My uncle was a pastor in Georgia until his son developed AIDS in the early 1990s and his homosexuality became impossible to hide. The church fired my uncle and shunned the whole family. It's just how church people are. For a religion supposedly based on grace and forgiveness, they are quick to judge and punish.
I’m a Christian and I agree. Western Christianity can either be completely wild and out there or it can be tighter than bolts. Most never seem to actually follow what Jesus said.
Yah this was weird to me. In the Baptist church I grew up in the pastor divorcing would get him removed from leadership and an out of wedlock baby would just never be talked about really.
Also if you know Baptist theology then Mary forcing her kids to get baptized in the last episodes doesn’t make much sense.
Jeff baptizing a baby goes against Baptist theology as well. (I’m Methodist but my wife was raised Baptist and she agrees with this point). I also seriously doubt a Catholic priest would baptize a baby against the parents’ wishes. I get she slipped him a few bucks but it still doesn’t seem like something a priest would do.
I agree, but this one id forgive because iirc he brought it up but then they made it a way to get back at the Catholics kind of joke so I wasn’t taking that one too serious.
I get why they did it and no, I don’t turn to the show for theological insight.
On a side note, there was an episode of All in the Family where Archie wanted his grandson baptized over the objections of Mike. (He was an atheist). The preacher at his church (or the church he went to when Edith dragged him along) refused to do it because the parents didn’t agree. So he snuck into the sanctuary and did it himself. In a later episode, Meathead was upset about it but Gloria tried to calm him down by saying she talked to the minister and he said it didn’t count. (Or words to that affect).
I go to church, pray, all that stuff and I've worked very hard to not cast judgement. I grew up southern baptist and saw the church kick people out for being gay; even tried to push out inter-racial couples. I now go to a church that the pastor is one of the most loving people I know.
Or... "have to get married." Usually to a teenage boy they barely knew. I am glad Mandy and Georgie didn't initially get married right away, but IRL in small town Baptist Texas I think they would have felt pressured to.
Idk but feels like that just what human do, although they follow certain religion. They do it because either they dont fully understand or act upon what was taught or simply that just how they are. Even tho lord told them to be forgiving and all being should be loved, they still judge. It’s not like a person follows a religion means they would act like it, some may even use aspect of religions to back them up for their wrong doings. It happens in every religions actually
Not all Christians are that way. It's mostly a Deep South Baptist thing. The American Civil War set the South's culture back by about 50 years. In the 1990s Baptists in the deep South were still following religious believes Christians in the Northeast, Midwest, and Western US were following in the 1940s. When it comes to religion Southern Baptists have strict views about sin and forgivenes. They believe more in the Old Testament which depicts God as being far more vengeful. In the Northeast, Midwest, and Western US, Christians tend to put more faith in the New Testament which depicts Jesus as being extremely forgiving. As a Catholic who grew up just outside of Bible Belt, I am very aware of the differences between "Yankee Christians" such as myself and "Dixie Christians" like Mary Cooper. So I can totally relate to Tam's and Mandy's experiences as Catholics meeting Southern Baptists.
Churches in that era were just wild with it fr. Especially in the south. It’s a pretty staple part of that old southern Baptist culture. Very self righteous and ignorant on some parts of Jesus’s teaching while focusing on complete purity (even though it’s impossible.
Because people would abandon their values as soon as they think there is no other choices :)
A person who abhors stealing would steal in desperation.
A generally soft-spoken person would suddenly shout if they reached breaking point.
I'm not saying you're wrong about being awful when convenient, but your examples aren't that of convenience. Those are moreso desperation, when anyone will do awful things to ensure their survival or their voice being heard.
I think a better example is finding a wallet and taking the money instead of returning it to the person on the ID.
I fixed it.
I was about to give other examples that may have been darker, such as a pacifist killing a person in cold blood, but I figure I don't want to be too edgy.
But yeah, you're right, ideals, principles, scruples, those kind of things are no longer valuable or a priority under desperate circumstances.
Makes me wonder, would you abandon your principles under desperation or will you try to believe there is always a way?
My favorite example of broken ideals is the Hunger Games. Everyone wants to go home, and will do what they can to do so. In extreme situations, anyone would give up their morals if it meant their survival.
I love dystopian novels because of that desperation, not quite seeing it break people, but knowing it's' possible.
