[Rule 15.2a](https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-of-golf/rule-15.html)
When a ball is ‘in’ or ‘on’ a movable obstruction, you remove the obstruction, mark the position on the ground below where the ball was (to the best of your knowledge) and drop with 1 club length of the mark, no closer to the hole, with not penalty.
It is in neither, it is on the rake, and as such you get to drop such that the rules allow. Depending on the location, some players may opt to drop in the bunker, if it was beneficial.
Additionally, some rules *do* allow moving from sand to grass. [Rule 16.1c - Abnormal Course Conditions](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/rule-16.html) allows you to drop outside of a bunker with standing water (with 1 stroke penalty), should your ball end up in it.
Actually the RandA cover this in their "definitions" section of the rule book. Here is what it says about "club-length":
The length of the longest club of the 14 (or fewer) clubs the player has during the round (as allowed by Rule 4.1b(1)), other than a putter.
Not a lefty but I’d imagine a drive length as for out to the left as possible without being closer to the hole would be fine for you stance? Also depends on how long the hole is and what club you’d be hitting from there
>It is in neither, it is on the rake
If it lies on a movable obstruction (ie rake) within the margin of the bunker, it is considered in the bunker.
The USGA rules even has a nifty graphic for this:
[https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-of-golf/769\_1.0.svg](https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-of-golf/769_1.0.svg)
The main question here is whether the ball is within the bunker margin, but it seems that part of the ball clearly is. Therefore you get free relief from the rake, but the ball must be dropped in the bunker, would be my interpretation.
“If there is no such nearest point of complete relief in the bunker, you may still take this relief”
You get free relief in the bunker, but if the whole bunker has water, you get a free drop outside the bunker.
Edit: I think I’m wrong here. See below. Free relief has to be in the bunker.
You cut off the most important part, which clearly states you do NOT get a free drop outside the bunker.
"If there is no such [nearest point of complete relief](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_7ace453e-6a32-4a40-a217-496065e5fb9b) in the [bunker](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_92c2e54a-7c01-4c86-a64b-db5bf0ddff92), you may still take this relief, by using the [point of maximum available relief](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_516e5857-490d-4401-8a20-8a32fc48ef75) **in the** [**bunker**](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_92c2e54a-7c01-4c86-a64b-db5bf0ddff92) as the reference point."
All Free Relief must be in bunker. If complete relief isn't available, you get Maximum Available relief, which is plain English is "closest thing possible to full relief still in the bunker."
[https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#\_516e5857-490d-4401-8a20-8a32fc48ef75](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_516e5857-490d-4401-8a20-8a32fc48ef75)
most important snippet: "Where that [abnormal course condition](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_fe62e1b7-c5e2-450c-b38b-a0d788c6974b) **least interferes** with the [stroke](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_d6d5a9cd-bef8-494f-bfc8-1d18761b474e) you would have made from the original spot if the condition was not there."
You’re misinterpreting the rule.
You don’t have to take complete relief inside the bunker if there is no complete relief available. In this case you’re allowed to take maximum available relief (eg you can try dropping in the area you have least interference from the water)
If you drop outside the bunker it is still 1 penalty stroke
Edit: sorry I see the guy below already explained it
There are two answers
1. The rake is supported by the grass and is thus part of the general area
2. The rake that the ball is embedded in prevented the ball from going into the bunker, and the positioning of the ball is over the edge of the bunker.
Personally, if I'm calling the shot here, I'm sorry but it's one thing if your ball is at rest against the rake and in turn, you got lucky that the ball hit the rake instead of rolling into the bunker. It's another that it's inside the rake in a position that is over the bunker. This counts as free relief inside the lip of the bunker. At least, if it's over the grass there's a slim chance it doesn't roll into the bunker and I'd give benefit of the doubt there.
Honestly this is the real answer. Shit like a rake or a sprinkler head or huge unfixed divots or wet/hard bunkers are things that don't affect high end courses and aren't intentionally part of the game and it's dumb for recreational players to penalize themselves over.
