They say in the article, that there are complications with Sony and Microsoft certification process? But they don't explain what It means and I don't find anything about the certification progress. so I am just confused about the reasoning. Like why should this be complicated for them? Didn't they already make such anime games for Playstation and Xbox?
Only thing I can think of is split screen not working on Series S and Xbox saying get it to work or it’s not on Xbox…. But then again the game doesn’t look demanding to the point that’s an issue
Eh it might get sticky having it one way but not the other.
Baldurs gate 3 was having similar difficulties on the Xbox side, think they managed to get it working eventually but it wasn’t easy
Wasn't BG3 just not released on xbox for a few months just so they could get it to work?
If Bandai doesn't want to release the game at different times for diferent pplatforms but also donesn't want to give up on the xbox, then that may suck.
Yeah it was actually splitscreen on the Series S if I remember rightly causing them aggro.
Different times for different platforms outside of a couple special cases could cause Bandai a load of issues. How terrible would it look for Xbox having games release a couple months after the PS5?
I’m sure it’d go down like a lead balloon if it was reversed too.
Timed exclusives are one thing, where money & advertising costs have been split between publisher & console manufacturer for exclusivity.
Far easier for Bandai to cut splitscreen & get a release across all platforms.
The reason baldurs gate 3 was delayed on Xbox was because of issues with split screen, I'm pretty sure it's just kinda hell to get it working and they just scrapped the idea
I was about to say, wtf is a certification process for a splitscreen game, I got buddies who publish indie games for console and steam yet never heard of that.
They just want people to buy two copies like Xenoverse (there is a splitscreen mode but its extremely limited)
Edit: To clarify there is a certification process when you want to publish on console, especially if you wanna use Playstation, Xbox ect branding in advertising but nothing that is solely just for local splitscreen games.
The problem is that splitscreen is more computationally intensive and microsoft say to get published on series x it needs the same features on series s.
They have made such games for PS and Xbox. However this is Tenkaichi. Sony and Microsoft KNOW that it will sell good. How do they sell even more copies? By making sure that everyone who wants to play it, buys it. It's business. If there's no local multiplayer, every player will be forced to buy a copy if they want to play with friends. They don't want you to play at your boys house. They want you to buy it and play your own copy. I doubt it's just Microsoft and Sony though. Bandai has a hand in this too.
This is probably similar to the Baldur's Gate 3 issue that was the reason it took so long for the game to be released on Xbox.
Sony and Microsoft don't want features to be exclusive to their competitor's platforms so they (or at least Microsoft) require feature parity. Microsoft also requires this for their much weaker Series S console.
It's stupid, but the devs' hands are tied.
wtf? No local co op?
That is absolutely brain dead. The whole nostalgic appeal of this is sitting on the couch with my fam playing DBZ
Take that away I have no reason to buy lol.
You’re severely underestimating how hard it is to make a Local Multiplayer mod. Unless there’s already files in the game for it, it’ll take a long ass time to make from scratch.
It took about half a year for DMCV to get it’s multiplayer mod, and that’s only because the game itself had a pseudo-multiplayer gimmick.
I agree with you, but then I've been surprised, bombrush had a multiplayer mod day 1 despite there it being a literal single player game, denuvo touted itself as being uncrackable then gets busted immediately, marvel 3 has a rollback mod very slowly being developed not to mention the pallette swap mod that shouldn't really exist
I don't think Tenkaichi will have a local mod that fast but also.....anything can happen if fans are crazy enough
>the pallette swap mod that shouldn't really exist
A lot of folks in the UMvC3 modding community are also in the XV2 modding community so I speak to them on occasion, and it's really crazy how the basis for the entire scene was all of the goofy shit the game can do that's locked behind Heroes and Heralds mode.
If it's anything like the gameplay of every other dbz game in this style, the gameplay is going to be puddle deep. What kept these games alive and made them forever classic to me was the gigantic roster and playing split screen with my buddies. If it's not in this one the game is dead on arrival for me
I’ll give you that. End of the day it’s an Arena Fighter, and they straight up admitted in the BT3 Strategy Guide that they weren’t interested in any sort of competitive balance really. It’s a Fanservice game above all else.
Yeah, and that's fine imo, it's what I always enjoyed about them. A lot of people in this thread seem to want it to be a competitive fighter for some reason.
A lot of people in this thread *don't* want it to be competitive for some reason. Some people think just because something isn't street fighter derived, it's instantly shallow and not competitive. You aren't beating those guys on the raging blast 2 leaderboard any easier than the ones of the Tekken leaderboard.
You don’t really know what you’re talking about. The Tenkaichi series was anything but puddle deep. It’s literally the deepest. People have finally started taking off nostalgia goggles for the budokai series. The Tenkaichi series is the much better and deeper game if you even bother to learn the mechanics
Insanely incorrect. You guys never played competitive and thats on yall [https://youtu.be/1ejl7I3VcWQ?si=NaI6fTNaOhaBmn5J](https://youtu.be/1ejl7I3VcWQ?si=NaI6fTNaOhaBmn5J)
Eh. Based on the gameplay trailer I'm just gonna stick to FighterZ. I'm not a fan of the Dragon Ball arena fighters, and this doesn't look to be an exception.
I understand what you're saying, but there was no way this was going to have splitscreen. It would either look like a much older game during splitscreen; or they would have to compromise most of the visual effects for the entire game, which would make it difficult to promote outside of the niche budokai tenkaichi crowd
Well, looks like I’m not buying it then.
The only reason I would get this game is to play around with my friends when they visit.
I’ll stick to FighterZ.
Can we talk to devs about allowing Local Co Op Back in games? What is this nonsense?! Nintendo is the only people out here remembering we like to play games in the same room as other people sometimes.
The article says that it’s not due to developmental problems, but due to Sony and Microsoft’s certification process and that they are looking for a solution
I don't think it is the devs fault, as others said it is something with Sony and Microsfot (apparently split-screens are copyrighted or whatever). We would need to convince the higher-ups
I think I heard somewhere that Sony and Microsoft as platform holders prefer to emphasize online multiplayer so they've been kinda disapproving of split screen in a lot of titles of late. Which I feel like we need to do some sort of Social Media Outcry or just have a local multiplayer game w/ splitscreen do numbers on either Switch or PC just to get Sony and Microsoft to not be butts about this.
So it could be Microsoft and Sony pushing their MP services that you have to pay for?
