionary practices. Your brother is in for a rude awakening with her and her family and all you can say is “Not my monkeys, not my zoo”. Again, don't let them run to you for anything in the present or future. They both can kick rocks. One has no spine and the other is childish = the perfect future wedding and overall marriage.
I originally said YTA, because I didn't read your post carefully enough, I'm sorry.
NTA. While I don't think anyone is entitled to be in a wedding party, it is indeed weird that they included all siblings except you.
Okay cmon. This is not a crazy demand. It’s normal
To be upset if your close sibling didn’t ask
You to be in the wedding. She’s allowed to be upset. And maybe her and SIL are close?? They are basically family now?? You think this so black and white and it’s not.
You're absolutely right, I didn't read this carefully enough. I take it back and I'm sorry for not taking the time to read the post properly. I'll see if I can edit it.
I can definitely understand why she is upset. Not being in my sibling's wedding party would really hurt my feelings. BUT, I would still go to the wedding. Two hurts don't heal relationships.
They didn’t though, they included all of the brides siblings. The groom included none of his family. And typically a bride picks her bridal party and a groom picks the groomsmen. Now maybe he should of asked to include his sister or had her be a grooms woman or best lady if that was the case.
That's what would bother me, too. The bride having all of her siblings in the wedding party, but the OP as the sister of the groom not being included in the wedding party, will look weird, and either way, it will not go unnoticed by the other guests. I could see it being awkward and humiliating for the OP if she attends the wedding. Guests will notice that she's not in the wedding party and will talk about it. She will look like a jerk if she doesn't attend, and guests will talk about that too. She's in a lose-lose situation. And in the second scenario, I'm sure the bride would be more than happy to tell the guests that the OP didn't attend because she was home pouting about not being in the wedding party.
In my opinion, Mother's Day is an odd day to pick for an engagement party.
I hear you about the exchange program, and while I partially agree, I think there’s more here. 1) my brother is close with my nuclear family (husband and kids) and I think everyone expects that I’d be part of it because of our relationship. 2) why is he lying when asked about it? If it’s about the bride’s choice, then say that. Don’t say I would but you’re married. The lie is more offensive than the act.
Saw your edit. I feel like people vote on these things in a vacuum or something. Of course you should be incredibly hurt by him excluding you from the wedding party. It’s petty and disrespectful. And your soon to be SIL is a piece of work for scheduling an engagement party on. Mother’s Day! How uncouth? Honestly, it sounds like neither of them have any etiquette. You should be the bigger person and attend, to support your brother, especially because he might need you for the impending divorce.
100% understand what you’re going through. Similar thing happened to me when my brother got married except he also included our siblings. I was the only one left out. I never did get a straight answer as to why, but I suspect it was bc I didn’t offer to pay for the reception. He wanted to have it at my house, to which I said yes, but when he met w vendors and the topic of cost came up he remained silent and looked at me. They also expected me to do all the bridesmaid’s tasks, including throwing (and paying for ) the shower and bachelorette! Unfortunately for him I have a spine and noped outta all that. All comments saying ur the ahole and they can have whomever they want, yes that’s true. But you can also make your own choices about how much you’ll be interacting with them going forward. Good luck.
NTA. Of course you dont have to attend - but I would avoid being much more Drama than quietly skipping. Your hurt feelings are valid, but ultimately it's their choice who's in the wedding party and they don't deserve to hear a ton of grief about it.
NTA.
I’ve noticed a lot of ppl r demonizing you for having feelings about not being treated equally or not being appreciative of not being in the wedding party or assuming you have done something terrible to the brother and fiancée.
Based on what you’ve said in comments and OG post, I think the fiancee is the AH for deliberately trying to exclude your family, lying, and getting so personally offended by you choosing your children over her.
NTAH!!! And that bridesmaid being single, doesn't float anymore. It's their wedding, absolutely! It's not their decision, it's her, the brides decision. Your brother can't stand up to his new bride. And yes, you are totally being excluded. This is just your new placement in her family setting. You aren't important to her. But she will expect things from you. If you don't go, it will be held against you, from now until the end of time. Choose carefully. I'd go, but I wouldn't do anything else, or contribute a dime for anything. Plus I'd give them a Dollar Tree toaster too. But I'm getting really petty in my old age too.
It never did! It was a maid of honor or a matron of honor, etc. depending on the marital status of the woman supporting the wedding. If the sibling relationship is important then the brother should have his sister as part of the wedding party. If not, then OP knows where she stands in her sibling’s eyes. ESH, but it seems to me that OP’s feelings are going to affect her relationship going forward and brother will have no one but himself to blame.
I'm curious: Is anyone from your family included in the wedding, or is it all about the bride and HER family? If that's the case, I think that that is setting precedent for the future as far as family gatherings go. Your family will always be second to hers.
No one else from my family has been asked to be part of the wedding. There’s rumors that my kids will be asked to be flower girl/ring boy but neither of them said anything about it directly. My mom also said something that my brother is inviting 10-15 people whereas his fiancé is inviting 40. The whole thing seems so off to me and, frankly, it’s not like my brother to not put his family first.
>My mom also said something that my brother is inviting 10-15 people whereas his fiancé is inviting 40. The whole thing seems so off to me and, frankly, it’s not like my brother to not put his family first.
Who is paying for this wedding? If it is her parents then money could have been offered with conditions and those could include guest list and siblings being included. Usually the side paying has more guests.
Could she be trying to isolate him from you and the family? Probably out of left field... but does she seem controlling? Maybe I am reading into something that is not there.
I would go to the wedding. If she is trying to isolate him you don't want to help her. Keep up your relationship so if he ever needs help he knows he has you.
It sounds like she is, especially with your update (that she scheduled the engagement party for Mother’s Day, and is annoyed because you didn’t cede the day to her). Who schedules their (non-mother-centric) event for Mother’s Day unless they’re trying to be territorial? And your brother should be able to determine his own supporters for his wedding. She sounds controlling.
For me NTA
Saw your update!
So your brother has no say on his own wedding to include his side of the family? He can’t include you or your husband as his groomsman or grooms woman? Brutal! Have you talked to your brother how worrisome and how this is a red flag for his future? 🚩🚩🚩She is putting distance between him and his family over an engagement party… you have 2 kiddos and it was your first Mother’s Day.
Who even schedules an engagement party on Mother’s Day?
I would go to the wedding Op… simply to be there for my brother. It sounds like he may need your support down the line. Don’t let her put a further wedge between you two. I mean that’s just my opinion. And I would definitely chat with him so he can grow a spine and open his eyes. The fact that she is holding a grudge against his family member over this and not letting him choose what he wants for his wedding is nuts, and him letting her do it is beyond me.
Best wishes Op and good luck to your brother.
I'd not go he is showing that his partners family means more to him then his family. Full bridal and groom party of her family that's so dam stupid. Does he not have a single friend who he would rather have up there instead of all her brothers??? Like she must have his balls in a dam vice grip or he is spineless.
Even if it's true, you claim that you're close to your brother. Is it your intention to abandon him in the light of evidence that you believe his future wife is trying to isolate him? You believe that she wants to cut his ties with you, and you're actively helping her by refusing to even attend the wedding?
I know it feels like a snub but not attending could ruin your relationship with your brother. Tell him you're disappointed but find out if there's some other way that you can support on the day. It feels so extreme to not even go.
NTA
She's a "ITS NOT OUR WEDDING IT'S MY WEDDING" bride and he's just rolling over for her. Tbh you should probably say goodbye to him. She's gonna put up a wall between the two of you asap. She'll probably even dupe him into building it for her.
If you think that might be the case, it's all the more reason to attend the wedding. If you don't, she will most likely hold it against you, and use it to drive a wedge between you and your brother. I think it's sad that no one is standing up for your brother at his wedding. I understand you're hurt, but if you care about your brother, then you should consider attending, albeit as a regular guest.
Nta especially with that edit.
So fucking weird how people on here are so "it's not your responsibility" in regards to anything family related but when you've decided to not be the only one excluded, over a fucking engagement party you're a prick 😂
YTA. They can pick whoever they want for their bridal party for any reason. The whole “married” thing is probably just an excuse.
Are you really close with your future SIL? If not, then that’s why, and you need to move on. Their wedding isn’t about you. If you are super close with her, then talk to her about it.
Maybe its possible OP thought they were close to their own brother? They can pick whoever they want for the bridal party, and OP can chose not to attend.
If all of the SIL's siblings are included, and OP's brother's siblings are excluded, OP is drawing a reasonable conclusion that their brother doesn't value them very much and it is a reasonable thing to be upset about.
THIS. I can't believe all the Y-T-A bc why would she want to go to a party to celebrate someone who is mad at her and the person who is enabling the bs reason why??? If she is not wanted, and she can sense that, why is everyone mad at her in this comment section???
INFO are you close to your brother? Like in recent years have you been on good terms and helping each other out/talking etc? Is your brother especially close to the in-laws? Does your brother have anyone that is his family/friend etc in the wedding party? How close is your brother to those people?
Siblings aren't guaranteed a spot at the wedding party, but not being invited can indicate a lack of closeness (which may or may not be a point of conflict, and may be the result of one sibling being an asshole to the other). I think the only way to know if your the AH is the have a fuller picture of the social situation.
Yes-brother and I are pretty close. I often host small holidays and events and have him and his fiancé over. We have sibling spats but definitely nothing that would result in us not being as close. My brother hangs out often at the in-laws but I’m not there so I can’t speak to their closeness. My brother and I have always been honest with each other and this situation is very offensive. My understanding is that all the groomsmen are her family members.
