So i think the part people forget is that she insists that there is no reacher or settler in their relationship. Marshall pesters her endlessly until she finally gives him an answer.
Honestly the thing she fucked up on was not realizing how desperate marshall was to hear he was the settler and not her
Exactly! I dont necessarily agree with her answer but i feel like people get mad at lily for this when really its something bad marshall did (which is rare)
Tbh, I think even if she’d said he was the settler he would have continued to pester her. Ted and Robin had already told him they considered him the reacher, and Lily could tell he was only pestering because he wanted her to admit something. He never would have pestered her to flatter his own ego
This comes up so often and I never comment but I’d like to put in my 2 cents. I love Marshall he is the best, but he wouldn’t be Marshall without Lily:
She put him through law school.( he mentions it in teds new car)
Marshall is someone who has the best intentions but he often loses his way, Lily is the person that pulls him back to himself.
When Marshall was about to take the job for financial reasons, even though it would help Lily with debt she tells him not to.
When Marshall gets fired , he is stressed about telling her but even though they have money problems she assures him it’s ok and she believes in him.
When his dad dies and he stays in his childhood home, she comes out and before heading back to NY calls him back to reality.
When he tells her he wants to stay with GNB for another 5 years , she reminds him it is no who he is.
And yes she went to airport but she still came back and supported marshal when he was hosting an event at their place for free.
It’s not about degrees or looks. I don’t think Marshall is the teacher, but having a partner that is supportive yet calls you out when you are swerving away is invaluable. Can’t get a degree for that. For that reason I think Lily is like slightly, 1% , a settler.
100% agree. And that's what a relationship is. A give and take. Lily did SO MUCH for Marshall, and he reciprocates, but in a different way. Both gave more at times and took more at other times. Both made mistakes, like, you know, humans do - HIMYM was always VERY real for a sitcom.
And she poignantly says in the last scene: you can't keep score, this is not tit for tat, not about you get to do this so I get to do it in return. That's not how relationships function, it's how they end.
I think insofar as it applies at all, Lily is the settler cause Lily had higher self-esteem and degree of emotional self-reliance, which is exactly why Marshall is the one who gets twisted up and insecure when the question pops up and the answer matters *so much* to him. That's the behavior of someone who knows they're the reacher, and wants to work through the silent resentment of that.
Lily is the one who has a brief stint of questioning and running away because she *can* conceive of a life that's different from the one she has with Marshall, she just ends up realizing she doesn't want to. He's completely shattered and lost until she comes back because he's more emotionally reliant on her than vice versa.
I feel like Lily loves/wants Marshall, but Marshal both loves her and needs her, and that makes for a slight difference in the dynamic that raises that question.
>That's the behavior of someone who knows they're the reacher, and wants to work through the silent resentment of that.
This is so funny to me. I can understand resentment when you're the settler, but who resents being the reacher? You hit the jackpot and you're now pissed off about that because..?
Because you feel in some sense your position is precarious, and that the other person has more options and power than you do. This doesn't even have to be objectively accurate or anything, but it's a sentiment some people have in similar situations.
And that's another thing right there. Asking this question is stupid because this concept only works in a positive way when both people think they're the reacher.
She didn’t want to answer, which was the right response. Marshall kept pestering for an answer and then got mad when she gave her opinion, which was not cool at all.
Agreed but she could have answered the other answer and made her husband feel good about himself too. It’s easy to twist a story to make either one the reacher or the settler, so the logical choice is to pick the areas in which your significant other excels to make them happy.
I mean Marshall is crazy tall, a fantastic musician, a lawyer, and friends with everyone. There’s enough to go on to say he’s the settler, no?
If my wife asked, I'd tell her she was the settler immediately. Marshall was clearly dealing with self-confidence issues and was searching for emotional support and I mean it was an immature way to go about it, but there was a good way to approach it and a bad way- he clearly needed a win.
I mean, if we're assuming a relationship is a team effort, then sometimes you gotta let your partner take a w.
It just sounds like a bad plan giving the other person this perspective they will continue to see you through and then it changes the dynamic of your relationship if they subconsiously feel like they settled for you and that they could do better and that you should be lucky to have them. I mean not in Lilly and Marshalls case because they are fictional characters, but in life.
Nah. Tell whoever you're with that you're lucky to be with them. Make them feel special. What is this zero sum game nonsense that your brain is creating, and is it why you're single?
I don’t know but how about you throw them a bone and help them out of it? Lily and Marshall were married at that point iirc, it’s time to throw away your ego and help if your partner is going through something.
But in some cases there's really no reacher and no settler. At least not until the end. Sometimes it becomes clearer by the end... and sometimes you realize you've just been slumming it all along.
Sorry lol, my stuff.
Think about it differently. You’ve been breezing through your career and your partner has been struggling, and you’ve making more money.
