This is aimed at the conservative voting public, not students, the effect on whom is almost irrelevant. What's being offered, to boost these shameless legislators' careers, is a "win" in the culture war by a visible display of dominance.
"You"? Is this person responsible personally and directly?
Strange word to use there. Not sure why you'd use it.
>So no a generation of kids will hate the Bible.
That's conjecture. A small minority of children of that particular generation, perhaps.
Atheists like me are cackling with the shenanigans some of these teachers could pull. The state wants the Bible taught to children? Well, it's gonna get *taught*.
Alright kids, open your Bibles up to Numbers 31!
"17 Now therefore kill every boy, and kill every woman who has been intimate with a man in bed 18 But all the women children, who have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves."
Your homework assignment is to ask your parents about this verse. Bring back a paragraph with your parent's signature on it explaining the historical context on this."
Ok class, today were going to be discussing the historical motivations behind the writing of Genesis chapter 1, and how the author most likely intended it to replace the older creation story found in Genesis 2-3. We'll also be comparing it to the Babylonian creation myth that it's clearly inspired by.
I'm a Christian, and even I don't think some of those parents would want me teaching the Bible to their children. This is going to open up such a massive can of worms, I'm almost chuckling at the thought of it.
Judges 1:19: "And the Lord was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron."
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That is..actually interesting and neccesary. Would also add the task of comparing to other flood stories so thst they can see there is a common kernel and consistency to the events registered by our ancestors, just looked from a different lense
I was thinking more of a Jewish yeshiva style of Bible study involving learning Hebrew, followed by memorizing the text along with Talmud and Mishnah.
The fundies would complain because it isn’t *Christian* Bible study…
Only shenanigans for stupid parents. Any serious person just explains these were the customs and commmandements given to ancient people in order to support their culture in a specific environment. Not threatening at all
Tomorrow we will read [Judges 19](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Judges+19&version=NRSVUE) "The Levite and his Concubine" and compare it to [Genesis 18-19](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+18%3A16-Genesis+19%3A29&version=NRSVUE) "God's Judgement on Sodom"
Your assignment is an essay on why the men in Gibeah raped the man's concubine when the men in Sodom would not settle for Lot's daughters.
The Superintendent and his supporters know this will wind up in the courts. If this struck down, well they gave a try and proved their bone fides to the voters to whom they want to appeal.
If they succeed in the courts at first, it will open a can of worms based on but not limited to
What they want to teach about the Bible.
What the teachers know of the Bible.
The reaction of families who aren’t Christian.
The reaction of Christian families that don’t want this either.
This is going to cause so many problems.
>The Superintendent and his supporters know this will wind up in the courts.
This is the part I think its easy to overlook. I'm somewhat less concerned about the fact that the Superintendent wants to try this, or that Alabama wants to put the 10 commandments in every room. These people didn't come up with these ideas yesterday.
I am more concerned that there are people out there watching the judicial landscape, keeping track of which judges are in which districts, who is being appointed where, and what is likely to come up in the near future - and those people tapped this Superintendent on the shoulder and said, "Now is a good time if you want to try that."
Makes me worry that they know something I don't.
Sounds very similar to when people who aren't teachers unilaterally decide what teachers should be teaching. The say they want teachers to teach computer programming, without giving the teachers any guidance into what they should actually be teaching, or giving them any resources to learn the material themselves so that they can teach it properly. Same goes for all the other stuff they are adding to the curriculum.
Well, I am a teacher, and I have had to decline to teach Algebra once (I'm an art teacher who earned Cs in high school algebra). I am also Catholic, and I would not want my kids taught the Bible through the lens of American Bible Belt Christianity.
This! This needs to be repeated. I am also a Christian, and I would not want my kids learning Christianity from anyone but their priest and parents. Teachers are dealing with too much already, stop doing this TO THEM!
My husband is a teacher here in Oklahoma, and we’ve been talking amongst other teachers about the logistics of this. A few of us think they’re going to have videos in the beginning that the teachers have to stream to show the kids since not all teachers know religion themselves. They’ll mandate those universal videos and add other things to the curriculum and make the teachers learn about them too, then build off of it.
I would happily teach the bible in a method that would make the people I teach far, far less likely to be Christian.
If you want me to teach the Bible, I'm going to teach the Bible.
Yes I don't think it is a good idea tbh..
Freedom of religion is a right. Whether you are Christian or not, your state's curriculum should offer all the religions books in that case. I don't support this at all.
I'm not sure how I feel about this. Is it a victory or is this just a messy riot in the making?
What about Muslims and Buddhists, etc
I'd pull my kid out of this school if I had any since it's not right to force religion on anybody
It's only gonna cause problems
He's not trying to push the Bible into schools, he's trying to push his own political agendas. Religion has been a vector in such political practices for centuries. It is why many left Europe for the America's, ESPECIALLY the Mayflower. Secularism is a two-way street. It keeps religion out of our state and the state out of our religion. If you are gonna put a religious text in a classroom, you better put in all of them. That includes the Quran, the Torah, even the Necronomicon.
I went to a Christian school from 3rd to 6th grade and one of my core memories is the school-wide chapel every morning. They were teaching about something and then mentioned the word “sodomy”. I said out loud to my classmates “what’s sodomy?” and obviously I said it pretty loud. The other people started busting up laughing and I never got the answer in chapel. Guess what? I “Ask Jeeves-ed” it (similar to googling back in the day)and got a full demonstration. 3rd grade is way way way too early to be teaching kids this stuff.
I doubt they will get into all of that. This video doesn't even say what exactly will be taught, and for how long.
"Teaching the bible" could just be talking about how it was written, or when, or where.
It is maybe the most important book in history, so yeah it should be at least mentioned in school.
They should really just have a religion class that teaches multiple religions. If you don’t teach kids about it the only info they will get is from their family or the media, both of which are always biased.
Even just teaching the practices and central mythology of different religions without taking any position on what is true is perfectly fine. It’s good to know how people think. And understanding western literature without the Bible is a lot more difficult.
Unless it’s basically just a survey of the practices associated with major feast days, the information presented is likely to be wildly inaccurate. People have a tendency to take all the main concepts in their own religion and map other religions onto that. It’s a hard habit to break, and there’s zero chance of getting enough competent religion teachers into public schools to even make it a widespread elective, let alone a required course.
Religious curriculum explaining some basics of each faith is sufficient for most people.
Most elementary school teachers in the UK can tell you basic facts/stories about Judaism, Islam, Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, Jainism. Some schools go further and explore newer religions like Baha'i
The problem for some religious people is that when you expose children to the "world", they will start noticing links between religions e.g. flood scenario occurring for Noah's Ark, Gilgamesh ending, Matsya (Vishnu in the form of a fish warning of a flood) etc. Some might worry this will result in people falling away from faith as they ask questions.
I took a mythology class in Highschool. We understood the place of myth within history and learned an appreciation for it. There is no literature with more of an impact on our modern world than the Bible, so while i don't agree with forcing schools to teach on it, i've always felt a little bit odd how terrified we are of bringing it up in school. Talk about Zeus as much as you want, but you dare not mention Christ.
Funny enough my public school had decades ago but it was removed ironically by a Christians group cause they also talked about Buddhism and Spiritualism.
I went to a catholic school in Maryland and learned all about Islam and Judaism and the various Christian denominations that arose during the reformation and colonial periods. They obviously put Catholicism at the top of the hierarchy, but it was fairly respectful toward others’ beliefs in comparison to most of the crazy stuff happening today.
