Im wondering how the servers work at bsg. When early wipe hits, player population probably goes up 10x times. At the moment, tarkov probably is at the lowest point of player base and its still not enough servers or its suddenly after pve released its record breaking players got back to game?
Judging by how long it takes to load into a match, my guess is there's probably not great optimization on the server side. So even with lower player numbers you need a server instance for every individual PvE player where as normally you would have 6+ sharing a server. Probably why they tried to limit the PvE to the Unheard edition so they wouldn't have to expand infrastructure.
Based on the poor performance of stuff like SIT, the server spaghetti can't possibly be well optimized. And, typically I'd say in fairness it's a Beta and optimization is generally on the lower end since it'll need to be done again when all the features are added. However, it's EFT so not a lot of sympathy, but that's probably the model of thinking they still have.
They're physical/dedicated servers that run server "containers" on them. When you connect to a server in Tarkov, whatever matchmaker/backend has simply spun up a server container with the arguments for whatever raid you queued for. E.g. it starts a server, sets the map to Factory at daytime, does what it needs to do and then you connect to it.
Once the raid is over, that "container" is shut down, data/logs from it presumably flushed to a backend somewhere, rinse-repeat. You'll see this if you track the IP addresses of servers you connect to; eventually you'll reconnect to the same IP address, but you'll be on a different port. E.g. my first raid might be on 123.456.789.0:12345 and the second raid might also be on 123.456.789.0 but the port might change to 12346.
When you're searching for a raid, you're simply waiting in a queue for a server container to become available for whatever raid you queued for. Each physical host can only handle so many server containers at once, which is why decreasing raid timers ultimately allows them to churn through more raids without necessarily having to pay to add more physical infrastructure.
> Each physical host can only handle so many server containers at once, which is why decreasing raid timers ultimately allows them to churn through more raids without necessarily having to pay to add more physical infrastructure.
They could also try something crazy like having enough nodes and chucking in some non-shit load balancing.
I can imagine the modding community could quickly create a better server infrastructure than bsg ever could. They proved to be extremely capable.
I mean thats whats happening in most other games.
One great programmer beats like a hundred mediocre ones.
It's relatively common for multiplayer games these days; much more cost-effective to run multiple virtual instances on the one server rather than dedicating one entire physical host, assuming you have the performance to do so. It's the same reason Virtual Machines/Servers (of which many might run atop the one physical host) are popular in cloud services.
I've also (over the years) seen BSG advertise in various job posts for devs with containerisation experience, among other things, lending credence to the use of containerisation when it comes to EFT lobbies.
You can infer logical solutions to an arbitrary problem as someone with a technology architecture skill-set.
In the same way an electrician can probably guess how a place was wired without being able to see through walls.
The electrician could be wrong because the electrician that was hired employed a terrible solution, but we tend to grant them the benefit of the doubt.
Working in a programming intensive field, chances are high you encountered a concept like this before, because containerization is very core to many servers nowadays.
Also if you have an affinity for server stuff when playing servers in regards to multiplayer, like creating your own servers, you can get this type of experience, even without working in a professional environment.
I’m positive they are using a container system which has this built in. It’s a physical server count issue. And really has has nothing to do with “optimized” servers or not.
A cpu can only handle so much.
Maybe should have waited for proper PvE implementation/server structure instead of rolling out the new edition so you wouldn't have to complain about people complaining
Isn’t it crazy what we have been putting up with.
Imagine having to roll out new servers for a game mode for all *existing* players? How can they fuck it up so badly that they have to provision independent platforms for a game mode. Absolute jokers.
>How can they fuck it up so badly
By presumably making their pve servers be essentially 1 slot multiplayer servers cause they couldn't be asked to rewrite the existing code for their outrageous cash grab.
Oh yeah technically it’s because they just replicated the back ends, made minimal modifications to make the game mode work as single player and pushed it out the door.
It tells me that they are not in it for much longer as it’s obviously unsustainable having all the slack capacity across both instances.
I’m just in awe that they thought it would be ok.
There's been enough rumors circulating they've had a really rough year and a half financially so all of these moves scream "we're going broke" to me. Even without a war there's no way their model from 2017 was going to keep them afloat this long. Their scope creep and mismanagement sadly will be the death of BSG.
The truly ironic part was that if they stuck to their promises and made a full world-explorable PvPvE experience like they advertised to us EoD users, a la the way STALKER Anomaly works but with PVP, with a narrative and dropping into shared instances between safe zones...
And then made that moddable...
Jesus. Imagine. We could've had a STALKER spiritual successor while STALKER was still dead. BSG could've kept us going on regular DLC drip feed, and new guns to add to the weapon economy, and new expansions for areas of the "Zone." That's the dream we were sold on with EoD. That's the dream they abandoned, to chase twitch streamer dollars and cheater repurchases.
That's the really sad thing, too. Tarkov's story is *actually pretty interesting.* A megacorp mining out the resources to produce yellow cake; secretly developing salted nuclear weapons; building a private army to do it, by acquiring the only mercenary organization to not screw up in Iraq, because they exercised discretion, and were utterly ruthless in culling witnesses. That corporation getting desperate enough to detonate an EMP, execute their own scientists, and kill government investigators just to cover up their possession of a nuke.
That is *really interesting.* Holy shit. Imagine experiencing that in a game that plays like Anomaly, mostly PVE with safe zones and trader hubs, but with random encounter PVP crossover while out in the wild.
The dream that went Unheard, everyone. Jesus Christ.