If that's the case that's really messed up and I agree that there should be outcry about it.
In the older generation, it could've been a limitation of the engines rendering the environment twice but now I'd say its probably more born out of just making online multiplayer is the only way to play together. But again, I don't have any official source to vet that.
I am. I never bought it and honestly the number of titles that have split screen in this generation and the generation past I feel could be counted on one hand.
Nintendo just has the opposite problem where they refuse to put online multiplayer in a bunch of their games
Played Kirby all the time with my brother when we were kids, now we're shit out of luck for playing the new ones since he moved to a different state
Local multiplayer means two people playing on one system, one copy of the game.
Forcing online only multiplayer means two systems sold, two copies of the game.
Idk what they are trying to do with this game. They had a whole video on game mechanics making it seem like they were trying to do the bare minimum appeal to the competitive crowd? Yet they don’t have local co-op, the way that competitive is mainly played?
Even from a casual perspective, this is a nostalgia game. People will want to have friends over and do rotations and tourneys and stuff like they did with older budokais. Now they can’t. Who does not having local co-op even serve?
The article says that it’s not due to developmental problems, but due to Sony and Microsoft’s certification process and that they are looking for a solution
Cool that you are letting them know its ok to strip fundamental features and give you a half baked experience. I'll be content with emulated Tenkaichi 3 at least I can play with my friends in IRL
This is how I know kids these days have never had to set up a Gundam EXVS LAN setup with 4 consoles, monitors, and game (it’s the best fighter with the worst tournament setup)
Why do you guys need FOUR setups? Is it a tag game?
In the Pokken scene we have a similar issue, where you need two consoles/displays/copies/lan adapters of the game for competitive events, thankfully it being on Switch makes that not quite as painful as if it were another platform, since it's relatively portable even with a dock and players can usually bring their own consoles.
it's a 2v2 3D fighting game where you have a partner that shares your "team HP"
If a player dies, depending on the point cost of their unit, the team HP goes down. You can respawn but if it depletes you lose. Stronger characters have a higher cost so a lot of the pre-game strategy is unit costs/compositions.
It has splitscreen but its only really there for casual play since it impacts framerate/ cuts your vision.
Pokken DOES play like Street Fighter, at least more then it plays like Tekken: The 2d phase is, well, 2d like SF is, and has actual combo links rather then juggles, the different attack buttons are lights, heavies, etc instead of controlling limbs, and the general pace and focus on neutral is also close to SF
And I really don't agree with the idea that it'd be better without the phase shift system: It adds a lot of depth when it comes to adaptation and adding to the mental stack, discourages flowcharting and is part of why the game has such a big emphasis on neutral.
At a very basic level, the Phase shift system acts as an Anti-Infinite system for the 2d phase: When your combo racks up enough Phase Shift Points (PSP), you get knocked back to the 3d phase (and as I explain below, back to neutral). The 3d phase is comparatively less critical to the game's combat and fundamentals, in part because you spend much less time of it: only ONE heavy hit or most specials will instantly shift you back to the 2d phase. By extension, the 3d phase is sort of a glorified second buffer layer of neutral, on top of the neutral that exists in the 2d phase.
At higher levels of play, though, it does more then that: Since different moves on hit will add different amounts of PSP to the hidden PSP guage that dictates when shifts happen, optimal play will have you altering your combo routes based on what the current PSP guage position is when you land your starter, that way you use your high damage ender right when the guage maxes out, as opposed to you using your unaltered BNB and the shift interupting your combo midway through.
Of course, sometimes you might want to intentionally not go for optimal damage and rather then changing your combo to be as high damage as possible based on the current PSP guage value, instead maybe you want to go for a combo that deals less damage or is maybe less safe, but will build LESS PSP and keep the other player in the corner in the 2d phase, as a sort of combo reset, to hopefully then allow you to land a second or a third combo in the same phase without a shift for higher long term damage then a single optimal combo, or just to keep them in pressure and to pysche them out, etc. Or maybe you'll go for a less-optimal combo that builds PSP extra fast to cause a shift earlier, in case you really want the meter causing a shift gives, or maybe you land a reversal and just want to get out pressure/the corner fast and give yourself a breather, etc.
Removing the Phase Shift system would basically make it an entirely different game and require reconsidering other design choices it has, and I personally really like how it leads to constantly going back to neutral and spending more time trying to get in, baiting the other player to whiff, and doing other mindgames. Even the way Pokken handles attack height (Moves bypass and punish each other based on height, rather then moves bypassing blocks based on height) enables extra reversals and more time for both players to get back to an advantage state or at least back to neutral.
This is also why to /u/konozeroda 's point, Pokken also has to have the wierd setup system it does, since the shifts and 3d phase means each player has their own camera perspective.
If people are iffy about Pokken's phases, I think the better solution to getting rid of it entirely would be to make the 3d phase less of a secondary thing compared to the 2d phase, and to give it more depth in it's own right, and make it play more like Tekken where characters still have full movelists, vs how it is now where it's basically a dumbed down gundam vs or dissidia with not a lot of options or room for combos (with some exceptions, Darkrai can do full length combos and setups in both the 2d and 3d phases), but even that I think might just make the system even more complex in a bad way
It’s only like street fighter in the sense that you have links. You don’t have spacing and strings like you do in sf, it’s very basic in that sense. Also arena phase is just ass, I don’t care if it breaks it up or not, it is quite simply not fun. Also it is super flowcharty in arena phase so I’m not sure why you’re saying it helps in that aspect. I realize it would be an entirely different game without it, but that’s that’s what I want lol. As far as phase shift points go it’s pretty meh, yeah you do have to track it and you can do more optimal combos depending on that but tbh that’s not a very interesting mechanic imo, I’d rather just have different combo starters lead to different routes instead. Also the fact a single throw causes a phase shift is super lame imo. The worst part though has to be burst because in arena phase it’s just plain stupid. Goes through light projectiles and light attacks which pretty much means you can’t click anything if the other person bursts without taking a huge risk. Tie in the fact that if you add your burst attack at the end of a combo the scaling is so bad that in some cases, like charizard, you only get 12 more damage which just promotes using burst attacks raw… not a fan
I’m not saying don’t like it, if you enjoy it, more power to ya. I’m just expressing the parts I dislike about it because it was a game that I was very excited for and was very mid imo by the end.
