I think there are two options with Protea, you either leave her vanilla with no subsumes or you subsume 4 off.
I do think you are absolutely insane to subsume her 1 off, as it is extremely useful. It is cheap. It causes slash in a large area that staggers an enemy. Its hold is overshield with long shield gate. It is two strong abilities in one.
Thank you, I'm aware that is the commonly held opinion, and I once held it myself. I just gave her 4 a chance and taught myself how to use it and I am pleasantly surprised with the result.
So instead of having permanent immortality for the team without having to think at all, you prefer skill-based immortality where you have to use timing to keep yourself alive?
Yes sir, at several hundred hours in the game nearing a thousand, I tend to value high skill ceiling builds over high skill floor builds; it's harder to pilot a Protea without the comfort of her 1 but you can make yourself stronger as a consequence.
But I understand it's a matter of preference, which is why it's far from my intention to impose upon others a certain build but it is instead to tell people about something they might have overlooked.
Reminder that you can **cancel the rewind of Temporal Anchor by holding 4** (I know you mentioned it, but it bears repeating). You can't cancel it after the rewind starts, but you *can* switch to operator, wait out the rewind animation and then switch back at your current location. Another thing to note is that you get forced into the rewind if you happen to be in operator mode when time's up (like Magus Revert, but I haven't explored this usage much)
She has a *really* good kit and doesn't need Helminth either but a lot of people hate Temporal Anchor, saying it's redundant or whatever, which I can understand if you weren't using the augment.
I'd like to share my build too. I'm really looking forward to her upcoming augment for Blaze Artillery. The flex slot is Precision Intensify, but it's so good for the armor strip and I'm hesitant to replace anything else... I guess I'd have to replace Overextended with Stretch to get some strength back and to make space for the new augment (or you can just abuse her passive but that's a pain to do it every time)
Anyway I'm just glad to see a fellow Temporal Anchor user. Managing that and her passive makes for an active and fun playstyle!
EDIT: Forgot to mention the Archon shards: 3x Ability Duration, 2x Casting Speed (all Tauforged)
https://preview.redd.it/jhfsj96bzxzc1.png?width=2168&format=png&auto=webp&s=3d1483429b4155ea7d7b5281acee650c8141b664
I love temporal anchor for things like sabotage, excavation, and also because my 5 star skill pilot bugs out and I just hate her ai, hack and go back out and shoot missions on railjack. rewind me right back to where you need to be, thanks!
That's a very nice build, I can tell you put a lot of thought into it. With Corrosive Projection + Molt Augmented ramped up it would fully strip armor with 3 shots of Blaze Artillery.
I still find it hard to justify keeping Temporal Anchor. If you were to replace it with Pillage you'd have a one button full strip using that same build, without even needing Molt Augmented (which you could replace or keep depending on your preference). You could then use that extra mod slot for more range, duration, or replace it with Protea's upcoming augment if it's any good.
And on top of all that, you wouldn't have to worry about fighting the rewind mechanic.
That's fair. But Temporal Anchor is my favorite ability in the game and I'm quite sick of using Pillage. At my stage I simply use whatever I find fun rather than the most efficient (and this build has no problems being good)
https://preview.redd.it/2nsn31m7byzc1.png?width=1066&format=png&auto=webp&s=3dd2a61e75305c74a913bb82125faf4b758709e6
As long as we are sharing builds, here is mine. Since I subsume Roar on her 1, I find that I don't need range at all. Energy Conversion is a bit clunky to use, even for Protea, so that slot will probably be replaced by the new Blaze Artillery augment unless it turns out to be really bad, and I didn't bother with upgrading my Vitality. Continuity is Archon only because I don't have a Primed Continuity and it's basically the same except it costs an extra point. Since Blaze Artillery uses Heat procs, Roar is a double dip and together with Protea's passive, its really easy to get 120%+ damage Roars.
About your build, Overextended makes sense if you use your 1 without Helminth, but I am curious what you are going for with Precision Intensify instead of just using Umbral Intensify. It specifically boosts the 4th ability, your anchor (I used to think it worked like Protea's passive but apparently not), and I don't think it's worth losing strength on other abilities. I also personally think 3 duration shards is overkill; just Continuity + Molt Efficiency seems to be enough duration in my experience, but I suppose it might make a difference in level cap for Blaze Artillery scaling. I didn't actually take Protea to level cap yet so I'm not sure. So I personally just use 3 casting speed and 2 ability strength shards.
But yes, it's indeed wild how much hatred Temporal Anchor gets. It's a bit gimmicky but I imagine the main reason people don't like it is because they don't take the time to figure it out, as was the case for me previously.
I love using her Shield Satellites (and they're great for team support as well) but I admit I don't use the Shrapnel often. I never infuse Roar or Eclipse on warframes, and in Protea's case I can confidently say that she doesn't need Roar at all, but if you like the extra damage, go for it!
>Overextended
I like having the extra range for my turrets. I like active playstyles but also equally like being lazy. But yeah it might be overkill for most maps, I might just replace it with Stretch later on,
>Precision Intensify
I found that her other abilities don't really need that extra strength (especially considering her passive) and it's better to just buff the armor strip % on Temporal Erosion, which is also why I use Corrosive Projection - stripping 82% would be a full armor strip (correct me if I'm wrong)
>3 duration shards is overkill
I like having the extra uptime (mainly for her 2 and 4). And since I don't use Roar, I don't need more strength. I might change these in future though depending on her new augment, but the 2x Casting Speed shards will stay.
Do you use this in high level SP? I can't imagine running Protea without the shield satellites. I have thought about a slash grenade build replacing the turrets with Roar though, slash procs ignore armor but the hit doesn't and the grenades strip the armor even faster than the turrets.
Yes sir, her shield satellites aren't really needed. Her 4 is insurance after all, been having no issues against up to level 500 enemies but I'm sure level cap won't be an issue too once I get around to taking Protea there. Haven't been playing much recently, only came back for Protea Prime.
Roar with slash built for range would also be interesting, but I think I prefer the rapid scaling and ease of use of Blaze Artillery. Also, slash is still relevant even if you strip armor because you get to keep your base damage and not just procs too, so don't be afraid to try that with Temporal Erosion anyway.
I do agree that Temporal Erosion's defense is underrated, but that sounds like a lot of mental work to keep yourself safe, I'll try it out though, do you use any other forms of defense from companions or operator arcanes?
I think you kinda get used to it. I'm a Garuda main and my muscle memory is already wired to hit 4 as a panic button so adapting to Protea was fairly smooth. The additional complication comes from quickly deciding if you want to rewind or cancel your anchor while doing other things.
