It’s all about shot placement. A .30 cal projectile is more than enough medicine for a whitetail. If you can hit the vitals of an deer at 200-300 yards you can put Whitetail in the freezer all day long with a .308
Shooting the gun well and knowing what its limitations are and more importantly knowing what your limitations are…..knowing where you can put that bullet repeatedly with confidence will be the largest factors in your success as a hunter than the caliber of gun you choose.
I’d add that said friend probably shouldn’t handle a firearm without some remedial training. First, he needs to start with some concepts like “ass”, “elbow” and “hole in the ground”.
Where I live .270 is the smallest caliber you can legally use for deer hunting. I’m really curious to hear what your buddy is using that is smaller than that.
Where the hell are you living that the smallest legal round you can use is a 270? The amount of deer killed across the world with much smaller bullets is staggering
Assuming the might be in Victoria, Australia. It’s not the smallest legal round, but it’s the smallest round you’re allowed to use on any of the large deer (Sambar, red, Rusa). The requirement there is calibre and weight - .270 firing a 130 grain
Where I live caliber 6.5 mm and 2000 Joules of energy at 100 Meters are erquired to shoot red deer, wild hogs, etc
Roe deer can be shot with 1000 Joules, so .222 or .223 are popular
Outside the US it is not uncommon to have minimal bullet diameter of for most hoofed animals. In Germany it is 6.5mm. So the .243 might get the job done, but is not legal.
We have 3000J at barrel lower limit for bigger game like deer, hogs, moose. I suppose our deer is in bigger side. 3000J leaves calibers like .308, 30-06, 6.5mm, 7x64, I believe there is some magnum round .270 with 3000J, but it is not common. This was discussed negatively between hunters, because many of them had .243 or .270 for deers, some used 7.62x39 SKS or similar rifles, that couldn't be used anymore.
I think I should add that by hunters morals here head and neck shot is unpreferrable and one should aim for vitals primarly.
Eastern Europe
You’re probably in Wisconsin or Nebraska with big ass deer. In west Texas, whitetail are the size of large dogs. Still, .308 is a fine caliber for Texas whitetail. Who wants those shoulders anyway?
This does depend where you live. 7 mag on a southern whitetail is 99% of the time really overkill. The deer are smaller and shots tend to be closer. Use a magnum if you want but unless you have the money to be hunting over clearcuts, it’s just more noise, recoil and meat loss.
Where I hunt (south/central Louisiana)it’s a lot of flood water with knolls and small ridges, a 7MM rem mag is a great gun. Trailing a deer in water isn’t optimal, practically impossible, I don’t need to trail them if I drop them on the spot, and I’ve never had one not do that with the 7MMRM
Worst I had was my first doe (small but it was my first time seeing one on a hunt and also my first time hunting deer, the excitement was real) where the stomach got a little sucked out of the exit wound. I have a photo somewhere showing it.
Heh, I’ve shot a few with a .450 marlin lever gun and discovered that there is indeed such thing as too much for deer. They ran a loooong way with a minimal blood trail because there’s not enough mass to make the bullet meaningfully expand. That’s my theory anyway
My .45-70 lever gun sure put down an Ohio doe. Used the Hornady Lever-evolution round and it expanded pretty good. But was through ribs so didn’t really lose any meaningful meat.
The only weapon I can conceive of even being able to carry into a forest and being inappropriate for a whitetail is a fucking grenade.
Even a .50 will leave plenty of meat. FFS.
I've killed deer with .243s and -06s, and several cartridges in between.
It's up to you whether it's a metric to be considered "too much gun," but I see a marked difference in meat trauma surrounding the entrance and exit wounds between the .243 and the -06, which matters to me when the wound is on the shoulder. More meat trauma= less meat in the freezer.
I err smaller as much as is reasonable for this reason.
Used .308 for years and .30-06 before that. They are the absolute perfect Deer caliber. Messing up meat is a lot more about shot placement than anything.
That’s exactly what I’ve been saying. He tore up a deer with a .30-06 and has sworn by .243 since lol. Never had any issues, my whole mentality is I’d rather be able to buy more .308 and get more practice than less.
Ive had to track to many shot with a .243 to trust it much. Yes it will take down the deer, but any body shot with a .243 I’ve always had a minimum 50-100 yard tracking job.
.308 at least packs the punch to drop most within 20 yards for me. With Hornady 165gr CX rounds and previously 165gr SST rounds. The year I made the mistake and used Match Rounds, the two Whitetails I harvested ran/rolled a little farther, 40-60 yards.
We had a .243 when we were kids for deer hunting (dad felt that we should carry our own gun and that we were going to suffer carrying the 30-06 or 700 mag, which is fair).
Anyhow there were some awesome doe hunts for kids like age 12 and I did not like tracking them and especially when we couldn’t find them if we didn’t have dogs at camp to help…. So I took it upon myself to make headshots only my motto.
Missed a couple of times but he started noticing the pattern. When I got older and could carry the 30-06 (maybe age 15) I got a buck take. Popped a small buck in the head, and cracked the skull to the point where you couldn’t mount it.
Dad was so mad at me, but I was just glad to have figured out how to not spend hours looking for something we probably weren’t going to find.
Years later I shot a nice buck in long grass in Southern Arizona with the 700 mag, took a long shot for the body, rolled it so I know it was a hit… and then I spent the afternoon, evening and start of the night looking for it.
Wanted to get my uncle’s permission to burn the field (his ranch and he was involved with the local fire department and could’ve set up a controlled burn)… but I was severely saddened when I learned I couldn’t even get the rack back.
I hate killing stuff that just goes somewhere else and dies. Not squeamish but it just feels like such a waste!
Bad shots can be made by any gun and any shooter. Had my first miss in 23 years last season.
Was going to take a cull buck that had a broken jaw from something. Went for a neck shot to save meat. Well I didn’t focus and was a little lackadaisical when lining up the shot. Deer turns as I had squeezed the trigger. Clean miss, as I tracked him for 200 yards with no blood sign. Still got pictures of him through the winter picking at some attractants I would keep out to keep them moving through my land.
It truly does suck wounding an animal and not being able to recover it. When family/friends make bad shots they usually have to drag me out of the woods to stop looking for them. I can’t stand the thought of one suffering.
Probably my favorite bulled before switching over to the outfitter series, after I found boxes of them for $5 a box cheaper than the superpreformance. I truly wish I had the equipment to reload all my own stuff. One day I will. Used to love helping my dads buddy do it as a kid.
The actual bullet choice (and obviously shot placement) will influence that more than the cartridge itself. 308 is totally fine on deer with a good hunting bullet, a lot of people still use 300 win mag for deer.
All that being said, if your buddy is a brand new shooter, a 243 would be about perfect as a deer rifle. Lower recoil makes pretty much everyone a better shot, especially when you're getting started.
Season before last, I was using my .308 and harvested my larger buck yet. A 158” deer. It came in quartering to to my right side. I’m a right handed shooter. Not wanting to let it get into the brush and lose my shot I could make great placement with the rifle with how much I was twisted. So I just got a solid bead on the front shoulder and squeezed. Took the front half of that right front shoulder and the rear half of the left front shoulder with it. Still plenty of meat though. Big bodied deer so was even able to get quality meat from ribs and other places.