>You don’t have spacing and strings like you do in sf,
You absolutely do: Certain combos only work with specific spacing, or by making microadjuistments to your position mid combo, or by waiting specific frame lengths between when you do inputs to so the hitboxes line up to allow the combo to work.
If you're just looking at basic autocombos, obviously that's not the case, but when you're looking at optimal combos, specific setups, or even just BNBs players use at mid and high level play, there's absolutely very technical and very strict to execute combos, setups, and tech
As an example, I play weavile, and there are corner carries you can get off of his 8Y anti air, where you juggle (not in a Tekken sense, but) the player to the corner even from mid stage or the other side of the stage: That requires repositioning weavile as the enemy is airborne after the intial 8y to get yourself into the right spot, then timing your inputs so your followup moves (Often 6y, though it depends on the specific corner carry) so you're not using the move too early and you whiff under them, or too late and they hit the ground before the 6y connects, and that timing isn't constant, it requires actively changing it based on the little wiggle room there is with spacing and timing that won't drop the combo that then changes the timing on subsequent inputs.
I'd consider myself a mid to high level player, I can do sets with people who have made top 8s at larger events and take some rounds/matches, but I'm not good enough to do the full stage corner carries: I can maybe link 2-3 6ys at most. But i'm also not even smart enough to really weigh using a corner carry over more damage optimal (or meter draining, since weavile has moves that sap meter) routes off of 6y, when I also have to keep in mind to change my routes based on the PSP to begin with: Worrying about corner carries as yet another option is too much for me to begin with!
> Also it is super flowcharty in arena phase so I’m not sure why you’re saying it helps in that aspect. I
I'm saying it helps the duel/2d phase be less flowcharty, and encourages changing up combo routes and composition based on how filled the PSP guage is at any given time, and gives extra incentives to weigh pros and cons of different BNBs and combo routes.
>I’d rather just have different combo starters lead to different routes instead.
I mean, they do? I get different combos off of 4y or 5y, or 5x, or 8y, etc as weavile: Both because different followup moves just won't land/connect, and also because depending on which starter you use, they add different intial amounts of PSP and limit the length of the combo differently.
>The worst part though has to be burst because in arena phase it’s just plain stupid. Goes through light projectiles and light attacks which pretty much means you can’t click anything
I agree with you here, though: Burst having light hit invul. is sorta BS, haha. In a Pokken sequel, that's one of the things I'd change, alongside adding EX specials to have another use for meter, and actually having the PSP guage on screen. Maybe make Focus/Counter attacks less safe on block, too... but I might be biased there since Weavile is one of the few characters that can't typically combo off of his CA/Focus attack.
Bro I’m not reading all that, I started and you thought I meant spacing on combos when I was talking about neutral so it’s bunch of responses to things I wasn’t even saying. Like I said, if you like the game, more power to you. I don’t, you don’t have to try and convince me to.
Pokken rocks I wish I played more of it, I picked up the switch version very recently but haven’t played it a lot. I like the mix of tekken and simplified Gundam Vs for the melee/projectile phases
So? They were amongst friends at home. Also doesn't mean local wasn't an important feature for THIS specific line of dragonball games. Literally stripping the game of half its replay value on top of making it not a true tenkaichi sequel. Honestly its kind of sad and is gonna kill the momentum this game had. Not to mention piss soooo many people off that aren't chronically online and pay attention to this stuff.
I'm confused by the wording. Why would there be co-op in a 1vs1 game anyway? Did the old games Have a co-op offline mode?
Surely they don't mean there is no offline VS.
Tenkaichi Tag Team did, honestly seeing Coop mentioned got my hopes up very briefly for 2v2 fights till the realization that they meant 1v1 splitscreen
Not co op. They definitely mean offline versus. This game is 1 v 1 only. To play someone else it would have to be online. That’s why all the comments are talking about there will be no tournament scene
Actually it's Budokai Tenkaichi ☝️🤓
For real now, I don't know why it's inverted in the game's title, then again my japanese is limited to asking what time is it
The wording on the article seemed to specify split screen mode specifically. I'm hoping at least there's a form of local multiplayer, but the lack of split screen just means that they are probably opting for the standard arena fighter cameras of being zoomed out and for me, it doesn't quite hit the same.
they better have godlike net code to make up for it then. I swear if this shit comes out and is stuck with the old SNK level trash tier net code that BT3 had.....
Sony and Microsoft being a nuisance again. Also, why was there a need to confirm something as obvious as GT characters being present in the game? Whatever gave anyone any reason to believe they wouldn’t?
So not only does it launch with less characters than a game from 2007, but with less features too including leaving out the single most essential feature for this sort of game.
I wasn't really planning on buying it unless maybe on sale in 6 years to get the full game all at once, but this means I've got no reason to ever buy it at all if in a few years I'll have to go on Discord to try to get someone to play with.
Tbh launching with less characters isn't too egregious since BT3 only got to the number they did from iterative sequels.
Sparking Zero is a game that's (from what I assume) is entirely built from scratch
Slots =/= Characters in the Tenkaichi series. Transformations take separate slots. It's essentially not possible by simple math for it to have more characters than BT3 due to that.
Sucks that there's no offline vs mode, but I'm seeing a lot of comments talk about the "competitive scene" - did anyone expect this to have a competitive scene? Tenkaichi games have never been competitive fighting games. Balance is quite literally not a thing in these games.
I fear this is gonna affect the game competitively like Pokken, to where even if the game can have depth and it seems like they are going for that angle based on that mechanic breakdown, not too many locals are gonna wanna invest in double the amount of setups to run tournaments for it.
Yeah, this game will not have an extended life period. So, what happens to the playability of multi-player when the servers eventually shut down.
Offline multi player is what makes so many retro fighting games unique. It can still be played at events offline, even decades later.
So local tournaments are gonna need 2 consoles to play matches? This is really not a wise decision in terms of the potential sales this game could have. By taking out a core BT3 feature it can easily be said that this game will lose a sizable number of those possible buyers
Maybe best to put it back in the oven
You're not alone. The top comments also made me feel like I was going insane. I saw the phrase "local co-op, the way competitive was meant to be played" and it hit me like a punch to the brain.
Bruh, the one thing that was a must have in sparking zero for it to be anything more than a few days of fun into getting shelved… and they can’t make it happen?
Oh well, it ain’t a game I’m interested in buying anyways but I was looking forward to playing it at a friend’s house during friendly gatherings. Guess that’s done and dusted now.