I don't know, I never seen it happened in real life. If someone's kid is doing something everyone else in church thinks it's wrong, they'll be upset about the kid but not the family. And it really depends what they did, in the church I grew up with, some of the few young people we did have had kids out of wedlock, and the pastor encourage them to get married, but I don't think they were particularly mean about it. (Eventually one couple did get married anyway. ) We did have a few single mothers, and there was never any meanness or judgement towards them. But then again, it wasn't a Baptist church, I never went to a Baptist church, and this is the 2000s-2010s so I'm guessing different time period, different churches and different areas see things differently.
As someone who was raised Southern Baptist that's pretty much par for the course. My family got bullied out of the church my mom grew up in because the church got involved in my great grandfather's marriage
I was raised Southern Baptist, the preacher’s daughter got pregnant in the 1980’s and was immediately fired. The family was forced to move because they had to vacate the parsonage. My BF in got pregnant as a sophomore and was asked not to come back. It’s very sad when it happens.
they believe his actions would mirror how he was raised- which would make Mary a bad baptist and parent which lead her kid to sinning .
Religious people are very judgmental
This is why I left the southern Baptist church. And when I stop coming they had the nerve to come to
My house with a group of people and invite themselves in to pray for me
many yrs ago I found a book my GMA had .her bookmark was things baptist people can get away with . when they had the funeral and he pastor Jeff changed the who art in heaven my expression 😏😒🫣.
Christian hate more the they say to love. I have a friend who was raised in an orthodox Christian household, and her father is also a priest. When she told her parents that she was a lesbian ( I myself am bisexual ), they would not speak to her for a couple weeks and refused to talk about it after (she also lives with them and we're in high school so this was extra hard for her). I was not raised with any religion, but I occasionally explored the idea of it. It broke my heart seeing how someone could treat their own daughter like that. Actually, before I met this friend, my ex-girlfriend was also raised Catholic with parents who were also homophobes, although she never came out to them.
Ohh please. The church people was insufferable but don't act as if you so called open minded people wouldn't have judged the Cooper's as revolting too. You reddit weirdos act weird about small normal gaps all the time. If Georgie and Mandy were real reddit, sweet "progressive" reddit would puke on them and the families that raised them.
And anyone arguing otherwise and that it's "different" is a slimy liar.
My husband, at 7, in the 80s asked his Sunday school class (in Georgia - North Georgia) where Cain's wife came from. If Adam and Eve were the first two people, and Cain and Abel were their sons - when Cain was cast out - how did his wife exist?
Instead of answering the question, or trying to figure it out, or even coming up with a solution, church elders came up to his grandmother (who had been a member of the church for over 30 years - and her family founded the town as well), and asked her to not bring him back. So the church asked that a 7 year old not come back because of a question (I wish I was lying but she confirmed this).
He has said afterwards that he saw something he had never seen, his grandmother (a proper southern lady) used words she would never and left that church (for another of course).
But since that time, he has a complicated relationship with religion and the teachings. I myself am agnostic (while he finds himself atheist). My issue was always watching people who are "sick" start reading and teaching the bible and quoting it to me, but they did not do that before (until they were ill). So I'm not a fan of the hypocrisy, but I don't care what others do and what they believe. It's not my place. I do also feel there is an educational component - similar to history (As church history is not kind and historically, it is a small group of people who use fear to control the masses). But we do not practice.
So to answer your question, it is/was very common practice to shun families for the action of another. This is apart of what has led to the declining numbers in churches.
I like to compare it to GOP politicians who are anti-gay marriage, or anti-this or anti-that, until it happens to them. In that same token, I believe Mary would have shunned someone to at some point prior to this.
My uncle was a pastor in Georgia until his son developed AIDS in the early 1990s and his homosexuality became impossible to hide. The church fired my uncle and shunned the whole family. It's just how church people are. For a religion supposedly based on grace and forgiveness, they are quick to judge and punish.
accurate.
OMG!
You are correct.
Ain't no hate like Christian love
I’m a Christian and I agree. Western Christianity can either be completely wild and out there or it can be tighter than bolts. Most never seem to actually follow what Jesus said.
But they were OK with Jeff getting divorced.
Do as I say not as I do.
Yah this was weird to me. In the Baptist church I grew up in the pastor divorcing would get him removed from leadership and an out of wedlock baby would just never be talked about really. Also if you know Baptist theology then Mary forcing her kids to get baptized in the last episodes doesn’t make much sense.