Sure they should, but the whole point of this exercise is to elevate their version of Christianity above all other religious beliefs, Christian or not. There’s no way these people would ever support the idea of teaching about other religions in schools.
Even if some teachers tried to indoctrinate, it'd be better than total ignorance. My senior year of high school our AP Gov teacher mentioned that atheists were the most distrusted demographic when running for office; it turned out half the class didn't know what atheism was.
I’m not debating that. I’m debating the idea that information they get from a teacher is by definition superior to that of a parent or media. It commonly isn’t and can be tainted with bias the same as any other source.
Parents/media can entirely fail to acknowledge the existence of demographics, as in my example, where several people had made it to the age of 18 without knowing what atheism was.
Yeah. At some point we should ask us, if everyone out there truly doesn't understand how loving we are, are they all idiots or are we just not acting as much out of love as we pretend to? If we heared someone talk about christians like christians talk about other faiths, atheists or queer people, we would be outraged.
I think it’s a great shame that the quiet, consistent and compassionate message of Christ doesn’t seem to compete well with all the power stuff that’s everywhere these days. What was masquerading as Christianity was really white nationalism.
This has to be one of the scariest and realest threats I've seen from any political party so far. Let's say, for argument's sake, they actually do have good intentions behind Project 2025... doesn't that still open the door for a Christofascist government takeover in the future? I mean, I'm Christian, but damn... I don't want people going to jail because they don't believe what I believe.
I agree with you. My best friend is Atheist and I love him like a brother. I would never want the power of the state to inhibit his decisions. I would fight for his freedom.
At the college I work for, we get a few Omani students every year for one of our programs, all of them are Muslim and they're extremely kind and hospitable, they're always eager to share their culture and since my father is their instructor, I get to join him with them for a delicious meal of Omani food from time to time. It actually hurts my heart to think of being in a country where them doing that would risk them being kicked out of our country, or worse.
As an atheist, I also never want the power of the state to inhibit other people's beliefs, or the practice thereof.
These kinds of laws aren't just a problem for non-Christians, but for Christians of different denominations, because they're not fundamentally about educating people, but asserting through symbolic gestures that one sect or denomination has preferential status.
This. It has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with power; they want what they believe to be enforced, and any difference is a problem. It starts with the easy to target differences, until they're targeting everyone whos not on their side.
Not to mention that the things that define "Christian" to them are things American Christianity is actually split down the middle on. They're not requiring more care for the poor, sick, widows, etc. They're going off about LGBT issues and abortion.
you don't want your country being taken over by romman catholics and neo chsrismatic evangelicals and nar, but old school bbileelievvers may wwork, because they ddon't want power and influence.
Certain Baptists definitely do. IFB Baptists definitely want influence and power, I sat in their congregations from the time I was born until I was old enough to leave and they love talking about America being a Christian nation, kicking out anyone else, and making people convert.
The least Christian time of my life was when I was pushed towards Christianity by other people. This is just politicians using our religion to gain votes. May as well start exchanging currency in a church.
Christian and public school teacher here. I don't like this on several levels, However, here are some things to give pause.
(1) It'll get challenged very quickly and likely struck down. This is just the OKlahoma lawmaker grandstanding
(2) Anyone with an ounce of sense should realize how this is going to go *very* quickly. "Okay kids, today we're studying how the first chapter says the world was created in six days. The moral here is that Christianity is based on an unreliable narrative." Or: "Now today we're going to read about Lots two daughters drugging their dad so they can have sex with them." Or: "This portion, about how Jacob's uncle Laban was cheating him, is clearly about the element of manipulation and exploitation inherent in a capitalist system."
"Teach on the Bible" is such an incredibly vague setup. You could give lessons on the Koran every day, it wouldn't mean you were being positive about it.
They are going to challenge this at the supreme court. In normal circumstances yes, this is illegal.
The spin that they are going with this though is that the Bible was of historical significance at the birth of the nation and it is being taught just as a teacher would teach about the Declaration of Independence.
This will obviously be challenged in court. They are going to try and make the case that they are not pushing religion even though it’s pretty obvious that they are. Idk how the Supreme Court will rule on it
>They are going to challenge this at the supreme court.
Of course they, and they will lose. And they know that. This is all performative. These people know their policies do nothing to improve the lives of their citizens so they have to pull expensive stunts like this to show what “good Christians” they are to win elections.
Review of when laws violate religious freedom goes through our court system, which has just been stacked all the way to the top by corrupt and/or far-right judges. It *should* be illegal, but our mechanisms for stopping it may fail.
I live in Oklahoma and I’m about to start teaching. My soon to be father in law is a pastor. He and I recently started talking about this and just how destructive it can be to faith and to kids. The Bible is not a children’s book — if it was there wouldn’t be children’s Bibles.
How can you teach kids from the Old Testament without mentioning war and death and rape and sex? You really can’t. How can you teach from the New Testament without teaching about evil and sin and all of that fun jazz? You can’t.
If you as a parent feel your kid needs to be taught the Bible at school then you’re failing to teach your kid at home. Stop passing off the things you find hard on teachers. And absolutely stop trying to *force* kids to be Christian because that won’t work.
And for those wondering, I think the loophole I’m going to use in teaching is during world religions units. If I can incorporate the Gospels into teachings about early Christianity or use Genesis to describe the beginnings of Judaism then I should be hitting the new standard without having to actually deliver a sermon to my students.
So, when are the 'good' Christians going to do anything more than gripe about this online?
Until I see that, they're just complicit, and I have to wonder what their limit is for that. Are they going to wait until people are being dragged from their home because they're of the wrong religious type?
Say nothing, do nothing, don't lament the fact that their is no one speaking for you in the end.
Fuck this is stupid.
Genuine question, but what would you have me do about laws made in a state I don't live in? Saying I'm complicit for something happening in a different state seems silly. Respectfully.
What evidence do you have that no Christian is doing anything against this?
And what do you want? Christians to protest that the bible not be taught?
I think Christians have bigger concerns, but yeah it's not the way I would do it.
Well how do we know that isn't happening?
And if 100% of Christians should be out protesting about stuff -- then I would think something like abortion or aid for poverty/countries are a better use of God's time
Jesus only harsh words were for those who hypocritically wielded religious and political power.
This kind of thing is exactly why I can no longer call myself an evangelical. Using the Bible as a political weapon is a sin.
I loved the scene in Saved when she picks up a bible and tells the girl that it's not supposed to be used as a weapon.
God is love. If you use the Bible to justify hate or cruelty you've got Matt 7:23 waiting for you
Jesus gave us Five Commandments:
1. Love God with all your heart, mind, strength, and soul. Luke 10:27, Matt 22:37
2. Love your neighbor as yourself. Luke 10:27, Matt 22:38
3. Treat others as you would want to be treated. Luke 6:31, Matt 7:12
4. Forgive others who sin against you, or the Father will not forgive you. Matt 6:14-15, Matt 18:21-35
5. Spread the Gospel to the entire world. Mark 16:15, Luke 14:23, Matt 28:19-20
If you are doing 2, 3 and 4 in ways that inhibit 5, you're doing them wrong.
I'm from Oklahoma, so I've been hearing about this.
Yes, Christianity/The Bible is important to the history of the US, and we learned as such back in the 90's. We learned about the religious lives of the Pilgrims and the Puritans, the Great Awakening, that churches were a popular place to discuss the Revolution, Christianity's place in the Pro/Anti-Abolition discussion, and so forth. We read 'The Crucible' and the sermons of MLK, Jr. We read the sermon 'Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God', and my English teacher even dressed in a robe and performed it (it was an honors class and it was for educational purposes, not for actual preaching.) As long as the Bible is presented in the context of its effect on history and culture, I'm fine with it.