How many articles will still be written about this same weeks old tweet, badly translating and even older French tweet, paraphrasing an influencer known for bullshitting
I'm not surprised there's no splitscreen. Idk what the certification process issue is, but I really don't think it would have been feasible to implement splitscreen without a decent amount of visual compromise. It would be nice if I were wrong tho
There goes the fun local tournament scenes for this game.
I bet it won't even have lan play connection
Honestly most of the fun of these games is couch co-op.
I bet the real reason is so they could sell an extra copy rather than just have 1 per house.
How come? The gameplay is basically the same as previous Budokai Tenkaichi but updated to the new generation, I didn't notice anything stopping it from having split-screen
It has something to do with the Sony and PS5 I don't remember what it was but there's an interference of co-op being compatible on PS5 which I think it's bs
LaThe camera is much more dynamic and the pacing of the game is much greater since the old dash speed is now the base one, in split screen it wouldn't work well
It wouldn't work well if it was on a lesser console maybe. Why set the bar so high visually if you aren't gonna compensate for potential split screen play? IF they actually mean it when they say they are fighting for it to happen. Also meaning they can do it but it's mostly a problem with the companies and not the technology.
To everyone claiming they aren't going to buy the game anymore due to no local multiplayer, the devs also said they want to look for solutions. It wont be there at launch but they are still going to try and either get through the certification process or see if there is another solution.
So what I should buy a full priced game in HOPES they will implement a feature later? What's the incentive to follow through when people bought the game anyways? Nah unless that shit gets confirmed I'm not spending a dime on it.
They said that GT characters are confirmed, but could be DLC, but fret not, as the base game will have 164 characters on launch apparently, including
https://preview.redd.it/f2wg51e9pqqc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b62882aabf81fef3684e9f13c5fac4d84d1295ab
I'm pretty sure this isn't the case. Around half of the cast they teased (if not more) is from Super. I doubt they're already showing off DLC in pre-release trailers.
How are you not gonna have local co-op in a fighting game? Isn't the point playing with someone next to you?
How will they do tournaments? Don't tournaments use local multiplayer to play?
it also means like to play with someone they also need a copy of the game. I can't just download it at college or something and plug in another controller like what I already do.
Like I've said before, no local multiplayer isn't a deal breaker for me personally, but the online multiplayer better be as good as the multiplayer for Tekken 8 or close to it. Also, I can easily see GT, OG Dragon Ball, and movie characters being post-launch DLC, which is fine by me.
Question. Will this game be playable using a stick/leverless, or does it utilize analog sticks for movement/camera?
(I never played Budokai so I'm not familiar with the format)
Already looked a little too close to xenoverse for me to be interested but I’ve heard a lot of good things about the series so I was willing to at least try it. This guarantees I won’t be buying it, no fighting game should not have local coop, that is a joke
They say in the article, that there are complications with Sony and Microsoft certification process? But they don't explain what It means and I don't find anything about the certification progress. so I am just confused about the reasoning. Like why should this be complicated for them? Didn't they already make such anime games for Playstation and Xbox?
Only thing I can think of is split screen not working on Series S and Xbox saying get it to work or it’s not on Xbox…. But then again the game doesn’t look demanding to the point that’s an issue
If that was the case, bandai could still add local Co op for ps5 and pc. I hope that Is the case
Eh it might get sticky having it one way but not the other. Baldurs gate 3 was having similar difficulties on the Xbox side, think they managed to get it working eventually but it wasn’t easy
Wasn't BG3 just not released on xbox for a few months just so they could get it to work? If Bandai doesn't want to release the game at different times for diferent pplatforms but also donesn't want to give up on the xbox, then that may suck.
Yeah it was actually splitscreen on the Series S if I remember rightly causing them aggro. Different times for different platforms outside of a couple special cases could cause Bandai a load of issues. How terrible would it look for Xbox having games release a couple months after the PS5? I’m sure it’d go down like a lead balloon if it was reversed too. Timed exclusives are one thing, where money & advertising costs have been split between publisher & console manufacturer for exclusivity. Far easier for Bandai to cut splitscreen & get a release across all platforms.
What do you mean sticky?
The reason baldurs gate 3 was delayed on Xbox was because of issues with split screen, I'm pretty sure it's just kinda hell to get it working and they just scrapped the idea
the other DB games have local multiplayer one one screen
I was about to say, wtf is a certification process for a splitscreen game, I got buddies who publish indie games for console and steam yet never heard of that. They just want people to buy two copies like Xenoverse (there is a splitscreen mode but its extremely limited) Edit: To clarify there is a certification process when you want to publish on console, especially if you wanna use Playstation, Xbox ect branding in advertising but nothing that is solely just for local splitscreen games.
The problem is that splitscreen is more computationally intensive and microsoft say to get published on series x it needs the same features on series s.
They have made such games for PS and Xbox. However this is Tenkaichi. Sony and Microsoft KNOW that it will sell good. How do they sell even more copies? By making sure that everyone who wants to play it, buys it. It's business. If there's no local multiplayer, every player will be forced to buy a copy if they want to play with friends. They don't want you to play at your boys house. They want you to buy it and play your own copy. I doubt it's just Microsoft and Sony though. Bandai has a hand in this too.
This is probably similar to the Baldur's Gate 3 issue that was the reason it took so long for the game to be released on Xbox. Sony and Microsoft don't want features to be exclusive to their competitor's platforms so they (or at least Microsoft) require feature parity. Microsoft also requires this for their much weaker Series S console. It's stupid, but the devs' hands are tied.
wtf? No local co op? That is absolutely brain dead. The whole nostalgic appeal of this is sitting on the couch with my fam playing DBZ Take that away I have no reason to buy lol.
the Budokai Tenkaichi games were known for this
Don't lose hope. The split screen will come with Dragon Ball Z: Sparking! One...
Watch someone mod it in day 1 and bamco scrambles to delete every shred of evidence it existed
You’re severely underestimating how hard it is to make a Local Multiplayer mod. Unless there’s already files in the game for it, it’ll take a long ass time to make from scratch. It took about half a year for DMCV to get it’s multiplayer mod, and that’s only because the game itself had a pseudo-multiplayer gimmick.
