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kalvinoz

Not related to this case (about which I have no information), but I've heard that often the death isn't pronounced on the spot so the body can be quickly removed, hence the frequent "died on the way to the hospital."


alexkey

In Europe (and NA I think same), only doctors can pronounce someone dead. Legally that is. Paramedics / first responders are there to do what’s necessary to deliver the person to the doctors as soon as possible, preferably alive. They do have a medical training, but are often not doctors, hence can’t declare a person deceased.


DrahKir67

I've heard something similar and that's why you might hear that they had "injuries incompatible with life" because the person speaking isn't allowed to pronounce that the person is dead.


FeelingFloor2083

coroner can too


kiersto0906

paramedics can do verification of death now


kalvinoz

I'm not a lawyer or doctor or anything, just your average redditor talking about stuff I know almost nothing about, but the gist of it would be that paramedics can't remove a dead body without the cops and/or a doctor signing it off, which would take time to organise (and create a lot of follow-on issues), but they can remove a seriously injured person, and the line between seriously injured and dead is fuzzy.


WeekendSignificant48

>I'm not a lawyer or doctor or anything, just your average redditor I'll take a redditors advice over a professional like a "lawyer" or a "doctor" with their fancy "degrees" any day


Very-very-sleepy

yep. I had a family member died at home  I called the paramedics but when they arrived they said they can't do much to help as the person is deceased.  to my surprise, they informed me they actually that I will need to wait for both the police and a doctor to arrive before the body is moved and they asked for the number of our family doctor. obviously police arrived quick but the doctor took almost an hr arrive in my home and once the doctor arrived. we were able to remove the body to a funeral home. I thought the whole process was ridiculous  that the paramedics does not have authority to actually declare someone deceased. 


teapots_at_ten_paces

This seems really odd. I have experience in both Queensland and NT, and they both have a protocol called Recognition of Life Extinct (ROLE). It's a set of criteria that say, we assessed the patient and found they were clearly and obviously deceased (injuries incompatible with life, hemicorporectomy, fetal maceration, etc.) or rigor mortis/livor mortis/decomposition. Also required are checks of vital signs - airway sounds, heart sounds, asystole on a cardiac monitor, all assessed for a minimum period of time to ensure there's not the faintest signs of life. The patient is then transferred by (? I actually don't know who) for an assesment by a forensic pathologist for cause of death. It surprises me NSW doesn't have this.


RigourousMortimus

https://www.sl.nsw.gov.au/find-legal-answers/rest-assured-legal-guide-wills-estates-planning-ahead-and-funerals-nsw/funerals Apparently needs a doctor's note but they can do one in advance. "When a death at home is expected, particularly in rural settings, doctors can complete a form before the death occurs to make the death certification process easier."


ghjkl098

NSW does have this. It’s called verification of death. If they called the doctor it wasn’t to declare them dead, it was to ask if they would write the death certificate so that it didn’t have to go through the coroner


Pepinocucumber1

They do. The body is then removed by the statewide mortuary service and taken to a hospital to certify death before transfer to the morgue.


mcmimi83

Had the same thing with my father in law. Except it took over 6 hours for the family doctor to get back to them.


mincat36

I met an ambulance officer / paramedic who told me that he once responded to an incident where a young girl was dragged a long distance by a bus, when he got there he thought she was very dead, so actually he didn’t rush too much but when he put a heart monitor on her she was still alive. That experience made him take the approach that unless they have rigor that person is still alive and he keeps working on them, he never assumes anymore. I also saw in an interview a military helicopter paramedic who said no one dies on my helicopter; in other words he just keeps going not matter what, if that want to call it at the hospital they can, but he just keeps working on them until then.


ghjkl098

not true in Australia


alexkey

And that may be the more sane approach


slower-is-faster

I was told a story by a policeman about a case where the body was missing the head. Still had to be declared dead by a Dr.


Teefdreams

Same in Aus. Only a doctor can "diagnose" death. My doc was telling me that even if someone is found decapitated, a doctor still needs to examine them and declare them dead.


ghjkl098

not true. Their death can be verified on the scene, but a doctor is needed for the death certificate which has a cause of death


Teefdreams

Lol my psychiatrist is a giant liar then


ghjkl098

It’s only been a few years that paramedics have been able to verify (maybe 5-8 years, I can’t remember) so a psychiatrist is unlikely to keep up to date with that sort of stuff


iShitSkittles

That makes perfect sense too.


ghjkl098

If they are dead, their death can be verified on the spot by paramedics.