I run a Moa for more mobility (Anti-Grav Array and Tractor Beam) as well as Guardian as extra insurance, and my operator stuff is just your standard Void Cascade level cap stuff and not really relevant to surviving as the warframe.
Yes, I've done level cap multiple times, just not with Protea yet. I also wouldn't say they are "very different", level 500 is about when enemies start to strip your shield completely in one hit. It just goes from instant strip from most things to instant strip from everything gradually. At both levels you're still relying on shieldgating, though of course 500 isn't so high you couldn't health tank with a dedicated build if that is what you wanted.
All good, like I said, didnt want to sound like a dickhead.
In my experience, people vastly underestimate the difference between triple digit enemies vs quadruple digit ones.
But if you've done it before, no sweat.
No worries, you're good. I don't really play as much as I used to nowadays, so I'd be happy to hear feedback on how my build does at level cap if you do decide to try something like that out.
My favorite frame is Protea, and while I do keep an upgrade slot with no subsume, I rarely use it just because subsuming over 4 is nearly always the better option. I actually have a lot of fun using anchor, especially with the augment. It’s great in small defense and interception maps, and you can get a huge amount of value from 15 seconds of essentially free turrets and grenades… but I don’t pretend it’s more effective or convenient than gloom or pillage. Or larva or ensnare. Or tempest barrage or Tharros strike. And since you’re covering 4, precision intensify is used instead of the augment and takes care of the extra strength you would need with some of those abilities to make them full strip.
Subsuming over 1 is just a terrible idea considering how busted 1 is. You get amazing overshield and shield gate AND long lasting slashy grenades that stick around forever (if you’re building duration which you should be doing for protea) with no quantity limit.
Can anchor be used effectively and be made powerful? Absolutely. Is it the superior option compared to subsuming? Almost never.
The augment somewhat helps the Anchor. Now it's not a complete waste to cancel the ability to not deal with the rewind, but then again, you could use another subsume to strip faster and cheaper or just use corrosive to strip via weapons.
Subsuming away the best, 5 second long shield gate is wild to me. I am a Gloomtea enjoyer, the cc it provides in combination with her 1 is bonkers.
If only they gave the Dispensary augment the ability to stick to you, atm she has one useless augment and one for Anchor that is situational at best
DE did an incredible job with Protea. I think the variety of builds you can run with and the very passionate discussion around those builds is evidence of this. I've also been tempted to taste the forbidden fruit of subsuming a 1.
Yup, you can just as easily build her as a gun platform or even an archgun platform (some Archguns like the Mausolon and Imperator Vandal are surprisingly effective with some investment), and I can think of at least 3 caster variations that work well with her. Her 4 also feels out of place at first glance which is the common opinion of her that I once shared, which is fine; just subsume over if it doesn't work for you! It's definitely a brilliant design job that's hard to appreciate at first, so good on you for catching that as it took me time to realize this.
I recently discovered that you can cancel the ability by holding 4, so that solves most my issues with it. The only problem left is her picking up energy and health orbs during the rewind animation which doesn’t add to your final total energy
Yup, which is why I either just cast abilities until I have a 4th one in the chamber so I can drop another boosted anchor/Roar, and am often not afraid to just cancel the anchor. Most of the time, you don't actually need the rewind (or the explosion), and you can just use it as a temporary ability that makes your damage dealing abilities also strip armor while giving you insurance in case you die.
So getting all your ammo, energy, health, and heavy ammo completely restored and stripping everythings armor, and burning everything you decide to look at to death with exponential heat procs with personal death negation as a cherry on top... Sucks?
yes. a good protea build has infinite energy, can shield gate forever easily and heavy ammo? are you unironically saying archguns are worth using? that is actually hilarious, temporal anchor gives her almost nothing and a hell of a lot less than just subsuming it
Temporal anchor gives her everything I just said up there, which is also everything her slow 3 gives her but multiple times faster, but her 3 doesn't activate temporal erosion, which means her blaze artillery and slash spheres don't armor strip.
You could get all that all the time, subsume her 3 off, and get even more stuff plus all that and the energy back for casting whatever ability you just put in place of her 3.
She's a frame so strong she doesn't need roar.
She doesn't need nourish because she gives herself all her energy back in an instant anyway.
She doesn't need gloom because she can't die and even if she does, in her 4 she doesn't.
She doesn't need her slow 3 because her 4 gives it all back to you anyway.
She doesn't need tharros or terrify or pillage because temporal erosion makes her blaze artillery, one of the strongest abilities period, armor strip everything and burn it to death at any level and the slash orbs do it in a huge radius too.
But the main point is that if you are going to subsume something, make it her 3. Anchor does all of that and more, and much faster, and much stronger.
If you want an infinite energy, slow, shield tank, that doesn't use any offensive abilities, doesn't require much attention or action, outside of just a strip and "insert top meta helminth here" and her equipped weapons, might I suggest hildryn?
lol. okay buddy, you like her 4, thats fine, it isnt better than her 3 and is janky as fuck. you know what is better? viral augmented corrosive barrage.
Her 3 is as slow as can be, nobody wants to sit and wait for it to pop out what they need or run back by when it finally does.
And yes viral augmented corrosive barrage is great, but you know what you could do?
Cast her 4, spam the hell out of viral barrage all over everything you please, and after the timer is up, over the course of about a second or two, whaddya know, that entire energy bar you just emptied is full again.
Rinse and repeat.
> Her 3 is as slow as can be, nobody wants to sit and wait for it to pop out what they need or run back by when it finally does.
and her 4 literally sends her backwards if you want to gain any of that energy ammo ect back, yes you can cancel it but then all you got was some slower armor strip, you are allowed to like it, that doesnt make it good
You are allowed to absolutely hate it, that doesn't make it bad either.
And if you are staying in one room farming, as most do in the endgame, ending up "backwards" in the same room you started anchor, but with everything dead and all your stuff back is in no way a downside or bad outcome.
*Slower* armour strip?
Tempest Barrage wishes it was Temporal Erosion with how much more range grenade fan and blaze artillery can cover. Don't even need that high strength for it to strip a massive area in seconds, and without wasting a shard slot on green shards to boot.
if you want it to be instant you run pillage or tharos strike, if you want more damage you run tempest barrage, temporal erosion sort of does both but increadibly jankily.
It's hardly janky... it's a straight upgrade to abilities you should already be spamming on Protea anyway, I don't think using shrapnel grenades or blaze artillery is janky.