I agree with you, but then I've been surprised, bombrush had a multiplayer mod day 1 despite there it being a literal single player game, denuvo touted itself as being uncrackable then gets busted immediately, marvel 3 has a rollback mod very slowly being developed not to mention the pallette swap mod that shouldn't really exist I don't think Tenkaichi will have a local mod that fast but also.....anything can happen if fans are crazy enough
>the pallette swap mod that shouldn't really exist A lot of folks in the UMvC3 modding community are also in the XV2 modding community so I speak to them on occasion, and it's really crazy how the basis for the entire scene was all of the goofy shit the game can do that's locked behind Heroes and Heralds mode.
It's not like the gameplay itself isn't gonna be fun tho?
If it's anything like the gameplay of every other dbz game in this style, the gameplay is going to be puddle deep. What kept these games alive and made them forever classic to me was the gigantic roster and playing split screen with my buddies. If it's not in this one the game is dead on arrival for me
They’re adding several new mechanics. They did a Gameplay Demo with the Director just the other day if you want to check it out.
None of which add a great deal of depth, though, let's be real.
I’ll give you that. End of the day it’s an Arena Fighter, and they straight up admitted in the BT3 Strategy Guide that they weren’t interested in any sort of competitive balance really. It’s a Fanservice game above all else.
Yeah, and that's fine imo, it's what I always enjoyed about them. A lot of people in this thread seem to want it to be a competitive fighter for some reason.
I’ll concede the lack of Offline Multiplayer IS really odd though!
A lot of people in this thread *don't* want it to be competitive for some reason. Some people think just because something isn't street fighter derived, it's instantly shallow and not competitive. You aren't beating those guys on the raging blast 2 leaderboard any easier than the ones of the Tekken leaderboard.
Why would you want a game with no semblance of balance (assuming it's like every previous Tenkaichi) to be competitive?
Unbalanced and competitive are not mutually exclusive. Marvel vs Capcom, CVS, Smash, MK9 are all very unbalanced.
They obviously do
You don’t really know what you’re talking about. The Tenkaichi series was anything but puddle deep. It’s literally the deepest. People have finally started taking off nostalgia goggles for the budokai series. The Tenkaichi series is the much better and deeper game if you even bother to learn the mechanics
Puddle deep lol? This sounds like you weren't any good at BT tbh, it's a fully fledged fighter
The 3d games are not fully fledged fighters lol. Maybe the 2d ones were, I can't say, but the 3D ones got nothing going on
Insanely incorrect. You guys never played competitive and thats on yall [https://youtu.be/1ejl7I3VcWQ?si=NaI6fTNaOhaBmn5J](https://youtu.be/1ejl7I3VcWQ?si=NaI6fTNaOhaBmn5J)
Eh. Based on the gameplay trailer I'm just gonna stick to FighterZ. I'm not a fan of the Dragon Ball arena fighters, and this doesn't look to be an exception.
I understand what you're saying, but there was no way this was going to have splitscreen. It would either look like a much older game during splitscreen; or they would have to compromise most of the visual effects for the entire game, which would make it difficult to promote outside of the niche budokai tenkaichi crowd
Excuse to sell online nice try, bandai.
Well, I'm glad I was wrong, but my reasoning was sound. There still needed to be compromise, and it wasn't originally intended to be a feature
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Lmao
Well, looks like I’m not buying it then. The only reason I would get this game is to play around with my friends when they visit. I’ll stick to FighterZ.
Same so we can play at our own pace
Can we talk to devs about allowing Local Co Op Back in games? What is this nonsense?! Nintendo is the only people out here remembering we like to play games in the same room as other people sometimes.
The article says that it’s not due to developmental problems, but due to Sony and Microsoft’s certification process and that they are looking for a solution
I really really hope the final product has some type of local co-op, it really kills the game if it doesn't.
I don't think it is the devs fault, as others said it is something with Sony and Microsfot (apparently split-screens are copyrighted or whatever). We would need to convince the higher-ups
I think I heard somewhere that Sony and Microsoft as platform holders prefer to emphasize online multiplayer so they've been kinda disapproving of split screen in a lot of titles of late. Which I feel like we need to do some sort of Social Media Outcry or just have a local multiplayer game w/ splitscreen do numbers on either Switch or PC just to get Sony and Microsoft to not be butts about this.
So it could be Microsoft and Sony pushing their MP services that you have to pay for? If that's the case that's really messed up and I agree that there should be outcry about it.
I don't have a source for it but I've heard that to be the case generally. However, considering things, seems it may not be inaccurate.
Why is split screen an issue? Hell, even the Demon Slayer game has local co-op & the Ninja Storm games. How is this a problem?
In the older generation, it could've been a limitation of the engines rendering the environment twice but now I'd say its probably more born out of just making online multiplayer is the only way to play together. But again, I don't have any official source to vet that.
Are we forgetting that Gran Turismo 7, a first-party Sony game, has 4-player split screen?
I am. I never bought it and honestly the number of titles that have split screen in this generation and the generation past I feel could be counted on one hand.
Nintendo just has the opposite problem where they refuse to put online multiplayer in a bunch of their games Played Kirby all the time with my brother when we were kids, now we're shit out of luck for playing the new ones since he moved to a different state
I don't even think they had proper online multiplayer w/ Super Mario Wonder. Nintendo and online still have a lot to learn.
Local multiplayer means two people playing on one system, one copy of the game. Forcing online only multiplayer means two systems sold, two copies of the game.
Idk what they are trying to do with this game. They had a whole video on game mechanics making it seem like they were trying to do the bare minimum appeal to the competitive crowd? Yet they don’t have local co-op, the way that competitive is mainly played? Even from a casual perspective, this is a nostalgia game. People will want to have friends over and do rotations and tourneys and stuff like they did with older budokais. Now they can’t. Who does not having local co-op even serve?
The article says that it’s not due to developmental problems, but due to Sony and Microsoft’s certification process and that they are looking for a solution
Thanks, I didn’t care enough about this game to read past the headline haha
So...so why comment
Probably because not having local coop in any fighting game is pretty stupid and this is a generic fighting game sub not the tenkaichi sub
Well, so much for this game. They really got our hopes up, didn’t they?
I'm still getting it.