* Was Tarkov lucrative? Yeah. They made a lot of money with it.
* Did I have fun with Tarkov the game? Yeah. Of course I did, I'm here.
* Am I satisfied with how the story will never get told? No. Not satisfied at all.
I'm actually kinda sad about it, now that the dream I paid for is dead. Yeah, we got our money's worth on the gameplay, but we EoD guys were hungry for the other stuff that never happened, too. What a waste of a universe, folks.
Not really a defense of BSG (but it may be taken as one), but they *clearly* did not plan to release this feature so soon, but given the speculation that they are bleeding money after the past fiscal year, they shoved it out the door less-than-half-finished to try to desperately create cash flow, since they *knew* that the non-wiping PMC that could play co-op with friends was a feature that a huge portion of the existing and potential player-base was excited for.
Yeah entirely possible. However if that’s the case then don’t bank on them being able to support two platforms with slack capacity for the install base across both. It seems like they’re out the door one way or another… :(
I think Nikita is just panicking as he watches his lifestyle gradually go down in flames with his company. He does not seem mentally stable, guy is flipping out at random people on Twitter in the most out-of-touch way possible.
Also, Nikkita lives in a country on the brink of ww3 with open threats of deploying nuclear arms and active conscription. He may have more prudent concerns for his team.
maybe he shouldnt put so much money into a pvp focused spinoff made out of a unfinished game that has tons of issues and then feel forced to increase revenue by releasing a coop mode that is just the unfinished game on a different server
Isn’t that what they were trying to do with the unheard edition having exclusive access to pve? And then using the money from that to add pve specific servers. It’s almost like no matter what, people will complain.
No one is happy. Everyone hates BSG and Nikita. Should just go full villain and pay for a bot to post every 10 minutes. They are in a lose lose situation and all because they don’t have any common sense.
It was about damage control, not about were they ready. They fucked up big and they needed something to help the game along so they released it prematurely and this is where we are.
I’ve only been developing live service software for millions of users for a few years now, but in my experience we usually provision infrastructure for the customers first, not sell them a product and get mad when they ask for it to work correctly as if them using it is somehow completely unpredictable.
Nikita demanding sympathy for a no-win situation that he created is not a good look.
If i had to have a guess, there is a chance they planned for x users to buy the new edition within x weeks of launching it. They rolled out those servers. They then were some what forced into just giving it away to what i would call the majority of the community. So now the number of users is drastically larger than they planned for. I got my PVE today and today there is a lot of complaints for server issues. I would suspect they are rolling out faster than their upgrade strategy is allowing for. I would suspect it could be incompetence or, a strategy to deploy only the minimum required number of servers needed.
I mean isn’t that modern gaming? I feel like most games don’t release with enough servers, all these companies try to get by with spending as little as possible.
The bigger question is why aren't they auto scaling the instances in and out?
I guess when you extract there's probably some database transactions going or something but seriously. With proper architecture that's solvable, too. They need to stop setting up servers manually, which it sounds like they're still doing.
Don't know what magical company you work for but every place I've launched services for millions of people the company budgets for like 30% of the infrastructure and calls it the MVP..then never circles back.
This is all too common
Seems pretty obvious to me the allocated for the usage they expected with Unheard edition, and adding EoD users screwed up whatever projections they had. Their choices are likely to just not allow EoD users in until the infra is there for them, or to let some in as infra comes available, but managing chunks of new users rushing to try something new out constantly (as each new EoD cohort gets allowed) as you're rolling new hardware out is likely much harder to plan for and do well than an initial projections, knowing it will be crazy for a couple days, and then settle into some usage trend you can use to figure out if you need to deploy more servers to smooth our resource usage.
Planning for a release is one thing, planning for a release only to have your entire community revolt and have to release something 10x or 100x larger (unless you think everyone was just going to by Unheard immediately) all of a sudden is something else entirely. BSG deserves a lot of flak for the shit they did, but not realizing their usage projections and server requirements it suggested for a new mode had to be thrown out the window before launch isn't one of them IMO.
On the release day for PVE the server queue time was the biggest complaint I could see. It's been like this since day 0.
Hell it's been like this every wipe way back to the pre alpha.
I get it’s annoying, because it probably is. But as everyone has pointed out, the community did not hold Nikitaand BSG at gunpoint and make them make a new edition and rush it out before the key mode of said edition coming to it and EoD was actually ready.
What a fucking disaster this has all been. Nikita needs to get off Twitter and just cool off. The dude is a blunt asshole and it just riles people up all the time. Let the PR team do their jobs and spin the spin.
The Community seem to have Stockholm Syndrom. If virtually any other game on the market had done only a fraction of the shit BSG has done, it would be long dead. This Community however will play this game and throw money at them if they added real money paid extracts.
The difference is there really hasn't been much in the way of actual competition for BSG up until recently. It's easy for BSG to keep most of their playerbase when you're really the only experience like it on the market.
We're only just now getting actual Tarkov like games on the market to compete with BSG. At most you had lighter experiences like CoD's DMZ or BF2042's Hazard Zone, both of which were more focused on the extraction side of things rather being a true Tarkov experience. It's not like Destiny where if Bungie fucked up people could just jump over to The Division. It's not like Valorant where if Riot fucked up the community could move over to R6 Siege or CS2.