Still was sad to lose the front shoulder roasts.
I’m always in the more over less camp with rifles. .308 is always my go to with the versatility it has and has done me quite well on whitetail. “Destroy” is going a little far. Maybe if you blow out both the shoulders but most calibers are gonna cause meat loss then. That being said, .270 is a fine caliber as well and might actually be a lot closer together than your buddy thinks.
I also have nothing against a .270. My favorite rifle I own is a .270 but I tend to take the bigger calibers out in the field a lot more. Whether it’s peace of mind or what I’m not sure I just like throwing a lot of lead down range at deer.
Same here. As far as your buddy is concerned, I own a couple b14s and they have been pretty picky with hunting bullets. I would lean toward a Tikka in that price range.
Accuracy. Finally found an off the shelf round for the 300wm that shoots well but have yet to find an off the shelf hunting round that is as accurate as I would like for the .308. Now granted I haven’t tried everything.
Yeah, your friend is being silly. Gotta apply common logic. .308 is good against people. Whitetail are more or less people size/weight, therefore. 308 is good for deer.
A .270 is a necked down .30-06. A .308 is a shortened modern .30-06.
.270 is speed, .308 is weight.
But, there really isn't much difference practical between them.
I've killed deer with 150 gr soft point .30-06 from 50 yds to 200 yards. Never "destroyed the meat". A little is lost on the off-side shoulder depending on the angle. But that is going to happen with any round that has what I would call adequate evergy. If it can't penetrate that deep, I don't think it's a enough gun.
.243 has dropped a bunch, so has .223.
.300 WinMag has, too!
It's all personal preference and shot placement. People get too hung up on the "perfect" round.
I use a 30-06...guess I'm just vaping deer according to your buddies dumb logic.
I bet he's the dude who grew up hunting with his dad and old timer grandpa who said "this is the one and only way to hunt white tail deer and everyone else is wrong"
I just got the B-14 in 308 last season for whitetail. Absolutely love it! Hunted with 270, 30-06, 30-30 for over 30 years…wanted a 308 if for anything the ease of getting ammo and the versatility, you still sling 150 grain and get similar results.
Your buddy doesn’t know much about ballistics to make that comment. Down range energy will be greater in the 270 past 150 yrds.
308 is an awesome choice. Placement, placement, placement…
Damage comes from velocity and bullet style. Faster fragile bullets will cause more meat damage than slower tougher bullets. Guess which one shoots a faster lighter bullet?
308 is fine for whitetail. It’s been used for decades and will continue to be used. Are there better rounds? Yes, but it isn’t bad round for whitetail by any means
I hunt elk, mule, whitetail, and bear with 30.06, while not enormously more energetic than 308, it is still more energetic. I have plenty of useable meat on everything I harvest
lol 308 is one of the top most popular calibers sold and takes tons of deer every year . I’ve heard of guys using 375 H&H mag for whitetail even , not that I think that’s appropriate but just saying you don’t have to worry about blowing a hole through your meat
I'm inclined not to trust anyone who says stuff like this. For all practical purposes when it comes to the cartridges themselves, they are practically identical, and ammo selection will easily provide a much larger variation in ballistics than one caliber or another. Meaning, I can shoot a heavy weight 270 bullet that will absolutely obliterate a whitetail deer, whereas a lighter weight 308 will do the trick without the destruction.
270 is a great round. It will take just about everything in North America with good ammo choice and proper shot placement. *But a 308 has exactly the same attributes.* That's why I say they are practically indistinguishable.
So, straying away from each cartridge's effect on game, we're left to evaluate things like recoil, rifle options, versatility, ammo availability and price, etc. For *all* of those, either it's a dead time or 308 takes the cake. For a *first* hunting rifle, you can't go wrong with either, but you'll likely be happier and richer with a 308.
The difference between 270 and 308 at hunting distances is negligible. If you want a little less recoil and a sweet shooter 243 is usually plenty for whitetail. Don’t overlook 25-06. I’ve taken several 200yd muleys with that. A new round worth considering for whitetail is 6 ARC. Might be harder to find ammo, but cool round.
I shoot 3-4 deer a year with my .308 and always has little to no triage to the shoulder area. Lately I’ve been hunting with Hornady Super performance 150 gr SST which is plenty for whitetail
I have shot the few whitetail I have bagged, all with a. .308 and Oryx 180 grain bullets. The first one I hit at the lungs (calf) and it had quite a marked explosive effect with the same load I use for moose. I made milder loads and they have dropped nicely with very little meat loss. V0 at 750 m/s.
I’ve used a .308 for years. Used .270 before and .243 as a kid. Never had to track with the .308. They drop in their tracks every time. No issues with meat loss either. Drops hogs just as well
Huh? ummm ok in short your friend is wrong. A .308 is perfectly fine for Whitetail, I've taken many with it, from about 15 feet (literally) out to 60 - 70 yards (NH hunting is typically pretty thick). As for the .270, it's as good for Whitetail. If you're in a western state or have ranges going over 200 -300 yards I'd probably go .270, but .308 is a fine round for hunting whitetail! As can be seen from all the comments below (or above ... or however this post gets placed).
Here's some ballistic info on the two:
[(161) 270 Win vs 308 Win: ONE Clear Winner On Mild Steel - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LudZcrNN2L8)
and a video on hunting with these two cartridges.
[270 vs 308: Which One Should You Hunt With? (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZ_BOQ97cE0)
I’ve been a .270 fan all my life. I have an Xbolt eclipse stalker with a Zeiss Conquest that I bought 11 years ago as my “forever” deer rifle. Last year I bought a Ruger American Predator .308, simply because I noticed.308 ammo was still mostly available during covid. It shoots lights out, and I’ve killed no less than 30 hogs with it, and every single one has been DRT. As much as I love that high dollar .270, every time I open the safe now to head to the deer stand I only grab it because I feel like I’d be cheating on it to kill a deer with another rifle, because my first temptation is to grab the .308
Whitetail in Texas/Florida/Alabama or other small body deer states yes. There will be a lot of meat damaged. Run a lighter round (.270/.243 etc ). Anywhere farther north with larger bodies and you will have a lot less waste if you step up to a .308.
This is purely focused on a meat damage viewpoint. Honestly, any solid round will work, but a .308 is a round that will kill any game animal on the planet.
LOL, if your .308 is a gatling, maybe.
.308, .30-06, 7mm Rem Mag, etc, will all do the job just fine without too much damage as long as you're aiming at the right spot and avoid the 'meaty' bits.
I shot my white tail buck 3 times with a 300 win mag last year from 400 yards. Each shot right in the boiler maker. Wrecked no meat. Toughest deer I’ve ever shot he just wouldn’t go down I didn’t want him running down into the thick shit.
Caliber alone is not a useful metric. Bullet construction and impact velocity are the critical factors in determining wound size. A .308 match bullet at high impact velocity? Yeah, you’re gonna lose some meat. The same weight and caliber mono or bonded bullet at the same impact velocity will damage less meat.
Your friend don’t know what he’s talking about. .308 is fine. I hunt with a .450 Bushmaster that works just fine too. It will not destroy a deer. If you hit a shoulder it will make a mess but it definitely will not destroy a deer.