Its not great that all of the bridesmaids and groomsmen are the bride's family, and there is no one in the wedding party to support the groom.
I don't want to overstate anything b/c I'm just a stranger reading this second hand. But if there is no special role for any one your brothers side (parents, family, friends) at all I would be concerned about your brother being intentionally isolated. But it is also possible that its "only" your brother being too lazy to be involved in wedding planning and SIL focusing on the relationships closest to her instead of deliberately excluding you. I put "only" in quotation marks because I think that is a reasonable thing to be upset about.
If you really do have a close relationship I really get why you are upset, but beyond that I think its a little beyond my pay grade TBH. Not going to the wedding is a big deal. But so is not including people you are close to in your wedding. Communicating with your feelings to your brother is important, but at what point are you acting entitled to the wedding party, which siblings aren't entitled to, and also what would be the point of guilting your brother into that. But it is also an AH thing to nurse a hurt instead of addressing. So really IDK. I know you chose to come to reddit for advice but this really feels like something you have to figure out with people IRL, like discussing with your mom, husband, friends etc to decide how to respond and if/how to talk to your brother about this.
Thanks. This is helpful. I’ll talk to my brother alone hopefully soon and get some clarity. My guess is he’s just doing whatever his fiance told him but you’re right, it might be something deeper that I’m not seeing. Thanks for even bringing that up.
For what its worth, the amount of downvotes on my comments on this thread suggest that I am totally out of whack with American wedding norms and expectations so take my speculation with an extra grain of salt
American here, no, I agree with what you have said above. If the roles/sexes were reversed, people would be livid and screaming that some sort of abuse was happening. It would be very clear if the entire wedding parties were made up of the grooms family, and he wasn't allowing any bride's family to join. So many on this sub seem to give women passes they wouldn't give men. (This is coming from a woman)
YTA. Quit being such a drama llama. Their wedding is not about you, it's about them. The only person being rude here, is you.
Traditionally, the bridesmaid were all unmarried, eligible young woman, usually relatives or close friends of the bride. Ditto with the groomsmen. Back when humanity was spread out and communication was difficult, a wedding was a way to meet potential spouses. It may be archaic, but if they want to follow that tradition, that is their choice...not yours.
You wanna stay home and raise a stink over it, fine, do it then. But all you're going to look like is a petty, immature AH who didn't their way and wasn't included in the wedding party.
Honestly, if this is your typical behavior, I can see why didn't choose you.
>Traditionally, the bridesmaid were all unmarried, eligible young woman, usually relatives or close friends of the bride. Ditto with the groomsmen. Back when humanity was spread out and communication was difficult, a wedding was a way to meet potential spouses. It may be archaic, but if they want to follow that tradition, that is their choice...not yours.
But now is not the past. This rule is just so pointless and trivial. Like lots of old-timey traditions are outdated and sexist etc etc but they have emotional or other significance. But the idea that we must run weddings in 2023 to accommodate dating patterns of idk the 1850s is just stupid. Its just cargo-culting the past. If the couple choose to follow that "rule" it is an active choice they are making, they can't hide behind tradition, its just an arbitrary choice that they made.
Like its not about conservative morals, its not about a traditional wedding. I mean how many people are seriously like "its my dream wedding, I'm wearing a gorgeous white dress, my dad is walking me down the aisle and also all the bridesmaids and groomsmen are single, that last thing is also important to my vision of the wedding for some reason"
But the concept of the wedding itself is all nonsensical clinging to pointless old rules and traditions. The altar, the walking down the aisle, the white dress, the concept of a bridal party, the bouquet, the veil, it's all equally as absurd as the bridesmaids-must-be-single thing.
Someone wanting single people as a bridesmaids so, for example, they can party hard until the wedding makes more sense than a lot of other stuff.
I always saw it as passing through the ranks of a club, in a way. The night before you marry, you have one last “sleepover” with your friends, as a single person without obligations to a husband or children at home, then you get married and pass into a different place in life, where you *do* have those obligations to get home to (and that’s wonderful and fun, too).
NTA every other sibling is in the bridal party just not you! I dont blame you for not going, your future SIL sounds like a nightmare and your brother a spineless jellyfish
You, your husband & you little ones should go somewhere fantastic on their wedding day and make better memories
NTA. Interesting that your brother doesn't have any say in his own wedding. Your future SIL sounds like a charmer. Having an engagement party on Mother's Day is poor planning. Then being upset that you, as a new mom, didn't feel like attending because of your own circumstances and holding that against you is petty. I wouldn't go either. Edit: While I agree that you have no right to demand to be in the wedding party, it seems that the reason is a spiteful one.
After the update, it's not really about being a bridesmaid.
Your brother is about to marry a woman who thinks that it is okay to cut off his family over a perceived slight. Why have an engagement party on a day that most people celebrate something else, especially first time mothers? If she ever becomes a mother, she'd probably throw a hissy fit about not being able to celebrate her special day.
Your brother should think long and hard about marriage to this immature girl.
Be grateful!! You get to wear an awesome dress in whatever colour you want, you and your husband get to party and enjoy the night without having any duties, why on earth would you want to be in the wedding party?
I don’t understand all the YTA’s? I think ESH for threatening not to go, but also do people in this thread not have siblings they are close to? If I had my sister in my wedding but I wasn’t in hers, I would be upset
Considering the update, I would 100% go and congratulate your brother… and barely acknowledge your incredibly lame FSIL
No judgment but really implore you to not stoop to the same level of petty. It’ll only alienate your brother over time.
Everyone seems to be excusing her future SIL for being petty. Yes it’s their wedding but the only reason OP isn’t a bridesmaid is because she couldn’t attend the engagement party, which means if she had attended she would’ve been in the bridal party. That’s very petty on future SIL’s part.
OP, your brother is in an impossible situation here. He’s getting push back from not only you but your grandma and who knows how many other family members which I’m sure is weighing on him. I would be really upset as well but would suck it up for my brother and go to the wedding and support him. You might end up regretting not going in the future. You don’t have to be best friends with SIL just be cordial for your brother’s sake. NTA
Brother is not in an impossible situation. He just needs to reach between his legs and confirm he still has some balls. Then use those balls to push back on his SO.
Their position seems a bit weird to me personally, but they seem to have a rationale behind it. At the end of the day, I think just focus on them having the best day possible, the way they envisioned it. I get that you might feel hurt, however making a big deal out of it to the point of not attending, I'd say makes YTA.
Well, I think your brother is going to be whipped. He could have asked for the two (you and your husband) of you to be in his wedding. Not so much of a big deal to me.
So I'm gonna say you're NTA.
NTA… but future SIL is. Yikes. That said, go to the damn wedding anyway to show support for your brother. You don’t have to like SIL, you just have to tolerate her if you want any sort of relationship with your brother. Go and be grateful that you don’t need to pay out for a million stupid things acting as a bridesmaid.
INFO Why doesn't your brother want your husband to be a groomsman? He should at least have a say in that part.
They don't owe you the positions, but if you found out they are lying to you about it because they are pissy about the engagement party, which they chose to have on another holiday, I might be upset about the deceit and possibly not really want to deal with people so petty.
It's the only time they get married and they can't stop being petty for one day?
NTA! Who the hell schedules an engagement party for Mother’s Day? Very uncouth and not proper etiquette 😬.
It’s a massive red flag that she’s isolating your brother literally from your entire family (it is beyond weird that the whole wedding party is her family, like beyond weird). I guarantee she’s going to put a wedge in between your brother and his family, you included.
Your brother lacks balls and a spine. The fact that he doesn’t see ANY of the red flags with this woman is disturbing. There’s MANY red flags here.
NTA. Your feelings are valid. It’s ok to be upset that your brother didn’t have a say on this. Especially if you’re his only sister.
But I think you should go to his wedding. Be the better person. Show up for your brother. I’m sure one day he will appreciate that you were there.
NTA - I am so surprised by all the Y-T-A, I can only imagine that people did not read your text closely. Your not upset because you aren't in the bridal party, your upset because you were the ONLY sibling left out, you have a close relationship with your brother, and they lied to you about why.
With your update it is even more--bride is being super petty.
edit to add: also, it IS normal for the bride to ask her SIL even if they aren't super close. And it sounds like she was planning on it until the engagement party thing, which is so immature on her part. It's like she wants your brother to see you as a villain.
NTA and that’s even before the edit. I don’t understand all the YTA comments. ALL of her siblings are in the wedding but not you? That’s ridiculous. And then with the edit, who has an engagement party on Mothers Day? It seems like she set it up that way knowing you wouldn’t want to attend on your FIRST Mothers Day. I wouldn’t doubt that the fiancé didn’t already have something against OP before the engagement party.
YTA - it's not your wedding, it's not your day, it's not about you at all. Stop making it about you!
Positions in wedding parties aren't a reciprocal affair and everyone has a different idea what the wedding party should be.
If you don't want to go to the wedding, don't. But just know that it's because of something you literally made up for yourself to be upset over.
NTA. I am sorry Op, your brother chose a sweetheart /s.
I understand your disappointment, and I think your future sil is overreacting, and your brother left his spine in a drawer, but if you don't go, you will be further estranged by your brother.
Nah after you explained she has an attitude cause you didn't attend an event on mother's day as you were a first time mom is ridiculous. Homegirl is childish and I wouldn't go to a wedding with someone who has an attitude that I spent mother's day celebrating myself. While your brother may be upset which is understandable you shouldn't have to be uncomfortable. Think about it so more and weigh the options.