Jeff baptizing a baby goes against Baptist theology as well. (I’m Methodist but my wife was raised Baptist and she agrees with this point). I also seriously doubt a Catholic priest would baptize a baby against the parents’ wishes. I get she slipped him a few bucks but it still doesn’t seem like something a priest would do.
I agree, but this one id forgive because iirc he brought it up but then they made it a way to get back at the Catholics kind of joke so I wasn’t taking that one too serious.
I get why they did it and no, I don’t turn to the show for theological insight. On a side note, there was an episode of All in the Family where Archie wanted his grandson baptized over the objections of Mike. (He was an atheist). The preacher at his church (or the church he went to when Edith dragged him along) refused to do it because the parents didn’t agree. So he snuck into the sanctuary and did it himself. In a later episode, Meathead was upset about it but Gloria tried to calm him down by saying she talked to the minister and he said it didn’t count. (Or words to that affect).
That is how Southern Baptists are, they ignore the "thou shall not judge lest ye be without sin" quote in the Bible.
Sounds like people just use religion to legitimize prejudices.
Yeah, sometimes I feel people use religion as an excuse to look down on people and discriminate against them. I'm glad Jesus wasn't that way.
Yeah. Thats true. That's true. To me, Jesus was the best us, by which I mean all humankind.
I go to church, pray, all that stuff and I've worked very hard to not cast judgement. I grew up southern baptist and saw the church kick people out for being gay; even tried to push out inter-racial couples. I now go to a church that the pastor is one of the most loving people I know.
There’s no hate like evangelical love.
Reddit atheists are number one
That’d be typical Baptist.
Southern Baptist! Also the land where random teenage girls would go “visit their aunt” for a year and come back a changed person.
Or... "have to get married." Usually to a teenage boy they barely knew. I am glad Mandy and Georgie didn't initially get married right away, but IRL in small town Baptist Texas I think they would have felt pressured to.
Idk but feels like that just what human do, although they follow certain religion. They do it because either they dont fully understand or act upon what was taught or simply that just how they are. Even tho lord told them to be forgiving and all being should be loved, they still judge. It’s not like a person follows a religion means they would act like it, some may even use aspect of religions to back them up for their wrong doings. It happens in every religions actually
Not all Christians are that way. It's mostly a Deep South Baptist thing. The American Civil War set the South's culture back by about 50 years. In the 1990s Baptists in the deep South were still following religious believes Christians in the Northeast, Midwest, and Western US were following in the 1940s. When it comes to religion Southern Baptists have strict views about sin and forgivenes. They believe more in the Old Testament which depicts God as being far more vengeful. In the Northeast, Midwest, and Western US, Christians tend to put more faith in the New Testament which depicts Jesus as being extremely forgiving. As a Catholic who grew up just outside of Bible Belt, I am very aware of the differences between "Yankee Christians" such as myself and "Dixie Christians" like Mary Cooper. So I can totally relate to Tam's and Mandy's experiences as Catholics meeting Southern Baptists.
That’s organized religion for you
Came here to say this. -proud and kind hearted atheist for life
Churches in that era were just wild with it fr. Especially in the south. It’s a pretty staple part of that old southern Baptist culture. Very self righteous and ignorant on some parts of Jesus’s teaching while focusing on complete purity (even though it’s impossible.
Because people would abandon their values as soon as they think there is no other choices :) A person who abhors stealing would steal in desperation. A generally soft-spoken person would suddenly shout if they reached breaking point.
I'm not saying you're wrong about being awful when convenient, but your examples aren't that of convenience. Those are moreso desperation, when anyone will do awful things to ensure their survival or their voice being heard. I think a better example is finding a wallet and taking the money instead of returning it to the person on the ID.
I fixed it. I was about to give other examples that may have been darker, such as a pacifist killing a person in cold blood, but I figure I don't want to be too edgy. But yeah, you're right, ideals, principles, scruples, those kind of things are no longer valuable or a priority under desperate circumstances. Makes me wonder, would you abandon your principles under desperation or will you try to believe there is always a way?
My favorite example of broken ideals is the Hunger Games. Everyone wants to go home, and will do what they can to do so. In extreme situations, anyone would give up their morals if it meant their survival. I love dystopian novels because of that desperation, not quite seeing it break people, but knowing it's' possible.
That's how they do.