White tail is in a sweet spot where you can go from 243 to 44 or shotgun slugs and still soak it well. 308 has been used across the country with very little meat loss. The important part is making sure it's hollowpoint 🥴 forgetting to reload your 762×54r mags with hollowpoints after a range day with cheap Russian full metal jackets is a mistake you'll only puke over once
Have killed several dear with my m1a in .308. It does an amazing job putting down deer. Your buddy that says .308 is too much is just plum dumb. Trying to be king turd on shit island.
Dude, anything between a .243 and a .45-70 is good for deer and nothing will vaporize the deer or ruin any meat. That’s a result of poor shot placement, poor shooting, and poor game handling from the hunter.
Yeah, if you Texas heart shoot a 70lb doe with a 7.62 lazarinni war bird, or a earhinsplittin loudin boomin, or a .777 T-Rex yeah, you’re gonna ruin some meat.
But anything you’ll want to shoot enough to sight in, will be fine for deer, if shot through the ribs.
This is completely asinine. The .270 has MORE ENERGY than the .308 and the difference in the diameter of the bullet is 1/32 of an inch or 10%.Plenty of people hunt whitetail with magnum calibers and do very well putting meat in the freezer. I can't picture a way to shoot a whitetail with anything less than one of the H&H calibers that wouldn't fill a 12x12x8" box in the freezer, except maybe the "Texas Heart Shot."
308 is probably the most popular whitetail caliber these days.
270 has more energy than 308, typically.
Also I use 300WM for deer hunting and that's just a 308 going fast. Works great.
Edit: Guess im as wrong about the energy, which is quite surprising to me. But I still stand in that 308 if fine.
I shoot both 308 and 270. Both with Remington corlokt. 270 in 130gr and the 308 in 150gr. The 270 will blow a hole big enough to put your fist through on the exit. Assuming you don’t hit shoulder. I’ve never recovered a bullet with it. Liquifies the insides when inside 150yrds. The 308 I’ve recovered 2 bullets now and cleaning is much easier in comparison.
I’m making these comparisons on 1 1/2 - 2 1/2yr old does. Western PA. I haven’t shot a buck with the 308 yet.
308 gets my vote all day.
lol. That’s priceless. My uncle has shot white tails with a 350 rem mag and had almost no meat loss. Put the bullet in the right spot and it’ll work perfectly. A 270 with a good shot and a 308 with a good shot there won’t be any difference what so ever
I deer hunted with a 270 for years, but my 300 winmag is a tac driver, I prefer it to all my other rifles, for comparison i have used 30-30,3006, 35 wheeling,270,300 winmag, 7mag , buck shot
I’ve shot a 300 win mag for 3 years now on whitetail because I bought it for my eventual elk tag I’ll draw fingers crossed. Honestly doesn’t create a massive hole at all, it’s all about that shock power. Right behind the shoulder every time and they never take a step. It’s nice not having to track lol
All about shot placement. You hit a deer with a 223 or a 7mm rem mag right in the boiler plate. Goes down with little to no meat loss every time. Make a bad shot, you lose meat. My buddy shot a whitetail buck walking straight towards us with his 300 win mag. Went down like a sack of spuds. However, pulling guts on that thing was an experience I wouldn’t not wish on anyone. 308 is a great round for most big game animals. I wouldn’t bat an eye at getting one.
It’s not too big at all. I used to hunt with a youth model 30-06, would drop deer where they stood. I got tired of the combination of a small rifle, large caliber, and a scope with minimal eye relief. Since then I switched to a 300 blk upper on my AR. Kills deer but they don’t bleed. So if you have to track it might take a while so I bumped back up to a .308. .308, .270, and 30-06 all do the trick quite well.
I use my 308 165 grain for deer and bear. I got a Vancouver Island blacktail this year and the hole was certainly bigger than my deer that I got with the 243, but if you get a broiler tool shot it really doesn't matter
Your friend is a moron lol. People have hunted deer with 30-06 for decades and it doesn’t cause ruined meat.
.308 is an extremely appropriate caliber for whitetail hunting
I sometimes use a 338 Lapua mag. Make a heart/lung shot and you won't mess any meat up with just about anything that is man portable into a tree stand.
Now if you make a shitty shot, every caliber will mess up meat, but on those smaller guns you won't need to worry about that meat as you aren't as likely to recover the animal.
30-06 and 300 mag are also incredibly popular deer cartridges. There is a rash of wasted meat with those. The biggest variable in meat destruction after a poor shot is bullet selection. Stick with a monolithic copper bullet like Barnes ttsx or Hornady cx or other similar lines and you will find them simultaneously very lethal and deep penetrating without making an enormous wound channel. Another benefit is since it is lead free you can utilize all the meat right up to the wound channel safely.
I'm old and my .308 disintegrated several deer, nothing left but legs.
.270, .308, 7mmRM, 30-06 is too much, unless you don't want an ethical kill.NDoes your friend hunt deer with 22lr or .177 air rifles?
EDIT: I own all of the above calibers, .270, .398, and 30-06 is what our family uses for Whitetail deer, Mule deer, Moose, Elk.
.308 is great for whitetails.
The B14 is a horrible hunting gun though, unless your friend is sitting in a blind or not planning on leaving a treestand, since the Bergara is a tank. It's just heavy.
If they're going to spend more time on the range than in the woods, it's not going to be the end of the world, but it's a hearty woods gun.
It's great for pretty much everything. A .308Win 150gr Perfecta soft point to the heart stopped my first deer in its tracks with no lost meat. My relatives tried to get me to eat the heart, but copper and lead as a salt and pepper substitute isn't the most palatable thing in the world.
Shot placement. I’ve blown up deer with 308 and 270…bullet selection is key too. Just get a jacketed soft point and it’ll be fine. Personally I love the ballistic silver tips. They go in and blow up. Never had a deer run more than 10 steps with them
.308 is a very popular cartridge to shot roe deer (which is even smaller and lighter than whitetail) her in Germany. We even use 8mm Mauser or .30-06 on roe deer a lot.
.308 is a great allrounder and the B14 is a great rifle
While I completely agree that the smaller rounds are perfectly adequate with a good shot, I've found my 300wsm makes instakills negating the need to follow a blood trail. Texas whitetail and large feral hogs. Still needs to be a good shot to not ruin meat, but that's a given.
>Another buddy says “that’ll destroy a whitetail deer”, says anything bigger than .270 is too much.
Whoever said that is an idiot and should not be allowed out of the house without adult supervision.
I've successfully hunted Springbok antelope with a .308, the same one successfully hunted larger game like wildebeest and Kudu, so I believe it should be good for whitetail deer.
Dude the .308 is a perfect caliber for Whitetail Deer. I use 7 MM REM Mag and my dad a 30.06 which is a necked up .308 both larger calibres than .308. Shot placement is key. Put it anywhere in the heart/lung area you will not be wasting much meat at all. The .308 is a great all purpose caliber it will handle most anything you can kill in North America. Ive personally seen it put down everything from Pronghorn Antelope to Moose and black bears no issues at all with any of them. Best of luck 😬👍
For game that size, Germany actually dictates at least 6,5mm projectile diameter. So the .270 would barely make the cut.
Iÿm hunting roedeer (much smaller) with 308, totally fine.