ESH. They can have who they want in their wedding. Is it odd that EVERYONE in the wedding party is on the bride's side? YES. Why doesn't the groom get to choose people?
Whatever, not your circus. If he can't speak up for himself, that's HIS choice, his wedding (or his bride's, whatever, he CHOSE HER).
It's childish to threaten not to go though. Be there for him now, & in the future when this marriage eventually implodes (sorry, lol, couldn't resist).
Look, I'm going ESH- best man suggests you are close, and if brides siblings are also standing for husband, yeah its gonna look off that his family isn't, as well, which is putting you in a weird spot, optically
That said, it's their wedding and you're overstepping. Brother obviously agrees with bride enough he's not putting his neck out for you. In short, you aren't as close as you thought you were. I agree the unmarried excuse is stupid and rarely used. Just do with this info as you see fit. Day of the wedding, you are just guests. Do absolutely nothing extra. No additional events for the wedding, no rehearsal dinners, ect. Do not stay and help clean up, just leave when you want to leave. No wedding related favors, and bare minimum of what's expected for a gift. Just don't go breaking you back to help out brother and make sure wedding duties are left to the wedding party
NAH You are understandably hurt that you were overlooked by your brother and his fiancé. It’s their wedding, so if they get to choose attendants. Hold your head up and go to the wedding. Not being a bridesmaid just saved you lots of $$. Just choose a gift for them and let it go. Life is short.
NTA. It seems that their marriage is starting off with how it's going to go. She's obviously in control and will be for the future.
I would go but take your brother aside and tell him that you love him and he can always come to you if things go awry. Tell him that if she's going to be petty because of an engagement party then you'll so be it but he needs to carefully think if this is the right relationship for him but you'll support him from a distance.
Enjoy the day as a guest, where you have no responsibility. This is unlikely to end we'll, it just might be later rather than sooner.
I'm going for NTA. Of cause you'd be sad being left out. I think everyone would. Even the ones here who call you an AH if they'd be honest to themselves. Quite sure some who'll attend the wedding will wonder about it and question why that is. I wouldn't want that kind of negativity either. I understand fully if you don't go!
Your brother needs to grow a spine and put his foot down. It is HIS wedding too, not just the bride, and if he wants his family standing with him he needs to stand up and say something instead of going along with her and then lying to you about why.
NTA
YTA. It isn't rude or disrespectful for an engaged couple to decide who they want in their wedding party. From your post, it doesn't sound like you and your brother's fiancée are close; you weren't even aware that she was annoyed with you (I don't think she should have been annoyed re you missing the engagement party, but the fact that you didn't even realise she was missed suggests this isn't a close relationship).
You don't talk about feeling disappointed not to be involved or upset; simply peeved at a perceived slight. You don't even express any concern re he and his fiancée apparently disagreeing on the wedding party. So this sounds like it's more about your ego than caring about your brother.
A wedding isn't a summons and you don't have to go, however, your reasons do make you the AH in my view. If your brother is in a difficult position where he and his fiancée don't agree on things like the wedding party, support him instead of making this harder. Check he's happy, check he isn't being steamrolled. Don't start huffing.
NTA- based on the edit, while she can have whoever she wants in her bridal party, she's doing it for pretty spiteful reasons.
She expected you to skip your first ever Mother's Day for an engagement party? I'm as childfree as it gets, but that seems ridiculous.
Well even before the update NTA.
After the update what a selfish raging bitch she is. That is going to be a short marriage, poor guy is going to be hating life and she will probably cheat in a couple years or less. Depends on how badly she feels she settled for your brother.
Yes I'm being rude and hope none of that happens to your bro, but damn what a jerk she if. Ask your brother if he is sure she is ok to marry if she is going to treat his family like that. She doesn't sound like a nice person.
Although the reason why you weren’t asked to be a bridesmaid sucks, it’s not as an obvious slight as your non-attendance at the wedding would be, it will be easier to portray you as the villain in this story. He will always be your brother, maybe think about going to support him. Being a bridesmaid is expensive and time consuming, being a carefree family wedding guest is much more fun.
NTA. If you host a party on a holiday, you can’t be pissed people are celebrating the holiday by doing their own thing. She planned something on Mother’s Day and then get pissed when a new mom wants to celebrate Mother’s Day, she’s TA.
ESH - you because of the “not attending the wedding” comment, your brother for lying, and your future SIL for being mad over something so incredibly petty.
I have dreaded every wedding I have had to be part of the wedding party (well... except my role as groom). I would be super psyched to being "excluded" and have tried to dodge it every time I can.
Much better to just be a guest and eat their food, drink their wine, and not have to deal with the hassle and time (photos take forever).
ESH
Not going to the wedding is a step too far. Being the bigger person and going to the wedding would look better of course. Then when they divorce in a couple years bc the bride’s control issues become to unbearable, you can talk shit to your brother and make him feel bad for not including you in the wedding.
I think there are multiple issues at play here.
The first: what is your husband’s relationship with your brother? You said your brother way your best man- why? Was it because they genuinely have that close of a relationship, or did your husband ask your brother to be his best man because he felt like it was the right thing to do? If that’s the case, is it possible that your brother has a closer relationship with the men that he asked to stand up with him?
In the same vein: what’s your relationship with your future SIL? Are you close? Look, I love my husbands sisters- they’re both great women. But the relationship I have with them is not the same as the one I have with my sister and my closest friends, so I didn’t ask them to be bridesmaids, and they were both very understanding of that decision. You aren’t entitled to a role in someone else’s special day.
Is their reasoning for not including you weird? Absolutely. Matrons of Honor have long been a thing, single people aren’t the default for bridal parties. But it kind of sounds like they don’t feel the same way about the relationship they have with you as you do with them, or they don’t feel the same familial obligation that you did when you selected your bridal party, and they were grasping at excuses so they didn’t have to straight up tell you that. It’s fine for you to prioritize family. It’s also fine for them to prioritize their close relationships.
NTA.
Reading your update makes your SIL a petty person. She looks like the type who also loves drama. Also, why are all of her siblings bridesmaids and groomsmen while none of your brother's family are. You mentioned that being "single' was just a lie.
Soft YTA - because the last thing I would ever want to do is be in another wedding. But match some petty. Give them 40 bucks, drink to your hearts content, be the last one on the dance floor, wear something loud and if they say anything about it, say it is because you are married. Match energy gleefully.
As a mom of 2 myself… I’d be happy to not be in the wedding. That shit is exhausting and takes up so much of your time! It’s time to just attend weddings and relax vs being in them!
ESH
I am also surprised about the many YTAs. You FSIL acts childish and punishs you for not attending your engagement party. They did lie to you instead of communicating open to you.
But no reason to not attend their wedding because of this. Although I understand that you feel hurt of their behaviour.
Sad, but yeah, don’t go and keep your distance. Sounds very petty not to have you there for a weird reason and with you having a reasonable explanation to boot. And they even lied about it. Enjoy time with people that care and who you can care about. NTA.
NTA- Who the heck plans a Engagement Party on Mother's Day?? Anyway- Go to the Wedding as guests, that way zero pressure on you to do anything! Get a beautiful dress and have hubby dress up spiffy! Treat it like a "Date Night!" Dinner & Dancing! You'll still have to sit through the ceremony, but at least you won't have to stress! If they come back to you with some request to do something for the Wedding ( help set up/ read a psalm/ hand out the flowers-- whatever, politely DECLINE. You are a Guest, no duties for you. OP, yes it's a bit sad that you don't get to stand up for your Brother on this milestone of His, but KNOW that now You are no longer required to be the Rock for him. SHE WILL HAVE TO BE. So do yourself up and you and Hubby have a Night OUT! Enjoy! SIL to be has shown who she really is, least you know now at the start. Oh, and DO NOT let your Parents pressure you into doing ANYTHING!
I think in this case, it's reasonable to have hurt feelings since it seems like FSIL is doing it out of spite. In many cases asking someone to be a bridesmaid is an honor and FSIL is being petty about it. I'd go and have a good time wearing something fabulous.
NTA, the wedding is for a celebration of the bride AND groom. The bride not allowing the groom to choose people to represent them in their wedding party is major a red flag. And it’s hard to participate in something that you don’t support.
I'm honestly surprised by the consensus, but it seems like you're choosing not to go because of WHY you weren't chosen as a wedding party member.
For example, if you were just angry about being excluded, that's one thing, but IMO, if you could tell it was bullshit and felt bad vibes from them, I wouldn't be comfortable going either.
They lied to you. She's being a petty baby because you were busy being a mother. So you're not allowed to be petty back? Nah. NTA
Also, your brother should've stood up for you or had your back in the first place. If he won't do that, you're not a bad person for not going.
Dude, you are not the asshole. If your family and future family can not think of family feelings and only think on their side of the family, and all of that because of pettiness? Who is she? Kim Jong un? If people don't act the way she wants, they are out of having a role in their brothers wedding? She sounds like a big controlling bit*h and I would give them 15 years until he gets sick of her taking control of everything and divorcing
Surely it is her choice who she has as a bridesmaid? Traditionally bridesmaids are from the woman’s side of the family/friends, not the man’s. If she doesn’t want you as a bridesmaid, as much as you may not agree, she is entitled to make that decision.