That would be like playing with a flat basketball or not counting a soccer goal that slips through a hole in the net. Imperfect course management is not intentionally part of the game.
They did not specific how you drop so if you choose sand instead of grass, throw up the ball like 50ft straight up; guarantee a good friedegg sandplay.
Last time we were in Tahoe, my wife didn’t play golf, and I didn’t want to spend the cash on Edgewater. Now that she plays, the next time we go to Tahoe Edgewater’s gonna cost us a pretty penny.
I work at a course and in the morning when the crew is doing setup for the day you always find a few rakes in WTF spots and positions. Truly is enlightening seeing all the awful ways people manage to set a rake down
USGA 101.3.4 clearly states that “player must pick up rake and advance ball by using a lacrosse-like overhand swing, then play the ball from the new location without incurring a stroke penalty.”
Guarantee that’s how me or my buddies play it
Pick up the rake and carry it ever-so carefully up to the green making sure not to drop the ball and plop that pink bad boy right in the cup. It’ll be our little secret…
The game of golf. Where you have no intention of that type of shot, yet it looks so farfetched. This looks like you could only place the ball there for this picture. I have played enough golf to know this was a natural landing for the ball.
If you’re playing for fun ? Do whatever suits.
If you’ve a card in hand for a comp the below covers it.
[USGA SAY SO](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/course-care/green-section-record/60/04/where-should-golfers-put-bunker-rakes-.html)
The number of folks in this sub who don’t seem to know the rules is hilarious.
Edit. The complication is that the ball is suspended in the air rather than on the ground against the rake.
Make sure it rolls toward the grass when you pick up the rake. You don't hit off of man-made placed objects. It's also just a free drop no closer to the hole and likely wither 1 or 2 club lengths. So drop in the grass.
If you are playing with your friends drop it by the hole. If you are not playing with your friends drop it by the hole. You are not on tour, so no one cares.
Well, first, I’d throw it as close to the green as possible. Then, I’d probably take a rough shot and call it an eagle, Pat on the back, swig of a beer with a cigarette butt hiding in it and breathe a sigh of relief.
Call in the rules official (guy with walkie talkie). Move the specatators back, take your drop, commercial break probably Farmers insurance (hilarity ensues). Set up for your shot, realize this red sphere should been regifted or thrown in the garbage.
Basically like a Hammer-Throw: Make sure the ball stays balanced on the head of the rake until you start to spin. Centrifugal force and the angle at which the rake is held will keep the ball in place. Once you have built up enough momentum, release the rake and ball towards your target. Be sure to replace the rake in a respectful manner, on the edge of its bunker. Tip the BevCart-girl and fix your divots.
Just pick the rake up carefully without moving the ball, walk to the green and roll it in the hole 😂
...okay, mark it, take free relief within a clublength of it, no nearer the hole.
In, an obstruction... Mark the position of the ball as close as you can with a tee, then drop within a length of a club...
What makes me doubt, is in this case the rules I think will state general area, not sure if you could drop inside the bunker as well as depending on the shot an the distance and the conditions of the rough, someone could prefer to drop inside the bunker and not into the long rough...
Lots of wrong info. You pick the ball up. put a tee in the ground at the point you think was "directly under your ball"
ie. imagine a line going through the dead center of the ball 90 degrees to the ground.
If that spot is in the grass, you get one club length to the left only. If that spot is in the sand you get a drop 1 club length to the right. in either scenario, no closer to the hole.
Your free relief from the rake has to be taken in the same area of the course as the spot you deemed your ball to be directly over. The grass is general area. The bunker is a bunker (duh).
It doesn't matter if the ball would likely fall into the bunker if you could magically make the rake disappear. All that matters is what you determine is directly under where the ball is sitting on the rake. In this case......you have to determine it's grass or sand.