Cool that you are letting them know its ok to strip fundamental features and give you a half baked experience. I'll be content with emulated Tenkaichi 3 at least I can play with my friends in IRL
Aaaaand tournaments are 100% dead
This is how I know kids these days have never had to set up a Gundam EXVS LAN setup with 4 consoles, monitors, and game (it’s the best fighter with the worst tournament setup)
Why do you guys need FOUR setups? Is it a tag game? In the Pokken scene we have a similar issue, where you need two consoles/displays/copies/lan adapters of the game for competitive events, thankfully it being on Switch makes that not quite as painful as if it were another platform, since it's relatively portable even with a dock and players can usually bring their own consoles.
it's a 2v2 3D fighting game where you have a partner that shares your "team HP" If a player dies, depending on the point cost of their unit, the team HP goes down. You can respawn but if it depletes you lose. Stronger characters have a higher cost so a lot of the pre-game strategy is unit costs/compositions. It has splitscreen but its only really there for casual play since it impacts framerate/ cuts your vision.
Still so disappointed pokken turned out the way it did. Would have liked it to be a bit more like street fighter personally, not a fan of the phases
Pokken DOES play like Street Fighter, at least more then it plays like Tekken: The 2d phase is, well, 2d like SF is, and has actual combo links rather then juggles, the different attack buttons are lights, heavies, etc instead of controlling limbs, and the general pace and focus on neutral is also close to SF And I really don't agree with the idea that it'd be better without the phase shift system: It adds a lot of depth when it comes to adaptation and adding to the mental stack, discourages flowcharting and is part of why the game has such a big emphasis on neutral. At a very basic level, the Phase shift system acts as an Anti-Infinite system for the 2d phase: When your combo racks up enough Phase Shift Points (PSP), you get knocked back to the 3d phase (and as I explain below, back to neutral). The 3d phase is comparatively less critical to the game's combat and fundamentals, in part because you spend much less time of it: only ONE heavy hit or most specials will instantly shift you back to the 2d phase. By extension, the 3d phase is sort of a glorified second buffer layer of neutral, on top of the neutral that exists in the 2d phase. At higher levels of play, though, it does more then that: Since different moves on hit will add different amounts of PSP to the hidden PSP guage that dictates when shifts happen, optimal play will have you altering your combo routes based on what the current PSP guage position is when you land your starter, that way you use your high damage ender right when the guage maxes out, as opposed to you using your unaltered BNB and the shift interupting your combo midway through. Of course, sometimes you might want to intentionally not go for optimal damage and rather then changing your combo to be as high damage as possible based on the current PSP guage value, instead maybe you want to go for a combo that deals less damage or is maybe less safe, but will build LESS PSP and keep the other player in the corner in the 2d phase, as a sort of combo reset, to hopefully then allow you to land a second or a third combo in the same phase without a shift for higher long term damage then a single optimal combo, or just to keep them in pressure and to pysche them out, etc. Or maybe you'll go for a less-optimal combo that builds PSP extra fast to cause a shift earlier, in case you really want the meter causing a shift gives, or maybe you land a reversal and just want to get out pressure/the corner fast and give yourself a breather, etc. Removing the Phase Shift system would basically make it an entirely different game and require reconsidering other design choices it has, and I personally really like how it leads to constantly going back to neutral and spending more time trying to get in, baiting the other player to whiff, and doing other mindgames. Even the way Pokken handles attack height (Moves bypass and punish each other based on height, rather then moves bypassing blocks based on height) enables extra reversals and more time for both players to get back to an advantage state or at least back to neutral. This is also why to /u/konozeroda 's point, Pokken also has to have the wierd setup system it does, since the shifts and 3d phase means each player has their own camera perspective. If people are iffy about Pokken's phases, I think the better solution to getting rid of it entirely would be to make the 3d phase less of a secondary thing compared to the 2d phase, and to give it more depth in it's own right, and make it play more like Tekken where characters still have full movelists, vs how it is now where it's basically a dumbed down gundam vs or dissidia with not a lot of options or room for combos (with some exceptions, Darkrai can do full length combos and setups in both the 2d and 3d phases), but even that I think might just make the system even more complex in a bad way
It’s only like street fighter in the sense that you have links. You don’t have spacing and strings like you do in sf, it’s very basic in that sense. Also arena phase is just ass, I don’t care if it breaks it up or not, it is quite simply not fun. Also it is super flowcharty in arena phase so I’m not sure why you’re saying it helps in that aspect. I realize it would be an entirely different game without it, but that’s that’s what I want lol. As far as phase shift points go it’s pretty meh, yeah you do have to track it and you can do more optimal combos depending on that but tbh that’s not a very interesting mechanic imo, I’d rather just have different combo starters lead to different routes instead. Also the fact a single throw causes a phase shift is super lame imo. The worst part though has to be burst because in arena phase it’s just plain stupid. Goes through light projectiles and light attacks which pretty much means you can’t click anything if the other person bursts without taking a huge risk. Tie in the fact that if you add your burst attack at the end of a combo the scaling is so bad that in some cases, like charizard, you only get 12 more damage which just promotes using burst attacks raw… not a fan I’m not saying don’t like it, if you enjoy it, more power to ya. I’m just expressing the parts I dislike about it because it was a game that I was very excited for and was very mid imo by the end.
>You don’t have spacing and strings like you do in sf, You absolutely do: Certain combos only work with specific spacing, or by making microadjuistments to your position mid combo, or by waiting specific frame lengths between when you do inputs to so the hitboxes line up to allow the combo to work. If you're just looking at basic autocombos, obviously that's not the case, but when you're looking at optimal combos, specific setups, or even just BNBs players use at mid and high level play, there's absolutely very technical and very strict to execute combos, setups, and tech As an example, I play weavile, and there are corner carries you can get off of his 8Y anti air, where you juggle (not in a Tekken sense, but) the player to the corner even from mid stage or the other side of the stage: That requires repositioning weavile as the enemy is airborne after the intial 8y to get yourself into the right spot, then timing your inputs so your followup moves (Often 6y, though it depends on the specific corner carry) so you're not using the move too early and you whiff under them, or too late and they hit the ground before the 6y connects, and that timing isn't constant, it requires actively changing it based on the little wiggle room there is with spacing and timing that won't drop the combo that then changes the timing on subsequent inputs. I'd consider myself a mid to high level player, I can do sets with people who have made top 8s at larger events and take some rounds/matches, but I'm not good enough to do the full stage corner carries: I can maybe link 2-3 6ys at most. But i'm also not even smart enough to really weigh using a corner carry over more damage optimal (or meter draining, since weavile has moves that sap meter) routes off of 6y, when I also have to keep in mind to change my routes based on the PSP to begin with: Worrying about corner carries as yet another option is too much for me to begin with! > Also it is super flowcharty in arena phase so I’m not sure why you’re saying it helps in that aspect. I I'm saying it helps the duel/2d phase be less flowcharty, and encourages changing up combo routes and composition based on how filled the PSP guage is at any given time, and gives extra incentives to weigh pros and cons of different BNBs and combo routes. >I’d rather just have different combo starters lead to different routes instead. I mean, they do? I get different combos off of 4y or 5y, or 5x, or 8y, etc as weavile: Both because different followup moves just won't land/connect, and also because depending on which starter you use, they add different intial amounts of PSP and limit the length of the combo differently. >The worst part though has to be burst because in arena phase it’s just plain stupid. Goes through light projectiles and light attacks which pretty much means you can’t click anything I agree with you here, though: Burst having light hit invul. is sorta BS, haha. In a Pokken sequel, that's one of the things I'd change, alongside adding EX specials to have another use for meter, and actually having the PSP guage on screen. Maybe make Focus/Counter attacks less safe on block, too... but I might be biased there since Weavile is one of the few characters that can't typically combo off of his CA/Focus attack.