I run a Nourish build for shorter missions that actually subsumes it over Dispensary, but for any mission type where you *do* get to stand still, it's really a no brainer pick, equilibrium gives you actual infinite energy with no rewind gimmick, and I mean infinite, I just sit in a corner and spam artillery for hours, with energy leeches going off under me, and never run out.
Also her 4th does not recover its own cost, you will still run out of energy.
Her 4th gets bad flakk for how it was on release without the augment, but it's still an incredibly annoying ability that was just band aided with an armor strip augment.
As weird as it sounds, yes. Ammo, energy and health are trivial to refill and there are easier ways to armor strip. The heat procs don't require her 4 to work. Having to to either go through the process of pressing and holding her 4 before it ends or suffering through a long animation that sends you back to where you were when you cast the ability feels terrible. The reason people subsume it off is that it's not actually required for anything. She has better survivability in her 1, better energy economy with her 3, even corrosive can be used to full armor strip these days so using a mod slot and a lackluster ability just to armor strip is not great.
No statistically, stripping while procing an exponential DOT is better than full stripping and then doing it.
And it's mighty short that rewind, and you are immune during it.
And her rewind feels fine if you plan your start point and plan your route on the fly or even better, you actually don't need to move to reap it's benefits anyway, it just takes a modicum of thought and planning.
And her 1 falls off quickly when enemies start to 1 tap it off, and there's no fun in just spamming shield satellites to stay alive and get nothing else done.
She's an agile frame who's meant to be here, there, and everywhere. Trying to turn her into Rhino Clone #25 is directly against her entire design philosophy and is done better by the many frames made to play that way.
Her loop is effective, powerful, immortal, and infinite at base. And frankly if the thing that makes protea the most protea is the part you hate and the part you will make every excuse to deem useless and weak, maybe you should just find a different frame.
And to your point if all the things that her 4, and 3, and 2 with the augment, and 1 do are all so trivial to you, why are you using protea?
Hi, I just noticed there was a parallel discussion going on that I noticed and I must say, you seem to know what's up when it comes to Protea. It's rather sad how people try to build her as a bootleg Hildryn when Hildryn is right there (and quite effective), Protea shines as an offensive frame that covers huge chunks of the map and that's what she is uniquely good at. So yeah, just wanted to say I agree with everything you said. :)
Thank you man.
If you need any tips on protea, or any other frames really, when I get back to my PC in a few hours I'm happy to share builds and advice if needed.
Hope you have a great day.
Protea shines most in endless game modes, and those are also conveniently the ones where Temporal Anchor shines most.
I used to *hate* Temporal Anchor but now I use it so much more because with Temporal Erosion it actively synergizes with the rest of her abilities on a whole other level that no subsumed ability ever will.
I've seen the take that "blaze artillery" will shoot armoured enemies more and thus get to higher shots before it kills, but that's some seriously flawed logic because an armoured enemy is an enemy that will die more slowly heat proc or not, since heat doesn't ignore armour unlike slash. And then there's the other weird take which is that Temporal Erosion is janky, and it's really not, otherwise you're admitting you think slash grenades and Blaze Artillery are also janky, and at that point I have to echo "why play Protea at all?" Temporal Erosion turns Blaze Artillery up to eleven, combine that with Archon Vitality and you have some seriously powerful turrets. Leave some slash grenades at choke points and between her passive and molt augmented, as soon as you press Temporal Anchor you strip a massive amount of enemies in mere seconds while inundating them with slash and heat procs. O
It just feels wrong to use anything else on that slot now.
I'm also pretty sure casting speed shards speed up the rewind, at least it feels that way to me, and to be annoying I fundamentally agree with the idea that subsuming over 4 is wild.
Roar isn't giving her anything she can't do already with Blaze Artillery. Gloom isn't doing anything for her - if anything it might have anti-synergy since it'll stop enemies from running into the firing lines of Blaze Artillery and AoE of slash grenades. Tempest Barrage requies a green shard which isn't ideal. Pillage is redundant with shield satellites and needs much higher consistent strength than other options to armour strip. Larva and other grouping abilities are a moot point ever since Steel Path became a thing with its much higher enemy density, and you don't need grouping for Blaze Artillery to be effective on non-steel path missions. Terrify and Tharros Strike are more understandable than other susbsumes but they're still not the best.
Temporal Anchor isn't a bad ability. With Temporal Erosion it's a *godlike* ability: everything you're already doing on Protea is now also armour stripping; and you have two layers of gating before you ever die. With Dispensary and Equilibrium you never run out of energy or health. You're one of the most self-sufficient and powerful frames in the game. And people still subsume over Temporal Anchor and then put abilities that need to take extra steps to do things they could have already done beforehand.
Yep. None of those are difficult problems to overcome normally, without having to get forced to move back to wherever you were when you activated the ability.
It's an interesting ability on paper. It's a bad ability in practice.
The act of going back to the other side of the room to refresh your get out of jail free card and all her benefits and set up another field of stripping fire beams isn't "bad".
Why can't y'all handle going a little back on a timer that the game shows you, its not like it catches you off guard, you know it'll happen, and you know exactly when.
It's not like it's reviving the enemies with it too.
I get it you guys don't like the time rewind, but that doesn't make it bad, especially when you can get back to where you were anyway with 1, maybe 2 bullet jumps?
Y'all are acting like the rewind steals your kills, resets your combo, reduces your mastery rank and scrolls back your daily login rewards by 10 every time it happens.
Not sure why you think it's an issue of being unable to handle it. It's that I don't WANT to handle it. It provides no benefit to me, and only serves as a detriment to my gameplay. It IS bad. It forces the player out of position and interrupts the flow of gameplay for effectively zero benefit. Ammo isn't a scarce resource to begin with, and Dispensary generates it infinitely. Along with health and energy.
You can like and enjoy bad things. That's fine. No one is trying to stop you. But the ability is in fact bad. It offers nothing of value, and the little it does offer is served far better from other sources, none of which have any downside whatsoever.
So if you didn't like divine spears with it's augment on Nezha, does that now make divine spears factually a bad ability?
It's just terrible now because you don't like it?
I'm not trying to say her 4 is the best thing ever and amazing and faultless.
What I'm saying is it isn't "Bad".
I'm not sure how you managed to reach this point, but not even a gold medal would do justice to those mental gymnastics.
Being forced out of position is an objective downside to the ability, and the ability does literally nothing of value that cannot be achieved elsewhere for no cost or effort. In certain situations this downside can be taken advantage of, but it that does not mean it is not a downside.