No, 308 is perfect. But both will do the job
Whitetail deer are about the same size as fallow deer we have in the uk. I shot 20 in the early part of this year culling before the season closed until the 1st august. I will continue to shoot more from that date.
The 270 will kill them too but you might get more meat damage if you’re within 200y because the bullet is travelling much faster. It can be quite a destructive round at close range. A 308 is ideal for a woodland stalking situation.
Deer are not tough animals to kill, any appropriately constructed bullet fired from a centrefire accurately will kill them all day long. The 243 has probably taken more deer in the UK than any other chambering. If I were allowed here, I would happily shoot deer with my 223 though I must concede grandfather swede is about Goldilocks for the job.
Good luck
I have a .308 as my only rifle. I've used it for moose, white tail and roe deer. No issue.
If my FIL is to be believed, his Marlin 45-70 is the best gun he's owned for deer as it doesn't destroy as much as the smaller calibers. Caliber is not the main factor in this regard, a faster bullet will do more damage to the meat than a slow one.
Also, although 270 is a smaller and lighter bullet than 308. In most cases it is carrying more energy and higher velocity than 308. So depending on bullet choice the 270 could cause much more damage than 308. Seems like a moot point to me.
I agree that neither are too big for whitetail.
All depends where you hit it. Put it behind the shoulder in the ribs, no issues whatsoever. Put it into the shoulder, gonna lose some meat. I've seen shoulder demolished from a 243. 308 is perfectly fine
A .308 is pretty much perfect, deer are a lot tougher then most think. My 270 and my dads old 308 do pretty much the exact same to a deer. If your buddy were to ruin the meat with a 308 its probably where he would be aiming as opposed to what hes shooting ( this does of course depend on the size of the deer, if your shooting a tiny deer at point blank then its probably going to rip through it a little bit more lol )
That fudd acting like a .270 (the 6.5CM of the .30-06 family) has less ballistic impact on a target than standard .308 is hilarious to me.
I use 7mm Rem Mag, .30-06, 6.5CM, 5.56, and 7.62 NATO (don’t have .308 ammo and the milsurp is cheaper) and have yet to see a deer, hog, or coyote I’ve smoked become nothing more than their hooves or paws.
Sounds like your buddy just has no idea what he’s talking about and is turning down your perfectly good advice. Let him buy what he wants. If he sticks with deer hunting there’s a good chance he realizes you were right by the time he buys a second rifle.
Depends on the area you’re shooting. In south Texas our white tail are really small and a .308 when hitting the deer quartered, can hit the front leg and destroy a quarter. I switched to 6.5CM and the bullet stops as soon as it touches the far quarter. This is assuming you’re going for the double lung/heart. I still haven’t had a deer go more than 10 yards with a .308 or 6.5CM.
There will be nothing left to eat but the hooves. ' Lol your friend is an idiot. Get the 308. Great round for all kinds of big game including deer.
Agreed , I have been hunting whitetail with a .308 for 30 years with no issue .
Hunting yes, but have tou ever shot one with a .308?
I’ll pitch in- I’ve got 5 deer and 4 antelope with one. And there’s a lot of people who say it’s too light for elk- it’s a great deer round.
The people that say a .308 is too small for elk are wrong.
I agree. I was adding that point to be poignant to the topic of “too much for deer”. It absolutely is not.
I’ve taken 2 moose with my .308.
It’s all about shot placement. A .30 cal projectile is more than enough medicine for a whitetail. If you can hit the vitals of an deer at 200-300 yards you can put Whitetail in the freezer all day long with a .308 Shooting the gun well and knowing what its limitations are and more importantly knowing what your limitations are…..knowing where you can put that bullet repeatedly with confidence will be the largest factors in your success as a hunter than the caliber of gun you choose.
I’d add that said friend probably shouldn’t handle a firearm without some remedial training. First, he needs to start with some concepts like “ass”, “elbow” and “hole in the ground”.
That’s just not true, I hunt with a 308 and there’s the hooves are gone to
Where I live .270 is the smallest caliber you can legally use for deer hunting. I’m really curious to hear what your buddy is using that is smaller than that.
243 is a great deer round. 223 is also perfectly adequate if you pick shots.
Agreed. Especially with the right ammo. A Barnes TSX with a .223 will kill any deer where I hunt (Texas).
Where the hell are you living that the smallest legal round you can use is a 270? The amount of deer killed across the world with much smaller bullets is staggering
Assuming the might be in Victoria, Australia. It’s not the smallest legal round, but it’s the smallest round you’re allowed to use on any of the large deer (Sambar, red, Rusa). The requirement there is calibre and weight - .270 firing a 130 grain
Where I live caliber 6.5 mm and 2000 Joules of energy at 100 Meters are erquired to shoot red deer, wild hogs, etc Roe deer can be shot with 1000 Joules, so .222 or .223 are popular
Yeah that sounds like BS, I don’t know any place that doesn’t allow 243
Outside the US it is not uncommon to have minimal bullet diameter of for most hoofed animals. In Germany it is 6.5mm. So the .243 might get the job done, but is not legal.
243 will def get the job done with those small deer, actually might be the best caliber
Even a well placed .223 Rem or .204 Ruger will drop a whitetail. Maybe even a Moose at short ranges.
.243 is the smallest legal rifle caliber in my state.
We have 3000J at barrel lower limit for bigger game like deer, hogs, moose. I suppose our deer is in bigger side. 3000J leaves calibers like .308, 30-06, 6.5mm, 7x64, I believe there is some magnum round .270 with 3000J, but it is not common. This was discussed negatively between hunters, because many of them had .243 or .270 for deers, some used 7.62x39 SKS or similar rifles, that couldn't be used anymore. I think I should add that by hunters morals here head and neck shot is unpreferrable and one should aim for vitals primarly. Eastern Europe
.243 is plenty acceptable for whitetail.. curious why that is considered too small.
Smallest by what standard? Is that caliber, named cartidges, etc?
25-06 hornady 117sst alllll day long !!! Western Oklahoma plains whitetail
You’re probably in Wisconsin or Nebraska with big ass deer. In west Texas, whitetail are the size of large dogs. Still, .308 is a fine caliber for Texas whitetail. Who wants those shoulders anyway?
No such thing as too much for deer, 308 is perfect. Even the big magnums 7mm and 300win mag ain’t too bad on deer from my experience.
Can confirm. My 7mm rem mag ain’t bad on whitetail at all.
I confirm your confirmation! No idea what OPs friend is talking about.
His friend prob thinks 9mm will blow someone’s lungs out too.
This does depend where you live. 7 mag on a southern whitetail is 99% of the time really overkill. The deer are smaller and shots tend to be closer. Use a magnum if you want but unless you have the money to be hunting over clearcuts, it’s just more noise, recoil and meat loss.
I have yet to see it actually have a noticeable difference on meat loss
Where I hunt (south/central Louisiana)it’s a lot of flood water with knolls and small ridges, a 7MM rem mag is a great gun. Trailing a deer in water isn’t optimal, practically impossible, I don’t need to trail them if I drop them on the spot, and I’ve never had one not do that with the 7MMRM
Worst I had was my first doe (small but it was my first time seeing one on a hunt and also my first time hunting deer, the excitement was real) where the stomach got a little sucked out of the exit wound. I have a photo somewhere showing it.