Man made obstruction. Drop within one club length no closer to hole.
[Rule 15.2a](https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-of-golf/rule-15.html) When a ball is ‘in’ or ‘on’ a movable obstruction, you remove the obstruction, mark the position on the ground below where the ball was (to the best of your knowledge) and drop with 1 club length of the mark, no closer to the hole, with not penalty.
But is this ball in the grass or sand? Because you can't move from sand to grass can you? Edit: thanks for the answer
It is in neither, it is on the rake, and as such you get to drop such that the rules allow. Depending on the location, some players may opt to drop in the bunker, if it was beneficial. Additionally, some rules *do* allow moving from sand to grass. [Rule 16.1c - Abnormal Course Conditions](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/rule-16.html) allows you to drop outside of a bunker with standing water (with 1 stroke penalty), should your ball end up in it.
As a lefty, I’m thinking one club length to the left wouldn’t be a great lie, so I’d consider dropping in the sand
It's any club, so use a driver and that should give you enough relief to have a solid stance.
Ah idk why I just assumed it would be the club in hand
Easy assumption to make. But may as well take advantage when the rules allow it.
Actually the RandA cover this in their "definitions" section of the rule book. Here is what it says about "club-length": The length of the longest club of the 14 (or fewer) clubs the player has during the round (as allowed by Rule 4.1b(1)), other than a putter.
I have one of those extendable ball retriever type "clubs". That's what I use at full extent for my relief.
Not a lefty but I’d imagine a drive length as for out to the left as possible without being closer to the hole would be fine for you stance? Also depends on how long the hole is and what club you’d be hitting from there
>It is in neither, it is on the rake If it lies on a movable obstruction (ie rake) within the margin of the bunker, it is considered in the bunker. The USGA rules even has a nifty graphic for this: [https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-of-golf/769\_1.0.svg](https://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-clarifications/rules-of-golf/769_1.0.svg) The main question here is whether the ball is within the bunker margin, but it seems that part of the ball clearly is. Therefore you get free relief from the rake, but the ball must be dropped in the bunker, would be my interpretation.
Wait that would be a one stroke penalty? The fuck, thats insane. I guess that would be a scenario where it’s on the course to put it as GUR?
“If there is no such nearest point of complete relief in the bunker, you may still take this relief” You get free relief in the bunker, but if the whole bunker has water, you get a free drop outside the bunker. Edit: I think I’m wrong here. See below. Free relief has to be in the bunker.
Ahhh gotcha, okay thanks for the clarification
You cut off the most important part, which clearly states you do NOT get a free drop outside the bunker. "If there is no such [nearest point of complete relief](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_7ace453e-6a32-4a40-a217-496065e5fb9b) in the [bunker](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_92c2e54a-7c01-4c86-a64b-db5bf0ddff92), you may still take this relief, by using the [point of maximum available relief](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_516e5857-490d-4401-8a20-8a32fc48ef75) **in the** [**bunker**](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_92c2e54a-7c01-4c86-a64b-db5bf0ddff92) as the reference point." All Free Relief must be in bunker. If complete relief isn't available, you get Maximum Available relief, which is plain English is "closest thing possible to full relief still in the bunker." [https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#\_516e5857-490d-4401-8a20-8a32fc48ef75](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_516e5857-490d-4401-8a20-8a32fc48ef75) most important snippet: "Where that [abnormal course condition](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_fe62e1b7-c5e2-450c-b38b-a0d788c6974b) **least interferes** with the [stroke](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/rules/rules-2019/players-edition/definitions.html#_d6d5a9cd-bef8-494f-bfc8-1d18761b474e) you would have made from the original spot if the condition was not there."
You’re misinterpreting the rule. You don’t have to take complete relief inside the bunker if there is no complete relief available. In this case you’re allowed to take maximum available relief (eg you can try dropping in the area you have least interference from the water) If you drop outside the bunker it is still 1 penalty stroke Edit: sorry I see the guy below already explained it
Yup. I edited the comment. Weird as I did that once before but I must have accidentally posted again?