INFO:
What culture are you? Are you a different culture to the bride? Traditionally the bride and bridesmaids would be unmarried, and the best man would also be single (and usually the grooms brother) as his role was to step in and marry the bride if the groom was a no-show. Obviously not many people continue that tradition, but there’s still plenty of archaic traditions involved in weddings (father giving away the bride to the husband for example)
Ultimately you can’t declare yourself a bridesmaid, that’s entirely up to the bride, and it’s not unusual for a bride to prefer to have her own sisters or close friends as bridesmaids, rather than in-laws she doesn’t know very well.
As for your husband and the ushers, how well does your husband know your brother? Of they’re not that close I would just expect him to be a guest rather than an usher.
At the end of the day you can’t force the bride to pick you and your husband to be in the bridal party, it’s not your wedding so you get no say. Refusing to attend because if this makes you look incredibly petty and will damage your relationship with the family going forward.
YTA - you ask someone to be in your wedding party because you want them in your wedding party, not beside you expect something out of it. Your petty and selfish behaviour speaks volumes. Maybe this is why no one wants you to stand up for them. Stop making your bother’s wedding all about YOU.
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YTA - It’s not a given that if you have someone as a bridesmaid or groomsman or best man that you will the same at theirs. Of my bridesmaids who got married, I have not been a bridesmaid at any of their weddings. And I’m really good with that. It’s not an exchange programme. And my husband’s been a best man at four weddings. Was he supposed to have rotating best men?
“It’s not an exchange program.” LOL. Perfect.
[удалено]
Honestly, the older I get, the more I wonder this. I have absolutely no desire to have to do all the activities (and spend money on things) that are included with being in a wedding “party”.
totally agree. when you are in your 20s and 30s you spend so much time going to weddings, being in weddings, spending money for friend's weddings you most likely wont see again, it gets so tiresome after a while and you long for the days your friends stop getting married. I think more people should elope.
Absolutely! Imagine how many couples could start their marriage with healthy bank accounts and peaceful memories if they just said no to the entire wedding industry. But it seems they are all convinced they need to compete with the British royal family and see how much money they can waste and how many people they can offend. Such a waste!
The older I get, the less I even want to GO to a wedding. Lol
This was exactly my POV when my bro got married. Sis, on the other hand, thought it was just terrible that his weddings was ‘one-sided.’ Our SIL is much younger than us and I told sis she would probably much rather have her younger friends in the wedding party instead of people her parents’ age. Sis didn’t care, and kept browbeating bro about it. The one time he commented that she was b*tching about it yet again. I told him to make her a flower girl since she was acting so childish about it. 🙄
Also frankly being a bridesmaid or MoH is actually a death curse to your wallet and time. I don’t get why the hurt boo boo over this! You’re saving money and time not being at the whim of a bride. Count yourself lucky you just have to attend the function.
Seriously. I pride myself on being close enough to be invited to the bachelorette party, but not so close I'm in the wedding :p
I love this. If you're afraid I'll feel excluded if you don't ask me to be in your wedding party, don't. Please exclude me! I'm begging you.
I'm so happy to inform you that I've never been a bridesmaid or MoH!
Thank you for this - I've been the Maid of Honour in THREE weddings and my goodness, would I give my left arm to just be a guest. (Also, FWIW, I've been the MOH because I'm super Type A organized and I get shit done... not because any of those brides considered me their closest... and one time was for my sister, and I think it was easier than her choosing out of her close friends, but I didn't hold that against her because she's not dramatic, never would be, and if I had an issue with any single thing, I would tell her). OP - BE GRATEFUL. You can wear what you want, talk to who you want, eat when you want, drink as much as you want, and most importantly... LEAVE WHEN YOU WANT.
I hate being a bridesmaid so I didn’t have a wedding party when I got married and it was awesome. I had less to worry about and my friends all got to wear their own awesome outfits and have fun instead of spending forever posing for staged photos or standing around waiting for me.
The new wedding culture is one thing that makes me glad I am old. Back in my day (I just had to use that phrase) the bridesmaids usually took the bride out to dinner at a nice restaurant, and that was it. No bachelorette trip. One of bride's relatives was responsible for a (usually in home) shower, and we paid for our dresses. That was it. Now it's like a second job, only one that takes money from you instead of paying you.
Me either, but I know people become entirely too extra about it. We skipped having one to try and cut down on drama and still had people butthurt they weren't asked to be part of the nonexistent wedding party lol
Agreed! I just had one bridesmaid - my best friend. That was it! (I didn't have siblings anyway). I trusted her to choose her own dress in her own colour and my trust was well-placed. No bachelorette parties (not a done thing in my day anyway) - just a nice afternoon tea with simple kitchen-item gifts. Honestly, who needs all the rest of the palaver? It seems to me that weddings are just totally over-the-top these days and a tremendous waste of money.
Exactly! You don't have to plan an engagement party, bridal shower, or bachelorette- but you can attend and enjoy the benefits of those if you want to. You don't have to buy a dress (that is not really for your body type), shoes, spanx you will never wear again. You don't have to wake up early on a Saturday to get your hair and makeup done and do damage control for a nervous bride. You don't have the pressure of posing for photos. You get to take your time, arrive when everything's been all set, drink, eat, party, not have to worry about making a speech, and leave whenever you want! Enjoy!
Being a bridesmaid was a death blow to our friendship of 15 years.
Seriously!! I'd rather be just a guest any day.
Read the update.
Eh, thats debatable. Not that it's supposed to be a guarantee, but I'm not the type of person that selects groomsman because I'm related to them or something. I only chose those closest to me. And if those closest to me do not consider me close enough to them to stand up with them at the wedding, I'd very much be offendedly reevaluating my friendship with them
Nah, that's not how this works. In a family, there are expectations, it's no use to pretend like they don't matter. It's what keeps us going back to each other even when we're mad at each other. That thing called love and all that. It really depends on how close a family is. Mine is pretty much like glue, and if my sister decided to keep me out for whatever reason, that would have changed our relationship forever. This is not a friend, it's her brother. I think it's very weird you guys don't think she's allowed to be incredibly sad about what's obviously a very specific exclusion. All the wife's siblings are there, it's not unreasonable of her to be upset
She’s allowed to be sad, it’s just an AH move to refuse to go to the wedding over it. And it’s nice that your family is so close knit but not every family is your family. And she’s not been left out, she’s invited. It’s the bride’s family and friends who are bridesmaids, not the groom’s. I would actually think it’s quite odd to have the groom’s family in the bridal party. They don’t have to be friends just because OP’s brother is marrying her.
She’s being left out of the wedding party because the bride is upset that she didn’t spend her first Mother’s Day at a bridal shower. On top of that, Bride and Bro made up a bullshit reason and didn’t have the guts to tell her the truth.
Totally agree. Reddit is full of AHs, but OP isn’t one of them.
I agree with you @Aposematicpebble. I would be pretty hurt and upset if I were the OP. No disrespect to the people who think differently, I just see it the way you do, for the same reasons that you gave.
ESH. Your brother should be more respectful of your feelings, but he probably has to manage a lot of demands with his fiances family. So don't be petty, remember it is not *your* wedding, and relax.
While I more or less agree with you it's appears that it's not 'his' wedding either. Is this a it's all about me as a bride thing?
Doesn’t the bride get to decide who her bridesmaids are though?
The groom (the OPs brother) could have a female attendant on his side. This is not a gender restriction.
He of course could have, but chose not to, which is why I maybe thought and OP weren’t that close. OP specifically mentioned being a bridesmaid though, which is generally up to the bride.
Yup! I was a Groomslady for one of my close friends.
Sounds a lot better than *female attendant*.
Sure, but OP hasn’t suggested that. She’s just been upset the bride got to pick her own bridesmaids. If the brother wanted OP as someone on his side he should’ve asked 🤷♀️
The argument of being all single though, is lame. If married, your title as an attendant is Matron of Honour and it happens plenty.
Agreed-that was clearly a cop out.
Only if you're the honor attendant. Otherwise it's bridesmaid
Maybe. Or maybe there’s a dynamic between OP and her brother that we aren’t seeing the brother’s side of and he doesn’t want OP in the wedding for the given reason, or any other number of possible reasons.
yeah, really the only correct answer to this post is INFO. Is OP distant or rude to their brother? Is their brother especially close to the ILs? Lots of questions would need answering. I think as OP presents it, OP is NTA, but on the other hand the post is pretty short and idk OP's vibe makes me think there are missing missing reasons for why OP's brother doesn't want them in the wedding party.
Definitely not distant or particularly rude. We have always been pretty close. I would say the only time we weren’t as close was when I went away to college but that changed when came back. Honestly, the post is short because I was writing it while in line to pick up my kids from daycare.
Are you very close friendds with your bro's fiance? Is your husband close friends with your brother? If the answer is no then why would you expect to be a bridesmaid?
>appears that it's not 'his' wedding either. Don't count him out just yet..... his sister not being asked could very easily be his idea. He may not want his sister in his wedding or he just doesn't care and the bride does or he traded for something he does want. Not everyone wants their siblings in their wedding but also do not want the confrontation from those siblings. He might be hiding behind his bride to avoid an argument with OP.
According to the update. She's mad OP didn't attend the engagement party that they put to be at mothers Day. OP made an update
It’s definitely not her wedding but it seems like she is close or was close with her brother. And his future wife is demanding his sister to be left out (if he would allow her, that is). Because of missing an engagement party? Seems like petty is, petty does for all of them.
Well, since she isn't important since it's not her wedding day, I don't really see why her attendance is required.
