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The issue with her double order ability is that the only unit worth buffing, Kasrkin, is typically used as a one-shot suicide weapon and getting 2 CP per turn on top of the default +1 from Lord Solar is worth far more than a second infantry order for one unit on one turn before she dies.
Because a free stratagem isn't literally CP gain, it's just 2 CP worth of value every turn. It's 2 CP because Creed's free stratagem is one that costs 2 CP.
It's a cool ability. I usually use it +1 to hit and save while she's hidden for the first 3 turns and +1 to hit and movemovemove when I'm scrambling for objectives turn 4+5.
She also gets screening duty if things are dire and the Lord Solar is threatened, she's one of our better melee options unfortunately.
On top of what you've already identified, Creed is pretty bad as an actual leader currently
The only real exception to this is Creed can be attached to some units in the scenario that your opponent has the indirect to kill her, so if you have Kasrkin it becomes... ok.
Really what you want Creed to do for you other than Fields of Fire are some combination of the following:
-Investigating Signals
-Screening from Deep Striking
-Re-rolling number of hits on Medusas / Earthshakers
Thus the only exception I listed being that your opponent has indirect fire or aircraft? That's the only time you'd want to attach Creed to something, is explicitly when you can't hide her and want the bodies to protect her
She’s 55 points if someone wants to shoot a 180 point whirlwind that might not kill her it’s a win. I run lord solar no bodyguards against a mirror match haha
A Whirlwind with no buffs at all averages 3.6 wounds per turn against Creed, meaning you're very likely to lose her in one turn and will almost certainly lose her on the second turn. I think paying 180 points to shut down your +2 CP per turn is a pretty good investment when at the end of that trade the 180 point unit is still alive and still has 3-4 more turns to shoot your other stuff.
Saying it as +2cp is wrong it’s a free strat per turn. If your nulling the efficiency of a Kasrkin unit and spending points for lord solar to have a bodyguard unit your list is already in a points deficit
> Saying it as +2cp is wrong it’s a free strat per turn.
Correct, it's *better* than actual CP regen because it isn't subject to the cap. With Lord Solar and Creed you effectively have +3 CP regen per turn.
>If your nulling the efficiency of a Kasrkin unit
You aren't nulling it, you're just using it for a different purpose. Instead of direct damage you're using the Kasrkin to generate 6-10 CP for 120 points.
6-10cp for the game? How do they do that?Haha Kasrkin aren’t about direct damage. Getting that scout move to position them, move block, using their ability and generating mortal wounds from their melta mine and than bringing them back for 2cp to rinse and repeat is what makes them good. Their shooting is just a bonus
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The issue with her double order ability is that the only unit worth buffing, Kasrkin, is typically used as a one-shot suicide weapon and getting 2 CP per turn on top of the default +1 from Lord Solar is worth far more than a second infantry order for one unit on one turn before she dies.
Thanks for the explanation! How do you get 2 cp per turn on top of lord solar cp with kasrkin? I thought that extra cp was capped at one per round
Because a free stratagem isn't literally CP gain, it's just 2 CP worth of value every turn. It's 2 CP because Creed's free stratagem is one that costs 2 CP.
Ohh that’s what you mean, tysm! I’ll keep running her in backline, that definitely is a good way to look at it.
It can be CP gain though. It procs the Vox-caster 5+ CP gain.
It's a cool ability. I usually use it +1 to hit and save while she's hidden for the first 3 turns and +1 to hit and movemovemove when I'm scrambling for objectives turn 4+5. She also gets screening duty if things are dire and the Lord Solar is threatened, she's one of our better melee options unfortunately.
On top of what you've already identified, Creed is pretty bad as an actual leader currently The only real exception to this is Creed can be attached to some units in the scenario that your opponent has the indirect to kill her, so if you have Kasrkin it becomes... ok. Really what you want Creed to do for you other than Fields of Fire are some combination of the following: -Investigating Signals -Screening from Deep Striking -Re-rolling number of hits on Medusas / Earthshakers
> -Re-rolling number of hits on Medusas / Earthshakers How are you doing that with Creed?
Command Reroll is a Battle Tactic and Medusa and Earthshakers are Regiment
If you attach creed to kasrkin they lose the scout ability. The fact they have that pre game move is half the reason why they are taken
Trust me I'm aware, but when the distinction is lose Creed vs put a unit of Kasrkin 6" back you should usually do the latter
If you can’t hide creed 6” away and throw orders out it’s pretty bad. I run creed and lord solar by themselves
Thus the only exception I listed being that your opponent has indirect fire or aircraft? That's the only time you'd want to attach Creed to something, is explicitly when you can't hide her and want the bodies to protect her
She’s 55 points if someone wants to shoot a 180 point whirlwind that might not kill her it’s a win. I run lord solar no bodyguards against a mirror match haha
A Whirlwind with no buffs at all averages 3.6 wounds per turn against Creed, meaning you're very likely to lose her in one turn and will almost certainly lose her on the second turn. I think paying 180 points to shut down your +2 CP per turn is a pretty good investment when at the end of that trade the 180 point unit is still alive and still has 3-4 more turns to shoot your other stuff.
Saying it as +2cp is wrong it’s a free strat per turn. If your nulling the efficiency of a Kasrkin unit and spending points for lord solar to have a bodyguard unit your list is already in a points deficit
> Saying it as +2cp is wrong it’s a free strat per turn. Correct, it's *better* than actual CP regen because it isn't subject to the cap. With Lord Solar and Creed you effectively have +3 CP regen per turn. >If your nulling the efficiency of a Kasrkin unit You aren't nulling it, you're just using it for a different purpose. Instead of direct damage you're using the Kasrkin to generate 6-10 CP for 120 points.
6-10cp for the game? How do they do that?Haha Kasrkin aren’t about direct damage. Getting that scout move to position them, move block, using their ability and generating mortal wounds from their melta mine and than bringing them back for 2cp to rinse and repeat is what makes them good. Their shooting is just a bonus