What I'm afraid of, however, is that this is a form of proselytizing. While I'm a Christian myself, I don't think a public school is the place for a teacher to preach the Gospel. While I am unopposed to voluntary displays of things like the Ten Commandments, I don't think they should be mandated and I feel the same here. This will most likely not stand up in court.
This is pure clown behavior.
I support every person alive becoming familiar with the texts of the Bible, but this is a gross overstep of the government and these teachers aren't equipped to teach it.
If it were my class, this is the only verse we'd study:
>Ezekiel 23
>
> 1The word of the LORD came to me again: 2“Son of man, there were two women,a daughters of the same mother, 3who acted like prostitutes in Egypt,b behaving promiscuously in their youth. Their breasts were fondled there, and their virgin nipples caressed. 4The older one was named Oholah,c and her sister was Oholibah.d They became Mine and gave birth to sons and daughters. As for their names, Oholah represents Samaria and Oholibah represents Jerusalem.
>
> 5“Oholah acted like a prostitute even though she was Mine. She lusted after her lovers, the Assyrians:e warriors 6dressed in blue, governors and prefects, all of them desirable young men, horsemen riding on steeds. 7She offered her sexual favors to them; all of them were the elite of Assyria. She defiled herself with all those she lusted after and with all their idols. 8She didn’t give up her promiscuity that began in Egypt,f when men slept with her in her youth, caressed her virgin nipples, and poured out their lust on her. 9Therefore, I handed her over to her lovers,g the Assyrians she lusted for. 10They exposed her nakedness, seized her sons and daughters, and killed her with the sword. Since they executed judgment against her, she became notorious among women.
>
> 11“Now her sister Oholibah saw this, but she was even more depraved in her lust than Oholah, and made her promiscuous acts worse than those of her sister.h 12She lusted after the Assyrians:i governors and prefects, warriors splendidly dressed, horsemen riding on steeds, all of them desirable young men. 13And I saw that she had defiled herself; both of them had taken the same path. 14But she increased her promiscuity when she saw male figures carved on the wall,j images of the Chaldeans, engraved in vermilion,k 15wearing belts on their waists and flowing turbans on their heads; all of them looked like officers, a depiction of the Babylonians in Chaldea, the land of their birth. 16At the sight of theml she lusted after them and sent messengers to them in Chaldea.m 17Then the Babylonians came to her,n to the bed of love, and defiled her with their lust. But after she was defiled by them, she turned away from them in disgust. 18When she flaunted her promiscuity and exposed her nakedness, I turned away from her in disgust just as I turned away from her sister.o 19Yet she multiplied her acts of promiscuity, remembering the days of her youth when she acted like a prostitute in the land of Egypt 20and lusted after their lovers, whose sexual members were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of stallions. 21So you revisited the indecency of your youth, when the Egyptians caressed your nipples to enjoy your youthful breasts.
If only there were specific places, open to the public where they could learn about the Bible. Maybe have weekly gatherings to discuss. Even higher education school specifically for the subject.
I can see how this could be contentious. People really don't want religion forced on their kids.
However I remember in public highschool while analyzing literature, many kids would complain when the teacher would explain how certaing things in other books were based on things that happened in the bible. But the teacher said that's just the way that english literature was written as it was the most common religion in the english speaking world. Understanding the bible can give you a lot of insight into literature and history.
That doesn't mean you have to believe it. I think it really depends on how they teach it, and at what level. They should also be learning about other religions as well so that people have a better understanding of other people's cultures.
My kids took a World Religions class in highschool. Learned about all the major world religions including native american beliefs.
I think that handled properly, learning about the bible and other religions could be very beneficial to students. Although I doubt that's what they're going for here.
The quote in the video
>"A necessary historical document to teach our kids about the history of this country"
Isn't necessarily wrong, but I really don't think they are trying to give kids an objective view of the bible from a historical perspective in this case.
That is an overly sympathetic interpretation as to what the case is here though, the Superintendent of schools didn't say that the all religious and legal texts must be included within their historical framework and interpreted in such. Rather that the 10 Commandments and Bible must be taught.
"A necessary historical document to teach our kids about the history of this country"
Why not then mandate the teaching of the Enlightenment thinkers? Common Sense and The Federalist Papers? Instead he specifically is mandating the Judeo-Christian text as a ***requirement***.
Very much misunderstanding communism. As far as I understand, most communist countries are actually the opposite. Because things like education are free, students are admitted to certain fields based on standardized tests. If you want a highly respected job like a doctor or engineer, you have to earn your way into that job through hard work.
In a capitalist country where people can pay to get into certain schools, and some of the smartest people can't afford to go to school, there's much fewer people who are succeeding just based on merit. Plus the US invented "No child left behind", which basically sound a lot like what your teacher was describing. Where everyone gets a pass and a lot of students get a worse education as a result.
> many kids would complain when the teacher would explain how certaing things in other books were based on things that happened in the bible
Did they really? Could you give us an example of a child protesting biblical allusions? Ngl, that sounds misinterpreted at best.
When I was a senior in high school we read a lot of Biblical allusions and the non-Christians in class complained about how they didn’t understand the allusion. My teacher promptly told them that if they planned to actually be scholars in the English language (which some of them actually are in school right now studying English) then they needed to at least familiarize themselves with the more basic Bible stories.
Oh sure, that's how involving the state in religion always work. The state picks out your particular interpretation, acknowledges it as objectively correct, and manages to get people on the same page in a way two thousand years of theological discussion has failed to.
A teacher with an education degree focused on math, science, or reading probably isn't the best person to teach a government-designed bible curriculum.
With how much Conservatives talk about not trusting the government, I'm not sure why they want the government to be in charge of their kid's bible curriculum.
What I find most amusing is that the States proposing stuff like this tend to be at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to education, across the board. Poor graduation rates, literacy, et cetera.
Maybe they should focus less on making kids read the Bible and more on making sure they can read at all.
This is absolutely disgusting and repulsive. I don’t understand how EVERYONE OF YOU don’t find this scary. I thought what made the U.S. different was individual freedom??? If you want to teach your kids the Bible in school you pay for a private school. If this was any other religion that was indoctrinating students yall wouldn’t have it. VOTE the entirety of the country relies on it
Will they also allow the Quran? The Kangyur? or other holy texts from other religions?
No??? ... just Christians because they believe themselves above everyone else?
Public schools need to focus on teaching our children how to read and write, math and history. Critical thinking needs to be learned as well.
It is very disheartening to hear people want this in public schools.
Whose Biblical doctrine?
Catholic or Protestant?
Baptist, Methodist, or Church of Christ?
Not only will this stir up Christian V non Christian conflict but also denominational conflict.
I am a Christian and I would prefer that my children are being taught basics from as much of a neutral political position as possible. I don’t expect that to be the case because everyone has a bit of an agenda.
If the Bible were to be taught, I would rather it be taught by an expert in the material rather than a secular humanist gay teacher who hates its very existence.
“Required” is not the way. Optional classes, clubs, etc I’m not opposed to. I don’t even mind biblical scriptures emblazoned on the walls and such, but a forced teaching? Doesn’t sound good to me.
They wouldn't like what I taught from the Bible.
I went to, arguably, the *queerest* seminary in the country. And I've got a copy of "A Game for Good Christians" in the living room. I know *all* the juicy, hippie, socialist of the Bible to get into.