Responding to OP's edit: >The truth- his fiancé is mad at me because I didn’t go to the engagement party. Which was on Mother’s Day. Who on earth schedules an engagement party on Mother's Day? That's going to be a hugely inconvenient clash for so many people! Brother's fiancée sounds supremely petty and a drama llama.
Exactly. IMO OP dodged a bullet here not having to be in the wedding. Go be a guest and avoid the drama. Cheer up, maybe you can be in your brother’s next wedding OP and in the meantime you now know where you stand with your brother.
YTA Really? You’re incapable of being there to support and celebrate your sibling because you’re expected to be a guest without a title? Come on! You can be better than that. Honestly, do you really want to spend all the time and money on all the bridesmaid requirements anyway? Just go & have fun. You’re not the bride’s bff or family. It would have been nice for her to include you, but it’s hardly tragic that she didn’t. Shift your focus from yourself to your brother, and enjoy his wedding.
There is no way I would miss my sibling’s wedding over not being in the wedding party. Like you said, why are you unwilling to support your brother over a title?
I missed my sibling’s wedding because I had Covid and it sucked, but only one member of the family was included in the party, and that was by the bride, not my sibling. So immature, if you need a title to support your sibling, you’re not there to support at all.
>you’re expected to be a guest without a title? God this is so perfectly phrased
ESH. The YTA votes are a bit ridiculous. If the BRIDE is having all of her siblings as bridesmaids and groomsmen, then OP's brother, who was the best man at her wedding and godparent to her first child, should have spoken up and ensured OP at least was involved in the wedding party or has a special part. It doesn't look like anything bad happened between the siblings. They also lied because being single has nothing to do with anything and I'm from the same culture as OP. They could have at least kept it real. Now where OP goes wrong is expecting everyone to have the same expectations as she does. It is your brother's wedding and his day. His choice (although I think it's all the bride and if so good luck with that marriage). He is justified in what he wants for his day, as much as you feel hurt and excluded. Maybe your relationship was closer than you thought. He showed his cards on how he feels about your sibling relationship, so run with it. I would attend the wedding, pay them dust, and not let them get to you. At least you can let loose, have fun, not be expected to take a bunch of photos, not shell out tons of money, and just do you. Make sure your man and you look HAWT! You are there as guests, nothing more! I would also politely decline any duties given from here on out until the wedding day. Bridal party, rehearsal dinner, son as ring carrier, reading Bible passage during the ceremony, additional activities, all would be a NO from me. Keep it cool, calm, collected, and maintain your distance for your peace. Your emotions are justified and you are allowed to feel hurt. How you continue forward is what matters as you want to enforce boundaries, but don't want to look like the bad person. Your brother should also know that he can't run to you with any issues anymore, that door is closed. Don't get your parents involved anymore. If they bring it up divert or close the conversation. As adults, it's between your brother and you and that is it. It's mind-boggling how family members get to be complete trash toward other family members and it is okay. At least he can't run back to you when issues happen because the relationship already sounds completely unbalanced and unstable. Do you and take people for what they show you to be!
I mean what if OP isn’t close with future SIL at all though? She hasn’t mentioned even being close with her brother, only that he was in her wedding. Her brother and FSIL could hang out with her siblings all the time and be really close. We don’t know this if this is the case or not, but I do find it odd OP never mentioned what type of relationship she has with either of them. That matters.
It 100% matters, but if you are my husband's best man and godfather to my child, then that relationship is very close. OP also hinted that her brother's partner's siblings whom he has known for less than a year are in the wedding party as groomsmen. I honestly think the fiance is controlling things and that the brother has no backbone.
The whole point of me saying he was best man and godfather was to show (rather than just say) how close we are. Thank you for being the only one to pick up on that.
Given the update, NTA. Your future SIL is being ridiculously petty and holding a grudge. I feel sorry for your brother. Going forwards, you need to support him because she sounds like a bucket of fun /s
I would go to the wedding as a normal guest and address your hurt with your brother at a different date. Yes, you are not owed a place in the wedding party, but the fact that she's packing your brother's groomsmen with her own brothers does send a message. I doubt your brother has much call here either way, unless he happens to be good friends with his fiancee's brothers. Cut any contributions you intended to give for the wedding to that of a standard guest, wash your hands of needing to help out or clean up, and go enjoy a party. Explain to him after the wedding that you were wondering if something has happened, as you thought the two of you were close. Hear him out and then let it go. Being hurt is reasonable, choosing not to go is an escalation.
I am wondering if he is closer to his BiLs than OP is actually aware of
If your brother’s fiancée is controlling things, don’t turn that into a rift with your brother over this. You can express your hurt without refusing to support him.
OP after reading the update, I would honestly just tell my brother “Okay, thank you for being honest. I respect your stance on your fiance's decision. I will support your wedding from a distance, as a guest”. Decline any and every future change/invite, keep clear of SIL, and always just remain cordial in front of her. They should have not scheduled an Engagement Party on Mother's Day, SIL should have spoken up if she felt a way, and your brother should have put his foot down through SIL's exclusionary practices. Your brother is in for a rude awakening with her and her family and all you can say is “Not my monkeys, not my zoo”. Again, don't let them run to you for anything in the present or future. They both can kick rocks. One has no spine and the other is childish = the perfect future wedding and overall marriage.
INFO: Are you only interested in being a bridesmaid? Or would you have been willing to be a groomswoman on your brother's side?
Either. Honestly-I just wanted to be talked to about it instead of fed some line about marital status.
For what it's worth, OP, I understand why you are hurt and angry. I would have felt hurt and angry, too.
Are we assuming that he's closer with all of his future brother-in-laws that are being put into place as his groomsmen?
YTA, it’s not your wedding and they can have whoever they want in their bridal party.
I originally said YTA, because I didn't read your post carefully enough, I'm sorry. NTA. While I don't think anyone is entitled to be in a wedding party, it is indeed weird that they included all siblings except you.
Okay cmon. This is not a crazy demand. It’s normal To be upset if your close sibling didn’t ask You to be in the wedding. She’s allowed to be upset. And maybe her and SIL are close?? They are basically family now?? You think this so black and white and it’s not.
You're absolutely right, I didn't read this carefully enough. I take it back and I'm sorry for not taking the time to read the post properly. I'll see if I can edit it.
I can definitely understand why she is upset. Not being in my sibling's wedding party would really hurt my feelings. BUT, I would still go to the wedding. Two hurts don't heal relationships.
They didn’t though, they included all of the brides siblings. The groom included none of his family. And typically a bride picks her bridal party and a groom picks the groomsmen. Now maybe he should of asked to include his sister or had her be a grooms woman or best lady if that was the case.
That's what would bother me, too. The bride having all of her siblings in the wedding party, but the OP as the sister of the groom not being included in the wedding party, will look weird, and either way, it will not go unnoticed by the other guests. I could see it being awkward and humiliating for the OP if she attends the wedding. Guests will notice that she's not in the wedding party and will talk about it. She will look like a jerk if she doesn't attend, and guests will talk about that too. She's in a lose-lose situation. And in the second scenario, I'm sure the bride would be more than happy to tell the guests that the OP didn't attend because she was home pouting about not being in the wedding party. In my opinion, Mother's Day is an odd day to pick for an engagement party.
I hear you about the exchange program, and while I partially agree, I think there’s more here. 1) my brother is close with my nuclear family (husband and kids) and I think everyone expects that I’d be part of it because of our relationship. 2) why is he lying when asked about it? If it’s about the bride’s choice, then say that. Don’t say I would but you’re married. The lie is more offensive than the act.
Saw your edit. I feel like people vote on these things in a vacuum or something. Of course you should be incredibly hurt by him excluding you from the wedding party. It’s petty and disrespectful. And your soon to be SIL is a piece of work for scheduling an engagement party on. Mother’s Day! How uncouth? Honestly, it sounds like neither of them have any etiquette. You should be the bigger person and attend, to support your brother, especially because he might need you for the impending divorce.
100% understand what you’re going through. Similar thing happened to me when my brother got married except he also included our siblings. I was the only one left out. I never did get a straight answer as to why, but I suspect it was bc I didn’t offer to pay for the reception. He wanted to have it at my house, to which I said yes, but when he met w vendors and the topic of cost came up he remained silent and looked at me. They also expected me to do all the bridesmaid’s tasks, including throwing (and paying for ) the shower and bachelorette! Unfortunately for him I have a spine and noped outta all that. All comments saying ur the ahole and they can have whomever they want, yes that’s true. But you can also make your own choices about how much you’ll be interacting with them going forward. Good luck.
YTA - they can pick who they want. You’re being petty and over dramatic about not attending because you’re not getting your way.
NTA. Of course you dont have to attend - but I would avoid being much more Drama than quietly skipping. Your hurt feelings are valid, but ultimately it's their choice who's in the wedding party and they don't deserve to hear a ton of grief about it.
NTA. I’ve noticed a lot of ppl r demonizing you for having feelings about not being treated equally or not being appreciative of not being in the wedding party or assuming you have done something terrible to the brother and fiancée. Based on what you’ve said in comments and OG post, I think the fiancee is the AH for deliberately trying to exclude your family, lying, and getting so personally offended by you choosing your children over her.
Agreed. Don't tell me the bride doesn't know exactly what she has done and how it looks to the OP.