You tell them that they’re making a much bigger impact on people.
I absolutely hate this theory bc imo, relationships aren't about reachers and settlers. That's not a good way to look at your relationship. You're supposed to come together to build a partnership. No one should feel like they're settling.
I think the show was written that way so us fans would have something to talk about lol. If they said Marshall was the settler, 99% of us would agree & the debate would be dead😂
I think I agree, but I have a question: is the argument on itself enough that Marshall is the settler based on their college history? Lily is the one that approached him, wanting him to be her boyfriend. And it was Marshall who was doubting if it was a good idea to stick with Lily or that he should play the field when Ted tells him to choose Lily.
I don’t think there is any reason to assume Lily is the settler besides the fact that she has way more confidence than he has and she is more outspoken. She is also just more audacious and this seems at odds with her being a reacher.
Also, didn't she destroy her stereo just to meet Marshall again while Marshall was not even sure she was the one (he said so during that time Ted asked Lilly to join their roommate photo).
>**she** is a failed artist turned kindergarten teacher
I bolded the important part of this sentence. Men don't care about a woman's career, or lack there of.
actually the thing is, It was true when the show started. Lilly was the beautiful, young girl with a decent job while marshal was this fugly looking kid who was still in education. By the time the show ends Marshal is the established older lawyer who is more confident and makes a lot of money, while lilly is the lady with nothing goin on and rapidly losing her looks.
shows how women have higher dating value early in their 20s while the script gets flipped near late 20s.
So i think the part people forget is that she insists that there is no reacher or settler in their relationship. Marshall pesters her endlessly until she finally gives him an answer. Honestly the thing she fucked up on was not realizing how desperate marshall was to hear he was the settler and not her
Great point! He pestered & he pestered lol. Then, was outraged by her response
Exactly! I dont necessarily agree with her answer but i feel like people get mad at lily for this when really its something bad marshall did (which is rare)
This is a common thing here. People are so desperate to hate on lilly they ignore parts of the show
Tbh, I think even if she’d said he was the settler he would have continued to pester her. Ted and Robin had already told him they considered him the reacher, and Lily could tell he was only pestering because he wanted her to admit something. He never would have pestered her to flatter his own ego
>Honestly the thing she fucked up on was not realizing how desperate marshall was to hear he was the settler and not her Yeah but honestly... why?
This comes up so often and I never comment but I’d like to put in my 2 cents. I love Marshall he is the best, but he wouldn’t be Marshall without Lily: She put him through law school.( he mentions it in teds new car) Marshall is someone who has the best intentions but he often loses his way, Lily is the person that pulls him back to himself. When Marshall was about to take the job for financial reasons, even though it would help Lily with debt she tells him not to. When Marshall gets fired , he is stressed about telling her but even though they have money problems she assures him it’s ok and she believes in him. When his dad dies and he stays in his childhood home, she comes out and before heading back to NY calls him back to reality. When he tells her he wants to stay with GNB for another 5 years , she reminds him it is no who he is. And yes she went to airport but she still came back and supported marshal when he was hosting an event at their place for free. It’s not about degrees or looks. I don’t think Marshall is the teacher, but having a partner that is supportive yet calls you out when you are swerving away is invaluable. Can’t get a degree for that. For that reason I think Lily is like slightly, 1% , a settler.
100% agree. And that's what a relationship is. A give and take. Lily did SO MUCH for Marshall, and he reciprocates, but in a different way. Both gave more at times and took more at other times. Both made mistakes, like, you know, humans do - HIMYM was always VERY real for a sitcom. And she poignantly says in the last scene: you can't keep score, this is not tit for tat, not about you get to do this so I get to do it in return. That's not how relationships function, it's how they end.
I think insofar as it applies at all, Lily is the settler cause Lily had higher self-esteem and degree of emotional self-reliance, which is exactly why Marshall is the one who gets twisted up and insecure when the question pops up and the answer matters *so much* to him. That's the behavior of someone who knows they're the reacher, and wants to work through the silent resentment of that. Lily is the one who has a brief stint of questioning and running away because she *can* conceive of a life that's different from the one she has with Marshall, she just ends up realizing she doesn't want to. He's completely shattered and lost until she comes back because he's more emotionally reliant on her than vice versa. I feel like Lily loves/wants Marshall, but Marshal both loves her and needs her, and that makes for a slight difference in the dynamic that raises that question.
>That's the behavior of someone who knows they're the reacher, and wants to work through the silent resentment of that. This is so funny to me. I can understand resentment when you're the settler, but who resents being the reacher? You hit the jackpot and you're now pissed off about that because..?
Because you feel in some sense your position is precarious, and that the other person has more options and power than you do. This doesn't even have to be objectively accurate or anything, but it's a sentiment some people have in similar situations.
And that's another thing right there. Asking this question is stupid because this concept only works in a positive way when both people think they're the reacher.