I feel it should not be required, kids who are forced to read it will just read it to get it over with, not actually soak up the information and think deeply about the stories and meanings. I feel it will deter more people away from the religion as it is being forced… that’s what had me steer away from Catholicism, but now I am veering back into it willingly, and that is the key right there… going into religion willingly with full openness with God, I feel that is the right way, not forced obligation.
Well, the questions is not whether we should or shouldn't, but how and by whom, also which other holy textbooks are including in this teachings?
Because you know, freedom of religion and from religion and stuff.
That's terrible! There is separation of church and state for a reason. I don't want Christianity forced on anyone! There's freedom of religion for goodness sake! Plus, the people teaching, can you imagine if they have religious trauma?!
They need to stop. This will do nothing but fuel fires of separation and hatred. :(
To portray the Bible in a secular and objective manner in public schools means that the Bible must be subjected to critical theory like any other secular text. Contradictions, mistakes, superstitions, general ignorance of any early Iron Age culture, and the massive amount of glorified horror in the text could be picked apart and examined in detail if a teacher wanted to make a point.
This is how secular history texts are treated as a matter of course.
Is this really what Christians want?
Thomas Jefferson's scissors would be a mild approach in contrast.
If it was just teaching about the history of the Bible, then I think that would be fine. But I don’t think that teaching from the Bible in school is a good idea. Also, I don’t think it’s legal under their states constitution, and possibly the federal one.
My question is how.
If the bible is being taught from an academic standpoint. I think its totally reasonable. To know the bible in the west in important. Its as culturally significant as something can get.
To preach it is another thing.
But academically people should be learning about the bible.
Unfortunately there’s private schools which are religious or there’s public which are not religious. Only option is homeschooling but not everyone can do that when cost of living is so high and you’d have to have a parent home with them during the day. Plus you’d have to be a good teacher, which obviously some are not. This is a huge disservice to these children
absolutely horrible idea. separate church and state unless you want all religions to be taught equally. and religions like islam do not need to be taught to children.
It's just a book.
You act like people who are taught it aren't "smart" enough to not believe it or have the ability to think for themselves.
No different then any book assigned by the English teach by principle
In Germany, schools teach religion, but it’s either Catholic or Lutheran, not fundamentalist crap. Also, you learn a bit about other religions. No-Christians can take ethics instead. Sadly, this kind of compromise is unlikely in the US. Who will teach these courses? Religious education is not a major in most American universities.
If it’s taught as an essential text providing for the foundation of Western civilisation this is great! If taught as a way to convert students, this will be counter productive.
Christians are forcing religion where it's not wanted so don't look surprised when Gen Alpha becomes even more secular and anti-religion than Gen Z. Brainwashing works best when the subject is isolated and these kids have social media
Once again lazy Christians (fake?) hide behind the state to do what THEY are supposed to. Spreading the word teaching Christ's commands and making disciples was given to the body not the state. No worse idea than having someone unqualified or an unbeliever teach scripture.
Terrible idea!
The problem is that while things like these *after school Satan clubs that are slowly opening up in schools* are giving kids a choice, where as we are forcing kids to learn about the Bible, without giving them a choice.
We’re making the enemy’s teachings seem more alluring just by forcing The Bible on kids.
I wonder which Bible they will be teaching? Have they come up with a study plan? Should we read Revelation to our first and second graders? Or even our seniors for that matter. Way to scare the hell out of kids 👍🏻👍🏾👍🏿👍
As a devout Christian I am against it. When God’s Holy Word falls into a mouth of people with money and power, then it turns into a heresy. They will twist the meaning however they want according to their own standard and shut each mouth in the class who sees another meaning and reads what isn’t supposed to be read by their standard.
Spreading God’s Word and outlining it must be the prerogative of Christ’s Church only ⛪️, not the Devil’s government!
Very bad idea at this point. Everyone know what Ten Commandants are. But to have it in school is a bad idea. Nobody can keep the law, it was given to nation of israel
When I was in school, I hated all the books I was forced to read. Until a few years later I got bored and read them again, and I actually really liked them. Forcing kids to read the Bible is going to make them never WANT to read the Bible. A good alternative would be having different classes for each religion and allowing students to pick one to study, freedom comes with interest. they don’t have to believe in it of course, but it’s generally good to be cultured and knowledgeable about different beliefs around the world. Forcing it to be ONLY Christianity’s religious text though? Not a good idea, and I’m Christian.
There's nothing that will get kids to hate the bible more than being forced to read it in school.
I don't understand how people don't understand this
This is aimed at the conservative voting public, not students, the effect on whom is almost irrelevant. What's being offered, to boost these shameless legislators' careers, is a "win" in the culture war by a visible display of dominance.
You are exactly right and it's a shame that isn't obvious to everybody.
The Bible is already offered as a elective course as well. Seems fine to just stick with that.
An elective is fine because they can elect to take the class. I think a Bible as literature class would be fine. As an elective.
Even if the Bible is portrayed in a non secular way, this is very dangerous direction to be heading.
Damn not at my school i don’t know we’re you live
I read that Oklahoma schools offer it as a elective.
But you didn't. So no a generation of kids will hate the Bible.
"You"? Is this person responsible personally and directly? Strange word to use there. Not sure why you'd use it. >So no a generation of kids will hate the Bible. That's conjecture. A small minority of children of that particular generation, perhaps.
Atheists like me are cackling with the shenanigans some of these teachers could pull. The state wants the Bible taught to children? Well, it's gonna get *taught*. Alright kids, open your Bibles up to Numbers 31! "17 Now therefore kill every boy, and kill every woman who has been intimate with a man in bed 18 But all the women children, who have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves." Your homework assignment is to ask your parents about this verse. Bring back a paragraph with your parent's signature on it explaining the historical context on this."
Ok class, today were going to be discussing the historical motivations behind the writing of Genesis chapter 1, and how the author most likely intended it to replace the older creation story found in Genesis 2-3. We'll also be comparing it to the Babylonian creation myth that it's clearly inspired by.
I'm a Christian, and even I don't think some of those parents would want me teaching the Bible to their children. This is going to open up such a massive can of worms, I'm almost chuckling at the thought of it.
Judges 1:19: "And the Lord was with Judah; and he drave out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron." You need to install Lord 2.0 for Iron Chariots. Please update your subscription.
That is..actually interesting and neccesary. Would also add the task of comparing to other flood stories so thst they can see there is a common kernel and consistency to the events registered by our ancestors, just looked from a different lense
Wait, you are telling me that floods happen anywhere there are rivers? GTFO!
I don’t know if you can say “*clearly* inspired by”. Like, floods happen anywhere there’s a river, most religions involve a flood myth.
I was thinking more of a Jewish yeshiva style of Bible study involving learning Hebrew, followed by memorizing the text along with Talmud and Mishnah. The fundies would complain because it isn’t *Christian* Bible study…
Ask your parents how they knew which children had not laid with a man
Only shenanigans for stupid parents. Any serious person just explains these were the customs and commmandements given to ancient people in order to support their culture in a specific environment. Not threatening at all
Tomorrow we will read [Judges 19](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Judges+19&version=NRSVUE) "The Levite and his Concubine" and compare it to [Genesis 18-19](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+18%3A16-Genesis+19%3A29&version=NRSVUE) "God's Judgement on Sodom" Your assignment is an essay on why the men in Gibeah raped the man's concubine when the men in Sodom would not settle for Lot's daughters.
I was just thinking that. Like, I could be super eager to read a book on my own, but the moment it was assigned for a class, it was pure drudgery.
Exactly idk about this law...
that's with mmost thinggs in scchool.