Bro I’m not reading all that, I started and you thought I meant spacing on combos when I was talking about neutral so it’s bunch of responses to things I wasn’t even saying. Like I said, if you like the game, more power to you. I don’t, you don’t have to try and convince me to.
Pokken rocks I wish I played more of it, I picked up the switch version very recently but haven’t played it a lot. I like the mix of tekken and simplified Gundam Vs for the melee/projectile phases
Yup. Although in EXVS's case, it's justified given how split screen would be such a pain to play
the Budokai Tenkaichi games were never competitive
So? They were amongst friends at home. Also doesn't mean local wasn't an important feature for THIS specific line of dragonball games. Literally stripping the game of half its replay value on top of making it not a true tenkaichi sequel. Honestly its kind of sad and is gonna kill the momentum this game had. Not to mention piss soooo many people off that aren't chronically online and pay attention to this stuff.
This was never going to be more than a fun side-tournament game.
tbf noone goes to tournaments anymore
I'm confused by the wording. Why would there be co-op in a 1vs1 game anyway? Did the old games Have a co-op offline mode? Surely they don't mean there is no offline VS.
Yeah, I think it's supposed to mean offline versus, because no game in this series had coop one way or another.
Tenkaichi Tag Team did, honestly seeing Coop mentioned got my hopes up very briefly for 2v2 fights till the realization that they meant 1v1 splitscreen
Not co op. They definitely mean offline versus. This game is 1 v 1 only. To play someone else it would have to be online. That’s why all the comments are talking about there will be no tournament scene
Look at the releases of jjk and Naruto connections. It's been the same shit
and I thought it was wack when Eyes of Heaven did it too
Local co-op was what make the sparking series ( previously known as tenkaichi budokai in the west ) big in the first place
Actually it's Budokai Tenkaichi ☝️🤓 For real now, I don't know why it's inverted in the game's title, then again my japanese is limited to asking what time is it
The wording on the article seemed to specify split screen mode specifically. I'm hoping at least there's a form of local multiplayer, but the lack of split screen just means that they are probably opting for the standard arena fighter cameras of being zoomed out and for me, it doesn't quite hit the same.
Most likely there wont be. I don't see any form of local working without split screen anyways with how big the maps seem to be.
At least have a LAN mode as a compromise. Hope Team Battle mode isn't removed too.
they better have godlike net code to make up for it then. I swear if this shit comes out and is stuck with the old SNK level trash tier net code that BT3 had.....
And I’m out
Sony and Microsoft being a nuisance again. Also, why was there a need to confirm something as obvious as GT characters being present in the game? Whatever gave anyone any reason to believe they wouldn’t?
FighterZ DLC add-ons(tho obviously the DLC will be stuff from the Dragon Ball Super Hero movie).
“The game will feature GT, either as base or dlc” 💀 mf no one doubted GT would EVENTUALLY get in, it’s just WHEN AND HOW
to me this is odd "co-op in a fighting game??" is not the same thing as local vs...
This can’t be real lmfao. No local 1v1? Surely Bandai namco wouldn’t be that stupif
So not only does it launch with less characters than a game from 2007, but with less features too including leaving out the single most essential feature for this sort of game. I wasn't really planning on buying it unless maybe on sale in 6 years to get the full game all at once, but this means I've got no reason to ever buy it at all if in a few years I'll have to go on Discord to try to get someone to play with.
Tbh launching with less characters isn't too egregious since BT3 only got to the number they did from iterative sequels. Sparking Zero is a game that's (from what I assume) is entirely built from scratch
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Slots =/= Characters in the Tenkaichi series. Transformations take separate slots. It's essentially not possible by simple math for it to have more characters than BT3 due to that.
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Work on your people skills. Devs are using "Slots" as roster. Also devs lie.
So I get playable Pan! Yay!
Sucks that there's no offline vs mode, but I'm seeing a lot of comments talk about the "competitive scene" - did anyone expect this to have a competitive scene? Tenkaichi games have never been competitive fighting games. Balance is quite literally not a thing in these games.
I mean, there is a competitive scene for it. I personally haven't dived into the meat of things, but all the tech out there seems cool
Local Co-op is like the whole point of this.
I fear this is gonna affect the game competitively like Pokken, to where even if the game can have depth and it seems like they are going for that angle based on that mechanic breakdown, not too many locals are gonna wanna invest in double the amount of setups to run tournaments for it.
They have never been competitive series since they have litteraly always been shit competitive games.
People will compete in anything lmao. There's way less mechanically sound games then BT2,3, or Raging Blast 2 that have more players
can’t trust ever trust an arena fighter to be good lmao
They do exist. The Gundam Versus series and some of the older Dragon Ball Budokai Tenkaichi games and Raging Blast were great.
Obligatory Kill la Kill mention
Boo
That’s fucked. Boooo
Then I’ll pass
lol pass
Is there a press release or something? All I'm seeing is a Twitter account linking to another content creator Twitter account
Literally never heard of this source before, is it even legit?
Like right? That's what I'm thinking. They legit had a showcase of Goku vs Vegeta. Were the two players playing online with different systems, wtf??
I’ll still cop it but man, that’s disappointing as hell. Thats like half the point of even having the game.
Then why are you spending your money to buy it if tenkaichi 3, xenoverse, and fighterZ still exists? lol
The fucks the point them
No local vs? Im out
Yeah, this game will not have an extended life period. So, what happens to the playability of multi-player when the servers eventually shut down. Offline multi player is what makes so many retro fighting games unique. It can still be played at events offline, even decades later.