Again, you can like bad things. It's fine. I'm not telling you to stop using her 4, or that Protea that doesn't subsume her 4 are trash, or anything of the sort. The ability is bad and there are far better ones that offer much more in pretty much every possible way. Use it if you like it. I will use an actually useful ability instead, and I will continue to recommend people do the same because the demerits of the ability simply *exist*, and there are dozens of alternatives that have none. That's it. That's the whole thing. Fin.
And clearly your protea flow is just wrong, going back and forth from A to B then B to A with literally no cost at all because of the everything refund is proteas flow, and if that part is "Bad" then that means to you, protea is Bad.
That's how she's supposed to be played, that's proteas thing.
If her 4 gives no benefits to you, then her 3 also gives no benefits to you because her 3 is a lite version of her 4.
And heat damage can be done by multiple frames, and same with shield gating.
Removing the thing that makes protea protea and leaving her with the things that basically every other frame can do just means she could be any other frame, in which case, why are we even arguing about protea?
Nah, that's YOUR flow, not the frames. It's cool that you found a way to mitigate the downside of the ability within your gameplay style. That doesn't mean that it isn't a downside, or that the frame is objectively only supposed to be played that way. Temporal Anchor is not the entire identity of the frame. If you want to be reductive, ammo restoration can be done with pizzas, and moving from point to point can be done...by moving from point to point. Guess she's just a non-frame! Wrap it up, she's pointless!
It's almost like she has 3 other abilities and a passive. But surely those don't matter, Protea IS her 4, period.
The frames flow comes from their native abilities. And she isn't just her 4, but her 4 facilitates the spam of everything else she does with wreckless abandon.
Part of excals native flow involves exalted blade, part of kullervos native flow involves his wrathful advance.
Part of styanaxs flow is keeping his 3 up.
They facilitate and benefit, they anchor the rest of what the frame is doing.
I don't see how Chosing to use a frames "signature" ability is only MY flow and not the one likely intended by the folks who made the frame.
They make each frame with an intended flow and playstyle, now sure you don't have to use it, but to call using a frames signature or anchoring thematic ability the wrong flow is just absurd.
If you go back and read the words that I actually wrote instead of the ones you fabricated in your head, you might discover that I didn't say or imply that using her 4 made the gameplay flow "wrong". I said that it *interrupts* the flow. Generally speaking, moving forwards is the expectation. Even in point defense missions with multiple objectives, physically moving forward is the default. Losing control of your character and being forced to move backwards until the point that you activated the ability is an interruption. One you can expect and work around if you can be bothered, sure, but it's still an interruption.
Theme of the frame does not matter even a little bit, by the way. You can play into if you want, but it's not a requirement. It's barely even a suggestion. I'm not using Mag to fling enemies around like a toddler throwing a tantrum. I'm not using Frost to make ice sculptures. I'm not using Ember to be an arsonist. The theme is flavor. If you like the flavor, great. If you don't, also great.
The way that you play the game is not objectively correct.
I had the same impression of it and it would definitely be my subsume slot without the augment, but I find now that there is quite a bit of utility in it. I recommend giving it an honest try, could change your mind like it has mine.
I used to swear by her 1 because it's both damage and survivability in one, but I realize now it kinda has counter-synergy with the rest of her kit because 4 already gives survivability, and you need Range to make the most of her grenades. With 1 gone, you can happily stack Ability Strength and some duration.
Well it's simple; you need to be able to shieldgate without any extra survivability from abilities to play most frames anyway, so imagine you're playing Protea like any other frame. Then add the foolproof insurance from her 4, which you constantly use anyway for armor stripping. She is really quite survivable even without her 1, and it was this realization that made me think that's the subsume slot I want.
Her 1 is a good ability, but you can do without it. More importantly, it benefits a lot from stacking range, which has an opportunity cost in ability strength, so removing it from the loadout altogether, no matter how good it is, means you can skip range and get more ability strength instead as none of her other abilities really have a use for extra range.
The issue is that her 4 isn't a good ability. It's powerful, but the downside is enough to kill it even with the ability to cancel it.
Also we must be playing different frames. Typically you'd want a bunch of range on her since her 2 and 1 are both so strong, and strength isn't super important since her turrets delete even the strongest enemies in seconds regardless, especially if they're armor stripped. You can achieve armor strip with actually good abilities subsumed over her mediocre 4. Notably, Tempest Barrage which not only strips armor but can also proc Viral for even more damage on both her 1 and 2.
Respectfully, I disagree. Her 2 has plenty of range for just about every map at 100% range; if you get 280% range like you want to if you regularly use 1, you end up with a range of 84 meters for the Blaze Artillery; that's entirely overkill when most firing lines on the vast majority of maps are short enough for 30m to be enough.
You also underrate how powerful it is for the ability that deals the damage to also be the one that strips. "Actually good" abilities require you to actively be armor stripping, with Erosion you just pop the insurance button (you literally cannot die with it active, it's foolproof), spam your abilities, and then gain your energy back if you want to, or cancel if it's more convenient to do so.
As for artillery killing regardless, that will hold less and less true the higher levels you face. The extra firepower is really notable against tougher enemies.
Her range isn't only useful for her 2 though, that's the thing.
And no, I'm not underestimating it at all. Again, she doesn't actually need to strip armor since her turrets already delete enemies. There is no normal content in the game where it is necessary. She can nuke SP enemies into the upper hundreds, if not higher, with just ~30% extra power strength, even without armor strip. It will only get easier after the upcoming enemy health and armor rework. You can actually kill up to level 200 SP corrupted HGs with NEGATIVE strength with nothing but corrosive projection.
And sure, you can't die with her 4 active, but there are so many ways to not die that this isn't really much of an incentive to use it.
I'm not saying no one should ever bother with her 4. Use it if you like it. There are just many other much better options available.
Removing her 1 is beyond insane IMO. Unless you are a donut, her shield fans make her unkillable.
Beyond that, her slash fans can be used to strip using Roar over her 4, and a Helios using Vicious Bond and Deconstructor.
I run this on one of my configs with high range (230+) and I can strip entire rooms. And I am basically immortal.
I think there are two options with Protea, you either leave her vanilla with no subsumes or you subsume 4 off. I do think you are absolutely insane to subsume her 1 off, as it is extremely useful. It is cheap. It causes slash in a large area that staggers an enemy. Its hold is overshield with long shield gate. It is two strong abilities in one.
And it gives your *whole squad* the overshields. *And* your companion.
Thank you, I'm aware that is the commonly held opinion, and I once held it myself. I just gave her 4 a chance and taught myself how to use it and I am pleasantly surprised with the result.