"she doesn't want too" HMMMMMM why could it be??? trash take
This is an excellent take.
Lily's support for Marshall isn't talked about enough here.
>having a partner that is supportive yet calls you out when you are swerving away is invaluable. Can’t get a degree for that. Amen.
Love this. So true
It’s just a bad choice on Lily’s part to call herself the settler. Always say you’re the reacher. Always pursue the person you love.
She didn’t want to answer, which was the right response. Marshall kept pestering for an answer and then got mad when she gave her opinion, which was not cool at all.
Agreed but she could have answered the other answer and made her husband feel good about himself too. It’s easy to twist a story to make either one the reacher or the settler, so the logical choice is to pick the areas in which your significant other excels to make them happy. I mean Marshall is crazy tall, a fantastic musician, a lawyer, and friends with everyone. There’s enough to go on to say he’s the settler, no?
I would’ve also called my partner the reacher out of annoyance if he’d spent hours trying to get an answer out of me
If my wife asked, I'd tell her she was the settler immediately. Marshall was clearly dealing with self-confidence issues and was searching for emotional support and I mean it was an immature way to go about it, but there was a good way to approach it and a bad way- he clearly needed a win. I mean, if we're assuming a relationship is a team effort, then sometimes you gotta let your partner take a w.
I'm crazy jealous of people who are confident enough in their partner's intentions to be able to give them this without hesitation.
"for this reason, I declare you the reacher".
You forgot an important thing - He is an amazing standup comedian. Fish?
It just sounds like a bad plan giving the other person this perspective they will continue to see you through and then it changes the dynamic of your relationship if they subconsiously feel like they settled for you and that they could do better and that you should be lucky to have them. I mean not in Lilly and Marshalls case because they are fictional characters, but in life.
Nah. Tell whoever you're with that you're lucky to be with them. Make them feel special. What is this zero sum game nonsense that your brain is creating, and is it why you're single?
No, what is this zero sum game _their_ brain is creating, and why are they dragging me into it?
I don’t know but how about you throw them a bone and help them out of it? Lily and Marshall were married at that point iirc, it’s time to throw away your ego and help if your partner is going through something.
Ok you do you I guess. Just because you don't like something doesn't make it nonsense.
Seriously though, love the one you’re with and treat them as if they were special. Negging is for the insecure.
Them's the facts.
But in some cases there's really no reacher and no settler. At least not until the end. Sometimes it becomes clearer by the end... and sometimes you realize you've just been slumming it all along. Sorry lol, my stuff.
And in cases where it’s truly even, perfect. You have a lot of reasons why you should tell your s/o they’re special.
Completely agree, but is this framework the best format in which to do so?
Think about it differently. You’ve been breezing through your career and your partner has been struggling, and you’ve making more money. You tell them that they’re making a much bigger impact on people.
I hate when this episode comes up whenever my partner and I do rewatches.
I absolutely hate this theory bc imo, relationships aren't about reachers and settlers. That's not a good way to look at your relationship. You're supposed to come together to build a partnership. No one should feel like they're settling.
She supported him while he was in law sch-- oh, forget it 😐
support? how? she distracted him at every turn and even gave him massive credit card debt even though she knew he would not make big money
I think the show was written that way so us fans would have something to talk about lol. If they said Marshall was the settler, 99% of us would agree & the debate would be dead😂
Yeah, Marshall was definitely not the reacher.
I think I agree, but I have a question: is the argument on itself enough that Marshall is the settler based on their college history? Lily is the one that approached him, wanting him to be her boyfriend. And it was Marshall who was doubting if it was a good idea to stick with Lily or that he should play the field when Ted tells him to choose Lily. I don’t think there is any reason to assume Lily is the settler besides the fact that she has way more confidence than he has and she is more outspoken. She is also just more audacious and this seems at odds with her being a reacher.
Ooh, excellent point. If you take that as a deciding factor, then yes, Lily ends up being the reacher.
As a bisexual who LOVES women, Marshall was the settler 🙈
Also, didn't she destroy her stereo just to meet Marshall again while Marshall was not even sure she was the one (he said so during that time Ted asked Lilly to join their roommate photo).
Guys, c'mon... Marshall was the settler. I mean, he's buying Lily a horse!
>**she** is a failed artist turned kindergarten teacher I bolded the important part of this sentence. Men don't care about a woman's career, or lack there of.
as much as I agree with what you're saying, it's also true that in the modern world looks are what matter the most followed by social confidence.
actually the thing is, It was true when the show started. Lilly was the beautiful, young girl with a decent job while marshal was this fugly looking kid who was still in education. By the time the show ends Marshal is the established older lawyer who is more confident and makes a lot of money, while lilly is the lady with nothing goin on and rapidly losing her looks. shows how women have higher dating value early in their 20s while the script gets flipped near late 20s.