Heh, I’ve shot a few with a .450 marlin lever gun and discovered that there is indeed such thing as too much for deer. They ran a loooong way with a minimal blood trail because there’s not enough mass to make the bullet meaningfully expand. That’s my theory anyway
It’s the same for muzzleloader hunting, most of the time it’s subsonic when it enters the deer, but 240 grains does the trick
Where did you shoot it? The hoof? I shot one with a 45/70 bullet also didn't mushroom (entry and exit where the same) but dang did she drop fast
My .45-70 lever gun sure put down an Ohio doe. Used the Hornady Lever-evolution round and it expanded pretty good. But was through ribs so didn’t really lose any meaningful meat.
The only weapon I can conceive of even being able to carry into a forest and being inappropriate for a whitetail is a fucking grenade. Even a .50 will leave plenty of meat. FFS.
A grenade sounds like a fantastic challenge.
I've killed deer with .243s and -06s, and several cartridges in between. It's up to you whether it's a metric to be considered "too much gun," but I see a marked difference in meat trauma surrounding the entrance and exit wounds between the .243 and the -06, which matters to me when the wound is on the shoulder. More meat trauma= less meat in the freezer. I err smaller as much as is reasonable for this reason.
.45-70
Used .308 for years and .30-06 before that. They are the absolute perfect Deer caliber. Messing up meat is a lot more about shot placement than anything.
That’s exactly what I’ve been saying. He tore up a deer with a .30-06 and has sworn by .243 since lol. Never had any issues, my whole mentality is I’d rather be able to buy more .308 and get more practice than less.
Shot placement is key. Tell your friend to aim better next time
Tell your friend the .243 is just a necked down .308.
Shot placement and bullet selection are more important than caliber. A 100 grain Ballistic tip in the shoulder from his 243 will make a mess.
Ive had to track to many shot with a .243 to trust it much. Yes it will take down the deer, but any body shot with a .243 I’ve always had a minimum 50-100 yard tracking job. .308 at least packs the punch to drop most within 20 yards for me. With Hornady 165gr CX rounds and previously 165gr SST rounds. The year I made the mistake and used Match Rounds, the two Whitetails I harvested ran/rolled a little farther, 40-60 yards.
We had a .243 when we were kids for deer hunting (dad felt that we should carry our own gun and that we were going to suffer carrying the 30-06 or 700 mag, which is fair). Anyhow there were some awesome doe hunts for kids like age 12 and I did not like tracking them and especially when we couldn’t find them if we didn’t have dogs at camp to help…. So I took it upon myself to make headshots only my motto. Missed a couple of times but he started noticing the pattern. When I got older and could carry the 30-06 (maybe age 15) I got a buck take. Popped a small buck in the head, and cracked the skull to the point where you couldn’t mount it. Dad was so mad at me, but I was just glad to have figured out how to not spend hours looking for something we probably weren’t going to find. Years later I shot a nice buck in long grass in Southern Arizona with the 700 mag, took a long shot for the body, rolled it so I know it was a hit… and then I spent the afternoon, evening and start of the night looking for it. Wanted to get my uncle’s permission to burn the field (his ranch and he was involved with the local fire department and could’ve set up a controlled burn)… but I was severely saddened when I learned I couldn’t even get the rack back. I hate killing stuff that just goes somewhere else and dies. Not squeamish but it just feels like such a waste!
Bad shots can be made by any gun and any shooter. Had my first miss in 23 years last season. Was going to take a cull buck that had a broken jaw from something. Went for a neck shot to save meat. Well I didn’t focus and was a little lackadaisical when lining up the shot. Deer turns as I had squeezed the trigger. Clean miss, as I tracked him for 200 yards with no blood sign. Still got pictures of him through the winter picking at some attractants I would keep out to keep them moving through my land. It truly does suck wounding an animal and not being able to recover it. When family/friends make bad shots they usually have to drag me out of the woods to stop looking for them. I can’t stand the thought of one suffering.
I load those 165 SST with IMR 4350 and man is it good
Probably my favorite bulled before switching over to the outfitter series, after I found boxes of them for $5 a box cheaper than the superpreformance. I truly wish I had the equipment to reload all my own stuff. One day I will. Used to love helping my dads buddy do it as a kid.
Everyone has that one round that gets them into reloading, for me it was re priming Remington UML.. the super performance is hot AF, love the box
The actual bullet choice (and obviously shot placement) will influence that more than the cartridge itself. 308 is totally fine on deer with a good hunting bullet, a lot of people still use 300 win mag for deer. All that being said, if your buddy is a brand new shooter, a 243 would be about perfect as a deer rifle. Lower recoil makes pretty much everyone a better shot, especially when you're getting started.
I still use both of these for white tail. I have yet to tear one to pieces.
Season before last, I was using my .308 and harvested my larger buck yet. A 158” deer. It came in quartering to to my right side. I’m a right handed shooter. Not wanting to let it get into the brush and lose my shot I could make great placement with the rifle with how much I was twisted. So I just got a solid bead on the front shoulder and squeezed. Took the front half of that right front shoulder and the rear half of the left front shoulder with it. Still plenty of meat though. Big bodied deer so was even able to get quality meat from ribs and other places. Still was sad to lose the front shoulder roasts.
I live on a ranch and exclusively use .308 for our whitetail. It does not “destroy” them at all. It does knock them down instantly, which I prefer.
It’s nice to have your deer drop within sight
Just tell him to get a .45-70 it's perfect for rabbits and deer
Spotlighting rabbits with the deer .30-06 was a fun memory. Poor rabbits lol.
I’m always in the more over less camp with rifles. .308 is always my go to with the versatility it has and has done me quite well on whitetail. “Destroy” is going a little far. Maybe if you blow out both the shoulders but most calibers are gonna cause meat loss then. That being said, .270 is a fine caliber as well and might actually be a lot closer together than your buddy thinks.
Yeah that was part of my argument is the difference between .270 and .308 realistically isn’t much in terms of short distance ballistics.
I also have nothing against a .270. My favorite rifle I own is a .270 but I tend to take the bigger calibers out in the field a lot more. Whether it’s peace of mind or what I’m not sure I just like throwing a lot of lead down range at deer.
Nah I love .270, i have one too, but .308 has been my favorite round forever. Just partial to it lol
Same here. As far as your buddy is concerned, I own a couple b14s and they have been pretty picky with hunting bullets. I would lean toward a Tikka in that price range.
Picky? As in feeding or accuracy/precision?
Accuracy. Finally found an off the shelf round for the 300wm that shoots well but have yet to find an off the shelf hunting round that is as accurate as I would like for the .308. Now granted I haven’t tried everything.
Yeah, your friend is being silly. Gotta apply common logic. .308 is good against people. Whitetail are more or less people size/weight, therefore. 308 is good for deer.
I love my 270. Such a flat-trajectory cartridge, I even use it for elk. It really is all about shot placement.
A .270 is a necked down .30-06. A .308 is a shortened modern .30-06. .270 is speed, .308 is weight. But, there really isn't much difference practical between them. I've killed deer with 150 gr soft point .30-06 from 50 yds to 200 yards. Never "destroyed the meat". A little is lost on the off-side shoulder depending on the angle. But that is going to happen with any round that has what I would call adequate evergy. If it can't penetrate that deep, I don't think it's a enough gun. .243 has dropped a bunch, so has .223. .300 WinMag has, too! It's all personal preference and shot placement. People get too hung up on the "perfect" round.