NTAH!!! And that bridesmaid being single, doesn't float anymore. It's their wedding, absolutely! It's not their decision, it's her, the brides decision. Your brother can't stand up to his new bride. And yes, you are totally being excluded. This is just your new placement in her family setting. You aren't important to her. But she will expect things from you. If you don't go, it will be held against you, from now until the end of time. Choose carefully. I'd go, but I wouldn't do anything else, or contribute a dime for anything. Plus I'd give them a Dollar Tree toaster too. But I'm getting really petty in my old age too.
It never did! It was a maid of honor or a matron of honor, etc. depending on the marital status of the woman supporting the wedding. If the sibling relationship is important then the brother should have his sister as part of the wedding party. If not, then OP knows where she stands in her sibling’s eyes. ESH, but it seems to me that OP’s feelings are going to affect her relationship going forward and brother will have no one but himself to blame.
I'm curious: Is anyone from your family included in the wedding, or is it all about the bride and HER family? If that's the case, I think that that is setting precedent for the future as far as family gatherings go. Your family will always be second to hers.
No one else from my family has been asked to be part of the wedding. There’s rumors that my kids will be asked to be flower girl/ring boy but neither of them said anything about it directly. My mom also said something that my brother is inviting 10-15 people whereas his fiancé is inviting 40. The whole thing seems so off to me and, frankly, it’s not like my brother to not put his family first.
>My mom also said something that my brother is inviting 10-15 people whereas his fiancé is inviting 40. The whole thing seems so off to me and, frankly, it’s not like my brother to not put his family first. Who is paying for this wedding? If it is her parents then money could have been offered with conditions and those could include guest list and siblings being included. Usually the side paying has more guests.
My brother is paying. Her family is “giving a gift”
Could she be trying to isolate him from you and the family? Probably out of left field... but does she seem controlling? Maybe I am reading into something that is not there.
Potentially. It hasn’t crossed my mind until another person here suggested it.
I would go to the wedding. If she is trying to isolate him you don't want to help her. Keep up your relationship so if he ever needs help he knows he has you.
🦧🛎🛎🛎🛎🛎 Her family may become HIS family, but he still has HIS family, and she can just as well become part of HIS.
It sounds like she is, especially with your update (that she scheduled the engagement party for Mother’s Day, and is annoyed because you didn’t cede the day to her). Who schedules their (non-mother-centric) event for Mother’s Day unless they’re trying to be territorial? And your brother should be able to determine his own supporters for his wedding. She sounds controlling.
NTA... The update shows that you'll be in fir a lot of drama from your new sil. She sounds very childish. Your brother needs to really think on this.
For me NTA Saw your update! So your brother has no say on his own wedding to include his side of the family? He can’t include you or your husband as his groomsman or grooms woman? Brutal! Have you talked to your brother how worrisome and how this is a red flag for his future? 🚩🚩🚩She is putting distance between him and his family over an engagement party… you have 2 kiddos and it was your first Mother’s Day. Who even schedules an engagement party on Mother’s Day? I would go to the wedding Op… simply to be there for my brother. It sounds like he may need your support down the line. Don’t let her put a further wedge between you two. I mean that’s just my opinion. And I would definitely chat with him so he can grow a spine and open his eyes. The fact that she is holding a grudge against his family member over this and not letting him choose what he wants for his wedding is nuts, and him letting her do it is beyond me. Best wishes Op and good luck to your brother.
This very much. So many red flags. Hope your brother sees them before it's too late.
YTA. Not going to the wedding of someone you claim to love bc you didn’t get a star role in it is petty, spiteful, and childish.
I'd not go he is showing that his partners family means more to him then his family. Full bridal and groom party of her family that's so dam stupid. Does he not have a single friend who he would rather have up there instead of all her brothers??? Like she must have his balls in a dam vice grip or he is spineless.
I haven’t had a chance to really talk to him but, honestly, this was EXACTLY what I thought
Even if it's true, you claim that you're close to your brother. Is it your intention to abandon him in the light of evidence that you believe his future wife is trying to isolate him? You believe that she wants to cut his ties with you, and you're actively helping her by refusing to even attend the wedding? I know it feels like a snub but not attending could ruin your relationship with your brother. Tell him you're disappointed but find out if there's some other way that you can support on the day. It feels so extreme to not even go.
💯
NTA She's a "ITS NOT OUR WEDDING IT'S MY WEDDING" bride and he's just rolling over for her. Tbh you should probably say goodbye to him. She's gonna put up a wall between the two of you asap. She'll probably even dupe him into building it for her.
This is what I’ve been afraid of for a while. Ugh
If you think that might be the case, it's all the more reason to attend the wedding. If you don't, she will most likely hold it against you, and use it to drive a wedge between you and your brother. I think it's sad that no one is standing up for your brother at his wedding. I understand you're hurt, but if you care about your brother, then you should consider attending, albeit as a regular guest.
Nta especially with that edit. So fucking weird how people on here are so "it's not your responsibility" in regards to anything family related but when you've decided to not be the only one excluded, over a fucking engagement party you're a prick 😂
NTA these people saying YTA don’t mind being disrespected I guess
NTA, not because you’re not in the wedding party, just that it’s your right to attend or not.
YTA. They can pick whoever they want for their bridal party for any reason. The whole “married” thing is probably just an excuse. Are you really close with your future SIL? If not, then that’s why, and you need to move on. Their wedding isn’t about you. If you are super close with her, then talk to her about it.
Maybe its possible OP thought they were close to their own brother? They can pick whoever they want for the bridal party, and OP can chose not to attend. If all of the SIL's siblings are included, and OP's brother's siblings are excluded, OP is drawing a reasonable conclusion that their brother doesn't value them very much and it is a reasonable thing to be upset about.
NTA. Your update seems that you guys have a bigger problem.
At first I was in the YTA camp until I saw the update. NTA. Sounds like she doesn’t really want you there so why go
THIS. I can't believe all the Y-T-A bc why would she want to go to a party to celebrate someone who is mad at her and the person who is enabling the bs reason why??? If she is not wanted, and she can sense that, why is everyone mad at her in this comment section???
That sil is probably the reason why
INFO are you close to your brother? Like in recent years have you been on good terms and helping each other out/talking etc? Is your brother especially close to the in-laws? Does your brother have anyone that is his family/friend etc in the wedding party? How close is your brother to those people? Siblings aren't guaranteed a spot at the wedding party, but not being invited can indicate a lack of closeness (which may or may not be a point of conflict, and may be the result of one sibling being an asshole to the other). I think the only way to know if your the AH is the have a fuller picture of the social situation.
Yes-brother and I are pretty close. I often host small holidays and events and have him and his fiancé over. We have sibling spats but definitely nothing that would result in us not being as close. My brother hangs out often at the in-laws but I’m not there so I can’t speak to their closeness. My brother and I have always been honest with each other and this situation is very offensive. My understanding is that all the groomsmen are her family members.
Its not great that all of the bridesmaids and groomsmen are the bride's family, and there is no one in the wedding party to support the groom. I don't want to overstate anything b/c I'm just a stranger reading this second hand. But if there is no special role for any one your brothers side (parents, family, friends) at all I would be concerned about your brother being intentionally isolated. But it is also possible that its "only" your brother being too lazy to be involved in wedding planning and SIL focusing on the relationships closest to her instead of deliberately excluding you. I put "only" in quotation marks because I think that is a reasonable thing to be upset about. If you really do have a close relationship I really get why you are upset, but beyond that I think its a little beyond my pay grade TBH. Not going to the wedding is a big deal. But so is not including people you are close to in your wedding. Communicating with your feelings to your brother is important, but at what point are you acting entitled to the wedding party, which siblings aren't entitled to, and also what would be the point of guilting your brother into that. But it is also an AH thing to nurse a hurt instead of addressing. So really IDK. I know you chose to come to reddit for advice but this really feels like something you have to figure out with people IRL, like discussing with your mom, husband, friends etc to decide how to respond and if/how to talk to your brother about this.
Thanks. This is helpful. I’ll talk to my brother alone hopefully soon and get some clarity. My guess is he’s just doing whatever his fiance told him but you’re right, it might be something deeper that I’m not seeing. Thanks for even bringing that up.
For what its worth, the amount of downvotes on my comments on this thread suggest that I am totally out of whack with American wedding norms and expectations so take my speculation with an extra grain of salt
American here, no, I agree with what you have said above. If the roles/sexes were reversed, people would be livid and screaming that some sort of abuse was happening. It would be very clear if the entire wedding parties were made up of the grooms family, and he wasn't allowing any bride's family to join. So many on this sub seem to give women passes they wouldn't give men. (This is coming from a woman)
NTA
After reading update, nah NTA. She’s being petty so you have a right to be petty back.
YTA. Quit being such a drama llama. Their wedding is not about you, it's about them. The only person being rude here, is you. Traditionally, the bridesmaid were all unmarried, eligible young woman, usually relatives or close friends of the bride. Ditto with the groomsmen. Back when humanity was spread out and communication was difficult, a wedding was a way to meet potential spouses. It may be archaic, but if they want to follow that tradition, that is their choice...not yours. You wanna stay home and raise a stink over it, fine, do it then. But all you're going to look like is a petty, immature AH who didn't their way and wasn't included in the wedding party. Honestly, if this is your typical behavior, I can see why didn't choose you.