It's so weird this is a thing there
“Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion”
But they’re not *establishing* a religion. They’re *perpetuating* a religion. That’s completely different. /s
It doesn’t say “establishing religion.” Read it again more slowly.
"Establishing" also doesn't mean "Starting" in the context but is a legal term meaning "Making this the official religion of the country".
The Superintendent and his supporters know this will wind up in the courts. If this struck down, well they gave a try and proved their bone fides to the voters to whom they want to appeal. If they succeed in the courts at first, it will open a can of worms based on but not limited to What they want to teach about the Bible. What the teachers know of the Bible. The reaction of families who aren’t Christian. The reaction of Christian families that don’t want this either. This is going to cause so many problems.
>The Superintendent and his supporters know this will wind up in the courts. This is the part I think its easy to overlook. I'm somewhat less concerned about the fact that the Superintendent wants to try this, or that Alabama wants to put the 10 commandments in every room. These people didn't come up with these ideas yesterday. I am more concerned that there are people out there watching the judicial landscape, keeping track of which judges are in which districts, who is being appointed where, and what is likely to come up in the near future - and those people tapped this Superintendent on the shoulder and said, "Now is a good time if you want to try that." Makes me worry that they know something I don't.
Sounds very similar to when people who aren't teachers unilaterally decide what teachers should be teaching. The say they want teachers to teach computer programming, without giving the teachers any guidance into what they should actually be teaching, or giving them any resources to learn the material themselves so that they can teach it properly. Same goes for all the other stuff they are adding to the curriculum.
Well, I am a teacher, and I have had to decline to teach Algebra once (I'm an art teacher who earned Cs in high school algebra). I am also Catholic, and I would not want my kids taught the Bible through the lens of American Bible Belt Christianity.
This! This needs to be repeated. I am also a Christian, and I would not want my kids learning Christianity from anyone but their priest and parents. Teachers are dealing with too much already, stop doing this TO THEM!
Preach it, CarolinaGirl!
As an orthodox Christian, I completely agree that I don’t want my child being taught the Bible from an American point of view.
Never mind that it’s probably not the full thing anyway, but an abridged Protestant version.
Exactly!
It's almost inevitable that given enough time they will have a key people in just right places to ensure it can't be successfully challenged.
My husband is a teacher here in Oklahoma, and we’ve been talking amongst other teachers about the logistics of this. A few of us think they’re going to have videos in the beginning that the teachers have to stream to show the kids since not all teachers know religion themselves. They’ll mandate those universal videos and add other things to the curriculum and make the teachers learn about them too, then build off of it.
Might I recommend the Bible intro course lectures available on the Yale Divinity School YT channel as a start-off point.
Ahhh yes, it’s a huge Bible though. And add on more that they have to teach to children in addition to the huge workload they already have
I would happily teach the bible in a method that would make the people I teach far, far less likely to be Christian. If you want me to teach the Bible, I'm going to teach the Bible.
Yes I don't think it is a good idea tbh.. Freedom of religion is a right. Whether you are Christian or not, your state's curriculum should offer all the religions books in that case. I don't support this at all. I'm not sure how I feel about this. Is it a victory or is this just a messy riot in the making? What about Muslims and Buddhists, etc I'd pull my kid out of this school if I had any since it's not right to force religion on anybody It's only gonna cause problems
He's not trying to push the Bible into schools, he's trying to push his own political agendas. Religion has been a vector in such political practices for centuries. It is why many left Europe for the America's, ESPECIALLY the Mayflower. Secularism is a two-way street. It keeps religion out of our state and the state out of our religion. If you are gonna put a religious text in a classroom, you better put in all of them. That includes the Quran, the Torah, even the Necronomicon.
What happens when a six year old kid asks their teacher what adultery is? Guess we're gonna need sex ed for first graders now.
“When a mommy and her work friend love each other very much…”
God did say make love to thy neighbor 😬
I think you’re mixing up the part about coveting thy neighbor’s ass…
Lol
I went to a Christian school from 3rd to 6th grade and one of my core memories is the school-wide chapel every morning. They were teaching about something and then mentioned the word “sodomy”. I said out loud to my classmates “what’s sodomy?” and obviously I said it pretty loud. The other people started busting up laughing and I never got the answer in chapel. Guess what? I “Ask Jeeves-ed” it (similar to googling back in the day)and got a full demonstration. 3rd grade is way way way too early to be teaching kids this stuff.
And the Bible gets much more graphic than categorizing sex acts by their faithfulness
More like when they ask their teacher if it's okay to be gay
I doubt they will get into all of that. This video doesn't even say what exactly will be taught, and for how long. "Teaching the bible" could just be talking about how it was written, or when, or where. It is maybe the most important book in history, so yeah it should be at least mentioned in school.
Why would they make a 6 year old read the bible? Surely this is for mid-high schoolers or whenever forced reading is already introduced
only other crazy ideas are allowed to poison their brain wwwith.
How to make kids to hate religion.
The party of big government.
They should really just have a religion class that teaches multiple religions. If you don’t teach kids about it the only info they will get is from their family or the media, both of which are always biased.
Yeah I think the Bible should be taught in line with the mainstream academic consensus on its authorship, historicity, etc.
Even just teaching the practices and central mythology of different religions without taking any position on what is true is perfectly fine. It’s good to know how people think. And understanding western literature without the Bible is a lot more difficult.
Unless it’s basically just a survey of the practices associated with major feast days, the information presented is likely to be wildly inaccurate. People have a tendency to take all the main concepts in their own religion and map other religions onto that. It’s a hard habit to break, and there’s zero chance of getting enough competent religion teachers into public schools to even make it a widespread elective, let alone a required course.
Religious curriculum explaining some basics of each faith is sufficient for most people. Most elementary school teachers in the UK can tell you basic facts/stories about Judaism, Islam, Christianity, Buddhism, Hinduism, Jainism. Some schools go further and explore newer religions like Baha'i The problem for some religious people is that when you expose children to the "world", they will start noticing links between religions e.g. flood scenario occurring for Noah's Ark, Gilgamesh ending, Matsya (Vishnu in the form of a fish warning of a flood) etc. Some might worry this will result in people falling away from faith as they ask questions.
Maybe.
Replace the word literature with culture, mindset and values
I took a mythology class in Highschool. We understood the place of myth within history and learned an appreciation for it. There is no literature with more of an impact on our modern world than the Bible, so while i don't agree with forcing schools to teach on it, i've always felt a little bit odd how terrified we are of bringing it up in school. Talk about Zeus as much as you want, but you dare not mention Christ.
Funny enough my public school had decades ago but it was removed ironically by a Christians group cause they also talked about Buddhism and Spiritualism.
I went to a catholic school in Maryland and learned all about Islam and Judaism and the various Christian denominations that arose during the reformation and colonial periods. They obviously put Catholicism at the top of the hierarchy, but it was fairly respectful toward others’ beliefs in comparison to most of the crazy stuff happening today.
Honestly that better than the catholic schools in my area.
Sure they should, but the whole point of this exercise is to elevate their version of Christianity above all other religious beliefs, Christian or not. There’s no way these people would ever support the idea of teaching about other religions in schools.
When I was in grade school, in our history class we literally learned about world religions akd various figures.
Totally. Because educators never teach their bias to kids…
Even if some teachers tried to indoctrinate, it'd be better than total ignorance. My senior year of high school our AP Gov teacher mentioned that atheists were the most distrusted demographic when running for office; it turned out half the class didn't know what atheism was.