So instead of having permanent immortality for the team without having to think at all, you prefer skill-based immortality where you have to use timing to keep yourself alive?
Yes sir, at several hundred hours in the game nearing a thousand, I tend to value high skill ceiling builds over high skill floor builds; it's harder to pilot a Protea without the comfort of her 1 but you can make yourself stronger as a consequence. But I understand it's a matter of preference, which is why it's far from my intention to impose upon others a certain build but it is instead to tell people about something they might have overlooked.
Reminder that you can **cancel the rewind of Temporal Anchor by holding 4** (I know you mentioned it, but it bears repeating). You can't cancel it after the rewind starts, but you *can* switch to operator, wait out the rewind animation and then switch back at your current location. Another thing to note is that you get forced into the rewind if you happen to be in operator mode when time's up (like Magus Revert, but I haven't explored this usage much) She has a *really* good kit and doesn't need Helminth either but a lot of people hate Temporal Anchor, saying it's redundant or whatever, which I can understand if you weren't using the augment. I'd like to share my build too. I'm really looking forward to her upcoming augment for Blaze Artillery. The flex slot is Precision Intensify, but it's so good for the armor strip and I'm hesitant to replace anything else... I guess I'd have to replace Overextended with Stretch to get some strength back and to make space for the new augment (or you can just abuse her passive but that's a pain to do it every time) Anyway I'm just glad to see a fellow Temporal Anchor user. Managing that and her passive makes for an active and fun playstyle! EDIT: Forgot to mention the Archon shards: 3x Ability Duration, 2x Casting Speed (all Tauforged) https://preview.redd.it/jhfsj96bzxzc1.png?width=2168&format=png&auto=webp&s=3d1483429b4155ea7d7b5281acee650c8141b664
I love temporal anchor for things like sabotage, excavation, and also because my 5 star skill pilot bugs out and I just hate her ai, hack and go back out and shoot missions on railjack. rewind me right back to where you need to be, thanks!
That's a very nice build, I can tell you put a lot of thought into it. With Corrosive Projection + Molt Augmented ramped up it would fully strip armor with 3 shots of Blaze Artillery. I still find it hard to justify keeping Temporal Anchor. If you were to replace it with Pillage you'd have a one button full strip using that same build, without even needing Molt Augmented (which you could replace or keep depending on your preference). You could then use that extra mod slot for more range, duration, or replace it with Protea's upcoming augment if it's any good. And on top of all that, you wouldn't have to worry about fighting the rewind mechanic.
That's fair. But Temporal Anchor is my favorite ability in the game and I'm quite sick of using Pillage. At my stage I simply use whatever I find fun rather than the most efficient (and this build has no problems being good)
https://preview.redd.it/2nsn31m7byzc1.png?width=1066&format=png&auto=webp&s=3dd2a61e75305c74a913bb82125faf4b758709e6 As long as we are sharing builds, here is mine. Since I subsume Roar on her 1, I find that I don't need range at all. Energy Conversion is a bit clunky to use, even for Protea, so that slot will probably be replaced by the new Blaze Artillery augment unless it turns out to be really bad, and I didn't bother with upgrading my Vitality. Continuity is Archon only because I don't have a Primed Continuity and it's basically the same except it costs an extra point. Since Blaze Artillery uses Heat procs, Roar is a double dip and together with Protea's passive, its really easy to get 120%+ damage Roars. About your build, Overextended makes sense if you use your 1 without Helminth, but I am curious what you are going for with Precision Intensify instead of just using Umbral Intensify. It specifically boosts the 4th ability, your anchor (I used to think it worked like Protea's passive but apparently not), and I don't think it's worth losing strength on other abilities. I also personally think 3 duration shards is overkill; just Continuity + Molt Efficiency seems to be enough duration in my experience, but I suppose it might make a difference in level cap for Blaze Artillery scaling. I didn't actually take Protea to level cap yet so I'm not sure. So I personally just use 3 casting speed and 2 ability strength shards. But yes, it's indeed wild how much hatred Temporal Anchor gets. It's a bit gimmicky but I imagine the main reason people don't like it is because they don't take the time to figure it out, as was the case for me previously.
I love using her Shield Satellites (and they're great for team support as well) but I admit I don't use the Shrapnel often. I never infuse Roar or Eclipse on warframes, and in Protea's case I can confidently say that she doesn't need Roar at all, but if you like the extra damage, go for it! >Overextended I like having the extra range for my turrets. I like active playstyles but also equally like being lazy. But yeah it might be overkill for most maps, I might just replace it with Stretch later on, >Precision Intensify I found that her other abilities don't really need that extra strength (especially considering her passive) and it's better to just buff the armor strip % on Temporal Erosion, which is also why I use Corrosive Projection - stripping 82% would be a full armor strip (correct me if I'm wrong) >3 duration shards is overkill I like having the extra uptime (mainly for her 2 and 4). And since I don't use Roar, I don't need more strength. I might change these in future though depending on her new augment, but the 2x Casting Speed shards will stay.
Do you use this in high level SP? I can't imagine running Protea without the shield satellites. I have thought about a slash grenade build replacing the turrets with Roar though, slash procs ignore armor but the hit doesn't and the grenades strip the armor even faster than the turrets.
Yes sir, her shield satellites aren't really needed. Her 4 is insurance after all, been having no issues against up to level 500 enemies but I'm sure level cap won't be an issue too once I get around to taking Protea there. Haven't been playing much recently, only came back for Protea Prime. Roar with slash built for range would also be interesting, but I think I prefer the rapid scaling and ease of use of Blaze Artillery. Also, slash is still relevant even if you strip armor because you get to keep your base damage and not just procs too, so don't be afraid to try that with Temporal Erosion anyway.
I do agree that Temporal Erosion's defense is underrated, but that sounds like a lot of mental work to keep yourself safe, I'll try it out though, do you use any other forms of defense from companions or operator arcanes?
I think you kinda get used to it. I'm a Garuda main and my muscle memory is already wired to hit 4 as a panic button so adapting to Protea was fairly smooth. The additional complication comes from quickly deciding if you want to rewind or cancel your anchor while doing other things. I run a Moa for more mobility (Anti-Grav Array and Tractor Beam) as well as Guardian as extra insurance, and my operator stuff is just your standard Void Cascade level cap stuff and not really relevant to surviving as the warframe.
Not to sound like a dickhead but have you tried Levelcapping before? Level 500 and Level 9999 are very different beasts.
