Pretty sure no one cares what are you listening besides metal, it's just that too many times metal subs become places where people post more about non-metal stuff than metal.
I am sure people in r/Metalcore will also be annoyed if I go there and post about Priest and Iron Maiden.
I am pretty sure people in r/BlackMetal get annoyed too if you go there and post about Priest and Maiden. You got a point but you should put a subgenre on the same rank as a subreddid dedicated to metal overall.
But no one actually posts Maiden and Priest on the black metal subreddit because they actually understand that those bands aren’t black metal. Plus 99% of black metal fans worship classic bands like Priest anyways.
None of the subgenres you have in the bottom are metal, or at least are not accepted as metal on this sub and many other metal subs. Like, post core stuff in core communities?
This is a general metal sub. Metal core would fall under the umbrella if metal. It's fine if people generally don't like it, but is it really out of place?
I may be a poser in your eyes, but the definition is ambiguous enough to where I'm able to believe I'm not. Like yeah, Nu metal can be "poser" material since it's nu metal, but what about 616 Undone? Sisthema? Distortion Drum? nah dawg, that's acceptable
I was talking about the clean vocal stuff, like trad is one of the most beloved subgenres among metalheads and it has clean vocals. Same for EUPM, USPM and lots of speed metal bands. Maiden, Mercyful Fate, Grim Reaper, Satan, Jag Panzer etc are some of the most celebrated bands in metal. Even newer bands like Eternal Champion or Visigoth.
If you're not into metal, you are not my friend!
I thought that it was clear to everyone at least since 1992...
Wimps and posers should really leave the hall.
Depends on the metalcore that you're talking about. That term is honestly shit, it's a label slapped onto a metric ton of different sounds. Some of those, to my ears at least, sound pretty damn close to metal. Others are clearly very different.
Many metalcore bands from the early 00s took lots of inspiration from 90s melodeath, basically just adding breakdowns and the occasional clean vocals (which many melodeath bands also have). Other more modern metalcore bands just sound like pop rock with some screaming.
The problem is these two groups sound nothing alike and they aren't even the only styles described as "metalcore."
Because it originated in the harcdore punk scene in the 90's. It was then much closer to hardcore, sonically and culturally (bands like Earth Crisis and Merauder). Some people still consider it that way today.
The thing is, it evolved radically over time, first in the early 2000's, taking more influences from melodic death metal / thrash metal and less from hardcore. Then it evolved again with all the prog and djent influences of the 2010's. Bands from these genres are much closer to metal than hardcore.
Today "metalcore" is a very generic term that can be used to describe both a prog metal band with some breakdowns and a hardcore band with melodeath riffs, so I think there is no true answer
Metalcore is not metal because metalcore bands take more influence from hardcore, post-hardcore, and emo bands than metal. That's the crux of the "debate". Two bands can be "heavy" to a non-meralhead.
Metalcore, deathcore, screamo are not metal for the same reason Blink-182 or Taylor Swift aren't metal.
If you start a band, and you and all your bandmates grew up listening to Slayer, Death, Cannibal Corpse, Motorhead, Priest, etc. there's a pretty good chance you'll be playing metal. If instead they grew up listening to Parkway Drive and Asking Alexandria and Bring me the Horizon, they're not gonna be playing metal.
At the end of the day, calling out posers is important. This is not to gatekeep: no one is being kept from being a metalhead. You HAVE TO LISTEN TO METAL to be a metalhead, simple as that. If you listen to screamo, and pretend that's heavy, you're a poser. If you wear a T-shirt for a band you don't listen to, you're a poser. Pretty cut and dry for me
There are always going to be blurred lines (I specifically didn't mention grindcore), and don't get me wrong, I like Killswitch a lot. BUT Killswitch themselves have cited Faith No More, Sick of it All, and Agnostic Front as much or more than their metal influences.
I listened to God Forbid for 30 seconds and could tell you that's not metal. Come on bruh.