A 270 will probably tear up more of a whitetail than the 308. Depending on velocity and bullet construction
Right I have seen some pretty nasty exit wounds from a .270 compared to a .308
I blew 5 ribs out on a quartering deer with my 270. That was gnarly
lol…your buddy is an idiot… I’ve killed plenty of deer w/ a 308 and 30-06
Here to add to the “your friend is an idiot” pile. He’s probably fun to have a beer with but don’t loan him money.
I use a 30-06...guess I'm just vaping deer according to your buddies dumb logic. I bet he's the dude who grew up hunting with his dad and old timer grandpa who said "this is the one and only way to hunt white tail deer and everyone else is wrong"
You hit the nail on the head lmao
I just got the B-14 in 308 last season for whitetail. Absolutely love it! Hunted with 270, 30-06, 30-30 for over 30 years…wanted a 308 if for anything the ease of getting ammo and the versatility, you still sling 150 grain and get similar results. Your buddy doesn’t know much about ballistics to make that comment. Down range energy will be greater in the 270 past 150 yrds. 308 is an awesome choice. Placement, placement, placement…
Your friend is inexperienced. It’ll be fine. I’ve shot deer sized animals with a .375H&H and it didn’t tear them up badly.
Damage comes from velocity and bullet style. Faster fragile bullets will cause more meat damage than slower tougher bullets. Guess which one shoots a faster lighter bullet?
My buddy hunts with a mag 7mm it works fine for deer. 308 is a great choice.
308 is fine for whitetail. It’s been used for decades and will continue to be used. Are there better rounds? Yes, but it isn’t bad round for whitetail by any means
I hunt elk, mule, whitetail, and bear with 30.06, while not enormously more energetic than 308, it is still more energetic. I have plenty of useable meat on everything I harvest
.308 is what I’d probably tell people to get if they could only have one caliber for hoofed animals.
lol 308 is one of the top most popular calibers sold and takes tons of deer every year . I’ve heard of guys using 375 H&H mag for whitetail even , not that I think that’s appropriate but just saying you don’t have to worry about blowing a hole through your meat
.308 is what I shoot, your friend is an idiot
[Shooting a deer with a 50 BMG](https://youtu.be/x2I8qp9ZSA0?si=uu1ulxtneFjCEW9K)
I'm inclined not to trust anyone who says stuff like this. For all practical purposes when it comes to the cartridges themselves, they are practically identical, and ammo selection will easily provide a much larger variation in ballistics than one caliber or another. Meaning, I can shoot a heavy weight 270 bullet that will absolutely obliterate a whitetail deer, whereas a lighter weight 308 will do the trick without the destruction. 270 is a great round. It will take just about everything in North America with good ammo choice and proper shot placement. *But a 308 has exactly the same attributes.* That's why I say they are practically indistinguishable. So, straying away from each cartridge's effect on game, we're left to evaluate things like recoil, rifle options, versatility, ammo availability and price, etc. For *all* of those, either it's a dead time or 308 takes the cake. For a *first* hunting rifle, you can't go wrong with either, but you'll likely be happier and richer with a 308.
The difference between 270 and 308 at hunting distances is negligible. If you want a little less recoil and a sweet shooter 243 is usually plenty for whitetail. Don’t overlook 25-06. I’ve taken several 200yd muleys with that. A new round worth considering for whitetail is 6 ARC. Might be harder to find ammo, but cool round.
Is he confusing whitetail with munjack?
Great all around. Look into the 7mm-08. You guys can compromise. It’s a .280 bullet in a .308 cartridge.
I actually think the 7mm-08 is better than the 308 in everything way other than factory ammo availability.
I’d probably agree with you in most circumstances. I love that round.
I use .308 for whitetail most of the time and it's fine.
I shoot 3-4 deer a year with my .308 and always has little to no triage to the shoulder area. Lately I’ve been hunting with Hornady Super performance 150 gr SST which is plenty for whitetail
I have shot the few whitetail I have bagged, all with a. .308 and Oryx 180 grain bullets. The first one I hit at the lungs (calf) and it had quite a marked explosive effect with the same load I use for moose. I made milder loads and they have dropped nicely with very little meat loss. V0 at 750 m/s.
Nah
I’ve used a .308 for years. Used .270 before and .243 as a kid. Never had to track with the .308. They drop in their tracks every time. No issues with meat loss either. Drops hogs just as well
Huh? ummm ok in short your friend is wrong. A .308 is perfectly fine for Whitetail, I've taken many with it, from about 15 feet (literally) out to 60 - 70 yards (NH hunting is typically pretty thick). As for the .270, it's as good for Whitetail. If you're in a western state or have ranges going over 200 -300 yards I'd probably go .270, but .308 is a fine round for hunting whitetail! As can be seen from all the comments below (or above ... or however this post gets placed). Here's some ballistic info on the two: [(161) 270 Win vs 308 Win: ONE Clear Winner On Mild Steel - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LudZcrNN2L8) and a video on hunting with these two cartridges. [270 vs 308: Which One Should You Hunt With? (youtube.com)](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZ_BOQ97cE0)
I’ve been a .270 fan all my life. I have an Xbolt eclipse stalker with a Zeiss Conquest that I bought 11 years ago as my “forever” deer rifle. Last year I bought a Ruger American Predator .308, simply because I noticed.308 ammo was still mostly available during covid. It shoots lights out, and I’ve killed no less than 30 hogs with it, and every single one has been DRT. As much as I love that high dollar .270, every time I open the safe now to head to the deer stand I only grab it because I feel like I’d be cheating on it to kill a deer with another rifle, because my first temptation is to grab the .308
Whitetail in Texas/Florida/Alabama or other small body deer states yes. There will be a lot of meat damaged. Run a lighter round (.270/.243 etc ). Anywhere farther north with larger bodies and you will have a lot less waste if you step up to a .308. This is purely focused on a meat damage viewpoint. Honestly, any solid round will work, but a .308 is a round that will kill any game animal on the planet.
My buddy swears by .300 win mag. You're good.
Just don't hit the shoulder blade and you should be fine.
I use .308 for blacktail all the time. It’s not overkill. It gets the job done quickly.
LOL, if your .308 is a gatling, maybe. .308, .30-06, 7mm Rem Mag, etc, will all do the job just fine without too much damage as long as you're aiming at the right spot and avoid the 'meaty' bits.
Your friend has obviously never shot a deer before. Otherwise he would realize the absolute ridiculousness of that statement.
I shot my white tail buck 3 times with a 300 win mag last year from 400 yards. Each shot right in the boiler maker. Wrecked no meat. Toughest deer I’ve ever shot he just wouldn’t go down I didn’t want him running down into the thick shit.
Holy cow, you found the Boromir of the deer world.
Caliber alone is not a useful metric. Bullet construction and impact velocity are the critical factors in determining wound size. A .308 match bullet at high impact velocity? Yeah, you’re gonna lose some meat. The same weight and caliber mono or bonded bullet at the same impact velocity will damage less meat.
I think 308 is the ideal whitetail round
308. Tell your friend to read.,
Your friend don’t know what he’s talking about. .308 is fine. I hunt with a .450 Bushmaster that works just fine too. It will not destroy a deer. If you hit a shoulder it will make a mess but it definitely will not destroy a deer.