Yes, I've done level cap multiple times, just not with Protea yet. I also wouldn't say they are "very different", level 500 is about when enemies start to strip your shield completely in one hit. It just goes from instant strip from most things to instant strip from everything gradually. At both levels you're still relying on shieldgating, though of course 500 isn't so high you couldn't health tank with a dedicated build if that is what you wanted.
All good, like I said, didnt want to sound like a dickhead. In my experience, people vastly underestimate the difference between triple digit enemies vs quadruple digit ones. But if you've done it before, no sweat.
No worries, you're good. I don't really play as much as I used to nowadays, so I'd be happy to hear feedback on how my build does at level cap if you do decide to try something like that out.
My favorite frame is Protea, and while I do keep an upgrade slot with no subsume, I rarely use it just because subsuming over 4 is nearly always the better option. I actually have a lot of fun using anchor, especially with the augment. It’s great in small defense and interception maps, and you can get a huge amount of value from 15 seconds of essentially free turrets and grenades… but I don’t pretend it’s more effective or convenient than gloom or pillage. Or larva or ensnare. Or tempest barrage or Tharros strike. And since you’re covering 4, precision intensify is used instead of the augment and takes care of the extra strength you would need with some of those abilities to make them full strip. Subsuming over 1 is just a terrible idea considering how busted 1 is. You get amazing overshield and shield gate AND long lasting slashy grenades that stick around forever (if you’re building duration which you should be doing for protea) with no quantity limit. Can anchor be used effectively and be made powerful? Absolutely. Is it the superior option compared to subsuming? Almost never.
Ehh. Id rather just subsume pillage over her 4. Saves a mod slot. And with her passive, you dont need to overly invest in strength.
The augment somewhat helps the Anchor. Now it's not a complete waste to cancel the ability to not deal with the rewind, but then again, you could use another subsume to strip faster and cheaper or just use corrosive to strip via weapons. Subsuming away the best, 5 second long shield gate is wild to me. I am a Gloomtea enjoyer, the cc it provides in combination with her 1 is bonkers. If only they gave the Dispensary augment the ability to stick to you, atm she has one useless augment and one for Anchor that is situational at best
DE did an incredible job with Protea. I think the variety of builds you can run with and the very passionate discussion around those builds is evidence of this. I've also been tempted to taste the forbidden fruit of subsuming a 1.
Yup, you can just as easily build her as a gun platform or even an archgun platform (some Archguns like the Mausolon and Imperator Vandal are surprisingly effective with some investment), and I can think of at least 3 caster variations that work well with her. Her 4 also feels out of place at first glance which is the common opinion of her that I once shared, which is fine; just subsume over if it doesn't work for you! It's definitely a brilliant design job that's hard to appreciate at first, so good on you for catching that as it took me time to realize this.
Yea but you have to use her 4 which sucks
I recently discovered that you can cancel the ability by holding 4, so that solves most my issues with it. The only problem left is her picking up energy and health orbs during the rewind animation which doesn’t add to your final total energy
Yup, which is why I either just cast abilities until I have a 4th one in the chamber so I can drop another boosted anchor/Roar, and am often not afraid to just cancel the anchor. Most of the time, you don't actually need the rewind (or the explosion), and you can just use it as a temporary ability that makes your damage dealing abilities also strip armor while giving you insurance in case you die.
So getting all your ammo, energy, health, and heavy ammo completely restored and stripping everythings armor, and burning everything you decide to look at to death with exponential heat procs with personal death negation as a cherry on top... Sucks?
yes. a good protea build has infinite energy, can shield gate forever easily and heavy ammo? are you unironically saying archguns are worth using? that is actually hilarious, temporal anchor gives her almost nothing and a hell of a lot less than just subsuming it
Temporal anchor gives her everything I just said up there, which is also everything her slow 3 gives her but multiple times faster, but her 3 doesn't activate temporal erosion, which means her blaze artillery and slash spheres don't armor strip. You could get all that all the time, subsume her 3 off, and get even more stuff plus all that and the energy back for casting whatever ability you just put in place of her 3. She's a frame so strong she doesn't need roar. She doesn't need nourish because she gives herself all her energy back in an instant anyway. She doesn't need gloom because she can't die and even if she does, in her 4 she doesn't. She doesn't need her slow 3 because her 4 gives it all back to you anyway. She doesn't need tharros or terrify or pillage because temporal erosion makes her blaze artillery, one of the strongest abilities period, armor strip everything and burn it to death at any level and the slash orbs do it in a huge radius too. But the main point is that if you are going to subsume something, make it her 3. Anchor does all of that and more, and much faster, and much stronger. If you want an infinite energy, slow, shield tank, that doesn't use any offensive abilities, doesn't require much attention or action, outside of just a strip and "insert top meta helminth here" and her equipped weapons, might I suggest hildryn?
lol. okay buddy, you like her 4, thats fine, it isnt better than her 3 and is janky as fuck. you know what is better? viral augmented corrosive barrage.
Her 3 is as slow as can be, nobody wants to sit and wait for it to pop out what they need or run back by when it finally does. And yes viral augmented corrosive barrage is great, but you know what you could do? Cast her 4, spam the hell out of viral barrage all over everything you please, and after the timer is up, over the course of about a second or two, whaddya know, that entire energy bar you just emptied is full again. Rinse and repeat.
> Her 3 is as slow as can be, nobody wants to sit and wait for it to pop out what they need or run back by when it finally does. and her 4 literally sends her backwards if you want to gain any of that energy ammo ect back, yes you can cancel it but then all you got was some slower armor strip, you are allowed to like it, that doesnt make it good
You are allowed to absolutely hate it, that doesn't make it bad either. And if you are staying in one room farming, as most do in the endgame, ending up "backwards" in the same room you started anchor, but with everything dead and all your stuff back is in no way a downside or bad outcome.
*Slower* armour strip? Tempest Barrage wishes it was Temporal Erosion with how much more range grenade fan and blaze artillery can cover. Don't even need that high strength for it to strip a massive area in seconds, and without wasting a shard slot on green shards to boot.
if you want it to be instant you run pillage or tharos strike, if you want more damage you run tempest barrage, temporal erosion sort of does both but increadibly jankily.
It's hardly janky... it's a straight upgrade to abilities you should already be spamming on Protea anyway, I don't think using shrapnel grenades or blaze artillery is janky.
I run a Nourish build for shorter missions that actually subsumes it over Dispensary, but for any mission type where you *do* get to stand still, it's really a no brainer pick, equilibrium gives you actual infinite energy with no rewind gimmick, and I mean infinite, I just sit in a corner and spam artillery for hours, with energy leeches going off under me, and never run out. Also her 4th does not recover its own cost, you will still run out of energy. Her 4th gets bad flakk for how it was on release without the augment, but it's still an incredibly annoying ability that was just band aided with an armor strip augment.
