Increasing dark reapers really isn’t justified. There was one tournament list where they did well. Hardly worthy of a nerf.
Fuegan and the winged Autarch would be my bet. They’re almost auto-include.
Most of our index is already overcosted. If they nerf points on popular units, it will kill us competitively. Take a look at the units some armies get for less points.
Agreed. We are barely in the ideal win rate. I think we are sitting at 45-46% since the last balance slate. If they do any nurfs without adding in significant buffs the faction will be dead competitively. But considering how bad Admech is we might be joining them.
Nothing is really too efficient right now. For diversity we just need the bad units to come down in points (half the index).
I think the most interesting thing would be if the wave serpent came way down. This would open the table to so many new list types and also cut down on the need for the main 3 units (spiders/hawk/spectres) as we would have efficient ways to boost movement everywhere else.
I like that, it's the sort of thing that could actually bring real change to list design, rather than a generic +5 to the good stuff and -5 to the bad stuff.
I honestly think we'd see almost zero change to good lists even if they increased points on spiders/hawks/specters and lowered them on the rarely seen melee units. We'd just get lists with one less unit of good stuff instead. It's not about the points.
God I'm so tired of this stupid narrative that half of our index is bad. Look at tournament results. Our Index is incredibly deep. People are winning GT's with a wide variety of lists bringing very diverse lists. There's really only 3 or 4 datasheets that are overtuned and likewise a few that really need a buff.
I am exaggerating with respect to half. But there are some strong ones that come to mind like warlocks/shining spears/vypers.
But I still believe the serpent opens up a lot more list design changes.
Yeah the Serpent one is a good idea! There are already some borderline good combos with Quins but shaving off a few points of the Serpent and our other melee infantry would open up an all new playstyle. Scorpions, Corsairs, Banshees... they'd all look a lot more appealing with a few points cut off.
The constant exaggerations on the state of our internal balance just irks me. Started playing in 8th and we never had close to such a great internal balance during that time.
I think it's less that half the index is bad, and more that the bad are some *real* stinkers. Like they could cut the cost of Spears in half and I'd still be tempted not to take them.
Spears I feel can be salvaged with points, Warlocks are just utterly useless. What do you price a unit that does nothing and gives up Assassinate points?
You can protect Eldrad from all those pesky psychic attacks. Some guy out there only plays against Grey Knights and Thousand Sons in his local meta and has gotten great mileage out of them.
Nerfs on autoinclude aspects: Hawks, Spiders, Specters all seeing significant points increases. I also expect them to do something about the Yvraine w/ Harlequins blob leading to more sad clown noises as if they haven’t suffered enough.
And because it’s GW probably something nonsensical like +5 on Vypers.
What's the point of doing this though? These are obviously great units, but if they just increase the points of the most successful units of every army every 3 months they'll just have to keep doing that every time. Something's always gonna be the best.
Right now eldar is hardly sticking out as doing anything gamebreaking in the meta.
I'm expecting no changes or light touches to everything not in the top 3 or 4 armies or bottom 3 or 4 armies this time. If they change too much they'll just start alienating the player base. Especially on the more casual side that's not following the tournament scene and what's doing good and not.
Hopefully we have the update on thursday though and we'll see! I'm ready to make the best of whatever is regardless of what it is!
It depends on the Eldar have averaged a win rate at 50% since the last update. With eldar dipping to like 45% bottom end of gws spectrum for the top tables and tourney win rates.
By all accounts, this last update finished off fixing the aeldari being too powerful.
With the increase in indirect and the 3 in ds that aeldari have little defense for, they might dip further.
My prediction is an average price to increase of 10% across the index. With very few to no units taking a points drop.
I don't see either avatar or wraith knight getting a points decrease and wayleaper will take a nerf for sure.
The aspects will eat the bulk of the points nerfs.
Feugan and Wayleapers up in points. Minimum 10 max 40.
Minor point increases on warp spiders, hawks, and spectres. Possibly also wraith guard/blades (5 min - 20 max).
I actually think we can see point drops on the wraith knight, and maybe minor drops on the Avatars.
Outside of that I’d like to see, but feel it’s unlikely, point drops on Wraithlords, Guardians, Striking Scorpions, Howling Banshees, Shining Spears, Warlocks/Conclaves, Warp Hunters, Wave Serpents, Corsairs, and Webway gates.
I think wayleaper is great but he's expensive but we need the cp to keep us afloat imo.
Feugan is way too cheap at the moment.
Would love the avatar and knight to come down,.they're both solid but very expensive.
Fire prisms could come down a little....
Increasing dark reapers really isn’t justified. There was one tournament list where they did well. Hardly worthy of a nerf. Fuegan and the winged Autarch would be my bet. They’re almost auto-include.