Iirc, if you drop it in the bunker outside of the standing water, it's not a 1 stroke penalty. It only applies if you remove it from the bunker.
You can move anywhere within 1 club length and no closer to the hole. It it improves your line or lie, great.
Both, and neither. It’s Schrodinger’s ball.
There are two answers 1. The rake is supported by the grass and is thus part of the general area 2. The rake that the ball is embedded in prevented the ball from going into the bunker, and the positioning of the ball is over the edge of the bunker. Personally, if I'm calling the shot here, I'm sorry but it's one thing if your ball is at rest against the rake and in turn, you got lucky that the ball hit the rake instead of rolling into the bunker. It's another that it's inside the rake in a position that is over the bunker. This counts as free relief inside the lip of the bunker. At least, if it's over the grass there's a slim chance it doesn't roll into the bunker and I'd give benefit of the doubt there.
I had to hit it off of Frankenstein’s fat foot!
By the looks of it you’re not a professional so grab it and drop it in the grass and be thankful the rake stopped your ball
Honestly this is the real answer. Shit like a rake or a sprinkler head or huge unfixed divots or wet/hard bunkers are things that don't affect high end courses and aren't intentionally part of the game and it's dumb for recreational players to penalize themselves over. That would be like playing with a flat basketball or not counting a soccer goal that slips through a hole in the net. Imperfect course management is not intentionally part of the game.
Pick up the rake and sling it like a lacrosse ball 🥍
That would have worked better than my chip
This is the way... consider it a bonus stroke.
Mark the ground where the ball is, move the rake, drop the ball within 1 club length the mark (not closer to the hole), play your shot
Yup. And 1 club length can net you quite a bit here so choose wisely where you drop.
Oops, dropped into sand
They did not specific how you drop so if you choose sand instead of grass, throw up the ball like 50ft straight up; guarantee a good friedegg sandplay.
Drops have to be straight down from knee height
Are you on tour? Pick that mf up give yourself a nice lie and throw a 🎯😉
is this edgewood?
Great eye, fun course with some great views
haha well my eye only works at the handful of courses we have in Tahoe. Edgewood is tough to beat, hope you all had a good time
Weather was great yesterday, little wind. The music festival at one of the casinos was a little loud on a few of the holes though
yea you're only like 150y from the stage on 8 and 9... emo music doesn't seem all that easy to putt to😂. enjoy your trip!
And the price tag to go with it!
Father’s Day present, so I can’t complain
Last time we were in Tahoe, my wife didn’t play golf, and I didn’t want to spend the cash on Edgewater. Now that she plays, the next time we go to Tahoe Edgewater’s gonna cost us a pretty penny.
*Edgewood. I’d say the course felt pretty easy overall though. Couple of really long holes but otherwise manageable
Hah, the Edgewater is a hotel I stayed at in Seattle. I always get the damn names mixed up.
Do they have a golf course? I’m going to Seattle in a few weeks
I picked up on that right away. Was going to say don’t hit it in the Lake.
Just use your foot wedge!
I’d prolly end up kicking myself somehow
Play as it lies. 👌
No joke, golf is way more fun this way.
Play it as it lies. If Shooter had to shoot off of Frankenstien’s fat foot, you can shoot off the rake.
Rule 17.1.d: Pick up the rake and whip it like a lacrosse stick towards the hole…play where it lands
With as much force as possible. Send it.
I think this could count as a hole in one. Pick your ball up and put 1 on the scorecard
Great, that would bring my score down to a solid 120
Throw the rake in the forest so that it can be with its family.
With the ball still on it?
I would also test the rake for its durability.
Download USGA rules app Think they have this and similar situations
PLAY. IT. AS. IT. LIES.
LOL
Stomp the end of the rake, and chip the ball mid air. Only play IMO
First of all bring it back to the mini putt and get a real ball
Did you play lacrosse?