Rather fittingly in that they're also a studio of Russian origin and constantly refused to listen to the community until they got massive backlash, Tarkov's situation is a lot like War Thunder in that there hasn't be a game like it to offer true competion. Yes War Thunder technically has World of Tanks/Warships to compete with, but WoT/WS is so different from WT that they don't over much to compete beyond "Military vehicle based game". War Thunder was the only thing that offered an experience like it, which allowed Gaijin to constantly push the community until they finally had enough last year.
BSG had done the same thing. They pushed the community until they had enough thanks to Unheard and got BSG to at least change on that. And now that we're seeing games that offer a Tarkov experience, we might see the competition actually get BSG to stop being BSG.
I don’t buy Ubisoft or Bethesda games but they are certainly not shunned entirely by the gaming community . Both are in court for trying to do what bsg rolled back upon pushback.
We don’t have to pretend bsg is pioneering greedy corporate tactics to criticize them.
Because he's an utter piece of shit lol how is this even still a question? How is this guys reputation still even remotely afloat after the Unheard nonsense?
Instead of generic replies why not tell us how many people are playing, how many are being invited each day, how quickly the servers are being turned up, when the massive wait time for a single player game is expected to be fixed.... you know... any info people actually care about.
I honestly don't why people still play EFT after all the lies, Z bullshit and treating players like second class citizens. I get that it's one of a kind but honeslty, just not worth it.
Same thing happens with any other product people have to purchase. They buy, it sucks, they complain. This is basically just people reviewing a product. And when a good amount of people have bad reviews for the same product, well, your going to hear about it a ton. Video games are no different
See, Nikita just wants us to do one solid transcendental meditation session before each raid and some people are so impatient and entitled that they tell him he need to cut down on the load times.
These people are obviously not true believers. SMH my head.
Sick of this developer. Been playing since 2018, drank the kool-aid, got excited every big patch and wipe.
But given how slowly this game has progressed is only made worse by Nikita being an absolute cunt.
Now with the rise of "simmilar" games coming around, I have zero desire to play. You can fix a broken game, you can't fix an egotistical developer.
If I paid 250 for this edition and had to deal with f***ing rogues and raiders on Ground Zero I’d be asking for my money back too. This is supposed to be a casual experience for us non sweaty people. This is wild
When you stop believing there's a translation issue, when you start realising they've been doing this for a long time, that English should and is easy for him, you'll start realising that he is rude, condescending and an absolute prick in the way he talks to the community..
Absolute piece of shit...
Yea, I do want you to make a post. How many people had access yesterday, how many people have access today, how many people will have access tomorrow. It’s not rocket science it is basic communication
You know, they even have their own website, that could simply show us a tracked number of access given. Instead of using social media to give people updates for you game.
i just laugh at all of this bullshit, from some posts that ive read so far, people literally just ignore the fact that they literally gotta pay 250 (plus taxes) just for an option to play singleplayer, what the world has turned into
yes nikita, thats what i want. thats what communication is like. thats whats status updates on bugs/problems are.
god damn, you dont even need to do it yourself, but at least let us players know whats going on from time to time.
because offline pve shouldnt be ran on dedicated server bust hosted off the players pc doesnt make sense if you cant support the demand of it to do it like that
No, but he could make it evident they're adding new servers every day by leading with example, like you know if you were actually adding new servers the game load time would go down right ?
no, we want you to stop being mad and bitch around, just because the community told you that you are completely disconnected to your own game and basically have no idea what the community wants and how to engange with them (twitter is not the right way, Niki).
we want you to fucking care about your game and actually listen to us. not release game versions nobody asked for. stop making up this bullshit quarrel with ABI, nobody gives a damn except for drama queens like OnePeg or the like. work on your game, work with your community and show us that you know where to go. headless chicken time is over, my friend. you need to save your game. yesterday and not tomorrow.
If they're adding "new servers" every day, then why did they have to reduce raid times to half of what they were before? :P
Seems to me, they are repurposing servers instead of "adding" them\^\^
Don't get it.
If it's like a cloud server (which it should be), they can scale up and down very fast.
If its a physical machine, then they will have a boat load of expensive machines just wasting electricity because payer count always drops after the peak.
Wtf are they even doing?
Servers with proper Infrastructure as a code do not take weeks to get up. If the Terraform (or other tooling) is properly written using Openstack modules/AWS modules, you can spin up hundreds of servers within hours. Hopefully you are also using containers and automation tools like Ansible/Chef/Puppet.
If not, you should fire your Infra team
If I don't match instantly, I back out, restart, and go again. 9/10 it works after just one restart. If it doesn't work, I restart again for a 2nd time and it'll work. Other than that, I've never had issues
Any excuse he has is null and void. If tencent ripped your game wouldnt they have the same problems? So how do their servers load instantly with 140 fps on lower end pcs? Tarkov is cooked
Nikita getting pissy because other games are taking his player base that he decided to disregard. Maybe you should have tackled cheating better, maybe you should have not come out with the Unheard edition.
This coo after all these years of work hasn’t yet realised you can’t be well accepted by community while you frustrate them with disrectpecful things, quite rare big game updates, not delivered promises, keeping very few words of actual progress on core issues and barely addressing core issues at all and ….. same time telling fun stories through videos and making silly polls.
Everything needs balance.
You tell a joke and run event? Okay. But next to it show progress on concurrent work behind certain on core issues, give details, be transparent on this.
Communities always have people that suck.
The toxicity from the community is a top-down issue. BSGs attitude, communications, customer care & service, etc...sucks, and therefore, the community sucks in response.