I don't know, I never seen it happened in real life. If someone's kid is doing something everyone else in church thinks it's wrong, they'll be upset about the kid but not the family. And it really depends what they did, in the church I grew up with, some of the few young people we did have had kids out of wedlock, and the pastor encourage them to get married, but I don't think they were particularly mean about it. (Eventually one couple did get married anyway. ) We did have a few single mothers, and there was never any meanness or judgement towards them. But then again, it wasn't a Baptist church, I never went to a Baptist church, and this is the 2000s-2010s so I'm guessing different time period, different churches and different areas see things differently.
Have you never met a single christian?
🤣 Because it’s church. It’s what they do.
I don’t agree with church ⛪️
If it was Georgie only they'd not get the desired outcome as Georgie didn't really care about church.
As someone who was raised Southern Baptist that's pretty much par for the course. My family got bullied out of the church my mom grew up in because the church got involved in my great grandfather's marriage
Because that's how those types of churches operate.
I was raised Southern Baptist, the preacher’s daughter got pregnant in the 1980’s and was immediately fired. The family was forced to move because they had to vacate the parsonage. My BF in got pregnant as a sophomore and was asked not to come back. It’s very sad when it happens.
Hypocrites!!
That's what southern Baptist churches do!
It be like that in among church folk
they believe his actions would mirror how he was raised- which would make Mary a bad baptist and parent which lead her kid to sinning . Religious people are very judgmental
Because southern baptists! Southern Baptists are some of the most judgey and hateful people.
They wanted to make the church look bad. Some churches are like that. Some are not.
This is why I left the southern Baptist church. And when I stop coming they had the nerve to come to My house with a group of people and invite themselves in to pray for me
many yrs ago I found a book my GMA had .her bookmark was things baptist people can get away with . when they had the funeral and he pastor Jeff changed the who art in heaven my expression 😏😒🫣.
Some places are ridiculous. To paraphrase Ghandi, some "Christians" aren't very Christ-like.
Christian hate more the they say to love. I have a friend who was raised in an orthodox Christian household, and her father is also a priest. When she told her parents that she was a lesbian ( I myself am bisexual ), they would not speak to her for a couple weeks and refused to talk about it after (she also lives with them and we're in high school so this was extra hard for her). I was not raised with any religion, but I occasionally explored the idea of it. It broke my heart seeing how someone could treat their own daughter like that. Actually, before I met this friend, my ex-girlfriend was also raised Catholic with parents who were also homophobes, although she never came out to them.
Nobody is more judgemental than church people. They're also at the top of my list for hypocrisy.
That's religion for ya
Ohh please. The church people was insufferable but don't act as if you so called open minded people wouldn't have judged the Cooper's as revolting too. You reddit weirdos act weird about small normal gaps all the time. If Georgie and Mandy were real reddit, sweet "progressive" reddit would puke on them and the families that raised them. And anyone arguing otherwise and that it's "different" is a slimy liar.
Reddit atheists are worst then any southern religious ever Reddit atheist are just too lazy to act in what they say
Because children are a reflection on their parents.
Not always. People just like to judge.
I think that was the church's view in the show... the out of wedlock pregnancy cast "shame" on the whole family.
No, it's because southern Baptists are largely a group of overly-judgmental p\*\*\*ks.
My husband, at 7, in the 80s asked his Sunday school class (in Georgia - North Georgia) where Cain's wife came from. If Adam and Eve were the first two people, and Cain and Abel were their sons - when Cain was cast out - how did his wife exist? Instead of answering the question, or trying to figure it out, or even coming up with a solution, church elders came up to his grandmother (who had been a member of the church for over 30 years - and her family founded the town as well), and asked her to not bring him back. So the church asked that a 7 year old not come back because of a question (I wish I was lying but she confirmed this). He has said afterwards that he saw something he had never seen, his grandmother (a proper southern lady) used words she would never and left that church (for another of course). But since that time, he has a complicated relationship with religion and the teachings. I myself am agnostic (while he finds himself atheist). My issue was always watching people who are "sick" start reading and teaching the bible and quoting it to me, but they did not do that before (until they were ill). So I'm not a fan of the hypocrisy, but I don't care what others do and what they believe. It's not my place. I do also feel there is an educational component - similar to history (As church history is not kind and historically, it is a small group of people who use fear to control the masses). But we do not practice. So to answer your question, it is/was very common practice to shun families for the action of another. This is apart of what has led to the declining numbers in churches. I like to compare it to GOP politicians who are anti-gay marriage, or anti-this or anti-that, until it happens to them. In that same token, I believe Mary would have shunned someone to at some point prior to this.