Edit: Orchid fucking slaps, and is metal, taking basically all influence from Sabbath. That's about as distilled as it gets
My take on the, let’s call it the Encyclopedia Metallum delineation, is that if you are looking at it from a purely musical lens, numetal and metalcore, can obviously be included under the heavy metal umbrella. However, metalcore and numetal are not part of the heavy metal *subculture.*
I believe this frustration stems from those two flavors being the most mainstream and popular. I don’t particularly care for metal core or numetal. I do love Deftones though, there’s always exceptions. Over time however, I’ve grown very resentful of of those two subgenres specifically because of a very specific, recurring social interaction.
I meet someone, I ask what kind of music they like. They say metal. I get excited. I ask what they’ve been listening to lately.
It’s fucking five finger death punch. Ah ok, let’s see what else they’re into!
Do you like cannibal corpse, necrophagist, death?
Never heard of em.
Do you like Darkthrone, Emperor, Dissection, Wolves in the Throne Room?
Never heard of em.
do you like Iron Maiden? Judas Priest?
they might say yes to that but wouldnt be able to tell you their favorite album by any of those bands.
What about Rhapsody? Blind Guardian? Dig those bands?
Never heard of them.
I’m sure there’s people who like nu metal and metalcore who are also actual metalheads. I know they’re in this sub. You’re obviously not who I’m talking about but come on, can you really blame us for rolling our eyes when people want to talk about it? I couldn’t even tell you how many times I’ve lived through the experience above. Sure, you got me, technically it’s metal but I don’t believe it’s a part of the same subculture the rest of us share, because they don’t know shit about it outside of their own silo. It’s not like that with fans of other subgenres. They can almost always discuss heavy metal holistically or at least historically.
1st. Avatar definitely belongs on the bottom, genuinely one of the worst bands I've ever listened to
2nd. ABBA? What? Everyone loves ABBA! They are the pop music GOAT
wdym? ABBA is goated
ABBA are the sole justification for Eurovision.
What about Lordi?
If you are six years old maybe
Exactly. How can you not like ABBA?
based and ABBA-pilled
Pretty sure no one cares what are you listening besides metal, it's just that too many times metal subs become places where people post more about non-metal stuff than metal. I am sure people in r/Metalcore will also be annoyed if I go there and post about Priest and Iron Maiden.
I am pretty sure people in r/BlackMetal get annoyed too if you go there and post about Priest and Maiden. You got a point but you should put a subgenre on the same rank as a subreddid dedicated to metal overall.
But no one actually posts Maiden and Priest on the black metal subreddit because they actually understand that those bands aren’t black metal. Plus 99% of black metal fans worship classic bands like Priest anyways.
None of the subgenres you have in the bottom are metal, or at least are not accepted as metal on this sub and many other metal subs. Like, post core stuff in core communities?
This is a general metal sub. Metal core would fall under the umbrella if metal. It's fine if people generally don't like it, but is it really out of place?
Every metalhead likes ABBA, this has to be a fact
Nope, not me 😅 sorry
Poser
Just because I'm more into classical music, gabber (90s dutch hardcore house), rap/hiphop and raggacore/jungle/drum&bass next to metal? Wtf :')
Damn, leave ABBA out of this
ABBA is top panel. They are goated lmao.
Nekrogoblikon is goated
I’ve only heard one song by them and I really liked it (bones), any songs you recommend by them?
Prince of the land of stench
This Is It Dressed as Goblins Powercore The Magic Spider (a good intro to the band)
Who doesn't like ABBA?
Me, sorry 🥲
Can we just stop please, I'm begging you
“I like poser music” “But I also like poser music”
Oh boy...
You call ABBA poser music?
ABBA are actually the only non-poser band on that list
how are these poser bands lol
Who the fuck is upvoting this shit?
People who realize he's taking the piss
If being a priest fan is being a poser, then I will pose harder than anyone will ever pose
Oh god, bro youre so tough, you only listen to the real shit. Youre the one, tell em those posers!!