What point would that be? AWS servers are about 3-5 clicks to provision manually and they should have scripts to bring them up. So it ONLY takes Nikita to order how many he needs. Same fucking day ready and running. Or is he like personally mines rare earth minerals to make cpus to forge servers himself? So much labor, so little appreciation.
ROFL rolling out new edition and "new game mode" with price tag of $250 and making excuse of being sarcastic?
JUST DON'T LAUNCH A GAME THAT YOU CAN'T EVEN HANDLE. Tired of early access and beta bs. grow up now
Honestly with the room temp IQs of most of the people on the internet, a 10 minute reminder might axtually help some of the "less fortunate" members of BSG's audience.
While he does have a point, he could and should make a more long-term statement like:
"We are aware of the situation. So far we have increased the capacity by x% and y% EoD owners have access. We estimate 100% access by \[date\], and queue times and raid times to be back to normal by \[date2\]. Subject to change".
If he was adding new servers everyday we'd been seeing it, but we're not are we? So are we getting our legs kicked out from under us again? But we have these issues day 1 to day whatever of each wipe time and time again seeing 20 minute queues or 10 minute ones if that. If they were doing their jobs as respectfully as they say they are we'd have 20 second queues everyday and the game would run miles and miles better than it currently does. But ya know. Anyways, back to the mode that this subreddit mods would like to bean me for.
If you wait 20 min to load...don't..leave the loading screen and try again, most of the time I can load in 2-4 min more than that it's most likely a bug.
Seeing those who gave them money for this shit the wider community was complaining about and begging them not to now filling this sub and twitter up with complaints of their own about pve is just *chef’s kiss* perfect
Im wondering how the servers work at bsg. When early wipe hits, player population probably goes up 10x times. At the moment, tarkov probably is at the lowest point of player base and its still not enough servers or its suddenly after pve released its record breaking players got back to game?
Judging by how long it takes to load into a match, my guess is there's probably not great optimization on the server side. So even with lower player numbers you need a server instance for every individual PvE player where as normally you would have 6+ sharing a server. Probably why they tried to limit the PvE to the Unheard edition so they wouldn't have to expand infrastructure.
Based on the poor performance of stuff like SIT, the server spaghetti can't possibly be well optimized. And, typically I'd say in fairness it's a Beta and optimization is generally on the lower end since it'll need to be done again when all the features are added. However, it's EFT so not a lot of sympathy, but that's probably the model of thinking they still have.
8 year old beta lol
7days just hit 1.0 after 12 years, so they're got time lol
Laughs in Star Citizen
How much are the different packs/editions for 7days?
Fika works fine
Tarkov is a perfectly optimized game with 0 issues. Nonsense.
They're physical/dedicated servers that run server "containers" on them. When you connect to a server in Tarkov, whatever matchmaker/backend has simply spun up a server container with the arguments for whatever raid you queued for. E.g. it starts a server, sets the map to Factory at daytime, does what it needs to do and then you connect to it. Once the raid is over, that "container" is shut down, data/logs from it presumably flushed to a backend somewhere, rinse-repeat. You'll see this if you track the IP addresses of servers you connect to; eventually you'll reconnect to the same IP address, but you'll be on a different port. E.g. my first raid might be on 123.456.789.0:12345 and the second raid might also be on 123.456.789.0 but the port might change to 12346. When you're searching for a raid, you're simply waiting in a queue for a server container to become available for whatever raid you queued for. Each physical host can only handle so many server containers at once, which is why decreasing raid timers ultimately allows them to churn through more raids without necessarily having to pay to add more physical infrastructure.
> Each physical host can only handle so many server containers at once, which is why decreasing raid timers ultimately allows them to churn through more raids without necessarily having to pay to add more physical infrastructure. They could also try something crazy like having enough nodes and chucking in some non-shit load balancing.
whoa now.. that would take actual engineering
I can imagine the modding community could quickly create a better server infrastructure than bsg ever could. They proved to be extremely capable. I mean thats whats happening in most other games. One great programmer beats like a hundred mediocre ones.
This is super interesting.... how do you know all this?
Man understands networks and server infrastructure
Thanks
It's relatively common for multiplayer games these days; much more cost-effective to run multiple virtual instances on the one server rather than dedicating one entire physical host, assuming you have the performance to do so. It's the same reason Virtual Machines/Servers (of which many might run atop the one physical host) are popular in cloud services. I've also (over the years) seen BSG advertise in various job posts for devs with containerisation experience, among other things, lending credence to the use of containerisation when it comes to EFT lobbies.
The job post point is really good, thank you for sharing this!
You can infer logical solutions to an arbitrary problem as someone with a technology architecture skill-set. In the same way an electrician can probably guess how a place was wired without being able to see through walls. The electrician could be wrong because the electrician that was hired employed a terrible solution, but we tend to grant them the benefit of the doubt.
Working in a programming intensive field, chances are high you encountered a concept like this before, because containerization is very core to many servers nowadays. Also if you have an affinity for server stuff when playing servers in regards to multiplayer, like creating your own servers, you can get this type of experience, even without working in a professional environment.
Well as someone who has it, afaik, all the raids i played yesterday only had 25m of raid time. It sounds like they're definitely low on space.
Dynamic load balancing is something never heard/read at BSG. years go by and Mikita complains about "buying" servers.
I’m positive they are using a container system which has this built in. It’s a physical server count issue. And really has has nothing to do with “optimized” servers or not. A cpu can only handle so much.