Fuegan +10 Hawks +5 Spectres +5 Banshees -5
If they keep raising the points ima just have to buy less units, lol
Most of our index is already overcosted. If they nerf points on popular units, it will kill us competitively. Take a look at the units some armies get for less points.
Agreed. We are barely in the ideal win rate. I think we are sitting at 45-46% since the last balance slate. If they do any nurfs without adding in significant buffs the faction will be dead competitively. But considering how bad Admech is we might be joining them.
This. Point increases at this point are unwarranted. Increases on the good stuff we have is going to put the nail in the competitive coffin.
Nothing is really too efficient right now. For diversity we just need the bad units to come down in points (half the index). I think the most interesting thing would be if the wave serpent came way down. This would open the table to so many new list types and also cut down on the need for the main 3 units (spiders/hawk/spectres) as we would have efficient ways to boost movement everywhere else.
I like that, it's the sort of thing that could actually bring real change to list design, rather than a generic +5 to the good stuff and -5 to the bad stuff. I honestly think we'd see almost zero change to good lists even if they increased points on spiders/hawks/specters and lowered them on the rarely seen melee units. We'd just get lists with one less unit of good stuff instead. It's not about the points.
I thought the same thing. Bring that down to 85pts and you'd see a lot of changes.
God I'm so tired of this stupid narrative that half of our index is bad. Look at tournament results. Our Index is incredibly deep. People are winning GT's with a wide variety of lists bringing very diverse lists. There's really only 3 or 4 datasheets that are overtuned and likewise a few that really need a buff.
I am exaggerating with respect to half. But there are some strong ones that come to mind like warlocks/shining spears/vypers. But I still believe the serpent opens up a lot more list design changes.
Yeah the Serpent one is a good idea! There are already some borderline good combos with Quins but shaving off a few points of the Serpent and our other melee infantry would open up an all new playstyle. Scorpions, Corsairs, Banshees... they'd all look a lot more appealing with a few points cut off. The constant exaggerations on the state of our internal balance just irks me. Started playing in 8th and we never had close to such a great internal balance during that time.
I think it's less that half the index is bad, and more that the bad are some *real* stinkers. Like they could cut the cost of Spears in half and I'd still be tempted not to take them.
Spears I feel can be salvaged with points, Warlocks are just utterly useless. What do you price a unit that does nothing and gives up Assassinate points?
You can protect Eldrad from all those pesky psychic attacks. Some guy out there only plays against Grey Knights and Thousand Sons in his local meta and has gotten great mileage out of them.
Nerfs on autoinclude aspects: Hawks, Spiders, Specters all seeing significant points increases. I also expect them to do something about the Yvraine w/ Harlequins blob leading to more sad clown noises as if they haven’t suffered enough. And because it’s GW probably something nonsensical like +5 on Vypers.
What's the point of doing this though? These are obviously great units, but if they just increase the points of the most successful units of every army every 3 months they'll just have to keep doing that every time. Something's always gonna be the best. Right now eldar is hardly sticking out as doing anything gamebreaking in the meta. I'm expecting no changes or light touches to everything not in the top 3 or 4 armies or bottom 3 or 4 armies this time. If they change too much they'll just start alienating the player base. Especially on the more casual side that's not following the tournament scene and what's doing good and not. Hopefully we have the update on thursday though and we'll see! I'm ready to make the best of whatever is regardless of what it is!
It depends on the Eldar have averaged a win rate at 50% since the last update. With eldar dipping to like 45% bottom end of gws spectrum for the top tables and tourney win rates. By all accounts, this last update finished off fixing the aeldari being too powerful. With the increase in indirect and the 3 in ds that aeldari have little defense for, they might dip further.
My prediction is an average price to increase of 10% across the index. With very few to no units taking a points drop. I don't see either avatar or wraith knight getting a points decrease and wayleaper will take a nerf for sure. The aspects will eat the bulk of the points nerfs.
Feugan and Wayleapers up in points. Minimum 10 max 40. Minor point increases on warp spiders, hawks, and spectres. Possibly also wraith guard/blades (5 min - 20 max). I actually think we can see point drops on the wraith knight, and maybe minor drops on the Avatars. Outside of that I’d like to see, but feel it’s unlikely, point drops on Wraithlords, Guardians, Striking Scorpions, Howling Banshees, Shining Spears, Warlocks/Conclaves, Warp Hunters, Wave Serpents, Corsairs, and Webway gates.
I think wayleaper is great but he's expensive but we need the cp to keep us afloat imo. Feugan is way too cheap at the moment. Would love the avatar and knight to come down,.they're both solid but very expensive. Fire prisms could come down a little....
I would contend that appropriate point drops where needed would reduce the reliance on CP to function.