D O D
Some people just wana watch the world burn. What a shitty place to leave the rake, in a shitty position
I work at a course and in the morning when the crew is doing setup for the day you always find a few rakes in WTF spots and positions. Truly is enlightening seeing all the awful ways people manage to set a rake down
Edgewood?
Yep! It was a beautiful day
After some prayers.
You place it on the ground or sand and then you swing at it.
Rule 37b of section a, You gotta pick up the rake and use it like a catapult or take 2 penalty strokes.
I played that course on Father’s Day. It was in really good shape.
Do your best Mickelson impression you'll be fine haha...
"You got this shot pods. You can do it, it's a hooded 4 iron, man."
Carefully
Just move the rake and put the ball back where it was in the grass This ain't the PGA brother
With a club
With a golf club dingus
I had to hit off of Frankensteins fat foot. Play it as it lies
USGA 101.3.4 clearly states that “player must pick up rake and advance ball by using a lacrosse-like overhand swing, then play the ball from the new location without incurring a stroke penalty.” Guarantee that’s how me or my buddies play it
With your playing partners wedge. Same with cartpath, roots, rocks, etc.
Whoever left the rake like that is a moron
Two strokes for playing a red ball.
Pick up the rake and carry it ever-so carefully up to the green making sure not to drop the ball and plop that pink bad boy right in the cup. It’ll be our little secret…
Everyone telling you to move it are pussies. You pick the rake up like a lacrosse stick and yeet that bad Larry onto the green.
You need to play the ball as it lies. I had to hit it off of Frankenstein’s fat foot, remember?
Very carefully
How *did* you hit that ball?
The game of golf. Where you have no intention of that type of shot, yet it looks so farfetched. This looks like you could only place the ball there for this picture. I have played enough golf to know this was a natural landing for the ball.
When I hit my shot, I swear it landed in the trap. It was so close
Also, very nice place to play golf.
Gotta use the rake as a Lacrosse stick. I’ll allow it
Lateral club length
Where it lies 😆
Free drop ?
That's a nicely edged bunker. I don't see them red balls all that well.
What's the distance?
Hit THROUGH the rake
Slowly pick up the rake so the ball stays attached … then walk it carefully towards the hole. Drop accordingly.
That's in the hole.
Ah, yes, the man with red balls..
Foot wedge.
Are rakes 90% air like trees?
Very Carefully
Foot wedge.
What ball?
I don’t know but those bunkers are beauuuutiful
Man made obstruction = free drop
If you’re playing for fun ? Do whatever suits. If you’ve a card in hand for a comp the below covers it. [USGA SAY SO](https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/course-care/green-section-record/60/04/where-should-golfers-put-bunker-rakes-.html) The number of folks in this sub who don’t seem to know the rules is hilarious. Edit. The complication is that the ball is suspended in the air rather than on the ground against the rake.
Pick up the ball and move it so you can hit it???
I'm not sure it's red
You get free relief. One club length no closer to the hole.
Carefully
Move it to the grass and hit it
Sling it with the rake baby
unplayable lie
As it lies
What you on the tour ?Move the rake and hit the ball!!
Make sure it rolls toward the grass when you pick up the rake. You don't hit off of man-made placed objects. It's also just a free drop no closer to the hole and likely wither 1 or 2 club lengths. So drop in the grass.
That’s a gimme.
Take it off the rake. Put it on the ground. Hit the ball.
You don’t hit it -/ man made obstruction -/ club length drop and then hit, not closer to green, no penalty
If I wasn’t married I’d have quit the game a long time ago.
Take it off the rake
Looks like a nice course
Pick it gently on the rake carry it to the green and drop next to hole!
Put the ball on the ground
You don’t. Take free relief.
This is morning but an an engagement farming post. No way anyone asks this question seriously
Cool ball choice. I love using the red Callaway and Maxfli balls. Currently playing orange just to mix it up a bit.