Yes and no. Optimisation is the difference between 100 containers per server, or 500. (Random numbers)
Maybe should have waited for proper PvE implementation/server structure instead of rolling out the new edition so you wouldn't have to complain about people complaining
Isn’t it crazy what we have been putting up with. Imagine having to roll out new servers for a game mode for all *existing* players? How can they fuck it up so badly that they have to provision independent platforms for a game mode. Absolute jokers.
>How can they fuck it up so badly By presumably making their pve servers be essentially 1 slot multiplayer servers cause they couldn't be asked to rewrite the existing code for their outrageous cash grab.
Oh yeah technically it’s because they just replicated the back ends, made minimal modifications to make the game mode work as single player and pushed it out the door. It tells me that they are not in it for much longer as it’s obviously unsustainable having all the slack capacity across both instances. I’m just in awe that they thought it would be ok.
There's been enough rumors circulating they've had a really rough year and a half financially so all of these moves scream "we're going broke" to me. Even without a war there's no way their model from 2017 was going to keep them afloat this long. Their scope creep and mismanagement sadly will be the death of BSG.
The truly ironic part was that if they stuck to their promises and made a full world-explorable PvPvE experience like they advertised to us EoD users, a la the way STALKER Anomaly works but with PVP, with a narrative and dropping into shared instances between safe zones... And then made that moddable... Jesus. Imagine. We could've had a STALKER spiritual successor while STALKER was still dead. BSG could've kept us going on regular DLC drip feed, and new guns to add to the weapon economy, and new expansions for areas of the "Zone." That's the dream we were sold on with EoD. That's the dream they abandoned, to chase twitch streamer dollars and cheater repurchases. That's the really sad thing, too. Tarkov's story is *actually pretty interesting.* A megacorp mining out the resources to produce yellow cake; secretly developing salted nuclear weapons; building a private army to do it, by acquiring the only mercenary organization to not screw up in Iraq, because they exercised discretion, and were utterly ruthless in culling witnesses. That corporation getting desperate enough to detonate an EMP, execute their own scientists, and kill government investigators just to cover up their possession of a nuke. That is *really interesting.* Holy shit. Imagine experiencing that in a game that plays like Anomaly, mostly PVE with safe zones and trader hubs, but with random encounter PVP crossover while out in the wild. The dream that went Unheard, everyone. Jesus Christ. * Was Tarkov lucrative? Yeah. They made a lot of money with it. * Did I have fun with Tarkov the game? Yeah. Of course I did, I'm here. * Am I satisfied with how the story will never get told? No. Not satisfied at all. I'm actually kinda sad about it, now that the dream I paid for is dead. Yeah, we got our money's worth on the gameplay, but we EoD guys were hungry for the other stuff that never happened, too. What a waste of a universe, folks.
Not really a defense of BSG (but it may be taken as one), but they *clearly* did not plan to release this feature so soon, but given the speculation that they are bleeding money after the past fiscal year, they shoved it out the door less-than-half-finished to try to desperately create cash flow, since they *knew* that the non-wiping PMC that could play co-op with friends was a feature that a huge portion of the existing and potential player-base was excited for.
Yeah entirely possible. However if that’s the case then don’t bank on them being able to support two platforms with slack capacity for the install base across both. It seems like they’re out the door one way or another… :(
I think Nikita is just panicking as he watches his lifestyle gradually go down in flames with his company. He does not seem mentally stable, guy is flipping out at random people on Twitter in the most out-of-touch way possible.
Also, Nikkita lives in a country on the brink of ww3 with open threats of deploying nuclear arms and active conscription. He may have more prudent concerns for his team.
Nah. He was a self-absorbed, rude, gaslighting dickhead before all of that happened. This is par for the course. He's been like this for years.
maybe he shouldnt put so much money into a pvp focused spinoff made out of a unfinished game that has tons of issues and then feel forced to increase revenue by releasing a coop mode that is just the unfinished game on a different server
Amen.
It’s rough. Lots of time spent with long load times or connections failing as soon as the raid launches. I’ve lost a lot of kit to disconnections.
Isn’t that what they were trying to do with the unheard edition having exclusive access to pve? And then using the money from that to add pve specific servers. It’s almost like no matter what, people will complain.
That’s an idiotic business model to cover up their technical debt it was never going to go over with the community favourably.
No one is happy. Everyone hates BSG and Nikita. Should just go full villain and pay for a bot to post every 10 minutes. They are in a lose lose situation and all because they don’t have any common sense.
It was about damage control, not about were they ready. They fucked up big and they needed something to help the game along so they released it prematurely and this is where we are.
I’ve only been developing live service software for millions of users for a few years now, but in my experience we usually provision infrastructure for the customers first, not sell them a product and get mad when they ask for it to work correctly as if them using it is somehow completely unpredictable. Nikita demanding sympathy for a no-win situation that he created is not a good look.
Not to mention we are in the least traffic heavy part of the wipe cycle. A cycle bsg has had 8 years to figure out.
The least traffic in general probably considering half the player base that did play threw whole wipes is all gone too lol
This, my entire group quit after the bs unheard edition was announced lol
Out of everyone I know that played, which was about 10-15 people. One still plays. Ive been on greyzone and other shit
Im patiently waiting for the ABI open beta. The twitch drop shit has burned me twice at 98% lol
Half of Reddit maybe. The vast majority of the player base doesn’t care. If they did, BSG and Nikita wouldn’t keep pulling stupid shit
Also there are way less people playing right now due to competition. Guy's a fucking clown.
