Tbh I took a break right when "Perfect" dodge came out but I did experience it a little and honestly it felt bad having dodge windows get played with. dodges in the first place are situational so a "Perfect" dodge might not actually be. I often delay a dodge purposely to mess up strings of my opponent, but that wouldn't be "Perfect.". Now hold to dodge is also bad imo because it makes faster weapons like katars, scythe, and battle boots easier to dodge. Scythe and katars especially don't have many true combos just fast strings so making it harder for one of those weapons to punish a mistake is just bad design and a skill issue in my opinion. I'm 2200
The recharge negated on P dodge can be played around with, in my opinion it's more of a thing that you could eventually get used to, like when ground and air dodges were made to have the same cooldown. Dodges are situational depending on playstyle, if you are more aggressive, then dodges are necessary to have a whiff to punish to keep a combo going.
So I think hold to dodge and perfect dodge cannot exist together. To your point it's not a whiff punish if you dodged after being hit that's more akin to waking up. If you are talking about baiting an attack first then perfect dodge wouldn't apply. Overall I think perfect dodge adds complexity to dodging that they just removed and hold to dodge is down right bad. More to hold to dodge being terrible, it builds bad habit for new players to just hold the button when being attacked, creating more things for them to learn.
I don't know what you mean of it "not applying". I mentioned in the post above that P dodge would open up more combos out of dodge especially P dodge > attack > GC > attack. That lowered window is just enough to add another method of attack off one P dodge utilizing a GC. Another example of P dodge working after baited attack is dodged is in the case of a katar halfpipe or similar katar combo because after dlight > dair there is actually a huge window for the enemy to attack before you can do something else and some characters like orion or artemis can even dsig, P dodge would allow for another dodge in that moment that (untested) isn't possible normally.
I think the worst part about H2D is that the new player holding the key isn't actually engaging in a bad habit because not dodging is automatically worse than dodging in a direction that could maybe possibly be punished. It's pretty much a free nerf to dex weapons.
I see what you mean now. I don't know about the "huge window" or about Orion or Artemis dsig being able to hit first I am a Lin fei main and have never been woken up on in a half pipe. So for hold to dodge I'm not saying it's bad I'm saying it's another mechanic newer players will rely on because it's good but that in of itself will create a bad habit just like how newer players rely heavily on sigs. It's something else for them to learn and unlearn.
Tbh I took a break right when "Perfect" dodge came out but I did experience it a little and honestly it felt bad having dodge windows get played with. dodges in the first place are situational so a "Perfect" dodge might not actually be. I often delay a dodge purposely to mess up strings of my opponent, but that wouldn't be "Perfect.". Now hold to dodge is also bad imo because it makes faster weapons like katars, scythe, and battle boots easier to dodge. Scythe and katars especially don't have many true combos just fast strings so making it harder for one of those weapons to punish a mistake is just bad design and a skill issue in my opinion. I'm 2200
The recharge negated on P dodge can be played around with, in my opinion it's more of a thing that you could eventually get used to, like when ground and air dodges were made to have the same cooldown. Dodges are situational depending on playstyle, if you are more aggressive, then dodges are necessary to have a whiff to punish to keep a combo going.
So I think hold to dodge and perfect dodge cannot exist together. To your point it's not a whiff punish if you dodged after being hit that's more akin to waking up. If you are talking about baiting an attack first then perfect dodge wouldn't apply. Overall I think perfect dodge adds complexity to dodging that they just removed and hold to dodge is down right bad. More to hold to dodge being terrible, it builds bad habit for new players to just hold the button when being attacked, creating more things for them to learn.
I don't know what you mean of it "not applying". I mentioned in the post above that P dodge would open up more combos out of dodge especially P dodge > attack > GC > attack. That lowered window is just enough to add another method of attack off one P dodge utilizing a GC. Another example of P dodge working after baited attack is dodged is in the case of a katar halfpipe or similar katar combo because after dlight > dair there is actually a huge window for the enemy to attack before you can do something else and some characters like orion or artemis can even dsig, P dodge would allow for another dodge in that moment that (untested) isn't possible normally. I think the worst part about H2D is that the new player holding the key isn't actually engaging in a bad habit because not dodging is automatically worse than dodging in a direction that could maybe possibly be punished. It's pretty much a free nerf to dex weapons.
I see what you mean now. I don't know about the "huge window" or about Orion or Artemis dsig being able to hit first I am a Lin fei main and have never been woken up on in a half pipe. So for hold to dodge I'm not saying it's bad I'm saying it's another mechanic newer players will rely on because it's good but that in of itself will create a bad habit just like how newer players rely heavily on sigs. It's something else for them to learn and unlearn.