I’d pick the rake up and fling the ball towards the hole
That's not a ball, that's a pink charm that fell off someone's bracelet.
Backwards nine iron into the trap 👏🏻
Take your driver and smack the shit out of it
Move it, there’s no green jackets out there for you
With your golf club
Don’t drop in the bunker.
Edgewood?
With a legitimate swing, no scooping!!
Hit that orange thing in the lake
Plenty of answers here already so I’ll just ask: what track is this? Looks mint
Gotta putt that out sideways.
Free drop
You found my ball.
You move it and hit the ball
Hit the rake, Hit the rake, hit the freaking RAKE!
Free drop no closer to the home
Really hard.
If you are playing with your friends drop it by the hole. If you are not playing with your friends drop it by the hole. You are not on tour, so no one cares.
Dude Perfect All Sports Battle. Did you happen to bring a pool stick?
Smash your club into the rake and hope for the best.
Seriously... These set-up 'dilemmas'...
Well, first, I’d throw it as close to the green as possible. Then, I’d probably take a rough shot and call it an eagle, Pat on the back, swig of a beer with a cigarette butt hiding in it and breathe a sigh of relief.
With a puttwr
Finally a rake saving someone. I like to leave them in front of bunkers to help out
Driver, obviously
Move the rake
Free drop
Be a hero.
It’s a free drop
You get one free sling. Launch that ball as far as you can!
I’d use a golf club
Play it where it lies
You grab your putter, turn it to the side, and hit it with the toe of the putter
If that’s the rule how come Shooter had to hit it off the foot…?
Pool cue it
Carefully
Who leaves a rake like that?!
Man made obstruction drop w/relief
Rakes belong in the traps. You get a very pleasant relief from that lie.
That's a nice ass bunker
I had to hit off of Frankensteins fat foot. Play it as it lies
use the rack wedge provided to sling it across the green
Call in the rules official (guy with walkie talkie). Move the specatators back, take your drop, commercial break probably Farmers insurance (hilarity ensues). Set up for your shot, realize this red sphere should been regifted or thrown in the garbage.
Pick it up, take a par
Leave the rakes in the bunker, folks.
Playing for money? 1 club length no closer to the hole. Playing for fun, just move the fucker.
Basically like a Hammer-Throw: Make sure the ball stays balanced on the head of the rake until you start to spin. Centrifugal force and the angle at which the rake is held will keep the ball in place. Once you have built up enough momentum, release the rake and ball towards your target. Be sure to replace the rake in a respectful manner, on the edge of its bunker. Tip the BevCart-girl and fix your divots.
Just pick the rake up carefully without moving the ball, walk to the green and roll it in the hole 😂 ...okay, mark it, take free relief within a clublength of it, no nearer the hole.
You use the rake as a sling golf club
360 rake throw
You’ve gotta go to your happy place.
You move it
Put it on Frankenstein’s fat foot. Add a stroke.
In, an obstruction... Mark the position of the ball as close as you can with a tee, then drop within a length of a club... What makes me doubt, is in this case the rules I think will state general area, not sure if you could drop inside the bunker as well as depending on the shot an the distance and the conditions of the rough, someone could prefer to drop inside the bunker and not into the long rough...
Lots of wrong info. You pick the ball up. put a tee in the ground at the point you think was "directly under your ball" ie. imagine a line going through the dead center of the ball 90 degrees to the ground. If that spot is in the grass, you get one club length to the left only. If that spot is in the sand you get a drop 1 club length to the right. in either scenario, no closer to the hole. Your free relief from the rake has to be taken in the same area of the course as the spot you deemed your ball to be directly over. The grass is general area. The bunker is a bunker (duh). It doesn't matter if the ball would likely fall into the bunker if you could magically make the rake disappear. All that matters is what you determine is directly under where the ball is sitting on the rake. In this case......you have to determine it's grass or sand.