If i had to have a guess, there is a chance they planned for x users to buy the new edition within x weeks of launching it. They rolled out those servers. They then were some what forced into just giving it away to what i would call the majority of the community. So now the number of users is drastically larger than they planned for. I got my PVE today and today there is a lot of complaints for server issues. I would suspect they are rolling out faster than their upgrade strategy is allowing for. I would suspect it could be incompetence or, a strategy to deploy only the minimum required number of servers needed.
This right here.
I mean isn’t that modern gaming? I feel like most games don’t release with enough servers, all these companies try to get by with spending as little as possible.
The bigger question is why aren't they auto scaling the instances in and out? I guess when you extract there's probably some database transactions going or something but seriously. With proper architecture that's solvable, too. They need to stop setting up servers manually, which it sounds like they're still doing.
Don't know what magical company you work for but every place I've launched services for millions of people the company budgets for like 30% of the infrastructure and calls it the MVP..then never circles back. This is all too common
Seems pretty obvious to me the allocated for the usage they expected with Unheard edition, and adding EoD users screwed up whatever projections they had. Their choices are likely to just not allow EoD users in until the infra is there for them, or to let some in as infra comes available, but managing chunks of new users rushing to try something new out constantly (as each new EoD cohort gets allowed) as you're rolling new hardware out is likely much harder to plan for and do well than an initial projections, knowing it will be crazy for a couple days, and then settle into some usage trend you can use to figure out if you need to deploy more servers to smooth our resource usage. Planning for a release is one thing, planning for a release only to have your entire community revolt and have to release something 10x or 100x larger (unless you think everyone was just going to by Unheard immediately) all of a sudden is something else entirely. BSG deserves a lot of flak for the shit they did, but not realizing their usage projections and server requirements it suggested for a new mode had to be thrown out the window before launch isn't one of them IMO.
On the release day for PVE the server queue time was the biggest complaint I could see. It's been like this since day 0. Hell it's been like this every wipe way back to the pre alpha.
He wouldn't have to worry about servers if he also added a local mode where a server isn't needed for pve
I get it’s annoying, because it probably is. But as everyone has pointed out, the community did not hold Nikitaand BSG at gunpoint and make them make a new edition and rush it out before the key mode of said edition coming to it and EoD was actually ready. What a fucking disaster this has all been. Nikita needs to get off Twitter and just cool off. The dude is a blunt asshole and it just riles people up all the time. Let the PR team do their jobs and spin the spin.
The Community seem to have Stockholm Syndrom. If virtually any other game on the market had done only a fraction of the shit BSG has done, it would be long dead. This Community however will play this game and throw money at them if they added real money paid extracts.
The difference is there really hasn't been much in the way of actual competition for BSG up until recently. It's easy for BSG to keep most of their playerbase when you're really the only experience like it on the market. We're only just now getting actual Tarkov like games on the market to compete with BSG. At most you had lighter experiences like CoD's DMZ or BF2042's Hazard Zone, both of which were more focused on the extraction side of things rather being a true Tarkov experience. It's not like Destiny where if Bungie fucked up people could just jump over to The Division. It's not like Valorant where if Riot fucked up the community could move over to R6 Siege or CS2. Rather fittingly in that they're also a studio of Russian origin and constantly refused to listen to the community until they got massive backlash, Tarkov's situation is a lot like War Thunder in that there hasn't be a game like it to offer true competion. Yes War Thunder technically has World of Tanks/Warships to compete with, but WoT/WS is so different from WT that they don't over much to compete beyond "Military vehicle based game". War Thunder was the only thing that offered an experience like it, which allowed Gaijin to constantly push the community until they finally had enough last year. BSG had done the same thing. They pushed the community until they had enough thanks to Unheard and got BSG to at least change on that. And now that we're seeing games that offer a Tarkov experience, we might see the competition actually get BSG to stop being BSG.
Well said.
They won’t stop being BSG. They’ll just bury their head until either they die or their competition fails which with tencent backing it seems unlikely
Activision always makes shitty choices and COD always sells more 😉
I’m convinced most of the community defending this game lately are just Russian bots. Most of them are from newer Reddit accounts
I don’t buy Ubisoft or Bethesda games but they are certainly not shunned entirely by the gaming community . Both are in court for trying to do what bsg rolled back upon pushback. We don’t have to pretend bsg is pioneering greedy corporate tactics to criticize them.
nobody is pretending that, maybe stop being the voice of simp reason
why is he so hostile in every response, why does he have to be a cunt about everything?
Fragile ego is my bet.
Because he's an utter piece of shit lol how is this even still a question? How is this guys reputation still even remotely afloat after the Unheard nonsense?
Lol he shouldn’t have dicked over his customers. Everyone would be understanding if they weren’t scummy lmao
Instead of generic replies why not tell us how many people are playing, how many are being invited each day, how quickly the servers are being turned up, when the massive wait time for a single player game is expected to be fixed.... you know... any info people actually care about.
Because then we’d see that the game peaks at 100-200k players and they can’t handle that even after 8 years and after releasing a 250 USD edition.
100k-200K players is a lot for a game as niche as Tarkov, I doubt the number of active players is that high
Bro Nikita is a fuckin child.
How is Nikita so good at consistently just saying the wrong things.
people are surprisingly consistent
I honestly don't why people still play EFT after all the lies, Z bullshit and treating players like second class citizens. I get that it's one of a kind but honeslty, just not worth it.
Z bullshit? First time I'm hearing of it, what's going on there?
Watch this, he explains it pretty good. https://youtu.be/tSO5gGg6Cn8?si=gb85TjUHpvwiSZ8g
Yike.