JSTLF

Isn't it often the case that someone doesn't legally count as dead until they've been declared so by a doctor or something like that? So someone could have died at 5 PM, but it doesn't count until/unless a doctor says "yeah they carked it at 5"?


owleaf

I think so tbh, unless they’re injuries that are incompatible with life. In which case, you wouldn’t attempt resuscitation because it would be futile.


kiersto0906

paramedics have recently been given the ability to fill out a verification of death too


kiersto0906

once someone gets into an ambulance they have to work on them, they can't be pronounced dead on the way (essentially noone "dies" in an ambulance), they are either dead and we stop working on them before they get in the ambulance or we work on them all the way to the hospital where the doctors pronounce them dead.


sweextin

Someone jumped/fell to their death not long ago on Castlereagh st, too. Horrifying.


BellaVistaNorfolk

Oh no. My heart goes out to the family and friends.


iShitSkittles

Apparently, they survived the fall. Ambulance has taken her.


ghjkl098

ambulance taking her doesn’t mean she survived the fall


iShitSkittles

After reading some of the comments here, I now understand that. I only relayed what my fiance's sister told us, as she was there watching it from her office window.


potatodrinker

Hopefully they recover. Fall from heights off a ladder is no joke. Must've been darn lucky to survive jumping off an apartment tower


OldSpiceSmellsNice

Lucky is pretty subjective in this case…


potatodrinker

Yep... lifetime of care and on wheels in the best case scenario


BellaVistaNorfolk

What a battle she'll have to recovery.


laffer27

My office had full view, no way she survived her head was completely shattered with brains all over the ground. Fucked up stuff.


SadAd9828

Jeez that's horrific. If you saw any of that, I'm sorry. Do pay extra attention to your mental health over the coming days this stuff can really be damaging. Your work may even offer some support (eg EAP) which could be good to take up if available.


iShitSkittles

Yeah that's completely fucked up. After seeing that, U ok?


Alternative_Sky1380

Gosh that's tragic.


mitchy93

Thank goodness!


SirAwesomee

Wait what? There's two? Someone else jumped an hour ago too next to the Fire and Rescue on Castlereagh st near Hyde Park. I was in my office and people started crowding the windows.


sweextin

Happened 10m from me. Can't believe they didn't fall on someone. Horrifying all around.


wharblgarbl

Obligatory recommendation to play tetris https://www.psych.ox.ac.uk/news/tetris-used-to-prevent-post-traumatic-stress-symptoms Take care of yourself and speak about it to a professional


Retireegeorge

I thought this was a joke because of the similarity of a piece descending and a person falling. But it is a real article. So it may be better to say that this is good for avoiding PTSD *in some circumstances*.


drinkmaxcoffee

Jesus Christ, are you okay? Do you have someone you can talk to?


BellaVistaNorfolk

Oh no. Can't even begin to imagine. Consider getting help for yourself.


ThippusHorribilus

That is so sad.


Dramatic-Lavishness6

far out :(


iShitSkittles

Wow, that's crazy.


cirancira

I know we don't really publicise info about suicides, but is there any way to tell if there has been a spike? Like a dataset or something of recent events? Because there has been an anecdotal increase on the sub and a bunch of mysterious train delays. Is there like a study that compares it with cost of living?


Top_Chemical_7350

I’ve definitely seen suicide rate compared with interest rate raises. [2022 suicide data finalising now](https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/health/causes-death/causes-death-australia/latest-release). We will likely see this year’s around mid 2026.


pixieshit

According to this, rates of suicide have remained relatively stable 2013-2022


latending

Rents have gone up \~50% since 2022 with the unprecedented immigration surge. There's likely to be a lot more triggered by poverty. But at least Albanese made some landlords very, very rich. Or perhaps just even richer?


nojaneonlyzuul

Australian Bureau of Statistics has info on deaths and causes. I like to go directly to them rather than articles, that way you're not reading someone else's narrative spin https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/health/causes-death/provisional-mortality-statistics/latest-release


Sea_Lingonberry_1584

This is so sad, the same thing has happened two weeks apart at the new parramatta Meriton apartments, one on Good Friday and another two weeks before, 🙇🏼‍♂️


HidaTetsuko

How awful. Hope things get better for her


miss_kimba

According to [this article](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13270629/Sydney-kent-street-barangaroo-woman-suicide.html), she threw her dog out the window first.