>Traditionally, the bridesmaid were all unmarried, eligible young woman, usually relatives or close friends of the bride. Ditto with the groomsmen. Back when humanity was spread out and communication was difficult, a wedding was a way to meet potential spouses. It may be archaic, but if they want to follow that tradition, that is their choice...not yours. But now is not the past. This rule is just so pointless and trivial. Like lots of old-timey traditions are outdated and sexist etc etc but they have emotional or other significance. But the idea that we must run weddings in 2023 to accommodate dating patterns of idk the 1850s is just stupid. Its just cargo-culting the past. If the couple choose to follow that "rule" it is an active choice they are making, they can't hide behind tradition, its just an arbitrary choice that they made. Like its not about conservative morals, its not about a traditional wedding. I mean how many people are seriously like "its my dream wedding, I'm wearing a gorgeous white dress, my dad is walking me down the aisle and also all the bridesmaids and groomsmen are single, that last thing is also important to my vision of the wedding for some reason"
But the concept of the wedding itself is all nonsensical clinging to pointless old rules and traditions. The altar, the walking down the aisle, the white dress, the concept of a bridal party, the bouquet, the veil, it's all equally as absurd as the bridesmaids-must-be-single thing. Someone wanting single people as a bridesmaids so, for example, they can party hard until the wedding makes more sense than a lot of other stuff.
I always saw it as passing through the ranks of a club, in a way. The night before you marry, you have one last “sleepover” with your friends, as a single person without obligations to a husband or children at home, then you get married and pass into a different place in life, where you *do* have those obligations to get home to (and that’s wonderful and fun, too).
What sane person even WANTS to be in a wedding party? Just wondering?
Not everyone is a bridezilla/groomzilla. Being in my best friend's wedding was an honor and one of my most treasured memories.
This comment doesn’t help at all
NTA every other sibling is in the bridal party just not you! I dont blame you for not going, your future SIL sounds like a nightmare and your brother a spineless jellyfish You, your husband & you little ones should go somewhere fantastic on their wedding day and make better memories
NTA. Interesting that your brother doesn't have any say in his own wedding. Your future SIL sounds like a charmer. Having an engagement party on Mother's Day is poor planning. Then being upset that you, as a new mom, didn't feel like attending because of your own circumstances and holding that against you is petty. I wouldn't go either. Edit: While I agree that you have no right to demand to be in the wedding party, it seems that the reason is a spiteful one.
NTA. You dont have to go, and they dont have to include you. Shitty situation though.
After the update, it's not really about being a bridesmaid. Your brother is about to marry a woman who thinks that it is okay to cut off his family over a perceived slight. Why have an engagement party on a day that most people celebrate something else, especially first time mothers? If she ever becomes a mother, she'd probably throw a hissy fit about not being able to celebrate her special day. Your brother should think long and hard about marriage to this immature girl.
100%. After the update, it just confirmed what I originally thought. Future SIL is childish and insufferable. They have bigger issues.
Be grateful!! You get to wear an awesome dress in whatever colour you want, you and your husband get to party and enjoy the night without having any duties, why on earth would you want to be in the wedding party?
I don’t understand all the YTA’s? I think ESH for threatening not to go, but also do people in this thread not have siblings they are close to? If I had my sister in my wedding but I wasn’t in hers, I would be upset
These comments are rancid
NTA. Don’t bother going.
Considering the update, I would 100% go and congratulate your brother… and barely acknowledge your incredibly lame FSIL No judgment but really implore you to not stoop to the same level of petty. It’ll only alienate your brother over time.
Everyone seems to be excusing her future SIL for being petty. Yes it’s their wedding but the only reason OP isn’t a bridesmaid is because she couldn’t attend the engagement party, which means if she had attended she would’ve been in the bridal party. That’s very petty on future SIL’s part. OP, your brother is in an impossible situation here. He’s getting push back from not only you but your grandma and who knows how many other family members which I’m sure is weighing on him. I would be really upset as well but would suck it up for my brother and go to the wedding and support him. You might end up regretting not going in the future. You don’t have to be best friends with SIL just be cordial for your brother’s sake. NTA
Brother is not in an impossible situation. He just needs to reach between his legs and confirm he still has some balls. Then use those balls to push back on his SO.
Their position seems a bit weird to me personally, but they seem to have a rationale behind it. At the end of the day, I think just focus on them having the best day possible, the way they envisioned it. I get that you might feel hurt, however making a big deal out of it to the point of not attending, I'd say makes YTA.
Well, I think your brother is going to be whipped. He could have asked for the two (you and your husband) of you to be in his wedding. Not so much of a big deal to me. So I'm gonna say you're NTA.
NTA… but future SIL is. Yikes. That said, go to the damn wedding anyway to show support for your brother. You don’t have to like SIL, you just have to tolerate her if you want any sort of relationship with your brother. Go and be grateful that you don’t need to pay out for a million stupid things acting as a bridesmaid.
INFO Why doesn't your brother want your husband to be a groomsman? He should at least have a say in that part. They don't owe you the positions, but if you found out they are lying to you about it because they are pissy about the engagement party, which they chose to have on another holiday, I might be upset about the deceit and possibly not really want to deal with people so petty. It's the only time they get married and they can't stop being petty for one day?
NTA! Who the hell schedules an engagement party for Mother’s Day? Very uncouth and not proper etiquette 😬. It’s a massive red flag that she’s isolating your brother literally from your entire family (it is beyond weird that the whole wedding party is her family, like beyond weird). I guarantee she’s going to put a wedge in between your brother and his family, you included. Your brother lacks balls and a spine. The fact that he doesn’t see ANY of the red flags with this woman is disturbing. There’s MANY red flags here.
NTA. Your feelings are valid. It’s ok to be upset that your brother didn’t have a say on this. Especially if you’re his only sister. But I think you should go to his wedding. Be the better person. Show up for your brother. I’m sure one day he will appreciate that you were there.
NTA - I am so surprised by all the Y-T-A, I can only imagine that people did not read your text closely. Your not upset because you aren't in the bridal party, your upset because you were the ONLY sibling left out, you have a close relationship with your brother, and they lied to you about why. With your update it is even more--bride is being super petty. edit to add: also, it IS normal for the bride to ask her SIL even if they aren't super close. And it sounds like she was planning on it until the engagement party thing, which is so immature on her part. It's like she wants your brother to see you as a villain.
NTA and that’s even before the edit. I don’t understand all the YTA comments. ALL of her siblings are in the wedding but not you? That’s ridiculous. And then with the edit, who has an engagement party on Mothers Day? It seems like she set it up that way knowing you wouldn’t want to attend on your FIRST Mothers Day. I wouldn’t doubt that the fiancé didn’t already have something against OP before the engagement party.
YTA - it's not your wedding, it's not your day, it's not about you at all. Stop making it about you! Positions in wedding parties aren't a reciprocal affair and everyone has a different idea what the wedding party should be. If you don't want to go to the wedding, don't. But just know that it's because of something you literally made up for yourself to be upset over.
It’s an invitation not a summons right? That’s what y’all usually say. If you don’t wanna go no matter the reason just don’t go.
NTA. Your update seems that you guys have a bigger problem.
NTA. I am sorry Op, your brother chose a sweetheart /s. I understand your disappointment, and I think your future sil is overreacting, and your brother left his spine in a drawer, but if you don't go, you will be further estranged by your brother.
NTA - don’t go, your future SIL sounds awful and your brother needs to grow a spine
Nah after you explained she has an attitude cause you didn't attend an event on mother's day as you were a first time mom is ridiculous. Homegirl is childish and I wouldn't go to a wedding with someone who has an attitude that I spent mother's day celebrating myself. While your brother may be upset which is understandable you shouldn't have to be uncomfortable. Think about it so more and weigh the options.
ESH. They can have who they want in their wedding. Is it odd that EVERYONE in the wedding party is on the bride's side? YES. Why doesn't the groom get to choose people? Whatever, not your circus. If he can't speak up for himself, that's HIS choice, his wedding (or his bride's, whatever, he CHOSE HER). It's childish to threaten not to go though. Be there for him now, & in the future when this marriage eventually implodes (sorry, lol, couldn't resist).
Look, I'm going ESH- best man suggests you are close, and if brides siblings are also standing for husband, yeah its gonna look off that his family isn't, as well, which is putting you in a weird spot, optically That said, it's their wedding and you're overstepping. Brother obviously agrees with bride enough he's not putting his neck out for you. In short, you aren't as close as you thought you were. I agree the unmarried excuse is stupid and rarely used. Just do with this info as you see fit. Day of the wedding, you are just guests. Do absolutely nothing extra. No additional events for the wedding, no rehearsal dinners, ect. Do not stay and help clean up, just leave when you want to leave. No wedding related favors, and bare minimum of what's expected for a gift. Just don't go breaking you back to help out brother and make sure wedding duties are left to the wedding party
NAH You are understandably hurt that you were overlooked by your brother and his fiancé. It’s their wedding, so if they get to choose attendants. Hold your head up and go to the wedding. Not being a bridesmaid just saved you lots of $$. Just choose a gift for them and let it go. Life is short.
NTA But both you and the bride are petty af.
NTA. Your update seems that you guys have a bigger problem.
NTA. It seems that their marriage is starting off with how it's going to go. She's obviously in control and will be for the future. I would go but take your brother aside and tell him that you love him and he can always come to you if things go awry. Tell him that if she's going to be petty because of an engagement party then you'll so be it but he needs to carefully think if this is the right relationship for him but you'll support him from a distance. Enjoy the day as a guest, where you have no responsibility. This is unlikely to end we'll, it just might be later rather than sooner.