No.
White tail is in a sweet spot where you can go from 243 to 44 or shotgun slugs and still soak it well. 308 has been used across the country with very little meat loss. The important part is making sure it's hollowpoint 🥴 forgetting to reload your 762×54r mags with hollowpoints after a range day with cheap Russian full metal jackets is a mistake you'll only puke over once
I have a Bergara B14 in 6.5 and regret not getting it in .308. Your buddy is wrong.
Have killed several dear with my m1a in .308. It does an amazing job putting down deer. Your buddy that says .308 is too much is just plum dumb. Trying to be king turd on shit island.
.308 is my deer rifle. Bullet selection and shot placement are going to be more important.
My main deer gun is a 30-06. There isn't much heart left, but the rest of the meat is just fine.
You can take a horse to the water but you can’t make it drink. .270 is a great round but your buddy’s understanding of .308 is.. less than ideal.
Kinda scary the top comments seem to think bulket diameter is the only factor.
Dude, anything between a .243 and a .45-70 is good for deer and nothing will vaporize the deer or ruin any meat. That’s a result of poor shot placement, poor shooting, and poor game handling from the hunter. Yeah, if you Texas heart shoot a 70lb doe with a 7.62 lazarinni war bird, or a earhinsplittin loudin boomin, or a .777 T-Rex yeah, you’re gonna ruin some meat. But anything you’ll want to shoot enough to sight in, will be fine for deer, if shot through the ribs.
Hell no . It’s a perfect caliber for anything the size of a whitetail or mule deer
.308 is a tack driver as we call it. Accurate and dependable. More than enough for whitetails
This is completely asinine. The .270 has MORE ENERGY than the .308 and the difference in the diameter of the bullet is 1/32 of an inch or 10%.Plenty of people hunt whitetail with magnum calibers and do very well putting meat in the freezer. I can't picture a way to shoot a whitetail with anything less than one of the H&H calibers that wouldn't fill a 12x12x8" box in the freezer, except maybe the "Texas Heart Shot." 308 is probably the most popular whitetail caliber these days.
270 has more energy than 308, typically. Also I use 300WM for deer hunting and that's just a 308 going fast. Works great. Edit: Guess im as wrong about the energy, which is quite surprising to me. But I still stand in that 308 if fine.
Your friend is uneducated about ballistics.
I shoot both 308 and 270. Both with Remington corlokt. 270 in 130gr and the 308 in 150gr. The 270 will blow a hole big enough to put your fist through on the exit. Assuming you don’t hit shoulder. I’ve never recovered a bullet with it. Liquifies the insides when inside 150yrds. The 308 I’ve recovered 2 bullets now and cleaning is much easier in comparison. I’m making these comparisons on 1 1/2 - 2 1/2yr old does. Western PA. I haven’t shot a buck with the 308 yet. 308 gets my vote all day.
lol. That’s priceless. My uncle has shot white tails with a 350 rem mag and had almost no meat loss. Put the bullet in the right spot and it’ll work perfectly. A 270 with a good shot and a 308 with a good shot there won’t be any difference what so ever
It’s a great round for deer! And all ages and sizes of shooter!
I deer hunted with a 270 for years, but my 300 winmag is a tac driver, I prefer it to all my other rifles, for comparison i have used 30-30,3006, 35 wheeling,270,300 winmag, 7mag , buck shot
I have a special friend as well, he’s got a hard-on for the 270 as well, thinks anything other than 270 is to big.
Everyone I know uses .30 cal for deer. Typically .30-06 when I started using a 5.56 my group clowned me and said it way too small of a caliber
Personally I would use 6.5 creedmore but there's absolutely nothing wrong with .308
No
I’ve sent a 45-70 round through two side by side white tail does and I’ve bricked a 7 year old buck with a 375 Ruger.
3/4s on the ground is better then 4/4 running through the woods. ;)
I have used a .308 on every deer I have killed except the 1st one. It was a 12 gauge slug. We only hunted birds until I was 15. The .308 works great.
I shot 3 whitetail with .308 this last year and got plenty of meat off each. I think it would suit your buddy great
I’ve shot a 300 win mag for 3 years now on whitetail because I bought it for my eventual elk tag I’ll draw fingers crossed. Honestly doesn’t create a massive hole at all, it’s all about that shock power. Right behind the shoulder every time and they never take a step. It’s nice not having to track lol
Your friend is a fudd
All about shot placement. You hit a deer with a 223 or a 7mm rem mag right in the boiler plate. Goes down with little to no meat loss every time. Make a bad shot, you lose meat. My buddy shot a whitetail buck walking straight towards us with his 300 win mag. Went down like a sack of spuds. However, pulling guts on that thing was an experience I wouldn’t not wish on anyone. 308 is a great round for most big game animals. I wouldn’t bat an eye at getting one.
Remind your friend you don't eat the lungs or ribs(generally) it's about getting close enough to ensure your shot placement 😉
450 bushmaster is the ultimate whitetail hunting rifle, but .308 is completely acceptable. Your buddy is big wrong.
.30-06 here, but I've taken a few with my .308, too. It's a nostalgia thing for me.
It’s not too big at all. I used to hunt with a youth model 30-06, would drop deer where they stood. I got tired of the combination of a small rifle, large caliber, and a scope with minimal eye relief. Since then I switched to a 300 blk upper on my AR. Kills deer but they don’t bleed. So if you have to track it might take a while so I bumped back up to a .308. .308, .270, and 30-06 all do the trick quite well.
.308 is my hunting caliber and a large amount of hunters in my area still use the .30-06. Same bullet size but more power behind it
I own both a 270 and 308. It’s messed up stuff exactly the same.
I use my 308 165 grain for deer and bear. I got a Vancouver Island blacktail this year and the hole was certainly bigger than my deer that I got with the 243, but if you get a broiler tool shot it really doesn't matter
I've taken multiple deer every season with a Sig Patrol 716. Not only .308, but one of the deadliest platforms known to man... an A motherfuckin' R.
No not at all
Your friend is a moron lol. People have hunted deer with 30-06 for decades and it doesn’t cause ruined meat. .308 is an extremely appropriate caliber for whitetail hunting
I can’t even decide where I would start arguing with that guy. He’s dumb.
Well seeing how 45-70 is heavily used (especially by the old school hunters) as a "brush" round for deer, I would imagine the .308 will be just fine.
I sometimes use a 338 Lapua mag. Make a heart/lung shot and you won't mess any meat up with just about anything that is man portable into a tree stand. Now if you make a shitty shot, every caliber will mess up meat, but on those smaller guns you won't need to worry about that meat as you aren't as likely to recover the animal. 30-06 and 300 mag are also incredibly popular deer cartridges. There is a rash of wasted meat with those. The biggest variable in meat destruction after a poor shot is bullet selection. Stick with a monolithic copper bullet like Barnes ttsx or Hornady cx or other similar lines and you will find them simultaneously very lethal and deep penetrating without making an enormous wound channel. Another benefit is since it is lead free you can utilize all the meat right up to the wound channel safely.