Poser identified.
ABBA > metalcore
True
I, too, like ABBA
Everybody loves ABBA
Metal subreddits when someone likes a "poser" band (one of their songs had 2 seconds of clean vocals)
Are you bananas? Tons of metal has clean vocals. Nobody’d call you a poser for listening to Blind Guardian or something.
Yeah I was just making fun of the mega elitists n stuff,,. Sorry if my comment was taken wrong (I thought it was funny)
I can dig it. The poser discourse gets heated around here lol
It's ok to be clueless about metal and metal community, but after this reply don't pretend you aren't a poser.
I may be a poser in your eyes, but the definition is ambiguous enough to where I'm able to believe I'm not. Like yeah, Nu metal can be "poser" material since it's nu metal, but what about 616 Undone? Sisthema? Distortion Drum? nah dawg, that's acceptable
I was talking about the clean vocal stuff, like trad is one of the most beloved subgenres among metalheads and it has clean vocals. Same for EUPM, USPM and lots of speed metal bands. Maiden, Mercyful Fate, Grim Reaper, Satan, Jag Panzer etc are some of the most celebrated bands in metal. Even newer bands like Eternal Champion or Visigoth.
OHHHH okok yeah
???
"Hey guys, everyone look how special I am!" 🤓
Boomer ass meme
Ok boomer
All my music sounds like shit, and that's fine
People are too obsessed with metal sub-genres. Use them as a [Tool](https://youtu.be/ed_UWFr13pU) to find similar sounding albums.
Nahhh, not ABBA, but i also love listening to gabber (dutch 90s hardcore house), rap/hiphop, classical music and jungle/raggacore/drum&bass
r/metal when you post a band that has more than 3 monthly listeners /hj
So.. you like entry level metal bands, nu metal, and core? I don’t think your music taste is as diverse as you think it is
Ok, recommend stuff i should listen to, to widen my music taste
Lemmy liked ABBA, only argument needed
If you're not into metal, you are not my friend! I thought that it was clear to everyone at least since 1992... Wimps and posers should really leave the hall.
I don't get why metalcore isn't considered metal, could someone explain please ?
Depends on the metalcore that you're talking about. That term is honestly shit, it's a label slapped onto a metric ton of different sounds. Some of those, to my ears at least, sound pretty damn close to metal. Others are clearly very different. Many metalcore bands from the early 00s took lots of inspiration from 90s melodeath, basically just adding breakdowns and the occasional clean vocals (which many melodeath bands also have). Other more modern metalcore bands just sound like pop rock with some screaming. The problem is these two groups sound nothing alike and they aren't even the only styles described as "metalcore."
Because it originated in the harcdore punk scene in the 90's. It was then much closer to hardcore, sonically and culturally (bands like Earth Crisis and Merauder). Some people still consider it that way today. The thing is, it evolved radically over time, first in the early 2000's, taking more influences from melodic death metal / thrash metal and less from hardcore. Then it evolved again with all the prog and djent influences of the 2010's. Bands from these genres are much closer to metal than hardcore. Today "metalcore" is a very generic term that can be used to describe both a prog metal band with some breakdowns and a hardcore band with melodeath riffs, so I think there is no true answer
Because it doesn’t sound like metal. If you disagree, you’re uneducated.
Metalcore is not metal because metalcore bands take more influence from hardcore, post-hardcore, and emo bands than metal. That's the crux of the "debate". Two bands can be "heavy" to a non-meralhead. Metalcore, deathcore, screamo are not metal for the same reason Blink-182 or Taylor Swift aren't metal. If you start a band, and you and all your bandmates grew up listening to Slayer, Death, Cannibal Corpse, Motorhead, Priest, etc. there's a pretty good chance you'll be playing metal. If instead they grew up listening to Parkway Drive and Asking Alexandria and Bring me the Horizon, they're not gonna be playing metal. At the end of the day, calling out posers is important. This is not to gatekeep: no one is being kept from being a metalhead. You HAVE TO LISTEN TO METAL to be a metalhead, simple as that. If you listen to screamo, and pretend that's heavy, you're a poser. If you wear a T-shirt for a band you don't listen to, you're a poser. Pretty cut and dry for me
Still not going to tell me that Killswitch Engage or God Forbid are closer to HxC than Melodeath. I don't think Orchid is not heavy either.