I’m not debating that. I’m debating the idea that information they get from a teacher is by definition superior to that of a parent or media. It commonly isn’t and can be tainted with bias the same as any other source.
Parents/media can entirely fail to acknowledge the existence of demographics, as in my example, where several people had made it to the age of 18 without knowing what atheism was.
And schools can fail to educate, and do frequently
We had this as an elective course in high school
Good idea
This is how my social studies class was in middle school. I’m 53 and went to public school in the Washington DC metropolitan area.
It's called 'history' you ignora.. But you want to change that, *too*. Be. Prepared.
Meanwhile, frequently found on this sub: “why is Christianity losing followers?”
Still a mystery 😂
Yeah. At some point we should ask us, if everyone out there truly doesn't understand how loving we are, are they all idiots or are we just not acting as much out of love as we pretend to? If we heared someone talk about christians like christians talk about other faiths, atheists or queer people, we would be outraged.
I think it’s a great shame that the quiet, consistent and compassionate message of Christ doesn’t seem to compete well with all the power stuff that’s everywhere these days. What was masquerading as Christianity was really white nationalism.
Project 2025 are/is trying everything to get themselves started...
This has to be one of the scariest and realest threats I've seen from any political party so far. Let's say, for argument's sake, they actually do have good intentions behind Project 2025... doesn't that still open the door for a Christofascist government takeover in the future? I mean, I'm Christian, but damn... I don't want people going to jail because they don't believe what I believe.
I agree with you. My best friend is Atheist and I love him like a brother. I would never want the power of the state to inhibit his decisions. I would fight for his freedom.
At the college I work for, we get a few Omani students every year for one of our programs, all of them are Muslim and they're extremely kind and hospitable, they're always eager to share their culture and since my father is their instructor, I get to join him with them for a delicious meal of Omani food from time to time. It actually hurts my heart to think of being in a country where them doing that would risk them being kicked out of our country, or worse.
As an atheist, I also never want the power of the state to inhibit other people's beliefs, or the practice thereof. These kinds of laws aren't just a problem for non-Christians, but for Christians of different denominations, because they're not fundamentally about educating people, but asserting through symbolic gestures that one sect or denomination has preferential status.
This. It has nothing to do with religion and everything to do with power; they want what they believe to be enforced, and any difference is a problem. It starts with the easy to target differences, until they're targeting everyone whos not on their side.
Obviously, the Inquisition was bad, but what they are doing is not?
Not to mention that the things that define "Christian" to them are things American Christianity is actually split down the middle on. They're not requiring more care for the poor, sick, widows, etc. They're going off about LGBT issues and abortion.
So, they are disobeying Father and Yeshua, in fact sinning against "Love your neighbor". That wide road is overflowing...
you don't want your country being taken over by romman catholics and neo chsrismatic evangelicals and nar, but old school bbileelievvers may wwork, because they ddon't want power and influence.
Old school believers in the US means fundamentalist evangelicals and they do want power and influence.
also catholics and marxists. baptists n puritans don't
Certain Baptists definitely do. IFB Baptists definitely want influence and power, I sat in their congregations from the time I was born until I was old enough to leave and they love talking about America being a Christian nation, kicking out anyone else, and making people convert.
The least Christian time of my life was when I was pushed towards Christianity by other people. This is just politicians using our religion to gain votes. May as well start exchanging currency in a church.
Christian and public school teacher here. I don't like this on several levels, However, here are some things to give pause. (1) It'll get challenged very quickly and likely struck down. This is just the OKlahoma lawmaker grandstanding (2) Anyone with an ounce of sense should realize how this is going to go *very* quickly. "Okay kids, today we're studying how the first chapter says the world was created in six days. The moral here is that Christianity is based on an unreliable narrative." Or: "Now today we're going to read about Lots two daughters drugging their dad so they can have sex with them." Or: "This portion, about how Jacob's uncle Laban was cheating him, is clearly about the element of manipulation and exploitation inherent in a capitalist system." "Teach on the Bible" is such an incredibly vague setup. You could give lessons on the Koran every day, it wouldn't mean you were being positive about it.
isn't this a violation of the constitution
I'm pretty sure this can get removed instantly and the idiots responsible fired - I mean, you guys are still at least officially secular, right?
They are going to challenge this at the supreme court. In normal circumstances yes, this is illegal. The spin that they are going with this though is that the Bible was of historical significance at the birth of the nation and it is being taught just as a teacher would teach about the Declaration of Independence. This will obviously be challenged in court. They are going to try and make the case that they are not pushing religion even though it’s pretty obvious that they are. Idk how the Supreme Court will rule on it
Yeah, that's my thought too. They're TRYING to get this to the Supreme Court so that previous cases can be overturned.
>They are going to challenge this at the supreme court. Of course they, and they will lose. And they know that. This is all performative. These people know their policies do nothing to improve the lives of their citizens so they have to pull expensive stunts like this to show what “good Christians” they are to win elections.
>Of course they, and they will lose. I would not be so certain. Not with this court.
I agree. But it seems so blatantly unconstitutional to me that I’m still 90% sure. OTOH, I have been known to be wrong on occasion. :-)
The only way the historical argument would hold up is if the curriculum was in a state almost no Christian would tolerate.
It's possible the Oklahoma state Supreme Court could strike it down, they recently disallowed state funding to a religious charter school
Review of when laws violate religious freedom goes through our court system, which has just been stacked all the way to the top by corrupt and/or far-right judges. It *should* be illegal, but our mechanisms for stopping it may fail.
I live in Oklahoma and I’m about to start teaching. My soon to be father in law is a pastor. He and I recently started talking about this and just how destructive it can be to faith and to kids. The Bible is not a children’s book — if it was there wouldn’t be children’s Bibles. How can you teach kids from the Old Testament without mentioning war and death and rape and sex? You really can’t. How can you teach from the New Testament without teaching about evil and sin and all of that fun jazz? You can’t. If you as a parent feel your kid needs to be taught the Bible at school then you’re failing to teach your kid at home. Stop passing off the things you find hard on teachers. And absolutely stop trying to *force* kids to be Christian because that won’t work. And for those wondering, I think the loophole I’m going to use in teaching is during world religions units. If I can incorporate the Gospels into teachings about early Christianity or use Genesis to describe the beginnings of Judaism then I should be hitting the new standard without having to actually deliver a sermon to my students.
Enough Of This Malarkey VOTE BLUE NOW
So, when are the 'good' Christians going to do anything more than gripe about this online? Until I see that, they're just complicit, and I have to wonder what their limit is for that. Are they going to wait until people are being dragged from their home because they're of the wrong religious type? Say nothing, do nothing, don't lament the fact that their is no one speaking for you in the end. Fuck this is stupid.
Genuine question, but what would you have me do about laws made in a state I don't live in? Saying I'm complicit for something happening in a different state seems silly. Respectfully.
What evidence do you have that no Christian is doing anything against this? And what do you want? Christians to protest that the bible not be taught? I think Christians have bigger concerns, but yeah it's not the way I would do it.
Christians to protest that the Bible should not be mandated in public schools…
Well how do we know that isn't happening? And if 100% of Christians should be out protesting about stuff -- then I would think something like abortion or aid for poverty/countries are a better use of God's time
I would think protecting America’s god given right of freedom would be a better use of God’s given time.
Jesus only harsh words were for those who hypocritically wielded religious and political power. This kind of thing is exactly why I can no longer call myself an evangelical. Using the Bible as a political weapon is a sin.