Perfection
.308 is a very versatile round not perfect but it can do alot
I'm old and my .308 disintegrated several deer, nothing left but legs. .270, .308, 7mmRM, 30-06 is too much, unless you don't want an ethical kill.NDoes your friend hunt deer with 22lr or .177 air rifles? EDIT: I own all of the above calibers, .270, .398, and 30-06 is what our family uses for Whitetail deer, Mule deer, Moose, Elk.
.308 is great for whitetails. The B14 is a horrible hunting gun though, unless your friend is sitting in a blind or not planning on leaving a treestand, since the Bergara is a tank. It's just heavy. If they're going to spend more time on the range than in the woods, it's not going to be the end of the world, but it's a hearty woods gun.
Your buddy is probably one of the type that thinks 308 is more powerful than a 30-06, b because he's shot neither.
My buddy shoots deer with a 7mm and it doesn’t tear them up as long as you don’t hit them in the shoulder
It’s what use
I've only used .308 to harvest deer. It is a great round for whitetail and I will recommend it all day every day.
It's great for pretty much everything. A .308Win 150gr Perfecta soft point to the heart stopped my first deer in its tracks with no lost meat. My relatives tried to get me to eat the heart, but copper and lead as a salt and pepper substitute isn't the most palatable thing in the world.
Shot placement. I’ve blown up deer with 308 and 270…bullet selection is key too. Just get a jacketed soft point and it’ll be fine. Personally I love the ballistic silver tips. They go in and blow up. Never had a deer run more than 10 steps with them
Barnes ammo with a 130TTSX is almost identical to a .270. .308 isn’t perfect for much, but it’s good enough at almost everything.
.308 is a very popular cartridge to shot roe deer (which is even smaller and lighter than whitetail) her in Germany. We even use 8mm Mauser or .30-06 on roe deer a lot. .308 is a great allrounder and the B14 is a great rifle
I know people that hunt white tail with 45-70 You’re fine
.308 is a great deer round. I even used it three years ago on pronghorn. It was fine.
While I completely agree that the smaller rounds are perfectly adequate with a good shot, I've found my 300wsm makes instakills negating the need to follow a blood trail. Texas whitetail and large feral hogs. Still needs to be a good shot to not ruin meat, but that's a given.
>Another buddy says “that’ll destroy a whitetail deer”, says anything bigger than .270 is too much. Whoever said that is an idiot and should not be allowed out of the house without adult supervision.
I've successfully hunted Springbok antelope with a .308, the same one successfully hunted larger game like wildebeest and Kudu, so I believe it should be good for whitetail deer.
Shot placement is key. Aim for the boiler room (double lung). Regardless, 308 is fine for US whitetail.
Dude the .308 is a perfect caliber for Whitetail Deer. I use 7 MM REM Mag and my dad a 30.06 which is a necked up .308 both larger calibres than .308. Shot placement is key. Put it anywhere in the heart/lung area you will not be wasting much meat at all. The .308 is a great all purpose caliber it will handle most anything you can kill in North America. Ive personally seen it put down everything from Pronghorn Antelope to Moose and black bears no issues at all with any of them. Best of luck 😬👍
For game that size, Germany actually dictates at least 6,5mm projectile diameter. So the .270 would barely make the cut. Iÿm hunting roedeer (much smaller) with 308, totally fine.
Great round
No, 308 is perfect. But both will do the job Whitetail deer are about the same size as fallow deer we have in the uk. I shot 20 in the early part of this year culling before the season closed until the 1st august. I will continue to shoot more from that date. The 270 will kill them too but you might get more meat damage if you’re within 200y because the bullet is travelling much faster. It can be quite a destructive round at close range. A 308 is ideal for a woodland stalking situation. Deer are not tough animals to kill, any appropriately constructed bullet fired from a centrefire accurately will kill them all day long. The 243 has probably taken more deer in the UK than any other chambering. If I were allowed here, I would happily shoot deer with my 223 though I must concede grandfather swede is about Goldilocks for the job. Good luck
I have a .308 as my only rifle. I've used it for moose, white tail and roe deer. No issue. If my FIL is to be believed, his Marlin 45-70 is the best gun he's owned for deer as it doesn't destroy as much as the smaller calibers. Caliber is not the main factor in this regard, a faster bullet will do more damage to the meat than a slow one.
I use a 308 for black grouse with fmj. It's the round that's important
Definitely not. Works just fine. I on the other hand use 30-06.
You americans should look in to 6,5x55 Swedish mauser. One hell of an all round caliber, I shoot anything from capercaillie to moose with it
308 is perfect, he's nuts
Shot my first deer with a win. model 100- 308 my whole family hunts whitetail with 308, sure to kill it and not a lot of meat damage.
30 caliber bullets have killed more whitetail deer than any other.
[my first (and smaller white tail)](https://www.reddit.com/r/Hunting/s/SBeoPtNoKA) As you can see .308 out of a bergara b14 left no meat.
Every deer, caribou and moose I've killed was with 30 caliber or shotgun. Choose ammunition appropriate for the game you're hunting.
Also, although 270 is a smaller and lighter bullet than 308. In most cases it is carrying more energy and higher velocity than 308. So depending on bullet choice the 270 could cause much more damage than 308. Seems like a moot point to me. I agree that neither are too big for whitetail.
All depends where you hit it. Put it behind the shoulder in the ribs, no issues whatsoever. Put it into the shoulder, gonna lose some meat. I've seen shoulder demolished from a 243. 308 is perfectly fine
A .308 is pretty much perfect, deer are a lot tougher then most think. My 270 and my dads old 308 do pretty much the exact same to a deer. If your buddy were to ruin the meat with a 308 its probably where he would be aiming as opposed to what hes shooting ( this does of course depend on the size of the deer, if your shooting a tiny deer at point blank then its probably going to rip through it a little bit more lol )
they have almost the same muzzle energy lol
That fudd acting like a .270 (the 6.5CM of the .30-06 family) has less ballistic impact on a target than standard .308 is hilarious to me. I use 7mm Rem Mag, .30-06, 6.5CM, 5.56, and 7.62 NATO (don’t have .308 ammo and the milsurp is cheaper) and have yet to see a deer, hog, or coyote I’ve smoked become nothing more than their hooves or paws.
Sounds like your buddy just has no idea what he’s talking about and is turning down your perfectly good advice. Let him buy what he wants. If he sticks with deer hunting there’s a good chance he realizes you were right by the time he buys a second rifle.
Ive been using my. 308 for years for white tail
I shot a deer once w/ 308. Vaporized. Instantly.
I use a 308. I hut all over the world. One of the most versatile and effective rounds
Depends on the area you’re shooting. In south Texas our white tail are really small and a .308 when hitting the deer quartered, can hit the front leg and destroy a quarter. I switched to 6.5CM and the bullet stops as soon as it touches the far quarter. This is assuming you’re going for the double lung/heart. I still haven’t had a deer go more than 10 yards with a .308 or 6.5CM.
308 is just fine for deer, I use 6mm though
I just picked up a .308 bergara B14 wilderness ridge for hunting boar and whitetail. Going to take it out to the range for first time tomorrow
I use .30 06. It is not too big. It's about shot placement.
Yall do know there's different grain sizes, right? I use my .308 at 150gr for muley, and 185gr for elk. It's not too big, just use smaller grain.
You can always get reduced power loads if you’re really concerned with saving meat…