There are always going to be blurred lines (I specifically didn't mention grindcore), and don't get me wrong, I like Killswitch a lot. BUT Killswitch themselves have cited Faith No More, Sick of it All, and Agnostic Front as much or more than their metal influences. I listened to God Forbid for 30 seconds and could tell you that's not metal. Come on bruh. Edit: Orchid fucking slaps, and is metal, taking basically all influence from Sabbath. That's about as distilled as it gets
My take on the, let’s call it the Encyclopedia Metallum delineation, is that if you are looking at it from a purely musical lens, numetal and metalcore, can obviously be included under the heavy metal umbrella. However, metalcore and numetal are not part of the heavy metal *subculture.* I believe this frustration stems from those two flavors being the most mainstream and popular. I don’t particularly care for metal core or numetal. I do love Deftones though, there’s always exceptions. Over time however, I’ve grown very resentful of of those two subgenres specifically because of a very specific, recurring social interaction. I meet someone, I ask what kind of music they like. They say metal. I get excited. I ask what they’ve been listening to lately. It’s fucking five finger death punch. Ah ok, let’s see what else they’re into! Do you like cannibal corpse, necrophagist, death? Never heard of em. Do you like Darkthrone, Emperor, Dissection, Wolves in the Throne Room? Never heard of em. do you like Iron Maiden? Judas Priest? they might say yes to that but wouldnt be able to tell you their favorite album by any of those bands. What about Rhapsody? Blind Guardian? Dig those bands? Never heard of them. I’m sure there’s people who like nu metal and metalcore who are also actual metalheads. I know they’re in this sub. You’re obviously not who I’m talking about but come on, can you really blame us for rolling our eyes when people want to talk about it? I couldn’t even tell you how many times I’ve lived through the experience above. Sure, you got me, technically it’s metal but I don’t believe it’s a part of the same subculture the rest of us share, because they don’t know shit about it outside of their own silo. It’s not like that with fans of other subgenres. They can almost always discuss heavy metal holistically or at least historically.
You probably won’t get a rational answer from here, I’m afraid Edit: Haha, yep.
I feel like most of the replies are long paragraphs that just mean "I don't like it so it isn't metal" lmao
"If you don't listen to exactly the same bands as me then you're a poser"
I didn't realize Im the only one that doesn't like ABBA. Each to his own I guess . But as someone who likes country music, I can relate to this meme.
1st. Avatar definitely belongs on the bottom, genuinely one of the worst bands I've ever listened to 2nd. ABBA? What? Everyone loves ABBA! They are the pop music GOAT
ABBA is based
Fax
Yeah kinda, Metalcore is metal. Put my head on a stick if you want to.
Average Trivium enjoyer take
Womp womp
*sad poser noises*
“I’m not a poser!!” - the poser said
ok poser
ABBA? Do you mean Ghost? Edit: Hold up you guys! It's a fucking joke! I love both Ghost and ABBA! xD
Thats a compliment, tbh. ABBA were brilliant musicians
Or Sabaton or Opeth ?
why cant people just be open minded
I still don't understand how many grown ass adult men can act like someone liking something else cheapens what they like.
What about Maggot Infested Animal Corpse
Isn't Avatar also metalcore 🤨
Not even a little bit lol
I always heard metalcore aspects especially in their early stuff and metallum seems to agree so idk
Their early stuff is pure Swedish melodeath
Abba is da big poopoo tho