>getting all your ammo, energy, health, and heavy ammo completely restored Don't forget shields and combo counter as well. It's comically powerful
Oh I didn't even realize it affected the combo counter too~ Sounds like something else to play around with.
Her 1 refills shields and tennokai is a thing nowadays.
Yeah but not every build has space for tennokai.
As weird as it sounds, yes. Ammo, energy and health are trivial to refill and there are easier ways to armor strip. The heat procs don't require her 4 to work. Having to to either go through the process of pressing and holding her 4 before it ends or suffering through a long animation that sends you back to where you were when you cast the ability feels terrible. The reason people subsume it off is that it's not actually required for anything. She has better survivability in her 1, better energy economy with her 3, even corrosive can be used to full armor strip these days so using a mod slot and a lackluster ability just to armor strip is not great.
No statistically, stripping while procing an exponential DOT is better than full stripping and then doing it. And it's mighty short that rewind, and you are immune during it. And her rewind feels fine if you plan your start point and plan your route on the fly or even better, you actually don't need to move to reap it's benefits anyway, it just takes a modicum of thought and planning. And her 1 falls off quickly when enemies start to 1 tap it off, and there's no fun in just spamming shield satellites to stay alive and get nothing else done. She's an agile frame who's meant to be here, there, and everywhere. Trying to turn her into Rhino Clone #25 is directly against her entire design philosophy and is done better by the many frames made to play that way. Her loop is effective, powerful, immortal, and infinite at base. And frankly if the thing that makes protea the most protea is the part you hate and the part you will make every excuse to deem useless and weak, maybe you should just find a different frame. And to your point if all the things that her 4, and 3, and 2 with the augment, and 1 do are all so trivial to you, why are you using protea?
Hi, I just noticed there was a parallel discussion going on that I noticed and I must say, you seem to know what's up when it comes to Protea. It's rather sad how people try to build her as a bootleg Hildryn when Hildryn is right there (and quite effective), Protea shines as an offensive frame that covers huge chunks of the map and that's what she is uniquely good at. So yeah, just wanted to say I agree with everything you said. :)
Thank you man. If you need any tips on protea, or any other frames really, when I get back to my PC in a few hours I'm happy to share builds and advice if needed. Hope you have a great day.
Protea shines most in endless game modes, and those are also conveniently the ones where Temporal Anchor shines most. I used to *hate* Temporal Anchor but now I use it so much more because with Temporal Erosion it actively synergizes with the rest of her abilities on a whole other level that no subsumed ability ever will. I've seen the take that "blaze artillery" will shoot armoured enemies more and thus get to higher shots before it kills, but that's some seriously flawed logic because an armoured enemy is an enemy that will die more slowly heat proc or not, since heat doesn't ignore armour unlike slash. And then there's the other weird take which is that Temporal Erosion is janky, and it's really not, otherwise you're admitting you think slash grenades and Blaze Artillery are also janky, and at that point I have to echo "why play Protea at all?" Temporal Erosion turns Blaze Artillery up to eleven, combine that with Archon Vitality and you have some seriously powerful turrets. Leave some slash grenades at choke points and between her passive and molt augmented, as soon as you press Temporal Anchor you strip a massive amount of enemies in mere seconds while inundating them with slash and heat procs. O It just feels wrong to use anything else on that slot now. I'm also pretty sure casting speed shards speed up the rewind, at least it feels that way to me, and to be annoying I fundamentally agree with the idea that subsuming over 4 is wild. Roar isn't giving her anything she can't do already with Blaze Artillery. Gloom isn't doing anything for her - if anything it might have anti-synergy since it'll stop enemies from running into the firing lines of Blaze Artillery and AoE of slash grenades. Tempest Barrage requies a green shard which isn't ideal. Pillage is redundant with shield satellites and needs much higher consistent strength than other options to armour strip. Larva and other grouping abilities are a moot point ever since Steel Path became a thing with its much higher enemy density, and you don't need grouping for Blaze Artillery to be effective on non-steel path missions. Terrify and Tharros Strike are more understandable than other susbsumes but they're still not the best. Temporal Anchor isn't a bad ability. With Temporal Erosion it's a *godlike* ability: everything you're already doing on Protea is now also armour stripping; and you have two layers of gating before you ever die. With Dispensary and Equilibrium you never run out of energy or health. You're one of the most self-sufficient and powerful frames in the game. And people still subsume over Temporal Anchor and then put abilities that need to take extra steps to do things they could have already done beforehand.
Yep. None of those are difficult problems to overcome normally, without having to get forced to move back to wherever you were when you activated the ability. It's an interesting ability on paper. It's a bad ability in practice.
The act of going back to the other side of the room to refresh your get out of jail free card and all her benefits and set up another field of stripping fire beams isn't "bad". Why can't y'all handle going a little back on a timer that the game shows you, its not like it catches you off guard, you know it'll happen, and you know exactly when. It's not like it's reviving the enemies with it too. I get it you guys don't like the time rewind, but that doesn't make it bad, especially when you can get back to where you were anyway with 1, maybe 2 bullet jumps? Y'all are acting like the rewind steals your kills, resets your combo, reduces your mastery rank and scrolls back your daily login rewards by 10 every time it happens.
Not sure why you think it's an issue of being unable to handle it. It's that I don't WANT to handle it. It provides no benefit to me, and only serves as a detriment to my gameplay. It IS bad. It forces the player out of position and interrupts the flow of gameplay for effectively zero benefit. Ammo isn't a scarce resource to begin with, and Dispensary generates it infinitely. Along with health and energy. You can like and enjoy bad things. That's fine. No one is trying to stop you. But the ability is in fact bad. It offers nothing of value, and the little it does offer is served far better from other sources, none of which have any downside whatsoever.
It's not bad, you don't like it, there's a difference.
It's not good, you just like it, there's a difference.
So if you didn't like divine spears with it's augment on Nezha, does that now make divine spears factually a bad ability? It's just terrible now because you don't like it? I'm not trying to say her 4 is the best thing ever and amazing and faultless. What I'm saying is it isn't "Bad".