Same thing happens with any other product people have to purchase. They buy, it sucks, they complain. This is basically just people reviewing a product. And when a good amount of people have bad reviews for the same product, well, your going to hear about it a ton. Video games are no different
Probably shouldve fixed the game instead of trying to find a way to scam the entire community
It would honestly be nice to see some sort of structure to how they do the waves, but I'll patiently wait
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We are hardcore or whatever
I do not believe his tweet when he says 30% of EoD users have it.
Bro says 50% of eod players are in now (1h on twitter)
The gas, we light!
The fact people actually purchased and are still playing despite how BSG's own CEO is treating the fans is... Abhorrent.
I mean I bought the game and I'm not getting my money back so I might as well play it. Won't be spending another dime though.
Stoppp playinnggg the gaaammmeee. I’ve given up and will never return to this shit show. Let it all burn
like so many have said, everyday it amazes me how not only this game still has a playerbase but also people actually defending this shit
Pfff entitled gamers cannot wait 20 minutes in lobby
See, Nikita just wants us to do one solid transcendental meditation session before each raid and some people are so impatient and entitled that they tell him he need to cut down on the load times. These people are obviously not true believers. SMH my head.
Actually true, they barely paid $250 to queue into pve /s
Sick of this developer. Been playing since 2018, drank the kool-aid, got excited every big patch and wipe. But given how slowly this game has progressed is only made worse by Nikita being an absolute cunt. Now with the rise of "simmilar" games coming around, I have zero desire to play. You can fix a broken game, you can't fix an egotistical developer.
Nikita actually hit me up for server hosting today. Thats why queues are down to 15 minutes. They're on my Dell R720. 7200RPM Drives
Maybe he should learn to only sell working products. I hate this dude so much
If I paid 250 for this edition and had to deal with f***ing rogues and raiders on Ground Zero I’d be asking for my money back too. This is supposed to be a casual experience for us non sweaty people. This is wild
This Nikita guy has lost it completely.
Screw that clown. Play the mod. It actually works for a change.
nikita really embracing the victim mentality at the moment. utterly pathetic
Nikita should try shutting the fuck up.
Jesus Christ Nikita is such a fucking moron lmao
Servers should not be needed. PVE should be hosted by the client. There's no reason why it can't be an offline only mode
Somebody Probably Technically Already Knew It
Should I say… the amount of servers required is unheard of?
When you stop believing there's a translation issue, when you start realising they've been doing this for a long time, that English should and is easy for him, you'll start realising that he is rude, condescending and an absolute prick in the way he talks to the community.. Absolute piece of shit...
Yea, I do want you to make a post. How many people had access yesterday, how many people have access today, how many people will have access tomorrow. It’s not rocket science it is basic communication
You know, they even have their own website, that could simply show us a tracked number of access given. Instead of using social media to give people updates for you game.
But you've been saying this shit for 5 years, Nikita. Queues are still absurdly long.
So he's upset that the customers who gave him hundreds of dollars actually want to see work done?
If he would host more servers every day, the problem would be solved by now
EoD since Jan 2017 ,still no PvE
8 years in development guys... wolfs circling around now. he is really active on twitter all of the sudden amusing to see
Ngl I doubt doing story telling has any impact on the development/maintenance of the main game.
what a fucken bitch boy. who the hell is this guy? launches a garbage feature for $250 + taxes and can't take the heat?
Only the true believers get to experience this pain
i just laugh at all of this bullshit, from some posts that ive read so far, people literally just ignore the fact that they literally gotta pay 250 (plus taxes) just for an option to play singleplayer, what the world has turned into
Bro is so fucking mad lmao
yes nikita, thats what i want. thats what communication is like. thats whats status updates on bugs/problems are. god damn, you dont even need to do it yourself, but at least let us players know whats going on from time to time.
because offline pve shouldnt be ran on dedicated server bust hosted off the players pc doesnt make sense if you cant support the demand of it to do it like that
This fucking moron shouldn't be doing PR for his game.
No, we want you to realize that charging $250 for that was a scam and refund everyone.
“Were working on it everyday!” Swear i havent heard anyone say that the servers have gotten better since day 1 of pve being out
No, but he could make it evident they're adding new servers every day by leading with example, like you know if you were actually adding new servers the game load time would go down right ?
no, we want you to stop being mad and bitch around, just because the community told you that you are completely disconnected to your own game and basically have no idea what the community wants and how to engange with them (twitter is not the right way, Niki). we want you to fucking care about your game and actually listen to us. not release game versions nobody asked for. stop making up this bullshit quarrel with ABI, nobody gives a damn except for drama queens like OnePeg or the like. work on your game, work with your community and show us that you know where to go. headless chicken time is over, my friend. you need to save your game. yesterday and not tomorrow.
If they're adding "new servers" every day, then why did they have to reduce raid times to half of what they were before? :P Seems to me, they are repurposing servers instead of "adding" them\^\^
I got PVE access yesterday, queue times weren't that bad. For the first raid i waited around 3.5minutes, next 3 raids were almost instant.
Don't get it. If it's like a cloud server (which it should be), they can scale up and down very fast. If its a physical machine, then they will have a boat load of expensive machines just wasting electricity because payer count always drops after the peak. Wtf are they even doing?
Nikita Sounds Really pissed. And I Hope he is!