I loved the scene in Saved when she picks up a bible and tells the girl that it's not supposed to be used as a weapon. God is love. If you use the Bible to justify hate or cruelty you've got Matt 7:23 waiting for you
Jesus gave us Five Commandments: 1. Love God with all your heart, mind, strength, and soul. Luke 10:27, Matt 22:37 2. Love your neighbor as yourself. Luke 10:27, Matt 22:38 3. Treat others as you would want to be treated. Luke 6:31, Matt 7:12 4. Forgive others who sin against you, or the Father will not forgive you. Matt 6:14-15, Matt 18:21-35 5. Spread the Gospel to the entire world. Mark 16:15, Luke 14:23, Matt 28:19-20 If you are doing 2, 3 and 4 in ways that inhibit 5, you're doing them wrong.
I'm from Oklahoma, so I've been hearing about this. Yes, Christianity/The Bible is important to the history of the US, and we learned as such back in the 90's. We learned about the religious lives of the Pilgrims and the Puritans, the Great Awakening, that churches were a popular place to discuss the Revolution, Christianity's place in the Pro/Anti-Abolition discussion, and so forth. We read 'The Crucible' and the sermons of MLK, Jr. We read the sermon 'Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God', and my English teacher even dressed in a robe and performed it (it was an honors class and it was for educational purposes, not for actual preaching.) As long as the Bible is presented in the context of its effect on history and culture, I'm fine with it. What I'm afraid of, however, is that this is a form of proselytizing. While I'm a Christian myself, I don't think a public school is the place for a teacher to preach the Gospel. While I am unopposed to voluntary displays of things like the Ten Commandments, I don't think they should be mandated and I feel the same here. This will most likely not stand up in court.
This is pure clown behavior. I support every person alive becoming familiar with the texts of the Bible, but this is a gross overstep of the government and these teachers aren't equipped to teach it. If it were my class, this is the only verse we'd study: >Ezekiel 23 > > 1The word of the LORD came to me again: 2“Son of man, there were two women,a daughters of the same mother, 3who acted like prostitutes in Egypt,b behaving promiscuously in their youth. Their breasts were fondled there, and their virgin nipples caressed. 4The older one was named Oholah,c and her sister was Oholibah.d They became Mine and gave birth to sons and daughters. As for their names, Oholah represents Samaria and Oholibah represents Jerusalem. > > 5“Oholah acted like a prostitute even though she was Mine. She lusted after her lovers, the Assyrians:e warriors 6dressed in blue, governors and prefects, all of them desirable young men, horsemen riding on steeds. 7She offered her sexual favors to them; all of them were the elite of Assyria. She defiled herself with all those she lusted after and with all their idols. 8She didn’t give up her promiscuity that began in Egypt,f when men slept with her in her youth, caressed her virgin nipples, and poured out their lust on her. 9Therefore, I handed her over to her lovers,g the Assyrians she lusted for. 10They exposed her nakedness, seized her sons and daughters, and killed her with the sword. Since they executed judgment against her, she became notorious among women. > > 11“Now her sister Oholibah saw this, but she was even more depraved in her lust than Oholah, and made her promiscuous acts worse than those of her sister.h 12She lusted after the Assyrians:i governors and prefects, warriors splendidly dressed, horsemen riding on steeds, all of them desirable young men. 13And I saw that she had defiled herself; both of them had taken the same path. 14But she increased her promiscuity when she saw male figures carved on the wall,j images of the Chaldeans, engraved in vermilion,k 15wearing belts on their waists and flowing turbans on their heads; all of them looked like officers, a depiction of the Babylonians in Chaldea, the land of their birth. 16At the sight of theml she lusted after them and sent messengers to them in Chaldea.m 17Then the Babylonians came to her,n to the bed of love, and defiled her with their lust. But after she was defiled by them, she turned away from them in disgust. 18When she flaunted her promiscuity and exposed her nakedness, I turned away from her in disgust just as I turned away from her sister.o 19Yet she multiplied her acts of promiscuity, remembering the days of her youth when she acted like a prostitute in the land of Egypt 20and lusted after their lovers, whose sexual members were like those of donkeys and whose emission was like that of stallions. 21So you revisited the indecency of your youth, when the Egyptians caressed your nipples to enjoy your youthful breasts.
This is one of my go-tos as well. Time for little Timmy and Sally to study up on donkey dicks and horse jizz!
If only there were specific places, open to the public where they could learn about the Bible. Maybe have weekly gatherings to discuss. Even higher education school specifically for the subject.
I can see how this could be contentious. People really don't want religion forced on their kids. However I remember in public highschool while analyzing literature, many kids would complain when the teacher would explain how certaing things in other books were based on things that happened in the bible. But the teacher said that's just the way that english literature was written as it was the most common religion in the english speaking world. Understanding the bible can give you a lot of insight into literature and history. That doesn't mean you have to believe it. I think it really depends on how they teach it, and at what level. They should also be learning about other religions as well so that people have a better understanding of other people's cultures. My kids took a World Religions class in highschool. Learned about all the major world religions including native american beliefs. I think that handled properly, learning about the bible and other religions could be very beneficial to students. Although I doubt that's what they're going for here. The quote in the video >"A necessary historical document to teach our kids about the history of this country" Isn't necessarily wrong, but I really don't think they are trying to give kids an objective view of the bible from a historical perspective in this case.
That is an overly sympathetic interpretation as to what the case is here though, the Superintendent of schools didn't say that the all religious and legal texts must be included within their historical framework and interpreted in such. Rather that the 10 Commandments and Bible must be taught. "A necessary historical document to teach our kids about the history of this country" Why not then mandate the teaching of the Enlightenment thinkers? Common Sense and The Federalist Papers? Instead he specifically is mandating the Judeo-Christian text as a ***requirement***.
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Very much misunderstanding communism. As far as I understand, most communist countries are actually the opposite. Because things like education are free, students are admitted to certain fields based on standardized tests. If you want a highly respected job like a doctor or engineer, you have to earn your way into that job through hard work. In a capitalist country where people can pay to get into certain schools, and some of the smartest people can't afford to go to school, there's much fewer people who are succeeding just based on merit. Plus the US invented "No child left behind", which basically sound a lot like what your teacher was describing. Where everyone gets a pass and a lot of students get a worse education as a result.
> many kids would complain when the teacher would explain how certaing things in other books were based on things that happened in the bible Did they really? Could you give us an example of a child protesting biblical allusions? Ngl, that sounds misinterpreted at best.
When I was a senior in high school we read a lot of Biblical allusions and the non-Christians in class complained about how they didn’t understand the allusion. My teacher promptly told them that if they planned to actually be scholars in the English language (which some of them actually are in school right now studying English) then they needed to at least familiarize themselves with the more basic Bible stories.
Well hopefully it’s taught correctly.
Oh sure, that's how involving the state in religion always work. The state picks out your particular interpretation, acknowledges it as objectively correct, and manages to get people on the same page in a way two thousand years of theological discussion has failed to.
For sure.
It won't be.
I would be you’re right.
OMG OMG That is too cool buuuuuuut........ Everyone should have freedom of religion so I could not vote for this 😞
A teacher with an education degree focused on math, science, or reading probably isn't the best person to teach a government-designed bible curriculum. With how much Conservatives talk about not trusting the government, I'm not sure why they want the government to be in charge of their kid's bible curriculum.
What I find most amusing is that the States proposing stuff like this tend to be at the bottom of the barrel when it comes to education, across the board. Poor graduation rates, literacy, et cetera. Maybe they should focus less on making kids read the Bible and more on making sure they can read at all.