Lachlantula

christ..


[deleted]

Your regular reminder that the Daily Mail is terrible in every way and literally supported Hitler back in the day. Not a reliable source.


4614065

Very disturbing. Although, I guess if you felt like you didn’t have anyone who could look after it once you’d gone then you might think it was the best option. Terribly sad either way.


brandon_strandy

C'mon don't defend this. She could've done it at the vet in a peaceful way. This, is fucking horrifying that poor dog oh my god.


4614065

Not defending at all. I guess you’ve never been suicidal, though, if you think people make rational choices in that state.


Other-Swordfish9309

Life in Sydney right now is absolute shit. Everyone I pass looks miserable.


iShitSkittles

I think that's life everywhere - even though life in Sydney is shit, whenever I'm asked "how ya going?" My answer is "I'm always good, I never complain - no one listens!". That always gets a smile.


Other-Swordfish9309

I feel like the current financial climate and the state of the rest of the world right now is making for seriously depressing times - and some of us still haven’t really dealt with the shit show that was the pandemic, then returning to normal life. Strange times…


No_Strain_703

Yep, completely and utterly miserable.


MeasurementMost1165

I feel even if she survived, she will have a difficult chance of survival….. I feel the biggest blow is surviving the actual fact but dying in hospital a few days later…. Rather than to die straight away


bxmarz

[Daily Mail](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13270629/amp/Sydney-kent-street-barangaroo-woman-suicide.html) Looks like the UK gets the news before we do. According to this, she took her dog with her. Nothing on the Hyde Park incident.


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Love2readalot

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13270629/Sydney-kent-street-barangaroo-woman-suicide.html


iShitSkittles

Oh man, and she threw her dog off too... That sux


surprisedropbears

The fuck


furlean

My condolences to her family. 😢 I fear for the future with too many changes and never ending pressure.


-Draiocht-

Oh no!!!! Ohhhh no. Sending love and thoughts to everyone who may need it. This is awful 😔


Dramatic-Lavishness6

very sad :( I hope she and all other witnesses etc get support.


A_thanatopsis

A dog was thrown over? Seems weird, maybe someone has thrown the dog and her? You've got to be a massive piece of shit to hurt an animal that's done nothing if this is the case.


Several_Education_13

It happens. There was a case not long ago I think in Perth where a lady threw her dog off a shopping roof to spite her partner and it was caught on video.


OldSpiceSmellsNice

Right? Motherfucker. Idgaf what your problems are. The poor dog. Thing wouldn’t have had a clue what was going on.


clouxr

Did the dog survive...?


naughtylemon96

So sad and infuriating if it didn’t, which I think is the case


Retireegeorge

Rest in peace


Fungus1968

Nothing in the news…


MeasurementMost1165

Might sound harsh but I think the cops or media don’t want copycat cases so they don’t want to put it in the news


iShitSkittles

That's mostly it, I've been told that's why they don't put it in the news when someone ends up diving in front of a train.


surprisedropbears

Suicides dont get published in the news much. It’s an unwritten media policy- encourages too many copy cats otherwise.


MagicTurtleMum

I have heard that too. Obviously the daily mail doesn't subscribe to that policy. Someone has posted a link in this thread to the dailyfail article and the headline in the url refers to suicide.


Need4Sheed23

Daily mail is hardly a bastion of journalistic integrity


MagicTurtleMum

True. I knew they scraped the bottom of the barrel, this feels like just removing the bottom completely.


latending

\~9-10 people take their own lives every day in Australia, they aren't rare events. How often do you hear about a suicide in the news? The media doesn't report on them to prevent copycats. The dailymail sometimes does as they have been the absolute gutter trash of reporting for [100+ years](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8384lBaN3a0).