Servers with proper Infrastructure as a code do not take weeks to get up. If the Terraform (or other tooling) is properly written using Openstack modules/AWS modules, you can spin up hundreds of servers within hours. Hopefully you are also using containers and automation tools like Ansible/Chef/Puppet. If not, you should fire your Infra team
If I don't match instantly, I back out, restart, and go again. 9/10 it works after just one restart. If it doesn't work, I restart again for a 2nd time and it'll work. Other than that, I've never had issues
when you stuck on matching in PVE just tap ESC and click again. Will be faster :D
Adding servers being hard is a myth, if your backend is properly made. BSG being BSG, their backend most likely fucking suck, hence the troubles
Any excuse he has is null and void. If tencent ripped your game wouldnt they have the same problems? So how do their servers load instantly with 140 fps on lower end pcs? Tarkov is cooked
Arena breakout sub 1 minute queue times
Nikita getting pissy because other games are taking his player base that he decided to disregard. Maybe you should have tackled cheating better, maybe you should have not come out with the Unheard edition.
This coo after all these years of work hasn’t yet realised you can’t be well accepted by community while you frustrate them with disrectpecful things, quite rare big game updates, not delivered promises, keeping very few words of actual progress on core issues and barely addressing core issues at all and ….. same time telling fun stories through videos and making silly polls. Everything needs balance. You tell a joke and run event? Okay. But next to it show progress on concurrent work behind certain on core issues, give details, be transparent on this.
Dudes got a point, it's been addressed several times I believe.
He could just say nothing at all. He has had no problem doing that regarding most issues during the development of the game.
Yeah I really wish he’d stop digging his heels in, he’s his own worst PR
We are at the end of the 2 week timeline tbf and none of my friend group has access. Last update was “30% are in”.
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Why bother asking if you aren't going to believe what he says anyways?
Because it annoys him
I get that BSG sucks but the attitude from the community is often worse. Two way street for sure.
Communities always have people that suck. The toxicity from the community is a top-down issue. BSGs attitude, communications, customer care & service, etc...sucks, and therefore, the community sucks in response.
To be fair tarkov community is especially toxic lol. I’d rank it up there with league.
What point would that be? AWS servers are about 3-5 clicks to provision manually and they should have scripts to bring them up. So it ONLY takes Nikita to order how many he needs. Same fucking day ready and running. Or is he like personally mines rare earth minerals to make cpus to forge servers himself? So much labor, so little appreciation.
It’s because he’s trying to get the least amount possible and not spend a dime more, it’s obvious.
They don't use AWS and due to the sanctions AWS are not taking on any new customers in Russia.
I am guessing the same. I don't think they have a lot of options.
He’s gotta loot the PCs on reserve for the components.
There's PCs on Reserve??
r/confidentlyincorrect they don't use AWS. So saying how easy it is to click a button doesn't apply.
What do they use?
Or how about making it really offline without bsg servers?
Tarkov is literally a dumpster fire right now. Uninstalled when all this started happening, and I dont anticipate downloading it again any time soon.
If there was only a way to play pve offline.............................................
I just back out any time matching takes longer than 1:30. And next time I’m in in under 2 minutes.
ROFL rolling out new edition and "new game mode" with price tag of $250 and making excuse of being sarcastic? JUST DON'T LAUNCH A GAME THAT YOU CAN'T EVEN HANDLE. Tired of early access and beta bs. grow up now
He not wrong yall annoying
Honestly with the room temp IQs of most of the people on the internet, a 10 minute reminder might axtually help some of the "less fortunate" members of BSG's audience.
Room temp IQ is releasing a $250 game package with the lynchpin being PVE, only to have that product not work properly.
While he does have a point, he could and should make a more long-term statement like: "We are aware of the situation. So far we have increased the capacity by x% and y% EoD owners have access. We estimate 100% access by \[date\], and queue times and raid times to be back to normal by \[date2\]. Subject to change".
He's a Russian not American he doesn't do corpospeak for better and worse lmao.
He’s got a point. Bring on the down votes.
If he was adding new servers everyday we'd been seeing it, but we're not are we? So are we getting our legs kicked out from under us again? But we have these issues day 1 to day whatever of each wipe time and time again seeing 20 minute queues or 10 minute ones if that. If they were doing their jobs as respectfully as they say they are we'd have 20 second queues everyday and the game would run miles and miles better than it currently does. But ya know. Anyways, back to the mode that this subreddit mods would like to bean me for.
If you wait 20 min to load...don't..leave the loading screen and try again, most of the time I can load in 2-4 min more than that it's most likely a bug.
Seeing those who gave them money for this shit the wider community was complaining about and begging them not to now filling this sub and twitter up with complaints of their own about pve is just *chef’s kiss* perfect
Same my freind group of 4 who played often and another 2 dc servers I'm in have almost completely stopped playing.
just admitting this was a diarrhea of an idea would do us good
What a shitshow this game has become
Lmao
To be fair matching was good for me today, maximum 5 minutes, average like 2 minutes
Yes I do think you should do it every 10 minutes. Fix it
Imagine if we all did spend the extra $250 and still had to deal with this shit. It is an offline mode, why does it need online servers?
Well at least he didn't call him a freeloader
he should start a poll. lol
yeah, actually. i'd love to see that. maybe post some proof too.
Honestly yeah because I refuse to believe he isn't putting it off
I am sorry you feel that way- Nikita
What a fool
72 hour special server operation.
Yes you definetely should give feedback about the biggest issue with the game right now which is loading time of your DLC that isnt a DLC
Shit devs, shit code, shit company, great gameplay
Niki seems to be losing it