I'm going for NTA. Of cause you'd be sad being left out. I think everyone would. Even the ones here who call you an AH if they'd be honest to themselves. Quite sure some who'll attend the wedding will wonder about it and question why that is. I wouldn't want that kind of negativity either. I understand fully if you don't go!
Your brother needs to grow a spine and put his foot down. It is HIS wedding too, not just the bride, and if he wants his family standing with him he needs to stand up and say something instead of going along with her and then lying to you about why. NTA
YTA. It isn't rude or disrespectful for an engaged couple to decide who they want in their wedding party. From your post, it doesn't sound like you and your brother's fiancée are close; you weren't even aware that she was annoyed with you (I don't think she should have been annoyed re you missing the engagement party, but the fact that you didn't even realise she was missed suggests this isn't a close relationship). You don't talk about feeling disappointed not to be involved or upset; simply peeved at a perceived slight. You don't even express any concern re he and his fiancée apparently disagreeing on the wedding party. So this sounds like it's more about your ego than caring about your brother. A wedding isn't a summons and you don't have to go, however, your reasons do make you the AH in my view. If your brother is in a difficult position where he and his fiancée don't agree on things like the wedding party, support him instead of making this harder. Check he's happy, check he isn't being steamrolled. Don't start huffing.
NTA- based on the edit, while she can have whoever she wants in her bridal party, she's doing it for pretty spiteful reasons. She expected you to skip your first ever Mother's Day for an engagement party? I'm as childfree as it gets, but that seems ridiculous.
ESH you all sound insufferable
Well even before the update NTA. After the update what a selfish raging bitch she is. That is going to be a short marriage, poor guy is going to be hating life and she will probably cheat in a couple years or less. Depends on how badly she feels she settled for your brother. Yes I'm being rude and hope none of that happens to your bro, but damn what a jerk she if. Ask your brother if he is sure she is ok to marry if she is going to treat his family like that. She doesn't sound like a nice person.
Although the reason why you weren’t asked to be a bridesmaid sucks, it’s not as an obvious slight as your non-attendance at the wedding would be, it will be easier to portray you as the villain in this story. He will always be your brother, maybe think about going to support him. Being a bridesmaid is expensive and time consuming, being a carefree family wedding guest is much more fun.
Nta. I'd still go to the wedding. For your brother if nothing else. I feel he is going to need you. Who schedules an engagement party on mother's day?
NTA. If you host a party on a holiday, you can’t be pissed people are celebrating the holiday by doing their own thing. She planned something on Mother’s Day and then get pissed when a new mom wants to celebrate Mother’s Day, she’s TA.
ESH - you because of the “not attending the wedding” comment, your brother for lying, and your future SIL for being mad over something so incredibly petty.
I would say thank you for not making me do all that but that’s just me. Being a bridesmaid is expensive, time consuming, and stressful.
I have dreaded every wedding I have had to be part of the wedding party (well... except my role as groom). I would be super psyched to being "excluded" and have tried to dodge it every time I can. Much better to just be a guest and eat their food, drink their wine, and not have to deal with the hassle and time (photos take forever).
Go as an honored invited guest.
ESH Not going to the wedding is a step too far. Being the bigger person and going to the wedding would look better of course. Then when they divorce in a couple years bc the bride’s control issues become to unbearable, you can talk shit to your brother and make him feel bad for not including you in the wedding.
I think there are multiple issues at play here. The first: what is your husband’s relationship with your brother? You said your brother way your best man- why? Was it because they genuinely have that close of a relationship, or did your husband ask your brother to be his best man because he felt like it was the right thing to do? If that’s the case, is it possible that your brother has a closer relationship with the men that he asked to stand up with him? In the same vein: what’s your relationship with your future SIL? Are you close? Look, I love my husbands sisters- they’re both great women. But the relationship I have with them is not the same as the one I have with my sister and my closest friends, so I didn’t ask them to be bridesmaids, and they were both very understanding of that decision. You aren’t entitled to a role in someone else’s special day. Is their reasoning for not including you weird? Absolutely. Matrons of Honor have long been a thing, single people aren’t the default for bridal parties. But it kind of sounds like they don’t feel the same way about the relationship they have with you as you do with them, or they don’t feel the same familial obligation that you did when you selected your bridal party, and they were grasping at excuses so they didn’t have to straight up tell you that. It’s fine for you to prioritize family. It’s also fine for them to prioritize their close relationships.
Matron (maid) of honor? MOH was traditionally the older sister, or married friend/sister of the bride.
NTA, but however, do you want to be a bridesmaid to a bride who doesn’t want you?
Could your brother make you a groomsmaid?
NTA. Reading your update makes your SIL a petty person. She looks like the type who also loves drama. Also, why are all of her siblings bridesmaids and groomsmen while none of your brother's family are. You mentioned that being "single' was just a lie.
Soft YTA - because the last thing I would ever want to do is be in another wedding. But match some petty. Give them 40 bucks, drink to your hearts content, be the last one on the dance floor, wear something loud and if they say anything about it, say it is because you are married. Match energy gleefully.
As a mom of 2 myself… I’d be happy to not be in the wedding. That shit is exhausting and takes up so much of your time! It’s time to just attend weddings and relax vs being in them!
With the update I guess my comment is there's nothing stopping your brother from adding you and/or your husband to standing up with him on his side.
ESH I am also surprised about the many YTAs. You FSIL acts childish and punishs you for not attending your engagement party. They did lie to you instead of communicating open to you. But no reason to not attend their wedding because of this. Although I understand that you feel hurt of their behaviour.
Sad, but yeah, don’t go and keep your distance. Sounds very petty not to have you there for a weird reason and with you having a reasonable explanation to boot. And they even lied about it. Enjoy time with people that care and who you can care about. NTA.
NTA- Who the heck plans a Engagement Party on Mother's Day?? Anyway- Go to the Wedding as guests, that way zero pressure on you to do anything! Get a beautiful dress and have hubby dress up spiffy! Treat it like a "Date Night!" Dinner & Dancing! You'll still have to sit through the ceremony, but at least you won't have to stress! If they come back to you with some request to do something for the Wedding ( help set up/ read a psalm/ hand out the flowers-- whatever, politely DECLINE. You are a Guest, no duties for you. OP, yes it's a bit sad that you don't get to stand up for your Brother on this milestone of His, but KNOW that now You are no longer required to be the Rock for him. SHE WILL HAVE TO BE. So do yourself up and you and Hubby have a Night OUT! Enjoy! SIL to be has shown who she really is, least you know now at the start. Oh, and DO NOT let your Parents pressure you into doing ANYTHING!
I think in this case, it's reasonable to have hurt feelings since it seems like FSIL is doing it out of spite. In many cases asking someone to be a bridesmaid is an honor and FSIL is being petty about it. I'd go and have a good time wearing something fabulous.
Why can’t your brother have you as a groomsperson?
NTA shame on your brother for not standing up for you.
NTA: bride is petty
NTA
NTA, the wedding is for a celebration of the bride AND groom. The bride not allowing the groom to choose people to represent them in their wedding party is major a red flag. And it’s hard to participate in something that you don’t support.
NTA that would be his whiney future wife.
NTA. I wouldn't blame you for skipping the wedding
I'm honestly surprised by the consensus, but it seems like you're choosing not to go because of WHY you weren't chosen as a wedding party member. For example, if you were just angry about being excluded, that's one thing, but IMO, if you could tell it was bullshit and felt bad vibes from them, I wouldn't be comfortable going either. They lied to you. She's being a petty baby because you were busy being a mother. So you're not allowed to be petty back? Nah. NTA Also, your brother should've stood up for you or had your back in the first place. If he won't do that, you're not a bad person for not going.
Dude, you are not the asshole. If your family and future family can not think of family feelings and only think on their side of the family, and all of that because of pettiness? Who is she? Kim Jong un? If people don't act the way she wants, they are out of having a role in their brothers wedding? She sounds like a big controlling bit*h and I would give them 15 years until he gets sick of her taking control of everything and divorcing
Surely it is her choice who she has as a bridesmaid? Traditionally bridesmaids are from the woman’s side of the family/friends, not the man’s. If she doesn’t want you as a bridesmaid, as much as you may not agree, she is entitled to make that decision.
INFO: What culture are you? Are you a different culture to the bride? Traditionally the bride and bridesmaids would be unmarried, and the best man would also be single (and usually the grooms brother) as his role was to step in and marry the bride if the groom was a no-show. Obviously not many people continue that tradition, but there’s still plenty of archaic traditions involved in weddings (father giving away the bride to the husband for example) Ultimately you can’t declare yourself a bridesmaid, that’s entirely up to the bride, and it’s not unusual for a bride to prefer to have her own sisters or close friends as bridesmaids, rather than in-laws she doesn’t know very well. As for your husband and the ushers, how well does your husband know your brother? Of they’re not that close I would just expect him to be a guest rather than an usher. At the end of the day you can’t force the bride to pick you and your husband to be in the bridal party, it’s not your wedding so you get no say. Refusing to attend because if this makes you look incredibly petty and will damage your relationship with the family going forward.
Same culture as the bride. Same country of origin
YTA. It’s their wedding. They can have whoever they want in their bridal party
YTA. The bride is naturally going to pick people closest to her. But stomp your feeties and throw your tantrum, I guess.
YTA - you ask someone to be in your wedding party because you want them in your wedding party, not beside you expect something out of it. Your petty and selfish behaviour speaks volumes. Maybe this is why no one wants you to stand up for them. Stop making your bother’s wedding all about YOU.