Please tell me this is bait
So local tournaments are gonna need 2 consoles to play matches? This is really not a wise decision in terms of the potential sales this game could have. By taking out a core BT3 feature it can easily be said that this game will lose a sizable number of those possible buyers Maybe best to put it back in the oven
Then truly what is the point? See you in 8 years on a sale then. Namco you dumbass wastes of space.
Wait, why does that matter? Unless they mean local versus, then that's outrageous.
They definitely mean local vs
Ok? did People expected co-op in a 1vs1 fighting game? or is just that the wording is weird and we should not expect local multiplayer at all?
Local co op means local vs
I must have slipped to a new universe where "cooperation" means "vs". In my original universe co-operation means "cooperative multiplayer PVE"
You're not alone. The top comments also made me feel like I was going insane. I saw the phrase "local co-op, the way competitive was meant to be played" and it hit me like a punch to the brain.
"couch co op" has always been used to describe a game you can play locally with another friend regardless of the context
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The article this comment is under..
a blow
I still don't get if this is gonna be a fighting game or an arena fighter, does anyone know?
They’ve released multiple gameplay videos now, it’s an arena fighter like every other game in the series.
sad. Any idea on when they will put out DBFZ2, since you're so well informed?
Bruh, the one thing that was a must have in sparking zero for it to be anything more than a few days of fun into getting shelved… and they can’t make it happen? Oh well, it ain’t a game I’m interested in buying anyways but I was looking forward to playing it at a friend’s house during friendly gatherings. Guess that’s done and dusted now.
How many articles will still be written about this same weeks old tweet, badly translating and even older French tweet, paraphrasing an influencer known for bullshitting
Damn, that sucks. Guess it isn't a full priced game...shame.
FUUUUUUCK
I'm not surprised there's no splitscreen. Idk what the certification process issue is, but I really don't think it would have been feasible to implement splitscreen without a decent amount of visual compromise. It would be nice if I were wrong tho
This sucks but i always played this alone my friends never played with me as they hated these games.
Series s at fault for this
At least they could get local LAN to work for tournaments right? ... Right?!
Yeah us DB fans have been mad about this since they announced the decision a while ago. I will take all the GT characters I can get though!
I swear if it doesn't have local multi-player then what's the point
Welp, that’s going on my no-buy list lol
Ooof.
There goes the fun local tournament scenes for this game. I bet it won't even have lan play connection Honestly most of the fun of these games is couch co-op. I bet the real reason is so they could sell an extra copy rather than just have 1 per house.
Rejoice brethren!
"Will feature GT Characters" I FUCKING WON
Co-Op usually means PVE or playing together on the same team, Does this mean no Split Screen PVP?
No split screen so this game will most likely be like Xenoverse 2
No co op is fine but like local vs for sure right?
Nope.
Everyone I know whos played this, plays it casually. Thats bullshit they're not adding that.
Lol there it is. The turn around on the game. Most of yall not buying it now? Really?
Honesty it was obvious from the gameplay trailer, it can't realistically work in split
How come? The gameplay is basically the same as previous Budokai Tenkaichi but updated to the new generation, I didn't notice anything stopping it from having split-screen
It has something to do with the Sony and PS5 I don't remember what it was but there's an interference of co-op being compatible on PS5 which I think it's bs
LaThe camera is much more dynamic and the pacing of the game is much greater since the old dash speed is now the base one, in split screen it wouldn't work well
It wouldn't work well if it was on a lesser console maybe. Why set the bar so high visually if you aren't gonna compensate for potential split screen play? IF they actually mean it when they say they are fighting for it to happen. Also meaning they can do it but it's mostly a problem with the companies and not the technology.
The consoles are the limitation on current gen games.
To everyone claiming they aren't going to buy the game anymore due to no local multiplayer, the devs also said they want to look for solutions. It wont be there at launch but they are still going to try and either get through the certification process or see if there is another solution.
If that’s the case, I may pick it up in the future
So what I should buy a full priced game in HOPES they will implement a feature later? What's the incentive to follow through when people bought the game anyways? Nah unless that shit gets confirmed I'm not spending a dime on it.
Don't bother me none. I don't have any local friends anyways lol. Just give me crossplay PLEASE
I think if they have lan capabilities tournaments should be fine but no co-op is weird
I’m more upset at the potential for GT characters to be DLC.
They said that GT characters are confirmed, but could be DLC, but fret not, as the base game will have 164 characters on launch apparently, including https://preview.redd.it/f2wg51e9pqqc1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b62882aabf81fef3684e9f13c5fac4d84d1295ab
They probably will seeing how big the numbers were when they released Baby and Ssj4 Gogeta as DLC in FighterZ.
Perfect, I was worried that Goku wouldn’t make it into the game
Oh yea, we will get DBZ cast as base roster, but DB GT and Super will be dlc. DBFZ had 24 characters at launch and now it has over 40 with all the dlc
I'm pretty sure this isn't the case. Around half of the cast they teased (if not more) is from Super. I doubt they're already showing off DLC in pre-release trailers.
That is so stupid. So incredibly disappointing
How are you not gonna have local co-op in a fighting game? Isn't the point playing with someone next to you? How will they do tournaments? Don't tournaments use local multiplayer to play? it also means like to play with someone they also need a copy of the game. I can't just download it at college or something and plug in another controller like what I already do.
No local co-op is absurd. The devs are brain dead.
Sadly it's not their fault ig. Blame Sony and Microsoft for this L
Local coop isn’t as widely talked about but it’s still used by plenty of people. Friends, siblings, parents wanting to play with their kids.
How much you want to bet this is to prevent local tournaments
Like I've said before, no local multiplayer isn't a deal breaker for me personally, but the online multiplayer better be as good as the multiplayer for Tekken 8 or close to it. Also, I can easily see GT, OG Dragon Ball, and movie characters being post-launch DLC, which is fine by me.
Arena fighter, don't care.
Some of you guys won’t play because of no local co-op, that’s the breaking point for you?
Question. Will this game be playable using a stick/leverless, or does it utilize analog sticks for movement/camera? (I never played Budokai so I'm not familiar with the format)
This game uses sticks for movement
Damn
Already looked a little too close to xenoverse for me to be interested but I’ve heard a lot of good things about the series so I was willing to at least try it. This guarantees I won’t be buying it, no fighting game should not have local coop, that is a joke