I'm not sure how you managed to reach this point, but not even a gold medal would do justice to those mental gymnastics. Being forced out of position is an objective downside to the ability, and the ability does literally nothing of value that cannot be achieved elsewhere for no cost or effort. In certain situations this downside can be taken advantage of, but it that does not mean it is not a downside. Again, you can like bad things. It's fine. I'm not telling you to stop using her 4, or that Protea that doesn't subsume her 4 are trash, or anything of the sort. The ability is bad and there are far better ones that offer much more in pretty much every possible way. Use it if you like it. I will use an actually useful ability instead, and I will continue to recommend people do the same because the demerits of the ability simply *exist*, and there are dozens of alternatives that have none. That's it. That's the whole thing. Fin.
It's not fucking bad... End of story.
And clearly your protea flow is just wrong, going back and forth from A to B then B to A with literally no cost at all because of the everything refund is proteas flow, and if that part is "Bad" then that means to you, protea is Bad. That's how she's supposed to be played, that's proteas thing. If her 4 gives no benefits to you, then her 3 also gives no benefits to you because her 3 is a lite version of her 4. And heat damage can be done by multiple frames, and same with shield gating. Removing the thing that makes protea protea and leaving her with the things that basically every other frame can do just means she could be any other frame, in which case, why are we even arguing about protea?
Nah, that's YOUR flow, not the frames. It's cool that you found a way to mitigate the downside of the ability within your gameplay style. That doesn't mean that it isn't a downside, or that the frame is objectively only supposed to be played that way. Temporal Anchor is not the entire identity of the frame. If you want to be reductive, ammo restoration can be done with pizzas, and moving from point to point can be done...by moving from point to point. Guess she's just a non-frame! Wrap it up, she's pointless! It's almost like she has 3 other abilities and a passive. But surely those don't matter, Protea IS her 4, period.
The frames flow comes from their native abilities. And she isn't just her 4, but her 4 facilitates the spam of everything else she does with wreckless abandon. Part of excals native flow involves exalted blade, part of kullervos native flow involves his wrathful advance. Part of styanaxs flow is keeping his 3 up. They facilitate and benefit, they anchor the rest of what the frame is doing. I don't see how Chosing to use a frames "signature" ability is only MY flow and not the one likely intended by the folks who made the frame. They make each frame with an intended flow and playstyle, now sure you don't have to use it, but to call using a frames signature or anchoring thematic ability the wrong flow is just absurd.
If you go back and read the words that I actually wrote instead of the ones you fabricated in your head, you might discover that I didn't say or imply that using her 4 made the gameplay flow "wrong". I said that it *interrupts* the flow. Generally speaking, moving forwards is the expectation. Even in point defense missions with multiple objectives, physically moving forward is the default. Losing control of your character and being forced to move backwards until the point that you activated the ability is an interruption. One you can expect and work around if you can be bothered, sure, but it's still an interruption. Theme of the frame does not matter even a little bit, by the way. You can play into if you want, but it's not a requirement. It's barely even a suggestion. I'm not using Mag to fling enemies around like a toddler throwing a tantrum. I'm not using Frost to make ice sculptures. I'm not using Ember to be an arsonist. The theme is flavor. If you like the flavor, great. If you don't, also great. The way that you play the game is not objectively correct.
I had the same impression of it and it would definitely be my subsume slot without the augment, but I find now that there is quite a bit of utility in it. I recommend giving it an honest try, could change your mind like it has mine. I used to swear by her 1 because it's both damage and survivability in one, but I realize now it kinda has counter-synergy with the rest of her kit because 4 already gives survivability, and you need Range to make the most of her grenades. With 1 gone, you can happily stack Ability Strength and some duration.
only people that think this are ones who only follow youtube build guides
So does pillage.
Isn’t her 1 both her CC and survivability tool? How do you not get gibbed on Steel Path without it?
Well it's simple; you need to be able to shieldgate without any extra survivability from abilities to play most frames anyway, so imagine you're playing Protea like any other frame. Then add the foolproof insurance from her 4, which you constantly use anyway for armor stripping. She is really quite survivable even without her 1, and it was this realization that made me think that's the subsume slot I want. Her 1 is a good ability, but you can do without it. More importantly, it benefits a lot from stacking range, which has an opportunity cost in ability strength, so removing it from the loadout altogether, no matter how good it is, means you can skip range and get more ability strength instead as none of her other abilities really have a use for extra range.
The issue is that her 4 isn't a good ability. It's powerful, but the downside is enough to kill it even with the ability to cancel it. Also we must be playing different frames. Typically you'd want a bunch of range on her since her 2 and 1 are both so strong, and strength isn't super important since her turrets delete even the strongest enemies in seconds regardless, especially if they're armor stripped. You can achieve armor strip with actually good abilities subsumed over her mediocre 4. Notably, Tempest Barrage which not only strips armor but can also proc Viral for even more damage on both her 1 and 2.
Respectfully, I disagree. Her 2 has plenty of range for just about every map at 100% range; if you get 280% range like you want to if you regularly use 1, you end up with a range of 84 meters for the Blaze Artillery; that's entirely overkill when most firing lines on the vast majority of maps are short enough for 30m to be enough. You also underrate how powerful it is for the ability that deals the damage to also be the one that strips. "Actually good" abilities require you to actively be armor stripping, with Erosion you just pop the insurance button (you literally cannot die with it active, it's foolproof), spam your abilities, and then gain your energy back if you want to, or cancel if it's more convenient to do so. As for artillery killing regardless, that will hold less and less true the higher levels you face. The extra firepower is really notable against tougher enemies.
Her range isn't only useful for her 2 though, that's the thing. And no, I'm not underestimating it at all. Again, she doesn't actually need to strip armor since her turrets already delete enemies. There is no normal content in the game where it is necessary. She can nuke SP enemies into the upper hundreds, if not higher, with just ~30% extra power strength, even without armor strip. It will only get easier after the upcoming enemy health and armor rework. You can actually kill up to level 200 SP corrupted HGs with NEGATIVE strength with nothing but corrosive projection. And sure, you can't die with her 4 active, but there are so many ways to not die that this isn't really much of an incentive to use it. I'm not saying no one should ever bother with her 4. Use it if you like it. There are just many other much better options available.
I mean, it'd be nice to use her 4, but the nausea does me in every time.
[удалено]
Edit: how did I get here? This comment was meant for a completely different post xD
Edit: how did I get here? This comment was meant for a completely different post xD
>Subsuming Roar on her 1 Aight im out
Removing her 1 is beyond insane IMO. Unless you are a donut, her shield fans make her unkillable. Beyond that, her slash fans can be used to strip using Roar over her 4, and a Helios using Vicious Bond and Deconstructor. I run this on one of my configs with high range (230+) and I can strip entire rooms. And I am basically immortal.