This is absolutely disgusting and repulsive. I don’t understand how EVERYONE OF YOU don’t find this scary. I thought what made the U.S. different was individual freedom??? If you want to teach your kids the Bible in school you pay for a private school. If this was any other religion that was indoctrinating students yall wouldn’t have it. VOTE the entirety of the country relies on it
Will they also allow the Quran? The Kangyur? or other holy texts from other religions? No??? ... just Christians because they believe themselves above everyone else?
Public schools need to focus on teaching our children how to read and write, math and history. Critical thinking needs to be learned as well. It is very disheartening to hear people want this in public schools.
Whose Biblical doctrine? Catholic or Protestant? Baptist, Methodist, or Church of Christ? Not only will this stir up Christian V non Christian conflict but also denominational conflict.
Disgusting. This is the opposite of religious freedom.
This is what creates athiests
They should open this up to allow other faiths, too. Let kids read the Torah and the Bhagavadgita. Nothing wrong with a little culture.
I am a Christian and I would prefer that my children are being taught basics from as much of a neutral political position as possible. I don’t expect that to be the case because everyone has a bit of an agenda. If the Bible were to be taught, I would rather it be taught by an expert in the material rather than a secular humanist gay teacher who hates its very existence. “Required” is not the way. Optional classes, clubs, etc I’m not opposed to. I don’t even mind biblical scriptures emblazoned on the walls and such, but a forced teaching? Doesn’t sound good to me.
Fun fact: the Federalist Papers quote from the Bible exactly zero times. The Bible is quoted only in the anti-Federalist papers.
They wouldn't like what I taught from the Bible. I went to, arguably, the *queerest* seminary in the country. And I've got a copy of "A Game for Good Christians" in the living room. I know *all* the juicy, hippie, socialist of the Bible to get into.
I feel it should not be required, kids who are forced to read it will just read it to get it over with, not actually soak up the information and think deeply about the stories and meanings. I feel it will deter more people away from the religion as it is being forced… that’s what had me steer away from Catholicism, but now I am veering back into it willingly, and that is the key right there… going into religion willingly with full openness with God, I feel that is the right way, not forced obligation.
I highly doubt this would be effective.
Well, the questions is not whether we should or shouldn't, but how and by whom, also which other holy textbooks are including in this teachings? Because you know, freedom of religion and from religion and stuff.
People hate reading because they were forced to read classics in school. Now they'll hate the Bible. *sigh*
Are all students required to study it? If so, that's a slippery slope to a theocracy. Even Christians should be wary.
I don't know how much the separation of church and state could be any more clear. Any other religion and we would have a mob.
In the sense of neutral RE? Seems fine. I remember at university I met someone who said she didn't know who Moses was.
Kids need morality right now more than ever, but this just opens the door for the Quran and Book of Mormon or book of satan to be taught in school
That's terrible! There is separation of church and state for a reason. I don't want Christianity forced on anyone! There's freedom of religion for goodness sake! Plus, the people teaching, can you imagine if they have religious trauma?! They need to stop. This will do nothing but fuel fires of separation and hatred. :(
This is a bad idea and should be struck down and Ryan Walter's should be removed. There ahoukd be a class to learn about all religions.
This isn’t gonna go well
Nothing wrong teaching good moral standards to kids. I don't know why atheist and so called "christians" are yapping about.
Im sure the people putting this law into play are VERY religious /s
I pray that the teachers don't hate monger or shame so that their experience with gospel is seen as a sacred and safe space
To portray the Bible in a secular and objective manner in public schools means that the Bible must be subjected to critical theory like any other secular text. Contradictions, mistakes, superstitions, general ignorance of any early Iron Age culture, and the massive amount of glorified horror in the text could be picked apart and examined in detail if a teacher wanted to make a point. This is how secular history texts are treated as a matter of course. Is this really what Christians want? Thomas Jefferson's scissors would be a mild approach in contrast.
If it was just teaching about the history of the Bible, then I think that would be fine. But I don’t think that teaching from the Bible in school is a good idea. Also, I don’t think it’s legal under their states constitution, and possibly the federal one.
Not a problem, as the human mind is capable of critical thinking. It kinda balances out what is being taught in schools now.
My question is how. If the bible is being taught from an academic standpoint. I think its totally reasonable. To know the bible in the west in important. Its as culturally significant as something can get. To preach it is another thing. But academically people should be learning about the bible.
This is a mistake, and the place for the Bible is not in public schools.
Unfortunately there’s private schools which are religious or there’s public which are not religious. Only option is homeschooling but not everyone can do that when cost of living is so high and you’d have to have a parent home with them during the day. Plus you’d have to be a good teacher, which obviously some are not. This is a huge disservice to these children
Let's gooooooooo
At least the kids won't be conned by posers, such as Kenneth Copeland, by knowing what aligns with the Word and what doesn't.
absolutely horrible idea. separate church and state unless you want all religions to be taught equally. and religions like islam do not need to be taught to children.
which translation?
It's just a book. You act like people who are taught it aren't "smart" enough to not believe it or have the ability to think for themselves. No different then any book assigned by the English teach by principle
You’re going to get the question of which translation to use as well
In Germany, schools teach religion, but it’s either Catholic or Lutheran, not fundamentalist crap. Also, you learn a bit about other religions. No-Christians can take ethics instead. Sadly, this kind of compromise is unlikely in the US. Who will teach these courses? Religious education is not a major in most American universities.
What if yout jewish?
Jewish people and other non christians aren’t allowed to exist in Trump’s America
Trumpers aiming at kids
If it’s taught as an essential text providing for the foundation of Western civilisation this is great! If taught as a way to convert students, this will be counter productive.
What a number you did on yourselves here, really.
Matthew 13
Christians are forcing religion where it's not wanted so don't look surprised when Gen Alpha becomes even more secular and anti-religion than Gen Z. Brainwashing works best when the subject is isolated and these kids have social media
Once again lazy Christians (fake?) hide behind the state to do what THEY are supposed to. Spreading the word teaching Christ's commands and making disciples was given to the body not the state. No worse idea than having someone unqualified or an unbeliever teach scripture. Terrible idea!
The problem is that while things like these *after school Satan clubs that are slowly opening up in schools* are giving kids a choice, where as we are forcing kids to learn about the Bible, without giving them a choice. We’re making the enemy’s teachings seem more alluring just by forcing The Bible on kids.
I am a Christian. Religion should never be mandated. Christ gave us free will.
I wonder which Bible they will be teaching? Have they come up with a study plan? Should we read Revelation to our first and second graders? Or even our seniors for that matter. Way to scare the hell out of kids 👍🏻👍🏾👍🏿👍
As a devout Christian I am against it. When God’s Holy Word falls into a mouth of people with money and power, then it turns into a heresy. They will twist the meaning however they want according to their own standard and shut each mouth in the class who sees another meaning and reads what isn’t supposed to be read by their standard. Spreading God’s Word and outlining it must be the prerogative of Christ’s Church only ⛪️, not the Devil’s government!
Very bad idea at this point. Everyone know what Ten Commandants are. But to have it in school is a bad idea. Nobody can keep the law, it was given to nation of israel
When I was in school, I hated all the books I was forced to read. Until a few years later I got bored and read them again, and I actually really liked them. Forcing kids to read the Bible is going to make them never WANT to read the Bible. A good alternative would be having different classes for each religion and allowing students to pick one to study, freedom comes with interest. they don’t have to believe in it of course, but it’s generally good to be cultured and knowledgeable about different beliefs around the world. Forcing it to be ONLY Christianity’s religious text though? Not a good idea, and I’m Christian.
Bible stories instead reading comprehension sounds pretty cool